- 5 minutes ago
Lizzy McAlpine joins the Rolling Stone Studio at our New York office to break down her new album ‘Angel,’ meeting her hero Joni Mitchell, and making peace with her “Ceilings” days and early TikTok fame. She goes deep on her new songs, from collaborating with Fleet Foxes’ Robin Pecknold to crediting Nick Drake on “A Car Wash and a New Pair of Pants,” and discusses how her Broadway debut (in the 2025 production of 'Floyd Collins'), helped the album come to fruition. Watch the interview and dive into the making of ‘Angel.’
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00:00Your birthday is later this month. What are your plans?
00:02I am making all of my friends perform The Little Mermaid.
00:06Oh my god. How is that going to go down?
00:09Well, I'm giving them all script, I assigned them characters, and we're just going to go for it.
00:14I assigned the songs to people I knew could handle it, but I'm like,
00:17y'all need to learn your songs and show up correct.
00:25Hey everyone, I'm Angie Martosio, and we are at the Rolling Stone studio today
00:29with a very special guest. We have Lizzie McAlpine.
00:32Thank you so much for being here.
00:34Thanks for having me.
00:35You are gearing up to release Angel. It's your new album, your fourth.
00:40But before we dive into that, I want to talk about Last Night,
00:43because you just performed in Williamsburg and Brooklyn, the entire album all the way through.
00:48What was that like for you?
00:49It is really fun and also very nerve-wracking.
00:53Playing new songs that no one has ever heard is like, it really gives me like an adrenaline rush.
01:00So it makes me really nervous.
01:03But it was really fun, and the crowd was super welcoming.
01:06What is it like to watch fans' faces like hearing these songs for the first time?
01:10Because you've been sitting with these songs for quite some time, but they haven't heard them yet.
01:14Well, I don't really look at their faces.
01:18Honestly, if I watch people having a reaction to the songs, I will start to cry.
01:25It's just this music means so much to me.
01:27This is kind of true for everything, but this album in particular feels really potent for some reason.
01:33And so I can't really focus in on the emotions that they are feeling,
01:38because I just will start to feel those emotions as well.
01:43Like, I don't know, I'm really sensitive and also very empathetic.
01:47So, and also this music means a lot to me.
01:49Can you tell me a little bit about the title and how it all kind of came together?
01:53This was like the second song I wrote for the album, I think, Angel.
01:57And I was kind of unsure where it should go in the track list for a while.
02:03And at the very end, it landed at the bottom.
02:06But the song itself is about starting to see someone new and like feeling like it's an opening up and
02:13it's like a healing time.
02:14And then I wrote the whole song and then I couldn't figure out how to end the song.
02:18And then I went to therapy and I was talking to her about it and just like all the feelings
02:24I was feeling at that time.
02:25And then I hung up and I wrote the last verse, which is about seeing myself as the angel.
02:33Like the whole song is like talking about my, this partner that I was with being the angel.
02:39And the end is me realizing that it's also me and I'm looking in the mirror at myself.
02:44And just the last line of that song feels like the thesis statement of the record.
02:48I have always been here waiting just to be.
02:52So it just felt right to name, to name the record that.
02:56Yeah. And let's talk about the literal painting that makes up the cover.
02:59What is that of? Tell me about it.
03:01It's really up to interpretation.
03:02We found this artist online.
03:05Her name is Tidy and she, we sent her the album and she listened to it and she painted this
03:10beautiful abstract piece.
03:12And I just loved her work so much and it felt so thoughtful and emotional, even though you can't really
03:20pin down, like, it's not a painting of a specific thing.
03:25It's just a painting of a feeling, which is what I really loved about her work and what I wanted
03:29for this cover in particular.
03:31Because I didn't feel like I could pin it down with just one image of one thing.
03:35Were you sure right away, like, that you didn't want yourself on the cover?
03:37I think so, yeah.
03:38This one in particular felt more nuanced than that and it didn't really feel like that would have been correct,
03:45like, spiritually.
03:46When you say seeing yourself for the first time, like, very clearly, would you say that's, like, the theme of
03:50the record?
03:50I think so.
03:51I think the theme is just healing and growth and coming back to center and, like, finding myself again and,
04:01like, learning to spend time with myself and enjoy it.
04:04Yeah, the record kicks off with the light in the painting, which is such an amazing way to kick off
04:11the whole vibe.
04:12Tell me about writing that one.
04:13I think you were in San Francisco.
04:15Yeah, I was backstage on tour.
04:17The first voice memo I have of, like, writing this song, I'm signing things.
04:22You can, like, hear me signing posters and then, like, I'm humming, trying to figure out the melody at the
04:27same time.
04:28And then, like, my tour manager comes in the room and I stop the voice memo, like, it was very
04:32much, like, on the fly.
04:34But that's kind of how a lot of these songs happen.
04:37I just, like, have the idea and I need to get it out.
04:39You said it was inspired by a Crosby, Stills & Nash song?
04:42Yes.
04:42Lady of the Island.
04:44My lady of the island.
04:49I love that song.
04:50Me too.
04:51Not just because I'm a gram girl, but really because I feel like Our House kind of overshadows that one.
04:57Like, it's another Joanie song about loving her, but it's not talked about enough.
05:01I know.
05:01It's so beautiful.
05:02The first time I heard it, I was like, this is the most magical song.
05:06It's just such a, it creates such a world.
05:10You co-produced this album alongside your very long-time collaborators, Mason Stoops and Taylor Mackle.
05:16I love them so much.
05:18We made Older together and then we made Older and Wiser.
05:20And that record was very focused on, like, the band aspect of it.
05:25So that was me and Mason co-producing, but also it felt very much like a band vibe.
05:31This record, we decided to just have it start with the three of us because that felt like the core
05:39of the songs and the record.
05:41And then we just kind of built on top of that and brought people in when needed.
05:44Is it correct to say that Mason's song is about Mason?
05:47Yeah.
05:48Tell me about writing that one and what was his reaction to it?
05:50We actually finished it together because I wrote, like, the first verse.
05:54I was struggling with the chorus.
05:55I brought it in and then Taylor and Mason and I finished it together and we literally both, like, couldn't
06:01stop crying.
06:01I just wanted to write about, like, friendship.
06:06I feel like I don't hear too many songs, like, about that.
06:11Mason's friendship in particular is just so special to me and I feel like we were siblings in a past
06:16life.
06:17I feel like we were, like, meant to be in each other's lives and make music together.
06:22And it's just something that feels so natural and right.
06:25And I just, like, wanted to write about it.
06:27I read that there's a lot of 70s folk inspiration.
06:30Can you tell me about which artists aside from Crosby, Stills, and Ash?
06:33Definitely Joni.
06:34Yeah.
06:35Lots of Joni.
06:36I was listening to a lot of Hajira.
06:37Okay, this is great that you pointed this out.
06:39I think it's Our Strange Ways sounds very much like Amelia in the best way.
06:43Oh, yes.
06:44The way it opens, I was like, what is this reminding me of?
06:47Hajira is obviously a classic.
06:48One of my favorites from her and just in general also.
06:51I see something of myself in everyone.
06:56And who else?
06:57Let's see, Joni.
06:58A lot of Nick Drake, Car Wash, and A New Pair of Pants is...
07:02So I wrote that song and then I played it for my friend and he was like,
07:06this sounds, like, so similar to this Nick Drake song.
07:09And I was like, oh, no.
07:11And I listened to it and I was like, it's in the same key.
07:14The intro progression, core progression is, like, basically the same.
07:16They feel like sister songs to me.
07:18And I was like, wow, I really, like, tapped into something that...
07:22Because I'd never heard that song when I wrote Car Wash.
07:25Never.
07:26Oh, my God.
07:26That's incredible.
07:27And I was like, wow, I really tapped into something there.
07:29And so we reached out to his estate and I was just like, his music inspires me so much.
07:35And so now his name is next to mine in the credits, which is just, like, so surreal and I'm
07:41so honored.
07:42That's incredible that you hadn't heard that song.
07:44I know, it's really wild.
07:45I mean, obviously, I know why, because Pink Moon, it's not on Pink Moon, it's brighter later.
07:50And it's not really the one that everyone talks about.
07:53But his sister runs the estate and she, I've spoken to her and she just loves to hear how much
08:00people love her brother's music.
08:01And then Soldier of the Road.
08:04Let's talk about that because Robin Pecknell is on that.
08:07How did that happen?
08:08Such a beautiful song.
08:09And it's a great centerpiece.
08:11He's just amazing.
08:12I have been a fan of Fleet Foxes for a minute now.
08:14And Taylor actually played with Robin at the Joni Jam.
08:18They did.
08:19They did.
08:19They played at the Hollywood Bowl together with Joni, which is just insane.
08:22They were friends.
08:23And then I think it was Taylor's idea to have him sing on this song.
08:27And he just put us in a group chat.
08:29I sent him the song and I was like, we would love if you could come and sing on this.
08:32And he was like, I'm so down.
08:33I'll be there.
08:34You also met Joni, right?
08:35There's like a photo.
08:36Yes.
08:36What was that like?
08:37Oh, my God.
08:37So briefly.
08:38I think I've honestly blacked out because we were on tour in Europe when the Hollywood Bowl happened.
08:44And so Taylor brought me to a production rehearsal before we left.
08:48So I could like at least see a little bit of it.
08:50And I mean, it was insane just sitting like 10 feet from her watching her sing.
08:55I was like full body chills, almost in tears like the whole time, pretty much.
08:59I honestly don't even remember what I said.
09:01I think I was just like, I love your music so much.
09:04I'm so inspired by you.
09:05And Brandy Carlile was there and she was like, Lizzie is amazing.
09:08I was like, oh, God.
09:09It was really crazy.
09:11It must be like insane.
09:12Just her presence in general.
09:14I know.
09:14She just sat in her gold throne with a glass of wine.
09:17The throne is crazy.
09:18She was just like with her cane.
09:20I was like, yes, queen.
09:21In terms of Soldier of the Road, what is your relationship like with touring now?
09:26It definitely has gotten better.
09:28Okay.
09:28Because I feel like my team knows me so well at this point.
09:31And we have really worked very hard to make touring an enjoyable or more enjoyable experience for me.
09:38Just because it's so taxing on like the body and the mind and everything to be moving constantly.
09:46And to play a show for me is like so much energy I have to exert.
09:51So it definitely is easier now.
09:53But it's also still hard.
09:56And I think it will always be hard.
09:58It's just like how to make the percentage more fun.
10:03I mean, even before this interview started, I was like, what's your schedule like this week?
10:07Because like I even feel that we're like, for me, I want things to be spread out.
10:10I want to know what's expected, what time it is, like just to be my best self, I guess.
10:16And I can't even imagine what it's like to just go from place to place.
10:19It's tough to not feel grounded.
10:21But last night you had a phone free crowd.
10:24Is that right?
10:25Yeah.
10:25What is it like as a performer?
10:28It's very fun and kind of freeing in a way, because I was like telling stories in between each song
10:34and I was like messing up.
10:36And I was like, thank God no one is recording this right now.
10:38Like it was very much like I could just be myself.
10:43Are you going to be on tour behind this album?
10:46Maybe.
10:46Yeah.
10:47Well, if you do tour behind the album, would you also do the same thing of phone free?
10:52Probably not.
10:53Okay.
10:53For the tour, I think it will, they'll be able to have their phones.
10:58Because also I do think that being able to capture the memory of being there and having videos to look
11:08back on and rewatch.
11:10And I think that's also a big part and a special part of touring, of going to see a show
11:15for a fan.
11:17So I want them to have that experience as well.
11:19What is it like to play the album all the way through?
11:22I like being able to feel the rhythm of the record, the way that it flows from the beginning to
11:32end.
11:33It just like, I feel affirmed in my track list order decision.
11:36Yeah, totally.
11:37Because I'm like, it just, it feels so good to play it from front to back.
11:40Would you say that this is your favorite record you've made?
11:42I feel like if it wasn't, then we would probably have a problem.
11:46Because I'm like, every record that I make, I hope is my favorite record.
11:50Right.
11:50I always want to be growing and changing and getting better.
11:54But yeah, I think this is definitely my favorite.
11:57I think it's so layered and like complex.
12:00And it's, I felt like older was the foundation.
12:04It was kind of a reset for me of like figuring out who I wanted to be.
12:08And as an artist and as a musician, this album is kind of building off of that.
12:13So I feel like it kind of combines my first three records together and has a bit of everything in
12:19it.
12:19How long did it take overall to make this album?
12:21I wrote it over maybe like two years.
12:25We started producing in the middle of that.
12:27And then I was kind of still writing.
12:29Are you able to write on the road?
12:30Are you constantly working on things?
12:32Or is it very much like start and stop?
12:33I mean, usually when I was touring before older, I was never able to write.
12:39I was like so exhausted.
12:40I had nothing.
12:41Because the way we were touring back then was so like, this is the way that everyone does it.
12:45And I was having a really hard time with that schedule.
12:48And so I had no extra energy whatsoever.
12:50I didn't really even have energy to be playing the shows.
12:52But I was anyway.
12:54So that was depleting me even further.
12:55But on the older tour, I feel like we really cracked the code and we spread it out a lot.
13:00So I wrote a bunch of songs on tour.
13:03You described older as like pretty sad when you were doing those interviews.
13:07But reading back at those, how do you feel about this record?
13:10This record feels like really hopeful to me.
13:13Writing this record, I was going through a lot of change.
13:17And I think that's really the theme is just change for the better and feeling hopeful about the future.
13:28I want to know your take on the sad girl music genre.
13:32I feel like I definitely have been looped into that genre.
13:37I mean, and granted, like a lot of my songs that I write are sad, but I really don't know.
13:42I don't think about it that often because also like it has been apparent now, like releasing Light in the
13:47Painting first and that truly not being a sad song in any way, shape or form.
13:51And people being like, whoa, this is crazy coming from Lizzie because, you know, she only writes sad songs.
13:58Yeah, there's like more.
14:00There are more things.
14:02I'm multifaceted.
14:03I contain multitudes, you know, like there's so many feelings that I maybe just haven't like experienced enough to write
14:11about them.
14:12I just feel like sometimes it reduces the artist because, as you said, like ugly things, you know, topically maybe
14:18about something sad, but like it's such a triumphant, like there's so much happiness in it.
14:23Yeah, yeah, yeah.
14:23And it's something you can like dance around to.
14:26So like I would never describe it as sad.
14:28It's always more nuanced than just like sad music.
14:31What I love about so much of your music and some of your songs is that you kind of will
14:36start slower tempo and then it kind of builds to this beautiful climax.
14:41Is that something that you consciously do or it just happens that way?
14:44I bring the songs in and we just listen and then we go based off of our gut instincts.
14:50It's really like let the song tell us what it needs and then we do it.
14:54I'm never like, well, the album already has like something like this, so we should make something like this.
14:58It's more like the songs are the songs and then by nature of the way that we work and the
15:06things that we like and our instincts, the songs will transform into an album that makes sense together, even if
15:11the songs don't necessarily sound the same.
15:14Are you ever like consciously aware of how something will be perceived or are you able to just kind of
15:19like separate all of that and make your art?
15:21I don't think it helps the process in any way to think about that stuff.
15:24How do you decide what you want to keep private in your life and in your songs versus what you
15:30want to share with the world?
15:31I share a lot in my songs because I think that the more honest a song is, the more it
15:35will connect to people and the better a song it will be.
15:41But I feel like I've learned how to tow the line between like keeping some things for myself and then
15:48giving the fans a glimpse into my life because I never want to get to a place where I stop
15:55giving them anything.
15:56Yeah.
15:56Because I feel like that is when they disconnect and they're like, we can't emotionally like access this anymore.
16:04I also like the balance you strike because while you offer a glimpse, you can also leave listeners their own
16:09interpretation for their own lives.
16:11Yeah.
16:11What's your relationship like with social media now?
16:13I think I definitely like took a step back just from like posting all the time.
16:19I think I feel like I used to post a lot more and give people more of an insight into
16:23my life.
16:24And I feel like I'm at a point in my career now where that's OK.
16:27You recently made your Broadway debut in Floyd Collins, which was amazing.
16:33You manifested being basically like in theater, like you wanted this years ago.
16:37You were talking about it.
16:38Yes, I'm a theater kid.
16:39What was that like for you?
16:40Because it was really, really awesome to see.
16:43It was amazing.
16:44I had such an incredible time.
16:47It gave me so much confidence.
16:50And I really feel like I got my light back.
16:55That's how I felt when I came home.
16:56I was like, wow, I feel like a new person.
16:58What other Broadway plays would you want to be a part of?
17:02So many.
17:03I mean, my dream role that I say every time anyone asks me is next to normal.
17:10Natalie is just like my dream role of my life.
17:14That would be amazing.
17:15Spring Awakening would be amazing.
17:17Anything.
17:18I mean, I just love musical theater so much.
17:20And I'm waiting for the right thing to come along next.
17:24How is it being in New York for that?
17:25Because I know you're mostly in L.A.
17:27Yeah, it was great.
17:28I mean, I really lived like a monk while I was doing it.
17:31I did not leave my apartment for anything other than walking to the theater and walking
17:35home.
17:35But I kind of liked that.
17:36I liked locking in and on a routine and doing the same thing every day.
17:41I like that.
17:43It's really satisfying to me.
17:45I had a similar conversation earlier this summer with Sara Bareilles, and she was pretty open
17:51about the fact that she never wanted the trajectory of being like a pop star.
17:55Do you relate to that at all?
17:56Kind of, because I feel like initially in my career, I definitely was like, yeah, I want
18:03to be famous.
18:03And then when Ceilings went viral and I signed to RCA, and suddenly it was like, you can do
18:10all these things and you could definitely push your status up.
18:14And I was like, I don't want to do those things.
18:16Like, wait, hold on.
18:17What do I actually want?
18:18That's when I was making older and I was like, who am I?
18:23What do I want?
18:25And now I feel like I've settled on like, I don't really want to be famous.
18:31I don't want to be like a celebrity.
18:33I just love making music so much.
18:35It feels like what I was meant to do in this life.
18:39And I feel like I'm focusing on that.
18:45And if things happen because of that, and things definitely have happened because of
18:49that, that is amazing.
18:50And I'm so grateful.
18:51But it's really never my focus.
18:54And you were pretty open about the fact that when Ceilings blew up, that you wanted to be
18:58taken as like a serious artist.
19:00I was just feeling so impatient because I knew the things that I was making and the album we
19:06were making was so different from 5 Seconds Flat.
19:07And I was like, I know that this stuff is really amazing.
19:10Not that 5 Seconds Flat wasn't, but I was like, the stuff I'm making right now is so
19:14good.
19:14And I want people to know that like, that's also a part of me.
19:19Like, I can also do that stuff.
19:20And so having that music not be out yet and having to live in this in-between where like
19:27the only thing that people were really listening to was Ceilings and my older music that didn't
19:32really feel like me anymore.
19:34I wasn't resonating with it anymore.
19:35And to have that be like the focus when I was like, wait, no, like, that's not really
19:40who I feel like I am anymore.
19:41But now I feel like I have so much more grace for my older self and my older music.
19:47And I think at the time that Older came out, I was feeling really like, that's not who I
19:53am.
19:53And that's never who I was.
19:55And like, it was always like, just, you know, whatever.
19:57It was never real.
19:57I didn't, it was never real.
19:59And, and I think that was just coming from a place of like the reset of it all with older
20:03and like wanting to be taken seriously, I guess.
20:06And, and I listened to some of those interviews now and I'm like, girl, just calm down.
20:11Everything's okay.
20:12Like everything's fine.
20:13You also kind of had a right to be though, because you perform Ceilings and then you would
20:17talk about how crowds would leave.
20:19And that, that sucks.
20:20Like I would, I would be personally pissed by that.
20:22That, that was a crazy time when, when we were touring older and yeah, that, I didn't
20:29love that, but you know, we move.
20:34Do you think that, um, between Broadway and we're going to talk about this, but you just
20:38filmed a movie, like incredible.
20:40Do you need these other creative outlets that are, can you get something out of that that
20:44you can't get from making a song?
20:45Definitely.
20:46I think the whole reason why I wanted to do Broadway in the first place was because I was
20:50feeling so burnt out after making older, just because of like, it just took so much out
20:54of me.
20:55I wanted to fill one of my other cups.
20:57Like I have so many interests and acting has always been an interest of mine.
21:02And so I wanted to go do something that was completely different because I just like needed
21:07it.
21:07I was, I was going through it after we made older.
21:10And so it allows the music cup to refill.
21:15And so by the time I was finished with Broadway, I was like, I want to make music again.
21:18This is so much fun.
21:19And then making Angel was like so much fun.
21:21Let's talk about only what we carry because there's no lightweights in this, you know,
21:25it's like fun Tarantino, Simon Pegg.
21:27How did that happen?
21:29What was it like to do that for the first time?
21:31Well, I think the director, Jamie, just reached out because he was a fan of my music and he
21:35was like, would she want to do this?
21:36And I was like, what, what, what is this?
21:38It was like a six day shoot on the coast of France and it was all improv and there was
21:43no script.
21:44And I was like, what the heck?
21:45Like, I like to put myself in situations where I know I will be challenged because that's
21:51how you grow and learn.
21:54That's really what it was.
21:55I was like, I'm about to take an acting class pretty much.
21:58And I learned so much.
22:00And I, and Simon says something to me at the end, he was like, now the next time you do
22:04like a real movie, it's going to be so easy compared to this.
22:06I was like, you're probably right.
22:08I mean, you were thrown into it.
22:09It was crazy.
22:10That's why I like barely said anything on screen.
22:12I was just like, yeah, I was like, I don't know what to say.
22:15How did you handle the nerves with that?
22:17I was like, if I think about this too much before I do it, I'm going to spiral.
22:20I'm going to put myself in, in, in a, in a headspace that is not where you want to be
22:27when you're making a movie.
22:29So I just kind of lived moment to moment.
22:33And I was like, just going for it.
22:35Do you have any nerves on stage these days when you're performing music?
22:39Yeah.
22:39I get nervous before anything.
22:41I do really, um, on stage.
22:44It's like, doesn't matter what size of the crowd is.
22:46It doesn't matter who's there.
22:48It doesn't matter what I'm doing on the stage.
22:49It's just, if I'm on a stage in front of people, I'm nervous.
22:52But what about this year?
22:53Like we've had so many great albums come out.
22:55What are your favorites?
22:57Oh my God.
22:58Um, I feel like the things that I'm listening to right now are like singles from albums that
23:03have yet to be released.
23:04Um, I'm really looking forward to the Remy Wolf album, the Troye Sivan album, role model
23:11too.
23:11Yes.
23:12Like all your previous collaborators are all doing, having a huge year.
23:15Mason, Taylor.
23:16Oh, they did such a good job with that record.
23:18Your birthday is later this month.
23:20It is.
23:21Yeah.
23:21Happy birthday in advance.
23:22Um, what are your plans?
23:23I am making all of my friends perform the little mermaid.
23:27Oh my God.
23:28How is that going to go down?
23:30Well, I'm giving them all script.
23:32I assigned them characters and we're just going to go for it.
23:35That sounds amazing.
23:37Yeah.
23:37I'm really excited.
23:38Honestly, I assigned the songs to people I knew could handle it, but I'm like y'all need
23:42to learn your songs and show up.
23:43Correct.
23:44I just, or I just placed a big costume order.
23:47It's going to be great.
23:48It's going to be like forks in the hair and all of that.
23:50Oh yeah.
23:50Oh my God.
23:51I loved it.
23:51I just want to say, and I've said it already, but this album is just so incredible.
23:55Thank you so much for being here.
23:57Thanks for having me.
23:57This has been so fun and I can't wait to see you next time at the Rolling Stones studio.
24:01Thank you very much.
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