- 14 ore fa
Il crimine è ovunque e Bruxelles non ne è esente: Rama difende l'Albania nel suo percorso verso l'Ue
Il premier albanese Edi Rama afferma che il suo Paese merita un posto nell'Ue, menzionando le riforme e il sostegno dell'opinione pubblica. Secondo Rama, la criminalità e la corruzione sono problemi seri, ma non solo a Tirana
ALTRE INFORMAZIONI : http://it.euronews.com/2025/11/24/il-crimine-e-ovunque-e-bruxelles-non-e-da-meno-rama-difende-lalbania-nel-suo-percorso-vers
Abbonati, euronews è disponibile in 12 lingue.
Il premier albanese Edi Rama afferma che il suo Paese merita un posto nell'Ue, menzionando le riforme e il sostegno dell'opinione pubblica. Secondo Rama, la criminalità e la corruzione sono problemi seri, ma non solo a Tirana
ALTRE INFORMAZIONI : http://it.euronews.com/2025/11/24/il-crimine-e-ovunque-e-bruxelles-non-e-da-meno-rama-difende-lalbania-nel-suo-percorso-vers
Abbonati, euronews è disponibile in 12 lingue.
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NovitàTrascrizione
00:00Now, my guest for this year of conversation is Albania's Prime Minister, Edi Rama.
00:12Sir, thank you so much for joining us.
00:15You are in Brussels holding talks about enlarging the European Union and joining the European Union.
00:22So the obvious question is, why does Albania want to become an EU member?
00:27Because this is what we always wanted.
00:30And that we finally can.
00:32So we came from a very long way.
00:37And we were under different empires.
00:43And finally, of our own choice, we want to join this empire.
00:53And, oh, you consider it an empire, the European Union?
00:56Of course.
00:57In what way?
00:57An empire, in all the ways.
01:01A nice one.
01:03A nice one.
01:04So, well, here's the thing.
01:05The question why I ask you why now is you say it's a nice empire.
01:10But, of course, it has been a very difficult three years now for the European Union.
01:15Obviously, the war in Ukraine is having a lot of impact in the European conversation.
01:19We've also seen this moment of either radical change for the EU or slow agony.
01:24Mario Draghi said that.
01:25So, has the EU lost some of the gloss around it or do you still believe there is still an opportunity?
01:30Listen, there are different things you are asking about.
01:36So, on one hand, it's about how we see it.
01:42And on the other hand, it's about how Europe should see itself in this new world.
01:50When it comes to how we see it, we see it as the only place we want to be because it's the only place where certain things that we fought for are going to be guaranteed.
02:07And I'm talking about freedom, I'm talking about equality in front of the law, I'm talking about democracy in general.
02:18From my own angle, very humbly, I would say that Europe, it's not that Europe has lost something, it's that Europe should gain something.
02:33And when you look at the situation, however, in Europe, obviously the war is still going on.
02:38You say very humbly, I'm not going to tell the EU what they need to do because right now you're not a member of the EU.
02:44But you also said, I have my views of what Europe should be.
02:47What do you think the war in Ukraine is going to do to this continent?
02:50Well, the war on Ukraine is beyond Ukraine in a way.
03:01It's a very brutal signal of changing world, of gathering storms of geopolitics and of different ballgame in the international arena.
03:21And for that Europe needs to come out with an approach that is not based on the old new normal because it's not going to come back.
03:41But it's based on how to make sure that it will not become irrelevant.
03:53So the war in Ukraine is a big test for all of us in many ways.
03:59And first and foremost, I believe in how much Europe will be able to, at the end, be a driving force for peace and not a force of war.
04:20You said it will depend on largely how this war ends, the reflection in Europe.
04:27If there's a bad deal in Ukraine, is that going to make Europe weaker?
04:30And is that a union that you want to be a part of, a weak union?
04:34Listen, it all depends.
04:36It all depends in this case because, let's face it, you know, it doesn't look very comforting that the European Union or Europe as such,
04:47the democratic Europe has not yet a peace plan for Ukraine.
04:52And this does not mean to compromise on the territorial integrity or to recognize the result of aggression in any shape or form.
05:08But it means to find a way to combine the resistance to the aggression with a realistic peace plan
05:20and to make the outmost for offering both resilience, resistance, muscles in the arena
05:32and vision of the future, of a common future possibly, including Russia,
05:40when it comes to a path towards first peace and then cooperation.
05:48I know it looks like completely crazy to think in these terms today,
05:55but Europe has shown that enemies can become partners and partners can become friends.
06:05Of course, to go there, first and foremost, we all need to overcome the brutality of the aggression
06:15and to not reward the aggression by no doubt.
06:18And that's interesting because a lot of the language that we hear coming out of Brussels says
06:22that Russia is now a threat for Europeans and there is no clear path in terms of normalizing relationships.
06:29Are you looking at Russia at a country that is, yes, a threat to Europeans?
06:33Or is there perhaps a way that you have to engage just because Russia is not going anywhere?
06:40Listen, one does not exclude the other in my view.
06:46The Soviet Union was a threat to the world and to the United States,
06:50but Richard Nixon and Henry Kissinger, they found a way to build in the same time
07:01a very solid channel of communication and to start something completely new in the world scene.
07:11Same with the communist China at that time.
07:13Now, of course, I don't want to make comparisons that may not fit the purpose,
07:21but I simply want to say that while fighting, and rightly so,
07:28while supporting Ukraine, and rightly so,
07:32while thinking in terms of strength, and rightly so,
07:39Europe should also have its own plan of peace and should not give up diplomacy
07:47because outsourcing the European diplomacy and outsourcing whatever type of peace
08:01that may come on the other side of the ocean,
08:04it doesn't seem to have been very rewarding so far.
08:09So when you say outsourcing, you mean to Trump?
08:11If there's no communication?
08:11No, I mean, no, but it's not to Trump.
08:16On the contrary, thanks to Trump,
08:18Europe rediscovered the word ceasefire,
08:22which seemed to be banned from the vocabulary
08:27with the previous administration.
08:29So I mean, it doesn't matter whatever happens on the other side of the ocean
08:35or whomever is on the other side of the ocean.
08:40Europe should have its own peace plan and, of course, then harmonize and then integrate and so on.
08:47Where is it?
08:47So when you talk to your European counterparts and they say,
08:50we want a just and fair peace, you don't think there's any depth to that?
08:53No, I am not advocating any unjust or unfair peace.
08:58I'm simply saying that diplomacy should not be left behind, although there is a war.
09:06You know, don't forget, you know, Israel and Hamas were fighting to the teeth
09:15and they were communicating, they were negotiating, they were talking.
09:19So this is something normal.
09:22And it's not a war somewhere.
09:25It's a war in Europe.
09:27And now going back to the reason why you're in Brussels,
09:32has it had any impact, the fact that there's this war going on,
09:35that now there's this real momentum on enlargement?
09:37Is this impacting you in a positive way where you say,
09:39because of this war, now there's this impetus?
09:41If there had been no invasion of Ukraine, we would not be here.
09:44We would not be talking about this.
09:45It's very probable.
09:47And it's sad.
09:49It's sad that...
09:50That it took a war.
09:50It's sad that it took a war to turn the very just and right words in real deeds
09:58because it has always been said that the Western Balkans are strategically important
10:05for the European Union, that the future of the Western Balkans is the European Union,
10:10that one day we'll be together.
10:13But in the meantime, the process was quite disappointing in many ways.
10:19I must say that the aggression created a new energy.
10:32And this is also something very, you know, inspiring,
10:38as it is inspiring how Europe got together,
10:42as it is inspiring to read in the wall of this big building
10:46and having a very clear, you know, message of unity.
10:54And now you've entered what is now seen as almost a final stretch in negotiations,
10:58and then it will become a political question, too,
11:00because you have to win over the 27 heads of state.
11:03Who do you consider your biggest ally?
11:04Because to me, when I see it from the outside,
11:07Giorgio Ameloni is your best friend in Europe, isn't she?
11:10Listen, I don't want to go there because it would not be fair to the very true
11:23and very generous friendship we are being offered by many in this part.
11:33You have a special chemistry.
11:34You can see it.
11:34What do you like about her?
11:36Yeah, you now are curious because she's a woman, you are a woman.
11:41But I must say that when it comes to Italy,
11:44there is something very special between Albania and Italy in general.
11:50and all the Italian prime ministers,
11:54independently from their political party or political colors of the government,
12:05they have been very good to us.
12:06And with Giorgia is special chemistry.
12:10I cannot hide it because it's very visible, right?
12:14And more than that, beyond that,
12:19she is someone that is very much about doing things and not just saying things,
12:27which is not very typically Italian, I must say, but she is like that.
12:32And would you be better off if there were more leaders like Giorgia Ameloni?
12:37Listen, Giorgia is one of a kind, and I'm not sure she can be replicated,
12:44but by no doubt, more women in leadership positions will help Europe to be stronger.
12:53And this is obvious when you see the president of the European Union Commission,
13:01when you see Giorgia, when you see Mette Frederiksen.
13:04So these women are incredibly strong,
13:07and they make men look like they have to improve.
13:12And, of course, when it comes to Albania,
13:14in a European context, we often hear it in the sentence,
13:18the Albanian model.
13:19I'm sure you know what that refers to.
13:21Obviously, this is a deal that you cut with regards to migration,
13:24where the Italians, they now have set up this migration center,
13:28and their jurisdiction is applied, but this is your land.
13:31When you hear the Albanian model,
13:33a lot of people assume or think of it as a loss of sovereignty of a country,
13:37and that refers to yours.
13:38Is that unfair?
13:40What do you mean sovereignty?
13:41We are...
13:42To have police from another country, law from another country,
13:45migrants from another country.
13:48You know, Italy is not another country.
13:50Italy is, you know, the Albania we look forward to have.
13:58So Italians are Albanians dressed by Versace.
14:02So we are the same people.
14:05We speak two different languages.
14:07We are united by the same sea.
14:12We love many things.
14:14But when you hear the dark side of the Albanian model,
14:17what does that mean to you?
14:18Is that something that you go,
14:19it is unfair, and by the way,
14:20more countries would do this if they could?
14:22First of all, not with Albania,
14:24because we can do it only with Italy, as I said, you know,
14:28because it's...
14:30There are many reasons for that.
14:32And on the other hand,
14:35I don't care what people say, you know.
14:38It's good that people can say things.
14:40You don't care about this perception of a country
14:42that's created a part of sovereignty.
14:43This is why we love freedom.
14:46This is why we want democracy,
14:47because people can say whatever they want.
14:49You don't regret it in any way.
14:51You can do it again.
14:51No, what sovereignty, you know.
14:54Italians are at home in Albania,
14:58and we feel at home in Italy, so...
15:01The Italians don't apply your law.
15:03But it's up to them to apply their law
15:05in that piece of land
15:06where they have to manage this operation,
15:10which is theirs.
15:11And they asked us to do it,
15:14and we said, of course, you are welcome.
15:16It's your home.
15:17There's this idea that you are putting the police,
15:20the laws, and people from one country to another,
15:22and that you ceded part of your territory for that.
15:25In that specific area,
15:26it's almost a piece of Italy.
15:28Some would argue there's something wrong in that model,
15:31but at the same time,
15:32I wonder if you think there's a level of hypocrisy,
15:35because more would do it if they could.
15:36No, I can't accuse anyone of hypocrisy.
15:39I simply think that people have different views,
15:42and sometimes people are jealous,
15:46but it's human.
15:47In this case, I don't know.
15:48I simply know that for us,
15:52it has been a due,
15:55so we had to do it because Italy asked us.
15:58And when Italy asks, we always say yes.
16:01And, you know, it's not just Georgia.
16:05It's Italy.
16:06And do you hope that that yes,
16:08when they ask, we say yes,
16:10that they are going to return the favor at some point?
16:13Some argue it's a transactional relationship in a way.
16:16No, there's no transactional relation between Italy and us,
16:18because Italy has done for us a lot
16:23without any favor asked in return.
16:28And I'll never forget the day we were so down,
16:37because an earthquake hit us very, very strongly.
16:43And the first to arrive in our health
16:46were the Italian firefighters,
16:52and they entered under the rubbles
16:55to save lives of people they didn't know.
16:59In a country they put their feet for the first time,
17:05and they did it like heroes.
17:09And, Prime Minister, just a final question.
17:11You've said there's a lot of cliches and stereotypes
17:13about what Albania is.
17:15I didn't say that, but I agree with you.
17:19No, you've never said,
17:20because I've said this in a sentence where you said,
17:22there's ideas that have been presented about Albania
17:26that I find are a cliche or stereotypes
17:29of what Albanian people are.
17:30At the same time, some of your critics would argue
17:32what this collective imagination alludes to
17:35is this idea of perhaps mafias, crime, gangs.
17:38Is that something that you take serious and you say,
17:40well, it's not a stereotype,
17:42it's something we have to fight?
17:43And how do you do this dual path
17:46in which you change the narrative,
17:48but also tackle issues like this?
17:49No, but the narrative has already changed,
17:52and it's changing every day,
17:53because now Albania is not anymore
17:55a mysterious shithole in the middle of Europe,
18:01where everyone...
18:01You think that's how people perceived you?
18:03Everyone was imagining, you know,
18:06mafia and criminals and drugs and prostitutes
18:09and all the bad things.
18:13Now Albania is a shining example
18:16where millions and millions of Europeans
18:20come to visit,
18:22and where they see that it's a piece of Europe
18:26that has to be part of the mosaic,
18:30while in the same time.
18:33Do we have still issues with organized crime?
18:37Yes, we do.
18:39Who don't?
18:39Look at this city.
18:41This city is, you know, an example,
18:46and still there are great things happening here.
18:49Do we have issues with drugs?
18:52Who don't?
18:52Then, of course, we need to fight,
18:54and the fight will never end,
18:57as the example of Europe shows.
18:59Europe has fought drugs all the way,
19:03but drugs are still in Europe,
19:06and the fight goes on.
19:08And the Commission also made that point,
19:09so you agree on that specifically, too,
19:12in the recommendations.
19:13So, Prime Minister...
19:14I agree with all the recommendations.
19:16I have never seen anything more objective,
19:20more brutally...
19:21So it was a good report.
19:22More brutally truthful and more amazingly inspiring
19:26than the European Commission report.
19:27We live for this book.
19:29Well, we'll tell the commissioners
19:30you'll be happy to see someone read it
19:32and start to end.
19:33They know, they know,
19:34and we have some people that read it
19:36from the beginning to the end.
19:37I don't know how they survived it,
19:38but they do,
19:39and I just adore them,
19:42and I live for this book.
19:44Looking at this book getting better and better
19:47is the legacy of my political life.
19:50Well, on that note, Prime Minister,
19:52thank you very much for joining us on Euronews.
19:54Thank you.
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