Who Hired the Hitman Season 1 Episode 2

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Who Hired the Hitman. (2025) Season 1 Episode 2 - The Murder of Big Joe   #Hitman #RealityInsightHub   🎞 Please subscribe to our official channel to watch the full movie for free, as soon as possible. ❤️Reality Insight Hub❤️ 👉 Official Channel:  />👉 THANK YOU ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

Transcript

00:00The idea of a hitman is a long-time trope of the movies.

00:25You've got John Cusack and gross point blank.

00:28You've got the guys from Pulp Fiction, Dressed in Black, The Narrow Ties.

00:33Even more recently, Michael Fassbender is the killer.

00:37This case was more like Fargo.

00:39This was Amateur Hour.

00:41I felt that this was a story that should be told.

00:46And 25 years later, it's just being told again.

00:52The case had a number of twists and turns.

00:55There was a business card attached to his head.

01:01They create a homemade silencer with an empty soda bottle.

01:07Who does that?

01:10And when you hear what they did it for, what the price was, you scratch your head.

01:17Did she set this up?

01:19Ben Franklin said three people can keep a secret if two of them are dead.

01:23In this case, three people couldn't keep a secret.

01:27One of those bullets had the victim's name on it.

01:30We were all asking the same questions.

01:32Joe Lewinsky was a close friend of mine.

01:46He was a big brother to me.

01:49Anybody who knew Joe would call him loose.

01:53It would be a deep loose.

01:56He was a fun guy to be around and always cracking jokes, having a good time.

02:00Joe didn't have any children.

02:02He liked partying.

02:04His dad did have a landscape business.

02:07Joe did landscaping also.

02:09But he had other ways to make money.

02:12Buying and selling cars.

02:13Repairing other people's cars.

02:15And the wintertime, Joe was snowplower.

02:19The night of December 14th, I came home from work.

02:27I received a phone call at 6.36 or 6.37 p.m.

02:31Joe's dad, Mr. Lewinsky, was on the other side of that line.

02:36He said, Joe didn't show up to do any of his snowplowing.

02:40We don't know where he is, and we can't get into the shop because it's locked and you only have the key.

02:48Joe's place was mainly a structure of many garages.

02:53That's where he ran the business.

02:55But above, the two that were in the front were a studio apartment.

02:59So I arrived.

03:00I opened the door because I had the key.

03:02And when I entered, I went up the stairs.

03:05Now, these stairs were rather steep, wooden, crickety.

03:10You couldn't walk up them without making noise.

03:14I went upstairs, and I saw that he was on the bed.

03:19That was dark.

03:21So I called his name.

03:22Joe, Joe.

03:24Joe, get up.

03:26You awake?

03:27You all right?

03:27Joe.

03:29There was no response.

03:32So I went over, and I put my two fingers, my index finger and my middle finger, on his back.

03:36And at that point is when I realized something was terribly wrong here.

03:43And he was cold to the touch.

03:44So.

03:47Our people got a call.

03:49The officers took a look at the scene, found Joe Nowinski face down in his bed,

03:56bleeding from the area of his ear, and apparently deceased.

04:03When we entered the crime scene, it was in disarray.

04:06They didn't find any sign of forced entry.

04:11Clothes strewn about, et cetera.

04:13The wallet was left open.

04:16It's hard to tell if something is missing because we don't know what's normally at the scene.

04:20So initially, the thought is, well, was there a struggle?

04:25Was there a dispute that went on?

04:29However, the body tells a different story.

04:32Joe was laying in bed, partially undressed and covered by a blanket, suggesting that at the time he was probably asleep.

04:42About midnight was the approximate time of death.

04:47And he was a big guy.

04:48So if, in fact, he had been awakened while the assailants were present, there would have been a struggle and there would have been a fight.

04:58And the scene would have been much different.

04:59So what we took away was that he was basically executed while he was sleeping.

05:06We could see there was some copper bullet fragments present on and near the body.

05:12And there were little bits of paper surrounding his head.

05:16One curiosity reported that the scene was the presence of a business card on the side of Joe's head.

05:25The card was kind of a mystery.

05:29The name of their company was Pain Realty.

05:33Now, it's spelled differently than pain, P-A-I-N.

05:37But the significance of the word pain may be connected in some way.

05:43Maybe the suspect left it as an indication that, yeah, I'm going to deliver some pain.

05:47The murder of Joe Nowinski was a rarity and not something we see often, especially in West Hartford.

05:58West Hartford is a suburb of the city of Hartford.

06:02It's a pretty safe town.

06:05We'd get a murder maybe every other year.

06:08It was a whodunit to start with.

06:10So, the officer walked into the victim's friends, relatives, and associates because they didn't set any light on the internet.

06:26I met Joe, like, 56 years ago.

06:30He was 14, I was 10.

06:32You know, we're riding bikes, playing basketball.

06:34We're always at one another's house.

06:35As we got a little older, probably around 12, 13 years old, we dated for pretty much six years, on and off, and then we got married a year after high school.

06:45I was 19.

06:47Joey was, what, 22, 23 when we got married?

06:51That's our wedding photo.

06:53He was just really caring and made me feel, you know, that he was just the one that I thought I was going to spend the rest of my life.

07:04And we talked about having a family and having kids and things like that.

07:09It just got to the point later on, I guess we kind of just, like, grew apart.

07:13We were divorced.

07:15We were married pretty much probably about almost three years, three and a half years.

07:18I, to this day, believed that he loved me and he still, but we were just better friends than we were as husband and wife.

07:25Joe never remarried or had children, but he loved his family.

07:29Uncle Joey was a big kid.

07:34He just liked to have fun.

07:36He had to be the center of attention, like, the biggest personality in the room.

07:40And he just, he didn't grow up.

07:42And even, like, I was looking at some pictures, and it's the five siblings, and it's a picture of them all as little kids.

07:50And he's standing behind them, like, making a pose.

07:54And that's so him, even as a kid.

07:57Joe is my uncle.

07:58He was definitely the fun uncle.

08:00He was the guy with the loud car, boats, motorcycles.

08:03One of the things I think about the most when I think about him is my grandmother yelling at him for driving too fast, because you could usually hear him coming up the street.

08:16When we were crazy kids growing up, his true passion was cars.

08:22Had to have a high-performance motor.

08:24Had to have the loud exhaust.

08:26My brother Steve owned a car that he used to drag race.

08:30And we did a lot of things.

08:32A lot of boating.

08:34A lot of amusement parks.

08:36A lot of racing.

08:37A lot of demolition derbies.

08:40That's one.

08:41And used to go blue fishing.

08:45Oh, my God.

08:47You know how you know Joe was on the boat?

08:50Big blue, yeah, big blue.

08:52He'd be yelling, oh, my God, he cleared the boat out, right?

08:54Just so you could get his side of the boat.

08:56Yeah.

08:56Big mouth.

08:58Big, big, big, large mouth.

08:59He had to be noticed.

09:00And he was.

09:02I think Uncle Joey lived his life to the fullest.

09:04Every time I think Uncle Joey, if I just remember back to when I was little, it's always fun things that I remember.

09:10I just remember happiness and love.

09:13And that's all I want him to be remembered.

09:17It breaks my heart that he's, most people only know him as a murder victim.

09:22When they said they found Joe that he was dead, they said he was shot.

09:27I didn't want to know.

09:29Because I didn't want to remember him that last time I saw him.

09:32I wanted to remember how I knew him before.

09:35Not seeing him with a bullet in his head and laying in his bed.

09:39I didn't want to remember him like you see him in there with that smile, this gold chain.

09:48He's loved.

09:54He's still loved.

09:55He's still loved.

09:55After his murder, there was lots of questions, you know, why.

10:04I didn't know if there was somebody trying to get revenge on him.

10:08Were they going to try to hurt someone else in the family?

10:10A lot of us all went into hiding at that point.

10:12We kind of stayed home and my mother said, Raymond, watch your back because you have no,

10:16you have no idea who or what or when it might be coming for you or anybody else.

10:25The investigators really were at a loss for what this might have been.

10:29They obviously go speak to various people to try to find out if there was any ongoing beefs or anything like that.

10:36They also now look into the business card from Payne Real Estate and, you know, whether that had any role.

10:44We did connect with the owner of the company and he had stated that Joe and Penn wanted to buy some property.

10:50And it didn't work out, but he took his business card and he had nothing to do with it.

10:55You know, everything's a building block in an investigation.

10:57You start from the body, work your way out and try to figure out what has meaning in a crime scene and what doesn't.

11:04There was not any force entry in this situation and, you know, it appears Mr. Nowinski knew his attacker.

11:15Investigators learned that Joe, the deceased, had a girlfriend.

11:20Rosemary Cusano.

11:24She was 30s, tall, long flowing hair, sexy looking.

11:30You see, wear a lot of lipstick, real deep red lipstick all the time.

11:38Hey, kiss that brother, you're going to be red all over.

11:40I know Joe was very much in love with her.

11:47How could he not? She was a very good looking woman.

11:49From what I know, from what I've seen of Rose with Joe, being how long they were together, it was, for me, it wasn't long.

11:59Because I, Joe just brought her on.

12:02I'd say, if anything, a couple of months, maybe a couple of months.

12:09We would meet her at parties.

12:11My wife would talk to her, play sports.

12:13We'd eat, we'd drink, we'd have fun.

12:16I know she was very, like, flirtatious with his friends and stuff.

12:22One day, my aunt was standing behind Rosemary and one of my uncle's friends.

12:27And I guess she made a very sexual comment to his friend.

12:31And so, I think that thought process with some of my family was that she was like that to men.

12:40We all understood how she was.

12:41She liked to flirt with the guys and stuff like that.

12:44Hitting on guys, like, hugging them, putting her arm around, you know, talking with them.

12:49Not meaning anything, just to tease Joe.

12:52He was a little bit jealous like that, you know?

12:53When an investigator hears that someone is talking about maybe a loved one, but not in a very positive way,

13:01that's a person that I want to talk with.

13:06We actually contacted his girlfriend, Rosemary.

13:10She was very forthcoming with information, but she didn't seem upset.

13:17Rosemary gave us a background on their relationship.

13:21It was complicated.

13:23Their relationship was pretty hot and cold.

13:28I think they were both very emotional people.

13:33And she, you know, shared that he could be verbally abusive at times.

13:39And sometimes physically abusive.

13:45Yeah, I think I do recall hearing that.

13:48Joe would sometimes get loud with her for various reasons.

13:52There was a time where I was at the shop working, and they were clearly in a shouting match.

14:00It clearly elevated.

14:02She was hands-on all over him.

14:04Yeah, of course, he, you know, puts his hands up and tries to get away and, you know, hold her back a little bit.

14:09And I stepped in between them, and I said, no, this has got to stop, or Joe, this has got to stop, or I'm leaving.

14:16I don't know what it was pertaining to, but it was a time that I was very uncomfortable, and they knew it.

14:23It slowed down at that point.

14:26They did stop the bickering, and we'll leave it at that.

14:30This piques our interest.

14:33We want to try to confirm.

14:35And there was another friend of the victim telling us that Joe treated Rosemary very bad.

14:44This was Mark Pascual.

14:46He had a small engine repair shop.

14:51He worked on boats, boat motors, and jet skis, and snowmobiles.

14:57I don't think particularly prosperous.

14:59He lived in his parents' house in the basement.

15:04Mark Pascual was someone Joe met up at the lake.

15:09Joe was having trouble with his boat.

15:12Went over to the marina to see if they could see what was wrong with it, and that's where he met Mark.

15:16Joe had a boat, and Mark had a marine repair shop.

15:23So the friendship was probably more convenient for Joe to get some free work done on his boat.

15:30He was, he's a weird-looking guy.

15:33He's a pretty short man.

15:36His hair is really, really curly, kind of all over the place.

15:40He's not the most attractive being.

15:43Mark, I'm not going crazy eyes, huh?

15:47He did have one wandering eye.

15:50Joe, I said, Joe, this guy ain't for you, man.

15:52What are you hanging with him for?

15:53Well, you got the marina.

15:54Get my boat fixed for nothing, Steve.

15:56Take care of me.

15:57I said, I don't know, Joe.

15:59I don't know, Joe.

16:00This guy ain't too slick.

16:01We were talking to him, and Mark admitted that he knew Rosemary and Joe.

16:08Mark said he treated her violently, and perhaps there was some fear of that.

16:12We delved a little further with Rosemary about Joe.

16:20It turns out Rosemary was the last person to actually have eyes on, see him alive.

16:26This case, Rosemary told us earlier that day.

16:39She had stopped to see him.

16:42She went upstairs, and his door was open.

16:49Our apartment was in disarray.

16:50He was lying in the bed, and she surprised him, and he's like, what the hell are you doing here?

16:57And she goes, when the door was open, I was calling you, the door was open.

17:02And he said something like, well, that's not like me.

17:04And I think she saw a joint in the ashtray or something, and he became very irate.

17:14He yelled and screamed at her, told her to get the hell out, pushed her against the wall.

17:18She left, and then they spoke a little bit later, and they went to dinner together.

17:24Like nothing ever happened.

17:28Rosemary, she had kids, and she told us he had all kinds of presents wrapped up

17:34for all the kids that night.

17:38Joe gave them early Christmas presents.

17:43And as they leave, the last thing Joe says to her is something to the effect of, have a nice life.

17:56I think he realized that he and Rosemary had come to the end.

18:00He gave those presents to the boys two weeks before Christmas.

18:07Maybe Joe had decided that he was done with Rosemary.

18:12Was there some motive here?

18:15It wouldn't be abnormal for her to have access to his apartment.

18:19When they had this information, their first thoughts were, did Rosemary kill Joe?

18:32When the investigator hears that someone has placed themselves at the scene, it piques our interest.

18:38Oftentimes, people that are closer to the victim are often looked at.

18:44But you don't want to go necessarily with one theory and try to make your evidence fit that theory.

18:50You want to be open to any possibility.

18:52I believe it was in the area of 8 or 9 p.m. that Rosemary had last seen Joe, and she goes home with her boys.

19:05In this case, we conduct our interviews, and we check with alibis, and we verify that she was telling the truth.

19:13And the problem was, one of Joe Nowenski's employees was supposed to work that night, and so Joe had left some keys for him in the mailbox.

19:25But the keys were not in the usual place.

19:28One can assume it could have been used by the killers to get in, especially to get in quietly.

19:34It was well known that Joe kept a spare key in his mailbox.

19:40If anyone knew that, could access the apartment.

19:46And at this point, we had nothing to indicate that Rosemary was directly involved.

19:55But during our interview with Rosemary, we learned...

19:59Joe had some dicey relationships with other people.

20:02He sold a little weed, sold a little coke.

20:05Bone sharking, turning back odometers.

20:07Who's the hell saying that? The cops are saying that?

20:09No!

20:10I was a mechanic for Joe, and at no time did Joe ever ask me to roll back in O'Donnell.

20:16Stolen merchandise, gambling, sale of false ID.

20:20One of the early concerns of the investigators was there might be too many suspects just based on him being a jerk to people around.

20:27And his lifestyle, it was somewhat of a mystery.

20:30He had told some friends over a period of a couple of weeks that a couple of his cars in his driveway, the tires had been slashed.

20:42The window in the garage was broken.

20:44The incidents occurred probably a week prior to the murder.

20:50He thought somebody had targeted him.

20:55He was concerned that if somebody is causing property damage, will that lead to violent actions?

21:06So he inquired with somebody about some sort of surveillance or security system.

21:13But that never came to fruition.

21:15It piques my interest, but we were unable to determine who slashed those tires.

21:24However, we interviewed Rosemary again, and Rosemary shared with us that several weeks leading up to the homicide, there was a small family outing that Rosemary, I think her mother and her sister and her kids,

21:44they took a day trip to Yankee Candle up in Massachusetts, and Joe didn't go, but his friend Mark did, which was just kind of odd.

22:00And then he said, well, tell us more about Mark.

22:05Rosemary was complaining to Mark about this relationship she had, that Joseph Nowinski did not treat her so well.

22:11At one point, Mark says to her, I know Joe treats you horribly.

22:17And then Mark told Rosemary that he had hired a private investigator to follow Nowinski.

22:22And it turns out he's going into Hartford and he's picking up prostitutes and taking them home and having sex with him.

22:30Prostitutes, I have no knowledge of that.

22:32I have no knowledge.

22:34Why would you go hire some prostitute when you can have any picket of litter you want?

22:38Come on.

22:39I know Joe very well.

22:41He was not running around with no hookers.

22:43I hope I'm not wrong, but I don't think so.

22:47I've never seen it.

22:51So when Rosemary recounts that conversation with Mark about, you know, a private eye observing and confirming that Joe is looking for prostitutes,

23:00she presented to us, she presented to us that, that really angered her.

23:08And she makes the statement that I should have somebody beat him up.

23:12And Mark's reply is, better yet, why don't you have someone put a bullet in his head?

23:21That's an aha moment.

23:27And that's pretty close to what happened.

23:29So it was a statement of some significance to us.

23:33In all the conversation that Joe thought somebody was out to get him, not in the slightest did he ever inform anyone that he thought Mark was that person.

23:46Two days after the murder, he was interviewed at our police station again.

23:55Once my partner and I started speaking with Mark Pascal, Mark was forthcoming with information regarding his relationship with Joe.

24:06He admitted that he knew Rosemary, he hung out with Joe, knew him for about two years.

24:12But he denied any involvement in the murder.

24:16And his alibi, which if you could call it that, was that he was working and he went home and watched TV.

24:23And it's not a rock-solid alibi, but a lot of people do have that, people that live alone, for instance.

24:29And he denied a statement about a bullet in the head.

24:32But then he admitted that he did tell Rosemary about the private investigator and then revealed to us that there was no private investigator.

24:41That was a story he told Rosemary.

24:46And then Mark was characterizing his and Rosemary's relationship as a romantic sexual relationship.

24:55This dude's so full of shit, man.

24:58Really.

24:59He had no sticky relationship with her.

25:01Come on, man.

25:02In addition to that trip in Massachusetts, in November, he and Rosemary went away for a weekend up in Maine.

25:19And they had sex.

25:23And I went to Mars recently and I got some popcorn and I watched a good movie.

25:28You won't believe that one, will you?

25:30We got no indication that that was the relationship from Rosemary.

25:38And that's an indication of us that Mark may be in a little bit of a fantasy land.

25:44So, we want to be able to gauge whether he is telling the truth, whether he's being deceptive or not.

25:54We briefly spoke with him and we offered him the polygraph.

26:00Now, the results of the polygraph are not admissible in court.

26:08However, it is a tool to detect deception.

26:09However, it is a tool to detect deception.

26:13And he showed many signs of deception.

26:17We confronted him with the discrepancies.

26:23Listen, you're deceptive here, you're deceptive there.

26:27Either you thought you were doing something good.

26:30You thought you were saving this woman from domestic violence.

26:34Or you're a cold-blooded murderer and you shot the guy in the head.

26:38He said, you know what, I'm going to tell you everything.

26:47I'm going to tell you everything.

26:49I don't want a lawyer.

26:51I just want to get it over with.

26:57The investigator called me at home and his exact words were, we got a break in the case.

27:02All the original theories about who this might have been went out the window and it became a murder for hire.

27:09During our interview with Mark, he said, I know who did it.

27:15Two young, 18, 19-year-old youth who he knew from being around town.

27:20Someone named Eduardo and someone named Matt.

27:28I am Matthew Terrell's cousin.

27:30We were, we were pretty close as a family growing up.

27:35We would all come gather together for holiday dinners, family picnics.

27:40I was the only girl of all of the kids.

27:47Matt would always make sure that I was okay and he would always make sure that I was included and...

27:54He was just, he was just a kind soul.

28:00I'm sorry.

28:03When Matt transitioned into like middle school and high school, there were a little bit more unsavory things that he might have been exposed to.

28:14He did spend some time in and out of juvenile hall.

28:17And I don't think back then I really knew how much he was struggling in his personal life.

28:26Maybe things would have turned out differently.

28:29If you're not in the criminal life, you probably don't know anybody who will kill for hire.

28:38You can't go on Angie's list and look for a four-star review.

28:42You have to ask around.

28:43Initially, Mark said he knew Eduardo Santiago from his small engine repair or boat shop.

28:56And Matthew seemed to be more a friend of, of Eduardo Santiago.

29:00Mark tells them, this girl Rosemary, she's got a really, you know, bad boyfriend.

29:06He beats her up.

29:07He's horrible.

29:08He's awful.

29:09He asked them if they would be interested or they knew somebody who would kill someone for, for money.

29:16And the response was, well, what do you got and how much?

29:24So, the plan was to use a rifle, but it's going to be loud and they would have to, you know, develop some kind of silencer or suppressor.

29:35This is a book called ****.

29:37It's got a lot of how-tos for various dirty tricks.

29:40On how to manufacture drugs, weapons.

29:43And one of the areas is how to make homemade silencers.

29:46And the book was readily available at libraries, bookstores.

29:52Apparently, Eduardo may have read that to create a homemade silencer with an empty soda bottle taped to the end of the barrel and filled with paper towels.

30:02And that also explains the little pieces of paper that they found on Joe Nowinski that night.

30:09Night of the murder, Mark drove the two of them about a half a block away from the victim's house.

30:16The three of them walked to Joe's residence.

30:20They took the key that was in the mailbox.

30:24And that's where Joe kept it.

30:26Who's going to look in your mailbox for a key?

30:28The only thing I can think is that Mark knew Joe had put his keys in the mailbox.

30:35Both Eduardo and Matthew went upstairs.

30:40Mark claimed he waited outside.

30:42And he heard a muffled noise.

30:44And the two men returned to him and said, he's done.

30:48In some ways, it's a relief that you finally got the story.

30:55You finally are on the right track.

30:57But it doesn't end here.

31:00Mr. Tyrell was arrested by the detectives.

31:04Also, our department sent a team out to Mr. Santiago's house.

31:08And found him asleep in bed.

31:17And in one of the bedrooms, they found a .223 rifle, which matched the type of firearm that was used in the killing of Joe.

31:26They also found additional rounds in Eduardo's house.

31:30Eduardo admitted to being at the scene.

31:36The business card turned out as more when they went through his wallet, the card fell out and fell onto him.

31:43And then he claimed that it was Matthew who shot Joe.

31:48Matt pointed the finger at him.

31:49He pointed the finger at Matt.

31:51However, Eduardo's palm prints were lifted off of the murder weapon.

31:58But there's also a lot more evidence related to the crime.

32:03We got the call from the lab.

32:04My investigator told me they had found markings on some of the projectiles and casings.

32:10And it was something I had never seen before.

32:13He goes, somebody etched a name in one of the bullets.

32:19What's the name?

32:21J-O-E.

32:27So one of those bullets had the victim's name on it.

32:35Our belief is that Eduardo Santiago had carved Joe's name on these rounds.

32:41He not only carved it on the cartridge, which is fairly large,

32:45but he had actually carved Joe on a round that was about that big.

32:53It's a Hollywood idea of having a bullet with someone's name on it.

32:56But in this case, Eduardo Santiago made it very literal.

32:59It just shows how twisted these people are.

33:04Like, no nice kid is going to go do something like this.

33:08And when you hear what they did it for, what the price was, you scratch your head.

33:13Mark, we asked him, well, how much?

33:18What was the payment?

33:19What was, you know, how much?

33:20And he said, well, they didn't want cash because they were interested in a snowmobile I had in my garage.

33:28And they pointed to one he had, and he told them.

33:35It needs to transmit.

33:36And when he goes, well, we'll take it.

33:38That's what it comes down to, a broken snowmobile.

33:41We were all taken aback that somebody could kill for a broken down snowmobile.

33:48And that's all they kept saying was a snowmobile, a broken down snowmobile.

33:51I'm like, what?

33:52There's a lot of questions that I don't understand.

33:56It doesn't add up Mark and Joe.

33:59If they were friends, friends help friends.

34:02Friends don't kill friends.

34:04Or was there something else that was causing this?

34:11So you would think the link is Rosemary.

34:16Many murder for hire plots start with a spouse, a girlfriend, a boyfriend.

34:23Did Rosemary set this up?

34:28What are your feelings about Rosemary?

34:34In my heart, in my heart only, I think that she fueled the fire.

34:46She fueled the fire on this.

34:49And there's a lot of us still wondering about this.

34:53If Joe and Rosemary were really going through hard times,

34:57wouldn't it have been just easier to wait it out for Mark?

35:01If Roe and Joe were going to separate,

35:05then Mark would eventually have Roe anyhow?

35:10It just doesn't make sense.

35:12I just feel that if this guy was because of Rosemary,

35:15is this why Joe died because of Rosemary?

35:18For some reason, I just feel,

35:20well, if he never hooked up with her,

35:22that he would be alive today.

35:24Hi, Rosemary.

35:28This is the producer with the documentary.

35:31I've been outside your apartment for two hours.

35:35I'm waiting to take you to your interview.

35:44So we had dealings with Rosemary Cassano

35:46when she spoke to us at the state's attorney's office,

35:49very much in love with Joe.

35:51Who could be gruff and verbally abusive,

35:55but a nice guy.

35:56She said he's a nice guy.

35:57I don't know that there was any outward signs

36:00of domestic violence,

36:02but the way Mark perceived their relationship

36:04was a lot different than what Rosemary

36:06described their relationship as.

36:09He felt he was Rosemary's savior.

36:12Mark thought that he and Rosemary had,

36:21were going to have a life together.

36:22That if Joe was out of the picture,

36:26he and Rosemary could go off into the sunset.

36:30Mark almost became proud of what he had done

36:33because at the end of that interview,

36:37he said, can I call Rosemary to tell her

36:40that he had set this whole thing up?

36:42Because he wanted to be the hero himself to Rosemary.

36:48They thought that very strange.

36:50It was almost like an honorable thing

36:52for him to have done

36:53or would be seen as such in Rosemary's eyes.

36:57Rosemary subsequently cleared of any suspicion.

37:12I don't feel sorry for Mark, no.

37:15You know, Mark was the orchestrator of all this.

37:19If there wasn't Mark, Joe would still be here today.

37:21That's how I feel.

37:22Mr. Santiago elected to go to trial.

37:30He was nothing but arrogant

37:32every time we ever saw him.

37:35He just had this smirk on his face.

37:37Oh, my God.

37:39It was, I'll just never forget, like, you know,

37:41I'm a big shot.

37:42I shot him type thing.

37:44The only one I'd say I did feel sorry for

37:46was the other one, a Matthew.

37:48He looked so young.

37:51He looked like a little kid.

37:53I will say this, Matthew Tyrell,

37:54we approached Matthew Tyrell.

37:56There was nothing we could offer him

37:58in terms of his cooperation in this case.

38:01And I just assumed when we brought him in,

38:04he was going to look at me and say,

38:05thanks, but no thanks.

38:07I'm just going to go serve my sentence.

38:09He looked at me, thought for a moment,

38:12and then said, you know what?

38:14I'll testify.

38:14It's the right thing to do for the family.

38:16When Matt came to court to testify

38:30during Santiago's trial,

38:32he read a statement.

38:34He was sorry for what he did,

38:36that he should have stopped it.

38:38He apologized to our entire family,

38:40to his family,

38:42and he was sobbing almost uncontrollably.

38:45The fact that Matt

38:47cooperated with the police,

38:50it tells me that

38:52he is

38:54the kid that I grew up with.

38:58And deep down in his heart,

39:00he's not this person.

39:05I know most of us in my family

39:08think he got a bad deal.

39:11There's days I wonder

39:12if he really deserves

39:14to spend the rest of his life in prison.

39:19Past 25 years,

39:21it's still hard for

39:22our family.

39:29My oldest brother,

39:30every year,

39:31never lets me forget.

39:35He just says,

39:36he just called me,

39:37he says, remember?

39:38Well, today this day,

39:39it's the day our brother

39:41got taken from us.

39:45My brother, Rick,

39:47he loved Joe.

39:49He did a lot.

39:53My brother loves him.

39:55I feel bad.

39:56He never forgets it.

39:59He never forgets it.

39:59I'll never hear it.

40:02He never forgets.

40:0425 years.

40:04I've been hearing it every year.

40:08What does that tell you?

40:13Joe was loved.

40:15I wish this was different.

40:17that he was here.

40:18And you were interviewing him.

40:22And

40:22he loved him.

40:29Joe was the nucleus.

40:31Joe held people together.

40:32And if he were here today,

40:35he would have held

40:37the group together.

40:40It's taken 25 years.

40:44But Joe Nowinski has

40:46pulled us all together again

40:49by this documentary.

40:53And

40:54he's working from the heavens.

40:58And I'm sure we all will

41:00cherish and honor

41:03that memory.

41:11A lot of stuff

41:12can be hush-hush

41:13sometimes in a small town.

41:15I've never heard of

41:16a murder-for-hire case,

41:17especially out of

41:18Clay County, Kentucky.

41:19It was somebody

41:19with a Medetta.

41:21He was

41:22very short.

41:23He had no teeth.

41:24Not attractive at all.

41:26The witch doctor,

41:28that was the name

41:29that he went by.

41:30The witch doctor,

41:31the witch doctor,

41:32the witch doctor,

41:33the witch doctor,

41:34the witch doctor,

41:35the witch doctor,

41:36the witch doctor,

41:37the witch doctor,

41:38the witch doctor,

41:39the witch doctor,

41:40the witch doctor,

41:41the witch doctor,

41:42the witch doctor,

41:43the witch doctor,

41:44the witch doctor,

41:45the witch doctor,

41:46the witch doctor,

41:47the witch doctor,

41:48the witch doctor,

41:49the witch doctor,

41:50the witch doctor,

41:51the witch doctor,

41:52the witch doctor,

41:53the witch doctor,

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