00:00You have talked about at times having a complicated relationship with your brother, your father.
00:06Is that something that you agree?
00:12Yeah, yes, of course. I think from a family perspective,
00:16again, another massively relatable issue for so many people. People, you know, there's sibling
00:23disagreements. There's broken relationships between, you know, kids and their parents,
00:30kids and one parent. That continues to come up with me the whole time by people that I speak to.
00:36I'm sure.
00:37So I know how relatable it is. That's probably why there's so much fascination in the-
00:41Everybody's family.
00:43Of everyone's family. And then people maybe look at us and go, how are you going to work it out?
00:46And then maybe how I see you're going to work it out, maybe that will help me work my stuff
00:50out.
00:51And some people don't want-
00:51How are you going to work it out?
00:52Well, some people don't want it to work out. I want it to work out.
00:55You do?
00:55Of course I do.
00:56Yeah.
00:57There's no-
00:57Again, with everything else that's going on in the world, the most important thing is to,
01:00is, you know, is to reconcile. That's the key point.
01:04Well, so much of the class two is about this idea of repair, right? Like that grief is, is
01:10not an inevitable fact. It's something that can be repaired. And so like the follow up to that would
01:14be, you know, is this, is this wound something that you think you can repair?
01:17Yeah, of course. I think every- Look, scars, scars stick around forever.
01:22But how you, how, what your perception is and what your mindset is to those things that have
01:28happened. Certainly letting go of the past, that's something that I would encourage everybody to do.
01:35If there's certain things from the past that are still affecting your everyday,
01:39that's harder to let go of. But you know, I've, for me, it's, um, there's enough drama in the world
01:45and enough drama in, in, in people's lives, um, than to continue with issues with, with family.
01:54You know?
01:54It's just like not, it's not worth it.
01:57That's hard to say to people when you're in it.
02:00Yeah.
02:00Yeah.
02:01Yeah.
02:01I mean, are you on good terms with everyone in your family? Maybe you're, um,
02:08maybe, maybe you're not, but this is the first time you're about to share that you're not.
02:11And then suddenly realized, but I thought we were on good terms.
02:14Well, now I feel like the way you feel where I'm just watching them watch this and be like,
02:17is he going to talk about me? Um, I, I would say generally, yes. You know, I mean, I think
02:22the thing,
02:22um, you asked about my family, uh, you didn't ask for this confidence, but I, I know your father's
02:31been sick. Mine, uh, was diagnosed with, uh, prostate cancer a few years ago. He's actually
02:35doing well, but another thing that watching your class made me think of is I've felt in moments
02:41almost in a kind of anticipatory grief, if that makes sense, you know, where you sort of start
02:47contemplating. I wonder if you felt something similar.
02:49Yeah. Uh, yes, I have. And I think that that is perhaps helpful because, but do you know what
03:00I mean? I think that, you know, again, it's the one thing that we are all going to experience,
03:04which is the loss of a parent, both parents and the loss of friends. That's universal. It is universal.
03:11Well, you, you've done a lot of chattel work and I think a lot of thinking about PTSI.
03:18Mm-hmm. Thanks for referring to it as PTSI.
03:21Right. Because yes, instead of PTSD. I would think having suffered the traumatic
03:28death of a parent that something like this could be very triggering in that respect.
03:33What? Having a sick, sick parent now.
03:36Um, yes, but he's, you know, he's getting better.
03:41Yeah. Um, so yeah, it's, it, there's a, I think there's a big difference between losing
03:47one parent and losing two from the, from the friends of mine that have lost two, they go,
03:51well, now I'm an orphan, even if you're in your forties or fifties.
03:54Yeah.
03:54So it's an interest that I'd never heard someone say that to me before. I was like, wow,
03:57I hadn't, I hadn't considered that. Um, but then also I've always thought to myself since I was a
04:02young kid and conversations with other friends of mine, which is if you had a choice, what would you
04:10choose? To have a parent ripped away from you suddenly without any preparation
04:18or having the longterm suffering, but the ability to say goodbye. And it turns out that there, that,
04:24I want to know your answer.
04:26There is, there is no answer because, um, you know, I've got friends and family who are suffering
04:34from cancer. I've had a, a mom that was taken away from me too soon. And I speak,
04:38I've spoken very openly about one of my biggest regrets is that last phone call I had with her.
04:44Um, if I'd known it was the last call with her, how different that conversation would be.
04:50And I'm the one that has to, has to live with that. And the fact that as a 12 year
04:54old kid,
04:54all I wanted to do was go off and run and play with my cousins.
04:57And you have to, you have to know that you have to know that, especially as a parent yourself now,
05:02of course, of course. But before I was a parent, that was the sort of
05:08bit of guilt and stuff that just really stuck with me. It was like heavy.
05:12And, and then, yeah, when you become a parent, it, it, yeah, of course it changes things.
05:17Yes. Yes.
05:18I mean, I haven't even asked you, like when it comes to grief and loss,
05:23what is your experience of this?
05:25I have a surreal experience. It's sort of what I was alluding to earlier, which is that both of my
05:29parents have had relatively bad forms of cancer that they both have survived. So I've had the
05:36anticipatory grief and I have many friends who have lost one or both parents. In fact, I had a
05:42conversation with my father, but he was sort of preparing me for his death, if we're being honest
05:46with each other. And I kind of was like, I haven't experienced this, but I, I barely have a friend
05:53who, who hasn't, like, you don't have to tell me that this is going to happen.
05:56Yeah.
05:58But also I, I sit here knowing that I do not know what is coming and I cannot be ready
06:03for it.
06:05How, how would you, how would you prepare yourself for it?
06:11I mean, did, did watching the class, did it, does that help?
06:15Of course it helps. I mean, I think you in general sharing your story helps.
06:19Well, anyone sharing their story should help.
06:21Yes. That's, that's the point of it.
06:22Yes. Um, well there, I have a journalist mind. So there's a, there's a certain like
06:28vividness to the, the version of it that you experienced, which is easy for me to wrap my,
06:32not easy for me to wrap my head around, but there's, I mean, how many books have been written
06:37about this? It's literally, it's literally narratively sort of out there. Um, but also,
06:42yeah, the way that, how many books have been read about what grief?
06:45No, about, uh, your family and your mother.
06:47Oh yeah. I mean, thousands.
06:49Yeah. I wrote one, but they all wrote thousands.
06:52Yeah. Well, I was going to ask you about this too, because I feel like that you make stuff.
06:56I, I, I, you know, like, I, I feel like I don't, I, I'm not a royal family expert,
07:00but I, it's not character.
07:02You look like you are, you're wearing a blazer. I mean, it's half the whole, you know.
07:05Let me in. Um, uh, it, it feels like the way that you, you know, you wrote this book,
07:13you made this masterclass, you, you, when you guys came to California, you, you know,
07:17you were, you were doing Hollywood stuff and production stuff and, uh,
07:23but that's not kind of like common for your family, right?
07:27To make stuff.
07:28Yeah.
07:28But it's storytelling.
07:29Yeah.
07:29You know, it's, it's, it's being in certain situations and, and being able to
07:36use and yeah, use creatively the platforms that are available to be able to share stories.
07:41So like my whole life, my whole background is charity.
07:44Yes.
07:45And what I realized very quickly when I moved over here was
07:49charity is so much at the downstream end.
07:53Yeah.
07:53What can I do with my life that is more upstream?
07:58That's, it's not about putting charity out of business,
08:01but, but if, if the problem now exists and it's so big that it needs charitable support,
08:08then what can you do other than put a, put a, a plaster or a bandaid on it?
08:13Yeah.
08:13So, you know, my work with better up for instance, online coaching platform was really focused on
08:18the upstream. Like if we can, you know, democratize and basically get as much coaching
08:22out there as possible from everyone, from the CEO to the janitor in these large corporations,
08:27large businesses, then hopefully they won't, won't be in the situation that I was,
08:31which is lying on the floor in the fetal position in your kitchen.
08:34Which is the thing that happened,
08:35which is, which is the thing that happens for so many people.
08:38Well, I'm asking about you though.
08:39Yeah. That's, that's, that's, that's a reality.
08:41Yeah.
08:41Right. It's just interesting how life, you know, pans out. It was like, wow.
