- 7 weeks ago
- #considerthis
In 5 years, approximately one in six Malaysians will be aged 60 and above. In the face of this demographic shift, Penang Island has become the first city in Malaysia to complete the application process to be recognised by the WHO’s global network to be an Age-Friendly City Status. The initiative aims to transform neighbourhoods, transport, and services for older persons. To mark the International Day of Older Persons, on this episode of #ConsiderThis Melisa Idris speaks with Datuk Seri Lawrence Cheah, Chairman of PPAWE (Pertubuhan Pusat Aktiviti Warga Emas) Jelutong, and Dr Sangeeta Kaur Darshan Singh, Honorary Secretary of the Malaysian Healthy Ageing Society @mhasociety_ and also the Project Manager for the Age-Friendly City, Penang Island Initiative.
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00:00Hello and good evening. I'm Melissa Idris. Welcome to Consider This. This is the show where we want
00:16you to consider and then reconsider what you know of the news of the day. Now in five years,
00:21approximately one in six Malaysians will be above, will be 60 and above. And as our country faces
00:29this demographic shift, I'd like to highlight Penang Island, which has become the first city
00:35in Malaysia to complete the application process to be recognised by the WHO's global network
00:41to be recognised with the age-friendly city status. So to mark International Day of Older Persons on
00:52October 1st, I have on the show with me Datuk Sri Lawrence Chia, who is advisor to the Penang
00:58Healthy Ageing Society. He's also chairman of PAWI Jelutong, which stands for Pertubuhan
01:03Pusat Aktiviti Warga Emas Jelutong. And also Dr. Sangeeta Koh Darshan Singh, who is the honorary
01:10secretary of the Malaysian Healthy Ageing Society. She is also the project manager for the Age
01:16of Friendly City Penang Island Initiative. Both of you, welcome to the show. Thank you so much
01:22for being here with me. Lots to talk about, but first maybe we can explain or get a better sense
01:29of what this Age-Friendly City Initiative is and why it started in Penang, why Penang Island has been
01:36able to achieve the recognition. Dr. Sangeeta, may I begin with you? Tell us a little bit about what
01:42this initiative is, who it intended to reach, what it intended to do.
01:48Okay. Thank you, Melissa, for the opportunity. And I'm so happy to be here with Datuk Lawrence.
01:53The Age-Friendly City actually was something that this Chief Minister of Penang has been talking about
02:01for the last 12 years. He's been really, really bringing the issue up because as you may already
02:09know, Penang Island is the city which has a lot of residents that are already ageing more than five
02:17people, unfortunately. Or fortunately, because of that fact, the CM has been very passionate about it
02:24and he made that announcement 12 years asking people to come forward and help through the processes.
02:32Malaysian Healthy Ageing heard this request and we were like, yes, please,
02:37please. We would love to work with you and through the City Council, obviously, because
02:43Age-Friendly City, there are two things that you can do as a country or as a city. You can either go
02:49Healthy City, which is incorporating everyone, like intergenerational approach and, you know,
02:56you can do a pilot project within the city, in the heart of the city itself. Or you can go Age-Friendly
03:02because, you know, Penang is a very ageing city. Yeah, I heard, I read somewhere that Penang has
03:08the second highest number of population above 60 in... Now the first. Oh, now the first.
03:14Now the first. Wow. Because people are now going to Penang Islands, like me also. Now the first is the highest
03:21percentage of seniors. The highest percentage of seniors in Penang. Okay. Not in Penang,
03:26throughout the country. Oh, throughout the country. So talk to me when the initiative started. So you
03:32said 12 years ago it was mooted, but when was the actual process to become an Age-Friendly City
03:39started? So one was to be either be a healthy city intergenerationally. Yes. The other option
03:45would be to be an Age-Friendly City. Age-Friendly City, which also talks about women, children,
03:51people with disabilities and primarily focus on the needs of the older people to continue to be part
03:58of this society. Yes. Okay. Yes. And when did Penang embark on this journey? So what happened was then
04:04when the CM made that announcement, we started approaching them, we started talking to them and
04:09then in November 2022, he made a local press release with us in presence with the city council and also
04:18Penang Development for Women. And they are partners. So the stakeholders in Penang, one thing is so nice
04:26to see. Oh my god, they really go all out. They all come together. They are on an island, they come
04:32together and they really collaboratively push the effort and they were so confident. Like we were saying,
04:39this is like a 10 year plan, five year plan or 15 years plan. But they were like, we will do it in three
04:45years. Yeah. And they did it. Okay. That's why being part of the Age-Friendly City Network, other cities
04:52in Malaysia, six other cities are doing it as well. But they have started early before even COVID. But
04:58Penang City said they will do it in three years and they have done it in the three years. Fantastic.
05:04Where did you come into the as part of this journey? Oh, it was way back in 82 when I first started
05:12the First Senior Citizen Association, together with Im Chong Yiu, Tung Apu Rahman as a patron to the First
05:20Senior Citizen Association, founded in 1982. But at that time, I was too young to be a member of the
05:28Senior Citizen. So I have to wait until 2000 when I reached 55. Then they elected me as the president.
05:37I stayed on for 14 years before I moved on to another international NGO that is Rose Charities
05:46International, where I started on 2000 and way on to just take off and retired at a few months ago after 17
06:00years at the hand. Wow. Then I moved on and set up Poway, that's a federal government-linked organization.
06:12And within eight months after it started, we have already 500 members. And we are going to push on to hit
06:21its target to 1000 members of multi-racial composition. And hopefully, we will be able to uplift and connect the
06:36seniors above 60s with various types of activities, empowering them.
06:43So part of the age-friendly city status is to ensure that there is social participation. So your
06:54community centers is part of that initiative. The whole process, the whole journey towards getting it.
07:03Maybe we can learn more about what that entails actually. So what does a city need to achieve to be
07:11able to be recognized as an age-friendly city? Sure. Dr. Mayor? Yeah. So there are four stages of the
07:20process. Number one is the mayor of the city has to sign on the letter saying that yes, they are taking the
07:26initiative. They are in agreement. They are agreeing to take on the role as to lead the whole process.
07:33Right. As you know, other ministry or the government is already very, very burdened with a lot of
07:38responsibilities. So the city council must sign the letter. That is number one. Number two is you must do
07:45a community-based, evidence-based study to understand what were the needs? What are the current needs? What do you
07:52need? How do we move forward? How do we integrate what you need and what the city is providing?
08:00Then there's a third step, which is bringing the stakeholders. Now, this is why I'm so passionate
08:06about this because, you know, from the state Exco, from the Go, State Go, the city council,
08:14they have all come together with all stakeholders, including the ministry, the government office,
08:19ministry of health, everyone, JKM and all that came together and they have been seeing and we've
08:26been hearing what they want. So we did a study. So based on the study, then we then get it to publish
08:33in a journal so that it's really evidence-based. And then we did a scoping review, which means we are
08:38looking at what Malaysia is already doing. So here is where we know six other cities are coming part of
08:44it. And other cities have also started the Healthy City Initiative and they are also doing that. Now,
08:50the last step where we already have completed is monitoring evaluation, making sure that every step
08:59has an indicator, we report back to the community, we tell them. So they have completed that fourth step.
09:05Okay. So in the time that Penang has been embarking on this as this journey to become age friendly,
09:15what have you witnessed? What have you seen? Particularly because you are involved with the
09:20senior citizens on the ground. When you look at your community center and you think, look at this,
09:27how senior citizens are living, what the needs are, as Dr. Sangita mentioned, what is it that you're observing?
09:33Dr. Sangita mentioned, there's a change in the improvement in the infrastructure,
09:41in everything that has done with the age friendly status implementation, and that has moved the city and
09:51its people, especially the citizen forward to a new height, to a new platform where they can enjoy
10:02the facilities that have been put in by the city council under its eight domain, the plan of age-friendly
10:15city status. And our center, Pau Wei Jelotong, has been nominated by the city council as the role model
10:26for each age friendly city status under WHO. Can you tell me why? Because within that short span,
10:37we have achieved within the goals of the city status under the plan, where we have all types of activities
10:47thrown in for the seniors to enjoy, to reconnect, to engage, and to embrace their journey during their golden years.
10:56Oh, there you go. It's really, I think, such a key part of having
11:03senior citizens or older persons to be part of society again. Because often we see
11:10an exclusion of elder persons in societal life. What are some of the more concrete examples
11:20that you can give us of how Penang has become age friendly? Is it more about built infrastructure?
11:29Is it about mobility friendly? How do we think about what makes a city friendly for people of all ages?
11:37So under WHO guidelines, there are eight areas that we need to focus on. One of it is open spaces.
11:44Open spaces. Yeah, meaning your parks, your walkway, and all that stuff. And then it is also about
11:52transportation, which I must say Rapid Penang has done. Oh my god, they're so active and so engaged.
11:58Really? Oh, really, really. I'm so impressed.
12:01I haven't been back home in a while. It's so impressive what they are doing in Penang. And you
12:07know, the responsive, isn't it that though? It's like every meeting we have and there will be
12:13stakeholders who stand up and say, oh, the bus was delayed. And she will immediately, they will stand
12:18up and they will say, where, when, which date, what time, and what was the delay about? And then we will
12:24immediately get back. And now we hear that the city council is actually hiring a consultant to map
12:31out the congestion. You know, everybody loves Penang Island, even Malaysians.
12:36Traffic is notorious, right?
12:37It's like such a nightmare. You know, the Penang, that is the main concern. That is the thing that,
12:42you know, the isolation happens so rapidly because of this. So transportation is the second one.
12:49The third one is housing because, you know, we are aging. We are aging in our house. We don't see
12:55the dangers, the risks in our own household. How many falls happen in the toilet itself?
13:02So the housing renovation, what do you need as you age, where you are so that you remain mobile,
13:08you remain part of the society, be it at your housing or outside. The fourth is about social
13:15participation, like you rightfully said, and also inclusion. Again, like you already mentioned
13:23that, you know, they need to be part of everything that is going on in the city. And that has happened
13:27over the last three years. And perhaps even before we started the whole project, they've been really
13:33good at things like that. The sixth is, I think, you know, very heavily debated recently about work
13:41and employability for people who are already retired. What happens? You know, we want you to stay active.
13:47We want you to stay engaged. We want you to be able to take care of yourself, not be a burden on anyone else.
13:53So how do you sustain that? If you're already hitting 55, if you're hitting retirement age, what happens?
13:58Yes, there's a lot of ages in the workplace.
14:01Yeah, exactly. And number seven is about, just let me quickly review.
14:07Community engagement.
14:09Yeah. Voila. Thank you so much.
14:11Community engagement.
14:13Yes.
14:13It's also about community information.
14:15Oh.
14:16You know, we, and this is another thing they are doing, which is an excellent, they set up a helpline.
14:20Oh.
14:21We have started, we have set up the first senior helpline.
14:25Okay.
14:25Apart from the usual helpline services you have. So that this helpline will concentrate on seniors.
14:34Wow.
14:34Because, you know, seniors, when they retired and nothing to do, they are bored.
14:39At least a helpline can help them. They can call up and chat on the helpline.
14:44You know, that will create a better environment for everybody.
14:49And that's where we come in to set up the first helpline and the first mobility van service to take sick patients to the general hospital and back.
15:02And it's free.
15:03Oh, wow.
15:04And this one is a mobility van that can take in what are called age-friendly people with ramps.
15:13Again, there's a ramp to take them to the hospital and back.
15:16And this one is provided by the city council to us and we will run that service for them.
15:22So this is all allowing for older persons to age in place.
15:28Yes.
15:29Because that's key to ageing better, ageing well.
15:35A few of the things you mentioned really piqued my interest, particularly in terms of transport.
15:40Let's talk about that because that's part of having older persons be mobile and independent.
15:46Penang, as we know, the infrastructure is quite tight.
15:49So I want to talk about the challenges of implementing age-friendly initiatives in a place like Penang Island, specifically,
15:59where the space constraints.
16:02We think of KL with the infrastructure of LRT, MRT, but Penang relies largely on road transport.
16:14Has that been a huge change?
16:16It's clearly possible to create age-friendly transportation without having to build something new.
16:27So talk to me a little bit more about that, particularly how older persons use public transport in Penang.
16:34Okay.
16:34Now with Rapid, they come up with a van system known as Rapid on Demand.
16:41So Rapid on Demand will station itself in several locations.
16:46Right.
16:47And you can call.
16:49If you stay in Tanjomonga area or Glugok, there's a station.
16:54You call the number, then Rapid on Demand is a small mini van, can seat about 13 people.
17:02We'll pick you up from a certain location and take you within that locality.
17:07So you don't have to say, I stay in Tanjomonga, I can call Rapid on Demand at a certain point, station there.
17:15Then you just go there, hop into the van, you pay a dollar, or you have a special Rapid card.
17:22You don't have to pay a single cent.
17:24Amazing.
17:24You hop into that, takes you to Gurney Plaza, drop you.
17:29And then when the time comes after shopping, you go back to the same spot.
17:36The van is there to take you back home.
17:38So this is all public transportation?
17:40This is a new one.
17:41All public.
17:42It's amazing.
17:43Under the Rapid on Demand.
17:46I think KL has also started.
17:48Yes.
17:49A lot of pockets, you can see them now.
17:51You see, the reason why they started with the van, because the bus was becoming a problem,
17:55because of the infrastructure, you know, going to Penang GH.
17:58Can you imagine the stalls on the right?
18:00So the buses and the cars are parked on the side.
18:03So the only reason they can go in and out is through getting a mini van.
18:07So that's why they started the van.
18:08Well, there are other challenges in trying to implement some of the WHO framework into Penang Island.
18:17I'm just wondering whether adaptations had to be made,
18:19whether all of the issues, all of the guidelines for the framework could be implemented wholesale,
18:25or did you need to localize it to a Penang Island context?
18:30Localization must happen in regardless, right?
18:33Because Penang Island, as you know, they have heritage.
18:37You know, they are trying to make sure that the charm of Penang Island is not, you know.
18:42So they had to integrate these things.
18:43Like if you go, I'm sorry, I'm Indian, so I have to say this.
18:47If you go to little India, you have to, you know, you cannot really move around in a car.
18:52You have to get down and you have to walk.
18:53But the problem is the steps are either too small, too high, and not everyone has ramps, right?
19:01So now what do you do?
19:03Because nobody will be able to move on.
19:05So what we had to do was make sure that when you're looking at these issues, you integrate it.
19:11That's why the back lane, isn't it, Datto?
19:13The back lane, bringing it up, you know, building it, making it better, making it accessible.
19:19Now all the back lanes in Penang, especially the heritage areas.
19:24Last time back lanes, you put the bicycle there.
19:27Now all that are gone.
19:28They decorate the place with murals.
19:31And you can walk at night and it's like a safe place.
19:36It's become another access point.
19:38Exactly.
19:39And another area is with the CCTVs all over the city.
19:45The crime rate, especially snack steves, has reduced or gone.
19:51Cause face recognition.
19:53Yeah.
19:54So that has helped a lot.
19:55And only two days ago, Penang has been listed or ranked number seven in Asia.
20:03To be the safest.
20:04With the, under the Asia Travel News.
20:08To be the safest city.
20:10No, the most accessible.
20:13Not accessible, the most famous or most popular tourist spot.
20:17Oh, tourist spot. Oh, because of all these initiatives.
20:20Yeah, yeah.
20:20Since you brought up technology, can I ask you about the role of technology?
20:24So often, whenever we think about making cities more accessible,
20:28or spaces more accessible, or even activities more accessible,
20:32we default to using technology.
20:34Yes.
20:35We have, there's an app for everything.
20:37There's a link for everything to sign up for.
20:40I want to talk about that, especially in relation to older persons.
20:45Okay.
20:46How do we make use of technology elder inclusive?
20:50Okay.
20:51The state government has set up Penang digital section, a center,
20:58where the public, like NGOs, can use their cultures.
21:03Like for our center, their cultures will come every month without fail
21:08to teach elderly people various types from AI to decluttering.
21:15Anything you want to know.
21:16Ah, everything about technology.
21:18Yeah.
21:18About AI or about how to use your handphone effectively rather than just call up your friends.
21:27So that has been implemented and that's how wherever you go to Penang, you find you are very happy with the car parks.
21:36Why?
21:36Yes.
21:36Everybody use handphone.
21:38Yes.
21:40To find parking spaces.
21:42Yeah.
21:42You don't have to, like last time in KL in Singapore, you have to scratch.
21:48No more.
21:48Go on.
21:49Yes.
21:49There's things of the past.
21:52So that is improvement, all right?
21:55Yes.
21:56You just have to key in the time through the apps.
22:01They call it Penang Smart Parking.
22:04And the elder and older people are not getting left behind because of the digital gap?
22:09Yeah.
22:09They are trained.
22:10They are at spaces every month.
22:12You go to certain kiosks, the people will teach you how to use the smart parking technology
22:19under the city council.
22:21Then you can, while eating, then you think, oh, my time is up.
22:26The phone rings, you just have to, the alarm, then you just add in another half an hour to one hour
22:33to your apps.
22:34That's it.
22:35You don't have to go in the hot sun or in the rain, right?
22:38Like last time.
22:39I remember.
22:40I remember feeding coins into that meter.
22:43That things of the past, this is what I mean, progress using AI technology.
22:50Dr. Sri is wearing yellow today and they have launched Pearl app that is also yellow.
22:56And it's all about accessibility, where, what is, how to get there.
23:01But let's keep something in mind.
23:03As you age, your fingerprints, they don't work anymore on the phone.
23:09It doesn't, it's not easy.
23:10Like you were saying, I have to wear glasses to look at what I'm reading.
23:14So what they're doing right now is it's bigger screen, it's finger, you know, it's, you have
23:21other options.
23:22You can put in a code, you can put this.
23:24True.
23:25You can do other things.
23:26So they will tell them, like, you know, sometimes people get very frustrated.
23:30Why is my phone not working?
23:31Yeah.
23:32So they will tell them, okay, this is why.
23:34So you cannot use your fingerprint anymore because your skin is dry, you know, so things
23:38like that.
23:39So they are educating, bringing the awareness.
23:43As you know, you know, we are also facing something part of the sandwich generation where
23:49the parents are stuck between caring for their parents and then caring for the children as well.
23:53And when you communicate about technology as a, you know, a mother or a daughter, they might
24:00be barriers because, you know, so what we do is we bring in others, right?
24:04So all we bridge the gap, get the children to talk to the grandparents and vice versa, but not leaving
24:10them behind.
24:11Yes.
24:11You know, it's like they need to know.
24:13And I'm sure you have realized they are also on the social media all the time.
24:18My aunt sends me videos every now and then.
24:21Digital literacy is very important.
24:23Yes.
24:24Yes.
24:24Okay.
24:25In the time that we have left, I do want to ask you what's next.
24:27So this is exciting that we have all these initiatives in place that Penang has been recognized as
24:33an age-friendly city.
24:35But how do we expand this?
24:37So it's beyond Penang Island.
24:39And how do we make sure that the residents of Penang really know how to leverage and benefit
24:47from all these initiatives that have been put in place?
24:49If I may start with Dr. Sangeeta.
24:52Let me just say I missed out one very, very prominent factor, which is health and the burden
24:58on health because, you know, all the people are in the health settings.
25:02And again, coming back, this is why you need the stakeholders.
25:05This is why you need members like this being upfront, bringing, you know, so we are moving
25:10to people's home rather than just waiting for them to come out.
25:14So the health is a bigger part of the community as well.
25:17Each friendly city cannot give you or the WHO cannot give you a certificate and say you're done.
25:23You actually have to breach the gap at every generation.
25:28People are aging every minute, every second.
25:31You have to continue the efforts.
25:33That's why they don't just tell you, yay, you have done the good job.
25:36They tell you continue your good efforts.
25:38It's not a destination.
25:40Exactly.
25:41And you know, the reason why we want to bring Penang Island and we want to talk about
25:46what they have achieved is because, one, we want to learn from each other,
25:49because there's six cities in the line to go.
25:52So we want to learn what worked, what didn't work.
25:55How can you integrate things, right?
25:57So this is something you have to continue.
25:59That's why it has to be a journey integrating not only national, not only city,
26:04but whatever you have in mind.
26:07That's true.
26:09Yes.
26:09I think the good thing is, I would like to congratulate the federal government
26:15in the next few days, next month, on the 5th, the government is going to launch its first blueprint
26:24on Senior Citizen Action Plan.
26:27That will cover more or less the whole spectrum, from ageing to a wide program, as you know.
26:36And this is a great initiative from the government after such a long wait and at long last.
26:43So we must congratulate the government for coming up with this blueprint,
26:49Senior Citizen Action Plan that covers the whole country nationwide.
26:55I think that's something which we should.
26:58I'm encouraged to hear that it's going to be launched soon.
27:00Yes.
27:01You're right.
27:01It's been in the works for many years.
27:02Yes, yes, yes.
27:04Both of you, thank you so much for coming on the show
27:07and sharing the exciting new things happening in Penang Island.
27:12It really is quite heartening to see this, and hopefully we'll see this
27:16in other areas around the country and become a real age-inclusive country.
27:21So thank you for your time, I appreciate it.
27:22Thank you very much.
27:24That's all the time we have for you on this episode of Consider This.
27:27I'm Melissa Idris, signing off for the evening.
27:29Thank you so much for watching.
27:30Good night.
27:46Thanks Speaker.
28:03Thank you, sir.
28:03Hey, boss.
28:06Hi, everybody.
28:07Are you ready?
28:09You're ready?
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