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05:07και η δημιουργία της δημιουργίας χρειάζεται η δημιουργία για να προσθέσεις.
05:13Και τι θα πάρει, θα θα πάρει πολύ χρόνο γιατί τώρα η Ελλάδα δεν μπορούσε να αποτελεί τελευταία τελευταία τελευταία
05:22τελευταία τελευταία τελευταία.
05:25Βτ勾, νό cardiacωσтом, με σά 있으τε μέσαρίων μητέρωνσι ΣΥΕ.
05:39Δεν έχουμε αντιμετωπίушνει αλλά στην ιστολία των ρ saltτζατών έтрjeες τελευταίες τελευταία τελευταία τελευταία τελευταία,
05:47το πολ flagsιο και αυτή η μητέρ του chief του τελευταία τελευταία.
05:51και στις πραγματικές δυνατότητες,
05:52είναι το πόδι.
05:55Μουσική είναι το πρόβλημα της πολιτικής.
05:57Μουσική είναι να εφηγήσει τίποτα μόνο,
06:01προς την εξωτερία μόνοιμότητα μόνοι και διπλωματικά διαδικές.
06:06Μουσική δεν έχω όσομαζει το πόρμα της δυπλωμάτιας.
06:10Πρέπει να δείξει και να πω πραγματικά.
06:13Και, γιατί με το είδη,
06:15με την εβδότηση της γερμανικής κλπ.
06:16που βλέπει με την συνδέα με τον συμπέντρο,
06:18Ευχαριστώ πολύ.
06:19Εντρία, δεν βρίζαμε καλύτερα.
06:20Δεν άνθησα εγγύρια προκράταση.
06:22Ωραία, διεύγια φίλια, θα ήταν υποίηστημα δημόσια προκράτησης.
06:29Ευχαριστώ ότι η συμφωνία συνέχεια στιγμή δημόσια στο λεγό.
06:31Στον τόσο διαφορά το κόσμος που δίνουν δημόσια,
06:34μαζί να δημόσια κοινωνία,
06:35παιδί δικασία, που θα πηγήσουν να βλέπουν πολύ.
06:36Θα ήξερα τους πρέπει να πάρει.
06:37Μπορείς να πάρει κανείς.
06:39Πρόκειται και πώς πρέπει να πάρει...
06:40πρέπει να πείξει την πρόκληση του Ραλόγου.
06:47Μπορεί να πω να πάρει πέραστημα για το Ραλόγου.
06:51Πρέπει να ξεκινήσουμε πράγματα για το Ραλόγου.
06:55Πρέπει να μιλάω να αισθάνεται από τη δυνατότητα.
07:01Υπότιτλοι AUTHORWAVE
07:28να μην μας δώσετε όταν δώση για να μην μας ευκολεύει να δώσει την κοινωνία του αλλού.
07:32Οπομένου είναι ότι δεν είναι μηχανείς τη σκέση για την νοικορία.
07:38Δεν υπάρχει το αντίστολισμα.
07:41Μπορείς, μάτω.
07:42Λοιπόν, δεν ξέρω.
07:43Νομίζω, αλλά πως είναι ένα σκέση.
07:45Όλοι μας, μιλάμε για τον κοινωνική warfight.
07:49Τι μιλάμε για τον κοινωνία της κοινωνίας,
07:52παύχαμε να δείχνουμε...
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08:57I guess that if there is a war between Europe and Russia,
09:03this war will be totally different and very short.
09:08That was the warning.
09:09This is a threat.
09:10I don't accept this type of speaking, but they speak this.
09:14So you condemn it.
09:15You condemn that statement.
09:16You want to listen to this.
09:18No, I just wonder, when you hear that statement, what would you say?
09:20You say, I don't accept this.
09:21I say that...
09:23You're condemning those statements.
09:24I say that there is a nuclear card.
09:28And when Russia, when Putin feels strong, he doesn't speak about this.
09:35When Russia feels weak, that happened in this war about some years ago,
09:39they start playing again with the nuclear card.
09:44So just I'm reminding that we need to have this into account.
09:50We cannot close our eyes that there are nuclear weapons on our continent,
09:57there are nuclear weapons in the arsenal of Russia,
10:02and this is part of the game calculation.
10:07And my appeal is that no one is speaking about this.
10:11No one is taking account of this risk.
10:16We have multiple analysts here who said they really believe to that extent
10:21it's a card that is played politically because the Russians think,
10:24or seem to think, weak leaders will get scared by it.
10:29You disagree.
10:30That's clear.
10:31Let's look at the eastern flank.
10:33There's a perception that the security picture for the eastern flank,
10:37certainly for the Baltics and Poland,
10:39has deteriorated over the past few months.
10:42We've also seen the drone violations of the airspace.
10:45What happened at the German airport, Romania,
10:49we've seen constant drone violations, on and on and on and on.
10:53Is this now a time to rethink, if this is hybrid warfare,
10:57and I wonder if you use that word, warfare yourself,
11:00is this not a time for the Europeans to redefine
11:02what hybrid deterrence to this warfare should look like?
11:06You mentioned hybrid warfare with drones.
11:09And other types.
11:10And other types, of course.
11:12It is extremely difficult to counter these drones.
11:17Why?
11:17It is extremely difficult to detect them.
11:19They fly low.
11:21They use non-metal materials.
11:23It is extremely difficult to detect on the radars.
11:27So, if you apply anti-drone systems,
11:31they need to be very, very congested on your boiler.
11:35That means a lot, a lot, a huge number of such systems.
11:40And their integration, and this is a huge technical challenge to all of us.
11:45And that's why my call is to think about this balance,
11:50about different instruments of power,
11:52and to design, to formulate a feasible end state of this war.
11:58Because we have changed our desired end state about seven to eight times.
12:05I don't remember even the formulation of these end states from the beginning of the war.
12:11That position is still a minority in the European Council.
12:13You say it's very different or very difficult to intercept the drones,
12:17the constant violations that we're seeing repeatedly.
12:19Is it because the European and NATO leadership is weak,
12:22or is it because they're not sending the right message?
12:24If you escalate, so can we.
12:27So, what is your proposal?
12:28To send a very hard warning to Russia.
12:33I agree.
12:34Okay?
12:35What about escalation?
12:37So, you just accept they can do whatever they want.
12:39They can put explosives on an airport.
12:41They can...
12:42No.
12:42What's the alternative?
12:43No.
12:44My alternative is to open the lines of communication,
12:49to sit down and to discuss.
12:51This is my proposal.
12:53And sooner or later, it will be achieved.
12:58Again, it depends.
12:59This is a war of attrition.
13:01It reflects our economies.
13:02It reflects the price of the fuel, the price of the gas.
13:06It reflects the shortage of fuel and gas in the European Union as well.
13:12My question, however, on the money.
13:14You will have to be in a consensus question,
13:16both at NATO and at a European Union level.
13:20When you get told at NATO you have to pay 5%,
13:23you have to buy weapons that are still continue to be American.
13:27At the same time, we need to build our own European industry.
13:30How do you go about this?
13:32Because what I see from the outside is
13:36you pay for American weapons while trying to build your industry,
13:39while talking about Made in Europe.
13:40You praise your visit with Macron.
13:42But to me, these are two strategies that at some point
13:44it's difficult to keep them on one lane
13:46because they're quite contradictory.
13:48So, which one is it going to be?
13:49A Made in Europe preference or not?
13:51The problem is that the European defense industry is highly fragmented.
13:56And, of course, we need to strengthen our defense industries.
14:00Safe instrument is extremely good instrument.
14:03Bulgaria is a very active participant in this instrument.
14:06Would you want a round two?
14:07There's been debate that maybe if the first round was successful,
14:10there could be a second one.
14:11Yes, there could be.
14:12And this is the right approach to strengthen our industrial base,
14:17to work together, to communicate, to coordinate.
14:21And this is the future for Europe.
14:22But as the Prime Minister of Bulgaria, if you have to sign a contract
14:25and in the future you have two weapons that ultimately do the same job,
14:28one is European, one is made in the U.S.,
14:30would you say, of course we go for the European first?
14:34We need a European preference.
14:35Yes, of course.
14:36This is the part of the European strategic autonomy concept.
14:41And I fully agree that we have been working for this.
14:45We need to strengthen the European pillar of NATO
14:50because we need to take care about our defense capabilities.
14:55And we need to do it in a smart way.
14:58We cannot exclude the United States because the United States is a leader
15:03in defense technologies.
15:06We need to cooperate.
15:07But, of course, we need to protect our defense industries.
15:11Otherwise, they will disappear.
15:12And for made in Europe, is it the right way to put this in writing?
15:17Do we need those percentages?
15:19Do we need that made in Europe?
15:22By law, we need to operate like this.
15:24Otherwise, we continue our strategic dependencies on the U.S.
15:28Are you in favor of legislating in this way?
15:29We cannot immediately guarantee our security by ourselves.
15:36Even talking about the nuclear shield,
15:39we cannot go without the United States of America
15:42because they provide the essence of the core defense capabilities in NATO.
15:48It is absolutely clear.
15:51It will take time for us to recover,
15:55to renovate our industries,
15:57our industrial base,
15:59our technology development.
16:01Should Ukraine be a core part of it?
16:03We heard from the Ukrainians saying
16:04the Europeans will need us more than,
16:06at this point, we need them on the technology advancement.
16:08Should we get them in this context?
16:10Ukraine has been already a part of this.
16:12because many European defense industries have already invested.
16:18Look at Rheinmetall, look at other companies.
16:21They have presence, they have invested,
16:23they have developed strong industrial sites and presence in Ukraine.
16:28Ukraine has been sharing latest state-of-the-art drone technologies
16:34they have developed through experimenting them every day on the front line.
16:39So as an equal partner,
16:40anyway, the Ukrainians will say
16:42we will be joining the European Union.
16:43So this debate at some point.
16:46Of course, Western Balkans, Ukraine, Moldova,
16:52all of them, they have place
16:54and their future is full integration into the European family.
16:57This is obvious, this is of course.
16:59As a final question,
17:01when we hear NATO 3.0,
17:04the impression that I get,
17:06nobody will say publicly with these words,
17:08but ultimately it means that we are going to have to pay big time in NATO.
17:13We are going to still have to continue for or pay for those U.S. weapons.
17:16Otherwise, there will be a retaliation for the administration.
17:19But then we're going to have to do all the hard work of the soldiers,
17:23all the work that means real defense will be us.
17:27And ultimately, all that will be left
17:29is the U.S. nuclear umbrella
17:31that will protect the Europeans
17:34and still be there as a last resort in NATO.
17:37That is essentially what NATO 3.0 means for the Europeans.
17:40Is that how you see it too?
17:42You say you're not politically correct.
17:43You're not in the mainstream.
17:44So I'm sure you can speak freely on this.
17:46We, when we speak about NATO 3.0
17:50and the defense capabilities of Europe,
17:53we should put on the table economic part, social part.
17:59We should put tariffs on the table.
18:02We should put European cars,
18:05talking with our most important strategic ally,
18:08the United States.
18:09We should put, because when we speak about defense capabilities,
18:14it means technology and industrial development.
18:17It should not go just for military equipment.
18:20It should go for everything.
18:21We cooperate with the United States.
18:24So tariffs are part of this approach.
18:27And Europe should put everything on the table.
18:31Your analysis of NATO 3.0,
18:33I still didn't fully understand it,
18:35because you said we need to put our economic relationship
18:38and even tariffs.
18:39The only tariffs are senior.
18:40The Americans are European products.
18:42So by 15%, they tripled.
18:45And we pay more into NATO.
18:46I'm just wondering, from your military background,
18:49when you look at this NATO 3.0
18:51and you say this is the plan for the next 15 years,
18:53what does it look like?
18:54Do you have U.S. troops stationed in Europe, or you won't?
18:58I think we need also more effective diplomacy
19:04speaking with the United States.
19:05So to bring everything in one basket,
19:08because everything is strongly connected.
19:12We cannot separate defense industry from technology,
19:17from science, from human capital,
19:20from industrial base,
19:22and all the products with dual usage.
19:26And they mix, especially in AI.
19:28and we are lagging behind here in Europe in AI.
19:31We should cooperate more strongly with the United States
19:37about AI,
19:39and we should go together as strategic allies and partners,
19:44because there are some other movements around the world
19:47in this direction as well.
19:49Well, Prime Minister, thank you so much for your time.
19:52You've been clearly very generous with your time,
19:53so thank you very much for joining us.
19:55Thanks.
