- 2 weeks ago
Oscar-winning composer (plus ten nominations) Hans Zimmer ('The Lion King') returns with his score for 'Widows,' Ludwig Goransson discusses his work on 'Black Panther,' and Terence Blanchard talks 'BlacKkKlansman.'
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Short filmTranscript
00:04gentlemen welcome and thank you again for doing this first question I'd like to ask is was there
00:09a movie you've seen in the last year or so where you were particularly impressed with the score
00:15Terrence why don't you go first it's hard for me to answer that question I don't get a chance to
00:21see a lot of movies obviously you know between my turn schedule teaching and a lot of things
00:26that I've been doing it's hard but I I love all of these guys work though I mean when I
00:33listen to
00:34some of the stuff he's done with like so many brass players you know on on a scene I would
00:40have
00:40never thought of that you know and stuff that he did in the film you know some of the rhythmic
00:45stuff
00:45that you did was really killing I would have never thought of that that's the thing that I love about
00:49being a being in this business the thing that I love about this kind of situation is that we get
00:55a
00:55chance to share the ideas because we all work in a vacuum you know we're all sitting in a room
01:02by
01:02ourselves for the most part every time we do the composer roundtable everyone says that yeah it's
01:07great to just speak for yourself young man what does nothing stopping you I mean am I saying you
01:14can't come over or you can't come over and we can just go and start playing some music and no
01:19no no
01:19yeah but you're always on tour right oh sure right we were just talking about that right well that's
01:25because nobody came you just said you had 28 dates added to the yeah okay nope and I'm the touring
01:34musician yeah okay but the bottom line is I the thing okay answering your question yes as soon as
01:41somebody asks me have you seen anything that absolutely amazed you my mind goes black right
01:47I think that's what usually happens but I remember seeing this guy's work and going oh yes I know what
01:56I know what that is about I understand what that is that is great that is stretching it that is
02:01going to
02:01Africa that's that's good that's doing the doing the real work and I just love what you did and I
02:09think I I seem to remember telling you at the time so you know this isn't just I mean I'm
02:17sitting here
02:18very you know humbled to be here surrounded by two creative geniuses that I've been studying my
02:25whole career and I think especially is something that I've been listening with your music for for
02:31years and years it's just like the way you guys bend genres and and and take me different music and
02:38combine them and and that's always been extremely inspiring to me all right um one of the things I
02:45love about film music is if I want to go and do my psychedelic country and Western heavy metal album
02:51there is there is probably a movie that is just a producer sitting somewhere going exactly banjos
02:59and fuzz guitars I need it you know you're required to experiment that's the call the call is to go
03:05and
03:05be try something new you know well being a performing musician being a jazz musician for me I've always
03:12wanted to write bigger pieces I've always wanted to do something in other areas and trying to do
03:19that as a jazz musician that's damn near impossible but you know have an opportunity to work in the film
03:26world I get a chance to experience a lot of different things writing for orchestra writing for electronic
03:31instruments writing for a lot of different type of other types of music that will bring into the fold so
03:37to speak and then the crazy part about it is that then it starts to influence what I do in
03:42my live show so
03:43then I start to figure out okay well that works there how can I take some of those elements and
03:48incorporate that
03:49into what I do as a as a performing musician so film the thing that I love about film is
03:55the the possibility of
03:56just experimenting and so many different genres and having that just be a part of your entire musical experience
04:03it's just not like you said it's not just a film thing but it's like you're bringing all of your
04:08experiences to bed to create something unique okay on the projects you worked on this year did you was
04:14there a moment where you had a breakthrough or an aha kind of moment well for me you know working
04:21on Black
04:22Klansman it's a tough subject to deal with I didn't think it was a real story at first but I
04:30kept trying
04:31to think about what would be the sound that would exemplify what most African Americans were going
04:37through at that time and the thing that I kept thinking about was when when Jimi Hendrix played the
04:42national anthem to me that was like one of the most patriotic things I've ever heard creatively done
05:00because not only did he play the anthem but the way he played it it seemed like it was screaming
05:05we're
05:06Americans too you know and dealing with this topic with this policeman who was a who's a rookie who
05:14decided to infiltrate the Klan I thought it was an incredibly heroic act but one that still was saying hey
05:22man we don't need this division we're all Americans we all belong to this country we all have something to
05:27contribute so the aha moment for me was to say okay well let me take that sound or that that
05:34sonic idea
05:35of Jimi Hendrix and use that as the focal point behind what it is that we're going to do for
05:40the
05:40film because I feel like oddly enough we're still saying this we're still screaming to be considered equal
06:12by doing that the music didn't take on a reflective kind of personality it took on something that's
06:21currently relevant unfortunately yeah yeah Hans how about you breakthrough moment on widows listening
06:28to him I'm going I'm going to tell you the same story 1983 I was Stanley Myers the composer Stanley
06:39Myers's assistant on television to the show called widows and it was amazing because I thought here's
06:47somebody writing about the sort of casual brutality that happens to women on a daily basis and this
06:53this series it's going to it's amazing it's going to revolutionize the way women are going to be
06:57treated in the world and when Steve McQueen came to me you know we always been talking over the last
07:02five
07:03years what are we what are we going to do next and he said what about widows and you know
07:08at first I was
07:09just really excited because I had a connection to it and then I suddenly realized that it was terrible that
07:15that it was so relevant to do this movie again because nothing if anything things had gotten worse
07:22right I look at the way Steve makes a movie and I go oh that's the melody all I am
07:28going to do is I'm
07:29just going to be an orchestrator I'm just you know just a little bit here there you know and and
07:35the
07:35movie the the tune is already completely established by by the artistry that is Steve McQueen we got to
07:42start thinking like professionals we're in business together there's not gonna be some cozy reunion
07:48after this job we're done we have three days to look and move like a team of men the best
07:56thing we
07:56have going for us is being who we are why because no one thinks we had the balls to pull
08:03this off you've
08:04all worked with the same director multiple times so Ludwig on on Black Panther how did that help you
08:12well I worked with Ryan Coogler for my whole professional career like I I moved out here
08:18from Sweden to study at USC and he was studying directing at USC and I was studying film scoring
08:23at USC and he was one of my first American friends he came up to me at a party and
08:29we started talking
08:29about Swedish music artists yeah I was like how do you know about luckily you're a little dragon and
08:35like all these name dropping all the Swedish artists and then I started talking about film and so we
08:40we just kind of hit it off right off the bat and then and then his first little student film
08:45was
08:45like a five minute short and then Fruitvale happen Creed happen and then Black Panther so we have the
08:54same kind of relationship that we had 10 years ago but it's just on a bigger you know bigger scale
08:59and so
09:00what is so unique about our relationship is that we are we get started so extremely early when we start
09:06working like he sends me the script as he's writing it so at that time I can like I'm reading
09:12the script
09:12for Black Panther and I'm like the only way I could score this would be for me to go to
09:17Africa and immerse
09:19myself in the culture research learn and study with some of the best musicians in the world and I could
09:28do
09:28that because I was you know normally normally you have three months to score a movie but but here
09:33because I because I read the script and I had six months before they started shooting so I went and
09:40did all my research and studied and and I was able to have something really unique Terence how about you
09:46with Spike how is that relationship it's very similar fashion actually you know Spike is you know Spike he
09:51gets excited and he'll call me up Terence I'm getting ready to do blah blah blah I'm sending you the
09:55script and he will send me the script well before he's in pre-production you know so with Black
10:01Klansman um I had the script and I'm sitting down trying to figure out what it is that I'm going
10:08to do
10:08and try to come up with ideas um and since it was set in the 70s you know we had
10:16initial conversation
10:17before he started to shoot where he said listen I think when I have an R&B band be a
10:21part of the
10:21orchestra and I said do exactly what I was thinking you know you can't have a movie with those bell
10:26bottoms and platform shoes and afros without that um and the cool thing about Spike is that you know
10:34while he's shooting he'll send me stills so I get a sense of what it looks like and get the
10:41tone of it
10:42and what I'd normally do is man I'll take those and I'll make them my screensaver you know so I'm
10:49I'll engross myself with with the look of the film you know and in Black Klansman you know there was
10:56some stark images you know in that especially the in the latter part of the film where Harib
11:01Elefanti is giving a lecture to some young college students those are some tough photos to look at but I
11:07use those things to kind of put me in the mindset of of the the piece in general and just
11:14so I can
11:14stay focused um but we start well in advance before anything as a matter of fact um one of the
11:23things
11:23that's really interesting about working with Spike is that he'll already know what scenes he want he
11:30wants to shoot based on music before he starts you know um and sometimes it may be a song sometimes
11:38it may be a piece of score or something like that but he's thinking about that before he starts
11:43pre-production all right um I want to talk about representation um obviously it's a it's a very large
11:49topic in Hollywood these days but how does the film world film music world how does it become more
11:55inclusive and and has it become more inclusive recently do you think I keep talking to my
12:02musician friends about it because it's a particularly interesting one I think to talk to amongst musicians
12:08and I just want to see with you guys if you think I am remotely right because like I have
12:15this band and they
12:16come from every continent and every nation and every creed and every gender and the only the only
12:25two things I'm asking of them blow my socks off when you play and um try to be on time
12:31when you
12:31come and but but I don't care about the rest so we're very inclusive and the other thing which I
12:39think musicians automatically do is it's not just about that we play well we learn how to listen to
12:47each other I mean when we play together we develop this acute sense of this is how you're going to
12:52make
12:52a piece sound beautiful is how you support the other musician right so I think we're we're naturally
12:58inclined to be more inclusive yes I think for musicians we have a certain type of open approach
13:06because you know there's a saying you know one of my teachers used to say but can he play yeah
13:12you
13:13know I mean because if you can play you're accepted automatically like that I don't think the issue is
13:18with the musicians the issue is in the industry itself there was one film that you know uh for
13:2525th hour when I was working with spike man we found this this this this Muslim cleric to to just
13:32come in and sing on the opening credits didn't give him any music just say hey man just sing what
13:37you
13:37feel and it was beautiful you know what I mean so it wasn't like we're trying to go get somebody
13:43to
13:43emulate what that no we went straight to the source just like he did yeah you know I mean so
13:48what
13:49musicians we are all inclusive because we are fascinated I know for me I'm fascinated by what
13:55people do you know we basically all use the same chromatic scale you know we we have these different
14:01instruments that could create different colors and rhythms and all of this stuff and to go to other
14:06parts of the world to figure out to see how somebody can take that same thing and come up with
14:10something
14:11unique is a fascinating prospect for me you know both of us work with Baba Mao right we are casting
14:18an
14:19instrument as much as an actor you know and um exactly even if you don't understand the words
14:25instinctively you know there's somebody telling you a profound story with their voice or with their
14:32instrument and filmmakers get to have the pleasure of seeing these amazing actors come
14:40as the last of the last actors that get cast are such incredible artists um and it's not that they
14:48serve the film they elevate the thing you know yes and uh word needs to get out that they can
14:55come from any
14:56culture and from any gender and from anything yeah they're all out there because everybody has a story
15:03to tell and and and and they're people who are i mean Baba Mao i mean i'm sure you had
15:09the same
15:09conversation sort of with him you know what amazed me is his background it's it's it's history 2000 year
15:18tradition of telling the history of his people you know and we get to go and put that into our
15:24little movie
15:25you know i mean that's it's it's quite an honor yeah i mean i i when i went to senegal
15:29he invited me
15:31to come with him on tour i wasn't even i wasn't even sure that i was going to be able
15:34to record with
15:35him so we both played with him so i went on i went on to a tour and we uh
15:41he started playing at 3 a.m in the
15:43morning and right that was we'd been traveling for three days and we just saw him like entering the stage
15:50and it was like a magical moment and he played up to a sunrise and then that was like an
15:57aha feeling
15:58for me like how can we capture this feeling in the movie
16:20and then i was i spent two weeks with him in the studio and every day was new musicians coming
16:26in
16:26and like i heard there was a group of talking drums players coming in with six talking drum players and
16:32that instrument is such an interesting instrument that we never really heard in the cinema before so
16:37and it sounded like really regal to me so that became tachala's theme and you can play you can talk
16:45with this talking drum so i asked the talking on player how would you say tachala's name on the
16:49drum and he played tachala that rhythm on the drum every time they became the theme and right away i
16:57sent that to ryan because he was he was in a voicemail and he was you know working on the
17:02movie at the
17:02time a couple of days later we recording a fula flute which is from the tribe fulani tribe and i
17:09never
17:09heard that type of instrument before you can you can scream into the flute and the and the flute player
17:15i told him about the killmonger's character and he kind of started playing and he transformed into
17:22another person and started screaming killmonger's name into the flute and that aggressive sound was
17:29was was something that i also never heard before and i recorded it on my iphone sent it to ryan
17:35and he was in pre-production and he sent it to michael b jordan as he was preparing for his
17:40role
17:40oh so that became the killmonger thing that became the killmonger that's amazing uh we have to wrap it
17:46up but i want to ask one more okay more fun question uh when you were 17 what was your
17:51favorite your
17:51favorite song or your favorite piece of music little green why don't you go first when i was 17 okay
17:57when
17:58i was 17 that was a long time ago uh i was a long time ago i was i was
18:05that was my last year of college
18:06okay and i was really into that was actually when i was 17 that was the first time i got
18:13an opportunity
18:14to write for orchestra so before that i was a metal guitar player played metallica i had just
18:19gotten into pat metheny and jazz and and kirk roosewinkel and keith jarrett in in high school
18:24then my last year of high school i got in i got an opportunity to write for symphony orchestra a
18:29five-minute piece and at that time i was listening to i think nightmare for christmas and star wars
18:36and so my orchestra piece was very much a combination of those two uh pieces of music
18:43but when i heard my music and it performed live for the first time for an eight you know by
18:48an 80
18:48piece orchestra hearing that it changed my life of course terrence how about you uh that's miles davis
18:56miles davis dude miles davis it's two albums one with him playing my friend valentine live live concert
19:03and then him doing poor game best and i think uh my friend of valentine really got me because
19:10i've been listening to clifford brown sunday ron's charlie parker and all that stuff and to hear all of
19:15those musicians i would hear them play these notes and then miles just said and it just caught my
19:20attention immediately because i'm sitting there saying well what is this and then to go from that to
19:26hear him with gil evans uh do poor game best with these great voicings that gil would use that was
19:32so different than anything i'd ever heard before it literally stopped me in my tracks man i remember
19:40i remember my father offering to give me cash to go out because i was sitting in the house
19:47on the weekends playing these records you know he's like man go do something you're always sitting
19:54in the house but i was so captivated by this stuff because i didn't know what jazz was i was
19:59still
19:59trying to figure it out so i would literally play all of these records man i would play one track
20:05and
20:05i would just listen to the bass and i'll go back and then i'll just listen to the drummer and
20:09i'll go
20:09back listen to each instrument trying to figure out what was jazz you know so it allowed me to understand
20:14how these guys communicate but that gill evans thing man it just blew me away with just the
20:19the orchestration and how everything came together to create this very unique but powerful kind of
20:25musical experience yeah hans how about you you're 17. um 17 i can pretty much tell you exactly um i'd
20:32gotten i'd gone through my blues phase in the year of my you know 12 13 14 as a rebellion
20:38against the
20:39classical music i was fed on a daily basis and i also found my way back to
20:45classical music and i remember being obsessed with the last movement of mahler's second symphony
20:50which i would just keep playing over and over but the same time i discovered kraftwerk and tundering
20:56dream and partly what i thought was so interesting was that there there now was a new german music that
21:05wasn't based on the blues because popular music in europe you know stones etc had basically stolen everything
21:14from america and had made that their language and suddenly there were these electronica musicians
21:20whose vocabulary was classical music again if they knew it or not i think um that was great and um
21:27thank you for the great conversation thank you appreciate it no thank you thank you for the honor of being
21:33with you too
21:36how are you
21:37how are you
21:38how are you
21:38how are you
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