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O Pacto Ecológico ainda está vivo? Javi López e Hildegard Bentele tomam partido no The Ring
Neste quarto episódio do «The Ring», focamo-nos no tema controverso do Pacto Ecológico e debatemos até que ponto a UE está unida em relação às metas e ambições climáticas.
LEIA MAIS : http://pt.euronews.com/2025/11/27/o-acordo-verde-ainda-esta-vivo-javi-lopez-e-hildegard-bentele-tomam-partido-no-the-ring
Subscreva, euronews está disponível em 12 línguas.
Neste quarto episódio do «The Ring», focamo-nos no tema controverso do Pacto Ecológico e debatemos até que ponto a UE está unida em relação às metas e ambições climáticas.
LEIA MAIS : http://pt.euronews.com/2025/11/27/o-acordo-verde-ainda-esta-vivo-javi-lopez-e-hildegard-bentele-tomam-partido-no-the-ring
Subscreva, euronews está disponível em 12 línguas.
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NotíciasTranscrição
00:00Olá e bem-vindo a The Ring,
00:11Euronews' novo debate show
00:13broadcasting from the European Parliament
00:15in Strasbourg.
00:17Once a week, two elected members
00:19of the European Parliament
00:20will go face-to-face
00:22on some of the most pressing issues
00:23for Europe.
00:25And this week, it's the Green Deal,
00:27a drag or an opportunity for Europe.
00:31Europe's fight against climate change
00:34is at a turning point.
00:36While the 27 officially maintain
00:38a unified front on climate,
00:40ambition is slipping,
00:41targets are under debate
00:43and industry-first pressures are mounting.
00:46Recent events underline this tension.
00:49In the European Parliament,
00:50the central-right European People's Party
00:52joined forces with the far-right groups,
00:54Patriots for Europe
00:55and the Europe of Sovereign Nations
00:56to ease the burden
00:58of corporate sustainability.
01:00The result?
01:01A balancing act
01:02between economic growth
01:03and climate responsibility
01:05that leads the EU
01:06at a crossroads.
01:08Can it still speak
01:09with one voice
01:09on climate action?
01:10But can the EU keep up
01:16a united front
01:18on what is now
01:18one of the most polarizing topics
01:20for Europeans?
01:22That is the question
01:23that we will be putting
01:24to our contenders.
01:26Let's meet them.
01:27Javi Lopeth,
01:31Vice President of the European Parliament,
01:34Member of the Socialist
01:35and Democrats Group.
01:37A champion of the fair-green transition,
01:39he believes global warming
01:41needs to be addressed immediately.
01:43We must make sure
01:45that Europe is on track
01:46in a socially just way,
01:48he said.
01:48A staunch advocate
01:59of slashing bureaucracy,
02:01she supports the green transition,
02:03but not at any cost.
02:05Known for her work
02:06on the Critical Materials Act,
02:08she once said,
02:08if we are serious
02:10about the Green Deal,
02:11sustainable sourcing
02:12of critical raw materials
02:14is part of the solution,
02:16certainly not the problem.
02:18Welcome to the ring
02:20and thank you so much
02:21for joining us this week.
02:23It's beautiful
02:24being in Strasbourg.
02:25We're happy to see you,
02:26but of course now
02:27let's get to the point
02:29of the question
02:29and that is the Green Deal.
02:31Hildegard,
02:32perhaps we'll start with you.
02:33Is it an opportunity
02:34or is it now just simply
02:35a drag for this economy?
02:37It is a necessity.
02:39So there is no worries.
02:40We have to,
02:41as political leaders,
02:42we have to look
02:43into the future
02:43and we decided
02:45to implement the Green Deal.
02:48We have to transform it,
02:49but we have to stick to it.
02:50When you say
02:50we've got to change it,
02:51transform it,
02:52what does that mean?
02:53That means we have to make
02:54out of the Green Deal
02:55a green industrial deal
02:56because we cannot do it
02:58without our industry,
02:59with our businesses
03:00and they have a hard time
03:01at the moment.
03:02Is that something
03:03that you hear
03:03we want the Green Deal
03:04but we've got to change it?
03:06Well, I agree
03:07that this is not only
03:08a green agenda,
03:10this is also
03:11economic agenda.
03:12In fact,
03:13the European Green Deal
03:14has to be
03:15our path to growth
03:17in the future
03:17and we are sure
03:19that the efforts
03:20of today
03:20will be the competitiveness
03:22of tomorrow
03:22because the green technology
03:24is the race,
03:25space race
03:26of the 21st century.
03:27But do you believe
03:29that the Green Deal
03:30can help
03:30the European economy
03:31because the economy
03:32is barely growing
03:33and energy
03:34is a massive problem
03:34for all of the European
03:35industry all over the EU?
03:37Yeah, it's true
03:38but then the point is
03:39which is the reason?
03:40Why during the last
03:4115 years
03:42we are losing
03:43the race of competitiveness
03:45and our economy
03:47that it has to be
03:47more dynamic
03:48and the reason
03:49is not the loss
03:49that we made
03:50during the last
03:50three, four years.
03:51It's not the Green Deal
03:52to blame?
03:52No, it's not
03:52over-regulation.
03:53The problem
03:54is the lack
03:54of investment
03:55and the point
03:56is how we should
03:57channel better
03:58private and public
04:00investment
04:00and this will be
04:01our discussion.
04:03Okay, but
04:03Madame Bentele,
04:04he says it's not
04:05the Green Deal.
04:05The Green Deal
04:05is not to blame for it.
04:07A lot of the industry,
04:08however, says
04:08you over-regulated
04:10too much
04:10and there was
04:11no industrial plan
04:12to go with it.
04:13Was it a mistake?
04:14Great idea,
04:15badly implemented.
04:16It was not a mistake
04:17but the deal part
04:19of the Green Deal
04:19was missing
04:20because as Javi said,
04:21I fully agree.
04:22It should be
04:23an idea of growth
04:25and we should
04:26create new jobs
04:28with this new economy
04:29we want to build
04:30but this part
04:31has not been fulfilled
04:33because the setting
04:34is different
04:34because we had COVID
04:35because we have
04:36the war in Ukraine,
04:37we have a trade war
04:38with Donald Trump
04:39and we have China
04:40which is much more assertive
04:42so the environment
04:43in which
04:44the whole Green Deal
04:46is taking place
04:47has changed a lot
04:47and this has put
04:48a lot of pressure
04:49on the industry.
04:51So how can this
04:52be adapted
04:52to a 2025 economy
04:54as she mentioned
04:55it's China
04:55it's the United States
04:56many issues
04:57for the European economy
04:58what needs to change
04:59in 2025?
05:00Well, first point
05:01like sure we can
05:02do better our laws
05:03and like the discussions
05:05that we have
05:05about simplification
05:06I think they are
05:08fair enough
05:08we should try
05:10to eliminate
05:11administrative burden
05:13and overlapping
05:14of laws
05:14something that happens
05:15sometimes in Europe
05:17many times
05:18some would say
05:18this is something
05:20that is there
05:20this is first
05:22secondly
05:22this is the main reason
05:24of the lack
05:25of growth
05:25in Europe
05:26not
05:27because
05:28if we see
05:29like the data
05:29and this is the point
05:31this is not a discussion
05:32about ideology
05:32it's first of all
05:34we have countries
05:34in Europe
05:35with growth
05:36of 2.5
05:37almost 3%
05:38during the last years
05:38Spain is a good
05:40example of that
05:41and with the same
05:42regulatory framework
05:43but a lot of money
05:44coming from the recovery fund
05:45yeah
05:46it's true
05:46investment
05:47because investment
05:48is the key
05:49it's not the regulatory framework
05:50secondly
05:51and not only that
05:53like our problem
05:54it was during
05:55the last 10 years
05:56in fact
05:57like the main problem
05:58during the last years
05:59it was our dependency
06:00of fossil fuels
06:01coming from Russia
06:02and our dependency
06:03of our industrial base
06:05in the continental Europe
06:06coming from the cheap
06:07gas coming from Russia
06:09and like
06:10with more
06:11green technology
06:12and renewals
06:13we would be able
06:15to be more competitive
06:16in the world
06:16was it Germany's fault
06:18he talks about
06:19a world in which
06:20Germany was hooked
06:21an industry on
06:21cheap Russian gas
06:22that has gone out
06:23the window
06:23now that is
06:24blaming the Green Deal
06:25but maybe the issue
06:25is much deeper
06:26Germany had a bad
06:27economic model
06:28and we paid for it
06:30the whole model
06:31also of the Green Deal
06:31depends on
06:32cheap affordable energy
06:34and we used to have it
06:36and I fully agree
06:36but because of the war
06:37if there was no war
06:39we would still
06:39rely on cheap
06:41Russian gas
06:42and until today
06:44you know
06:44there are new
06:45sourcing
06:47there are new
06:47oil and gas
06:48drilling
06:49so this model
06:50continues
06:51but I think
06:52it's not wise
06:53to continue with it
06:54but for resilience reasons
06:55but not in terms of price
06:57in terms of price
06:58the high energy prices
06:59in Europe
06:59are the main obstacle
07:00what's the solution
07:01is it simplification
07:02is it to simplify
07:03even more
07:04well this is one part
07:05of course
07:06we have to look
07:07at the legal requirements
07:08which are not feasible
07:09which are not economically viable
07:11I fully agree
07:12but we have to look
07:13into the real problems
07:14which is energy prices
07:15and which is also
07:16you know investment
07:17I agree
07:18but we have a problem
07:19because we have not
07:20unlimited budgets
07:21because we had a
07:22resilient recovery fund
07:23which you know
07:24for the first time
07:24the European Union
07:25indebted itself
07:26and now we have
07:28again the problem
07:29that budgets
07:29are shrinking
07:30and we have
07:31you know
07:31the challenge
07:32to invest
07:34into our defense industry
07:35so there's less money
07:37left
07:37for measures
07:38supporting
07:39all the time
07:40at the same time
07:40do you agree
07:41the issues
07:42we don't have money
07:43in Europe
07:43to invest
07:44well I think
07:45our problem
07:46is not only
07:46like public budget
07:47our problem
07:48is also private
07:49investment
07:50because one of the
07:51main problems
07:51that we had
07:52is during the last
07:53years
07:53private savings
07:55were like channel
07:56to American
07:57investments
07:58because there
07:59they can find
08:01more profits
08:02this was something
08:02that happened
08:03and then why
08:04because we have
08:05a fragmented
08:05financial system
08:07in Europe
08:08we don't have
08:09a banking union
08:10we don't have
08:10a saving unions
08:11like we should
08:13need to
08:13consolidate
08:14space
08:16in Europe
08:17to channel
08:18like private
08:19investments
08:20this is something
08:21that we need
08:21because it's not
08:22only like about
08:23public
08:23but my point
08:24here is like
08:25our problems
08:26are deeper
08:27than regulatory
08:28burden
08:28it's deeper
08:29than the green deal
08:30because this is a
08:31hot topic
08:31it's a toxic
08:32question for a lot
08:33of Europeans
08:33yeah but it
08:35will be really
08:35easy if we're
08:36changing like
08:37three or four
08:37laws that we
08:38made during the
08:39last Monday
08:39that we are
08:40solving our
08:41competitiveness
08:42problems
08:43and to be honest
08:44laws that they
08:45didn't enter into
08:46force
08:47they cannot be
08:48explained by
08:49our problems
08:50but some argue
08:50the targets are
08:51an issue
08:51the 2040
08:52the 2050
08:53sending a very
08:54stringent industry
08:55or signal to the
08:56industry
08:56do you believe
08:57Madame Bantala
08:58that these targets
08:59they are no longer
09:00relevant
09:00they are relevant
09:01because we have
09:01set their direction
09:02and we don't want
09:03to change
09:03you don't want
09:04to change
09:04them
09:04no no
09:05but we have
09:05to see
09:05I mean we
09:06just had
09:06you know
09:06the COP30
09:07conference
09:08and we see
09:08the global
09:09competition
09:09and we can
09:10see China
09:11which is
09:11you know
09:11the biggest
09:12emitter
09:13and they
09:13don't set
09:14themselves
09:14as targets
09:16you know
09:17they follow
09:17the industry
09:18the technology
09:18how fast
09:19they can
09:19develop
09:19technology
09:20and then
09:21they you
09:21know
09:21formulate
09:22their targets
09:22so they
09:23do it
09:23the other
09:23way around
09:24and I
09:24think we
09:24have to
09:25pay
09:25attention
09:25to this
09:26setting
09:27and we
09:27cannot do
09:28it alone
09:28because we
09:28are representing
09:299% of the
09:30global population
09:31and our
09:32industry
09:32even less
09:32so we
09:33have to
09:34adapt
09:35you know
09:35you're saying
09:36no
09:36our point
09:37is like
09:37we don't
09:38have to
09:39be fetish
09:39with the
09:40instruments
09:41but we
09:42have to
09:43be clear
09:43with the
09:43goals
09:44and this
09:45is something
09:45that we
09:45share here
09:46and we
09:46share in
09:47the parliament
09:47our point
09:49is like
09:49to have
09:49predictability
09:50and certainty
09:51in the rules
09:52that we
09:53are doing
09:54especially
09:55to ensure
09:55that we
09:57have enough
09:57investments
09:58China
09:58India
09:58the US
09:59they did
09:59not
10:00show up
10:00to the
10:00COP
10:00and they
10:01do not
10:01have
10:01the
10:01start
10:01are we
10:02doing
10:02too much
10:03it's a
10:03fair
10:03question
10:04but
10:04okay
10:05we can
10:06talk about
10:07China
10:07if you
10:07want
10:07China
10:08the 50%
10:08of the
10:09cars
10:09that they
10:09are
10:10selling
10:10in the
10:11in the
10:11in the
10:12in their
10:13market
10:1350%
10:14they are
10:14electric
10:15electric
10:15cars
10:15they are
10:16doing
10:16the 90%
10:1790%
10:18of the
10:18batteries
10:19or the
10:19solar
10:20panels
10:20in the
10:20world
10:21a lot
10:22of they
10:22are coming
10:22here
10:23like
10:23they are
10:24doing
10:24more
10:24than us
10:25in terms
10:28to be
10:29ready
10:29to compete
10:30in the
10:30world
10:30that it's
10:31coming
10:31this is
10:32the question
10:33and for
10:34to do
10:35that
10:35we need
10:35predictability
10:36and a
10:37regulatory
10:37framework
10:37that helps
10:38and accompany
10:39the private
10:39sector
10:40because they
10:40need help
10:41on this
10:41transformation
10:42but makes
10:43predictable
10:44what we are
10:45going to do
10:45the next
10:4510-15
10:46years
10:46I got a
10:46final question
10:47on this
10:47point
10:47however
10:48and it's
10:48political
10:49and you
10:49are
10:49politicians
10:50the pushback
10:51to the
10:52green deal
10:52at times
10:53seems to be
10:54part of the
10:54cultural war
10:55some believe
10:56that green
10:56has gone
10:57to woke
10:58is that
10:59something
10:59that you
10:59consider
11:00has green
11:00become too
11:01woke
11:01is that
11:01a valid
11:02question
11:02this is
11:02not what
11:03the EPP
11:03considers
11:03but we
11:04have to
11:04see the
11:04result
11:05of the
11:05elections
11:05and we
11:06have now
11:06three groups
11:07in the
11:07parliament
11:07which are
11:08pushing back
11:09which do
11:09not believe
11:10that climate
11:11change exists
11:12and that's
11:12what we can
11:13feel of course
11:14but what we
11:15need is more
11:15flexibility
11:16this is all
11:16what I want
11:17to say
11:17well let me
11:18stop you
11:18out right there
11:19for a second
11:19and of course
11:20the show
11:20is called
11:21The Ring
11:21so it is
11:22time to
11:23take the
11:24gloves
11:24off
11:25now you
11:29both are
11:29elected to
11:30ask tough
11:31questions to
11:32each other
11:32obviously your
11:33constituencies and
11:34the voters who
11:35put you here in
11:36this hemicycle
11:36expect that
11:37so now this
11:38will be an
11:38opportunity to
11:39ask questions
11:40you can ask
11:41Javi and Javi
11:42will ask you
11:43and I want to
11:43hear you know
11:44the punch that
11:44you have
11:45we'll start
11:45with you
11:46my main
11:46concern is
11:47the industry
11:47so my
11:48question to
11:48you Javi
11:49is do you
11:49agree that
11:50we have to
11:50transform the
11:51green deal
11:51in a green
11:52industrial deal
11:53that we have
11:54to take into
11:55consideration
11:55the situation
11:56of the industry
11:57and help
11:57it to become
11:59green
11:59yeah my
12:00answer will
12:01be of course
12:02the European
12:03Green Deal
12:03has to be
12:04our strategy
12:05to growth
12:05and to create
12:06competitiveness
12:08of tomorrow
12:09and we are
12:11sure that
12:12the race
12:13for the
12:15space race
12:16of the 21st
12:16century
12:17it will be
12:17the green
12:18technology
12:18and we have
12:19to be sure
12:20that we are
12:20accompanying
12:21the private
12:22sector
12:22and the
12:23industries
12:24in this
12:24massive
12:25transformation
12:25and your
12:27question
12:27is the
12:28green deal
12:28is alive
12:29here in the
12:31European
12:31Parliament
12:32it is alive
12:34but we have
12:35to adapt
12:36it
12:36I'm very
12:37sure
12:37because there
12:38are new
12:38concerns
12:39of the people
12:40as I've
12:40seen
12:40and if you
12:41look in
12:41the State
12:42of the
12:42Union
12:42speech
12:43of Ursula
12:43von der Leyen
12:44she has
12:45also changed
12:45her focus
12:46she put
12:46forward
12:47defense
12:47housing
12:48so more
12:49the daily
12:49concerns
12:50of people
12:50because they
12:51are
12:51you know
12:51cannot cope
12:52with living
12:52costs
12:53so the
12:54concerns
12:54have changed
12:55so I think
12:56the green
12:56deal
12:56I mean
12:57it's our
12:57responsibility
12:58to still
12:58work on it
12:59but I
13:00agree with
13:01you
13:01you know
13:01with regard
13:02to citizens
13:02the priorities
13:03have changed
13:04why is the
13:05APP
13:05if you
13:05align me
13:06one second
13:06why is the
13:06APP
13:07working with
13:07parties
13:08and groups
13:08that believe
13:09climate change
13:10is not real
13:10then
13:10we don't
13:11work with
13:11them
13:11so what
13:12are the
13:12votes
13:12that we're
13:13seeing
13:13in which
13:13there's
13:14two
13:14majorities
13:14you can
13:15either work
13:15with the
13:15progressives
13:16or a
13:16form of
13:16heart
13:16right
13:17well
13:18we always
13:19first try to
13:20work in the
13:21platform
13:22and only
13:23if we do
13:23not come to
13:25results
13:25or if the
13:26social democrats
13:27are not
13:27reliable
13:27in the
13:28plenary vote
13:29then we
13:30just work on
13:31our content
13:32we never
13:32work with
13:33the far
13:33right
13:34we work
13:34with the
13:34EZR
13:35but we never
13:35work with
13:36the far
13:36right
13:36if they
13:37agree
13:37with our
13:38proposals
13:38that's not
13:39our
13:39concern
13:40the EPP
13:41is not
13:41working
13:41with the
13:42far
13:42right
13:42well
13:43the EPP
13:44now
13:45this was
13:47a change
13:48in European
13:49politics
13:50made
13:50majorities
13:51with the
13:51far
13:51right
13:51to pass
13:53legislation
13:53this was
13:54what happened
13:55with the
13:55omnibus one
13:56and I think
13:57this is
13:57problematic
13:57not only
13:58on the
13:58content
13:59and I
13:59think
13:59the
14:00discussion
14:00it should
14:02not be
14:02only on
14:03the
14:03content
14:03because
14:04it's
14:05normalizing
14:05the
14:06position
14:06of the
14:07far
14:08right
14:08in European
14:09politics
14:09and it
14:10will have
14:10consequence
14:10in medium
14:11long term
14:12also
14:12for the
14:13EPP
14:13in my
14:14view
14:14and
14:15to that
14:15point
14:16can you
14:16clarify
14:17what is
14:17the
14:17position
14:18of the
14:18EPP
14:18there's
14:19a lot
14:19of
14:19confusion
14:20this is
14:20now
14:20a group
14:20that is
14:21willing
14:21to pick
14:21and choose
14:22in some
14:22files
14:23you're
14:23willing
14:23to work
14:24with people
14:24that
14:24four years
14:25ago
14:25you would
14:26have
14:26never
14:26worked
14:26with
14:27this is
14:27not true
14:27because
14:27we
14:28take
14:28most
14:29of the
14:29decision
14:29with the
14:30platform
14:31and it's
14:31the left
14:32side
14:32who's
14:33also making
14:33decisions
14:34with the
14:34far
14:34right
14:34on other
14:35issues
14:35but I
14:36said
14:36we always
14:37have a
14:37first option
14:38to work
14:38with the
14:39platform
14:39only if
14:40we are
14:40deceived
14:40and if
14:41we are
14:41very much
14:42convinced
14:42that these
14:43measures
14:43are
14:43urgent
14:44and these
14:44measures
14:45and omnibus
14:45were
14:45urgent
14:46I would
14:46have been
14:47killed
14:47back home
14:48if I
14:48couldn't
14:48bring a
14:49result
14:49from this
14:49vote
14:49and we
14:50had to
14:50repeat
14:51the vote
14:51because
14:51we
14:51first
14:52tried
14:52with
14:52the
14:53social
14:53Democrats
14:53and
14:53renew
14:54she's
14:55making
14:55an
14:55excellent
14:55point
14:55it's
14:56urgent
14:56could
14:57you
14:57give
14:57more
14:58leeway
14:58are
14:58you
14:58being
14:59too
14:59tough
14:59precisely
15:00to accuse
15:00him
15:01of being
15:01at work
15:02with a
15:02far
15:02right
15:02we are
15:03we are
15:04being
15:04really
15:05constructive
15:05on these
15:06discussions
15:06on simplification
15:07and the
15:08reality is
15:08we are
15:09not
15:09blocking
15:09any
15:10file
15:10and any
15:11decision
15:11we are
15:12saying
15:12we can
15:13discuss
15:14how to
15:14simplify
15:15legislation
15:16in Europe
15:16but my
15:17point is
15:18the main
15:18problem
15:19is the
15:20only
15:20discussions
15:21that we
15:21are having
15:22here
15:22in Europe
15:23is about
15:24simplification
15:24and we
15:25will not
15:26fix our
15:26economic
15:27problems
15:27only with
15:28simplification
15:28what we
15:29can do
15:29we can
15:30discuss
15:30to have
15:31a deeper
15:32single
15:32market
15:32this is
15:33something
15:33that
15:33dragon
15:34let us
15:34say
15:34in the
15:34reports
15:35to deepen
15:36the single
15:36market
15:37we have
15:37a lot
15:37of sectors
15:38where we
15:39have
15:39problems
15:39on
15:40fragmentation
15:40we should
15:41work on
15:41that
15:42and if
15:42we work
15:43on these
15:43areas
15:43sure
15:44automatically
15:45it will
15:45be like
15:46the
15:46but it's
15:46not happening
15:47automatically
15:48and the
15:48EPP
15:48did win
15:49the European
15:49elections
15:50with that
15:50agenda
15:51so some
15:51would argue
15:52you should
15:52move
15:54we don't
15:55have to
15:55move
15:56what we
15:56have to
15:56do
15:57is represent
15:57our
15:57voters
15:58this is
15:58how
15:58politics
15:59works
15:59and like
16:00represent
16:01our
16:01voters
16:01and their
16:02agenda
16:02if they want
16:03to win
16:03elections
16:03or not
16:04if they want
16:05to still
16:05be relevant
16:05we have
16:07to represent
16:08our voters
16:08with the
16:09best will
16:10of to
16:10have
16:10compromises
16:11and to
16:12build
16:12things
16:12together
16:13but we
16:14will
16:14and the
16:15problem
16:15is like
16:15we will
16:16not fix
16:16our
16:16problems
16:17like
16:17when you
16:17say
16:18okay
16:18green
16:18agenda
16:18is to
16:19work
16:19like
16:20the
16:20climate
16:20is to
16:21work
16:21like
16:21the extreme
16:22events
16:23that we
16:23are
16:23seeing
16:24especially
16:25in the
16:25south
16:25of
16:25Europe
16:26we
16:26can
16:26tell
16:27to
16:27the
16:27people
16:27that
16:27it's
16:28dying
16:28when we
16:28have
16:29summers
16:30too hot
16:31or when
16:31we have
16:32drops
16:33during
16:34winter
16:34like
16:35to be
16:35honest
16:36this is
16:37not about
16:38work
16:38agenda
16:38this is
16:39about
16:39reality
16:40and adapt
16:41to a
16:41new
16:41reality
16:42and adapt
16:42to a
16:43new
16:43economy
16:43in the
16:43world
16:44and this
16:44is what
16:44we are
16:45trying
16:45to do
16:46but
16:46it's
16:46also
16:47true
16:47that
16:47you
16:47know
16:47industry
16:48is
16:48complaining
16:48for a
16:49long
16:49time
16:49over
16:50too
16:50much
16:50reporting
16:51too
16:51much
16:51legal
16:52requirement
16:52and I
16:53think
16:53we
16:53cannot
16:53close
16:53our
16:54eyes
16:54because
16:54we
16:54have
16:55to
16:55do
16:55both
16:55we
16:56have
16:56to
16:56alleviate
16:57the
16:58bureaucratic
16:58burden
16:59and we
16:59are
16:59now
16:59in
16:59November
17:00and the
17:01first
17:01Omnibus
17:02was presented
17:02in January
17:03so I
17:03think
17:03it's
17:03high
17:04time
17:04to
17:04deliver
17:05back
17:05home
17:05but
17:06we
17:06should
17:06also
17:06do
17:06the
17:06other
17:06thing
17:07but
17:07we
17:07should
17:07not
17:07neglect
17:08you
17:08know
17:08and
17:09listen
17:09to
17:09the
17:09industry
17:10because
17:10if
17:10you
17:10just
17:10do
17:11politics
17:11from
17:11Brussels
17:11and
17:12not
17:12listen
17:12to
17:12the
17:12stakeholders
17:13we
17:13will
17:13lose
17:13them
17:14the
17:14industry
17:15says
17:15either
17:16this
17:16happens
17:16or
17:16you're
17:17going
17:17to
17:17put
17:17a lot
17:17of
17:17people
17:17out
17:17of
17:17business
17:18we
17:18are
17:18going
17:18to
17:18continue
17:19but
17:19first
17:19let
17:20me
17:20stop
17:20you
17:20here
17:20for
17:21one
17:21second
17:21because
17:22I
17:22want
17:22to
17:22bring
17:23in
17:23another
17:24voice
17:24now
17:29Antonio
17:29Guterres
17:29as
17:30the
17:30Secretary
17:30General
17:30of
17:31the
17:31United
17:31Nations
17:31spoke
17:32at
17:33the
17:33plenary
17:33in
17:34Belen
17:35President
17:35Lula
17:36of
17:36Brazil
17:36said
17:37well
17:37COP
17:3830
17:38is
17:38the
17:39moment
17:39of
17:39truth
17:40it
17:40is
17:40the
17:40moment
17:40of
17:41the
17:41hard
17:41truth
17:41and
17:42the
17:42hard
17:42truth
17:42is
17:42that
17:42we
17:43have
17:43failed
17:43to
17:44ensure
17:44that
17:44we
17:45remain
17:45below
17:451.5
17:46degrees
17:47this
17:48is
17:48a
17:48moral
17:49failure
17:49and
17:50a
17:50deadly
17:50negligence
17:52these
17:52are
17:52very
17:53tough
17:53words
17:53from
17:54Antonio
17:54Guterres
17:55I
17:55was
17:56struck
17:56by
17:56the
17:56brutality
17:56of
17:57the
17:57words
17:57this
17:58more
17:58negligence
17:58well
17:59I
17:59feel
18:00that
18:00the
18:00world
18:00is
18:01not
18:01doing
18:01enough
18:02but
18:02at
18:02the
18:03same
18:03time
18:03I
18:03feel
18:04proud
18:04that
18:04Europe
18:05is
18:05working
18:06in
18:06the
18:06right
18:06direction
18:07and
18:07we
18:07are
18:08doing
18:08efforts
18:08we
18:08are
18:08making
18:09efforts
18:09in
18:09the
18:10right
18:10direction
18:10the
18:10European
18:11Green
18:11Deal
18:12and
18:12all
18:12the
18:12difficulties
18:13that
18:13we
18:13have
18:13with
18:14that
18:14is
18:14a
18:14good
18:14example
18:15that
18:15we
18:15are
18:16pushing
18:16in
18:17the
18:17right
18:17direction
18:18the
18:18things
18:18well
18:18emissions
18:19in
18:19Europe
18:20is
18:20an
18:20example
18:20we
18:21were
18:21able
18:21to
18:22decrease
18:2237%
18:24the
18:24emissions
18:24in
18:25Europe
18:25we
18:26have
18:26clear
18:26targets
18:27for
18:272030
18:28and
18:28for
18:282040
18:28we
18:29showed
18:29up
18:30what
18:30we
18:30get
18:30in
18:30return
18:31is
18:31that
18:31this
18:31is
18:31moral
18:32negligence
18:32and
18:32this
18:33is
18:33deadly
18:33negligence
18:34is
18:34this
18:34kind
18:34of
18:34language
18:35useful
18:35well
18:37I'm
18:38not
18:38sure
18:38about
18:39that
18:39either
18:39and
18:39I
18:39think
18:40also
18:40Brazil
18:41has
18:41a
18:41moral
18:41obligation
18:42and
18:42they
18:42want
18:42do
18:43you
18:43know
18:43different
18:43things
18:44they
18:44want
18:44to
18:44protect
18:45their
18:45rainforest
18:46but
18:46at
18:46the
18:46same
18:46time
18:47they
18:47want
18:47to
18:47drill
18:47oil
18:47so
18:48I
18:48mean
18:48they
18:48are
18:48also
18:48playing
18:49on
18:49many
18:50cards
18:50so
18:50I
18:51think
18:51we
18:51should
18:51be
18:52more
18:52moderate
18:52with
18:54each
18:54other
18:54and
18:55see
18:55the
18:55progress
18:56we
18:56can
18:56achieve
18:56together
18:57I
18:57feel
18:57the
18:57Europeans
18:58always
18:58get
18:58blamed
18:58and
18:59they
18:59got
18:59to
18:59pay
18:59the
18:59tab
19:00why
19:00is
19:00that
19:00happening
19:01because
19:02I
19:02think
19:02we
19:03are
19:12it
19:12oh
19:13it's
19:13the
19:13Paris
19:13agreement
19:14so
19:14it
19:14was
19:15made
19:15in
19:15Europe
19:15and
19:16the
19:16reality
19:16is
19:16the
19:17reality
19:17and
19:17I
19:17understand
19:18the
19:18words
19:18on
19:19that
19:19sense
19:20the
19:20reality
19:20is
19:21we
19:21are
19:21arriving
19:23to
19:23a
19:23point
19:23that
19:23it
19:23will
19:24be
19:24impossible
19:24to
19:24accomplish
19:25the
19:25goal
19:25of
19:26the
19:26Paris
19:26agreement
19:26of
19:271.5
19:28degrees
19:29of
19:29increase
19:29it's
19:29impossible
19:30we
19:30are
19:31moving
19:33to
19:33a
19:33world
19:34that
19:34probably
19:35we
19:35will
19:35have
19:362
19:363
19:37degrees
19:38of
19:38increase
19:39of
19:40temperatures
19:41and
19:41we're
19:41going
19:41to
19:41continue
19:42with
19:42the
19:42implications
19:43but
19:43first
19:43let's
19:43take
19:44a
19:44short
19:44break
19:44here
19:45on
19:45the
19:45ring
19:46but
19:46stay
19:46with
19:47us
19:47because
19:47we
19:48will
19:48be
19:48back
19:48very
19:49soon
19:49with
19:50more
19:50political
19:51punch
19:51stay
19:52on
19:52the
19:52ring
19:52welcome
20:01back
20:02to
20:02the
20:02ring
20:02your
20:03new
20:03weekly
20:04show
20:04I'm
20:04joined
20:05by
20:05MEPs
20:06Javi
20:06Lopit
20:07and
20:07Hildegard
20:08Bentele
20:08and the
20:09idea
20:09here
20:09is
20:10to
20:10bring
20:10the
20:11European
20:11Parliament's
20:12debate
20:12to
20:13your
20:13couch
20:13so
20:14what
20:14about
20:14you
20:15what
20:15do
20:15you
20:16think
20:16about
20:17the
20:17efforts
20:17when
20:17it
20:18comes
20:18to
20:18combating
20:18climate
20:19change
20:20and
20:20according
20:21to
20:21the
20:21Eurobarometer
20:22more
20:23than
20:238
20:23in
20:2410
20:24EU
20:24citizens
20:25believe
20:26it
20:26is
20:26urgent
20:27to
20:27take
20:27action
20:28while
20:2838%
20:29feel
20:29personally
20:30exposed
20:31to
20:31climate
20:32related
20:32risks
20:33also
20:3479%
20:35believe
20:36that
20:36more
20:37public
20:37financial
20:38support
20:38should
20:39be
20:39invested
20:39on
20:40the
20:41prevention
20:41and the
20:42transition
20:42to
20:43clean
20:44energy
20:45are you
20:45surprised
20:46by the
20:46numbers
20:46it seems
20:47there is
20:47really
20:47broad
20:48consensus
20:48this is
20:49something
20:49Europeans
20:49really want
20:50well
20:51this is
20:51a bit
20:51abstract
20:52when
20:52it
20:52comes
20:53to
20:53renovate
20:54your
20:54house
20:54to
20:55change
20:55your
20:55heating
20:56when
20:56it
20:56comes
20:56to
20:57buy
20:57electric
20:57core
20:57when
20:58it
20:58comes
20:58to
20:59buy
20:59a
21:00product
21:00which
21:00has
21:00recycled
21:01materials
21:01and
21:02it's
21:02a bit
21:02more
21:03expensive
21:03then
21:04attitudes
21:04change
21:05so
21:05the
21:06proof
21:07is
21:07in
21:07the
21:07pudding
21:07if
21:08other
21:08consumers
21:08are
21:09really
21:09willing
21:10to
21:10embrace
21:11these
21:11new
21:12products
21:13and
21:13if
21:13their
21:16job
21:16is
21:16lost
21:17are
21:17they
21:17ready
21:17to
21:17move
21:18to
21:18a
21:18different
21:18job
21:19in
21:19the
21:19new
21:19economy
21:20but
21:20if
21:20we
21:20say
21:21and
21:21here's
21:21the
21:21thing
21:21we
21:21use
21:22very
21:22strong
21:23language
21:23saying
21:23this
21:24is
21:24deadly
21:24negligence
21:25the
21:25temperature
21:26will
21:26go up
21:27by
21:27three
21:27to
21:27four
21:28this
21:28is
21:28going
21:28to
21:28be
21:28help
21:29for
21:29the
21:29southern
21:29Europeans
21:30and
21:30there
21:30we
21:30go
21:31well
21:31we
21:31need
21:31to
21:31work
21:32and
21:32figure
21:32out
21:32if
21:33we
21:33can
21:33get
21:33to
21:33an
21:33agreement
21:33maybe
21:34they
21:34say
21:34one
21:35thing
21:35but
21:35vote
21:35a
21:35different
21:35one
21:36I
21:36feel
21:37there's
21:37a
21:37gap
21:38between
21:38the
21:38language
21:39the
21:39results
21:40that
21:40we
21:40played
21:40and
21:40some
21:41of
21:41the
21:41actions
21:41that
21:41we
21:41debate
21:42here
21:42to
21:43be
21:44honest
21:44sometimes
21:44I
21:45feel
21:45that
21:45we
21:45have
21:45to
21:45do
21:46more
21:46and
21:47here
21:47at
21:47the
21:47European
21:48level
21:49everything
21:50is
21:50slow
21:51and
21:52sometimes
21:52frustrating
21:53it's
21:53true
21:53with
21:54the
21:54green
21:54agenda
21:54and
21:54with
21:54more
21:55elements
21:56at
21:56the
21:56same
21:57time
21:57I
21:57can
21:57say
21:57we
21:58are
21:58moving
21:58in
21:58the
21:58right
21:59direction
21:59we
22:00are
22:00the
22:00block
22:00in
22:01the
22:01world
22:01that
22:01we
22:01are
22:01doing
22:01better
22:02on
22:03that
22:03we
22:04are
22:04able
22:05now
22:05to
22:06decrease
22:06our
22:06emissions
22:07and
22:07at
22:07the
22:07same
22:08time
22:08growth
22:09and
22:09deliver
22:09growth
22:10during
22:10the
22:10last
22:10years
22:11and
22:12the
22:12problem
22:12and
22:13the
22:13point
22:13it's
22:13not
22:13about
22:14the
22:14green
22:14agenda
22:14the
22:15point
22:15is
22:15the
22:15model
22:16of
22:16prosperity
22:17of
22:17Europe
22:17is
22:18sober
22:18the
22:18model
22:19of
22:19prosperity
22:19based
22:20on
22:20cheap
22:21and
22:21easy
22:22energy
22:22coming
22:22from
22:23Russia
22:23security
22:24cheap
22:24and
22:24easy
22:25coming
22:25from
22:25United
22:25States
22:26and
22:26products
22:27cheap
22:28and
22:28easy
22:28coming
22:28from
22:28China
22:29this
22:29model
22:29of
22:30growth
22:30over
22:30the
22:30last
22:3030
22:31years
22:31is
22:32over
22:32and
22:32we
22:32have
22:33to
22:33rebuild
22:33it
22:33and
22:34a
22:34part
22:34of
22:35this
22:35rebuilding
22:35of
22:36this
22:36new
22:36construction
22:36of
22:37prosperity
22:37it
22:38will
22:38be
22:38green
22:39agenda
22:39but
22:40this
22:40green
22:41agenda
22:41is
22:42the
22:42problem
22:42and
22:42again
22:43I
22:43try
22:43to
22:43make
22:43sense
22:43of
22:43the
22:44poll
22:44that
22:44we
22:44played
22:44that
22:45brought
22:45support
22:46with
22:46the
22:46fights
22:47that
22:47we
22:47see
22:47day
22:47in
22:47and
22:48day
22:48out
22:48in
22:48this
22:58I
22:58don't
22:58think
22:59so
22:59no
22:59no
22:59but
22:59I
23:00think
23:00the
23:00problem
23:00is
23:00it's
23:01a
23:01problem
23:01which
23:01is
23:01in
23:01the
23:02future
23:02I
23:02mean
23:02we
23:03feel
23:03some
23:03effects
23:04of
23:04climate
23:04change
23:04but
23:04not
23:05yet
23:05that
23:05strong
23:06we
23:06know
23:06what
23:07will
23:07happen
23:07if
23:07the
23:07tipping
23:08points
23:08play
23:09in
23:09but
23:10at
23:10the
23:11same
23:11end
23:11we
23:28assemble
23:28the
23:29curse
23:29of
23:30the
23:30Chinese
23:30and
23:31the
23:31Chinese
23:31don't
23:31just
23:31copy
23:32they
23:32innovate
23:32they
23:33are
23:33innovating
23:33and
23:34they
23:34are
23:35very
23:35strong
23:36and
23:36very
23:36dominant
23:36and
23:37very
23:37big
23:37it
23:38changes
23:38everything
23:38in
23:39a
23:39way
23:39for
23:39Europe
23:39but
23:40now
23:40of
23:40course
23:41it
23:41is
23:41time
23:42to
23:42move
23:42on
23:42we'll
23:43continue
23:43on
23:43this
23:43but
23:43we
23:44do
23:44want
23:44to
23:44get
23:44to
23:44the
23:44fifth
23:45and
23:45final
23:46round
23:46are
23:46you
23:47ready
23:47now
23:51it's
23:52time
23:52for
23:52something
23:53different
23:53and
23:53I'm
23:54going
23:54to
23:54ask
23:55you
23:55we've
23:55done
23:55a lot
23:55of
23:56chit
23:56chatting
23:56talking
23:57debating
23:57hard
23:58on
23:58the
23:58stage
23:59but
23:59I
23:59want
23:59to
23:59move
24:00on
24:00to
24:00yes
24:01or
24:01no
24:01questions
24:02let's
24:02see
24:03if
24:03it's
24:03doable
24:03but
24:04I'll
24:04try
24:04my
24:05best
24:05and
24:05I
24:05want
24:06to
24:06start
24:06with
24:06this
24:07one
24:07perhaps
24:07with
24:08you
24:08when
24:09it
24:09comes
24:09to
24:092050
24:10net
24:11zero
24:11is
24:11that
24:11still
24:12realistic
24:12yes
24:13it's
24:14binding
24:14not
24:15only
24:15realistic
24:15binding
24:17and
24:17realistic
24:17could
24:18be
24:18two
24:18things
24:18do
24:18you
24:19believe
24:19it's
24:19realistic
24:19climate
24:20neutrality
24:20by 2050
24:21these
24:21are
24:22two
24:22different
24:22things
24:22no
24:23yes
24:26well
24:27it's
24:27not
24:28realistic
24:28it's
24:29it's
24:29a
24:29no
24:29binding
24:30but
24:30it's
24:31not
24:31realistic
24:31let's
24:33go
24:33into
24:33wealth
24:34your
24:34nations
24:34should
24:35they
24:35be
24:35paying
24:36more
24:36that
24:37means
24:37you
24:37should
24:38pay
24:38more
24:38yes
24:39internationally
24:40yes
24:40no
24:40yes
24:41and
24:42this
24:42is
24:42international
24:43consensus
24:43on
24:43climate
24:44diplomacy
24:45that
24:45the
24:45wealth
24:46countries
24:47we
24:47pay
24:47more
24:48because
24:48we
24:48emit
24:49more
24:50during
24:50the
24:50last
24:50century
24:51yes
24:51no
24:51yes
24:51no
24:52should
24:52we
24:52pay
24:52more
24:52wealthy
24:53countries
24:53no
24:53no
24:54what
24:54about
24:54red
24:55tape
24:55should
24:56we
24:56continue
24:56to
24:56cut
24:57red
24:57tape
24:57more
24:58aggressively
24:58yes
24:59should
25:00we
25:00continue
25:00to
25:00cut
25:00red
25:00tape
25:01yes
25:01or
25:01no
25:01more
25:01aggressively
25:02maybe
25:04we
25:05have
25:05to
25:05ensure
25:06this
25:08process
25:08can
25:11simplification
25:11however
25:12coexist
25:13and
25:13just
25:13to
25:13remind
25:13our
25:14viewers
25:14simplification
25:15is
25:15to
25:15strip
25:15back
25:16some
25:16of
25:16the
25:16red
25:17tape
25:17around
25:17green
25:18policies
25:19can
25:20that
25:20coexist
25:20really
25:21with
25:21green
25:22protections
25:23from
25:23the
25:23outside
25:23seems
25:24a
25:24contradiction
25:24yes
25:24or
25:25no
25:25yes
25:25yes
25:27but
25:28simplification
25:29simplification
25:29not just
25:30regulation
25:30the regulation
25:31and this
25:31is something
25:32that
25:32sometimes
25:33here
25:33when we
25:34are
25:34talking
25:34about
25:34simplification
25:35it's
25:35not
25:35simplification
25:36okay
25:36is the
25:37Paris
25:37agreement
25:37still
25:38valid
25:38it
25:39should
25:40yes
25:40or
25:41no
25:41yes
25:42Paris
25:43agreement
25:43is still
25:43valid
25:43it's
25:44valid
25:44but
25:45we
25:45have
25:45not
25:45met
25:45the
25:46targets
25:46just
25:47finally
25:47should
25:48farmers
25:48be
25:48rewarded
25:49for
25:49sustainable
25:50agricultural
25:50prices
25:51yes or
25:52no
25:52sure
25:52should
25:53they
25:53continue
25:53to be
25:53rewarded
25:54yes
25:54yes
25:55and just
25:55lastly
25:56when it
25:56comes to
25:57international
25:57support
25:58do you
25:59believe
25:59India
25:59China
26:00and the
26:00US
26:00all of
26:01which
26:01skipped
26:01COP
26:03are they
26:03still
26:03allies
26:04when it
26:04comes to
26:05international
26:05climate
26:06policies
26:06yes or
26:06no
26:07should
26:08be
26:08because
26:09we
26:09cannot
26:09find
26:09another
26:10ones
26:10the
26:10planet
26:10is
26:11formed
26:11with
26:11with the
26:12country
26:12that
26:12we
26:13are
26:13India
26:13China
26:14the
26:14US
26:15competing
26:15very
26:15hard
26:16are they
26:16still
26:16allies
26:16on this
26:17matter
26:17all
26:18but
26:18US
26:18not on
26:19the
26:19federal
26:20level
26:20but on
26:20the
26:21states
26:21level
26:22they're
26:22very
26:22present
26:23and we're
26:23now reaching
26:24the end
26:24of the
26:24show
26:25and here's
26:25the question
26:25we've had
26:26a great
26:26debate
26:26but were
26:27you convinced
26:28by your
26:28opponent
26:29it's called
26:29the ring
26:30of course
26:30were you
26:30convinced
26:31well we
26:32continue to
26:33work
26:33together
26:34I think
26:34we are
26:34the center
26:35both of
26:36us
26:36and it's
26:37our
26:37responsibility
26:38to make
26:38the green
26:39deal
26:39the green
26:39industrial
26:40deal
26:40happen
26:41yes
26:42I think
26:43that we
26:44have
26:44difference
26:44but at
26:45the same
26:45time
26:45we have
26:45common
26:46space
26:46and we
26:47have to
26:47work
26:48on that
26:48common
26:48space
26:48because
26:49if we
26:50are not
26:50able
26:51to have
26:51common
26:52solutions
26:52together
26:53it will
26:53be the
26:53far right
26:54who will
26:55impose
26:55their agenda
26:56for the
26:56next
26:56years
26:56okay
26:57so for
26:57the
26:57omnibus
26:58the
26:58next
26:58one
26:59it's
26:59on
26:59TV
26:59it's
26:59caught
27:00here
27:00you
27:00will
27:00work
27:00together
27:01based
27:01on
27:01this
27:02I mean
27:03it's
27:03gotta
27:03be
27:03yeah
27:04this
27:06is on
27:07tape
27:07and we're
27:07gonna keep
27:08an eye
27:08on this
27:09well thank
27:10you so
27:10much
27:11for to
27:11the two
27:11of you
27:12of course
27:12for joining
27:13us
27:13Hildegard
27:14and
27:14Javi
27:14thank you
27:15so much
27:16and it's
27:16been great
27:17obviously
27:17to share
27:18this time
27:18with you
27:18and on
27:19that note
27:19we want
27:20to hear
27:20from you
27:21what about
27:22you
27:22do you
27:22believe
27:23the green
27:23transition
27:24green
27:24policies
27:25is still
27:25good
27:26for Europe
27:26an
27:27opportunity
27:27or a
27:29we want
27:33to hear
27:33your views
27:34see you
27:34very soon
27:35and of course
27:35back again
27:36on the ring
27:37on your news
27:38thank you
27:39very much
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