00:00Jeff Bezos back to start up. General Fusion is making its Nasdaq debut today, giving investors a new way to
00:05bet on Fusion Energy, a market some industry forecasts say could exceed $1 trillion a year by 2050.
00:12Joining us now is General Fusion CEO Greg Twinnion. Congratulations, Greg. You're trading now on the Nasdaq. GFUZ, GFuzz, and
00:20shares up 29% from the IPO price right now.
00:24What are you going to do with the proceeds?
00:26Look, it's a totally exciting time for us here today. To be the first publicly traded Fusion company in the
00:33world is pretty awesome.
00:35For us, getting to the public markets meant a whole bunch of things, but in particular, getting the capital that
00:41we could move the ball forward with our world-leading commercializable Fusion technology.
00:47We did that with Pipe Capital, and we're pretty excited to be able to have that come into the company,
00:51which will fund our roadmap and some really incredible milestones in the next couple of years.
00:56There are a lot of startups in this space, maybe even more than 50, that have been scrambling for funding.
01:01And you yourself, you talked about in 2025, about a quarter of your staff had to be laid off because
01:06of running short in funding.
01:07And I wonder just for Fusion companies, given how novel it is, given you haven't gotten to commercial viability yet,
01:13if you kind of have to go to public markets, if private funding has more or less dried up?
01:18You know, we've had great support from private investors all the way through, and so what we wanted to be
01:23able to do is advance the technology with that private capital to get us to a point where we have
01:28some real, tangible milestones to fund as we move into the public markets.
01:33And so we built a machine recently called LM26. That machine is going to demonstrate some industry-first milestones and
01:39move us really to the front of the pack.
01:41And so being first to the markets and the public markets allows us to access capital in ways that in
01:48the private markets don't allow for.
01:50And so we're pretty excited to be first. We're going to be able to sort of hit these milestones in
01:54the public markets, and that will bring additional capital in the future for sure.
01:58Greg, in December, Trump Media and Technology did a deal and agreed to merge with Fusion developer TAE Technologies or
02:05TAE Technologies.
02:06Have you had any discussions with the administration? How interested are they in this technology?
02:12Fusion is a game-changer. Countries all around the world are racing to put Fusion energy on the grid.
02:18It's energy security. It's an opportunity. And the export market for Fusion is, you know, trillion-dollar market opportunity. So
02:26it's huge.
02:27So to see TAE and others continuing to raise capital or enter the public markets, I'm not surprised.
02:33It validates that Fusion is now. It's happening. And I won't be surprised if others come to market as well.
02:39It's not quite now, Greg. I mean, just the idea of when you actually get this up and running, estimates
02:44are anywhere from 2030 to 2035.
02:46So maybe we have a decade to go. Things like Fusion, that's already a large industry at this moment.
02:53So how do you convince one of the big utility giants, one of the tech giants, to partner with you,
02:58to invest on you, to sign any agreements, when they could be waiting a decade at this point for power
03:02that they desperately need now?
03:05Yeah. So there's going to be near-term gaps in terms of power to satiate the demand that's there.
03:10We see that every day in the news, you know, AI, electrification, industrial heat. These types of things are drawing
03:15huge amounts of energy from the grid.
03:18For us, we're thinking about stepping in with our first of a kind in 2035. That timeline's not that different
03:23from what you're seeing from SMRs.
03:25And so what that means is Fusion can step in, play an important part in taking up the future growth
03:31of energy.
03:32And so, you know, Fusion really can deliver clean, limitless, almost limitless energy.
03:38And so the opportunity is much, much bigger than that of Fusion.
03:42And now also a safety profile that doesn't have long-term radioactive waste, chance for a meltdown.
03:47You're not using fuels that can be weaponized. So it's a big difference.
03:51So another one of your competitors, and sorry to talk about all your competitors, but Commonwealth Fusion Systems got some
03:57investment from NVIDIA and also Alphabet.
04:00Have you quartered large public companies like that? Anyone interested in investing in you?
04:05Yeah, we have some really great commercial relationships with a handful of utilities, industrial heat users all around the world.
04:12We work with them on a regular basis. And really what's important right now is to move the technology forward.
04:19That's the primary goal with us at General Fusion, move that technology forward.
04:22The markets are definitely being made. We have signed several agreements with potential customers of the future.
04:29But for us, it's, you know, move the technology forward. The market will be there. The demand for energy continues
04:34to grow.
04:35Those tailwinds, I think, are going to persist for quite some time.
04:37And a lot of these large tech players are kind of building, like, power, their own private power resources.
04:44They build these data centers, and along with the data centers, they are building the power resources right next to
04:49them, too.
04:49I know that's a huge appeal of Fusion. You don't have to worry about those transmission lines.
04:53You can be right there. Is that how you're thinking of how you'll be constructing that?
04:58Maybe when we first see General Fusion up and running, you're going to just be right next to some of
05:02the big data centers.
05:04Yeah, the beauty of Fusion is that it's safe. When Fusion fails, it fails safe.
05:08And what that means is that you can now place the energy right beside the demand.
05:13And you don't have to have a large exclusion zone or anything like that,
05:16because you're not working, again, with anything that has long-term radioactive waste or a chance for a meltdown.
05:22And so being able to put that energy source right beside a data center or a city or anywhere else
05:28that, you know, dense energy is required,
05:30that's the beauty of Fusion. And that's why it's such a huge market.
05:33You know, Greg, China ate everybody's lunch when it came to EVs in the end, right, and solar, obviously.
05:40And I'm curious, given that it's part of the 15th, you know, five-year plan,
05:45are you concerned that China's going to do the same thing eventually with Fusion technology?
05:50There is a global race happening.
05:52Countries all around the world pursuing Fusion, national labs, academia, private companies.
05:56We've been at this for 20 years.
05:58And so we've got a kind of two-decade head start, and we're moving at a pace that is accelerating.
06:03And so, you know, whether it's China or Germany or UK,
06:07it's great to see Fusion being worked on in all these different countries.
06:10We're a Canadian company developing Fusion right in Canada.
06:13We're excited to be on the NASDAQ.
06:15And what this all means is we're exporting the technology all around the world.
06:18And we've got a unique approach that's very practical, very economical,
06:22doesn't rely on superconducting magnets or lasers or any new materials.
06:26That's going to be a huge advantage as we move forward into commercialization.
06:30And I know you have more of a mechanical approach.
06:33Greg, I've seen it called by Credix as a steampunk approach to Fusion,
06:37which I feel like is kind of a cool thing to say.
06:39I don't know why a critic would choose something so cool to describe what General Fusion is doing.
06:42But those critics would also say, look at some of the research that you've published.
06:46It shows that you don't get hot enough, that your components don't, to get the actual Fusion that you need.
06:51What do you say to those that kind of push back against the technology itself,
06:55that it's not viable, not now, and it will take a long time before it's viable in the future?
06:59Yeah, so to create a fusion power plant, you've got to recreate the conditions of the sun inside of the
07:04machine.
07:05And there's lots of different ways to do that.
07:07We chose a way that uses mechanical means, you know, so that we can use existing materials,
07:12existing type technologies, and not be, you know, not need to work with superconducting magnets or lasers or new materials.
07:18And so we just recently commissioned a machine called LM26.
07:23That machine is designed to achieve fusion temperatures.
07:27And recently we published and communicated that you'd hit 8.4 million degrees Celsius with that machine.
07:34And as we progress that program over the next couple of years, we aim to achieve fusion conditions.
07:39And then the path for us is simpler because we're working with mechanical means.
07:44And so it's actually a big advantage to be using steam and pistons, liquid metal, when it comes to commercializing
07:51the technology.
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