00:00Obviously a lot has happened since you had the summer Davos in Tianjin last year when
00:05we're starting to digest the impact of the tariffs from the United States. Since then
00:11we've obviously had tit for tat retaliation from China. We've seen inflation go up. We've
00:16had war in Iran. So much has happened. What do you think is going to be the top talking
00:21point here over the next couple of days. I think you absolutely right to set the scene
00:26in such a way and thank you very much for inviting me. This is a very fragmented world
00:31in which there is a lot of tension to try to sort of separate things. Our main activity
00:37at the forum is to try to find the platform where we can actually exchange. I think over
00:41the years and you've mentioned that you've been present at a lot of our meetings in Asia
00:45but also of course in Davos. It is something that we've earned the trust of coming to us
00:52to discuss about different things. So we would like to define ourselves as the leading platform
00:57of exchange between business, politicians, academia, all sorts of opinion leaders and
01:03now we need dialogue much more than ever before because geopolitical forces seem to be intent
01:09in dividing us. Supply chains are shortening. We are moving away from the different models.
01:15We need to invent a new future. Hence the subject of this year, innovate at scale. How can we bring
01:21in new ideas for doing things? I mean, my definition of innovation is not necessarily technology.
01:26It's doing something that hasn't been done before and we need to adapt to this because
01:32if we don't do something that hasn't been done before, we're going to stay in the same situation
01:35which is not what we want. Yeah and if you're talking about technology and AI, I'm going to be
01:40moderating at least two panels here on AI including in the next hour, the opening panel and it's really
01:46going to be talking about how to go from all this piles of investment in AI to scaling. So everything
01:54not all at once is sort of the title of that panel which tells me that this is a long
02:01-term trajectory
02:01and otherwise you risk a bubble really popping. Absolutely and it cannot be just about the next
02:08technological innovation or the next new good ideas. It has to be about how can we make the benefit
02:13of these new ideas felt by the totality of people. The forum has spent a lot of time over the
02:20years
02:20talking about the future of work, talking about livelihoods, talking about integration of technology
02:25and human lives and I think that's what we need to go and see now. We see a big technological
02:31breakthrough
02:31in the AI application to the business world. How do we make sure that this feeds through to society
02:37in the broader sense. Right and again you know I talked to a lot of bankers, senior bankers and we've
02:42heard a chorus of concern. Obviously they want productivity gains but there's going to be job
02:47losses. There's going to be ramifications and that is something that Chinese leadership as well is
02:52taking on board and concerned about. Yeah absolutely. It could be looked at both ways. It could be seen as
02:58a
02:58destructive force or it could be as a contribution to a new economy. Some of the research we've published
03:04talks about an increase of roughly 20% of the jobs opportunity rather than rather than going into only
03:10the negative. The enabling our businesses to be able to do things differently, innovate, is something
03:17that we are going to see percolating to the market force as well. Where do you think the discussions will
03:23lead as far as where to find. We've been doing this every year. Where are we going to find the
03:27engine of global
03:27growth in a bifurcated trade world coming out of the war as well. The oil shock that we saw. But
03:33again we saw
03:34oil prices come back almost immediately come down when this truce it's a fragile truce has been
03:40peace deal has been signed. But again where where do you find that engine of global growth with China
03:45also its domestic economy is sputtering. So we've been pushing very hard the idea that if we pull
03:52resources if we pull if we pull technologies we will be able to create a better world. Now we're saying
03:57that the geopolitical agenda is more going towards fragmentation again and that means that we need to
04:02invest more into resilience of our systems. So the idea is not to to mitigate the impact of the crisis
04:08but the idea is to start adapting to it. And that in itself is a wonderful opportunity for job creation
04:14for new economic growth for new for new directions in which the whole the whole system could go. I give
04:22you a very precise example. The five year plan that the communist party here in China has approved last
04:29year includes a big component of the bio economy. How can we use nature as infrastructure and not just
04:36as something that needs to be exploited. Well that's your panel that you're going to be on nature in
04:39infrastructure. So I'm curious too whether you know there's going to be because of the war in Iran
04:45there's going to be a springboard effect maybe a bit of a lag but again because investment takes time.
04:50But is it going to be a springboard towards more renewables as China has really emphasized or with
04:56the oil prices coming back down significantly below $100 a barrel does it go back to business as usual
05:02and especially in places like the United States a de-emphasis on ESG. Yes so we have we have to
05:09put
05:09into we have to break down these different silos. We're not talking about energy renewable versus
05:14non-renewable. We're talking about energy need, energy security, energy independence and resilience
05:20of our systems. So there are a lot of different solutions to this and I think that renewable is a
05:26solution for countries where this energy is in big supply. Now the key to this is to make sure that
05:33we
05:33create sustainable systems and sustainable system does not mean we need to cherish nature. Of course we do
05:39need to cherish nature but that's not what we're discussing here. We need to look into a way of
05:44creating stable condition for sustainable prosperity and that we can only do if we take into account
05:49planetary boundaries. The ultimate example is to say that when you burn one liter of oil you get
05:55immediate benefits but in the long term you make more damage to the system and that's really where we
05:59need to sort of focus. How do we create resistance, resilience and long-term thinking.
06:05In that vein then where do you how do you assess the global economy right now because so much emphasis
06:11has been put on the oil shock and the war also perhaps over investment in AI. Would you say it's
06:17a
06:17fragile wall of worry or is there confidence that we can get through this and this this next wave of
06:24growth will be fed by AI despite the astronomical numbers that are being poured at data centers and
06:31infrastructure. I think we should need to look at this in a sort of household economy. You will never
06:36put all your money into a single horse or you'll never do betting just one thing. Or seven key
06:41companies in the United States. Or seven key companies in the United States. But the point I'm trying to
06:48make is that if you really want to create the resilient futures we deserve then we need to be able
06:53to
06:53hedge our bets and we will not be able to do that if we just focus onto one or two
06:58solution. AI is
06:59important. It will have an impact on society absolutely clearly but it's not the only thing
07:03happening. You know we need to also look at the fact that we are eight and a half billion on
07:07the
07:07planet. We also have to look at natural world collapsing, loss of biodiversity, climate change,
07:13plastic pollution, persistent organic pollution. I mean you can look at it in many different shapes.
07:18If we are destroying the house in which we live we are not going to be able to thrive in
07:22the future.
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