South Australia's new Independent Commissioner Against Corruption (ICAC) says her agency is "busier than ever". She largely refrained from criticising the 2021 law changes that limited ICAC's powers, saying "we work within the legislation that we have". The comments are in stark contrast to the approach of her predecessor, Ann Vanstone KC, who said the reforms made South Australia's ICAC "the weakest integrity agency in Australia".
00:04One of the most high-profile cases your organisation has been involved in concluded recently,
00:10with former Mount Gambier MP Troy Bell jailed for five years,
00:14given a two-and-a-half-year non-parole period for taking more than $400,000 of public money.
00:20In 2025, could the Commission you lead conduct the same investigation
00:24which ultimately saw Bell convicted and jailed?
00:27Yes, it could, Rory.
00:29Corrupt conduct has a very technical legal definition
00:34under the Independent Commission Against Corruption Act,
00:37but the type of conduct that you've just described is the type of conduct
00:42that would still be captured within the definition of corruption,
00:46albeit that Mr Bell was ultimately convicted of offences of theft.
00:52That conduct is conduct which, if it were alleged to have occurred,
00:57would likely be assessed by the Office for Public Integrity as a potential issue of corruption
01:02and referred to the Commission for Further Investigation.
01:06You are the third ICAT Commissioner South Australia has had your predecessor,
01:10Anne Vanstone, left mid-last year. She said she had run out of steam.
01:14She also said, and I quote, we are the weakest integrity agency in Australia. Is she right?
01:21Look, every agency of this nature within Australia operates under a different legislative regime
01:28and with different functions and a different remit.
01:32My focus is very much on doing the considerable amount of good work that I view the Commission is able to achieve within the legislative remit.
01:42What's changed when it comes to the regime since Anne Vanstone's departure to strengthen it?
01:48As any new leader would do, I have looked at ICAC through a fresh lens with a view to what is working well,
01:57what are potential areas for development. So there are a number of initiatives we have underway.
02:04One is that we have employed a witness welfare officer this year.
02:08But what about the framework itself?
02:10Yes.
02:11Because lots of Anne Vanstone's frustration stemmed from the reforms that passed through State Parliament without a dissenting voice back in 2021.
02:20National experts in this space say that it's left the framework toothless and powerless.
02:25Given the existing framework, is South Australia a fertile ground for corruption?
02:29In my view, no. Now, any organisation provides grounds for corruption.
02:35The Commission has an investigation function, and I think that's commonly known and understood.
02:41The number of matters being referred to the Office for Public Integrity,
02:45and therefore the number of matters currently being investigated by the Commission,
02:50has been slowly increasing over time.
02:54So in the last financial year, the Commission commenced 65 corruption investigations.
03:00People within public administration and indeed within the public are raising important issues
03:05where they identify a potential issue of corruption and reporting them.
03:10And then ICAC is proceeding to investigate them.
03:13And then they're sent off to South Australia Police.
03:16Correct.
03:17How many of those 65 have ended up with police thus far?
03:20I might come back to that question.
03:22I just wanted to add that the other important aspect where the Commission can have a great impact
03:28on South Australian public administration, and the integrity within it,
03:33is with respect to our prevention and education function.
03:37When we talk about matters being referred to South Australian Police,
03:40since I commenced, I've referred four matters of alleged corruption to South Australia Police
03:49to consider either further investigation or prosecution.
03:53Are you satisfied that's enough?
03:55Well, perhaps if I come back to the remainder, where we don't refer a matter for investigation
04:02or for further prosecution, we then look at those matters with a lens to
04:07are there any prevention initiatives that arise out of them.
04:10As you've described it, the Commission does not currently have the ability to commence an investigation on its own motion.
04:18Yes.
04:19How important is it for that to change?
04:21It is a matter which is amenable to being reviewed.
04:26Ultimately, what the Commission does, if the Commission, for example, has information
04:31that could lead to an investigation into potential corruption in public administration,
04:38then Commission employees, like any other public officer, have a mandatory obligation
04:44to make a report to the Office for Public Integrity.
04:47So we could report that information to the Office for Public Integrity,
04:51with whom we have a very cooperative relationship.
04:54That information could be quickly assessed and then returned back to the Commission for an investigation to commence.
05:01But hasn't the problem been, when it comes to any changes around the ICAC Act, a lack of political will?
05:06And that was very much the frustration of your predecessor.
05:10I can only talk to my experiences with the legislation and where I have seen aspects that I think are particularly amenable to further consideration.
05:23I've publicly stated that.
05:25Does that include the ability for your office to directly refer to the DPP?
05:30Because it's an issue that you've raised.
05:32Yes.
05:33It's also an issue that the Police Commissioner has raised.
05:35Yes.
05:36Do you feel you have made any progress?
05:37The issue there is that the Commission did used to have the ability to refer matters directly to the DPP at the conclusion of investigation.
05:46Now the legislation requires that we refer a matter to South Australian Police.
05:51And my primary concern around that is that that causes an extra layer in the process.
05:59It causes additional time for a process which involves…
06:03And potentially duplication if Police are looking at a similar issue.
06:06Potentially, yes.
06:07So there's a potential efficiency issue, but also an issue around the welfare of people who are brought into this system, whether it's a person of interest or a witness who's involved in proceedings.
06:23You have enjoyed an extensive legal career before moving into this role, including with the Director of Public Prosecutions and the Office of Public Integrity.
06:32Given the turbulent history ICAC has faced, why did you take the job?
06:36I've always been drawn to roles that have a very clear purpose and a sense of being able to make a contribution to the criminal justice system and also to the broader public administration.
06:50I really saw this role as an opportunity to make a contribution in a positive way to safeguarding and strengthening integrity in South Australia.
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