- 2 years ago
Matt Murray coordinates the United States’ active engagement and participation in APEC while also overseeing the Office of Economic Policy in the State Department’s Bureau of East Asian and Pacific Affairs. In 2023, he was nominated by the President and confirmed by the U.S. Senate for the rank of Ambassador during his tenure of service as U.S. Senior Official for APEC. During the U.S. APEC host year in 2023, Ambassador Murray is spearheading the advancement of U.S. APEC’s work across a wide range of policy domains and an economic policy agenda that benefits workers, businesses, and families in the United States and across the APEC region. Prior to his current role, Ambassador Murray served in the State Department’s Bureau of Economic and Business Affairs as Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Trade Policy and Negotiations from September 2020 to August 2021 and as Senior Bureau Official from August 2021 to January 2022.
Matt Murray joins 'Forbes Talks' with Diane Brady to discuss APEC's goals and what impact the election could have on the organization.
Matt Murray joins 'Forbes Talks' with Diane Brady to discuss APEC's goals and what impact the election could have on the organization.
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00:00 Hi, everybody. I'm Diane Brady. I am here with U.S. senior official for APEC Ambassador Matt Murray. Ambassador Murray, good to see you.
00:11 Great to see you. Great to be here.
00:14 So I want to start with this strange beast that is APEC, these 21-member economies, because I think most people don't really think about it on a regular basis as a conceit.
00:28 So maybe explain that for us first, if you don't mind, Matt.
00:32 Sure. So APEC, Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation, is a multilateral organization that was launched in 1989 with the goal of promoting more open trade and investment around the region.
00:45 And in 1993, when the United States was hosting, it was then elevated to a leaders level meeting, which means that every usually every November, all the leaders from the APEC economies get together.
00:57 But it's a full year long effort meeting, much like any other multilateral organization on a regular basis.
01:04 So it's both top down from leaders on down, but also bottom up with subject matter experts and then folks like me as senior officials to to shepherd the process.
01:13 It's a consensus based, non-binding organization.
01:15 We refer to it as an incubator of ideas.
01:18 And the 21 member economies account for roughly half of global trade and about 60 percent of global GDP.
01:26 So I want to I've always found it intriguing that basically the Pacific Ocean has to touch your shores to be a member, which is always kind of fascinating to me because you get Chile, you get China, you don't get India.
01:41 Let me let me focus on the fact that the US was the host this year in San Francisco.
01:48 Trade has been a very touchy topic politically.
01:53 Give us your sense of the landscape right now.
01:56 I mean, we saw these meetings with Xi Jinping, the Chinese leader during this particular last APEC.
02:04 Is what's the state of health?
02:06 Give us a report, Ambassador.
02:08 We talk about in APEC three economic drivers of growth, one being trade and investment, one being innovation and digitalization, and then a third being a sort of a catch all strong, secure, balanced, sustainable and inclusive growth.
02:22 And so the agenda for APEC every year, regardless of who is hosting, is going to touch on that broad set of issues.
02:30 I think over the past 30 years, APEC has obviously evolved into what it looks like, looks at.
02:35 I think early on it was very focused on tariff reduction.
02:40 I think right now it's very focused on some of the broader sets of issues that we realize that we're facing, particularly those coming out of the covid pandemic, making sure we have more resilient economies.
02:50 And also, as we address the climate crisis, making sure we have more sustainable economies.
02:56 So in short, what can we do together as these 21 economies to make some decisions where we believe we can help together, collaboratively move in that direction?
03:07 But to your point about the meeting with between the president and Xi Jinping, it's also really important that APEC serves as a convener throughout the year, but especially in that last week to bring together officials at all levels.
03:19 And then during Leaders Week to give the opportunity for leaders to meet where the agenda can be broader than just the economic issues that we're discussing in APEC.
03:29 And as we saw, President Biden and President Xi had a very constructive meeting on November the 15th in San Francisco, right before the leaders meeting for APEC started on the 16th.
03:39 And so we also really value APEC as a mechanism to bring officials from all over the region, including at the leaders level, together for those kinds of engagements.
03:48 You know, it's I think it's good to to step back a second and talk about why it's relevant to the average American or just say average citizen of any of these economies.
04:02 So but before like that's a baseline, I'm very familiar with the APEC CEO summit.
04:07 And it's always a reminder to me that there can be a disconnect between the rhetoric politically and the reality on the ground that the US is very engaged in this region on a business level, regardless of what different administrations say.
04:23 Why is it matter? Let's talk about what is it that the average American should think about when they're thinking about this organization, also engagement with this part of the world?
04:35 Well, I think you've hit on the key point, right, which is this public private sector engagement.
04:40 I refer to that really as the secret sauce of what makes APEC special, because you do have this opportunity for the private sector businesses, large and small, importantly, including small and medium sized enterprises having a seat at these meetings and then making sure that there's opportunities for businesses to engage with, you know, with leaders, with ministers, with senior officials from around the region.
05:04 Because, look, this is all about prosperity. And if it's all about prosperity, then it's all about jobs and it's all about good paying jobs.
05:10 And we want to make sure that we're able to continue to compete on a level playing field across the region so that we can create the jobs of the future.
05:19 Increasingly, APEC economies are also one of our most important sources of investment here, and especially in some of the jobs of the future in the areas of semiconductors in the area of electric vehicle batteries.
05:31 And so we're seeing companies come in from Taiwan, from Korea, from Australia, from around the region.
05:38 And if you look at the cumulative, you know, investment, total investment in the United States from the APEC region, it now totals one point seven trillion dollars of FDI stock.
05:50 Yeah, we did foreign direct investment.
05:52 Yep. Right. And so foreign direct investment now, one point seven trillion in the United States from the APEC region.
05:58 And so that creates a lot of good paying jobs here in America. And we want to make sure that as we go through the agenda in APEC,
06:05 whether it's around sustainability or resiliency or the digital economy or trade and investment, that we are very much doing whatever we can to help,
06:13 as you said, you know, average people here in the United States be able to to access the region's economy, to be able to connect with supply chains,
06:22 whether they work for a large company or a small company or anywhere in between, that they have, you know,
06:28 very much feel like they have a seat at the table in these discussions.
06:31 So reflect back on our our host here. Was it a success? Did we get what we wanted?
06:38 I certainly believe so. Look, we came in with with five key objectives straight from Secretary of State Tony Blinken.
06:45 We wanted to lead in a multilateral organization.
06:48 We wanted to enhance our relationships with like minded partners who are a lot of, you know,
06:53 the keys to creating some of these new trade investment opportunities.
06:57 We wanted to do what we could to uphold international rules and norms, which is really important for that level playing field piece.
07:03 We wanted to advance public private sector collaboration and we wanted to deliver some policy outcomes on sustainability, on resiliency, on the digital economy.
07:13 And I think across all of those objectives, we were successful.
07:17 I think we landed at the end of the year in November with a consensus leaders declaration,
07:23 which we called the Golden Gate Declaration, where we got all economies to agree on certain things we were going to do in the areas, particularly in sustainability.
07:32 And so I think in that in that way, it was a really successful year.
07:38 And I think all of the other things that came with it, the like you said, the Apex CEO summit and the public private collaboration.
07:45 Obviously, the bilateral meeting with President Biden and President Xi Jinping.
07:50 But also a lot of other key bilateral engagements with Japan, with Korea, with Papua New Guinea, with Taiwan.
07:56 You know, there were a lot of different opportunities. And then, of course, we had some other regional economic initiatives that were,
08:03 you know, move forward, such as the Indo-Pacific Economic Framework,
08:07 where three of the pillars were concluded by our colleagues at the Department of Commerce and U.S. Trade Representative's office.
08:13 And so I think all in all, it was a very successful year.
08:15 It's a good year for us. The key thing was, you know, really being able to demonstrate to the region that we are that we do have very strong economic engagement with the region and that we want to build on that.
08:26 You know, it's a good point, because when I first went to APEC, it was when the U.S.
08:30 hosted in Honolulu. The conversation back then was about Trans-Pacific Partnership.
08:35 Obviously, that term went away. How much are we dependent on a particular administration and its goals in terms of our engagement with the region?
08:47 You know, not to get you into the realm of politics here, but of course, we're heading into an election year.
08:54 How should people be thinking about that in regards to this?
08:59 Well, here again, from my perspective in APEC, this is where the engagement with the private sector is really,
09:03 really important because companies know that they need to engage with the Asia-Pacific and the broader Indo-Pacific for their own prosperity and for their own future in terms of their ability to be successful.
09:19 And so I think a lot of this is, you know, finding ways for administrations to be supportive of those business community objectives in order to create jobs here at home and foster broader economic prosperity.
09:33 So, you know, I think that the Biden administration certainly has done a great job of leading,
09:39 which I think is what our partners in the in the Pacific have told us they really want from the United States is for us to take a leadership role.
09:46 And the Indo-Pacific Economic Framework discussions, great example of that, you know, launched in May of last year by President Biden on a visit to Japan.
09:56 And now a year and a half later, I've already concluded three pillars of that agreement.
10:01 OK. And so I think, you know, that's another demonstration that, you know,
10:05 our partners in the Asia-Pacific want us to be engaged and through a variety of mechanisms.
10:11 And so I think regardless of which administration is in power, we need to continue to try to demonstrate that in order to really lead in the region.
10:21 Let me get back to one thing you mentioned, Ambassador, excuse me, which is like minded.
10:27 Of course, this has been a year where we continue to have the conflict war in Ukraine.
10:34 Of course, we have the Israel Hamas war that also very much, you know, flavored the conversation at APEC.
10:44 So Russia did not attend. It is a member.
10:47 Can you give us some perspective in terms of the conversations there and how is APEC helping us in the same way that, say, a NATO might help us?
10:59 Of course, very different organizations.
11:01 But geopolitics is top of mind for business leaders and political leaders these days.
11:09 Certainly. And, you know, as you said, every organization is unique.
11:13 And APEC is an organization that really has focused on regional economic cooperation over the last three plus decades.
11:20 The Russia Ukraine situation has been a very difficult one for APEC because, first of all, Russia is a member of APEC.
11:29 They did come to San Francisco, but at a lower level, they their deputy prime minister represented Russia in the leaders meeting.
11:36 And, you know, obviously there's also been significant economic shocks in the region that have been a result of Russia's invasion of Ukraine,
11:47 especially in the area of food security, where there's been some really significant harm for the for the entire region.
11:53 And so, you know, last year in twenty twenty two, after the war started,
11:56 there was a lot of like minded engagement across APEC in terms of making sure that we were making very clear that we condemned Russia's invasion of
12:06 Ukraine and that we could express concerns about the economic harm it was doing to the region.
12:13 And then this year we continued along that same vein.
12:16 Again, it's very difficult in a multilateral organization that's by consensus when one economy, one member is acting in the way that Russia is.
12:25 And so there are certainly some complications,
12:28 but I think we had pretty strong support for continuing to both condemn the war and express concern about the the outcomes.
12:37 I think when it comes to the conflict in the in the Middle East, it's, you know, again, from the perspective of APEC,
12:42 it's a little bit different because you don't have any of the Middle Eastern parties that are members of APEC
12:50 and you don't necessarily have some of the same economic impacts, at least not yet on the region.
12:56 But there is very much a shared concern across the APEC members in what's happening in the Middle East.
13:02 And so I think that as the discussions went forward in San Francisco,
13:07 it was a matter of how to contextualize some of these other, you know,
13:12 refer to them as geopolitical issues are impacting APEC as a membership.
13:17 And that's why we released the accompanying chair statement, which we discussed with all of the APEC members before releasing that on November 17th.
13:27 Yeah. Let's look ahead to 2024. You get into rooms we don't get to go.
13:33 What's on your radar that you want to put on ours in terms of how you're looking at APEC and just in general,
13:40 some of the opportunities that we should be attuned to?
13:44 Well, this year, APEC now moves to Peru. I just got back from Lima yesterday.
13:50 They had the first meeting of their host year, and I think they're going to do a great job of carrying forward
13:57 some of the things that we did this year, as well as previous hosts have done.
14:01 And so we want to be very active participants in that year, because, again, it's not just about who's hosting,
14:07 but it's about the opportunity to engage all of the other economies.
14:12 And I think also importantly, it's in the interest of the United States for APEC to be strong as an institution because of everything we've talked about today,
14:20 because of the opportunities that we have to really be a convener, but also get some some good work done on the economic side.
14:28 So I think as we look ahead to 2024, we have APEC being hosted by Peru.
14:33 You'll also next year have the G20 hosted in Brazil.
14:38 I believe this is the first time in history that both of those meetings will be hosted in Latin America.
14:43 So that will certainly bring a little bit of a different flavor to those meetings as we look ahead to November,
14:50 but also as we look ahead to the entire year's worth of ministerials and everything that APEC and the G20 will be will be having.
14:59 And then, of course, we have now with the three pillars concluded in the Indo-Pacific Economic Framework,
15:04 there's opportunities for really looking ahead to implementation there and trying to bring together some of the resources that we need to as a region in order to make those things work.
15:16 So yesterday I was at a meeting at the State Department with my boss, Assistant Secretary Kritenbrink.
15:23 He talked about 2024 being a year of implementation. And so I think that's what we want to do.
15:29 We did a lot this year to really lead on economic engagement in the region.
15:34 We, I think, ended up in a really good place in San Francisco in November.
15:39 And now it's really on all of us across government and across the private sector to take some of this forward in 2024 so that we can really implement what's been done and really carry forward for,
15:51 as we talked about earlier, greater prosperity, more jobs, more opportunities across the United States and across the region.
15:58 Execution. That is where great ideas are brought to life.
16:02 So I think that's a good, I guess, call to action, implementation for 2024.
16:08 Thank you for joining us, Ambassador Murray, and I hope that we get to continue the conversation.
16:15 Well, thanks very much. And thanks also for everything Forbes has done in terms of the engagement with APEC.
16:21 Really much appreciated and look forward to keeping in touch.
16:24 Thank you. Great. Happy holidays.
16:27 Same to you.
16:27 Thank you.
16:28 Bye.
16:29 Bye.
16:30 Bye.
16:31 Bye.
16:32 Bye.
16:33 [BLANK_AUDIO]
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