00:00 We are live in Salford for the very first time in this election. It is
00:06 Sunak versus Starmer, the ITV debate. This election is all about a choice.
00:12 More of the chaos and division we have seen for the last 14 years, or
00:17 turning the page and rebuilding with Labour. Beyond raising your taxes
00:22 and raiding your pensions, no-one knows what Labour would actually do.
00:27 But you know what I would do. I will cut your taxes, protect your pension
00:33 and reduce immigration. In the last few years I found it very difficult
00:37 to make ends meet and the money simply does not go far enough. All I do
00:41 is work to live. I don't think you actually understand how this is for
00:46 people like me. So what can you do about that? Thank you very much
00:50 indeed, Paula, for your question. Rishi Sunak. Paula, I know how much
00:55 of a strain the last few years have put on your family finances, the
00:59 family finances of everyone in our country. That is why my priority has
01:04 always been to do what I can to support you. That started with bold
01:07 action, like the furlough scheme during the pandemic, and more
01:10 recently my clear plan to bring inflation back to normal. Now our
01:15 economy is growing again, wages are rising and crucially we are able to
01:20 now start cutting your taxes. I'm not going to pretend that Ukraine and
01:24 Covid hasn't made things worse, but this government has lost control.
01:29 Liz Trust crashed the economy. They made it worse here than in other
01:32 countries. It is people like you that are paying the price. If a
01:36 government loses control of the economy, as they have, it is working
01:40 people that pay the price. I'm a cancer survivor, my son is a nurse, I
01:46 recently lost a cousin who was waiting for surgery. No-one is brave
01:52 enough to tell us the truth. The NHS is broken. Be honest with us. How
01:58 long will it take to fix it? Thank you very much indeed. Janet Kirstein.
02:04 Janet, I'm really sorry to hear about your own position and that of
02:08 your relatives. My wife works in the NHS in one of the big London
02:13 hospitals. My mum was a nurse, my sister was a nurse, so the DNA runs
02:17 through my DNA. You can imagine just how angry I am that it has been
02:21 broken, and it has been broken exactly as you describe. It is
02:25 unforgivable what has happened to the NHS. We have put record funding in,
02:29 we are training more doctors and nurses, we are doing more checks and
02:32 scans. What I want you to know is that the NHS is safe in my hands. I
02:36 will always stand up for it to give you and everyone else the peace of
02:39 mind that it will be there for you and your families when you need it. We
02:42 are now making progress, the waiting lists are coming down. What Kirstein
02:45 did not mention to you, which you did, Julie... They are now 7.5 million
02:50 and he says they are coming down. They are now coming down. 7.2 million
02:56 when you said you would get them down, and now 7.5 million. I would
03:00 like you to explain how they are coming down. They were coming down
03:03 from where they were when they were hired. They are now on their way
03:07 down. They are down. Because the NHS was impacted by industrial action.
03:13 If it wasn't for that... Half a million appointments would have been
03:17 saved. It is somebody else's fault. If you had loved ones on a long
03:21 waiting list for surgery, if you felt that was the only way forward, would
03:26 you use private healthcare? Yes. Kirstein? No. Politicians have broken
03:33 promises on immigration. Why should I trust either of you to do anything
03:39 about such large numbers of people risking their lives to cross the
03:43 channel to gain access to the UK illegally? Thank you very much
03:48 indeed, Stephen. Rishi Sunak? Stephen, immigration is too high. We will
03:54 need to take bold action to bring it down. Whether that is legal
03:58 migration, where we are going to introduce a new legal cap to
04:01 guarantee it will come down every year, or the boats which you
04:04 mentioned. We got the numbers down last year by a third and now we have
04:08 a deterrent ready to go. Migrants have been detained, the flights will go
04:12 in July, but only if I am your Prime Minister. We need to smash the
04:15 gangs that are running this vile trade, making a huge amount of money,
04:19 putting some of the most vulnerable people in boats across the channel.
04:23 They are making a fortune. Before I was a politician, Stephen, I was the
04:27 director of public prosecutions. I worked with the police and
04:30 prosecutors in other countries to bring down terrorist gangs running
04:33 across borders. I do not believe it is impossible to bring down these
04:36 gangs. If your Rwanda plan is blocked by the courts, and will this
04:40 appear in your manifesto, that you would remove the UK from the
04:43 European Convention on Human Rights, is that part of your plan? I am
04:48 crystal clear. I believe all our plans are compliant with our
04:51 international obligations, but if I am forced to choose between securing
04:55 our borders and our country's security, or a foreign court, I will
04:59 choose our country's security every single time. I am worried about the
05:03 UK's lack of leadership on the world stage. I want our PM to be strong
05:07 enough to take a stand, even when it is hard. What should happen next to
05:12 stop these awful scenes we are seeing in Gaza? The situation in Gaza is
05:18 intolerable. It is catastrophic. Tens of thousands of people have been
05:23 killed, a disproportionate number of women and children. What we need now
05:28 is a ceasefire, a cessation of the hostilities straightaway. Right now,
05:33 you will see that the US have put a deal on the table which we strongly
05:36 support, together with our allies, to bring an immediate end to the
05:39 hostilities, release hostages, get more aid in, and then build towards a
05:43 lasting settlement with a two-state solution. Like many young people, I
05:47 completed my final years of sixth form under Covid restrictions, started
05:51 university under them, and have had to deal with a cost-of-living crisis,
05:55 a housing crisis, and an unstable world. What future can you offer my
05:59 generation, and when will we become your priority? So we would ensure
06:03 that those jobs are there for you for the future, that you have the
06:06 opportunity to get on. We will build the houses so you don't have to be
06:11 30-something, 35, 36, before you own a house under this government. What I
06:15 won't be doing is sending you on national service, some sort of
06:20 British-made army, which would be what the Prime Minister would say. We
06:24 will introduce a modern form of national service, and I think it will
06:28 be transformational for young people in our country, giving them the
06:31 skills and opportunities they need to succeed in life, fostering a
06:34 culture of service in our society, bringing it together, but also
06:37 strengthening our resilience and security for the future, and I think
06:40 it is going to be something that is incredibly positive. But beyond that,
06:43 I want you to have financial security, so when you get that job, when you
06:47 for that house, we make it easier.
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