- 4 months ago
This episode of 5 Live programme focusses on the 'digital arrest' cyber scam that led to the death of a 76-year-old retired doctor in Hyderabad, who suffered a fatal cardiac arrest after being extorted over Rs 6.5 lakh from her pension account by scammers impersonating police officers.
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00:00Hi there, I'm Sorul Merotra Kapoor and this is 5 Live.
00:04Over the next one hour, we'll bring you stories that demand your time, your attention.
00:09Stories that should ignite you.
00:11And since it's 5 Live, we will also bring you stories to inspire your healthiest, happiest life.
00:16So stop scrolling. Let's tell you what's lined up on the programme today.
00:20First up, wishes are pouring in from across the world as Prime Minister Modi celebrates his birthday, 75th.
00:26From ministers to actors, world leaders, including Donald Trump, wish the Prime Minister on his birthday.
00:33Then the top focus on the programme today, we look at yet another case of digital arrest.
00:40But this time, it's more than just the monetary loss.
00:44It led to a heart attack of a doctor who was digitally arrested.
00:48It has now claimed a life.
00:51Also coming up on the programme, India's clinical trials gap.
00:55It's a big burden with very low data.
00:58How do we treat disease on an Indian body when we don't even have trials done on one?
01:05We look at that gap on the programme.
01:07And then we've got the grandmom who's taken the internet by storm.
01:13She's got spine of steel and hair made of silver.
01:17The grandmom who's weightlifting 115 kgs at 70 years of age.
01:25She joins us on the programme.
01:26And then we end the programme today with the trend story.
01:30The new age brides, what exactly are they looking for?
01:34Gen Z trends are all over.
01:36But are they now getting into and changing the way weddings are done as well?
01:42All right.
01:54By now, almost all of us know someone who's had a close call with cyber fraud.
01:59An OTP that almost got phished.
02:02A fake investment that sounded a bit too real.
02:05A bonus message that felt harmless until it wasn't.
02:09But what we are seeing now is something far darker.
02:13A scam that doesn't just take your money, it breaks your mind.
02:18It's called digital arrest and it's not just a fraud.
02:22It's a psychological warfare.
02:24Look at the numbers there.
02:26In 2024 alone, India saw 22 lakh cyber crime complaints.
02:33These are only the registered ones, remember.
02:35The total loss of money, 22,845 crore.
02:42But one story that has come today out of Hyderabad proves that some losses can't be measured in money.
02:50This is the story of a 76-year-old retired doctor.
02:54Someone who spent her life healing others because the latest victim of this twisted scheme.
03:00She became that.
03:01It began with a very simple WhatsApp video call.
03:06On the screen was what looked like a Bangalore police logo.
03:12The voice on the other end was calm, official, authoritative.
03:17They told her that she was being investigated in a human trafficking case.
03:22Shocking, absurd, completely fabricated.
03:25But the performance, that was flawless.
03:28They showed her official-looking documents, complete with her Aadhaar number.
03:34They flashed logos from Supreme Court, RBI Enforcement Directorate.
03:38They even cited a law, the National Secret Act of 1923, which, by the way, does not even exist.
03:45And then, the pressure began.
03:47Over the next three days, they flooded her video calls with different numbers, constant threats.
03:55They said her account would be frozen.
03:57Her name would be ruined.
03:59She could be physically arrested as well.
04:02Now, she was 76, alone, terrified.
04:08And in her panic, she did what they asked.
04:11She transferred more than 6.5 lakh from her pension account, hoping it would all just go away.
04:18But it didn't.
04:20The threats kept coming.
04:22The fake notices, the fake officers, the relentless fear.
04:25And then, on September 8th, the threats of it all finally took its toll.
04:33She collapsed with severe chest pain and died of a massive cardiac arrest.
04:39And here's the most chilling part.
04:42Even after her death, the fraudsters continued to message and call her phone.
04:47Her family has now filed a police complaint.
04:50Hyderabad Cyber Crime Unit is now investigating the charges.
04:54And what are the charges, really, in this case?
04:57Impersonation, forgery, extortion, criminal intimidation?
05:00Endless, right?
05:01The police believe that this is the work of an organized digital arrest gang.
05:06Cyber criminals who pretend to be authorities and use fear as their primary weapon.
05:11And the worrying part?
05:14It seems to be working.
05:16Because here's the thing.
05:18Today's cyber crime doesn't always come with a suspicious link or a hacked account.
05:23Sometimes it comes as a uniform on a video call, a convincing voice, a terrifying lie.
05:31So, if you or someone you know gets a call from someone claiming to be from the police or a court or even a government agency,
05:39don't panic.
05:40Don't pay.
05:41Hang up and verify.
05:44Call the real agency.
05:46Speak to someone you trust.
05:47Report them.
05:48That doctor didn't deserve what happened to her.
05:51No one does, really.
05:53Let her story today be a warning, not just about scammers and what they can do, but what a fear, unchecked, can really cost.
06:03So, here's us urging all of you to stay alert, stay skeptical, and most of all, stay safe.
06:10Because you don't want to be that next person.
06:14Let's take this story forward with our guest now to try and understand what could she have actually done differently.
06:20Joining us next is Sanjay Sahai, former IPS officer, cybersecurity expert as well.
06:26Mr. Sahai, in a situation like this, we've seen that the entire modus operandi is pretty straightforward.
06:33They look for people who are vulnerable, they look for people who get scared easy, they look for people who are largely alone and would perhaps then not share the story with somebody else or someone who could talk sense into them.
06:48But yet, we hear of these cases week after week, day after day.
06:53Could you, sort of, for anybody in that age bracket watching right now, what is your primary advice to them?
07:04That if you get a call from an officer, what is the first thing that you need to do?
07:10Primarily, we are sitting on a digital arrest which has slowly become a tinderbox and I've been talking about it for nearly the last one and a half years or somewhere.
07:17In October last year, the Prime Minister had also talked about it and he talked of caution and variety of other things.
07:24Before coming to the witness, I would like to suggest and I'll be suggesting any number of times that all the numbers which belong to the government,
07:32more so the enforcement, investigative and intelligence agencies, they should be white listed.
07:37When the call comes, it will say that it is coming from the government.
07:41The government has never thought it proper to do that.
07:43It can be done in a very, very easy manner.
07:45The second thing is regarding the mule accounts.
07:48So, regarding mule accounts, nothing has been done.
07:51I think last year I was talking, last year or sometime early this year, I was talking with RBI in a town hall event in Hyderabad.
07:59So, there what I was telling them that this digital onboarding has literally become a fake onboarding.
08:04See, our complete faith in digital systems, I think, is belying the actual reality.
08:11The actual reality is that we have a completely broken physical system and that has been translated into an equally broken digital system.
08:20So, we have 1.8 million mule accounts.
08:24Now, if the government knows of 1.8 million mule accounts, what have we done about it?
08:30What is happening in Cambodia and other places?
08:32So, there is a different story.
08:33Now, when we come to these elderly, from a very, very traditional, conventional policing point of view, which we have done most part of our life before digital policing and all this cyber and all that entered, we used to make a list of elderly people, single or couples.
08:54Because we had the threat that their house might be broken, variety of other crimes could happen because of the level of vulnerability which they have.
09:02I think in an equally similar manner.
09:05Now, it is, I think, it is a mandate or it is a requirement that the police visits them, talks to them, explains to them.
09:15I don't think any locality, if you take a police station, they will be having more than, say, a few hundred of these elderly people.
09:22And these elderly people, they also interact with each other.
09:26So, once they interact with each other, their lines of communication operate in the same group and in the same community and it moves pretty fast.
09:36Rather than making only a collar tune, I am not denying that collar tune might or, I don't know, might not have an impact and what I have seen, most of the efforts made by the government, as far as the elderly, educated and even people coming from bureaucratic background.
09:51So, they have fallen into this trap.
09:53Now, with this ending, there are a couple ofโฆ
09:55I think community policing is a great point, sir.
09:57But I also think that when it comes to cyber crime, it's got less to do with just knowing.
10:04So, everybody knows about cyber fraud, everybody knows about digital arrest, till the time it happens to them.
10:10It's very difficult in that moment to sort of point it out.
10:16I see a lot of people who say this keeps happening, but they yet fall prey.
10:20But let me bring in Pawan Dugal at this point.
10:23Let me bring him in.
10:24He's a cyber law advocate and expert as well.
10:26Pawan Dugal, we have reported on so many cases of cyber crime, cyber fraud in the past.
10:33It'sโฆI mean, I've lost count of the shows I have done on it.
10:36But whenโฆthis is the first time, perhaps, why the story shook me so much is because the first time it's taken away a life.
10:45Money, which you can perhaps lose and earn back, but life, once lost, is gone forever.
10:52However, how do weโฆhow are we, despite all the campaigns, and Sanjay said that rightly, right, despite all the collar tunes, despite the Prime Minister holding, you know, talking about it, despite a lot of chatter about it, news channels reporting it, the numbers only going up, and the crime is only getting more intense.
11:12So, how are we to tackle this?
11:15I think we need to have a new mindset to deal with it.
11:19If we are going to use existing law to deal with it, then we are mistaken because it's a broken house to begin with.
11:27And most of these new age crimes are not capable of being completely covered within the ambit of existing legal frameworks, whether it's the Information Technology Act 2000, whether it's the Bharatiya Nyai Sahita 2023.
11:41The reason for this is AI has brought in a completely new game-changing paradigm, which is now this new category of crimes called AI crimes.
11:51And these crimes are not distinctly coverable under the provisions of either the Information Technology Act 2000 or the Bharatiya Nyai Sahita.
11:59Unfortunately, at the time when I talk with you, India does not have a dedicated law on artificial intelligence, nor do we have a law either on deepfakes or on AI crimes.
12:12But this is not necessarily AI or deepfake, Pawandugal.
12:15This is just a man impersonating.
12:19Right. It's a man impersonating using technology.
12:22So, basically, it's nothing but electronic forgery.
12:25It's nothing but cheating by impersonation by using a computer resource.
12:30For that, you can definitely invoke Section 66D of the Information Technology Act 2000.
12:35But mind you, it's a minor offence.
12:37It's a bailable offence, punishable with three years imprisonment and two lakh rupees, fine.
12:42So, the detrance does not exist.
12:44Now, this is a new case that's come in.
12:46A couple of months back, we had this lady who was a government officer in Uttar Pradesh.
12:50She came to know about something on deepfake, fake information, led to a heart failure and led to loss of life.
12:59This is the second episode that's come in this regard.
13:01Now, these episodes will keep on increasing.
13:04The fundamental question we have to ask is, who's going to be responsible?
13:08Can we not make the intermediaries responsible?
13:10Currently, we have a very soft-touch approach on intermediaries, thanks to the current interpretation under Section 79 IT Act.
13:19But I think the time has come.
13:20We will have to straddle them with more responsibility.
13:22We'll have to, of course, try to find out the original perpetuator.
13:26But then finding that is a problem because maybe the original perpetuator is not a human.
13:31Maybe it's an algorithm.
13:32Now, when Albania has now come up with a new AI minister in the form of AI algorithm being the minister,
13:40it's time that India should come up with some out-of-the-box thought processes,
13:44some new approaches on how to deal with these practical issues
13:47because loss of life cannot be tolerated under any circumstances.
13:53And in a case like this, Section 66D of the IT Act,
13:58hardly does any justice to the gravity of defense.
14:01But Mr. Duggal, there's also a slight catch to the entire situation.
14:05In cases of, the law basically says that if you are willingly sharing the OTP,
14:12then it's on you, right?
14:15So if somebody were to scam me or coax me into sharing an OTP,
14:19or in all of these cases, what happens is the money is being transferred voluntarily.
14:24They are telling me, do it else.
14:27So in situations like these, the law is really flawed.
14:31Because they don't keep into account that this was done because there was a digital arrest
14:36or perhaps a gun to your head in a digital form.
14:38Yes, the law is flawed, is broken.
14:41But the time has come for us to expand the horizons and interpretations of existing law.
14:47And for therefore, all these transactions which I do,
14:51but I do under a fear of a democracy, a sword on my head,
14:56on fear, on potential retribution,
15:00that ought not to be considered as lawful consent.
15:04Because my consent was obtained by putting me into fear,
15:07into panic, by intimidating me.
15:10And that's not valid consent.
15:11Unfortunately, the current legal frameworks have not been drafted,
15:15keeping things in mind.
15:16So when I lose money on these internet frauds or these other exercises,
15:21or when I'm becoming a victim of deep seek,
15:23I know I'm doing something wrong,
15:25but I'm doing it because I am fearing more consequences.
15:29I think that kind of conduct also needs to be brought under unauthorized activity,
15:35under unauthorized transactions.
15:37Banks need to be made responsible.
15:39Why are the banks being allowed to be mere spectators?
15:42What is the Reserve Bank of India doing in this regard?
15:45If we can actually, you can hold the whip for the banks to say,
15:49hold, hold on, you will be responsible for the transactions.
15:53And please have a waiting time.
15:55So to that extent, you can start giving some breathing space to potential victims.
16:00But ultimately, you will have to go for more capacity building.
16:03Law comes in far more later.
16:05You will have to sensitize users.
16:07The time to say no is now.
16:09The time to exercise your veto by disconnecting the call on your mobile is now.
16:12You know what, I think there is no one solution to this.
16:16It can't be just buyer beware.
16:18It can't be just put on me as a citizen to ensure that I don't fall prey.
16:23And there has to be a stricter law that comes in place.
16:27And that's very clear.
16:27I have last few seconds to sort of get in Sanjay Sahai as well on this point.
16:33So every time I hear of a cyber fraud,
16:36I feel like they feed on ultimately human emotions.
16:41Fear of being isolated,
16:45isolated, of being put through something.
16:48They're ultimately feeding into human emotions.
16:51And like I said, they look for soft targets.
16:54Beyond just community policing,
16:56which let's be honest, we don't have enough people to do.
16:59What else can people do at their end?
17:02Or what else can police start doing?
17:06As far as what the police needs to do,
17:09first and foremost, I'll talk about digital policing.
17:11And the capability of digital police,
17:14of digital policing of the Indian police is certainly suspect.
17:18Let me tell you one simple thing.
17:20that 98% of the transactions today happen in the digital world.
17:24But the police, 98% is moving in the physical world.
17:28So that is one part of the story.
17:29The other part is the nature of control,
17:32which police has on all the other stakeholders of cybercrime.
17:36And the other very serious stakeholders
17:38are the telecommunication companies and the banks.
17:41The telcos, they can issue 500 SIMs on one number
17:46or on one person, there are 500 SIMs.
17:49And 1.8 million mule accounts
17:52have been repeating over and over again
17:54that the incapability of the police handling these stakeholders.
17:58Now, if the police finds out that there are mule accounts,
18:00what do they do about it?
18:02They go to the bank, but the bank don't respond.
18:04I can give you at least five business scenario tweaks
18:08in the core banking software
18:10that will be able to settle out at least 40-50% of the issue.
18:14And however much we talk about community policing,
18:17whether it is delivered, not delivered,
18:19whether it has capability or not capability to do,
18:22it is primarily the incapability of the police to reach a level
18:26where they are not able to communicate.
18:29They have not tried.
18:30Plus the intelligence enforcement and other agencies,
18:33collaborating together and intelligence being brought to the outside world.
18:38Even we don't have a list of numbers
18:40which have been used for all this.
18:42And Airtel keeps sending calls where it says it is spam.
18:46But for the digital arrest calls, rest all are spam.
18:49When there is a digital arrest call, it goes fine.
18:51And that advertisement, we are allowing it to go on on the national media.
18:57So it is a multi-headed dialogue.
19:00Yeah, I think both from a police perspective and a law perspective,
19:07since we have Pawan Dugal and Sanjay Sai both,
19:09it is very clear that the law seems to be flawed on both ends
19:12and we are way behind in trying to catch up with it.
19:15I think an urgent need of the hour is to address it,
19:19to change the law and also to sensitize our police forces for it,
19:22sensitize the society as well.
19:24And either one of them not falling through
19:27will just, again, lead to a fractured sort of situation here.
19:30Thank you both for joining us on this very, very sort of important discussion.
19:36All right, some updates coming in.
19:48Father of Captain Sumit Sabarwal,
19:50who was one of the pilots in the ill-fated Air India Dreamliner,
19:53has now demanded a formal investigation by the central government.
19:57In a letter to the Civil Aviation Secretary and the AAIB Director General,
20:01the 91-year-old Pushkaraj Sabarwal said that the selective leaks about the accident
20:08have led to speculation that Sumit was under tremendous psychological pressure
20:12and therefore was contemplating committing suicide.
20:15Now, he is saying this entire leak sort of tarnishes his son's image
20:21and he's appealing against it.
20:24Now, let me break that open.
20:25And my colleague Sumit Bharadwa joins us for more details on this.
20:34Amit, I can only but wonder the plight of a 91-year-old fighting
20:39and taking these escalating matters only to keep the reputation of his son intact.
20:45Well, so, which has been shot by the 91-year-old Pushkaraj Sabarwal,
20:52the father of, you know, Captain Sumit Sabarwal,
20:56who was one of the pilots on the ill-fated AI-171,
21:01yet again brings back the concern of the families of crew members
21:05and more so for the pilots because we had seen as to how the selective stories done,
21:10particularly in international media houses were making inventos
21:15that possibly, you know, these pilots were at fault
21:21and the attempt was to pin the blame on the two pilots,
21:25Clive Kunda as well as Captain Sumit Sabarwal.
21:29But now, the father of Sumit Sabarwal has written a letter to the senior official
21:36at the Civil Aviation Ministry seeking a formal inquiry
21:41which will, in a way, under Rule 12 of the, you know,
21:46Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau
21:48and that would have an independent Supreme Court judge
21:53as well as retired Supreme Court judge investigating into the entire matter.
21:57However, having said that, the investigation or the preliminary report
22:02which is issued, you know, which is released in public domain
22:05is never to put the blame on any individual for the crash.
22:10Rather, it brings to the fore only the specific details of the crash
22:15as to when did it happen and what could be possibly the primary reason.
22:20What happened in this particular case,
22:22is the selective text from the conversation regarding the fuel control switches
22:26but actually, you know, put out of context.
22:30Back to you.
22:31All right, Amit.
22:32Thanks so much for that update.
22:33Like we said, one can only imagine the plight of the 91-year-old
22:36who's now, after having lost his son,
22:39is fighting for his reputation.
22:42All right, moving on to the big health story we are tracking here on 5 Live.
22:50Indian patients often wait years after global approvals
22:54to access breakthrough therapies.
22:55This is because only 4% of Indians are represented in clinical trials globally.
23:02Roche has set up now 10 Indian government hospitals
23:06to ensure drugs and vaccines that are made in India
23:09also represent Indians.
23:11My colleague Milan brings you this report.
23:18India accounts for 17% of the world's population
23:22and 20% of the global disease burden.
23:26Yet, fewer than 4% of global clinical trials are conducted here.
23:32There is a gap.
23:33And Roche, a pharma company, is helping India address it.
23:37When we talk about diversity and representation somewhere,
23:41we are the, you know, backyard of the pharmacy of the world.
23:45But we rarely have that kind of representation in the world pharmacy
23:49when you look at it the other way, right?
23:51Yeah, so it's a very good question.
23:53I would answer this in two ways.
23:55So it's important for India, like any other country,
23:59to be well represented or fairly represented in global trials
24:02simply because we contribute 17% of the global population,
24:0720%, more importantly, when you come to pharma research,
24:1020% of the global disease burden.
24:12So there should be this proportion of Indian patients in trials.
24:17Now, what we try to do is to make sure that these centres
24:20are able to then do justice to the patients who are coming
24:23by then providing them this capability to be able to do global clinical trials.
24:28But clinical trials in India have long struggled with mistrust.
24:34Moreover, it's a real struggle to get Indians to agree for a clinical trial.
24:39When I put on the hat of industry, we want trials to be done well
24:44and to the extent possible also without compromising safety and standards,
24:51also as fast as possible.
24:52And it's not easy to find the kind of volume of patients
24:57that good centres in India has in other parts of the world.
25:02So that's another reason why, as a sponsor,
25:05as a pharmaceutical company, invested in R&D.
25:08The US ranks number one with maximum trial registrations,
25:13followed by China, India and then comes Japan.
25:16However, as per population, the USA tops the list,
25:21while India comes fourth with only 53 people
25:24who participate in trials per million people.
25:31The ecosystem for good phase three or four clinical trials,
25:35which are key stages, is missing.
25:38Roosh says it is working with trusted public hospitals to change that.
25:42We need to make sure that the trials that we have
25:46is representative of the patients who are going to get.
25:48And we've realised that we need the data
25:51to be able to make sure that the health outcomes are impacting
25:56and we maximise the health outcomes for all our patients.
26:00So the focus in India is not new.
26:04It is just something that we are now able to apply this
26:07to the need in the public hospitals
26:10where we see that there is a large amount of patients who go there,
26:13but there is not that many trial opportunities.
26:16And so we are building the capability in these hospitals
26:18to do more clinical trials.
26:25At PGIMS Rothak, one such partner site for CT investigations,
26:29Dr. Savita Verma and her team are part of Roosh's clinical trial programme.
26:34They are also currently working on clinical trials
26:36for India's first dengue vaccine.
26:39We are part of the ICMR project on dengue vaccine trial.
26:43It is still in the middle phase,
26:45like the trial started last year
26:46and we have a two-years follow-up.
26:49So only, I think after,
26:50it will take a longer one, one and a half years
26:53to generate that data which is required.
26:55So the recruitment has been completed recently.
26:58So, but there is a two-years follow-up.
26:59The focus is on five disease areas.
27:06Oncology, ophthalmology, neurology, immunology
27:11and cardiovascular and metabolic disorders.
27:14With Miland Sharma, Bureau Report, India Today.
27:18So what do you picture a grandmom doing at 70?
27:23Maybe some morning puja,
27:25taking care of grandkids,
27:26maybe an occasional satsang,
27:28maybe even a gentle yoga class.
27:31Well, get ready to toss that image
27:33out of the window
27:35because the grandmom you're about to meet now
27:38doesn't just chant mantras,
27:40she's dead lifting her body weight
27:43and much more.
27:44She's got silver hair
27:45and a spine of steel, quite literally.
27:49And she's proving one rep at a time
27:52that strength has no expiry date.
27:56She's not your average nani and dadi.
27:58She's the weightlifting warrior
27:59in a saree and suit.
28:02Let's welcome Roshni Devi Sangwan
28:04and her son,
28:05who's also a professional fitness coach,
28:07her personal guide,
28:08Ajay Sangwan on the program.
28:10Namaskar.
28:11Thank you very much for talking to us.
28:14Roshni ji,
28:15when we talk about 70-year-olds,
28:18people don't come to mind.
28:21First of all,
28:22I want to know
28:23how did your whole journey
28:25start?
28:26When did you first
28:27take a dumbbell in your hands?
28:31I was looking at my knees.
28:36So I went to the doctor,
28:38so I did the doctor therapy.
28:41And he was telling me,
28:42I'm going to go to the hospital.
28:45After three months,
28:47you had a physiotherapy
28:48and then he asked me,
28:49I don't want to know
28:51without physiotherapy.
28:51It's going to matter.
28:54I went to the gym.
28:55I said,
28:56I'm going to the gym?
28:57Which way will you go to the gym?
28:59I'll go to the gym with two or four.
28:59It'll go through the gym.
29:02So I tried to go to the gym.
29:04I asked him,
29:05I said,
29:06I went to the gym.
29:07That was amazing.
29:09I saw this.
29:21I was a little bit of a walk.
29:23I did a walk very quickly.
29:25I got 5 kilos.
29:27I got 10 kilos.
29:29I got 20 kilos.
29:31I got 40 kilos.
29:33I got 60 kilos.
29:35So this is my first time, then I started.
29:42So did you ever exercise, exercise, etc.
29:48This is the first time you went to the gym,
29:51and how long did you journey for 110 years?
29:56No, I never went.
29:58I never saw the gym in my childhood.
30:01I saw the gym in my childhood.
30:03I never saw the gym in my childhood.
30:05I never saw the gym in my childhood.
30:10And now you are crying with your son.
30:15Ajay is also with us.
30:17Ajay, you have some guts, I have to say.
30:20At this age, the kids say,
30:24don't do it.
30:26Don't sit down.
30:27Don't do it.
30:29And you have thrown away.
30:31You have to throw their weights.
30:33So how was this reaction?
30:34Your mother, they heard you.
30:36They didn't say anything.
30:38Actually, it was not easy to take it.
30:42But the first time, the doctor did ultrasound, MRI,
30:45so that his left knee had osteoarthritis,
30:48and his lower back injury.
30:50And the doctor said that they are still.
30:52The doctor said that,
30:53my mother has been born.
30:54You have to take care of yourself.
30:56You have to take care of yourself.
30:57Take a walk in the park.
30:58Then I decided that the doctor will not decide
31:01what I want to do.
31:03And they have to sit at home.
31:05Now you are sitting at home.
31:06You have to take care of yourself.
31:07You have to listen to the TV.
31:08Now you have to listen to your work.
31:09You have to retire.
31:10And I was thinking that I saw that weight training, exercise,
31:14exercise, strength training, which is India's concert.
31:17At the beginning, when I told them to go to the gym,
31:20it was a shock that the gym was literally worse.
31:23I had two or four hearts saved me,
31:25and I thought you would have lost two hearts.
31:27I thought I would have seen it.
31:28The problem was that I had to go to the gym.
31:31And in the suit, I just felt good.
31:33So when I went to the gym, there was a little crowd.
31:36So when I went to the gym, I would know that
31:37there would be a tone type.
31:39So I felt awkward.
31:42Then I went to the gym,
31:44and when I went to the gym,
31:45I said, you would have seen it on my side.
31:46Because there were four people
31:47who had met before or in the future.
31:49The problem was that you had to go to the gym.
31:52You don't listen to me.
31:53Look at me on my side.
31:54I said, I will try it very slowly.
31:57Then I started them as a basic thing.
32:00Then they took them for a half a year.
32:02Now they had 110 kg.
32:03They had a trap bar, deadlift, leg press.
32:06Now the doctors were all their fans.
32:08They said, you are exceptional.
32:11You are right.
32:14You are right.
32:16Tell me Roshni ji.
32:18The problem is that the right hand
32:21was cut 20 years ago.
32:22Therefore, the right hand is not cut.
32:24They have three fingers.
32:26Plus, the right shoulder is a muscle tear.
32:29You are right.
32:31You are right.
32:31After both of them,
32:32they have operation of Motiyah Bind.
32:34Plus, they have problems in the hip joint,
32:36in the right hand.
32:37A leg bow problem is the right.
32:39All right.
32:41So, in this period,
32:43you both get inspiration for this part.
32:46After they both go to the gym.
32:49Because they are addicted to the gym.
32:50If they go in the gym,
32:51they feel pretty unique.
32:52One day, they take it every time.
32:53I want to make sure that you have to do.
32:55I thought, no, I'll take it a little.
32:57I thought that I will do a little bit.
32:59I thought that I will do a little bit.
33:03Roshni ji, tell me, what has changed?
33:07Why do you think you should go to the gym in 103 Bukhar?
33:11I know that you are on a fitness journey,
33:15the happy hormones are decreased.
33:19What do you think you should go to the gym in 103 Bukhar?
33:25It is a good day to get my own fitness.
33:27I think that you can go to the gym every day.
33:31You can do the gym every day.
33:33It makes me very much good,
33:352,5 hours of gym every day.
33:37I feel very good.
33:39You should hold happy forms in the gym.
33:41Because it has become a bad thing.
33:44Do you, your twin, stay at home, what will you do?
33:48On Sunday Sunday it will be a gym,
33:50but on Sunday it will be a gym,
33:52But if you make a gym for Sunday, then you're fine.
33:55Happy hours at the gym.
33:56Now, that's a great line to deal with.
33:59But Ajay, this is a very inspiring story
34:02for you and your mom both.
34:04But what people are watching,
34:06I want to underline a very important thing
34:08that if you start lifting in such a life,
34:11please do it in supervision.
34:13Please ensure that someone has something with you.
34:16Because it can be counterproductive to wrong.
34:19In fact, at any age, resistance training
34:22or weights can get a lot of problems.
34:27So please do it in supervision.
34:29I want to say it first.
34:30But I want to go from Roshni.
34:32Roshni, you're so fit.
34:33What are you eating?
34:35These young people are eating protein powder in the gym.
34:40Where do you get your protein?
34:43I take my diet at the morning
34:47and I go to the gym.
34:49You're eating protein.
34:52You're eating protein.
34:53You're eating protein.
35:03Then you drank water in the gym.
35:05You drink water in the gym.
35:06There's a drink and you drink water in the gym.
35:08Yes.
35:09And after you've got your protein before you walk out.
35:11After you walk out?
35:12After you eat protein.
35:14Then you will pray after you walk out.
35:16After that, when we come, we have a little apple, apple, and salad.
35:23And we eat it in the morning.
35:26But Roshni, how much is it?
35:30Tell us about the portion control of the world.
35:34How much is it?
35:36One apple apple.
35:38One apple apple and salad.
35:42We eat it in the morning.
35:44One apple apple, one apple apple, and one apple apple.
35:49Only one apple apple and one apple apple?
35:52Yes, and one apple apple.
35:55One apple apple.
35:57Ajay, you are not putting herโฆ
35:59She is a vegetarian, that means.
36:01She is a hardcore vegetarian.
36:04So that's the reason I include protein supplement in our diet.
36:09She is eating so much food.
36:11She is exercising, lifting.
36:13She is physically very sweet.
36:15Before, she didn't raise her hand on her.
36:17She had a moment that she had to hold her down.
36:20She had to hold her down.
36:21Now, the moment was so good.
36:22The doctor was surprised that without her operation,
36:25everyone was doing her operation.
36:27She was doing the part of the diet.
36:28She was surprised.
36:29Now, she says,
36:30She is asking for her operation,
36:31she is doing the right thing.
36:33She is not the right thing to do the operation.
36:34I think that's what the story, that's the story all about, but what an inspiring story.
36:44She's more than 70 years old. She's doing deadlifts.
36:48For those of you who don't understand weights at all,
36:50deadlifts is actually pulling up that entire weight of 110 kg that she does at this age.
36:56This is a journey of just one and a half years.
36:59But of course, like we said,
37:01this comes with riders, which are very important to underline here.
37:05Please, if you're ever trying it at whatever age, do it under proper supervision.
37:11And that's the only way to go about.
37:13But what a story.
37:14Two years back, she couldn't lift her hand.
37:17And now, 110 kgs feels like a game for her.
37:24Just watch that video.
37:26She's got her posture correct.
37:28She's got her breathing technique right.
37:30And there she goes.
37:32Her son there, who's her personal physical trainer, telling us that this all started after the doctor said that,
37:40listen, you've got to sit back and do what old people do, but this is what old people should be doing now.
37:47Roshni ji,
37:49the last few minutes are with you.
37:51It's been fun talking to you today.
37:53I think,
37:55watching you,
37:57what you do in your life,
37:59you have to inspire young people.
38:01I think,
38:02in the world of the people who are watching you,
38:03who are also watching you in your life,
38:06who are watching you in your life,
38:08who are wearing your dad's,
38:09who are wearing your suit,
38:10who are wearing your shoes,
38:11who are wearing your shoes.
38:12They feel like this is not our way.
38:14They tell the doctor every day,
38:15who tells the doctor about knee replacement.
38:17Some say elbow replacement, hip replacement.
38:20They are so sad.
38:21Do you have any message to them?
38:25The message is that if you are not in the gym, you exercise in your house.
38:29Do not exercise in your house.
38:31Do not exercise in your house.
38:33Do not exercise in your body.
38:37Exercise is necessary.
38:41And I think that your story is very good.
38:43That you can start from any age.
38:45Our body is so beautiful.
38:47That you can start from any age.
38:49The transformation you can start from not to, is it?
38:51No one can do it?
38:53No one can do it.
38:55No one can do it.
38:57Plus, you don't have clothes, you can do it in suits.
39:00No one can do it.
39:01But do it exercise.
39:03Fitness is the first.
39:05The clothes you wearโ
39:07You have a model.
39:09It is.
39:11You can sit in suits.
39:13Please do it in 70 years.
39:15You don't have to demotivate your hands at least from home, because there is no culture
39:24with exercise.
39:26For female and elderly people, you must have strength training.
39:30Correct.
39:31So there are many taboos that you are talking about today.
39:35First, you don't have weights.
39:38Second, you don't have weights.
39:40Third, you don't have weights.
39:45And fourth, the most important thing is that if a doctor doesn't say anything,
39:49you must have supervision right now.
39:52So thank you, Roshni ji, Ajay, for sharing your story with us, for inspiring us.
39:58I'm going to go after this bulletin and go hit some weights as well.
40:02This is truly, truly inspiration.
40:05Thank you very, very much.
40:06And keep at it.
40:10What a story over there.
40:14If that doesn't inspire you, I don't know what will.
40:17But all right, let's leave you now with another story.
40:20It's a trend check that we've got for you here on Five Live.
40:23The visuals of Donald Trump's ongoing visit.
40:27In fact, let's bring you an update over there.
40:29The visuals of Donald Trump's ongoing visit to the United Kingdom,
40:33where he's been given a ceremonial guard of honour,
40:36along with the ruling monarch, Keith Charles, at the Windsor Castle.
40:40And this after having earlier proceeded to the castle in the ceremonial mantis as well.
40:46Enjoy these visuals.
40:48We'll see you again tomorrow.
40:49Bye-bye.
40:50Bye-bye.
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