- 1 year ago
- #mlb
#MLB reinstates Pete Rose and 'Shoeless' Joe Jackson. Wiggy: "MLB should be ashamed of themselves"
Should Rose and/or Jackson be in Hall of Fame?
Should Rose and/or Jackson be in Hall of Fame?
Category
🥇
SportsTranscript
00:00Nothing gets the old heads fired up like Pete Rose.
00:02Yeah, we can get to those calls.
00:04It's such a great conversation.
00:06We're at least fired up about it.
00:07Yeah, I mean, I, you know, I just, it's like, we have the conversation.
00:13Excuse me, I got a little bacon and I got stuck down there like that.
00:17Stuck in the little gullet there.
00:18Matter of fact, let me get a little water.
00:20You shine so right, though, when it comes to this.
00:22Like, the baseball writers are such hardos, they're not going to let them in anyway.
00:26So that's like, yeah, it's nice.
00:27They should be ashamed of themselves.
00:28Well, that's what it is, though.
00:30I don't think Pete has that ability.
00:31Well, you should.
00:32Should they be ashamed because they're writing about baseball or what?
00:35No, I mean, listen, you know, there are people out there who like baseball.
00:38Does Bradfoe have a vote?
00:40Yes, he does.
00:40Yes, he does.
00:41Oh.
00:42You know, but you should look in the mirror and go, okay, you should, like, stop with this,
00:45like, what's it, higher than mighty type of mentality.
00:51You're blocked.
00:52Holier than minister.
00:54Holier than minister.
00:55No, like, people do things that are effed up.
00:59They run a foul off the field.
01:01They run a foul on the field.
01:03But how good of a player was that guy on the field?
01:08And what he did as a player should that then not allow him to get in the Hall of Fame?
01:16Because, remember, he bet on baseball, at least, as we know, as a manager.
01:21So, if you want to keep Pete Rose, the manager, out of the Hall of Fame, all right, so be it.
01:26Kurt Spiracy from Brees Hill.
01:28I'm not aware of this, Curtis.
01:29But he was, sent me a text when we were talking about this, saying that shoeless Joe Jackson was not, there's a conspiracy that he was not a part of the fix because he hit 375 in that World Series and made no errors.
01:47And so, he was framed as the guy when it was the other guys.
01:51I didn't know that.
01:52I can't tell you I know a thing about the Black Sox.
01:56Great movie.
01:56You never watched that movie?
01:58What's it called?
01:58Eight Men Out?
01:59Yes.
02:00What was that?
02:01Why do I want to say Charlie Sheen was in it?
02:05Was he in it?
02:05He was.
02:06Yes, he was.
02:06And Michael Douglas.
02:08Yes.
02:09John Cusack.
02:10Yes.
02:11I love when I get a Doug laugh.
02:13It makes my day.
02:13And I apologize to Rob Bradford because he actually has a pinned tweet on his page that says, voting for the baseball hall should never be boring.
02:21Always an honor.
02:22Yeah.
02:23But I just, I don't like, I always look at sports because we have this conversation, like, when you're talking about players that you know are Hall of Famers and there's situations that you go, all right, obviously in the Pete Rose case, now that, you know, they're saying, all right, they lift the bench.
02:39And then with the audio of him actually talking about it, it's kind of like heartbreaking when you hear a guy like that who's, you know, I don't know how old he was when he passed away, but in his 80s.
02:49And he's, you know, like his one dying wish before he dies is to get into the Hall of Fame for something that, hands down, he deserves to be in.
03:00And then you got all these morons that never even played a Little League or maybe played Little League and sat on the bench or like, well, Pete Rose can't get in the Hall of Fame.
03:12But actually his dying wish was that he hit on the seven-leg parlay that he had on FanDuel that day.
03:19It's pretty simple, Wiggy.
03:20It's not whether you played big leagues or Little League.
03:22It's that if you can question the veracity of the outcome of an event, if a participant in the game is not on the level, then everything falls apart.
03:30Yeah, but so, okay, if we're going down this road, he bet on baseball when he was a manager.
03:37So why isn't the Pete Rose the player in the Hall of Fame?
03:41That's a good point, Wig.
03:42Because the rule is very simple.
03:44You are banned for life if you bet on baseball.
03:47It's on every clubhouse wall.
03:49It's in every contract you sign.
03:51It is as clear and black and white as it could possibly be.
03:55And also, Wiggy, the assumption has always been that he bet as a player as well.
03:59But you can't assume that.
04:01Of course you can't.
04:02He's lied about everything else.
04:03But unless there's facts that show he bet on baseball as a player.
04:08Well, he said he didn't for years until he realized he had to cop to it.
04:12No, no.
04:12As a player, if there's no proof as a player, there's plenty of people that say, well, I don't do this.
04:19Or people say he did this.
04:20Unless you can actually show me proof that he did it, the same with the steroid guys, right?
04:27Unless you can actually show proof that the guy did it, then how are you going to say, well, there's whispers and that kind of thing.
04:35And we're going based off of the whispers.
04:37You want to get to the calls on this?
04:38Is Carl still there?
04:40Oh, yeah.
04:40Sean?
04:41Carl from Nantucket.
04:42Hey, Carl.
04:44Hey, what's going on?
04:46Hey, what's up?
04:46First time, long time.
04:48Hey, Bob.
04:50Still, it's Joe Jackson.
04:51I only remember from loving the movie as a kid, I think Brees stole my thunder, but he was spot on in that series.
04:58Like, the only home run, 375, two doubles, six ribbies.
05:03Like, the whole team may have been, you know, guilty of collusion, but I got to think, man, if you're on that level in the World Series, you're probably not trying to throw games.
05:13Yeah.
05:14No errors.
05:15Right.
05:15So they blamed it all on him or whatever.
05:18Right, right.
05:18And so he's obviously not in the Hall of Fame.
05:21Which he should be.
05:22Yeah.
05:23And just for factual information.
05:25He was on, Curtis, wasn't he on every Monday with Dale?
05:28He was.
05:29Yeah.
05:32Dale here.
05:33Good morning, Dale.
05:34I'll be in Maine this weekend.
05:36So TJ Quinn at ESPN Outside the Lines had a story in 2015 where in 2004, after 15 years of denials, he admitted that he bet on baseball.
05:46And then new documents obtained by Outside the Lines in 2015 were notebooks that had overwhelming evidence that Pete Rose was betting as a player in the mid-80s with the Cincinnati Reds.
05:58Yeah.
05:58I think that's the thing.
06:00I mean, you don't just suddenly decide.
06:02No, I get it.
06:03You know, hey, I'm a manager now.
06:04Right.
06:05I think I'm going to give this betting thing a drive.
06:07Right.
06:07No, I believe, listen, I believe he probably bet on it when he was a player.
06:11He bet on it when he was a manager.
06:12He probably bet on his own team.
06:14I believe he ran afoul of the game.
06:16But there's no denying.
06:18There's no good play on words.
06:20Oh, you like that?
06:21Yes.
06:22There's no denying.
06:23Put that testy pole up there.
06:25There's no denying that Charlie Hustle should not be in the Hall of Fame.
06:31That's a double.
06:32I don't care what it is.
06:34You can't never have a player.
06:35Well, you know what?
06:36Never, ever, ever have I seen a bigger joke than Major League Baseball and their writers for keeping out the greatest hitter to ever play the game of baseball.
06:45And Pete Rose out of the Hall of Fame, knowing that the guy was in his 80s and you would think, okay, you know what?
06:52He served his time long enough.
06:54Let's send him home.
06:55Yeah.
06:56This is Bill from Newton.
06:58Hey, Bill.
06:59Hey, guys.
07:00How are you?
07:01What's up?
07:01Listen, where I have a problem with this, and there's no doubt he bet,
07:05is where Curtis says, when you've got a guy who's actively trying to lose.
07:12They looked back at all of Rose's games when he was a manager,
07:15and they tried to find the scratch-your-head moment where, oh, yeah, I mean, he clearly was trying to lose that game.
07:23They didn't find it.
07:24Now, I'm not saying he didn't do it, but, you know, betting on a game as a manager is no different than when in 2001,
07:31what I bet every time Pedro was pitching.
07:33I knew he was going to win, so I bet on him.
07:35I think that's what he was doing.
07:37But, Bill, Bill, Bill, but the point is, one second, I'll let you finish.
07:40I'll let you finish.
07:41The big point here is that it's what he was telling the people that knew, his bookies,
07:46when he didn't bet on the Reds, even if you want to trust him and say he never bet against them,
07:52when he did not bet, that was betting against his team to the betting markets.
07:57I got you, but that still is no different than what you were saying earlier is he's not trying to lose.
08:10He didn't bet on every single game.
08:12I guarantee you he wasn't betting on 162 games.
08:15But the bottom line is if you're taking steroids, you are absolutely affecting the outcome of the game.
08:23I can tell you right now, in the year 2000, if I knew Barry Bonds was going to jump from a 30-home run guy to a 70-home run guy,
08:30I wouldn't bet on every freaking game.
08:32I bet you the people in his organization knew that he was going to hit 70 that year.
08:36What's the difference?
08:37The difference is that you are taking a substance to improve your performance.
08:44That's the difference.
08:45You're affecting the game, Curtis.
08:46Well, how do guys – let me ask this question.
08:49Let me ask this question.
08:51How does a guy like, whether it's Alex Cora or some of those other guys,
08:55get caught or allegedly get caught for cheating on baseball,
08:59have the situations that they have, and then they're back in the game?
09:02You know, people do it with Bill Belichick.
09:04People say, oh, he cheated, and that affected – and there are situations where, like,
09:09they couldn't, like, prove, prove, prove, but they obviously found something.
09:13So how is it, like, guys like that –
09:15Because there is the way they –
09:16Wait a second.
09:17Where if you cheated and you did something wrong, you still are now allowed back in the game.
09:22Yeah.
09:22Isn't it kind of the same thing?
09:24No, you yourself said that there's one crime that should be punished.
09:27The rest are not as big of a deal.
09:29And what I'm saying, simply, is that it's not right to bang on a trash can
09:35and guess the pitch and get an advantage.
09:37He was punished.
09:38He was suspended a year because it was in an attempt to gain an advantage to win.
09:45Right.
09:45Not losing or tanking or questioning the veracity of the outcome in a game
09:50in an attempt to lose.
09:51Those are very different.
09:52For your own personal gain.
09:53Right.
09:54But if the colleges said that most of Pete Rowe's bets were to win –
09:58Right.
09:58But we don't –
09:59But it wasn't –
10:00But Alex –
10:01He's not going to talk to that, Wiggy.
10:02That's the point.
10:03But Courtney makes a good point.
10:04Alex Cora wasn't doing that.
10:07He was doing it to help the team.
10:09Yes.
10:09Not for his own personal benefit wagering.
10:12And go back to that London series when the Red Sox and Yankees played in London.
10:15Remember this part.
10:16We can find the audio where he's asked about the scandal.
10:19And he said, ask Bayerga – or not Bayerga – who was the hitter on the Astros that
10:23was on the Yankees coaching staff?
10:24Bregman?
10:25No, that was it.
10:25Beltran?
10:26Beltran.
10:26He said, ask Beltran about that.
10:28They all – there were several things in baseball, whether it's tipping pitches,
10:32guessing pitches, all of that.
10:33The Apple Watch.
10:34Apple Watches.
10:35Apple Watches.
10:35It all would have been fine if Pete Rose had a ride or die like Shohei.
10:39Right.
10:39You know what?
10:39Everything would have been fine.
10:41Chris Carter was right all along.
10:42Just get a ball guy.
10:43Courtney, I agree that they were doing things.
10:46I just don't – like, I don't get how – that you see a guy like that and you go,
10:53oh, his crime was so bad that we can't put him in the Hall of Fame.
10:58I mean, now that everything – now that gambling is legalized in most states,
11:02should we just do away with the whole thing and let these guys all gamble on – I mean –
11:07I need to know who's going to be the fall guy.
11:10Shohei in line seven.
11:12Well, they're already – they let them bet on sports.
11:15They're just saying you can't bet on your own sport.
11:17Should we just let them – like, we can –
Comments