00:30So, the Coalition of the Willing have met in Paris again, and we know that their plans are quite far advanced in terms of the military situation in a post-conflict Ukraine.
00:39But key to that, of course, as we know, is U.S. security guarantees.
00:44And what do we know about that so far? How concrete can they be?
00:49That's a good question.
00:50And frankly speaking, when I was in Odessa last week, I discussed with my Ukrainian counterpart,
00:58and he explained to me and to my colleague coming from Luxembourg and the Netherlands,
01:04because it was a Benedict's mission, that U.S., and especially President Trump and Secretary Rubio,
01:14made strong commitments related to this not only guarantee, but really legally-based backstop.
01:26So, that's something which should be normally like an Article 5, let's say, way of thinking.
01:35Of course, until now, I didn't see any paper in order to identify whether or not it is enough strong
01:45in order to give to Ukraine, like, certain entities.
01:51But I think that it's important also that the U.S. play an important role.
01:57But, of course, Europe also have to take responsibility.
02:03From the Trump perspective, how reliable can these security guarantees, this backstop, be,
02:09when we know over the past few weeks, in particular, we've seen him change his mind over things like a ceasefire,
02:15and, look, at the end of the day, it's not Article 5, because Ukraine is not in NATO.
02:20Yeah, it's really the core aspect of the current negotiation.
02:27We need to draw the framework of potential U.S. intervention, where, how, when,
02:38and it's true that when we discuss with Washington, there are several times a change of way of thinking, let's say.
02:49So, it will be really important to have strong commitments on paper in order to be sure that what U.S. have mentioned
02:58will be correctly executed in the advantage of Ukraine, of course.
03:05From a Belgian perspective, in the last few weeks, we've seen the European Commission really pushing for an updated scheme
03:13to take the €200 billion of frozen assets that Russia has in Europe mainly, in particular in Belgium.
03:20And it's really sort of, the momentum has grown since the recent attack in Kyiv,
03:25particularly against the European Union's offices and so on.
03:28Is the Belgian position for moving on this?
03:30Frankly speaking, and I clearly mentioned it once again in Copenhagen last week,
03:38confiscating those Russian sovereign assets is really not an option for Belgium.
03:47And maybe changing also the strategic investment of the current assets frozen in Brussels
03:55is also not an option for Belgium, because when we analysed the two options,
04:04we have many experts underlying the high risk, both legal and financial risk,
04:17it can generate if we decide to confiscate.
04:20Of course, it will be a very bad signal to other countries worldwide.
04:28Some of them also have assets, sovereign assets, in Brussels or in other places in Europe.
04:38And so, we consider that confiscating those immobilized assets should trigger the financial places,
04:51should generate some disturbance and erode also the confidence, the trust in the euro.
05:01So, it's really something that should create huge bad impact, systemic consequences
05:12for the credibility of the European financial places, according also to the European Central Bank.
05:20So, it's why I express the fact that Belgium will not take this risk and certainly not alone.
05:30Belgium has announced, you have announced as Minister of Foreign Affairs in Belgium,
05:34that Belgium will eventually recognise Palestine.
05:37First of all, the reaction to that from the Israelis for other governments since October 7th
05:43is that you're rewarding terrorism, because the offshoot of October 7th
05:47is that several countries have decided to recognise Palestine.
05:51What's your response to that criticism by the Israeli government?
05:53First, the context on the ground is really inhuman, especially in Gaza,
06:03when children, women, all the people and many citizens are starving.
06:10It's completely unacceptable.
06:11And I remind to the Israeli government that cutting off any humanitarian head is a war crime.
06:21And so, seeing the fact that the Israeli government intend to launch new processes,
06:31not only for the total military occupation of Gaza,
06:34but also for the expansion of new illegal settlements,
06:39especially in West Bank,
06:43we would like to send to the Israeli government, of course,
06:49but also the whole diplomatic world a strong political sign.
06:53But, at the same time, we will consider that the moment for Belgium
07:01to officially recognise the state of Palestine will come later,
07:07when two conditions will be met,
07:12in order to avoid precisely,
07:16to give the impression that we would like to reward Hamas.
07:21And so, that's the release of all the hostages,
07:25and also the fact that Hamas is out of any governance of Palestine.
07:31That's two conditions for a formal and legal recognition
07:36of the state of Palestine for Belgium.
07:39So, let's look at what we heard from Kayakalas, the EU's foreign policy chief.
07:43She said that the US's unshakable support for Israel
07:47means that Europe is a little inhibited in what it can do.
07:52But, in particular, when there has been some proposals,
07:55such as the most recent one from the European Commission,
07:58to partially suspend Israeli access to Horizon,
08:01the main obstacle is Germany.
08:03Germany has refused all along to any sort of progress
08:07in sanctioning Israel for what the EU even regards
08:11as breaches of international law.
08:13Of course, I respect the sovereignty of the whole government
08:17to take a decision,
08:18and I understand why Germany doesn't want to take sanctions against Israel
08:27for historical reasons, we know that.
08:29But, I've also seen that Germany has decided to, for instance,
08:39take strong commitments regarding the export of weapons to Israel.
08:48So, the lines are moving,
08:52and maybe we will be able to achieve extra results.
08:58I think it is important also for the credibility
09:02of the European foreign policy.
09:05Frankly speaking,
09:07this credibility of the current foreign policy is collapsing,
09:13and it is not the fault of Kayakalas, let me be clear.
09:18I really underline a strong involvement
09:22for leading the foreign and security policy of Europe.
09:27But, for many of our citizens,
09:31it's quite difficult to understand why,
09:33especially regarding the situation in Gaza.
09:37It is impossible for the EU to take strong decisions.
09:42It's, yes, they don't understand why we are not capable
09:49to take specific sanctions seeing the different images
09:54we are looking when we open the television.
10:00One of the other things you're going to do
10:01is stop importing goods from settlement,
10:03illegal settlements in the West Bank.
10:05Slovenia has done this,
10:06Ireland is doing something similar,
10:08Norway has done something similar
10:10in relation to boycotting settlements.
10:13But the backlash has been quite severe
10:15from the United States and Israel.
10:18Those countries have been threatened with sanctions,
10:20for example.
10:21Of course, we have concerns,
10:23but, frankly speaking,
10:25it's quite difficult to refuse to act
10:27according to our legal obligation
10:31when we face the current situation in Gaza
10:36only because of some fears
10:39related to economic aspects.
10:41Of course, we have the impression
10:47that the decision-take is just,
10:51it's a courageous one,
10:53but also a needed one.
10:55And I hope that the U.S. will not take,
11:00let's say,
11:02kind of sanction against the countries
11:06who decided to act like this
11:10in order to respect the international law,
11:14the humanitarian law,
11:16and trying to push pressure on Israel,
11:20not on the people of Israel, of course,
11:22because we also have, at Belgian level,
11:26taken some strong commitments
11:28in order to fight against any anti-Semitism,
11:32for instance.
11:34But it's really one of the measures
11:37taken in order to fight
11:39against the current far-right extremist government
11:44and the way this government
11:46is acting against the Palestinians.
11:49Okay, Maxime Prevost,
11:50Minister for Foreign Affairs of Belgium,
11:52thank you very much for joining us
11:54on the Europe Conversation.
11:55Thank you.
11:56Thank you.
11:56Thank you.
11:56Thank you.
11:56Thank you.
11:57Thank you.
11:57Thank you.
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