00:00Hi, everybody. I'm Brittany Lewis, a breaking news reporter here at Forbes. Joining me now
00:08is President and CEO of Oxfam America, Abby Maxman. Abby, thank you so much for joining me.
00:14Thanks for having me, Brittany.
00:17We have really seen international outrage ramp up over the humanitarian crisis that
00:21is currently unfolding in Gaza. And this comes as the war between Israel and Hamas has been
00:26playing out now for close to two years. The integrated food security phase classification
00:30said that the worst case scenario of famine is currently playing out in the Gaza Strip
00:35and quote, mounting evidence shows that widespread starvation, malnutrition and disease are driving
00:40a rise in hunger related deaths. So to start off the conversation, what is your reaction to what
00:45we're currently seeing in the Middle East? Well, Brittany, it is tragic. And it's a tragedy that
00:52does not to be need to be happening. Oxfam staff and our partners are witnessing scenes
00:57that defy belief. We see families wasting away from hunger, collapsing in the street,
01:05malnourished children too weak to cry, preventable diseases that are spiraling,
01:10and a medical system that's all but collapsed as Israel continues to bomb, force people who are so
01:16weak to move yet again with force displacement orders. And Israel has created a humanitarian
01:23catastrophe that is becoming more and more desperate and deadly with each passing day. We are seeing the
01:30signs of starvation taking hold. And for those of us who have sadly witnessed these tragic moments
01:36before, we know what we're seeing. It's a watershed moment. Dozens of deaths from malnutrition
01:43in 24-hour periods. We need to act now. And food is sitting on the borders of the Gaza Strip,
01:52unable to get in. In one case, it just heard from another partner organization that food had gone
01:59and passed its expiry date while people are going hungry inside the Gaza Strip.
02:05You're saying that this doesn't need to be happening and we need to act now. Specifically,
02:10what can Oxfam America do right now? Are your hands tied? What does that really look like?
02:16Well, we are not able to really do our jobs at the scale that we need to. We have not been since
02:22the ceasefire ended several months ago. And so we are doing what we can. Our staff and colleagues and
02:29partners who also are suffering from a lack of access to food and clean water. One of my colleagues
02:36shared with somebody that she feels guilty when she is able to have one meal a day, a small piece of
02:44something to give her nourishment while those around her do not have access to what they need,
02:48but still going out and doing what we can to provide water tankering, access to clean water,
02:56some small things that we're able to do. But it is nowhere near enough because the conditions are not
03:04enabling us to do it. And as Israel starves Palestinians in Gaza, any aid can help. But
03:12delivering it through other means that are dangerous and ineffective when there are over
03:19100 football fields worth of aid sitting outside of Gaza, ready to be delivered safely through land
03:26crossings right now, it's heartbreaking, it's heartless, it's harmful. And we really are at the
03:32point of no return, because the next days, and I'd say weeks, if we're lucky, we'll really determine
03:38if people in Gaza die or live, and if they will live with lifelong health implications from now
03:45nutrition. So organizations like ours are ready, are there, are able to scale up if the conditions are
03:54put in place that allow us to do our jobs in ways that we know work.
03:59President Trump has commented on this. And as we know, the United States and Israel are allies,
04:05but he did break with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. He said that the images out
04:10of Gaza show, quote, real starvation. And he also added this, you can't fake that. So we're going to
04:16be even more involved. A, what do you think of his commentary there? And B, what would you want to
04:21see the United States do right now? Because as you said, this is a watershed moment, and the next days
04:25and weeks really matter. Well, President Trump has come to an overdue but very important conclusion
04:33that Israel is simply unwilling to allow aid into Gaza in any meaningful way. Witnessing the images
04:40of children starving, of mothers too weak to nurse, is this watershed moment. So what we need to see
04:49is an urgent and sustained surge of aid right now. But the US and others must do more than spend more
04:57money on just food that's only get to four distribution points. They need to help find a
05:03solution that is significant. We need a flood the zone approach. There are experienced aid professionals,
05:10ourselves included, our teams with vast stocks of lifesaving aid who are poised and pleading to be
05:18allowed to spring back into action. We are there, we are ready, and our experts, humanitarian experts,
05:24teams of them, other organizations, partners, we have decades of experience in ensuring lifesaving aid
05:30safely reaches the people in Gaza who need it most. So we need and urge the US to partner with others
05:37to push to open the land crossings to allow in food, water, medicine, shelter, highly specialized materials
05:45and expertise that is now needed for the many in the last painful stages of malnutrition.
05:53So the US pledge of aid can't happen in a vacuum. We need safe access for humanitarian aid to reach
05:59communities. We need an immediate and permanent ceasefire. And the US has an extraordinarily unique
06:06position to use its leverage to get that. And the release of the hostages and illegally detained
06:12prisoners to have the best hope to avert the people of Gaza falling into an even greater catastrophe.
06:19To that point, I know there are international calls on Israel to allow more aid in because,
06:27I mean, the images that are coming out are just horrifying. You think there needs to be a louder
06:31call from the international community on Hamas to release these hostages too? Because then in that case,
06:37there can be a ceasefire because we're seeing what is playing out in Gaza and this humanitarian crisis
06:43continue to unfold.
06:45Well, we definitely need to see all the international community and the US putting all of their muscle
06:53and effort and expectations to secure this ceasefire. All parties must do their part to be at the
07:01negotiating table. But in the meantime, in the meantime, so these things happen have to happen
07:07to get that ceasefire to release the hostages. But and to enable the humanitarian community who are on the
07:16ground to do our jobs, we were begging to be able to do do them in ways that save lives and do no harm.
07:25And what we're seeing at distribution sites that are set up by Israel and supported by the US are,
07:31one might even say, from a dystopian nightmare. It's only the strongest are able to walk miles to
07:39these sites. They have to duck and sprint, avoiding bullets and be pushed into queues to receive
07:44what are not even meals. They're food that needs clean water and fuel to cook and the strongest get
07:50access to it. So we really need both things to happen. The US and the international community
07:57to make sure to demand a ceasefire and and the Israel to enable humanitarian access and this
08:06functional humanitarian system in Gaza to resume. We had 400 aid distribution sites before. Now there
08:14are four and they're becoming killing fields. And it's not how humanitarian aid works. We must be
08:21allowed to bring in our supplies, to use our expertise and trust with communities. And of course,
08:28the US needs to use its muscle and the international community to secure a ceasefire, to demand that all
08:35parties enable access. And we need an end to the siege and bombardment to make all that possible.
08:42Do you think there's anything missing really from this international conversation when it comes to
08:47humanitarian aid? Because by its very nature, humanitarian aid should not be political. It should
08:53not be partisan. It should not be any of that. Do you think something's missing here?
09:00You know, watching this can really make us all feel feel powerless, I'd say. But in the US, I would say
09:08we have more power than anybody realizes. I think what is missing at the moment with a special
09:16relationship between the US and Israel, that we can use our influence with this administration,
09:23that we have the power to stop this starvation of children that people are seeing on TV. We can move
09:31President Trump to action to take action of what he wants and cares about. And we can refuse to look
09:38away. And also, we know that there's two hands here. Congress can do much more. Recently, there was a
09:47vote on US arms to Israel, it passed, it approved more weapons. But it's disappointing, because that's
09:53fueling the atrocities, we need political solutions to fix and turn the tide in this terrible trajectory.
10:02And so selling arms on the one hand, while concurrently working for a peace deal, and also
10:08enabling humanitarian access, we must get aid in, we need the ceasefire, we know the US has power to
10:17influence that. And we need to encourage everybody to use our voice, make sure we're not looking away,
10:24tell friends and family what's happening, and influence the administration, because President
10:30Trump does respond to images. And this is a time where he can use his muscle to bring an end to this
10:38terrible tragedy.
10:39And just how strong is that US muscle, would you say? Because you said that we have a lot of
10:46a lot of power here. And let's say you could get in front of Congress, let's say you could even get
10:49in front of President Trump today. What would you tell them to do? What would be the ideal solution?
10:56Because as you said, watershed moment, what happens in the next few days is critical.
11:00Well, I would say, require, demand the relationship, the special relationship of the United States
11:09with Israel, demand the ceasefire, demand it now, stop transferring arms, well, and require a ceasefire
11:20now. Obviously, release of the hostages and the detained prisoners.
11:28And enable us and humanitarian workers to do our jobs. I think it is
11:36in the power and the gift of President Trump's administration to ensure that a deal happens.
11:45He's a deal maker. Make it happen. Bring a ceasefire to bear so that there are pathways to peace,
11:53a surge, an urgent surge of humanitarian aid into the Gaza Strip, and allow us to do our jobs. This
12:04has been going on for far too long. It is a tragedy unfolding before our eyes. As I watch my colleagues
12:12waste away in front of our eyes. It is harrowing. It's horrible. It's unconscionable. There's horrors that
12:19have happened since October 7. They continue to happen. And we need to make sure that this comes
12:25to an end. And the U.S. uses all its influence, all its power to stop it. And it can.
12:32And like I said at the top of this conversation, the IPC labeled this the worst-case scenario of
12:39famine that's happening right now in Gaza. I mean, what are the long-term implications of that?
12:45Oh, the long-term implications are terrible. It can have huge impact on, well, certainly,
12:54children's development, human development. What happens now matters so much, obviously,
13:01in saving lives, in life or death, but also in what happens afterwards. We know that the impacts of
13:09severe acute malnutrition have lifelong adverse impact on people's development. We see mothers,
13:18nursing mothers, pregnant mothers wasting away. And not to mention the trauma that 2 million people
13:28living in the Gaza Strip, who have been living under constant bombardment, on the move, forced
13:34displacement, very little access to food, clean water, healthcare system in collapse. The trauma
13:43is also enormous. Everything is needed for the dignity and security for all Palestinians and Israelis
13:52to have a new future. And we know that the current, the present situation is not that. It's not good for
13:59anybody and for the peace, the prosperity for Israelis and Palestinians to live together to recover from
14:06this terrible tragedy. But the impact on physical and human health are enormous, and it has to stop.
14:13Well, there's certainly a lot to look out for in this situation as we see developments. And I hope you
14:19can come back on and break them down with me. Abby Maxman, I always appreciate our conversations.
14:24Thank you so much for providing your insight today. Thank you so much, Brittany. I appreciate it.
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