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Watch Murder in Glitterball City () free Season 1 Episode 2 online in HD on Dailymotion (2026).
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00:00:16It started with a fight between lovers at a South 4th Street home and ended with two men charged with
00:00:21murder.
00:00:22When the murder of Jamie Carroll was uncovered, the story kind of just fell in my lap.
00:00:27Joseph Bainus is accused of killing James Carroll and burying his body in his basement.
00:00:32In my head, gears started to turn.
00:00:35Slowly at first.
00:00:38Joseph Bainus.
00:00:39Jeffrey Munt.
00:00:41James Carroll.
00:00:43Joseph Bainus is the first of two men to be tried for Carroll's murder.
00:00:48Lover's Triangle.
00:00:50Body in the basement.
00:00:52Spooky old mansion.
00:00:55Revenge.
00:00:56Drugs.
00:00:57Kinky sex.
00:00:59You couldn't make this stuff up.
00:01:01Jury is expected to hear closing arguments today.
00:01:05You are here to judge the guilt of Joseph Bainus.
00:01:08And Jeffrey Munt and Joseph Bainus did this together.
00:01:12They acted in complicity with each other to commit the murder of Jamie Carroll.
00:01:16Jamie Carroll spent six months in a 50-gallon Rubbermaid container.
00:01:24Would a verdict make sense of it all?
00:01:28Baby, can't you see I'm calling?
00:01:32A guy like you should wear one name.
00:01:37It's dangerous.
00:01:39I'm falling.
00:01:40I'm not going to operate a walker.
00:01:42Where's the emergency?
00:01:43My ex-boyfriend is attacking me.
00:01:48I need somebody help.
00:01:55Please hurry.
00:01:57Please hurry.
00:02:02Please.
00:02:04There you come.
00:02:07I can't get rid of him.
00:02:24The jury is getting ready to decide the fate of a Louisville man who could get the death penalty if
00:02:28convicted of murder.
00:02:29There's no indication yet how long Ms. Perry will let the jurors go tonight.
00:02:35Once we walked into the jury room to deliberate, we talked into the night up until about midnight.
00:02:42Jurors deliberated murder suspect Joseph Bainus fate for nine and a half hours last night before the judge ordered them
00:02:48sequestered overnight.
00:02:50It is an unusual situation where a jury would go out and we would be here late into the night
00:02:56to the point where we had to come back the next day.
00:02:58I think we essentially all agreed, like, from the start.
00:03:03I feel like Jeff Munt was more the mastermind.
00:03:07A lot of us believed that it was Jeffrey that was more guilty.
00:03:13After it seems like we've been stuck in the clouds forever, sunshine out there this morning, it's going to last
00:03:18all day.
00:03:19Good morning, I'm John Ball with some breaking news.
00:03:21We want to take you live downtown right now to the courthouse where we're about to get a verdict in
00:03:25the murder case of Joseph Bainus.
00:03:28The judge is speaking right now, so let's listen in.
00:03:30I was told you have a verdict, Mr. Fort Person. Is that true?
00:03:33Yes, Your Honor.
00:03:33All right. If you could have the jury, she's Chef Brown.
00:03:37Mr. Bainus, if you'd please rise.
00:03:43Under verdict of instruction number one, we, the jury, found a defendant, Joseph Bainus, guilty under instruction number one.
00:03:55It's against the rule, but I let them hug their, I mean, if a guy's going for life, what the
00:04:02heck, this might be his last time seeing his parents.
00:04:08If we had had both of them on trial together, our jury would have found them both guilty.
00:04:16Absolutely, 100%.
00:04:24Dearest Kevin,
00:04:29I just got my photos back and decided to send you one along with this card to let you know
00:04:34I've been thinking of you.
00:04:40Joey Bainus was my first boyfriend.
00:04:43He writes letters to me every single day.
00:04:46I still sometimes worry that you won't want to be my friend in the long term.
00:04:51This goes on for years.
00:04:53I have shoeboxes full of letters, like cards from him, all handwritten.
00:04:57He used to always finish it with a peace sign, a heart sign, a nice smiley face, peace, love, happiness.
00:05:02Joey.
00:05:05So this is the very first photograph that I ever took with Joey.
00:05:08This is when we fell in love.
00:05:11A drag queen once told us, you look like bookends.
00:05:17I met him on a rainy November night in a bank parking lot.
00:05:23I'll never forget his face, though, like just the first time I saw him through the car window, just like
00:05:30that slow looking over, like, is this him?
00:05:34And we were sitting in a car because our relationship was limited to that because he lived with his parents
00:05:39and I lived with my parents.
00:05:40Like, where were we supposed to go?
00:05:42So every night we would just sit in the car and just talk for hours.
00:05:45Remember, don't mail it in.
00:05:47Bring it in and get your cash today.
00:05:49He was very intelligent, and that was something that was really important to me.
00:05:52He could carry a conversation and from an amazing, you know, from a really, really good family and with a,
00:05:57you know, great pedigree.
00:06:01We decided we wanted to get our own place.
00:06:05We found this cute little apartment down on First Street.
00:06:09There were no closets in that apartment.
00:06:11And the joke was, well, we just came out of the closet, so I guess we don't need them anymore.
00:06:17Louisville broke the record for an all-time low temperature of minus 22 degrees.
00:06:22One year in, Louisville got hit with a huge snowstorm.
00:06:25We couldn't even go to work, like, businesses were shut down, so it was awesome for us, you know.
00:06:30We snowed in like kids and snowed in school.
00:06:34We, you know, started, you know, talking about things and smoking weed.
00:06:41He told me his story, and his story was he had spent time in jail.
00:06:48He's a deadhead.
00:06:49He followed the Grateful Dead around, and they found some, like, LSD in the car, and he had a gun.
00:06:54And I was like, wow, a gun?
00:06:55Like, that's, why would you, why would someone need a gun?
00:06:58But whatever.
00:06:58I was like, I don't know, I didn't care.
00:07:00You know, like, I love you.
00:07:02It's all right.
00:07:03People make mistakes, right?
00:07:05Now, let's just, let's move on.
00:07:06Let's move, let's move forward.
00:07:09And then from there, it was, hey, look, have you ever done LSD?
00:07:13And this is when I started to realize, like, he doesn't have the switch that people have.
00:07:18It's like, enough is enough.
00:07:21One day, it was on Father's Day, we did some LSD, and I was feeling good.
00:07:27We start, he starts this argument, right, and he gets sick, and he immediately gets angry.
00:07:31He just reaches down and picks up a piece of glass, and he shoves it in my arm.
00:07:35He goes, you see what you made me do?
00:07:36And I'm like, holy shit.
00:07:41And so I'm bleeding, and I was very calmly just get up, and I walk out of the apartment,
00:07:46and I walk next door, and knock on the neighbor's door, and the girl, she opens the door, and says,
00:07:50damn, I was like, would you call the police, please?
00:07:56So I get him kicked out, and that fucker moves in next door.
00:08:06It was scary.
00:08:26This is the Victorian Ghost Walk.
00:08:28It's a once-a-year annual event.
00:08:31People in Victorian attire and period costume are staged to come alive as the spirits.
00:08:42I'm going to sweat a lot of it off.
00:08:43I can tell already.
00:08:46It looks good in the beard, for sure.
00:08:52Because of the sensational murder trial, more people wanted to come see the neighborhood
00:08:57in spite of its sullied reputation.
00:08:59Louisville is an extremely spirited place, spirited with bourbon, and spirited around here with
00:09:08a lot of ghostly figures.
00:09:11I do believe in ghosts.
00:09:13So many people have lived and died in these houses.
00:09:16People have said that they have seen ghostly figures walking through my house.
00:09:21So many people have been laid in the front parlor for three days.
00:09:26I think there were some sad, sad things that happened in those front rooms.
00:09:30My husband passed away in this house.
00:09:33I found him lying on the floor.
00:09:36I felt like somebody was pinching me, which sounds so crazy.
00:09:41But that's what he would have done, just kind of aggravated me.
00:09:45My house had a ghost in it.
00:09:47My cat was the only one who could see it.
00:09:50I never saw it.
00:09:51She was the only one who saw it.
00:09:52But it was always the same place, the same setup, the same time of day.
00:09:58It was there.
00:09:59It was definitely there.
00:10:00Because she would just walk in the room and sit down and...
00:10:11There's a ghost here.
00:10:12There's one back here.
00:10:13Freaked out her brother.
00:10:16The woman...
00:10:18This used to be a brothel back here.
00:10:20That's what the landlord says.
00:10:21I don't think it's a ghost.
00:10:23No, the landlord talked about it years ago.
00:10:24Supposedly it's a woman.
00:10:26That's what her brother said.
00:10:29Gather around me, you see.
00:10:31She will only speak to all of us when she sees the nearer of thee.
00:10:36Every 15 minutes starting at 6 o'clock, a group of 35 to 40 people leaves with a guide.
00:10:42The baby's dead.
00:10:43She's not asleep.
00:10:45These are not professional actors.
00:10:47The reaper comes for souls to keep.
00:10:52Sometimes it's their first acting gig ever.
00:10:57The darker it gets, the spookier it gets and more witches come out.
00:11:10My paranormal friends, they think one of the reasons that this is such a haunted neighborhood is the fact that
00:11:15we have so much stone and brick construction.
00:11:17Because they retain energy, they retain images better than light, airy, wooden constructions would.
00:11:25Louisville is America's most haunted neighborhood because when you have a tour guide telling ghost stories three and four times
00:11:34a night.
00:11:35The more you say their name, the more energy you feed them, the more you're lifting their soul and their
00:11:42essence, so to speak.
00:11:45Well, last year they asked me to play Annie Whipple.
00:11:49Dr. Anderson!
00:11:52Dr. Anderson!
00:11:53Dr. Anderson!
00:11:53I implored!
00:11:53Dr. Anderson!
00:11:54Two doors down, they say a ghost of a governess they call Annie Whipple, walks up and down the staircase.
00:12:02And so my head drooped and my hand dipped its pen in ink and scrawled the message across the page.
00:12:15And when I awoke, the chilling words before me on the page said,
00:12:23You fool! I am not Dr. Anderson!
00:12:31But I want to make sure that I do her justice because I only live a block from her.
00:12:42It's been suggested that we have someone stationed in front of the murder house dragging a blue rubber made tote
00:12:50between the two of them, but we think it's a little too soon to go there.
00:12:56When I moved in across the street from the murder house, I was taking a lot of baths. I had
00:13:02an awesome clawfoot tub I spent a lot of time in.
00:13:10I started noticing a figure walking back and forth in front of the windows.
00:13:15And so I thought, oh, maybe at first this is somebody sneaking into that house.
00:13:20But I kept seeing that person in the window. Sometimes their hair is long. Sometimes their hair is short.
00:13:26And after a while, I realized, that person's not alive.
00:13:33I drew a sketch. I put it on my Instagram. And I said, yeah, I think that's Jamie Carroll's ghost
00:13:41trying to get my attention.
00:13:51I wanted to piece together a more complete portrait of Jamie Carroll. He had lived and worked for a while
00:13:58in Paintsville, Kentucky, where he ran a hair salon.
00:14:03Jamie was just a great person. Jamie would give you the shirt off his back and not expect anything in
00:14:09return.
00:14:11He was a mommy's boy. He made sure mom had groceries. You know, he made sure that mom was taken
00:14:16care of.
00:14:17He would stop by and see me. He always did come by and see me. Sometimes I could tell he
00:14:24was not himself. He was, he was just, he was, I better not say that.
00:14:33But he was, he was not himself. Maybe drugs or whatever.
00:14:41The name of Jamie's shop was Illusions. We was there a lot at night because, you know, Jamie did a
00:14:47lot of his secret business there.
00:14:49You know, making his money on the side there.
00:14:52His international house of business.
00:15:01He would mix all kinds of powder, besides hair chemical.
00:15:06He was our coke and meth dealer. I mean, I can tell you from experience, I mean, you know, I
00:15:11was addicted to meth for many years.
00:15:13Started doing meth and coke, 15, 14 year old, and with Jamie. You know, tyloxes, smoking weed, doing ecstasy, whatever
00:15:22I could get with him.
00:15:23Yeah, we've partied together. We've, we've been stupid. I've been a stupid mother, but...
00:15:29I'm never really a stupid mother. She's a fun mother.
00:15:34But when I would party with Jamie, I would carry around his little bag of his stash, whatever.
00:15:39And I would sell it for him.
00:15:41They'd be like, give me a 10, and I'd give him a little $10 bag or whatever.
00:15:44He used to have those little cute little meth bags that had little cherries on them.
00:15:47That's how you knew they were Jamie's.
00:15:48You'd find one laying around in paints full empty, and you'd say, that's Jamie's.
00:15:52He'd tell people when we first walked in, you know, this is my fag hag, you don't mess with her,
00:15:56and everything's okay.
00:15:57He had your back. You were protected when you was with Jamie.
00:16:01Around here, Jamie was a protector. He was a provider.
00:16:03But he had to get away from here to make all the money that he brought back into this place.
00:16:08And he thought that's the only way he would get accepted when he got here, was to provide for people.
00:16:14It started with coke, and it flowed like snow in the Alps there.
00:16:24Someone introduced Jamie to crack, and that's when it went downhill.
00:16:31Jamie lost the salon. Jamie lost the house. Jamie lost Jamie lost Jamie.
00:16:36And then it went to methamphetamine.
00:16:41That's the last thing I know that he sold.
00:16:47I can remember Jamie coming to visit me once in my apartment.
00:16:52And I look over and Jamie's in the floor.
00:16:57And I said, what are you doing? Get up.
00:17:02He said, bitch, I can't. I'm high. I said, on what?
00:17:10I said, bitch, you're smoking cat litter.
00:17:12She said, your cat shits rocks, girl, okay? She said.
00:17:17The meth that was around back then was like stuff that you had to go away from here and get.
00:17:21So the town hadn't seen the stuff like that, only the gay community.
00:17:24They call it high speed chicken feed.
00:17:26Because around here, you know, it's everybody on it.
00:17:28It's high speed when they're on it.
00:17:30How do you explain it?
00:17:31That's about it. It sums it up. You can do it all.
00:17:34And for days, there's no rest. You don't need no rest.
00:17:38It kind of decreases your inhibitions.
00:17:40It lets you put what you feel is your best foot forward, which it may not be, you know.
00:17:47That was what the crystal meth of that time really done and took it.
00:17:52That's how it took a hold of the small communities around here.
00:17:57This would be 13 and a half pounds of meth.
00:18:01Almost enough to fill a giant bag of cat food.
00:18:03The drug epidemic reaching every corner of Louisville.
00:18:07The biggest meth bust in the city's history.
00:18:10Over 34 pounds of meth.
00:18:12What happened was crystal meth came in.
00:18:15Then the scene changed.
00:18:18I can always tell when someone's doing meth, their eyes are darting a lot.
00:18:23They twitch a lot, move a lot.
00:18:25Very tweaky is the word, a tweak.
00:18:27They tweak a lot.
00:18:30We used to call, crystal meth was called Tina.
00:18:35Because Tina Turner was very popular and she would da-da-da-da-da, you know.
00:18:39So we call it Tina.
00:18:41Are we going to do some Tina?
00:18:42Yeah, I think I'm going to do some Tina tonight.
00:18:44I'll be fine.
00:18:47You know?
00:18:48You can tell by the teeth.
00:18:51How the decay in the teeth and things like that from using meth.
00:18:54They chew on their cheek.
00:18:56Crystal meth made your ambitions go away.
00:18:59And people were like, yeah, I could take on the world.
00:19:03You know?
00:19:03And a lot of times it meant, yeah, I could take on the world.
00:19:14I was gone for a couple of years because I had been in prison for drugs.
00:19:19So I came back to Louisville.
00:19:21I wanted to get high and have sex.
00:19:23And so I got online and me and Jamie hooked up.
00:19:32He came over to the hotel room that I was at.
00:19:35And we had sex on like 15 ounces of crystal meth.
00:19:40And I had a blast.
00:19:45During that time, I also met Jace online late night after clubbing.
00:19:53Um, messaged each other off of Adam for Adam.
00:19:57He and I were both high on crystal meth.
00:20:01The first time Joey and I met, we did drugs.
00:20:04Which was very exciting sexually.
00:20:07He loved, loved, loved latex, rubber, gear, forced chemicals, bondage.
00:20:14All things that were new to me that he got me to try.
00:20:29I mean, I don't know the best way to describe it, but it makes, it basically makes you incredibly horny.
00:20:35He was into bondage and I liked having threesomes.
00:21:01That's how Jamie, James and I ended up having that freeway.
00:21:13I guess you probably would hear a lot of people say this, but like I don't have a problem being
00:21:18high and like knowing what's going on.
00:21:22Jeffrey Munt was one of those people who absolutely loses touch with reality.
00:21:27Um, being high on crystal meth.
00:21:33Chase is having a, I guess, toxic reaction to something he ate or not being able to eat.
00:21:41See, he's passed out in the bed after trying to clean up the room.
00:21:52They're off in the Kentucky Derby.
00:21:57Attorneys deliver opening arguments on a love triangle murder case.
00:22:01In May, right after the Kentucky Derby, Jeffrey Munt stood trial.
00:22:06Joey Banis had already been found guilty for the murder of Jamie Carroll.
00:22:11Accused killer Jeffrey Munt scheduled to be in court today.
00:22:14Once again, Judge Mitch Perry presided in the courtroom, and familiar figures sat at the table for the prosecution.
00:22:22Three men entered.
00:22:24Two men leave.
00:22:25Two men leave.
00:22:26But the defense team had a markedly different makeup.
00:22:29What he just told you is a lie, and you'll know it.
00:22:32Dramatically, Romines went to the Rubbermaid storage bin and rolled it to the side, as if to convey to the
00:22:39jury that he and everybody else recognized it as a cheap gimmick.
00:22:44It's easy to defend a case when your defense is the truth.
00:22:50We'll prove to you before this trial is over, Jeff Munt is innocent.
00:22:55I know Steve from some of the cases he has in my courtroom.
00:22:59I call him big money.
00:23:01Yes.
00:23:02Steve Romines is one of the more well-paid, well-known criminal defense attorneys.
00:23:09There are certain type of cases that I prefer not to take.
00:23:12The first is, and this is a sad reality of it, is can they afford to defend the case properly?
00:23:20He wins a lot.
00:23:22Jeff Munt is innocent and will prove to you that they know it.
00:23:27He acts exactly like a very high-priced lawyer should act.
00:23:30They have had the evidence in their hands, and they have either ignored it, they have disregarded it, or they
00:23:36have hidden it.
00:23:38It doesn't come any more theatrical than that.
00:23:40That's what you're paying him for.
00:23:42You're going to get the whole truth.
00:23:44In fact, you're going to start it this afternoon.
00:23:47Joey Banis' own words.
00:23:48Let's hear him.
00:23:51I'm recording my death for the purpose of informing all informed or all concerned of my own willful suicide and
00:23:58the complete non-involvement or culpability of anyone else.
00:24:02Specifically of my boyfriend, lover, life partner, and friend, my one, Jeffrey Steven Munt.
00:24:08We felt like that was the single most powerful piece of evidence in the entire case.
00:24:18This includes killing someone.
00:24:21It's a confession.
00:24:23He's confessing to the murder, and he's confessing to threatening Jeff about it, to holding Jeff hostage, to violence against
00:24:31Jeff.
00:24:32The police and the prosecution had this the entire time, and they had never seen it until I showed it
00:24:41to the jury in opening statement.
00:24:42You clearly had not reviewed these videos.
00:24:46No, sir.
00:24:47Some of this information would have been helpful in retrospect, would it?
00:24:51Sir, it would have been very helpful.
00:24:53The reason why, and it's simple now, the police's forensic evaluations of computers were done with PCs, and that video
00:25:06was filmed on an Apple or a Mac.
00:25:11I'm thinking, okay, well, this is, this is a slam dunk.
00:25:15You've got this guy saying he's, he's doing, he's gonna commit suicide, he's clearing his lover.
00:25:20But then when it got back to the prosecutors a few days later, they come back, wait, there's a start
00:25:24to this.
00:25:25I guess at this point, Judge, I would move for a mission of that, permission to play it.
00:25:28And Judge, let's, let's not make some misimpression. There are three different videos.
00:25:32Judge, can we approach?
00:25:36There's three separate videos at this time.
00:25:38The impression was given that there's, that somehow we cut one of them off or whatever.
00:25:42Right, so.
00:25:43Two clips on the same day.
00:25:44Yeah, but again, there, there, it's not like we, we somehow edited it out or anything like that.
00:25:49The defense for Mr. Munt only played a portion of the video.
00:25:53And there is no doubt that they did not play the beginning part that was not that beneficial to them.
00:26:00Go ahead.
00:26:06All right now.
00:26:11Hello?
00:26:19Okay, please.
00:26:22So this is Joey's explanation of what he says happened during the recording of that video.
00:26:33This is a check to see if the video camera is recording correctly and setting it up for the suicidal
00:26:40farewell.
00:26:41I was sick of Jace and didn't want to be with him anymore.
00:26:45Jace would not let me go.
00:26:47He had threatened me and threatened my family.
00:26:49The only way was to completely absolve him of all responsibility.
00:26:54So Jace wrote out a script and told me to read it in front of the flip video camera connected
00:26:59to my computer.
00:27:00I'm sorry for any pain that this causes.
00:27:10Okay.
00:27:11Jace, Jace, Jace.
00:27:13Look.
00:27:16I tried to give you the...
00:27:20I tried to give you what you need.
00:27:23Is that it?
00:27:24Thank you, that's perfect.
00:27:25Okay.
00:27:27You can see who's in charge.
00:27:29You can see who's making this happen.
00:27:32And it, uh, it clearly is not Mr. Banis.
00:27:38You have Munt almost seeming to dictate what Banis was going to say.
00:27:43So you're right back to the start of who, who is guilty here?
00:27:47Every time you thought you knew, you didn't really know.
00:27:54A big twist today as the trial continues for the second man charge.
00:27:58Joseph Banis expected to testify against Jeffrey Munt.
00:28:01The courtroom perked up when bailiff Brown escorted Joey Banis in an orange jumpsuit to the stand.
00:28:08As Banis passed in front of the defense table, he gave his ex-boyfriend a strange, lovesick look.
00:28:16Banis agreed to testify in exchange for prosecutors dropping the death penalty.
00:28:20He was the prosecution's star witness, just like Jeff was the prosecution's star witness in Joey's case.
00:28:27Do you swear in front of the testimony you're about to give will be the truth and the whole truth?
00:28:30Yes, I do, Your Honor.
00:28:31Go ahead.
00:28:32Can you introduce yourself to the master of the jury, please?
00:28:35My name is Joseph.
00:28:36It's your Banis.
00:28:37One of the things that we intended to introduce was Jeffrey's testimony from Joey's trial.
00:28:44So that the jury could hear his testimony, his version of events.
00:28:48If the jury in Jeffrey Munt's trial would have been able to hear both sides, they would have been able
00:28:53to see the whole story.
00:28:56But the court did not allow that to happen.
00:28:58What happened on December the 14th, 2009?
00:29:01We're all getting it on.
00:29:03We were comfortable.
00:29:03We were in bed together.
00:29:05The three of us started, you know, watching porn and, you know, some music was on and we were playing
00:29:11around in the bed and so forth.
00:29:13Jeff suggested that he still had some money that he would like to spend and since the drugs were good,
00:29:19could Jamie get him some more?
00:29:22And Jamie said, oh yeah, sure.
00:29:24When Jamie was gone, Jeff asked, do you think anybody would miss Jamie?
00:29:31We could just take his drugs.
00:29:33When Jamie came back in, we decided we were going to play together, have sex together.
00:29:40After we were done, I got up to get dressed.
00:29:45I heard a noise and when I turned around, Jamie and Jeff were struggling.
00:29:49And they tumbled to the floor.
00:29:52They started struggling.
00:29:53I was still thinking this was some type of sex scene that was going on because that was one of
00:29:58the things we did involving in role play.
00:30:00Jamie yelled out, Joey, Joey, help me.
00:30:03Jamie started screaming, no, Joey, no, no, no, please no.
00:30:06I saw blood flying and I saw a knife in Jeff's hands.
00:30:11Joey had a knife in his hand and was slashing at Jamie's throat.
00:30:15There was blood that was literally everywhere.
00:30:19I mean, you could actually smell the blood.
00:30:21And I don't know where Jeff pulled it from, but he got a gun and it was the .38 Smith
00:30:27& Wesson.
00:30:27Joey takes several steps back and grabs a gun.
00:30:31And he shot Jamie.
00:30:32And Joey shot him, I believe, twice.
00:30:34I thought Jeff was perhaps going to shoot me.
00:30:38He said he would kill me and kill my family.
00:30:41He would go and kill my family and kill my cats.
00:30:46Threatening Jeff's cats, that's now a crime in Kentucky.
00:30:50Threatening the pets of someone you're in a domestic relationship with is now a crime
00:30:55because that has shown our evolving understanding of the dynamics of domestic violence and sexual abuse.
00:31:03Jay said that we were going to wait till Home Depot or Lowe's opened.
00:31:08Go there.
00:31:09Get a plastic tub.
00:31:11Get some lime.
00:31:13Joey was worried that it might start to smell.
00:31:15And I suggested sprinkling lime.
00:31:17I didn't know what the hell lime was, but he's familiar with it from gardening
00:31:25and from some movie where it's used to cover up the smell of decaying bodies.
00:31:31We got some type of cordage, some type of rope, something to help, you know, close the box that he
00:31:38was going to be put in.
00:31:40Jamie's body had gone into rigor mortis, and I held the body.
00:31:46He sledgehammered Jamie's kneecaps.
00:31:50Joey hit him with a sledgehammer so that the bones broke.
00:31:55And I guess the muscles relaxed and moved, whatever.
00:31:58And he was put into the container.
00:32:03I don't remember it being a particularly difficult task.
00:32:10Jeffrey's testimony from trial one, it did paint him in more of an accurate light.
00:32:15He was cold, self-serving, and calculating.
00:32:18And because we weren't able to show the real testimony, the real him in that way, I think that that
00:32:24hurt us.
00:32:25All right, let's keep going.
00:32:27Ms. Banks, you're a thief, you're a drug dealer, you're a murderer, and you're a liar, correct?
00:32:34No.
00:32:35Now, you told Detective Lesher the night that you were arrested that he worked for the NSA and was a
00:32:43secret agent slash assassin, didn't he?
00:32:47Mr. Munt had told me that in the past, he had worked for the U.S. government, and he told
00:32:53me that it was for the NSA.
00:32:55You're just making stuff up, aren't you?
00:32:57Your client is the one who told, where did he get a bullet in his head?
00:33:01Now, the NSA...
00:33:02That's why I never knew what to believe or not to believe.
00:33:05You know what not to believe?
00:33:06Okay, tell me.
00:33:10You...
00:33:13A Lurid Louisville murder trial took yet another trend today.
00:33:17Plenty of other Lurid details coming out.
00:33:19Conroy continued to work her way through the evidence, then brought up the sex tape.
00:33:25Have you reviewed prior to your testimony here today a video where Joseph Banas and Jeffrey Munt are engaged in
00:33:34sexual relations after the murder of Jamie Carroll?
00:33:37Yes, ma'am, I did.
00:33:38About 12 minutes long.
00:33:40May stop it before the end of it.
00:33:42Judge, ma'am, we approach before this one is played.
00:33:44This is designed to do nothing more than to inflame the passions of the jury.
00:33:48And Judge, I...
00:33:49How graphic is it?
00:33:50How much do you intend to play?
00:33:51Not...not much.
00:33:52I mean, this is not necessarily what I want to do on a Wednesday afternoon, but it's about the nature
00:33:56of the relationship.
00:33:57The evidence is what the evidence is.
00:33:58The argument that a sexual relationship between an abused person and an abuser somehow influences that relationship is absurd.
00:34:09The only purpose is we have straight people, straight men on the jury, and it's to inflame the jurors against
00:34:16Mr. Munt with this graphic sexual test.
00:34:18The best combo, if there's any way to avoid the graphic nature of this, either there's not...
00:34:22Not on this one.
00:34:24I'm going to allow you to do it.
00:34:26All right.
00:34:28Is it raw?
00:34:28It is raw.
00:34:32You're going to ride it instead?
00:34:34I'm going to ride it or else you're going to second pile drive it.
00:34:37I might be able to do that.
00:34:39Yeah.
00:34:44Ears reddening, Jeffrey Munt looks straight ahead for the entire length of the clip, as the jury and everyone else
00:34:51in the courtroom watch Joey and Jeffrey have sex on the screen.
00:34:56Say hi.
00:34:57Who's your bitch?
00:34:58My fucking bitch.
00:35:00Huh?
00:35:01Joey's my fucking bitch.
00:35:02My little bottom bitch.
00:35:04Is he right?
00:35:06I'm a bottom bitch boy.
00:35:08I'm going to stick my cock in his ass whenever the fuck I want.
00:35:11Ride him.
00:35:13Like ride my fucking cock.
00:35:16Jeff doesn't appear distressed.
00:35:18Jeff isn't crying.
00:35:19Jeff isn't begging for Joey to stop.
00:35:22You need to lift your ass up.
00:35:23Go ahead.
00:35:24If anything, it was Jeffrey Munt who was directing what was going to happen and calling the shots.
00:35:31They wanted to show that Jeff was a top and that therefore he could not have been the victim of
00:35:38an abusive relationship.
00:35:39Which any, that's bullshit.
00:35:48Everybody that was in the courtroom was texting.
00:35:50They're playing porn.
00:35:52In Division 3, you better get here now.
00:35:59After the first 10 seconds or so, it was like, okay, we've seen enough.
00:36:04Do we really have to see all of this?
00:36:08You would have heard a pin drop.
00:36:09It was such an uncomfortable moment.
00:36:13We stopped it before Jeffrey Munt said the N-word.
00:36:18We thought that that would be crossing the line and risk offending people.
00:36:25All right.
00:36:27I need a break.
00:36:28It's very hard to defend somebody you believe is innocent when there are salacious facts.
00:36:34I'm not sure why sex is any more offensive than stabbing and shooting a person.
00:36:39The dominant narrative here was that Jeff didn't participate in any of this willingly.
00:36:48Romines then had Latonya Jones on the stand, an advocacy programs administrator for nine years with the Kentucky Domestic Violence
00:36:56Association in Frankfurt.
00:36:58She established that Jeffrey Munt displayed all the signs of a typical battered spouse.
00:37:04I was called as an educational witness.
00:37:06My purpose was to educate the jury about the dynamics of domestic violence.
00:37:12Putting on that evidence was important so that the jury would know the truth of what a traumatic, abusive relationship
00:37:21is.
00:37:22These relationships where there is violence and where power and control sits at the heart don't make a lot of
00:37:31sense to people who are not inside of those relationships.
00:37:34Her relevance to the whole thing was marginal at best because she was talking in theoretical domestic violence terms and
00:37:44not necessarily about anything specific to this case.
00:37:47So if I came to you and I said, well, this guy claims he's being battered, but I've got a
00:37:53video of them having sex.
00:37:54May we approve.
00:37:55It would be improper for an expert of any type to testify to the ultimate issue.
00:38:03That would be the legal phrase.
00:38:04So to ask, is Jeffrey Munt a victim of domestic violence?
00:38:08You can't ask her that.
00:38:10I'll withdraw the question, Judge.
00:38:11Um, no.
00:38:12May we approve?
00:38:14I want an admonishment to the jury.
00:38:16He did that on purpose.
00:38:17And you know that he did.
00:38:18I want an admonishment.
00:38:20The ongoing sexual relationship is not controversial.
00:38:22It's not cutting edge theory.
00:38:24It is accepted in this area of expertise.
00:38:26Counsel.
00:38:27Yes, sir.
00:38:27You became very close to simply defying this court in an inappropriate fashion.
00:38:34The question was so suggestive of the facts and evidence in this case.
00:38:38I cannot imagine why you did what you did.
00:38:41All right.
00:38:41Stand by.
00:38:42Sorry.
00:38:44Ladies and gentlemen, please disregard that last question and answer.
00:38:48The facts of this particular case will be decided by you and you only.
00:38:53You can't unring a bell.
00:38:55When a judge tells jurors to forget what they just heard.
00:39:01If they were bored before the judge said that, I guarantee you that they're interested now.
00:39:09Both sides rested their case today.
00:39:11It was day nine of this trial.
00:39:12Closing arguments are currently underway.
00:39:14If you are a victim, if you are a witness, if you are a hostage, you act like it.
00:39:21It's the final chapter in a twisted tale of sex drugs and murder.
00:39:24It was going to take you live downtown right now to the courthouse where we're about to get a verdict.
00:39:31Mr. Mutt, can you stand please?
00:39:34All right.
00:39:45The jury deliberated for nearly eight hours before finding a Louisville man not guilty of killing his former lover and
00:39:51drug dealer.
00:39:52I was just dumbstruck.
00:39:53Like, how in the hell did a jury find him not guilty of murder?
00:39:59They beat him with a sledgehammer.
00:40:01They'd stuff him in a Rubbermaid in their basement.
00:40:05And for six months, they live happily ever after.
00:40:10I still can't believe that he's not guilty.
00:40:13Jeffrey Mutt was convicted of lesser charges.
00:40:16Convicting him of robbery and tampering.
00:40:17Three years for robbery and five years for tampering.
00:40:21The wrong message was sent here, which is that you can, in fact, get away with murder.
00:40:28The jury simply got it wrong.
00:40:36What happens in a courtroom, it's about winning and losing.
00:40:41Very rarely do we truly get an honest view of what happened.
00:40:48And that, for me, makes it difficult to trust a system that we would call a justice system.
00:41:05Follow me.
00:41:07So as we walk down the steps here, this basement is what I use for storage of my files.
00:41:12This was one of the exhibits that we showed at trial.
00:41:15Looking at that individual, that is not the individual that presented himself to that jury.
00:41:20We know that's the real Mr. Mutt.
00:41:24That's the real Jeffrey.
00:41:27I was the only one that ever visited Jeff in jail.
00:41:31He kept promising me that he would tell me the full story.
00:41:35But he didn't want to talk about it there.
00:41:37Of course, in jail, it's being recorded and all that.
00:41:40Mutt made parole a year after his trial, having served just four years of his eight-year sentence.
00:41:50And when he got released, we went and picked him up and brought him back to Louisville and we had
00:41:56lunch with his parents.
00:41:57No, we had lunch at Red Lobster.
00:42:01And then that was it.
00:42:03After he was paroled and basically served his time, he kind of disappeared.
00:42:08And no one even knows where he is today.
00:42:11So you don't know where he is?
00:42:13Last I knew was Baltimore.
00:42:17And he told me that he got a job at a movie theater and he wouldn't tell people he was
00:42:24from Louisville.
00:42:25And then slowly he stopped talking to me and then he ghosted me.
00:42:31Yeah.
00:42:33And I think that's what hurts the most.
00:42:36To think how I tried to be such a good friend and then all of a sudden, nothing.
00:42:43Can I ask you a question?
00:42:45Yeah.
00:42:46Have you been able to locate Jeff?
00:42:48No, I was going to ask if you, do you know where he is?
00:42:52See, that's a lot of stuff that I just am not, and I don't mean to be a stick in
00:42:57the mud and I don't mean to be a lawyer's lawyer.
00:42:59Uh, although I'm kind of proud of being that.
00:43:02Um, I gotta go.
00:43:04Yeah. I'm sorry.
00:43:05I hope I wasn't too circumspect.
00:43:08Much like reading a book about it, Jeff's case is over for me.
00:43:12Much like a lot of clients, I don't keep up with them when, when my case with them is over.
00:43:17I assume he's doing well.
00:43:20So the question is, where is Jeffrey Munt?
00:43:23Your guess is as good as mine, but I will make an agreement with you.
00:43:28If you find him, you let me know, and if I find him, I'll let you know.
00:43:36This is a prepaid collect call from...
00:43:39Joseph Bates.
00:43:40An incarcerated individual. This call will be recorded and may be monitored.
00:43:51Were you surprised that Jeffrey just disappeared?
00:43:56Uh, no.
00:43:57It doesn't surprise me that he could stay off the grid, um, build up a new identity, any of those
00:44:04things.
00:44:04He told me that he did that type of stuff.
00:44:08Obviously, I was disappointed because I'm in prison for something somebody else did.
00:44:16The laptop that we actually have here is a digital copy of Joey's laptop.
00:44:25In this case, with all the videoing they did of each other, it was overwhelming because, at that time, there
00:44:32was no digital forensic unit of the Louisville Metro Police Department.
00:44:35There wasn't a way to sift through all of that information.
00:44:39There's a lot of files, over 700,000 files.
00:44:43It was a one terabyte or tegabyte or...
00:44:46It was a big one.
00:44:48I clicked on every link that I could go through, but could not access anything on a Mac.
00:44:56I guarantee you there's information on his laptop that people haven't seen.
00:45:00I guarantee you that.
00:45:06You know, I had all kinds of little recording devices, and I was always trying to get him to admit
00:45:14what really happened.
00:45:16How many people have you killed, Jason?
00:45:19Only myself, Joey. Only myself.
00:45:22I doubt that.
00:45:24He was cagey as hell, because, you know, I mean, he's in the background and not saying very much of
00:45:29anything.
00:45:32Don't care about me.
00:45:36Well, that wasn't even fucking recording.
00:45:40Why do you think I was hamming it up, hey?
00:45:42Going up for what I've done?
00:45:44Oh, yeah, I'm sure of you.
00:45:48Yeah, what I've really done, that way you're mad that I've done.
00:45:50You can't even fucking tell me fucking...
00:45:52What I've done.
00:45:54And what fucking...
00:45:56You can't talk to me without getting the gun out.
00:45:59You need to be careful.
00:46:01About doubt. Not so much in yourself, but in others.
00:46:04What?
00:46:05Doubt. G-O-U-B-T.
00:46:07What are you fucking talking about?
00:46:10I don't understand.
00:46:11Lack of belief.
00:46:12Doubt.
00:46:13Doubt what, Jase?
00:46:14I said you better be careful.
00:46:17People will doubt you.
00:46:20He kept on threatening you.
00:46:21Saying, uh, Joey, uh, you can never say anything to anybody about this because nobody will ever believe you.
00:46:27Uh, because you have the criminal record and I don't.
00:46:31It was, uh, it was not a healthy relationship.
00:46:34Approaches
00:46:35Right
00:46:37Totally
00:46:37Native
00:46:38Was
00:46:38Was
00:46:38Alsohouse
00:46:38You
00:46:38You
00:46:57Did
00:47:00$
00:47:11Joey missed me or something and wanted me to come back after GLOW.
00:47:17And they had that new house in Old Louisville.
00:47:22And then I was Joey's assistant there for a while.
00:47:35When I first went to Joey and Jason's house, they took me down to the basement and to show
00:47:41me where the laundry room was and stuff.
00:47:46They tried to give me that guy's clothes and said that the guy had just basically left
00:47:51them there and went back home.
00:47:53He didn't want them, I guess.
00:47:54And they were a little big on me, obviously.
00:47:57So I was like, no, I don't need them.
00:48:00It was kind of traumatizing to think about that I was there feeding cats and there was
00:48:05a dead body downstairs and I just didn't know it yet.
00:48:12You know, that could have been me.
00:48:14And the way that my life was going then, it almost was me.
00:48:23We started to hook up a few different times.
00:48:26But I would pull back because it just seemed weird, the two of them, their connection.
00:48:31Something weird was going on there, like just the way they talked to each other.
00:48:36You could feel the tension between the two of them a lot.
00:48:59Every single bedroom had its own padlock, like the key ring was just a bunch of padlock keys.
00:49:06Every single door had its own padlock, it was very, very weird.
00:49:14Jeff had lost his job at the end of January, after the murder, and never put in a resume for
00:49:24another job.
00:49:26You know, he was supposedly renovating this house and turning it into a bed and breakfast.
00:49:33But basically, he was in serious debt.
00:49:38If they were planning to fix it up, they hadn't gotten far.
00:49:42That house was in complete disarray.
00:49:45It does seem like they were desperate for money.
00:50:01They had the telltale signs of two people that were living daily high on meth.
00:50:06I mean, they did a tour of their apartment showing off their counterfeiting process.
00:50:11No one does that unless you're just completely out of your mind on meth.
00:50:15I'm all about drug use. I love drugs.
00:50:17You know, a little theft by deception, sure, I've done that as well.
00:50:21But guess what? I'm not a computer programmer.
00:50:25This was something he was totally into.
00:50:27He was really good with computers.
00:50:30He was really good with online stuff and figuring all kinds of stuff out.
00:50:36I kept feeling that he was going to turn on me and try and throw me under the bus for
00:50:41everything.
00:50:42And so there was a time when I started documenting his criminal activities, though,
00:50:49particularly the counterfeiting and stuff.
00:50:51What are you doing?
00:50:53I'm editing the dollar bill.
00:50:54A hundred.
00:50:55The revert up still.
00:50:57Well, yes, that's how fast it paints on the screen.
00:51:00To put it this way, this would be seven HDTVs wide and five tall, the image size that we're editing.
00:51:09It's that high resolution.
00:51:27We've made all this counterfeit money, and we're going up to Chicago to turn a counterfeit money into real money.
00:51:48We got to the Hyatt Hotel on Wacker Drive in Chicago, and I asked Joey if he had any wands
00:51:56to tip the ballet with.
00:51:59And then I got changed from the ballet.
00:52:02He passed off a bill to the guy in broad daylight up there, the ballet.
00:52:09He was so spun out on meth that he grabbed stuff that he wasn't basically trashed.
00:52:15He grabbed some tester bills that had been washed and scrubbed and printed on over and over again to test
00:52:23the color and passed it to the ballet.
00:52:25Quick news. This is Wake 3 News.
00:52:28Suit Louisville men are behind bars in Chicago now after police found $50,000 in counterfeit cash in their hotel
00:52:34room.
00:52:35I couldn't believe it was the same Jeff I knew.
00:52:37It didn't look like him.
00:52:39He didn't look happy.
00:52:40He looked angry.
00:52:41Well, obviously he just got...
00:52:43Arrested.
00:52:44Arrested.
00:52:45They also found weapons, fake IDs, and a suspected date rape drug.
00:52:50I grew up a sheltered life.
00:52:52I don't know that much about drugs or anything.
00:52:56And, you know, people would say, you didn't know?
00:52:58I mean, he's always sniffling.
00:53:00I'm like, well, he said he had allergies.
00:53:02Yeah.
00:53:08We get arrested and I knew that my bail would be higher because I had a felony record.
00:53:14And so I told the detectives that he didn't know anything about it.
00:53:18It was all my stuff.
00:53:20I was trying to get him released on the lower box so that he could come and bail me out.
00:53:28So the funny thing about being scared of me doesn't really hold water because, you know,
00:53:33I mean, I was basically someplace where I couldn't get to him.
00:53:36I couldn't do anything.
00:53:37He couldn't have left me at jail.
00:53:41But anyways, he came back and paid $20,000 to get me out of jail.
00:53:53I come back to Louisville with him and it becomes just a terrible, terrible situation where there's no resolution.
00:54:05What?
00:54:06I'm not getting into the apron.
00:54:08I have a cigarette playing.
00:54:09I don't care.
00:54:10I don't want to hurt you.
00:54:11I don't want to hurt you.
00:54:12I don't care.
00:54:13You're only out.
00:54:14Do you understand?
00:54:15Goddamn, quit!
00:54:16I'm quitting.
00:54:18I quit.
00:54:19It's over.
00:54:20Fine.
00:54:21Oh, great.
00:54:21Now it's over.
00:54:23Fucking asshole!
00:54:24You just said quit.
00:54:25What do you want me to quit?
00:54:26Quit!
00:54:27You're goddamn pushing!
00:54:28All I want is for us to move forward!
00:54:32Great.
00:54:33Then move forward.
00:54:35Stop fucking making me your problem.
00:54:55What did you take?
00:54:57I didn't take anything.
00:55:00Chase!
00:55:01Chase!
00:55:02Chase!
00:55:04Chase!
00:55:06Chase!
00:55:08What is wrong with you?
00:55:14What did you take?
00:55:15Or what did I do, Chase?
00:55:19Chase!
00:55:22My head is bald.
00:55:26But she becomes a bullet.
00:55:30Point of a card.
00:55:32Of Slava.
00:55:55The next line is that I feel fine.
00:55:58And I didn't know that you were even fucking awake.
00:56:099-1-1 operator walker where's your emergency please 1435 south 4th street my ex-boyfriend
00:56:14is attacking me in my house please call me immediately who is attacking your door joey
00:56:19venus while i was sleeping off um being up days on meth he took my keys my phone my wallet
00:56:29went to the guest bedroom and uh called 9-1-1 and uh took a hammer banged it on the
00:56:37door and made you
00:56:38know background noises i can't get rid of him
00:56:45told him that his soon-to-be ex-boyfriend was trying to kill him which i wasn't i was asleep
00:56:52and they should break into the house and arrest me so the domestic run comes out they make the run
00:56:59separate the parties while they're separated munt says to one of the officers that bannis killed a
00:57:09guy the officer comes downstairs and tells bannis may your boyfriend must be really mad at you he
00:57:14just accused you of killing somebody anyways he won't come out of the bedroom until i'm in cuffs
00:57:20when i come out of the bedroom he says uh he's killed someone and at that point and i was
00:57:26like
00:57:27no no no no no yeah i didn't kill anyone he killed the person you know and i'll be happy
00:57:34to take you
00:57:34and give you the story so i went down to the uh homicide department and i started giving a statement
00:57:43so he comes down he tells lesher everything about what happened with this but he puts it all on munt
00:57:50police were definitely not inclined to believe me you're not making this stuff up this is not a lie
00:57:57to get back at him because you were arrested for you know a different crime
00:58:05munt came in there and uh acted at first like he didn't know anything about the case or the murder
00:58:11or the body or anything and then when he was about to be given a polygraph test he said that
00:58:18he couldn't
00:58:18take it because he'd been lying to them all along i mean everything i told you panned out correct
00:58:24the one thing i keyed on was munt talks about that bannis slipped the throat bannis says that
00:58:30munt stabbed him in the neck doesn't talk about slipping the throat if you look at the autopsy report
00:58:36it looks like they're stab wounds not not a slit
00:58:42that might seem like not a big deal i think that is a huge deal why is that not part
00:58:48of the story
00:58:49i don't know you all are writing a story not me i didn't write the story i'm literally just reading
00:58:58what's in the case file but i've learned over the years you know my time and and homicide and and
00:59:05working narcotics that your your motive you don't really have to kill somebody to rob them of their
00:59:11their dope of their money especially like as brutal as what that was this was extremely personal
00:59:18why would you do this i mean there there is no real motive for this jamie was a low-level
00:59:23drug
00:59:24dealer who probably had a couple hundred dollars on him that night he probably didn't have enough
00:59:28drugs to make it through the week we had a theory
00:59:35i mean the killing occurred during the middle of a sex act i think it was a thrill
00:59:46this is a prepaid collect call from joseph an incarcerated individual this call is not private
00:59:54if you believe this should be a private call please hang up all facilities ultimately i mean it all
01:00:00comes down to this and and jb they were both there to talk to me
01:00:10we had a couple three ways um i was normally restrained um they were both normally you know
01:00:19and um jace had actual ropes that you used to tie people up he knew a zillion different world tying
01:00:28tricks and knots and all that type of stuff and um it was fun but i had to go to
01:00:36work in the morning
01:00:37and it infuriated him that jamie and i stayed behind in his bun's house um in his bed
01:00:48uh continuing to get high and have sex while he had to go to work that was the the uh
01:00:56seed that
01:00:57germinated into uh the jealousy that caused the murder when the murder actually occurred i was restrained
01:01:08you know when i was tied up and and jamie was asking me joey help me and i couldn't help
01:01:14him i
01:01:14mean i've had nightmares about that for years i was plagued by the sound of his voice asking me to
01:01:21help
01:01:21him and you know i i just i couldn't do anything you have one minute left ultimately my friend died
01:01:31because jamie was my friend um and i feel terrible about that i have pictures of him i think seven
01:01:42days before the murder looking over my shoulder we were both smiling and just like we were friends
01:01:53i hate months because ultimately he killed jamie and really destroyed my life too uh goodbye
01:02:09why do you think joey asked me to reach out to you well i guess because he wanted someone to
01:02:16paint
01:02:17him in a good light here's what's up how long was that body there seven months and neither one of
01:02:28them
01:02:29took the opportunity at some point to say hey i'm living with crazy and uh and there's a dead guy
01:02:38in my
01:02:39basement neither one of them fuck both of them what everyone forgets is that jamie carroll
01:02:53died and so i decided i'm like i'm gonna do it for him because he doesn't have a voice and
01:02:57i do
01:03:00from what i've gathered the body was very well maintained because of the line
01:03:05i'm glad it preserved him i'm glad he raised enough hell from that little box so
01:03:10we could get him out get him brought to where he could be laid to rest properly
01:03:25i'm baffled i'm confused i don't know what made my friend enter a room with two people that
01:03:33she barely knew did not come out
01:03:43jamie carroll should be alive and doesn't matter drag queen drug dealer or whatever
01:03:51i can be in a situation that i think i'm just doing what i do
01:03:59and not be aware of the danger that might exist because of the toxicity in the relationship
01:04:08and then find myself in a really dangerous situation
01:04:14yeah that's the lie we tell when we say it's just about those two people or it's none of my
01:04:18business
01:04:21what happens behind those closed doors finds its way into public spaces and so it puts us all at risk
01:04:30that's the saddest part
01:04:35the monsters really do exist
01:04:47but we create our own
01:04:52with the drugs
01:04:54and the lies and the that we choose to live
01:05:12there were many things i did not know did not understand what it all meant
01:05:19why people did the things they did or said the things they said
01:05:25what lingered behind the walls of 1435 south fourth street
01:05:32and what really happened in the dark basement what lurked in the dark room found in every human mind
01:05:59the dead they are
01:06:02the wrong mix of it, the
01:06:02the
01:06:19who
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