- 6 weeks ago
On Thursday's edition of Zolak and Bertrand, the guys reacted to Patriots second round pick TreVeyon Henderson once again having a stellar day in joint practices with the Minnesota Vikings. This led to the guys questioning whether or not the team has already proved that they nailed the 2025 NFL Draft.
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00:00Okay, six sacks.
00:01So let's break that down first.
00:03What kind of sacks were they?
00:04Kill shots?
00:06Was it just get to him, touch him, and you call him down?
00:10Does he have the ability to run out of any of these?
00:14I talked to somebody who said he looked good,
00:16but there were issues up front a little bit.
00:18Didn't we expect that going in?
00:20Yes, 100%.
00:20Isn't that what Phil Perry said?
00:22Phil Perry said there was a real potential here that they could be overwhelmed
00:24in terms of what they saw against Minnesota.
00:27And then you heard Garrett Bradbury talking about how this is going to be
00:30the most complicated thing they saw all year when it comes to what Flores
00:33was throwing at them defensively.
00:35We didn't see him last week.
00:36So that's a new week for him.
00:39Morgan Moses, is he going to play in this game this week?
00:42Like you're shuffling in like two or three new guys.
00:45Continuity can be an issue this early.
00:47It really can.
00:49Your first game is in a couple weeks.
00:51So after, and I said this yesterday, after this game,
00:54you're going to shut it down.
00:56You're going to keep it tight.
00:57Fans aren't going to be able to see it.
00:59Writers aren't going to be know what they're doing.
01:01Josh is going to have some sort of game plan as to what protections he's going
01:04to use to start this season.
01:05And I don't want to say protections that he uses because he has multiple.
01:09I don't think they're going to load the kitchen sink.
01:11I think you got to get up and run it first, see who you can trust,
01:15real game situations, and then take it from there.
01:19But I talked to somebody, as I said,
01:22that said Drake looked really good yesterday.
01:24Yeah.
01:25It's the sacks aren't his fault.
01:28Or they can be.
01:29I don't know.
01:30See, I don't know what the call is.
01:31I don't know what the protection is.
01:32He can blow the play.
01:33He can.
01:34Hard for me to believe that he's going to stand or hold on the ball like we see
01:38Caleb Williams do.
01:39No, I don't think that's going to happen.
01:41No.
01:41I don't think that's going to happen.
01:43So, Phil Perry also had the Vikings with six sacks overall in that joint practice.
01:48That's solid.
01:49He also said, though, that four of those came in the first ten snaps.
01:52And then after that, things kind of got cleaned up.
01:54Okay.
01:54And so, I point to that, and I do look at potentially a learning experience here,
01:58first of all, and communication issues up front early on.
02:01Like you said, Bradbury back in the fold.
02:02You also have the two young guys on the left side.
02:04But I think the ability to grow from what you saw even at the beginning of practice
02:09to the end of practice and finish on a strong note there with the offensive line
02:13is a step forward in the right direction there.
02:15I just, there is way more talent on this offensive line than what we saw last year.
02:19It's going to be improved, what that ceiling ultimately is.
02:22I think we're going to have to find out.
02:23But when you look at sort of what the expectations were even coming into this Vikings,
02:27like you said, Phil Perry is saying that they could be overwhelmed
02:29in terms of what they saw with the Vikings.
02:30The fact it was up and down, though, and that they finished strong, to me, again,
02:35is a step in the right direction for this program as a whole with Mike Rabel.
02:38It's wild to me where we are right now with the Patriots
02:41versus where we were at this point last year.
02:44It is.
02:45I said that yesterday with Drake, too.
02:46I think from calling just, what, nine, ten of his games,
02:51it seems to me like he gets better as the game goes on.
02:54Because you get out there, you're raw, you're still young,
02:57you haven't played a ton of football, everything's new to you,
03:00and I think he's good at, and I said it yesterday, keeping the even kill.
03:04He's staying the same, whether it's good or really bad.
03:07And you have to do that as a quarterback.
03:08You can't look rattled.
03:09You can't do what Caleb Williams does.
03:12And go look at the videos, folks.
03:13He's screaming out there, slamming the ball, spiking it, complaining.
03:18Like, you can't be a spoiled brat like that.
03:20You have to get out there and you have to lead,
03:22and it's up to Rabel to get him going.
03:26See, this is so hard to talk about because, like, we're not there.
03:28At least, like, when they're playing at home.
03:30Yeah, you can evaluate it and see it.
03:32Yeah, I saw that one period.
03:33Yeah, they struggled there, but at least they got going at the end.
03:35So it's hard for me to sit here and say, why did the sacks happen?
03:38Here's my other question for you, too.
03:39So, Phil Perry also talking about, and I heard Bedard talking about this as well,
03:44where Mike Rabel, again, spending the majority of his time with the offense.
03:47Good.
03:48And Drake May.
03:49Are you surprised by that, with the defensive background that Rabel has?
03:51Like, what do you make of that, the fact that he's spending so much time
03:53with the offense right now?
03:54I like it because he's getting it up and going.
03:56I think he's worried about, not worried about the quarterback,
03:58but it's his job to get the quarterback ready for week one.
04:01Josh is coaching him.
04:02Josh is going to give him the plays that is really, you know, sort of fit for him.
04:07But, you know, when we go for it, this is what's going to happen, Drake.
04:10Drake, go down there, celebrate with your team.
04:12Listen to all the audio clips that they have,
04:14and they put it out there on social media.
04:16Rabel gets on May.
04:17Yeah, big time.
04:18And that's a good thing.
04:18I think that's the biggest reason.
04:20I think it's your quarterback.
04:21He knows he's got a 22-year-old quarterback,
04:24and their success hinges on the head coach, the offensive coordinator,
04:28and the quarterback.
04:29And you could sprinkle everything else in.
04:31And it's 2, 3, 4, 5, 6.
04:33Those are your first – that's your first issue.
04:35By the way, he's not wrong.
04:36His success does hinge on Drake May
04:38and what he ultimately turns into as quarterback,
04:40and I think that's why it's exciting to see a head coach do that.
04:43Say what you will.
04:45Gerard Mayo's success also hinged in large part
04:47on whether or not Drake May was going to be successful.
04:50They didn't put him in a position to be successful, certainly last year.
04:53But to say, yeah, you know what, I don't really do that side of the ball,
04:55head coach offense, and sort of watch that flounder
04:58the way that they did last year
04:59versus what you're seeing this year,
05:00a head coach taking accountability for even the side of the ball
05:03that isn't his specialty,
05:04I think goes a long, long way in terms, again,
05:07just the program overall.
05:08And like you said, too,
05:10it's not just being involved in the offense,
05:12but it's also the coaching up of Drake May
05:14in terms of what he wants that guy to be,
05:16which is a leader,
05:17which is ultimately a captain on this team moving forward,
05:20which again goes to how successful this team is going to be, right?
05:23It's going to be carried by Drake May.
05:25That's as far as you are going to go in this organization.
05:27Remember Mayo last year, he was at a press conference,
05:29I think he was asked about the offense,
05:31he goes, you got to go talk to Alex,
05:32he's the head coach of the offense.
05:32Head coach offense.
05:34This is the complete opposite.
05:36Can't do that.
05:36You have to take accountability.
05:37I'm sorry, you do.
05:38And we've seen other coaches have success with,
05:40you know, Sean McVay giving the defense originally
05:43to Wade Phillips back in the day.
05:44I understand all that,
05:45but it's a lot different, I think,
05:47if you're a defensive coach
05:48because you rely so heavily on your quarterback
05:51and you need that guy to be a leader in your organization.
05:53But here's your problem, too.
05:55I think if it was year one for Vrabel,
05:56he would be defensive heavy
05:57because he's a former defensive player.
05:59Yep.
06:00Really good former defensive player.
06:02Nasty, tough, all that stuff.
06:04And to defend Mayo here,
06:06he didn't know what to do.
06:07No.
06:08No.
06:08So his natural reaction is,
06:10okay, Bill never said a thing.
06:12Right.
06:12I'm going to play to my...
06:13I'm going to be good with the press.
06:14I'm going to tell you everything.
06:15Yep.
06:15We're going to break silos down,
06:16all that stuff.
06:17Get the walls down
06:18and we're going to all be together,
06:18have some fun, get good vibes.
06:20Yeah.
06:20No.
06:21You're 100% right.
06:22I just think it's really hard.
06:23I think as a head coach
06:24with an offensive background,
06:27you can turn over the defense
06:29to someone else.
06:30I don't think as a defensive head coach
06:32you can necessarily do that
06:34with the offense
06:34and not be involved
06:35with the quarterback.
06:36If you're a quarterback,
06:37you have to make sure
06:38that that guy represents
06:39your organization
06:40and is a leader
06:41and is a pillar
06:41for what you're trying
06:42to build long-term.
06:43And I think that's what
06:43Mike Vrabel's doing right now.
06:44And I think, again,
06:45the fact that they went to Minnesota
06:47against one of the best teams
06:48in the NFC last year
06:49and were competitive
06:50and there were up and downs
06:51in that practice, certainly,
06:53but, again,
06:54you're heading in the right direction.
06:55It doesn't feel like
06:56there was a huge lull
06:57in terms of coming off
06:58what was a successful week
06:59against Washington.
07:00You came ready to go
07:01yesterday against Minnesota
07:02and that's a huge step forward.
07:04I'm sorry.
07:04It is.
07:04It is.
07:05What's the biggest issue
07:06with the football team
07:07as you head into this year?
07:08What are you worried
07:09about the most?
07:10The offense.
07:11The offensive line.
07:12I would go offensive line.
07:13Yeah.
07:13So I don't think this is
07:14an indictment on, like,
07:15Josh McDaniels,
07:16like, oh, I've got to go
07:16babysit Josh.
07:17No.
07:18I'm the head coach
07:19of the football team.
07:19I want to know
07:20who the hell these five guys are
07:21and how they're going to block.
07:22What's the run call?
07:23So he's got to hear the run call.
07:24He knows the scheme.
07:26He's got to hear
07:26the pass protection
07:27and then he can sit there
07:28and look at it
07:29and watch practice that way
07:30and sort of evaluate it
07:31so he'll be ready to go
07:32when the team meeting starts.
07:33That's part of it.
07:34Yeah.
07:34No, for sure.
07:34Look, there's going to be
07:35rookies on the offensive line
07:36that they're certainly
07:37going to have to rely on.
07:38We'll get into that coming up.
07:38We'll also get into
07:39one running back
07:40that is peaking early here,
07:43Zoe, in his career.
07:44You mentioned the two-minute
07:4470-yard touchdown.
07:46Stud.
07:47The talent's undeniable, right?
07:48So, I mean,
07:49I think if you have him
07:50in your system
07:51and you're around him
07:51on a daily basis,
07:52you can see that.
07:53And I think that next part
07:54is being a leader
07:55and being that, again,
07:56that pillar of the franchise.
07:58I think that's why
07:58he's working so hard on it.
07:59So I give him
08:00all the credit for it.
08:01One nice element
08:02to this offense
08:03that's emerged here
08:04over the last two weeks,
08:05it feels like,
08:06especially Trevion Henderson.
08:07Huge play yesterday
08:08for a 70-yard touchdown.
08:10Drake made a Henderson.
08:11How involved is he going
08:12to be in this offense?
08:12Because it feels like
08:13it went from maybe being
08:14that third down back
08:16to now all of a sudden
08:16something a little more.
08:18So with Ramondre out,
08:18you've got to compensate.
08:19And I think he's going
08:20to get more carries, right?
08:21He may be the first guy
08:23in the huddle
08:23on Saturday afternoon.
08:25So I'm sitting there
08:26in the postgame last week.
08:27I'm doing fifth quarter.
08:28And he goes to the podium
08:29and I hear him talk.
08:30It was like an eight-year vet.
08:32I'm like, holy crap.
08:33So my opinion,
08:34not only of the game
08:35when you watch him play,
08:36like when the lights are on,
08:38but just, yeah,
08:39I bust my tail.
08:41I'm here to make plays.
08:42All that stuff.
08:43Nothing like pounding
08:44the chest or anything,
08:45but just down to the ground,
08:48very low key.
08:50And he can end up
08:52being a leader
08:52of that running back group
08:54with Ramondre.
08:56Because if he's nicked up
08:57with Gibson,
08:58Gibson's not a big vocal guy.
08:59Yeah.
09:00Gibson was arguably
09:01your best back last year,
09:02I thought,
09:03in terms of what he did.
09:04Just from a physical standpoint,
09:05what he's capable of, yeah.
09:06See, those things
09:07work itself out.
09:08So like the really,
09:09really good best players,
09:10they end up being
09:10the leaders of their group.
09:11And I think his skill set
09:13is off the charts.
09:14So obviously.
09:15Speed, though,
09:16impressed you
09:16in that first preseason game
09:18with Henderson?
09:19So they had a two-minute offense
09:20on the second play.
09:21He went for 70?
09:23Yeah.
09:24All right.
09:25Do it again Saturday.
09:26Make some big plays
09:27on Saturday.
09:28He has a good day
09:29on Saturday.
09:32He might be in the huddle
09:33week one
09:34against the Raiders.
09:36First snap.
09:37That would be something.
09:38I heard Chad Graff
09:39on with the morning show
09:41when I was driving in.
09:42He said that he talked
09:42to a Minnesota official
09:44walking off the field.
09:47And he said,
09:47Henderson is different.
09:49Special.
09:50Special.
09:51So, look.
09:52You can say,
09:53oh, running back,
09:53running back, running back.
09:54This is a team
09:55that desperately needs
09:56dynamic players
09:57in that offense.
09:58This offense has not
09:58had big plays
09:59for, it feels like,
10:00years now.
10:01So, to have someone
10:02that's actually capable
10:03of that,
10:04capable of turning
10:05a wheel route
10:06into a 70-yard touchdown
10:07like he did yesterday,
10:08that's a game-changer
10:10for this offense.
10:10I'm sorry.
10:11It is.
10:11Look at Buffalo.
10:12What'd they pay
10:12their running back
10:13yesterday, Cook?
10:13James Cook got paid.
10:14Four for 48?
10:16Yeah.
10:16I think a 46?
10:19That's a big contract.
10:20Ramondre's getting paid, too.
10:22But, like, boy,
10:22these running backs
10:23are starting to make
10:23some bank.
10:25So, I was thinking,
10:26okay, Terry McLaurin,
10:27that's the perfect spot
10:28to trade him to,
10:29Buffalo,
10:30because I think
10:30Allen needs another receiver.
10:34But if Cook can be
10:35that sort of game-breaker
10:36in Belkow,
10:38I like him.
10:38Bob and I like him a lot.
10:39But he was good
10:42against us.
10:43I don't watch him
10:44every week,
10:45but, man,
10:45that's a lot of money
10:46for a running back.
10:46It is.
10:47It is.
10:47So you got the rookie
10:48running back
10:49that you're excited about,
10:49obviously the left side
10:50of the offensive line,
10:51also rookies as well.
10:53Now, this is going to be
10:53something that doesn't happen
10:54in the NFL very often.
10:55I mentioned it earlier
10:57in the week that Mike Reese
10:58had this in his Sunday notes column,
10:59but since 2016,
11:02there has not been
11:04two rookies to start
11:05on the left side
11:06of an offensive line
11:07for an NFL organization.
11:09The Ravens in 2016
11:10were the last team to do it.
11:11They had Alex Lewis
11:12at left guard,
11:12Ronnie Stanley at left tackle.
11:14Joe Flacco was sacked
11:1533 times in 16 games
11:17in that season.
11:18Baltimore finished
11:19with an 8-8 record.
11:21Now, we have seen instances
11:22where there have been
11:24multiple rookies
11:25on an offensive line before.
11:26The Steelers had it last year,
11:2714 starts for Mason McCormick.
11:30Zach Frazier had 15 starts.
11:32They went 10-7 that season
11:34and the Cowboys
11:35going back to 2011
11:35also had a couple rookies
11:37on their offensive line
11:39and they finished 8-8.
11:40So, look, there's going to be
11:41bumps and bruises
11:43for this offense
11:44because of that,
11:45but I also think
11:45that you've seen
11:46based on just the records
11:47of those teams,
11:48you can still be
11:49a functional team
11:50with that left side
11:51if they're coached up properly
11:52and if the young guys
11:54actually wind up being players.
11:55I mean, if Ronnie Stanley winds up,
11:57if Will Campbell winds up
11:58being Ronnie Stanley,
11:59then you're in great shape here.
12:01That's a guy that you were
12:01ready to throw
12:02a ton of money at
12:04before he re-signed
12:04in this offseason
12:05with Baltimore.
12:07I just hate dismissing it
12:08like, okay,
12:09you've got two rookies there,
12:09that's going to be bad.
12:11If they're better
12:11than the other guys,
12:12you play them.
12:13So, what are you supposed
12:14to play, a lesser player?
12:16Number four overall pick,
12:17you play the kid.
12:18Start him at tackle,
12:19whether or not
12:20he ever flips the guard,
12:21but I keep hearing this too,
12:23like in the building,
12:24they like the offensive line
12:25and how it's trending
12:25and they like him at tackle.
12:28Vrabel picked him.
12:30Like, this is Vrabel's pick.
12:32He went down there,
12:33worked him out,
12:34and I think he understands
12:36what he can and what he can't do,
12:38and I don't think
12:38he would have chosen him
12:39at four
12:39if he thought the arms
12:41were an issue
12:41or this kid didn't have strength.
12:44Mike's a defensive edge guy,
12:45so he knows what to look at
12:47in tackles.
12:47He knows which guys
12:48he can take advantage of,
12:49which ones are going to be
12:50tough to play against.
12:52So he likes Campbell.
12:53Let's get this kid going.
12:54Our guy Jordan Schultz
12:55tweeting this out
12:56a couple days ago.
12:56He said,
12:57Patriots rookie offensive tackle
12:58Will Campbell
12:59has taken virtually
12:59every rep at left tackle
13:01and the team loves
13:02what they've seen.
13:03Despite some questioning
13:04if he'll be a left tackle
13:05in the NFL,
13:06he's delivered exactly
13:07as expected.
13:08One team source
13:09raved about his football IQ
13:11and that it's,
13:13quote,
13:13through the roof.
13:14He processes so fast
13:15and already thinks like a vet.
13:17He has the type
13:17of football character
13:18you want to build
13:19your program around.
13:20So I think your top two picks,
13:21they speak like they're vets.
13:23They don't seem like rookies
13:24that are in over their head.
13:25They don't know what to say.
13:26They just,
13:26yes,
13:27no.
13:28He stands there
13:29and faces the questions
13:30and gives you answers.
13:32Give this kid a chance.
13:34You know,
13:35week one was tough on him,
13:36right?
13:36A lot of people saying,
13:37yeah,
13:37he's getting beat here,
13:38getting beat there.
13:39One-on-ones.
13:40He got abused.
13:41Keyon White.
13:42Keyon White.
13:42Put him on his ass twice.
13:44All right.
13:44I thought he played well
13:45last week.
13:46I really did.
13:47Thought he played well.
13:48Yeah,
13:48they mixed up that TE game.
13:50And I heard Bedard talk about that
13:52with,
13:52about Marone.
13:53He asked Marone,
13:54like,
13:54what was that?
13:54He goes,
13:55yeah,
13:55I think that was a TE game.
13:56So they've got to,
13:58they've got to alert him.
13:59And I think that's what
13:59Doug Marone was saying.
14:01I got to be better as a coach
14:02so that he anticipates
14:05what the,
14:05what the,
14:06what the call is going to be,
14:07what check you can go to.
14:09If that's third and seven,
14:11guess what?
14:11They're running something
14:12to get after us.
14:13They're not just going to line up
14:14over here and go straight in.
14:15They're going to try and twist it
14:16and play some sort of game over there
14:18to get to the backside of the quarterback.
14:19And they did and they made him fumble.
14:222022 NFL draft for the Patriots.
14:25First round,
14:25it was Cole Strange.
14:26Second round,
14:26it was Taequann Thurton.
14:28Marcus Jones,
14:29third round.
14:29Jack Jones,
14:30fourth.
14:30Pierre Strong,
14:31fourth.
14:32Bailey Zappi,
14:33fourth.
14:33Kevin Harris,
14:34fifth round.
14:34Sam Roberts,
14:35sixth.
14:36Andrew Stuber on the seventh round.
14:39I know it's early to evaluate
14:42this draft class right now,
14:43but based on the way
14:45that they have played so far
14:46and what we're hearing
14:47even about Travion Henderson,
14:48we're talking about this class
14:49already as potentially
14:50a foundational piece
14:52for Mike Vrabel's program
14:53moving forward
14:54and we've seen past draft classes.
14:56I don't think we've seen
14:56the hype that we already have
14:58with some of these players.
14:59So it's been up and down
15:00for these offensive linemen
15:01early on.
15:01I understand that.
15:02It's going to be.
15:03But the fact that they're
15:04playing themselves
15:04into starting roles
15:05and look,
15:06we've seen it even
15:06with Kyle Duggar at this point.
15:08I know that's not necessarily
15:09a player that was Mike Vrabel's
15:10coming in,
15:11but you have to earn that spot.
15:13You have to earn that spot.
15:14And I don't think
15:14if they were playing,
15:16if Wilson wasn't playing
15:18up to a starting caliber
15:20left guard,
15:21I don't think he's
15:21in that position right now.
15:22Think about this too.
15:24So you drafted a kicker.
15:25Yep.
15:26He's going to be your kicker.
15:26You draft,
15:27you blew up your whole operation.
15:29Yes.
15:29You drafted a long snapper
15:30and a short snapper.
15:31He's going to do both
15:33and he's going to be here
15:34playing.
15:35Eftem Chisholm
15:36didn't even get drafted.
15:38Right.
15:38Probably going to make
15:39the football team.
15:39Yep.
15:40And we know what you did
15:41in the top two picks.
15:42like Kyle Williams
15:44doesn't go anywhere.
15:44It looks like a good draft.
15:46Looks like one.
15:47All right.
15:51All right.
15:51All right.
Recommended
22:03
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