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Große Debatten bei The Ring: Europas Sicherheit – zu welchem Preis?
Vor der Sommerpause des Parlaments blicken wir auf zentrale Debatten zurück: Wie stärkt Europa seine Verteidigung, wie reagiert es auf Krisen außerhalb seiner Grenzen?
LESEN SIE MEHR : http://de.euronews.com/2026/07/29/grosse-debatten-bei-the-ring-europas-sicherheit-zu-welchem-preis
Abonnieren Sie! Euronews gibt es in 12 Sprachen.
Vor der Sommerpause des Parlaments blicken wir auf zentrale Debatten zurück: Wie stärkt Europa seine Verteidigung, wie reagiert es auf Krisen außerhalb seiner Grenzen?
LESEN SIE MEHR : http://de.euronews.com/2026/07/29/grosse-debatten-bei-the-ring-europas-sicherheit-zu-welchem-preis
Abonnieren Sie! Euronews gibt es in 12 Sprachen.
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04:28Okay. Do you hear this?
04:29In the Cold War, freedom won against dictatorship.
04:32And this was, of course, due to deterrence.
04:36And deterrence is what is needed.
04:37Deterrence will also save us.
04:39And deterrence is only possible if we can take care of ourselves.
04:42And the security sector and industries is not isolated from other sectors.
04:46We have to understand Europe.
04:48And I really care for Europe's prosperity, for jobs on our continent,
04:51and for the future of the generations ahead.
04:54Europe became a continent of consumption.
04:56We have been consuming over decades innovation from America,
05:01production from China and other parts of Asia,
05:04also innovation from China in the meantime.
05:06So we need innovation on European soil.
05:09We also need production on European soil.
05:11And when you talk about the automotive sector,
05:13there are not many sectors as much connected to the security sector as this one.
05:17So security and economy has to be taken serious.
05:20That's why I'm also saying let's put first things first.
05:25This must be the priority.
05:29Now it's time for our viewers to get a real flavor of the European Parliament chamber,
05:34where members ask each other questions.
05:36And sometimes it can get heated.
05:39So let's get started.
05:40Lukas Madl, I'm going to ask you to ask the first question to Mark.
05:46Well, Mark Potenga, as a colleague in the European Parliament,
05:49how can we make sure that we establish more freedom for the Europeans to the inside and more strength to
05:55the outside?
05:56This is the overall issue of our time.
05:57I would say Europe needs more strength for its civilization, for its reliability,
06:01the diplomatic approach that you obviously do not see from the European side while Europe is the strongest diplomatic power
06:10given the geopolitical situation today.
06:11So how can we create more strength to the outside and how can we establish more freedom to the inside
06:16for our citizens?
06:17I think that's a very interesting question coming from the center right, who's governing in many governments in Europe
06:22and who's basically limiting the right to protest, who's limiting the right to strike,
06:28who's limiting basically fundamental freedoms of Europeans.
06:31And so I would say, first thing, please tell the governments of your political group, of your political party,
06:38to stop limiting the fundamental freedoms of Europeans.
06:42And secondly, towards the outside, I need, we need, I think, to rebuild European credibility.
06:49And how do we do that?
06:50We do that by stopping the double standards, by no longer saying international law is important for us in Ukraine,
06:56but in Palestine we don't care.
06:57International law is important when Russia or Putin violates it, but we don't care when Trump violates international law.
07:05Because if you have these double standards, never, ever will other countries take you seriously
07:10and never, ever will you be a decent player on the international scale.
07:14Okay, on this, I think you want to follow up.
07:18I mean, there is so much to be said.
07:20I think it was now the fourth or fifth conspiracy theory from Mr. Potenga in today's talk about freedom being
07:27limited in Europe.
07:28There is no part on this planet, no continent, no country where freedom is so much established
07:32and so much defended and strong as it is in Europe.
07:36Obviously, also that we have this debate today, also that extremists have all democratic rights in parliaments in Europe,
07:44including the very European Parliament, all of this is about freedom.
07:48And then mixing things up doesn't make it better.
07:51Of course, when international law is violated, Europe is the strongest voice speaking about that.
07:56Europe stood strong against Trump's attempt, for example, when it comes to Greenland,
08:01and we succeeded in that area.
08:03Europe stood strong when it was not clear whether the terrorists will go that way or the other way from
08:08Trump's side.
08:09He put us in a limbo again, but we didn't follow this pathway of a limbo.
08:13We didn't enter this political battlefield of Trump.
08:16We stood strong, and we managed to succeed more when it comes to the geopolitical tensions given than other parts
08:25of the world.
08:25But, of course, we need more strength to the outside, especially in that field you are doubting,
08:30in the field of our own security and being able to take care of it.
08:33Mark Maggiac, you want to react?
08:35And then your question to Lucas Maggiac.
08:37Well, I think it's interesting because very often the EPP and central parties, when they don't have an answer,
08:42they say this is a conspiracy theory.
08:44What we see in many countries, like in Germany now, there's a debate even on saying
08:47we can't use the watermelon anymore as a political symbol because it would be anti-Semitic.
08:51This is, you know, what we are seeing.
08:53We're seeing this also with action against trade unions in different countries.
08:57So we see that there's a democratic backsliding, which human rights organizations are pointing out in Europe.
09:02You know, it's not some kind of left conspiracy to say that.
09:05But you don't want to see it because it's your government's doing it.
09:08Secondly, what I indeed want to ask now, and I think that's a thing.
09:13You say that Europe stands up for international law and you quote Greenland.
09:20Europe didn't stand up for international law in Greenland.
09:22It stood up for its own territorial integrity.
09:25That is something very different because when we had to stand up for international law,
09:31the illegal war on Iran, you supported it yourself.
09:34When it is about denouncing the illegal occupation of Lebanon by Israel, you support it.
09:39When the International Court of Justice says that we should sanction Israel as third parties,
09:44we have a responsibility, you refuse it.
09:46So basically, when, you know, the Venezuelan president, whatever we think of him, is kidnapped illegally
09:51and the world globally condemns this, saying this is just absolutely not how we deal with,
09:57how would I say, with international relations and this is a violation of the UN Charter,
10:01you support it.
10:02So this is the issue.
10:03These double standards, it's not Europe that has double standards.
10:06You know, it is you.
10:08It is the governing coalition of Europe that has these double standards.
10:10Look, who is dealing with international law, who is in the lead of preserving it and observing
10:17it is the United Nations.
10:18We had yesterday night in the European Parliament's plenary a debate on the United Nations necessary
10:24reform.
10:25United Nations have to be reformed for obvious reasons.
10:28And if you are telling now that the war on the Iranian regime was wrong, I say, yeah,
10:35it was amateurishly done by the United States, while the decapitation of the Mueller regime's
10:42leaders worked very well.
10:44But the war obviously was wrong because it didn't work out well.
10:48The Mueller regime is still in place.
10:50I have been sanctioned myself by the Mueller regime since 2023.
10:53So I know what I'm talking about when I say women are suppressed in Iran.
10:58Iran is threatening the whole world, not only the region.
11:01And, of course, to threaten our only partner country in the region, the only democracy,
11:06the only rule of law-based state in the region, Israel, is part of the conspiracy theories
11:11of your political side.
11:13And this is a sign of freedom in Europe that you can speak freely about that, even if it's
11:18a very much in minority being opinion.
11:23But you are allowed to say that.
11:25And there are no many parts on Earth where you can do that.
11:27And last point on Greenland, I mean, when international law is violated, it doesn't matter whether
11:31it's Europe's interest or the Earth's interest.
11:33We care for international law.
11:34We even want to save international law during these geopolitical times of tensions.
11:39And that means that we have to reform the United Nations.
11:42OK, thank you for a great debate so far.
11:46We've heard your views.
11:48Now it's time to hear from a new voice.
11:54And for our quote of the week, I would like to bring in Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni.
12:00In a letter addressed to Commission President Ursula von der Leyen, she said this.
12:04We cannot justify to our citizens that the EU allows financial flexibility to be used for security
12:12and defense purposes in the strictest sense, but not to protect families, workers and enterprises
12:18from a new energy crisis that threatens to severely impact the real economy.
12:25Your take on this, Mark.
12:28Well, two things.
12:28First, she's walked back to on her statement.
12:30Secondly, it's terribly hypocritical because the fact that we now have, again,
12:35these horrible austerity rules was approved by her government.
12:39So first, and this is fantastic, first, the far right approves this,
12:43or the center right, whatever you want to call her, approves these rules.
12:46And then they say, ah, it's not fair.
12:48So this is, you know, pure populism.
12:50But what is true is that Europe today says there's no money for your hospitals,
12:56for your pensions, for your schools.
12:57But, miraculously, we find hundreds of billions for the defense multinationals.
13:03You know, this contradiction is real.
13:04And so, indeed, we do not need these austerity rules anymore.
13:08And once again, they've been imposed by the mainstream parties, including Georgia Maloney's.
13:13Okay.
13:13Lucas Mandel, your reaction?
13:14Yeah, this is part of the extremist populist approach.
13:16I think also the consumers, viewers of this program should see that there's no contradiction
13:22between producing something on European soil instead from buying it from outside
13:27and having hospitals and schools and streets, because the one thing is connected with the other.
13:32If we have strong prosperity, if we have growth, finally, in Europe again,
13:36we will also be able to afford the social welfare states.
13:39We have established generations before us have established in Europe,
13:42and we will have schools and roads.
13:47And another major issue that dominated the European news agenda this year
13:51was the war in Iran and the impact it's happening on the European Union
13:54and also on our economies.
13:56We had a lively debate between the Spanish MEP from the Socialists, Hanna Khalul,
14:01and the Austrian MEP from the European People's Party, Reinhard Lopatka.
14:08As you know, and as my Prime Minister, Pedro Santos, have stated,
14:12we think that any unilateral military intervention
14:15that has not passed through the Security Council of the United Nations
14:18is not in compliance with international law.
14:21So we condemn any unilateral attack.
14:25This is not to say that we are supporting the Iranian regime in any case,
14:30you know, because we have been against the Iranian regime
14:32criticizing the killing of Masha Amini
14:34and, you know, the protesters, you know, in the streets
14:36that were fighting for human rights and their liberties.
14:40And we have always condemned the relation of the Iranian regime
14:45with the militias such as Hezbollah or the Houthis or Hamas.
14:49So very critical with them always.
14:51And we fought to include the revolutionary guard in the EU terrorist list.
14:55So a condemnation of the Iranian regime, but also of the U.S.-Israeli intervention.
15:01Mr. Lopatka, do you think that this military intervention from the U.S. and Israel was justified?
15:07I can't agree. Why?
15:10Why? Because if we would wait until the Security Council of the United Nations is acting,
15:15we would never have a result.
15:17You know, it is blocked by Russia and China.
15:21They always support Iran.
15:22Whatever is ongoing there.
15:24So don't forget.
15:26This regime in Iran, the Mullah regime, is a terrorist regime.
15:31What did they do?
15:32They killed thousands of their own people.
15:36There was state oppression to the Kurds.
15:39There are 8 million Kurds.
15:40Have in mind how they killed Masha Animi some years ago.
15:46They are founding terrorist groups in the region.
15:51Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis.
15:53And they are a big danger also for Europe.
15:56We should not forget it.
15:57It was a diplomat.
15:59He was in Vienna, in our embassy.
16:02Then he was sentenced here in Belgium for 20 years
16:05because he was supporting terrorism here on European soil.
16:09So what I want to say is
16:12we can speak about international law.
16:16And here you can say maybe it was illegal.
16:19But I think the United States and Israel
16:23were legitimized to start with these strikes.
16:27So let me put that argument to you, MEP Yalalul.
16:30He's saying, well, maybe the legality is questionable.
16:32But isn't Europe letting the U.S. and Israel
16:36do its dirty work in the Middle East
16:38by going after the proxies,
16:40going after the nuclear and missile programs of Tehran, for example?
16:43Do you agree with that?
16:44Well, what I do think is that we have diplomacy for something.
16:47First of all, we cannot use double standards.
16:50We cannot criticize other aggressions, you know, for other countries
16:53and then say that this is something we can...
16:56But this is about international law,
16:57the system that we gave to ourselves after 45.
17:00So either we believe in international law
17:02or we don't believe in that.
17:03And we have means like diplomacy.
17:05Let's remember that one day before the conflict,
17:08even the Iranians sitting in a table of negotiations
17:13with the Omanis said that it will work not to enrich themselves.
17:16We know that and we have investigating
17:18and we send inspectors in order to see that it were enriching.
17:21And even if the director of the nuclear agency said a few days ago
17:27that they were not sure that they were building nuclear weapons,
17:31but they had more than 60% of the allowed enrichment of uranium.
17:34So we have been very critical of that.
17:36We were under control.
17:37But don't forget that we have also a deal in 2015
17:39between Iran and six other countries where the U.S. were within that country,
17:43even Russia and China.
17:44and then the U.S. unilaterally deployed afterwards,
17:48which had as a consequence Iran enriching much more
17:53and restricting more of the inspections.
17:55So either we have a consensus against Iran on diplomacy,
17:59fighting the enrichment on uranium
18:02and targeting any other kind of activities they can have.
18:06Or, I mean, it cannot be unilateral.
18:08We need to go all together and based on international base rule system.
18:11You bring up this question of double standards
18:13because the EU does pride itself on upholding the rules-based order,
18:17international law.
18:18You said yourself that you question the legality of this,
18:21yet the EU always is talking about international law in places like Ukraine.
18:25Isn't this double standards from the EU?
18:27No, not at all.
18:28Why?
18:29There's a big difference between the invasion in Ukraine of Russia
18:34to take the country, not respecting the sovereignty, not at all.
18:38And the situation here,
18:40The UN Charter,
18:42and I'm absolutely sure that the purpose of it is to protect human life
18:47and not to shield terrorist regimes like in Iran.
18:51The Security Council is not working,
18:54so we are in a very difficult situation
18:56because I think the bigger threat is
19:00when the Security Council is misused by regimes like Iran,
19:08by dictators like Putin.
19:10And on the other side,
19:12we have to do everything to protect the interest of our people
19:18and fighting terrorism.
19:21And Iran is the biggest sponsor of terrorism.
19:25Giving Israel the chance to survive as a nation,
19:29I think this is our duty
19:31and it's absolutely in the interest of Europe.
19:34So there's a big difference
19:36and no double standards, not at all.
19:41As you can see, there are lots of questions,
19:43but really hard to find the answers.
19:45Now it's time for us to take a short break here
19:47on this special summer edition of The Ring.
19:49Don't go anywhere.
19:50We'll be back soon.
19:59Welcome back to this special summer edition
20:02of Euronews Debate Show, The Ring.
20:04I'm Maid McMahon in Brussels.
20:06And as MEPs take a break from the city for the summer
20:09and the activities in the European Parliament Institute
20:11behind me take a slow,
20:13we're looking back at some of the highlights
20:15of this season on The Ring.
20:17One topic that featured a lot was, of course,
20:19the war in Iran and how Europe should respond.
20:22We can take a look now at an excerpt from this edition
20:24between Rio Terras,
20:25the Estonian European People's Party MEP,
20:28with Oswald Demariel,
20:29a far-left MEP from Germany.
20:35We have seen wars emerge around us.
20:40Europe has not launched any wars.
20:42Europe has not, in the last 70 years,
20:45not been part to a war itself.
20:48But we see others attacking European countries around us.
20:52Do you think that Europe can solve these problems diplomatically?
20:56Or do we need military means to back up our diplomatic efforts?
21:02And if not, what is the other way?
21:04To be honest, yes, the European Union,
21:07as the European Union didn't, launched wars.
21:10But European member states were also, in the past, part of wars,
21:15like we saw in Afghanistan, like we saw in Iraq, like we saw in Libya.
21:20It was not, the UK is not anymore European Union,
21:25but it was also European countries.
21:26So it's not true that the European Union in the past was just standing for diplomacy
21:32and against wars in this world.
21:34So if we want to answer the times of wars,
21:37we have to go back and to stop about talking just about militarization.
21:42Do you know the definition of a dialogue?
21:44Yes, sure.
21:45That means that it needs two parts who want to discuss, to talk to each other.
21:50If one side wants to talk and the other one is not,
21:53and I have been experiencing myself trying to reach out to Russian chief of defense,
21:58as I was chief of defense, and the response was, why?
22:00Nobody wants to talk to us.
22:03And not the dictator Putin, not Chairman Xi, they don't care.
22:08And as long as we are weak, we are not at the table.
22:12And the dialogue needs two sides.
22:15And if Russia understands only military means,
22:19and they did not use diplomacy against Ukraine.
22:21Maybe a reaction on them to that.
22:22I don't know what you mean with weak.
22:24European Union is one of the huge,
22:27or one of the biggest economic powers of the world,
22:30and also the European member states has a lot of military instruments,
22:34and we are spending a lot of money for military means.
22:38So it's like this.
22:39The facts are on the table.
22:41So don't tell just we are like this or we are like this.
22:45What is happening by now is that the European Union also decided,
22:49like the U.S., like China, like other big powers in this world,
22:53that they want to defend its own interests.
22:56And this means resources of the world, trade routes of the world,
22:59by military means.
23:01And what this means is that people are dying,
23:04that the working class all over the world is paying the bill for it.
23:08And this is not acceptable.
23:09This is why I'm rejecting this military means.
23:12And I'm saying we have to find another way to protect lives,
23:16to protect our Earth.
23:17There are certain things we cannot do yet that still responds to what we can or cannot do.
23:23So we need to invest commonly together to a drone defense,
23:29because we have seen a new weapon developing a disruptive technology,
23:34which has been used in Ukraine and kills people.
23:36We need, for example, to invest in this kind of technologies in order to make sure
23:41that our people are defended and they are not dying.
23:46Let me say clearly, it's not a solution for nobody to prolong wars.
23:51And it's also like this, that not just Putin said,
23:54I don't want to negotiate.
23:56It was also like this, that the Western countries long, long time said,
23:59we had no possibilities to negotiate.
24:01We don't want to negotiate.
24:03And this was prolonging this war.
24:06And the result of this war is not good for the Ukrainian people.
24:10So let me say this.
24:13You are from the EPP and you are standing for a conservative politics.
24:17You are, in the last weeks, your group has really weakened the right of asylum
24:23in European Union systems.
24:26And it's like this, that the war in Iran also has the result that people had to flee,
24:32that they become refugees and maybe they want to come here.
24:35What is your answer?
24:37Why are you supporting wars or not rejecting wars, not doing everything to stop wars,
24:41and on the other side working against people who are affected by these wars
24:46and become refugees?
24:47What is your answer on that?
24:48May I start with saying EPP is not launching wars, is not causing wars.
24:53And the only thing EPP stands for is to defend people against the wars which are around us.
24:59Be it the Iran regime which has been killing, torturing people 47 years.
25:08Or be it the Russia who has never listened to anybody who launched wars since 2008.
25:15Whose political aims are, who wants to achieve its political aims by military means.
25:21And just on the potential refugee ways.
25:23Yeah, yeah, I'll come back to that.
25:24And so that is not what we want.
25:26And we want European people to live safely in Europe.
25:32But we are ready to take refugees, but we don't want to have illegal refugees.
25:38We don't want to have economical refugees.
25:40We want to know who is living in Europe and who is not.
25:45And that's what we stand for.
25:46So it is now time to move on to our fifth and final round.
25:50Are you ready?
25:54So now it is time for something a little bit different.
25:57I'm going to be asking our MEPs a set of questions.
26:00And you only have the opportunity to answer with yes or no.
26:05So was it a good idea to kill the Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei?
26:09Yes or no?
26:11I don't like him, but I don't think that it's illegal and it shouldn't be.
26:17Was it a good idea?
26:18Yes or no?
26:18Yes.
26:19Is the US still a friend to the European Union?
26:22Yes or no?
26:23Yes.
26:24The US people?
26:25Yes.
26:25Trump?
26:25No.
26:26Should the EU be more involved in this war?
26:29Yes or no?
26:30Clearly no.
26:31Yes.
26:32And should European countries increase defense spending?
26:35Yes or no?
26:35Yes.
26:36No.
26:38Should Europe focus on renewable energy?
26:40Yes or no?
26:41Yes.
26:42And manage a mix?
26:44Manage a mix.
26:44And should NATO be involved if the conflict expands?
26:48Yes or no?
26:49No.
26:50No, I'm against NATO also.
26:52And just a question on European governments.
26:54Should European governments be subsidizing energy costs today now to protect consumers?
26:59Yes or no?
26:59Yes.
27:00Yes.
27:01And is Iran a direct threat to European security?
27:04No.
27:06Yes, and it has always been.
27:08Okay.
27:08And have you agreed on anything that you've heard here?
27:14And what about you?
27:15Have you agreed?
27:15I agree that renewable energy is a part of the energy mix.
27:22And you can watch the full episode of that edition of The Ring on Euronews.com.
27:26But that does bring this special summer edition of The Ring to an end.
27:31We'll be back very soon.
27:32But in the meantime, do let us know what topics you want us to debate here.
27:35The Ring at Euronews.com.
27:37That is our email address.
27:39But for now, thanks for tuning in.
27:40Take care and see you soon on Euronews.
27:43Well, let's see you soon on Euronews.