- 20 minutes ago
As AI copilots and autonomous agents rapidly enter the workplace, they promise unprecedented productivity. Yet early research suggests a paradox: employees who rely heavily on AI tools may experience higher cognitive load, constant context switching, and increased burnout risk.
So how do we ensure that AI augments human potential rather than exhausting it? From AI-assisted workflows to agentic systems managing complex tasks, the next frontier of workplace innovation may not be speed but sustainability.
This session explores what a healthy workplace looks like in the age of AI and agentic automation. How can companies design systems that reduce mental load, eliminate digital friction, and allow employees to focus on meaningful work? And how can leaders balance high performance with human wellbeing as AI reshapes the way we collaborate, decide, and create value?
So how do we ensure that AI augments human potential rather than exhausting it? From AI-assisted workflows to agentic systems managing complex tasks, the next frontier of workplace innovation may not be speed but sustainability.
This session explores what a healthy workplace looks like in the age of AI and agentic automation. How can companies design systems that reduce mental load, eliminate digital friction, and allow employees to focus on meaningful work? And how can leaders balance high performance with human wellbeing as AI reshapes the way we collaborate, decide, and create value?
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TechTranscript
00:00I
01:01All right. I see the countdown has begun, so I'm just going to jump straight into it.
01:06My name's Neil Cairns. I work for China Global Television Network, and we make a lovely television show called Razor,
01:13a science show, which you can watch on YouTube.
01:15And I'm joined by some very lovely people.
01:20Fanny Jack is Chief Medical Officer of Utelmed. Am I pronouncing that right?
01:25Yes, it's okay.
01:26Good. Tom Parker, CEO of Headspace, and Emily Whitcoe, Chief Executive Officer of Hugging Space.
01:34The proposition we have before us for this panel is that, and I'm going to have to read it,
01:40as AI co-pilots and autonomous agents rapidly enter the workplace, they promise unprecedented productivity.
01:49But early research suggests the paradox.
01:52Employees who rely heavily on AI tools may experience higher cognitive load, constant contact switching, and increased burnout risk.
02:02Okay? So, that's important.
02:06Before we begin with the questions proper, I'm going to ask the team to just tell us what their companies
02:11do.
02:12Introduce yourselves one more time.
02:14Tell us what your companies do, because they'll do a far better job of it than I will.
02:17Fanny, let's start with you.
02:19Thank you, Neil.
02:20So, I am a psychiatrist, and I am the CMO of Utelmed.
02:25Utelmed is a...
02:25CMO. Remember, no three-letter abbreviation.
02:27CMO, Medical Officer, not Marketing Officer.
02:31So, Utelmed is an international provider of global mental health and well-being solutions, and I'm also a writer.
02:40I write a book about AI.
02:42Liar, un ami qui vous fait du bien.
02:44So, about mental health and AI.
02:46Thank you very much. Tom.
02:47Hi, everybody. Tom Pickett.
02:50I'm the Chief Executive Officer of Headspace.
02:53We are a mental health company.
02:55Many of you might know Headspace as a consumer app.
02:59We have over 100 million downloads.
03:02We offer everything from meditation and mindfulness content to coaching, therapy, and psychiatry.
03:09We sell to employers as a mental health benefit, and we're now starting to sell directly to health plans as
03:15well.
03:16So, that's Headspace.
03:19Thanks, all.
03:20I'm Emily Whitco.
03:21I am the Head of Culture at Hugging Face.
03:24For the engineers in the room, you're likely fairly familiar with us.
03:28We are an open-source AI platform for researchers, developers, engineers to build, create, iterate on all things AI.
03:38Okay.
03:38Let's start with question one.
03:41AI is being sold to companies today as a productivity tool, but what effects is it having on employees?
03:48Should well-being be a main component of the equation of productivity?
03:52Let's start with you, Tom.
03:56Yeah.
03:56I think the primary cell for AI is productivity, and I think we're really good at measuring productivity.
04:03If you think about from an engineering perspective, we talk about software delivered, pull requests, sales calls delivered.
04:12You know, we're really good at that, but what we are not good at is really assessing the impact that
04:19AI is having on our employee population.
04:22So, just recently, we fielded a survey at Headspace called Workforce State of Mind.
04:28We did it in the U.S.
04:29We did it also in the U.K. and France, just to kind of see if there were any differences.
04:34And what we found is that the big theme is this general chronic cognitive strain.
04:43It's this idea that we are just really starting to get overwhelmed, and it's not just from AI.
04:49I think it started with the connected world that we live in, that people feel it's really hard to detach
04:56from their work and their computer.
04:58People have financial stress on top of it, political stress, geopolitical stress.
05:03And then we just launched AI, and everybody's being told, gosh, I don't know what's going to happen with your
05:08job.
05:09You have to relearn everything.
05:11You know, what you learned is no longer relevant.
05:14And so, the result of all that is that people are becoming increasingly burned out at work and starting to
05:22detach.
05:24The data for France, actually, is 40% of respondents said that they're just showing up at work burned out.
05:31And it's really being driven by the pace of change, more so than AI in particular.
05:37It's just the cumulative nature of all these things.
05:41And 60% of respondents across Europe have said, you know, we just don't have any resources or training to
05:49help us deal with this as well.
05:50So, there's no thought about change management.
05:53It's just like, let's go, go, go.
05:56And so, that's leaving people in a really tough spot.
05:59And so, I think, let's just be careful not to blame it all on AI.
06:04It's really more about the pace of change.
06:06And the key question is, like, how do we bring our employee population along on that journey?
06:11Fanny, do you recognize any of those things from Tom's survey?
06:15Yes, absolutely.
06:17What strikes me, it's not only fatigue.
06:20It is a real feeling of acceleration, as you say.
06:24Many people tell me I'm not necessarily working harder, but everything is moving faster.
06:30There is more information, more notifications, more tasks, more meetings, more decisions to make every day.
06:36So, as a psychiatrist, I don't think AR is a real problem for me.
06:42The real challenge is the pace of change.
06:45Because our brain hasn't evolved for thousands of years, and technology evolves every month.
06:53So, when change happens so fast, faster than our human brain adaptation, people naturally feel stressed and overwhelmed.
07:03And it's okay.
07:04So, that's why I believe we need to think not only about productivity, but also about cognitive sustainability.
07:13Right.
07:14We'll talk about exactly what that means a bit later, I think.
07:17Emily?
07:18Yeah, I don't have too much to add.
07:20These folks covered it beautifully.
07:23Maybe just a quick validating point is that I work with AI experts in the field, right?
07:29We have some of the best engineers working for us at Hugging Face.
07:32And even our folks are utterly overwhelmed just by, like Fannie was saying, the speed at which new technology is
07:41coming at us.
07:42One of the things that we've done at Hugging Face, I almost said Headspace, sorry.
07:46To cut back on that cognitive extra load is to make sure that people are focusing specifically on the new
07:55technology in their area of focus.
07:58So, what I mean by that is if you are working on AI visualizations, if you are working on data
08:03sets, it means that you don't need to know about every single new piece of technology that's making its way
08:09into the space right now.
08:11In a way to sort of cut down a little bit on that exhaustion.
08:15We also have, I wish I had the number, but we have 9,000 Slack channels at Hugging Face.
08:21It's quite absurd.
08:24And we've actually recommended that folks cut that down to maybe 15 or 20 at most.
08:29You do not need to be reading all 9,000 Slack channels.
08:33And that also seems to have helped a lot.
08:35So, just in case those tips are useful.
08:38All right.
08:39I know I'm afraid of AI.
08:41I freely admit it for a whole variety of reasons.
08:45But as people in workplaces, why are we afraid of it?
08:49Let's start with you again, Emily.
08:51So, I think part of the reason we're afraid of AI is because that's all we get heard about.
08:57I think Tom said it well earlier where, you know, it's not really AI that's the problem.
09:03It's the pace of change.
09:04It's change management, those pieces.
09:06And I also think that all of the media talk about AI is often written about employees and about workers
09:14and not with employees and not with workers.
09:17Not fully understanding the actual day-to-day impact of what these tools are.
09:22Just sort of talking about this abstract AI monster.
09:27Frankly, because people like to read things that are scary more than they like to read things that are about
09:32efficiency.
09:33Well, journalists like to publish things that are scary rather than.
09:37Fanny, why are we afraid of AI?
09:40As I said, I think fear, it's okay because it's a normal reaction for us to uncertainty.
09:47Human beings need to, they like to feel in control.
09:52So, when people don't know what will happen, what will happen with their job, their skill, their professional identity, anxiety
10:01naturally increases and it's okay.
10:03The interesting thing is that AI, it's not the first technological revolution in the history, but it may be the
10:12fastest.
10:14So, some people are very excited, of course.
10:17Some people are skeptical and some people are very anxious.
10:21Fear of becoming obsolete, of not being good enough.
10:25So, the challenge is to understand that an employee who is anxious, he's not outdated.
10:34He's just at the beginning of the curve of the change.
10:39And the goal is to be sure that he's not going to be stuck alone at the beginning of this
10:48curve.
10:49So, we have to help people adapt to change while maintaining a feeling of confidence and of control.
10:58Tom?
10:59Yeah, I think they've hit on it, but like we've literally changed the world paradigm, right?
11:05People are being told that what you learned in the past is now a commodity in many cases.
11:10And so, people are wondering what does that mean for me as I think about my job going forward.
11:16And I think we haven't been concrete in terms of when we talk to our employees, we say, hey, we
11:20want to be an AI first company.
11:22And everybody's like, great, what does that mean?
11:25And is that going to change my job?
11:26And so, I think when we talk about like bringing employees along, being as specific as possible, like break down
11:32the problem.
11:33We're, you know, we're going to change this task and we're going to redesign this workflow.
11:38And, you know, don't worry, but we're going to give you training.
11:41And at the end of this, this is how your job is going to look.
11:43So, I think the more specific that you can get with people, it's going to really help them, you know,
11:48not just fill in the blanks, which I think a lot of people are just filling in the blanks, which
11:52just causes them to become very anxious.
11:55But isn't one of the fundamental fears that they're not so much going to keep up but be obsolete?
12:01They're going to lose their jobs.
12:05Are people right to be afraid of that?
12:07Yeah, look, there's a lot of debate on this.
12:08Just my personal opinion is that there will be job shifting and that ultimately, like most companies just have more
12:15work that they would love to be able to do, productive work that sits below the line.
12:22And so, I think as we, you know, automate in certain areas or redefine jobs in certain ways, that helps
12:28us to unlock, you know, more productivity in other places.
12:31Now, that may mean that your job changes and I think, you know, one of the things that, you know,
12:36I try to say at my company is like, hey, like we're all going on the journey.
12:41Like let's all learn these skills together.
12:44And whether, you know, Headspace turns out to be the place you're going to be in two years or not,
12:48what I do know is that you need to have this skill set.
12:52Right.
12:52And we're going to invest in you and you're going to learn these skills and you're going to be marketable.
12:56You put it quite well in our pre-chat.
12:59You said the cat's out of the bag.
13:02Yeah.
13:02I mean, the cat is, cat's definitely out of the bag.
13:05It's, you know, you know, it's like if you're worried about getting replaced, you should be, you know, you're going
13:10to get replaced by an AI enabled person.
13:14Right.
13:15And so, there's no reason that you can't become that AI enabled person.
13:19So, curiosity, you know, take the leap, step into it is really important.
13:24And I think that's, you know, generally what all of us have to do.
13:28Here's one that we haven't really talked about before.
13:30But I remember the first digital revolution when personal computers came in.
13:35And we were all promised, you know, you're going to have so much leisure time.
13:40Life's going to get so much easier.
13:41You're going to have to work out how there's less work you're doing.
13:46You're going to have to use your life.
13:47It didn't happen.
13:48It all got harder, busier.
13:51You were always in contact.
13:53Is AI going to do that?
13:55Is it going to do another?
13:57I think that some of my colleagues may not appreciate my stance here.
14:02But I think a lot of the ways that we talk about AI is, frankly, overblown.
14:08Maybe a little similar to sort of the first, you know, when the internet came out and the
14:13first computers arrived.
14:17Again, I realize that's a topic of discussion as well.
14:22But there's a big responsibility piece here that I like to point out.
14:28I hope that if there are any CEOs or leaders in the room, I'm not offending you.
14:33But by the time product conversations about AI tools that you incorporate into your company
14:39reach you, it is the best of the best of the best of that sales pitch, right?
14:44It is the most exciting story about that tool.
14:48And you may not be able to clearly see the pitfalls or what your folks actually need because
14:55you're just so excited about what this tool can do for you.
14:59And so I just encourage folks to actually think through that possible overblown narrative
15:07and think critically about whether or not these tools can actually improve the culture at
15:14your organization, as opposed to just layering on extra tools.
15:18Benny, have you got anything to add to that?
15:21I think, of course, AI can be a part of the solution.
15:26It could save time.
15:28It could reduce administrative burden, et cetera.
15:31It can help people focus on high-value tasks.
15:36But saving some time, it's not the same as saving our mental health and improving well-being.
15:44If I save one hour, thanks to AI, but immediately this hour is filled by more meetings, more tasks
15:52to do, et cetera, et cetera, I'm not relieved.
15:55I'm not less stressed.
15:56I'm just working faster.
15:58So the real question is what we are doing with this time that AI gives back to us.
16:06I'm going to stay with you, Fanny.
16:08What is, in your view, and from what you've all learned, especially with your survey, Tom,
16:14what is the biggest mental health risk, number one, that we should worry about?
16:19Many risks, but the biggest for me, I think, is losing our critical thinking.
16:24Right.
16:25Because AI can provide very quickly very good answers.
16:29And the danger, of course, is that we stop questioning ourselves, questioning about those answers.
16:36Getting a good answer, it doesn't mean we understand the topic.
16:43This creates what I call an illusion of competence.
16:47We feel informed, but we have not necessarily reflected on the subject.
16:53So that's why I often say that AI should help us think better, not think less.
17:00Tom?
17:02Yeah, I think there's an easy way to get distracted with AI, particularly if we talk about having multiple agents
17:14and you're kind of working them all in parallel.
17:17And my general worry is that we're trying to do more, but I'm not sure that more is actually going
17:25to get through the system.
17:27Like, if you think of, you know, when you operate a company, the constraints are typically, like,
17:33there's only so many big initiatives that you can drive through a company.
17:37And it's usually limited by people and cross-functional coordination
17:41and how many different things you can launch over a different time period.
17:44And so AI makes it really easy for you to take on all these little small projects.
17:49And I just worry that we're setting ourselves up that, you know, more documents to be read, more distraction.
17:57And I think that, like, what we have to do is get really focused and make sure that we are
18:02picking the right projects.
18:04We're driving them as efficiently as we can.
18:07And we're having the most impact that we can.
18:10And then the last thing I would add is just I think we've probably all gotten documents that we're like,
18:16we're like, what is this?
18:18It's sort of a, you know, Claude and I worked on this.
18:23And I think that, like, what we have to make sure is that we don't take the accountability away from
18:28the person who's delivering the content.
18:30Right?
18:31Like, you have to own it.
18:32I don't care if Claude helped you with it.
18:33But, like, you have to own it.
18:35And if it's slop, you're just distracting the organization.
18:38So I think, like, it's so easy to put stuff out that, you know, you just have to make sure
18:43you're actually focused on the big things.
18:45That's what Fanny said.
18:46It's got to have value.
18:47Real value.
18:48I love that.
18:49Incredibly well said.
18:51And just a quick add.
18:52I feel pretty disrespected if I'm sent a document or an email that it's very clear the person has not
18:58read or touched or been involved in.
19:01I also think it's interesting that I'm about to mention a different mental health risks than my colleagues who are
19:09working in mental health.
19:10So I apologize if I'm overstepping here.
19:13But I find that there is many of us have a lot of our identities wrapped up in our work.
19:21Right?
19:21We might think of ourselves as a very good writer.
19:24We might think of ourselves as a very good software engineer.
19:26We might think of ourselves as a very good graphic designer.
19:29And AI is doing something interesting to those identities where it almost feels like some people, this is like a
19:37little bit woo-woo, but you're sort of floating around in space and not really sure what your purpose is
19:42anymore.
19:43And if you're missing meaningful work, I think that can actually really degrade your well-being.
19:49And so I think, you know, I don't have a great answer for this because it's probably each person's individual
19:55journey.
19:55But it's something that leaders at organizations can look out for, right?
19:59Your direct reports.
20:00Make sure that they are still doing something that inspires them and is meaningful despite the many changes they might
20:07be facing at the office.
20:09Can I just add one thing on that?
20:10Because I think, you know, as we work more with AI, we tend to be more inwardly focused.
20:16We're sort of staring at our screens all day.
20:18But going back to, like, how companies work, I still think, you know, the social dynamic is really important.
20:25Like, how is your relationship with your colleagues?
20:28Are you able to sell ideas through the organization?
20:32And so, you know, I think we have to make a commitment to ourselves to not isolate ourselves in this
20:39world,
20:40but to really continue to reach out to our colleagues to spend that time, to go on a walking one
20:45-on-one, right?
20:46Like, get yourself away from the screen.
20:48Continue to nurture the human side of things as well.
20:52Fanny, you, please.
20:53Sorry.
20:55Yes, yes.
20:56It's my answer to the next question.
20:58Yeah, yeah.
20:59Please.
21:00But you mentioned that when we had our pre-chat.
21:03You mentioned, I think you called it an empathy divide, where especially young people are feeling much more isolated as
21:10a result of AI.
21:12Yes, because technology is very powerful, of course, but relationships remain fundamental.
21:21AI can create isolation, especially for young people.
21:25For example, when we have a question at work, it's often faster to ask AI than to ask a colleague.
21:35But if we stop, and the younger people do that, and if we stop interacting with colleagues,
21:41of course, we risk losing something essential, you said it, human connection and social abilities.
21:51And it's very important because AI can process information, it can answer to the how,
21:59but human creates meaning, it is answering to the why, and meaning is becoming more important, not less important.
22:10It can't say that you're really stressed and you need help.
22:13Yes.
22:14It's like a manager, a human manager, well, a good one.
22:19Tom, did you want to add something?
22:20No, I'm good.
22:21No?
22:21What?
22:21I want to say this.
22:22We may have already answered this, but we sort of have, but I'm going to ask it anyway.
22:27What should we worry about losing as people, as AI becomes much more a function of our life?
22:35I'm going to start with you, Emily.
22:37Yeah, I agree.
22:38I think we touched on this a little bit, but there's a little bit of learned helplessness
22:42that comes along with using AI.
22:44I feel like we've probably all had this experience even before ChachiBT or whatnot.
22:50I know I have.
22:51I live in California.
22:52I come visit Paris.
22:54All of a sudden, my cell phone is not working.
22:58I do not know where I am, right?
23:00I don't have a map.
23:03That's it.
23:05It would take me 10 minutes to figure out what to do next, which is happening again, right?
23:11But it's happening in these smaller bits.
23:13It's happening when we go to write an email, and all of a sudden, we're like, oh, I can't
23:17respond to this unless I ask Claude first.
23:20And so I just, you know, those are sort of little moments that I think it's worth watching
23:23out for.
23:25I think there's a fine line, you know, when you think about how you use AI, and it's
23:31very easy to just ask a general question and then trust what you get back versus forcing
23:41yourself to really put your thoughts, your input into it, right?
23:48Like, I start with a strong hypothesis.
23:52This is your own critical thinking, right?
23:54Like, we all bring to the world a lot of insights, edge cases that we know about, things to watch
24:01out for, that the AI just doesn't know, right?
24:04And so, but it takes more work, and then you get an output.
24:08And then I find that you also have to, like, constantly challenge the output, right?
24:14Because then you tell the AI to beat up the output, and then the AI says, hey, actually,
24:18that's not a good argument.
24:19And you're like, wait, you just gave me this great argument, and now you're telling me it's
24:21not a good argument.
24:22And so, you have to find yourself, like, going back four or five times to actually get to
24:27something that you feel is, like, a really quality output.
24:30So, I think it comes back to also this idea of, like, you own it.
24:33You own this.
24:35Nothing changes from that perspective.
24:37Don't let yourself fall into this learned helplessness world.
24:42Annie, did we start with you on that one, or do you want to add something?
24:45You're good.
24:46But here's the sort of corollary of that, if I can say it.
24:52What human skills will become more important?
24:56Let's start with you, Tom.
24:59When, you know, I'm coming at this from multiple perspectives.
25:02Like, you know, wearing my CEO hat, like, I run a company, and then we're also a mental
25:06health company.
25:06But, like, just in terms of running a company, I always feel like we're limited by the people
25:13in the organization who can really drive execution, can collaborate with their peers, can get
25:22consensus around an idea, and deliver results.
25:25Like, it turns out it's a...
25:26You said limited by them.
25:27What's that?
25:27You said limited by them, didn't you?
25:29I'm limited by that.
25:30It goes back to, like, there's only so many, like, major things you can run in a company.
25:34It's usually limited by the number of people and just the organizational capacity to do those
25:40things.
25:41And so, what that comes down to is, like, who are the people with judgment?
25:45Who are the people with, you know, great people skills that can bring people along for the
25:50journey and then actually drive that through to execution?
25:55And so, I don't see that going away.
25:58I see with AI, you're going to, you know, you're going to be able to move faster on ideas.
26:03You're, you know, but you still have to execute.
26:07And execution, for me, comes down to people, and the people that make the decisions, it's
26:11really about judgment and critical thinking, and that is going to be really important as
26:16we go forward.
26:17Fanny, this is really your area.
26:18What human skills will become more important?
26:22I said, of course, creativity, judgment, trust.
26:27Trust.
26:28Empathy.
26:29Critical thinking.
26:31We have to hold on to all of those.
26:33Yeah.
26:34Yeah.
26:34Okay.
26:35So, this is, are you optimistic?
26:40And be truthful.
26:41I know you're all in this sector.
26:43You know, you're creating the tools that are creating all these beasts we're terrified of.
26:48Emily, are you optimistic about AI in the workplace?
26:51I am.
26:52I'll say I'm cautiously optimistic.
26:55I think in order for AI tool deployments to be successful in any workplace, there are
27:02two, two, maybe three things that need to happen.
27:05The first is that if you have a crappy, slow, frustrating process to begin with, that's going
27:12to degrade well-being.
27:14And just adding an AI tool into that slow, frustrating process is not going to solve the
27:20problem, right?
27:21And so, it's not so much thinking about how I can layer AI onto the processes I already
27:26have.
27:26It's, if AI existed when this process was built, what should it look like, right?
27:32Completely revamping your processes at work.
27:35And then the second thing I like to point out is that decisions should be made closest to
27:40people who understand the technology and the people that understand the problems, right?
27:46These decisions should be made with nurses, with customer service folks, with HR teams,
27:52because if you're just working with your leadership or if you're just working with engineers, we're
27:57missing a big piece of the puzzle.
28:00Tom?
28:02Definitely an AI optimist.
28:04I mean, I think if you...
28:05You wouldn't be in your business if you weren't, would you?
28:08Well, you never know.
28:09I mean, I could be anti-AI, right?
28:11And say, look, we just should get away from technology and...
28:14But I think if, you know, we could say this about the internet, right?
28:18Like, is the internet generally a good thing, an optimistic thing?
28:20Is that a thing that's really helped us as a society?
28:22I would say yes.
28:23Are there some downsides to it?
28:25Yes.
28:26And so, you have to mitigate that.
28:28And I think...
28:30For anybody who's used AI, which is all of us, like, I think it would be really hard to
28:34go backwards at this point, right?
28:36Because I think we've all found, you know, incredible, incredible use cases.
28:41So, I just think we have to watch out for the, you know, for the downsides.
28:44But cat's out of the bag again.
28:47You know, we're moving forward.
28:49Even as I think about mental health, like, if I just go into, like, for our business,
28:55there are just not enough therapists to go around for all the mental health challenges
29:00across the globe.
29:02And so, the only solution to that is going to be technology, right?
29:06And now we have conversational AI, and it's on a journey.
29:09And, you know, but I'm an optimist that that is going to be a large part of the solution
29:13as we go forward.
29:13I'm keeping my eye on the clock.
29:15Fanny, how do you feel about that?
29:17Not enough therapists to go around.
29:18I interviewed a robot powered by chat, GBT4, a while ago.
29:22And I got talked to it, and I thought, wow, when this gets better, this would be a great
29:27person to talk to about your problems, you know?
29:30And you'd switch it off, and you'd get all your problems deleted afterwards.
29:33But it was quite incredible.
29:35Do you see that as a possibility?
29:38No.
29:39No?
29:39No, no.
29:40I don't think so.
29:42But as a psychiatrist, for me, the real challenge, the real point is how can we make sure that
29:49AI can reduce stress instead of creating new form of stresses?
29:58That's why I'm very cautious.
30:00One of the things we are really afraid of, and you're excused answering this question unless
30:04you want to.
30:05I'm going to throw a curveball at you both.
30:08AGI, artificial general intelligence, an AI that's as flexible as the human brain, how
30:17far away is it?
30:19Yeah, Emily's probably the one.
30:21I think it's impossible.
30:22You do?
30:23Yeah, I do.
30:26Yeah?
30:26Top?
30:27I don't know.
30:28It's constantly debated.
30:29I mean, I think it's many years away, you know, if at all.
30:34Well, that's one thing we can relax about.
30:36Thank you all very much.
30:37It's been an honor and a privilege.
30:39Thank you, folks.
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