00:00Brian Wilson is a former UK Trade and Energy Minister.
00:04It would be unusual to set up an exercise of this scale with such a strong delegation from both countries
00:13and not to expect there to be some choreography at least to ensure that there were positive results come out
00:20of it.
00:20But in general I just think it's very welcome that trade has a life of its own
00:26and whatever's happening in politics or diplomacy, then trade continues
00:30and in fact is a very important part of diplomacy.
00:34And I think it's particularly fitting that just in the last stages of Keir Starmer's prime ministership
00:42that we should have this symbol, if you like, of the work that he has done
00:46on keeping these links open and deepening them with China.
00:51And I very much hope that there will be a lot of positive news to come out of that.
00:56Strong trade relations also allow for difficult conversations
01:02and let's not shy away from some of the difficulties between these two nations.
01:06If we think of what has happened around British Steel,
01:09which seems to be on the verge of being nationalised,
01:12that has potential for creating a lot of tensions.
01:16How do you think and expect that to be navigated?
01:20Well, I think there's always a balance to be struck,
01:24and we see it in energy as well,
01:28where we need to take advantage of Chinese technology, Chinese capacity,
01:37and that is a great contributor to our own economy.
01:42But at the same time, we have to safeguard our own industrial and economic base
01:48and to make sure that we have good capacity in key sectors.
01:51So maintaining that balance, which I think both parties would understand,
01:58that it cannot be a one-sided relationship,
02:01but there has to be...
02:03You would expect the Chinese government to recognise
02:06that the UK government has vital interests to defend as well.
02:11And so therefore, again, it's the difference between politics and trade diplomacy.
02:17As a former UK Trade and Energy Minister yourself,
02:20you've got many years of experience understanding those relationships
02:24and the dynamic of them.
02:26How critical are face-to-face meetings in solving problems?
02:31Well, I think they're crucial.
02:33But in the same way, I think Zoom calls are inferior to personal meetings.
02:40Then you don't get the full dynamic of a relationship established
02:47unless you're actually meeting people, you're chatting to them,
02:49you're finding common ground, and you're looking for solutions.
02:53And I think that's very much easier done in a face-to-face setting
02:58where misunderstandings can be sorted out more easily,
03:01where channels of conversation can be opened up more easily.
03:06So very, very important.
03:07And I'm really pleased that that is continuing.
03:12I certainly always enjoyed and I think benefited from my visits to China
03:19and good relationships were built.
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