- 6 weeks ago
This special report examines the political firestorm surrounding the Election Commission of India's (ECI) Special Intensive Revision (SIR) of electoral rolls. The process, which the opposition has termed 'vote chori' or vote theft, has intensified following the deletion of over 65 lakh names from Bihar's voter list. Congress leader Dr. Shama Mohamad questioned the transparency of the deletions, while BJP's Syed Zafar Islam indicated that detected individuals would face deportation as non-citizens. The ECI plans to extend this exercise to 12 other states and Union Territories, including West Bengal, Kerala, and Tamil Nadu, sparking further political contention. Opposition parties allege collusion between the ECI and the BJP, raising concerns about the timing, transparency, and potential disenfranchisement of voters. Conversely, the government and BJP maintain that the SIR is a routine and necessary process to ensure a clean and fair electoral roll, citing reasons such as deaths, duplications, and shifted residents, and referencing a Supreme Court observation.
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00:00So, from Ghuspaitia to the timing, to the process, vote-cho-recharge, minorities and marginalised being targeted.
00:07The opposition, as you see, has come out all guns blazing.
00:10But the CEC, he shot back, saying all this is, you know, where are those appeals?
00:16There were zero appeals made after the final list was published in Bihar.
00:20He insists the pruning is a regular process.
00:22It's a routine process.
00:24A process where 7.5 crore electorate of Bihar participated.
00:29The test case was successful.
00:31The process is now being taken nationwide in various phases.
00:36Opposition continues to call this process vote-cho-recharge.
00:38BJP says the opposition is upset because Ghuspaitias are being removed from the electoral roll.
00:45The vote bank of the opposition is being impacted.
00:48But will the process be flawless in states like Bengal, for example, Kerala, Tamil Nadu,
00:53where the ruling parties in these states are opposing it?
00:56Joining me on India first is Dr. Shama Mohammed, National Spokesperson of the Congress Party.
01:00Sayyad Zafar Islam is the National Spokesperson of the Bharatiya Janata Party, former Member of Parliament.
01:05Yashwan Deshmukh is not just a sophologist.
01:08He's the founder and director of SeaVoter.
01:11He's been studying voter reaction very closely.
01:16Namrita Kothari is a political analyst.
01:18He joins us from Bengal.
01:19We hope to get the thinking within the Trimul Congress, the ruling party in Bengal.
01:24Amitabh Tiwari is an election analyst and researcher, founder of VoteWipe, joining us on this special broadcast.
01:29Dr. Shama Mohammed, will the Congress Party continue to oppose what the CEC describes as
01:35is the purification of the electoral rolls.
01:39It's happened in the past.
01:41It's happening once again.
01:42He calls it a routine event.
01:45Okay.
01:46A couple of questions out here.
01:49What was the reason they started SIR?
01:52The reason they said at that point of time was they were Rohingyas, Bangladeshis, we need to get rid of them.
01:58After they did the Bihar SIR, nothing about the Rohingyas, nothing about the Bangladeshis, we've got to know nothing about them.
02:11My question today is, next year there is an election happening in four states.
02:18West Bengal is included.
02:19Kerala is included.
02:21Tamil Nadu is included.
02:22Assam is not included.
02:23Now, Assam is one of the states which borders Bangladesh and a lot of Bangladeshis came out.
02:30I really want to know who these Bangladeshis are in our state and tell them to leave the country and go back to Bangladesh.
02:37Now, what is the excuse given as their NRC is happening?
02:41Which NRC?
02:42We started NRC in 2014.
02:45The NRC finished in 2019.
02:4719 lakh names came out.
02:49Out of that, 12 lakh were Hindus.
02:52So, suddenly the NRC goes slow.
02:55In 2022, there was an audit report which says that many indigenous people were left out in Assam.
03:01The report also said nearly 1,600 floors were used and a lot of financial irregularities.
03:07So, which NRC is Yanesh talking about?
03:11I want to know.
03:12Why is Assam not included?
03:14Is there collusion between the election commission and BJP, the party which wants the government of the country?
03:23And the other thing, where he keeps saying that nobody filed a complaint.
03:27Now, how can we, that's a big lie.
03:30Are BLO's have filed a complaint?
03:32Are BLO's have filed a complaint?
03:33Are MLO's have filed a complaint?
03:34Are MLO's have filed a complaint?
03:35The other important thing.
03:38Voters have been deleted.
03:40The names of these voters are not known to anybody.
03:45So, they said the Supreme Court says, file a PIL, file a case.
03:50But how can I or any Biharu know, why is the election commission of India not putting out the voter list of those people who have been deleted?
04:0147 lakh people have been deleted.
04:03Correct?
04:04So, where is that list?
04:05Why is it not putting out?
04:06Then only one can findâŚ
04:07Syed Zafar Islam, a list of questions raised by the Congress party spokesperson.
04:13Add to this question raised by Pawan Kheda, who says through SIR, Bihar is being turned into some kind of a laboratory
04:19to murder democracy.
04:20Twelve states where SIR has been announced.
04:23Will the guidelines be different from those in 2003?
04:27Is this just a vote-cutting exercise?
04:30Because the election commission has not taken any step towards adding new voters, he asks.
04:39Well, two things.
04:41I heard the argument of Congress spokesperson and their leaders and all.
04:45It's terrible argument.
04:46First of all, they have to understand what is the objective.
04:51Very simple objective that they have to clean the electoral rolls.
04:56There should not be a person who has already died.
05:01Their name should not be there.
05:02Their name should be dropped.
05:04People who have migrated, because we have seen urbanization in the last few years, several years.
05:09And people have migrated from one place to another.
05:12And their name still exists in those voters, that needs to be dropped.
05:16Then there are people who are not bona fide citizens of this country.
05:21And they are still there.
05:22If they are there, their name needs to be dropped.
05:25So it's just the purpose is that it should be transparent, cleaner electoral roll.
05:30It should give you fairer election, opportunity for fairer election.
05:35And nobody should have any question about the electoral roll.
05:38If anybody has any observation, then Electoral Election Commission of India has very clearly
05:44said that we want to engage every political party.
05:47This is an exercise which we support, because we know that exactly that electoral roll should
05:52be clear from all speculations.
05:56And that is something which is being done by the Electoral Commission.
05:59If you have any information, your BLS should be activated.
06:02Your BLS were activated.
06:04Just a second.
06:04Are you hiding under the garb of NRC?
06:07Go ahead.
06:08And she says that's the collusion between the CEC or the EC and the BJP.
06:17Not at all.
06:18I mean, see, there are, when people say, let me, let me emphasize few things.
06:23When people say, or I heard Shama Muhammad, my friend Shama Muhammad, that she said that
06:27where is the Rohingya, where is the, who continue, who would to be citizen, but they are actually
06:35illegally staying here.
06:37I must tell them.
06:38And I must tell you, viewers, there are names which have been detected.
06:45And soon they will be deported.
06:49You heard me correctly or not?
06:50They have been detected.
06:52And soon they will be deported, because they are not the citizen of this country.
06:56Soon you will get to hear everything.
06:58So I am just telling you, there are, it is nothing to do with NRC, but it is something
07:02where the citizen have no, is trying to become citizen or claim to citizen, but they are not.
07:11So those people have been detected.
07:12So are you saying Bangladeshis and Rohingyas have been detected in Bihar and they will be thrown out?
07:17Okay, Dr. Muhammad wants to respond to you.
07:19Go on, ma'am, quickly, ma'am, before I bring in our other guests.
07:21No, no, he just said one point.
07:22No, no, just a second.
07:23I don't want to jump the gun.
07:24I don't want to jump.
07:26Zafar, Zafar, you said it has nothing to do with NRC.
07:29No, I don't want to jump the gun.
07:30Zafar's mouth.
07:31The truth has come out of Zafar's mouth.
07:33That has nothing to do with NRC.
07:34No, NRC.
07:35There is a pollution between the election commission.
07:38I am telling you that you keep on asking, na?
07:41No, one second.
07:42You said the names will come out.
07:44Why are they not putting out the names?
07:46Where are the names of the Bangladeshis?
07:48I want to see it in the list, the names of the Bangladeshis and the Rohingyas.
07:51Why is the election commission not putting out the names?
07:53Fair enough.
07:54Ma'am, you've raised that point.
07:55Sir, quickly respond.
07:56I have to quickly bring in another guest.
07:56Let me respond.
08:00I think why there is a lot of anxiety among Congress spokesperson and the leader.
08:08You have to understand it's the exercise to just clean the electoral rolls.
08:12Support the authority because they are not doing anything to favor any political party.
08:18They are doing what is supposed to be done by the authorities.
08:21It is their wisdom.
08:22It is their authority.
08:23It is their responsibility.
08:24They are just discharging their responsibility to clean the electoral roll free from all speculations.
08:30You have any rest of their observation, go to ACI.
08:34Engage them.
08:35And if you are still not satisfied, go to a high court, supreme court, anywhere you want to go.
08:40Take a legal request.
08:41But I know for sure that none is not a single complaint was there.
08:46And even if you have today some complaint, it's still there.
08:48The doors are open.
08:49You can go there.
08:50Sir, let me quickly bring in Namrita Kothari because I want to understand how this process will now be taken forward.
08:55In the state of Bengal, for example, before I bring in our analysts on this broadcast, Namrita Kothari, will Mamata Banerjee government cooperate with this process?
09:06Because the CEC made it very clear, state government is constitutionally mandated to ensure the process is carried out smoothly.
09:15At least he hopes there will be no threat to the lives of the BLOs carrying out the verification process.
09:24Yeah, first of all, I'd like to congratulate our central government for such a good initiative if it will be carried out properly.
09:31Regarding West Bengal, definitely the party over here will have no problem with SIR, keeping in mind, everything will be done in a fair way.
09:43What we are seeing in case of Bihar, like SIR has started that those who are the dead voters, those who are the infiltrators, they will be wiped out from the voters list.
09:54But till date, we didn't get any sort of list, who are the infiltrators, any names, it didn't come out from the election commission.
10:03So the same thing, I think it will going to be happened in Bengal also, if the things to be done like this, I think justice shouldn't be done in this way.
10:13And then the BLO and those people who are in this process, their number is very small.
10:20And those who, the government officials who are selected for, carried out this process, they are actually hampered our education systems.
10:27Because they are mostly hired from the teachers, from the schools and all.
10:31And as the board's examination is on, on March in Cave and March, so the studies of the students are hampered.
10:38So what is so much of hurry by the government, we have to do this right now.
10:44This is my first thing to know about this.
10:48Why are we in so in hurry?
10:51We will take time for this and then we will do that.
10:54Even today we will get the list of the 12 states where SIR will be done.
10:59What about Maharashtra?
11:00In the name of the election in local bodies, right now they are not doing SIR over there.
11:05Why?
11:06That means the people who are giving vote to the parties right now might be after the next assembly election or they might not be the citizens of India.
11:16So what is the, I didn't understand the actual motive of the government.
11:21He, for the local bodies, their election, they will be exempted and for the assembly and the other elections, they will not be exempted.
11:28Yeshwan Deshmukh, you are reading, you have heard political parties, you have heard analysts, okay, ma'am you have made that point, you have made that point twice now.
11:37Yeshwan Deshmukh, the CC gave details of how this process has been carried out regularly from 1951 to 2004, eight times by the EC.
11:48More than 20 years have passed since the correction of electoral roads.
11:52What is your reading?
11:54One of the opposition's stance?
11:56Is this pure politics or is there merit?
12:00Does the opposition have reason to be concerned?
12:01Just to be clear on the record, I mean, the day the Bihar SIR was announced, I was the first one to criticize it on the account that it should not have been done so close to the election, at least six months to one year prior to the election, this should be carried out.
12:17So, I was doubting on the time, but I never doubted on the intention on why and which is being done and how it should be done because I trust the election commission as an institution.
12:29That's my job to see through it how the things are carried out as a professional.
12:34Almost, I mean, on the conservative estimate, 60 lakh people have been removed from the Bihar list.
12:41I think, if I'm not wrong, Yogi Ndi said in Supreme Court probably 80 lakhs, some calculation that he said.
12:48If I go by that, almost like 33,000 people on an average from each constituency, they have been removed.
12:56Did we see 88 lakh people, 80,000 people, 8,000 people, even 80 people on the street that we have been disfranchised in Bihar?
13:09We are talking about Bihar, which is the most politically conscious state in India.
13:15Do you really believe that 80 lakh people would have been removed, disfranchised and there would be not even 80 people on the ground protesting against that?
13:23Do you really believe that?
13:26So, I mean, let's be very clear.
13:28Politics aside, and I am not a player, it's a political season, it's an election season.
13:33Political parties are free to take their stand.
13:36But where I have an issue with anybody trying to put up a question mark or bringing down an institution or questioning the entire process, I will have an issue with that.
13:48I have had an issue with the BJP when they questioned the EVM after 2009 defeat.
13:53I have a question with any political party who claims that the system is rotten or things are wrong.
13:59I mean, if it is so rotten, it is so wrong, just back out the election, don't contest the election.
14:04If you are so sure that ECI is a muse of the BJP, just don't contest the election, go ahead.
14:12Say we are not going to contest the election.
14:14If 50 lakhs or 60 lakhs or 80, as some may argue, have been removed from the Bihar electoral list, wouldn't people be out on the streets protesting?
14:24And Dr. Shama Mohamed, none is the point Yashman Deshmukh raises.
14:30Quickly respond before I bring in Mr. Tiwari.
14:32I want to ask Yashmanji that we all want an electoral list which is clean, where there are no double voters.
14:42I agree totally with you.
14:43None of us want these.
14:45But the problem is, Yashmanji, is why did they start it three months before the election in Bihar?
14:51They could have started it in Jan.
14:53Even I questioned it, even I questioned it, Shama, even I questioned it, that's why I said, that it should be done at least six months to a one year kind of gap should be done.
15:02Let me ask you one more thing.
15:04One more thing is that the deleted voters' names are not coming out.
15:07Why don't, see, if I want to, suppose I'm in Bihar, my name is deleted, all right?
15:12I have an election on November 6th, my first phase.
15:15I want to know if I'm deleted or not, I don't know.
15:17Then only I can file a case in court, isn't it?
15:20Names of who are deleted are not there.
15:22And a very important point, which is raised by Kavan Keda, is that why are the names, even when you go through a list, new names will be added, right?
15:31You also add.
15:32Why are those names not there?
15:33Which are the added voters in this list?
15:35That doesn't come out.
15:37And the most suspicious thing is Assam.
15:39To have an NRC, it is to prove citizenship, all right?
15:42But voter, SIR, is not to prove your citizenship.
15:45One is that they don't come into each other's way.
15:47And I've also asked the question about NRC, which is, happened, then let NRC happen all over the country, you know?
15:54Why one particular state is given this NRC thing, which is also after 2019, they've come out with 19âŚ
16:01The Home Minister has said it will happen, it will happen nationwide.
16:05And the thing is that the question, the list that in Bihar is being questioned, it carries 90,000 signatures of the booth level agents of each and every party.
16:20You know, why would a party who is questioning the list, ask the agents to sign it and certify it, number one?
16:27Number two, I mean, politics aside, politics aside, Shamadi, and I get your point.
16:32As far as cleaning the list, going for a right process, reforms are concerned, we are all sailing in the same boat.
16:39Nobody is questioning that, you know?
16:41But the question is that apart from the fact that it was done in a hasty process in Bihar, where I am questioning ECI just like you,
16:53for the elections which are coming in next one year, two years, if the things are being done on priority over there, why it should be questioned?
17:02Why not everybody gets to get it done properly?
17:04In fact, let me bring in Amitabh Tiwari into this conversation as we take this forward.
17:10There is a trust deficit here, Yashmat Deshmukhji.
17:12There is a trust deficit.
17:14When you do it in this wayâŚ
17:14But even courts of lawâŚ
17:16No, what is the basis of this trust deficit?
17:19Because I also want to quote to you what Justice Sulekand has said.
17:23No, give me a moment.
17:25So let me also bring in Amitabh Tiwari.
17:27It's almost 25 minutes.
17:28He hasn't come into this conversation at all.
17:29Amitabh Tiwari, BJP MP Nishikhan Dubey, after the Bihar electoral roll revision said some ghuzpaitiyas have been removed.
17:37More needs to be done or words to that effect.
17:40That is exactly what Sayyad Zafar Islam has also said.
17:43Words to that effect that people have been identified and they will be deported.
17:48Now, is the hint also at Bengal?
17:50And will this then become the big political face-off for elections in the upcoming elections?
17:56Now, essentially, see if in any state which had 7.89 crore voters and 65 lakh voters were deleted and that also were materially correct because, as the CEC claimed, not a single complaint was filed.
18:13And even if we assume that some complaints were filed, no material errors were found in the deletions of 65 lakh, which is 8% of the vote base of Bihar.
18:258% is a huge number, which means that anywhere between 0 to 8%, if we take Bihar as an example, there are wrong names in the voter list.
18:37That can be due to, one is death of people, second is movement of people from one state to other, third could be infiltration, which, I mean, to agree with the opposition was not a very big issue in Bihar as it was made out to be earlier because we do not have the list of people who have been deleted due to citizenship issue.
19:03So, that can be a big thing in West Bengal.
19:07I mean, we as citizens should hope that since this exercise has been carried out in Bihar, of course, there were transparency issues.
19:15Court was overseeing the entire process.
19:18Court intervened at regular intervals for inclusion of Aadhaar, for disclosing all the names of the people who were deleted.
19:26And the election commission also, since it was holding an SIR almost after 20 years, I think it would have learned from its mistakes committed during this entire process.
19:38And we should finally see a better, tighter, smoother process in the 12 states which are expected to see an SIR.
19:45Of course, West Bengal can be an issue because it is a border state and infiltration affects West Bengal and Assam the most.
19:54And I was one of the first ones to point out that if Aadhaar can be used as a document to make a voter ID, then it should also be used as a document for validating my name as a voter.
20:08So, that also, the Supreme Court, which you can say, what the opposition's demand also has been accepted.
20:16So, I think, let's hope that process cleans the entire electoral rolls before the next cycle.
20:21You know, because we are giving out, yeah, we are giving out details of those 65 lakh, Dr. Shama Mohammed.
20:26And I want to put it out once again, how many number are people who have died, those who have moved, those who are there and duplicate.
20:34All of that information is out there.
20:37But I want you to respond to what the Supreme Court said.
20:40I want you to see, this is that figure.
20:42Deleted due to death, 22.3 lakhs.
20:45Deleted due to duplication, 6.8 lakhs.
20:48Deleted due to shifting, 36.45 lakhs.
20:50Total deleted, 65.74 lakhs.
20:53Electors in draft list is 7.24 crore.
20:577.5 as the CEC said.
21:01But I want to quote what the Honorable Court said.
21:03Dr. Shama Mohammed.
21:04If I were to quote the Supreme Court on the 9th of October, 9th of October, Justice Surya Khan said,
21:10what's to the effect, that the total number of voters in Bihar outweighs its total adult population by 107% in the past.
21:18And that shows special intensive revision of electoral rolls carried out by the election commission is justified.
21:25It was definitely a problem that required correction.
21:28So, why is the opposition to this entire process?
21:31No, no.
21:33See, Gaurav, the issue, now the trust deficit, I tell you, the issue is, why did they do this?
21:40They did it.
21:40What is the, election commission could have said, we want to clean up the electoral roll, whatever, whatever.
21:46They said that we want to find out where, how many Rohingyas are there, how many Bangladeshis are there.
21:53Now, when it comes out, when Mr. Gyanesh Kumar was doing the press conference, how many of them have been found?
21:59He did not say one.
22:00Now, you have given, you, I think, have a good eyesight, because I don't see you wearing glasses, Gaurav.
22:05You have given me the number.
22:06Are there the names there?
22:08Who are these deleted people?
22:10Who are they?
22:10Do you know?
22:11Do you have the names?
22:12You are an intelligent guy.
22:13You're not some guy who's on the roadside Romeo.
22:15You're an intelligent journalist who have gone abroad and done wonderful stories.
22:20My question is, we don't have the names.
22:22And number three, very important, in 2022, it is this government who said, we have to link Aadhaar to our voter ID, because Aadhaar was so important.
22:31Everything is based on Aadhaar.
22:32We have to link it to our bank accounts, to our PAN number, everything.
22:36Why is the Aadhaar card kicked out, and then Supreme Court had to tell the election commission, get in the Aadhaar?
22:41Today, Gyanesh Kumar says, this cannot prove your citizenship.
22:45But who is Gyanesh Kumar to prove citizenship?
22:47The election commission has no right.
22:49It is with the Home Ministry, and that the Supreme Court also said.
22:53So, why does Gyanesh Kumar talk about citizenship and the Aadhaar card?
22:57I want to know.
22:58But he clarified that point.
22:59But anyway, Sayyid Zafar Islam wants to respond to you.
23:03He has his hand up.
23:04Respond, sir, to the points being made by Dr. Shamaa Muhammad.
23:10See, Dr. Shamaa Muhammad and her party and all the opposition parties are in block.
23:18They have this apprehension that all these bogus voters who support them, please do not interrupt.
23:26You get to the point, and we have to think, what are the names of these felicit voters?
23:30I said, don't interrupt.
23:35I told you, please have some decency.
23:38I know how to shout, how to shield.
23:40Please do not do that.
23:41I know exactly how to do that.
23:43So, all I am trying to tell you that these political parties have only one intention, to mislead the nation.
23:49This will not work.
23:50This issue has gone to Supreme Court.
23:52Honorable Supreme Court has delivered.
23:54Honorable Supreme Court had many observations.
23:57And Honorable Supreme Court has very candidly said that they have full faith in EC.
24:01And what does EC is saying?
24:03EC is saying that your BLS should work on the ground, but your BLS is only listening to your leader,
24:08who is trying to mislead the people and not working.
24:11If you have any observation, approach the court, approach first ECI.
24:15If you are not satisfied, approach the court.
24:17But you don't have any substance to approach the court, or you don't have any substance to approach the ECI.
24:23That's why you are making this kind of toll claim.
24:24Bogus voters will not remain in the electoral rules anymore, because they are not supposed to be there.
24:32That's why this cleaning exercise being undertaken by the election commission, and nothing against any political party.
24:38I am telling you repeatedly, and so is the election commission.
24:41It is election committee, it is not the government's exercise.
24:43It is the election commission, which is independent body, conducting an exercise.
24:47We are supporting the oil committee.
24:48But beyond Bihar.
24:49We also want electoral rules.
24:51Why are you defending the election commission?
24:53Why are you defending the election commission?
24:57Every time there is an election commission issue, the Batla Janta party defends the election commission.
25:01I am defending the objective the election commission has.
25:04And you have not answered.
25:06Let me bring in Namrita Kuthari also into this conversation.
25:10Namrita Kuthari, is there an apprehension?
25:13Now let's move beyond Bihar.
25:15Is there an apprehension that there could be a breakdown of law in order,
25:19and that, God forbid, there could be violence in Bengal on the issue of SIR if it's followed through?
25:25Because Mr. Gyanesh Kumar, the CEC, insists that Article 324, Subclause 6 makes it very clear,
25:33states have to provide officials.
25:36They have to cooperate with this process.
25:38Or, you know, because there are some reports from Bengal that seem to indicate that BLOs are not available in Bengal.
25:45There is some kind of a defiance of the EC order that's happening.
25:49At least that's the allegation.
25:50I don't think so.
25:53Central government will get full cooperation from the state government,
25:57because this one is a good initiative.
25:59And all the states in India want to definitely support this sort of, you know, rectification of voters and all.
26:08But the thing is, this should be done in a correct way.
26:13So that no one, those who are the voters, they shouldn't be cut off from the voter list,
26:18as happened in the case of Bihar.
26:20Because many voters, they are like 56 lakhs, 65 lakhs of voters, they are cut off from the voters list.
26:27So this is not justified.
26:28Being a citizen of India, you will snatch the right to vote.
26:33This is not justified.
26:34No, but 65 lakhs, according to the election commission, are people who are either dead or have moved.
26:39They have given details of who has been removed.
26:42The government will also support it.
26:44But definitely, if the genuine voter will be cut off from the voters list, then definitely boys will be raised.
26:51Okay.
26:51But is there evidence to suggest, Yashman Deshmukh, that genuine votersâŚ
26:55Okay, Syed Zafar Islam wants to respond to you.
26:57Can I come for 10 seconds?
26:59Go on, sir.
27:00So, see, I am really aghast when people are making this kind of speculation.
27:06All I am trying to tell you, that we areâŚ
27:08You as a political party, like us, should support the initiative undertaken by the election commission.
27:14If you haveâŚ
27:15They are following a process.
27:16They have defined the objective.
27:17They are following the process.
27:18You have problem with the objective?
27:20Then you tell me that we have problem with the objective.
27:22The bogus voters should be there.
27:23If you have no problem with the objective, defined by the election commission, then they haven't defined the process.
27:30If you have problem with the process, they will engage you.
27:33You tell them.
27:34No.
27:35To, you know, to prove that they are the citizens of the election.
27:38No, no.
27:40All I am saying, Damrata ji, all I am saying that you have problem with the processes, not the objective.
27:46Then process, that's why they said that we will engage every political party to make it a smooth operation.
27:53So that everyone is comfortable and there is no headroom for speculation.
27:57And what isâŚ
27:57Why are you making a speculation when the process has yet to initiate?
28:01And the process is something where your contribution should be there, your engagement is there, you can contribute, and you can alsoâŚ
28:08That's why we want here that no lacuna will be over here, we want that only.
28:19Now, all the dust has settled.
28:20So that the citizens of theâŚ
28:22Okay, Yashwan Deshmukh wants to come in.
28:23Yashwan Deshmukh and Dr. Shama Mohammed want to come in.
28:26Yashwan Deshmukh, will this end up being a big ticket polarizing election issue in poll-bound states and especially in Bengal?
28:35What, according to you, is the key takeaway from the process in Bihar?
28:39Well, I don't think it is going to have any issue whatsoever.
28:43I mean, trust me on that.
28:44I mean, because you know what, there is an impression, I mean, even the viewers might be thinking that these thousands and thousands of the BLOs are employees of election commission of India or employees of the central government.
28:54No, it's not.
28:56You know who are the officials of election commission?
28:58They are the state government employees.
29:00It's precisely the state governments who have appointed them and they will be carrying out this exercise.
29:06It is Mamata Banerjee's people in West Bengal.
29:09It will be Stalin's people in Tamil Nadu.
29:11They are salivate people of their government who will be carrying out this exercise.
29:15So, whosoeverâŚ
29:16See, the thing is, they're very clear.
29:18I tell you what the practical side of it.
29:19As we say in Hindi, you know, anybody and everybody who has a good presence on the ground, anybody and everybody who has a good organizational strength, you know, that party will be benefited from the SIR because they would be in control of what is going in the list, what is being cut out of the list.
29:40And they would be having a sheer strength presence on the ground to oppose if anything goes wrong.
29:47So, in case of Bihar, for example, RGD has that strength.
29:51CPI Mali has that strength.
29:53So, you will be surprised, you know, maximum number of addition deletions happened from the account of CPI ML because they have strength on the ground.
30:02They got it done.
30:03So, what I'm simply trying to say, as there were not even 800 or 80 people on the street who said that we are disfranchised in Bihar, you know, it did not happen.
30:14I do not see anything would be happening.
30:17And as Dr. Shama Mohammed rightly said, it's about the trustworthiness.
30:21I agree with her.
30:22You know, if it will be a question of trustworthiness, there would be no more than 25% turnout in Bihar.
30:28Okay.
30:29Okay.
30:30If this process, 55% turnout in Bihar, then there would be, shall be no question.
30:36Because ultimately, it's a question of trustworthiness for whom?
30:40May I just complete my point?
30:42May I just complete my point?
30:44Ultimately, it's a question of trustworthiness for whom?
30:47Not for you, not for me, not for any party.
30:49For the people of India, for the voter.
30:52If they trust the process, they will come out in a large number.
30:55If they do not trust the process, they will not come out in.
30:58Amitabh Diwari, Rahul Gandhi raised this issue very emphatically initially.
31:04But has he kind of retreated in the background on this issue in Bihar?
31:09And you've looked at it so extensively.
31:12Is it not an evocative issue in Bihar?
31:15Because the CC claims 7.5 crore electorate of Bihar, BLOs, all members of political parties, booth level workers.
31:23They participated in the process.
31:26They didn't challenge it through appeals.
31:27They signed off on this process.
31:28So, is this an indication, as the EC claims, only the correct names were deleted?
31:33Yeah, because if you see, I mean, any issue which finds resonance with the opposition voters or neutral voters has an electoral impact.
31:46So, I would not say that SIR as an issue has not resonated in Bihar.
31:50But it has resonated only largely with the core vote block of the Mahagadbandan.
31:56So, it does not have a significant electoral impact because those vote blocks were anyways going to vote for Mahagadbandan.
32:03And perhaps it energized and motivated the cadre.
32:06Now, since the Mahagadbandan has itself realized that SIR perhaps is not an issue, it is talking about sargari jobs.
32:15It is talking about permanency of the Jivika Dedis and rupees 30,000 salary.
32:21Correct?
32:21Because they have moved back to, you would see, bread and butter issues.
32:24And I agree with Yashwanji here is that in most of the states, we will likely see a smooth process
32:30because the opposition has also perhaps realized that this is not an election issue which can get it votes.
32:37Except perhaps for West Bengal because infiltration or illegal citizens can be an issue in West Bengal.
32:46There could be cooperation or non-cooperation issues with respect to central government.
32:51And this citizenship thing, because can the ECI decide on the citizenship, is still languishing in the court, in the Supreme Court.
32:59Because the Supreme Court has not given a final order on this.
33:02So, I think except for West Bengal, more or less, I think it's likely to be a smooth affair across the country.
33:08No, in fact, Bengal is area of interest.
33:11Just one point.
33:12One point.
33:12Go on, ma'am.
33:13One point.
33:14What I'm asking is, they're saying there is nobody objecting on the streets.
33:18There's nobody coming out on the streets.
33:20Mike, how can anybody come out when you don't know who has been deleted?
33:24The problem today is nobody knows who's deleted.
33:27Once that final list is published, wouldn't your booth-level workers know whether your voters are there on their list or not?
33:35Chains are not published yet.
33:37That's the problem.
33:38See, once it is done, that is the trust deficit.
33:40Be transparent.
33:42The way you keep out Assam, BJP rule state, these all go against transparency of the EC.
33:48Come out and tell us how many partnersâŚ
33:5030 seconds, Amitabh, 30 seconds, Amitabh and Sayyid Zafir Islam.
33:54Quickly, Amitabh first.
33:55Supreme Court asked the Election Commission to release the list of deleted names and it did so, I think, somewhere around August 20th, 17 to 20.
34:05It was asked by the Supreme Court.
34:07Second is that it's a misconception that the number of voters have declined compared to 2020 elections.
34:14In fact, the number of voters have increased compared to 2020 Vidansaba election.
34:19In 2020 Vidansaba election, there were 7.36 crore voters and in 2025 draft electoral roll, there are 7.42 crore voters, which is an increase of 1.6 percent, not a decline.
34:34Across constituencies, there is an increase of voters when you compare to 2020 Vidansaba election.
34:41Okay, Sayyid Zafir Islam, quick 30 seconds.
34:43Sayyid Zafir Islam has not answered any of the questions.
34:48Whether it's Bengal, whether it's Assam, whether it's any other states, every state will have to comply.
34:56Why are you doing choo-choo-choo-choo?
34:58Allow me to speak.
35:00Please, you always interrupt people when they don't interrupt you.
35:06So, please don't do choo-choo-choo when other people are speaking.
35:08Okay?
35:09So, all I am trying to tell you, Gaurav, that this noise you will hear.
35:15But they will like in Bihar, they are retracted.
35:18They will retract here also.
35:20They just want to mislead the people.
35:22Otherwise, the draft electoral roll is out.
35:26Everybody can see whether their name exists there or not.
35:29And as far as Assam is repeatedly, she is saying, election commissioner has already stated that there will be separate notification for Assam.
35:39Because of certain technical reason, he said.
35:42He is very clearly said in the press conference.
35:44Before the election of Assam.
35:45Why should it be after the election of Assam?
35:47We want it before the election of Assam.
35:49This is fraud over here in Assam.
35:51There is nothing called NRC.
35:53This is complete fraud and food all over India.
35:55You have problem with your bogus voters.
36:00I must tell you that your bogus voters will not be able to vote.
36:04No, no bogus voters will not be able to vote anymore.
36:08We are not concerned about the odd cause.
36:10An evocative issue.
36:12The CEC says if there are objections, there is form 6 and form 7.
36:17And for correction claims and objections, there is also form 8.
36:20Now, the CEC says there are multiple levels of appeals that a voter can make if a name is wrongfully deleted.
36:28We will track the story very closely.
36:29A quick break.
36:31I want to thank all my guests for joining me.
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