00:00And as we continue closely following the 79th edition of the United Nations General Assembly
00:05underway, our Special Envoy, Jorge Gestoso, dialogue with the Prime Minister of St. Vincent
00:11and the Grenadines, Ralph Gonsalves, for an exclusive interview with TELESUR.
00:15Let's listen.
00:19We are at the mission of St. Vincent and the Grenadines at New York, and we have the honour
00:25to have with us the Prime Minister of St. Vincent and the Grenadines, Mr. Ralph Gonsalves.
00:32Always a pleasure to have you, Mr. Gonsalves.
00:35Thank you very much.
00:36Mr. Gonsalves, what is the issue that you are bringing to the general debate that concerns
00:42you the most?
00:44Well, the first most important thing is for us to continue the work as small island developing
00:52states, which we elaborated at our meeting in Antigua and Barbuda in May, addressing
01:00the concerns of the 39 SIDs in the world, 70 million people, issues on climate change,
01:11climate financing.
01:14And then, of course, we are very much concerned about the contradictions in the world today
01:22and all the material difficulties that people are facing, and issues in Gaza and Ukraine
01:29and in other places, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Sudan and, of course, Haiti.
01:40Each of these conflicts has its own peculiar origins and context, but they are all reflective
01:48of a failure of the multilateral system, which is important for us to promote in order
01:55to have peace, justice, prosperity and security.
02:01And in the hemisphere, the issue has to be addressed about the ghost of Monroe, which
02:12still stalks the citadels of a great nation, and we suffer either collaterally or directly
02:27because of this ghost.
02:30And this ghost has made flesh in many cases.
02:32Still alive and kicking?
02:34And the weaponising of the financial system against Venezuela and Cuba, the embargoes,
02:43all the unjust declarations against these two countries, among others.
02:50And really to re-emphasise that there is no country in the Caribbean and Latin America
02:55This is a threat to this great nation, a nation of tremendous innovation and culture
03:06and hard work and ingenuity and prosperity.
03:14Of course, there are downsides, and one of the downsides is this ghost which traverses
03:23the marbled halls of the power brokers across this great empire.
03:30You have always the threat of climate change.
03:32You are living in first-hand hurricanes and devastation in the island.
03:40Absolutely.
03:41In St. Vincent and the Grenadines, since the dawn of the 21st century, we have had 12 major
03:47climatic events that separate and distinguish from the volcanic eruptions of April 2021.
03:56So that's a big issue for us.
03:57The last one is Hurricane Beryl, July the 1st this year.
04:04It affected 20% of our population and direct economic damage, one third of our gross domestic
04:12products.
04:13So it's a serious matter for relief, recovery and reconstruction.
04:18And the multilateral financial institutions are not fit for purpose to deal with these
04:27kinds of climatic events and the danger they represent and the damage they cause.
04:39What about the economy?
04:40Because also the fact that the world economy is not growing at the pace that everybody
04:46would love to, you also are feeling the pain.
04:50We do feel the pain.
04:53Part of it has to do with the internal contradictions of the dominant forces in the global political
04:59economy and the outpouring from the contradictions within that political economy with war and
05:07the expenditure on war, weapons of mass destruction, lethal weaponry.
05:14And if we can spend even a fraction of that kind of money on human beings and to deal
05:20with climate justice and poverty and unemployment and education and issues touching and concerning
05:28women and girls and the young people, we'd be in a far better place.
05:33But the only area, the only zone in where we can bring all these things together is
05:39in the multilateral space.
05:42Hegemons and would-be hegemons don't really want to act multilaterally unless they do
05:53it within their own interests, because great powers have a tendency to want to maintain
06:02dominance.
06:03It has been so historically.
06:05And now and again, they dress it up and tell us that the central contradiction is about
06:12democracy versus autocracy.
06:13Well, St. Vincent of Greenleaf is a democratic country, we are free, we are independent,
06:19and we remain so always.
06:23And from where we sit, from where we stand, the central contradiction is not between democracy
06:31and autocracy.
06:34It is who gets what, when, where, and how.
06:38Who owns and controls the means of production, distribution, and exchange.
06:42That's what it is about.
06:44And when the various factions and nation-states across the world, the hegemons and would-be
06:50hegemons, talk about the new world order, I ask the simple questions, what's new?
06:57Which world?
06:58And who gives the orders?
07:00What about the Brits?
07:02How do you see it?
07:04That's an important countervailing force which is arising.
07:09Still you have a unipolar world, but it's increasingly coming under strain and questioning.
07:18And that's part of the problem.
07:21And in some countries, you have an option being pursued, which is either a neoliberal
07:30option or even a neo-fascist option in some cases.
07:37Because the persons who are running these lines, apart from wanting to make their countries
07:44white again, which they never ... the country is never white.
07:49In any case, you can't turn the clock back.
07:51We are where we are.
07:53And it's really about maintenance of hegemony.
07:57To me, it's a very straightforward matter.
08:00And in a great nation, sometimes we find ourselves where we are in the shadow of this great nation.
08:08We become prisoners to their presidential politics, and so on and so forth.
08:15We have to live with these things and find the spaces to be able to organise our affairs
08:24in our own interests.
08:26It's not easy.
08:28And we have to ensure that we build alliances, and we build these alliances not to undermine
08:40anybody, but to build alliances to advance our own cause, our own interests, the interests
08:48of the people, to make sure that we live decent lives.
08:53As a neighbour of the Caribbean, Haiti, a question in two parts.
09:03Basically, pushed by the US, it has been sent a, quote unquote, police force to put order.
09:12First of all, it was not a United Nations typical mission, because it was not financed
09:17by the United Nations, it was financed by the US.
09:21So far, no results at all.
09:24What they're trying to say, that it's going to bring peace and whatever, it's not working.
09:29So, part of the question should be, is it already another intervention of the first
09:36world that is failing in Haiti?
09:39And the second part of the question, your reaction of Haiti in the political campaign
09:45of the US, trying to diminish the credibility of the Haitian and say that they're eating
09:52cats and dogs?
09:53Yeah, well, the latter issue about cats and dogs is just rubbish, absolute rubbish.
10:00It's where prejudices are being raked over in a quest of something ignoble.
10:10I don't think serious people take that kind of a rubbish, give it any credence.
10:16The question, the first part of the question, the more complicated one, when people are
10:23suffering from violence generated by gangs and criminal gangs, sometimes they put on
10:34the cloak as though they're Robin Hoods, but criminal gangs.
10:40People want peace, they want security, they want humanitarian assistance, they want to
10:45see certain basic rights restored to them, they want to see democracy, they want to be
10:53able to go about their lives in some way, give meaning to themselves and their families.
11:01And people would look to any source for security.
11:07Haiti is a member of the Caribbean community and we have been working politically on important
11:11questions and this is through the work of CARICOM that we are able to get the presidential
11:17council moving and see that there's a government in place which reflects broad interests, not
11:23yet elections, we'll get to that in another year's time, hopefully, always within the
11:31framework of something being Haitian led and Haitian devised.
11:39The Kenyans who are there, they're part of the MSF, the multinational security force,
11:53which the United Nations Security Council has approved of, not as part of a peacekeeping
12:01force from the United Nations, we have been there, that one before and that wasn't very
12:07successful.
12:09No, this one is to get countries to help, the United States is not going to put in any
12:19troops for all kinds of different reasons, no, you need Canada.
12:25So other countries have said, well, we can help, but it's an expensive business.
12:31So I don't see what is happening the same as the old-fashioned interventions, it's more
12:39nuanced, and look, when you're in a difficult situation, you have to try to make the best
12:49of it because men and women make history, but only to the extent that the circumstances
12:55of history permit them so to make.
12:58As I said, if you're living in the capital city and 80% of it is controlled by gangs
13:06who can, capriciously, you're not concerned about where the security comes from.
13:11The truth of the matter though is that the number of security personnel from outside
13:17on the ground, so far they aren't making a significant difference, they've made some
13:22difference, but the gangs are still there to be dismantled.
13:26So it's still a challenge.
13:27A great challenge.
13:28Do you think it's going to see results or hopefully results in what sort of term, short,
13:35medium, large?
13:36No, this is a long haul, and hopefully we can have enough security for the electoral
13:44system to be fashioned and for people to be able to campaign.
13:49Next year, for example?
13:51Maybe next year, maybe another year plus.
13:55You're optimistic?
13:56Well, hopeful.
14:00You know, there's a Pauline virtue about faith.
14:06It's the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of that which we have not yet seen.
14:13Mr. Prime Minister Ralph Gonsalves, thank you very, very much for having us.
14:20We were listening to our special envoy, Jorge Gestoso, and Prime Minister of San Vincente
14:25and the Grand Prince Ralph Gonsalves during an important exclusive at such a significant
14:30time for the international scene.
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