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اولویت‌های اتحادیه اروپا؛ جدال نمایندگان پارلمان اروپا در برنامه «رینگ»

در این برنامه مناظره‌ای، دو نماینده پارلمان اروپا، بندتا اسکودری (سبزها) از ایتالیا و مارکوس فربر (حزب مردم اروپا) از آلمان، رو در رو درباره مسئله تعیین‌کننده در اتحادیه اروپا مناظره می‌کنند.

لب بیشتر : http://parsi.euronews.com/2026/11/12/aoloithai-athadih-aropa-gdal-nmaindgan-parlman-aropa-dr-brnamh-ring

مشترک شوید: یورونیوز به یازده زبان دیگر در دسترس شماست

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00:08Hello and welcome to The Ring, Euronews' weekly debate show broadcasting from the European
00:14Parliament in Brussels. I'm Stefan Grobe. On The Ring, debaters go face-to-face on some
00:19of the biggest political issues facing the EU. Today, we want to talk about the right
00:25priorities for Europe's future. Politically speaking, what should the EU focus on delivering
00:31before the end of its mandate? Luis Albertos has more.
00:39Europe wants to be greener, richer, safer and more competitive. But can it realistically
00:45deliver on all these ambitions at once? The challenges are enormous. An increasingly volatile
00:51geopolitical situation is forcing Europe to rethink its security and economic model.
00:56At the same time, European industries are struggling with high energy costs, excessive regulation
01:01and fierce global competition. Is it time for Brussels to put competitiveness
01:06first, even if that means slowing down the green transition? But there's another dilemma.
01:11Money. Should Europe spend less, cut red tape and rain in its ambitions? Or should Europe
01:17have a bigger EU budget, more common investment and stronger social and climate policies?
01:22And does it have the political will to shape its own future?
01:29A lot to unpack here for our contenders. And here they are.
01:35Benedetta Scuderi, an Italian MEP from the Greens. She's a member of the Committees on Industry,
01:40Research and Energy and Women's Rights and Gender Equality. She says,
01:44One of the priorities is definitely to achieve European autonomy. Not in terms of military
01:49spending, but in our energy, digital and industrial clean tech capacity. The goal is to phase out
01:54fossil fuels and re-industrialize our regions in a socially just way, thinking of our people
01:59and territories. And let's make polluters pay for this.
02:04Markus Ferber, a German MEP from the Central-Right European People's Party. A long-serving member of the
02:09European Parliament, he's the Vice-Chair of the Subcommittee on Tax Matters and a member of the
02:14Committee on Economic and Monetary Affairs. He says,
02:17The EU must prioritize competitiveness, economic growth and simplification, not deregulation.
02:23We need to achieve the same ambitious goals with less bureaucracy and paperwork,
02:28because only a strong economy can finance our climate ambitions, security and social model.
02:35So let me welcome to the ring Benedetta Scuderi and Markus Ferber. Great to have you here. Good
02:41to see you. Speaking of legislative priorities for 2027, is Brussels addressing the issues that really
02:49matter to European citizens? Or is it still setting its agenda from inside the Brussels bubble? What is
02:57the strategy, if there is any? The strategy is, in comparison to the last period where the Green
03:02Deal was the headline for five years, competitiveness is the headline of this five years period.
03:07And that means we have to get rid of bureaucracy. We have to take care on competitiveness of our
03:13industry and our SMEs as well. And if we have a growth on GDP, we have a growth on the
03:19European
03:20budget as well. That is the easiest thing to understand. And therefore, growth and competitiveness
03:25is number one, of course, to have sustainable growth, to, of course, to have social economy driven
03:31growth. Right. But growth is the key answer. Benedetta, are you subscribing to this?
03:37Growth doesn't happen because we want it to happen. And Europe is a proof of it. With all the political
03:43powers that are investing in today's capacities and Europe that is not investing in its capacity,
03:48is not investing in energy transition enough, is not investing in adaptation enough, is not investing in
03:53digital transition, is not investing in a social justice, because the investments we do are well
03:58beyond, well below what we need, then we're never going to thrive as a continent, as a European Union,
04:05as a political union. If we are not a political union, first thing, then we're never going to thrive.
04:10So, Markus, is Europe investing in an old model rather than into digital economy, cyber technology?
04:18I think we have firstly to discuss who has to invest, if everything should be invested by the
04:23public. Sorry, we will never be able to deliver. What we have to create is an environment where
04:27private investment takes place. And what we see at the moment is that the big investors of the world
04:33are moving away from Europe, from Germany as well, but from Europe total as well. And so we have a
04:40lack
04:40of in foreign investments, but we have a lot of investments from European companies outside the
04:45European Union. And that is our main threat we are confronted with. And if you ask industry, why is that
04:51happening? Number one, high energy prices. Number two, high bureaucracy costs. Number three,
04:57the level of skills of the employees. And I think that are things we have to address.
05:04The point is that my country argument is his argument, because he said two of the three things
05:09that are stopping our companies to be able to invest in Europe are energy. And we need to invest in
05:14energy. Energy prices are super high because we are extremely dependent on gas and gas imports.
05:19And that's what is making our energy prices high. And that's what we need to invest. That's what we're
05:24saying. And I'm sorry, on these investments, these, they need to come from public. They need to be publicly
05:29driven, cannot be only public, but they need to be publicly driven because we know where the market is
05:34going. They don't care about about energy prices like the big fossil companies. They are making huge profits
05:41about from our crisis. They're not going to invest in what it will make us better. And we need to
05:45drive that.
05:46And the second thing, skills. Who can make the skills? We have the skill, the union of skills,
05:52and we need to implement that, invest in that, and make it right. So that means that we really need
05:59to be sure that the skills that we need are everywhere in every angle of Europe.
06:04So investing in skills, that sounds good to me, Marcus. Yeah, but the problem is who is responsible
06:09for what. And we cannot say every problem in Europe has to be addressed by the European Union. We need
06:14member states who really engage because education, social welfare, all this stuff is national competence.
06:20And according to the treaties, it's their obligation. On the other hand of energy, sorry,
06:24you come from a member state who is a net consumer on energy. Italy was never able even to deliver
06:30the
06:30own energy for its own industry. I come from a member state who could in the past, but now we
06:35are
06:35net consumers as well. If we have only net consumers in the European Union, we have a problem. So where
06:41are
06:41the possibilities to produce energy for the industry? And that will not be done only by photovoltaics and
06:48windmills. Sorry, we need other sources as well. And that is what we are not equipping for the moment,
06:52because we have high bureaucratic burden for this investment, even for a windmill. In Germany,
06:57it takes one year only to get the allowance to construct a windmill. Sorry, we are far away from
07:03achieving our goals. Okay, Benedetta, your answer. Absolutely, that we need to fasten up our permitting
07:08procedures. Absolutely, our bureaucracy. But why are you against the omnibuses then? Because they are not
07:14simplification, they have deregulation. Omnibus, by the way, is not about cars, right? It's about
07:19irregular simplification. If you think that to make a windmill, we need to take away the due
07:23diligence of multinational companies, I don't think so. I don't think due diligence of multinational
07:28companies, that's where Omnibus that you voted for... That's not the problem. What? That's what you
07:32made into Omnibus. Well, as you made it into Omnibus, deeper restoration, you made it into an Omnibus. I
07:37never heard an Omnibus about fastening up permitting of windmills, in my opinion. That was not. Now we have a
07:44permitting fasting that is coming in the next commission program, and I'm really willing to
07:50work on it, and us Greens, we're really willing to work on it. We had the red that was about
07:54fastening up permitting, and the Greens were in it. But the point is, fastening up permitting
07:58doesn't need to be for data center, doesn't need to be for big companies. It needs to be for what
08:04we
08:04actually need, like windmills, like solar energy and solar support. So we don't need data centers?
08:10All right. All right. It needs to be just one second. You will not create growth without data
08:15centers. How do you think we can achieve growth? Look to the United States. The only driving force
08:20is AI. AI needs data centers. We don't have growth. We don't have competitiveness. I see. We're just
08:27getting warmed up here, which is really good. But now it's time for gloves off.
08:36Now we want viewers to get a real flavor of the European Parliament. We've already got this a
08:42little bit, where members ask each other questions. And Benedetta, I'd like you to ask the first question
08:48to Marcus. So as we were getting into it, we have a huge need to achieve our digital autonomy and
08:56our
08:56digital strategy. So I'm just wondering, but this, we cannot do this if we are selling out our data as
09:03resources to big tech. So I'm wondering if the EPP is fine to have a European
09:10digital strategy and implementation act, but most of all to have regulation and a clear
09:17authorization process for data center in order to not give our data and our energy and our water to big
09:24American big techs that will not do anything about digital autonomy. So do you want to have a strong
09:30regulation for data center and a strong strategy for digital digital autonomy for having European data
09:36centers? I think that is not the right question. The question is even for European investors. And I
09:42have a few of them in Germany who really want to invest in data centers to safeguard, for example,
09:47the data protection regulation, which means data from Europe should stay in Europe and not misused
09:53by NSA in the United States. But they have a problem to get allowance, to have the energy,
10:00to get the allowance for the water. Sorry, if you make a strategy only protecting for other investments,
10:06but not taking care that the investments are taking place. Sorry, that is what you're doing,
10:10because you don't grant the energy. We have only four places in Germany where you have enough energy
10:16to run a data center. Sorry, that is the challenge. It's not the question who is investing. No one can
10:21invest because the infrastructure is not appropriate. And you are defending that we can invest in the
10:27infrastructure, which is a public demand, but then private investors will come even from inside
10:32European Union. That is the wrong approach. Sorry, but then if we see 90% of the data center that
10:38are
10:39asking and are doing the data center is American companies. It's not European companies. If you
10:44see an island where 20% of electricity is for American companies, 20% of electricity is for data
10:49center. And most of it is for American companies. Look at Italy. Sorry, get out of Germany. If this is
10:54the situation in Germany, look at Europe, look at Finland. But Ireland is a very special problem,
10:59which we have for years. So if you don't have regulation against this, then you're not going to have...
11:03If you know everything better, we can stop the discussion. It's now my turn to ask a question to you.
11:07On the other hand, on the contrary, Marcus, I want to ask a Benedetta question now.
11:12Yeah, that's what I wanted to do, but thanks that I have a chance. Your group, the Green Group,
11:17calls the program for next year, and I quote, an attack against nature. Are you really sure that
11:23you are reading correctly what the commission has proposed? Are you really sure if we are reviewing
11:29any regulation after five years? And we have, for example, the habitat regulation, which is
11:34older than 35 years, and a lot of things have changed, that we have a look on that,
11:39and that is not an attack against nature, but really adjusting to a new situation?
11:45I think that adjusting to a new situation would be extremely great if you look at what is the
11:50situation. But it looks like the EPP is not looking at the climate collapse.
11:54You are not able to do anything about the climate. Who says that? What is your proof for this race?
11:59Sorry. That is unacceptable. That is unacceptable, really. Why is EPP?
12:03Because all the omnibus, as you really fried with them, are going against anything that would be a
12:08climate collapse. Which omnibus? Tell me, which omnibus? I told you, deforestation. The omnibus,
12:13the omnibus on due diligence. Deforestation is not in an omnibus. Sorry, don't tell stories which are not the truth.
12:19You are talking. In which omnibus is deforestation? Tell me. You are taking away. It's not right what
12:24you are saying. Due diligence, then. It was one of the strongest things that we had for the climate.
12:30Thunder Lion said in 2019, that will be the race to the moon. But the race to the moon did
12:36not work
12:36with bureaucracy. It worked with technology. And that is what we are suffering. We don't need a
12:40race to the moon. We need to protect this planet. We need to protect this planet. We don't need a
12:45race to the moon. The moon is unlivable. And you want to make this planet unlivable as much as
12:49the moon, I think. That's what you want to do. All right. All right. If you like the moon,
12:53I don't want to make the earth to the moon. Do you have, Marcus, just a second. I really
12:59regret that. Do you have another question for Marcus? Short one. For sure. So we have need for
13:10socially just Europe. And we have a huge amount of our population that is not able to sustain a
13:16living. It's not able to find a house that regards young people, people of my age, that regards all
13:22the people that regards workers. Workers in cities are not able to go and work in the city anymore
13:27because they cannot afford an apartment. They cannot even afford a room. So I'm wondering if the EPP is
13:34able to look at this problem, not saying that we need to build more because many of our cities have
13:39enough empty houses. So probably it's not the number of houses, but to say that we need to
13:44regulate Airbnb and to say that we need to have more public houses that are actually public and for
13:53actually low income people and solution for middle income people. Are you able to say that or we just
13:58need to build with deregulation? I'm a little bit surprised that you are taking EPP as we had the
14:03rapporteur on the housing public. I would be very happy even to say one sentence without being
14:11disturbed. That's what you did with me, by the way. Okay. We had the rapporteur from EPP and he
14:17drafted a report which was adopted by a huge majority by the European Parliament. And one of the key
14:23quotes of this report is that we need to build more houses. Sorry, because we have a lack of that.
14:30We asked,
14:31and that part was not supported by the Greens, that we need less bureaucracy to build houses. Sorry,
14:38that's the same problem. In Germany, it takes eight years when a city decides to make an area for
14:44construction till you have the right to construct something on that. The rest of the world does it
14:48in one to two years, even protecting environment and taking care of standards. Sorry, that is our problem.
14:54And that is a problem of the Green Group because you are refusing that we have an omnibus for the
15:00housing area. You will not be able to finance all this stuff by public investments. We need private
15:05investments for that. And therefore, we have to make it cheaper. And therefore, Europe can play a role.
15:10Okay. Marcus, one last question to Benedetta. One last question to Benedetta in this round.
15:14Yeah. So if we speak about autonomy and stuff like that, I think we have to speak about trade agreements
15:20as well. How Europe can create a rule-based world with trade partners around the globe. And I was
15:27wondering why, for example, the Green Group was voting against the Mercosur agreement with the far
15:32right, by the way, and brought it to the court of justice without ratifying it. Sorry, I was surprised
15:39that it's the wrong answer for the demands we need and the Greens are asking for. Okay. It's funny
15:44that it's coming from an EPP member that we voted with the far right. No, you vote more with the
15:50far
15:50right than us. Sorry. Let her answer. Let her answer.
15:55They actually made agreement with the far right to vote about migration. They brought it together.
16:02I spoke about trade agreement. And now they're claiming to us that we voted in our long-standing
16:10position that was against this agreement of Mercosur because it's first is damaging our people.
16:1725 years negotiation is fast. Let her just develop this.
16:21Yeah, and we were... On which planet are you living? Let her just develop this, please.
16:25Sorry. Sorry. You calm down, because you didn't even hear what I said. And you're saying,
16:29which planet are you living? So what's your problem? Because if you hear what I say, if you
16:33hear what I say, if you hear what I say, if you hear what I say, and then you say
16:39that I live in
16:39another planet, then you can say it. But you don't even hear what I say, then you are in another
16:44planet because you don't know what's my argument. You said we negotiated fast. 25 years is fast for
16:49you. Good luck. You see, it's just 25 years, 25 years. We were against all along because you make
16:54this deal just for profit. You don't make this deal for people here. You don't make this deal for
16:59people in the Amazon. You don't make this deal for our farmers. That will be... And they are already
17:05asking that review of the deal because they are damaged by unfair competition. You didn't make
17:11a deal with clear rules about what can come in because now meat that is made with deforestation can
17:18come in, which is damaging our farmers. So you are against free trade in total. And you didn't make
17:22this deal for the people in the Amazon. So you are against free trade in total.
17:25All right. Because this is going to damage the Amazon. So that's my argument. So who is in
17:29another planet? It's you. All right. I'm not against fair trade. Yes, you are. I'm against
17:32trade without fairness. All right. We got to take a break here. That is a fair trade agreement. Sorry.
17:38We got to take a break here. Thank you very much so far to our guest. That's it for now
17:43on The Ring.
17:45Stay with us here on Euronews.
17:56Welcome to The Ring, Euronews's weekly debate show. I'm Stefan Grobet. I'm joined by two members
18:01of the European Parliament, Benedetta Scuderi from the Italian Greece and Marcus Fairberg,
18:06Christian Democrat from Germany. Today, we debated the political and legislative priorities of the EU,
18:13and we discussed whether Brussels is addressing the issues that matter to people, to European
18:19citizens. Now, what is important to Europeans? What are their worries? What are their demands?
18:25And here we have two recent Eurobarometer surveys that give a pretty good picture of what people
18:30are thinking. When asked, what should the European Parliament prioritize? Inflation,
18:36rising prices and cost of living, 47% say that almost half of the population. When it comes to the
18:44economy and job creation, it's 35% and a little less, 34% say it's EU defense and security. And
18:53when asked
18:53how the EU's budget should be allocated, employment, social affairs, and public health comes in on top,
19:0041%, a little less, 38% say security and defense. And finally, 33% say the money should be allocated
19:10for
19:11education, training, youth culture, and media go figure. So the issue of inflation and increased cost
19:19of living is on top of the list. Not really surprising. Is the EU, are European governments doing enough to
19:27bring prices down and protect households and businesses? Marcus, I'm going to start with you.
19:32Yeah, the fight on the inflation is the responsibility of the European Central Bank,
19:36to be very honest. It's not something we can do as politicians. It has to be price stability is a
19:42mandate of the European Central Bank. And in my capacity as a member of the Econ Committee,
19:47we are in direct exchange with Christine Lagarde. And I hope as she has resigned,
19:51we will get someone who will really fight against inflation in the years to come,
19:55because that will be a key issue. And therefore, we have to do, as I said before, some investments
20:01to reduce the costs as we have high demands and low supply that is increasing costs and prices.
20:07Right. Bernadette, we've been hearing these complaints about high cost of living for quite some time now.
20:14But yet nothing has changed, nothing tangible has changed for European households, families,
20:21and businesses. What's wrong here? I really think Europe should do a step up and should take a big
20:27part into this, because I'm a federalist. And I believe that Europe has to have a big role
20:32into the well-being of people. And that's why we are asking for more social investments. That's why
20:37we're asking for investments in housing. That's why we're asking for investment in energy,
20:41because what is driving up the prices? Yeah, it's inflation, it can be the central bank. But what is
20:46driving up inflation is the energy prices a lot, is what's driving up the prices is the rent prices,
20:54and so on and so forth. If we don't do investments into these things, then nothing's going to change
20:59for people. And I really think that the European Parliament should step up and should be clear in what
21:06is our direction. And that's why I was saying at the beginning, this work program is not clearly going
21:10into this direction. And the budget of the European Union is not really going into this direction.
21:14The moment of crisis we're living now, we are even thinking about decreasing the current budget that
21:21is like pennies at the moment. I think we need to step up. You mentioned the EU budget. We have
21:27these
21:29heated talks going on for quite some time, probably until the end of the year. What should the EU budget
21:34focus on, Marcus? What are the topics? Of course, it's not only one.
21:39If you would have colleagues from the agri-committee, from agriculture policy, they would say, yes,
21:44it's very important to be resilient in the food supply and in the production. If you have people
21:50from Pura region, they would say regional policy is key, cohesion policy is key. If you ask me,
21:56coming from Germany, I say research and innovation is key. So we have to prioritize, of course, if we have
22:03limited resources and sorry, the budget, the public budgets have limited resources on national level
22:08and on European level. But to be very clear, as we have for the moment, 1.1% of the
22:14GDP.
22:15That's our budget. If we increase the GDP, we have more resources. So I think growth, competitiveness
22:22is a key element, even to have more resources available to fulfill all the obligations people
22:26are asking from the European Union. Okay. What about security and defense? How do we reconcile this
22:32with limited resources, as Marcus said, and now we need to spend more on defense? I first want to say
22:38that I'm a bit tired of this fairy tale of the market and the growth and everything's going to be
22:43fine. And in the meantime, people are going to be dead and starving. This is what is happening. If we
22:48wait
22:48for this growth that will come eventually and will save us all because the GDP is going to increase and
22:54then
22:54we're going to increase the budget, then our people are going to starve. They don't want this,
23:00they can't keep up anymore. So the point is, we have resources. It's not true that we don't have
23:06resources because look at the money. Money is very much going to very small, very big pockets of very
23:14small amount of people. So the point is, are we strong enough to take resources from who has the
23:20resources? Because billionaires, because huge profits are increasing and increasing and increasing.
23:26These equalities are increasing and increasing. What we are telling to the people that now cannot
23:30afford to pay for the shop, for the grocery, we are telling them, sorry, let's make them richer,
23:37the 1% of the population, the 0.1% of the population richer. So maybe at some point with
23:42the tickle
23:43down, we all be richer. We say that's this for a century now. And what is happening is that inequalities
23:48are just increasing and people are worse. So maybe now it's time to say to the people,
23:54so then to 99%, sorry, we were wrong. We want to take the money from the smallest part of the
24:00population that has the billions, from the huge profits of who is actually damaging our planet.
24:05In that situation that you just described, sorry, in that situation that you just described,
24:10it makes it even tougher to increase defense and military spending. How do we reconcile this?
24:17I think we need to look at security as a broader thing when we talk about security. And one of
24:24the
24:24problems of the politics today in Europe and in many of our member states is that we look at
24:29security only as weapons. And if we think that we're going to be more secure just buying more
24:35weapons, then this is not the answer. We need to look at security as resilience. We need to look at
24:41security as digital cyber security. And I think these days are really telling us this. We need to look at
24:46security also as security from climate events. Like security is really a broader concept.
24:51And we need to increase our budget to be able to spend money on security as a broader content
24:58and on all the other priorities, because they are also extremely important. And the survey showed it.
25:03We cannot take from one to give to the other because that will not work.
25:07Okay. Marcus, I'll give you the floor once we've reached the next round, as it's time to move on
25:13and go to round number four.
25:20And this brings us to our quote of the week today from the EU Commissioner for Economy and Productivity,
25:26Valdis Dombrovskis. He said recently, and I quote,
25:29In 2027, we will go further in tackling unnecessary burdens and addressing implementation gaps in areas such as
25:38transport, housing and digital and accelerating permitting. Our goal is clear, less red tape
25:44and complexity for citizens and more scope for businesses to invest, innovate and grow.
25:51Marcus, you've heard the commissioner. Do you agree with him?
25:55Yes, it's the right agenda, because as we have a lack of investment, as we have a lack of productivity
26:02growth,
26:03we have to invest in the new technologies. And of course, we have to invest in decarbonisation.
26:08That's why energy is key. If you want to decarbonise by electrification and you want to have investments
26:15in AI, for example, you need more electricity than in the past. And we don't have that at the moment.
26:21And we have to do it sustainable. So therefore, huge investments are needed and possibilities to do
26:28the investments. And that's why bureaucratic burden are one of the key elements we are confronted with
26:33on European level. And there we have to find a solution, but as well on member states, on regional
26:38level, because at the end for the entrepreneurs, for the local authorities, it's a huge bulk of
26:45bureaucracy burdens coming from each political level. So we have to deliver, but member states and regions as well.
26:51Where do you draw the line between deregulation and sort of less spending,
26:58less benefits for, you know, people like families, the people who benefit from the current?
27:06Deregulation, maybe the wrong word is simplification, make it easier, make it simpler, not make it less
27:13burdensome in the sense of misusing nature, misusing water, misusing animal protection,
27:20biodiversity or whatever, even social systems. So simplification is the right answer. And that is
27:26one of the key problems. Inside the commission, you have silos of different general directories,
27:32who do not know what the other is doing. But at the end, all this stuff comes to the people,
27:36comes to the local authorities, comes to the entrepreneurs, and to get rid of these things,
27:42to achieve the main goals, but to simplify it. I think that is a key element. And the other thing
27:48is,
27:48of course, to create an environment where foreign investments will take place in the European Union
27:53as well. There we have really a lack, and that is what we have to address.
27:57Okay. Bernetta, simplification, as Marco said, is that a concept you could adhere to?
28:03Absolutely. When simplification is simplification, we are all in as Greens. We want to be faster on
28:10the transition, but we need to be knowing where we're going, so not to step backwards into our goals,
28:16because it's important also for investments, not just to simplify, but to give a clear direction,
28:22which now is a bit unsure in this European Union. We need to simplify the bureaucratic processes,
28:28and we need to simplify, more than simplify, to make efficient and more united what the commission
28:34is doing and what the territories are doing. What I'm wondering, though, is that why EPP is not
28:40doing this? Because you're running the European Commission. You're running the parliament. I mean,
28:45the EPP has had the president of the commission for the last seven years and a half now. And in
28:51this
28:51parliament, you're the biggest group. So why is this not happening? Why the commission has not
28:56reformed? Because actually, the commission now is even more divided into silos. It's even more
29:00complicated. Why are you not talking more with the territories? Why there's not more efficiencies?
29:05Like, I am wondering why this is not happening already, because we are all agreeing. The problem is
29:10that sometimes, behind the simplification, there's no difference in the bureaucratic process,
29:16but there's a lot of difference in the rules. And who is paying the price is local communities
29:20and nature. And this is the problem. Yeah. Sorry, it's not the EPP problem, to be very clear.
29:25It's a problem of the institution itself. Even in the parliament, you are sitting in the E3,
29:29I'm sitting in the Econ. When have we negotiated something? Although we are dealing with round about
29:34the same things. Yeah. We do macroeconomic tools, you do industry policy, but there's a lot of
29:40interlinkage. We never discuss it. You make your legislation. The competitiveness fund,
29:44for example, Econ is fully out. Although there are a lot of things, state aid rules,
29:48we are responsible. Competition rules, we are responsible. Tax rules, we are responsible.
29:53You don't take care. So don't blame EPP. It's a system problem, which you are not addressing,
29:58because you are misusing the system. That is what the Greens are doing. You live with this system,
30:03because you can develop things which are really harming us. Do no significant harm. It's harming
30:09us. It's harming investments. You invented it and brought it to all committees and to all realities.
30:14The question is, how do we get out of this? That's a problem. It's not EPP. It's the Greens who
30:18disturb it. You both describe the same problem, maybe from a different perspective. So my question is,
30:22how do we get out of this? How do we get out of a system that you describe as way
30:26too cumbersome,
30:27too bureaucratic and to the detriment of the people? I think Europe should focus on the main
30:35issues which really are European issues and not a Christmas tree with promises to everyone and
30:42everything, because we have local authorities with their responsibility. I come from a federal,
30:47state, regional authorities with their competences, the national level and the European level. If we
30:52focus on the really big things on European level, we will have the support by the citizens,
30:57and we will be able to deliver what is really demanded. So Parliament and Council are co-legislators,
31:04right? What happens if MEPs refuse to dilute legislation that the Commission wants to simplify?
31:13First of all, let me thank Marcus for the esteem he has in the Greens. We are the third smallest
31:22group in
31:22Parliament and we are managing to decide the agenda of the whole European Union. This is incredible.
31:29It's an incredible result. I am so amazed to be part of this group. You know, like they are the
31:35biggest
31:35party in the Parliament. They have the majority of the government and they have the president of the
31:40Commission. But who is harming Europe is the decision of the Greens that are setting the agenda.
31:45This is an incredible achievement. But that is what happened in the last period with the majority,
31:49the Socialists, Renew and Communists. Sorry, that is what you did. That is what you did to
31:54deforestation with five votes ahead. The not significant harm is an incredibly important
32:00principle that I thank the Greens. If it's really because of the Greens, I thank the Greens to
32:05excess, not because I'm part of it, but because it's an incredibly important principle that I'm
32:10sorry, but was taken on also from your president of the Commission. I want to remember it's an EPP from
32:15Germany and she wanted it in. So, and this is actually supporting nature, supporting the people,
32:21because it's saying, how can you say, do not do anything and harm me, it's harming us. If it's
32:26harming, you should not do it. And that is the basis of the principle. You brought it in with five
32:31votes,
32:32majority in this period. Sorry. Guys, I think there's disagreement, fair enough, right, on this point.
32:40And I thank you for that. On that note, we can close this point as it is time to move
32:44on to our fifth and final round.
32:50As we want to do something different, I'm going to ask you a set of questions and you can only
32:57answer with a yes or no. Okay. So, has the political center lost control of the political agenda,
33:06the European agenda to the far right and the populists? Yes.
33:13Markus? No, of course not. Okay. Should defense spending take priority over climate spending?
33:21That's not the issue. Sorry. Climate spending is a European responsibility. Defense, for the moment,
33:27is a national one. Yes, but now we have a defense commissioner and somebody in general.
33:31Yeah. In general, it's not so easy to answer as we don't have European projects. I would love to have
33:35European projects to finance, not to finance national budgets. Okay. So, in that case,
33:40we are responsible for climate, not for defense. Okay. Actually, we have the ECF,
33:46the majority of it is going into defense and a minority is going for climate. So, we have already
33:50the answer where the direction is going. And I would say no, it should not take over the climate. Okay,
33:57good. Next one. Does Europe need a bigger EU budget? Absolutely, yes. No more focused. Okay.
34:05Should the EU abandon its 2040 climate ambitions if they undermine competitiveness?
34:13Absolutely, no. We have to achieve both, yes. Should member states be allowed to run bigger deficits
34:19to invest in defense? No. Defense, no. Okay. Climate protection, no as well. Is common European debt
34:29necessary? Absolutely, yes. No. It transfers only the cost to another source which is not able to pay.
34:37Okay. Should agricultural subsidies be cut to finance European security? Only a little bit.
34:43I don't think, no. And last one. Is the EU doing enough to convince younger Europeans that the European
34:51project offers them a better future? Unfortunately, no at the moment. I think the EU is really pro-European
34:59and we should help them to continue being so. Okay. On that note, thank you very much. And that brings
35:06us
35:06to the end of this strong edition of The Ring. Thanks again to Benedetta Scuderi and Marcus Febber for a
35:13lively conversation here from the European Parliament. Thanks to our audience at home. If you like,
35:19you can continue the conversation by sending us your comments to thering at euronews.com. We'd love to
35:26have your feedback. That's it for today. I'm Stefan Grobe. Take care and see you soon here on Euronews.

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