'You can become self-radicalised: There's way too much political violence in the US'

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00:00Well, we just heard then from several officials in a press conference at Utah Valley University,

00:04where Charlie Kirk was killed about two days ago.

00:07We heard first from the Republican governor of Utah, Spencer Cox,

00:11who offered the most extensive details on the suspect.

00:15He confirmed that a family member of 22-year-old Utah resident Tyler Robinson

00:20turned him in after Robinson himself had confessed.

00:24As for a motive, the governor said that Robinson had become more political over the years

00:28and that he also told those close to him that Charlie Kirk was full of hate.

00:33We then heard from FBI Director Kash Patel and local sheriff Mike Smith.

00:37They mostly thanked government officials and the public before Cox gave concluding remarks

00:42about the state of violence, really, in the United States,

00:45essentially saying that every life matters,

00:47that this is about, of course, the political assassination of Charlie Kirk himself,

00:51but that it's bigger than that, that it's an attack on the American experiment.

00:56It must be said in really very thoughtful comments that were largely devoid

01:00of a lot of the divisive political rhetoric that we've heard in recent days.

01:05So for more on that conference, then, I'm joined now by our Washington correspondent,

01:09Fraser Jackson, former special FBI agent Jack Cloonan,

01:13and France 24's International Affairs Editor on set with me, Shirley Sitbon.

01:17Thank you all very much for joining us today.

01:20So, Fraser, we'll start with you.

01:21I mean, we heard from three people, including the governor of Utah, the director of the FBI.

01:27Again, quite remarkable to see that there wasn't much political rhetoric there.

01:33What do you think were the main takeaways from their remarks?

01:37Yeah, a lot more information there coming from the governor.

01:4122-year-old Tyler Robinson now confirmed, as the person believed to have carried out this assassination,

01:47they also believed that he acted alone.

01:50They say that a family member of the suspect contacted a family friend after the shooting,

01:56and that that friend, as that information was then passed along to law enforcement,

02:01that friend contacted the sheriff's office, telling officers that Robinson had confessed,

02:05or they suggested that he'd committed the killing,

02:07and that the roommate of Robinson was then located and interviewed,

02:12and on Discord showed them images of jokes and conversations with Robinson.

02:18The messages mentioning a rifle, needing to stash a rifle in bushes,

02:23picking up a rifle, wrapping the rifle in a towel,

02:26and also putting engravings on bullets.

02:28All things in line with what has been previously reported.

02:32And about those engravings on the bullets,

02:35which got a lot of attention online over the course of the last day or so,

02:38they confirmed that there were the reports of the engravings on the bullets,

02:42and they said that there were engravings on the unfired ammunition also in there.

02:46One of them said,

02:47Hey, fascist catch.

02:49Another that said,

02:50Bella Ciao.

02:51That probably referring to a song on the Netflix TV show,

02:55La Casa di Papel,

02:55which is,

02:56this song is effectively an Italian folk song,

03:00which has been used as an anthem for the anti-fascist resistance in Italy,

03:04and also elsewhere.

03:05Another one of the bullets reading,

03:07If You Read This You Are Gay,

03:09LMAO,

03:10an acronym, of course,

03:11for laughing my ass off.

03:12So,

03:13you can see the kind of childishness,

03:15really,

03:15with which this very deadly and serious event was almost kind of,

03:20was carried out with a bit of a window into the mind of Robinson there.

03:24Now,

03:25we also heard that there was video surveillance footage,

03:27which we hadn't heard about before,

03:29from the university,

03:30which showed Robinson arriving on the campus in a Dodge Challenger on Wednesday morning,

03:34about four hours before that attack took place.

03:37He was wearing maroon-coloured clothing,

03:39different to the clothing he was wearing when that shooting took place.

03:42And the law enforcement also said that he was apprehended wearing similar clothing

03:47when he was apprehended at around 10 p.m. on that evening.

03:51The interesting thing,

03:52though,

03:52really,

03:53was at the very end of that as well,

03:54Governor Cox,

03:55once again,

03:56trying to put forward a message of unity,

03:59to try to tone down the temperature at this very,

04:03very,

04:03you know,

04:05a charged moment.

04:06He got emotional at one point,

04:08saying that this was an attack on the American experiment,

04:10that this cuts to the very foundation of who we are,

04:13who we have been,

04:14and who we could be in the future.

04:16He said that over the last 48 hours,

04:17he's been as angry as he'd ever been.

04:19And it was Charlie Kirk's words in that moment that pulled him back from the brink.

04:24He quoted Charlie Kirk as saying,

04:26when people stop talking,

04:28that's when you get violence.

04:29The weak can never forgive.

04:31Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.

04:33Now,

04:34he basically ended that speech with a plea to the youth,

04:38the people who listen to Charlie Kirk the most.

04:40He says,

04:41your generation have an opportunity to build something that we're more than what we're building right now.

04:47At some point,

04:47we have to find an off-ramp.

04:48Otherwise,

04:49it's going to get much,

04:50much worse.

04:51Fraser Jackson,

04:52stay with us if you can.

04:53We're going to turn to you,

04:55Jack Cloonan,

04:56former FBI special agent,

04:58currently the head of specialty risk at the crisis management assistant company,

05:02Red 24.

05:03Thank you very much for joining us today,

05:06sir.

05:06As someone who worked for the FBI,

05:10I mean,

05:10what do you make of the timeline of this investigation,

05:13and of the remarks that we just heard from those officials there?

05:16Well,

05:19just looking at this from a purely investigative standpoint,

05:22I think that we've been through investigations like this previously.

05:27I think what you heard today was pretty much straight protocol.

05:31We use technology to our advantage.

05:35I think they were,

05:37Director Patel alluded to the fact that there were 11,000 leads.

05:42Now,

05:42you can get overwhelmed by technology.

05:45I think the most important thing,

05:46the most critical thing that happened in the last 48 hours was the release of the photograph.

05:52Once that photograph went out,

05:55I think it was only a matter of time before the suspect would have been identified.

05:59Set aside all the other leads that are going to come in.

06:02And this was the most critical thing.

06:05So,

06:05again,

06:06I don't think this is particularly unusual.

06:10The fact that the videos were exploited,

06:14it's commonplace today.

06:16And I just want to emphasize how important the public is.

06:21Once that photograph went out,

06:22as I said a moment ago,

06:24it was only a matter of time before somebody would have come forward,

06:27whether it's been the roommate,

06:28in this case,

06:30the parents.

06:30Now,

06:30you can imagine how the parents must have felt having to make the decision to turn this young man,

06:39their son,

06:40over to the authorities,

06:42knowing full well that in the state of Utah,

06:46he's going to face the death penalty.

06:49So,

06:50that is a very,

06:51obviously a very difficult decision.

06:53But,

06:53I'm glad that the manhunt is over.

06:57As long as the suspect was at large,

06:59there's always a risk to the public.

07:02When you get to the 48-hour timeline,

07:06and an investigation and a murder inquiry like this is critical.

07:11It's obvious that this young man hunkered on down,

07:15made it from Orem,

07:16to Washington,

07:18to the city of Washington.

07:19I'm not quite sure how long that distance is.

07:22But once the subject is mobile,

07:24that is critical for them,

07:26because they need a support network.

07:28So,

07:28it's clear to me that he went home,

07:31or went to his roommate,

07:32and hunkered on down.

07:34The information that was disclosed on Discord

07:37is obviously critical to the prosecution.

07:39We've got all kinds of evidence,

07:42whether it's from the gun,

07:44fingerprints on the gun,

07:46hair fibers on the gun,

07:48footprint.

07:48All of those things will coalesce into the investigation.

07:51I suspect that what will happen going forward now is that this young man would likely plead guilty.

07:59Now,

07:59he'll get represented by counsel if he has the wherewithal to do it.

08:03If he doesn't,

08:04then he'll have a public defender,

08:06and the public defender will try to negotiate a deal with the state of Utah.

08:10So,

08:11I think for all intents and purposes,

08:14the investigation going forward will center on the fact as to whether or not he,

08:18one,

08:18acted alone,

08:19whether he received any assistance whatsoever.

08:22And then I think the legal process will take hold.

08:25We did hear in the question and answer session,

08:28Jack,

08:28that at least for now,

08:29authorities do indeed believe that he acted alone.

08:33Now,

08:33to continue on this moving forward,

08:36I mean,

08:37it must be said that I think the remarks that we heard from the FBI,

08:40from those three officials were largely devoid of any kind of political suggestions.

08:46They were really aimed at uniting the public,

08:49being as factual and procedural as possible,

08:51as you said.

08:52But this is still a very public and politically charged case,

08:56independent of what we heard from the president,

08:58of what we heard from those officials.

09:00What do you think are some of the challenges that are going to come with that?

09:04Well,

09:05there's no question that in today's environment in the States,

09:08the discourse in politics is very,

09:12very difficult to describe.

09:14It's really,

09:15really difficult.

09:16Now,

09:16I'm certain that the,

09:17that the governor,

09:20the director Patel,

09:21and the sheriff were really concentrating on trying to tamp down the possibility of revenge.

09:28It's evident that Charlie Kirk had a huge following and his following has been very important on college campuses.

09:38And we always worry about copycat incidents and we always worry about retaliation.

09:46There's a lot of vitriol in the States right now.

09:50And I think as a governor,

09:52as a director Patel and as law enforcement,

09:55they're the ones who have to respond to incidents like this.

09:58They don't want it to happen.

10:00Now,

10:00how do we eliminate that with our ubiquitous use of cell phones,

10:05ubiquitous use of social networking?

10:08People vent their spleen all the time and you can be self-radicalized.

10:14Look at this young man.

10:15We always consider radicalization as something to do with the Middle East,

10:19something to do with Islam and so on.

10:21This is a man allegedly who came,

10:23became more political.

10:24What does that mean?

10:26It means he was operating in an echo chamber where everything that he heard made him take this particular step.

10:33How do you go from somebody who's interested in politics to somebody who wants to take somebody's life?

10:40That is a huge leap.

10:42He was probably inculcated on this,

10:44listened to things for a long period of time that stoked his anger.

10:49To go to a setting like this,

10:52to take a bolt action rifle with a scope,

10:56to fire at 200 yards under conditions such as they were,

11:01just think about that for a moment.

11:03Think about the level of commitment.

11:05Think about the depravity.

11:07Law enforcement, as I said a moment ago, has to respond to these things.

11:10So how do we prevent them?

11:13And I think that's what the governor was trying to get at.

11:17There's way too much political violence in this country.

11:20There's way too much hatred that directed at opposite politicians and political views.

11:27This young man etched something on bullets,

11:31as I think as your reporter indicated,

11:34and gave an explanation as to what that was.

11:37What does that say about a 22-year-old?

11:40How did he get that hatred?

11:41Those are the unknowns.

11:45Those are the things that we can't prevent.

11:47But we have to try to be better at it.

11:49And I think that's what the governor was getting at.

11:52Jack, thank you so much for your remarks.

11:54I do want to give some space to our international affairs editor, Shirley Sitbon,

11:58to conclude with just under a minute left.

12:00Shirley, what do you think are some of the major takeaways then from that conference?

12:03Well, that's exactly what we've heard throughout this debrief.

12:08The fact that there is such an extreme opposition in America,

12:14such a violent rhetoric that sometimes when people live this way

12:18and are basically in their bubble,

12:20this basically bursts sometimes and rarely but gets to this extreme situation.

12:27And that happens across the world, in Europe as well.

12:30But we don't have as many weapons.

12:31We don't have as many ways and means to get to this extreme political violence.

12:37And that's something that's such a problem in America,

12:39a huge tragedy, which everyone will try to tackle now,

12:43to change the course of history.

12:45Shirley Sitbon, thank you very much.

12:46Thank you very much as well to Fraser Jackson, our Washington correspondent,

12:51former special FBI agent Jack Cloonan as well.

12:57That wraps this edition.

12:58Stay with us.

12:58I'll be back shortly with a fresh look at the Daystaff stories.

13:09Last of all, Gary

13:18We'll see you next time.

13:20Bye-bye.

13:21Bye-bye.

13:22Bye-bye.

13:23Bye-bye.

13:24Bye-bye.

13:24Bye.

13:25Bye-bye.

13:27Bye-bye.

13:28Bye-bye.

13:29Bye-bye.

13:30Bye-bye.

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