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The Last Word with Lawrence ODonnell - Season 13 - Episode 08
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00:00Well, nine years ago, I asked the question on Twitter, if Trump gets dementia, how will we know?
00:07Donald Trump makes a public dementia diagnosis difficult because he is a pathological liar,
00:13having been caught telling over 30,000 lies and is forced for years of the presidency.
00:17He's also the most ignorant person in the history of the American presidency and
00:21usually operates at a level of public stupidity never seen in American political history.
00:26And so if you mix or together pathological lying with ignorance and relentless stupidity,
00:33you will sound like you are in neurological decline all the time, even if you're not.
00:39When you throw in a 79-year-old brain, then dementia is one of the very first things you think
00:44of
00:45when you see Donald Trump on Friday get up, get up from his chair in the middle of a White
00:49House meeting
00:49with oil executives to turn away from everyone in the room and gaze out a window which he imagined
00:57to be the entrance to a building that does not exist and then stand in that window talking to himself
01:07about what isn't outside that window.
01:13I got to look at this myself.
01:21Wow.
01:24What a view.
01:26This is the door to the ball.
01:31What a job.
01:34Unusual time to look.
01:38No, it's not the door to the ballroom.
01:40But he is right that it is an unusual time to look at his imaginary ballroom.
01:49And so everyone who has seen that, including the oil executives who were in that room,
01:54are left to wonder, is that dementia or is that just Trump?
01:58That's the person who was trying to convince the oil industry executives to rush down to Venezuela
02:02and start taking Venezuelan oil.
02:04And he convinced none of them to do that.
02:07And the evidence of Trump dementia during the meeting probably convinced most or all of them
02:12that Donald Trump can't be believed about anything.
02:18You'll make it back one way or the other.
02:20You're all going to do very well.
02:21I think really very well.
02:22Marco just gave me a note.
02:24Go back to Chevron.
02:27They want to discuss something.
02:28Go ahead.
02:29I'm going back to Chevron.
02:31Thank you, Marco.
02:32Is there a question, Mr. President?
02:35Yes.
02:35Go ahead, Marco.
02:36What are you saying here?
02:39Is that dementia or is that just Trump?
02:44Imagine just imagine what the White House press corps would have done with that
02:50if Joe Biden had done either one of those things that you just saw Donald Trump do.
02:59Donald Trump went to Detroit today to lie to the audience of rich people at the Detroit Economic Club
03:06telling them that prices are down after a year of inflation holding steady
03:10thanks to Donald Trump's tariffs and Donald Trump's other economic mismanagement.
03:17And so I think we can assume his lie about inflation to an audience that knows better today
03:22was just Donald Trump's typical pathological lying.
03:26He would have told that lie at his sharpest.
03:30That particular lie is not evidence of neurological decline in Donald Trump,
03:35but it is further proof that you cannot believe anything Donald Trump says about anything.
03:43Donald Trump droned through a lifeless teleprompter reading of a speech that appeared to be his
03:49first reading of the words that he was speaking to that audience.
03:53And at the end, Donald Trump decided in what could well be evidence of dementia
04:01that the Detroit Economic Club really wanted to see him dance in his 79-year-old way
04:09to America's gay national anthem YMCA by the village people,
04:15which was blaring away in the nightclubs that Donald Trump frequented when that song came out
04:21in 1978 when he was 32 years old.
04:28The United States is winning again, and we're rapidly making America and the great state of Michigan
04:34greater and more prosperous than ever before.
04:36I want to again thank the Detroit Economic Club.
04:39You do a fantastic job.
04:41So respected.
04:41God bless you, and God bless America.
04:44Thank you very much, everybody.
04:57Young man, there's no need to feel down.
05:01I said, young man, pick yourself off the ground.
05:05I said, young man, cause you're in a new town.
05:08There's no need to be unhappy.
05:27The man just walking off that stage and disappearing into those black curtains after trying and failing to dance thinks
05:35he is the acting president of Venezuela.
05:38He has publicly declared himself to be the acting president of Venezuela, and that is strong evidence of dementia.
05:44And it is a Trump pathological lie, and it is further proof that you cannot believe anything Donald Trump ever
05:52says about anything, and I mean anything.
05:57Donald Trump says she ran him over.
06:01The man who thinks he is the acting president of Venezuela said, quote, she ran him over.
06:08She didn't try to run him over.
06:09She ran him over.
06:12Those were Donald Trump's exact words when lying about Renee Good.
06:17Every video from every angle of the killing of Renee Good by one of Donald Trump's ICE agents shows that
06:25she did not run him over.
06:28And this angle proves that the ICE agent, Jonathan Ross, fired his last two shots at her when she posed
06:38no threat to him at all.
06:41He is clearly standing beside a car that is moving away from him.
06:47It is impossible for that car to hit that man now in that spot when he is firing that gun.
06:56That car cannot suddenly go sideways.
07:00The decision to fire those shots would have been made only if Jonathan Ross was convinced that the first shot
07:08he fired did not stop her.
07:12The fact is that most bullets fired by law enforcement officers in the line of duty miss their targets most
07:20of the time.
07:22But if Jonathan Ross's first shot hit Renee Good, then there was no reason to fire a second shot.
07:28And if the second shot hit Renee Good, then there was no reason to fire a third shot.
07:34And law enforcement officers are required to assess the situation after each shot that they fire to decide whether to
07:43fire another shot.
07:45It is not legal for them to just keep firing bullets as long as they have bullets.
07:52If the third shot hit Renee Good and killed her, that shot was fired when she posed no threat to
08:01Jonathan Ross or anyone else on that scene.
08:04As this disturbing video proves.
08:17What the f*** did you do?
08:19No!
08:20S***!
08:22S***!
08:23S***!
08:23Oh my f***z God!
08:25What the f*** – what the f***?
08:28You just f***ed!
08:29What the f*** did you do?
08:32What did you do?
08:34You!
08:35Shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, shame, what's happening to her?
08:54What happened?
09:24There was no apparent injury to Jonathan Ross on that video.
09:28You see him walking all the way down to the car after he has fired the deadly shots and
09:33you see him walking all the way back, no limping, nothing, no hint in any of his movement after
09:40the fact that he was injured in any way, not injured in the slightest, no hint of that
09:44in that video.
09:47It was mass resignation day in the Trump Justice Department today from Minnesota to Washington,
09:52D.C.
09:53In Washington, six members of the Civil Rights Division of the Trump Justice Department quit.
09:58MSNOW's Carol Lennig and Ken Delaney in report, quote, top leaders of the criminal section
10:02of the Civil Rights Division have left their jobs to register their frustration with the
10:06department after the Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights, Harmeet Dillon, decided not
10:12to investigate the ICE officer's fatal shooting of Renee Good last week.
10:16The criminal section of the division would normally investigate any fatal shooting by a law enforcement
10:21officer and specializes in probing potential or alleged abuse of improper or improper use
10:27of force by law enforcement.
10:29So the most experienced lawyers in dealing with incidents like this at the Trump Justice
10:34Department are not being allowed to participate in the investigation in any way.
10:40And in Minnesota today, another six attorneys have quit the Trump Justice Department in the
10:45U.S. Attorney's Office there.
10:46The Minnesota Star Tribune reports that, quote, a majority of the leadership team at the Minnesota
10:51U.S. Attorney's Office resigned on January 13 over the direction of the Justice Department
10:57under the Trump administration.
10:58Among those who resigned was Joe Thompson, the lead federal prosecutor and public voice
11:03on uncovering rampant fraud in Minnesota.
11:08Joe Thompson is a 12-year veteran of the U.S. Attorney's Office in Minnesota and has been
11:12leading the fraud investigation in Minnesota that Donald Trump claims is the reason he sent thousands
11:18of federal agents to Minnesota in what our first guest tonight calls an invasion.
11:24The Minnesota Star Tribune reports, quote, the departures of several prosecutors stemmed from
11:29directives from top federal officials to staff members after the killing of Renee Good by ICE
11:34agent Jonathan Ross, according to sources familiar with the decision that included blocking the
11:39Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension from the investigation into the shooting and a request
11:44from the Justice Department to investigate Good's widow for possible federal charges.
11:51Governor Tim Walz, whose state government has been the focus of Joe Thompson's fraud investigation,
11:58said, quote, Joe is a principled public servant who spent more than a decade achieving justice for
12:04Minnesotans.
12:04This is a huge loss for our state.
12:07Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O'Harris said, quote, when you lose the leader responsible for making
12:12the fraud cases, it tells you this isn't really about prosecuting fraud.
12:18Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison has now turned Kristi Noem into a defendant in the case of
12:24Minnesota versus Noem.
12:26The attorney general, along with the cities of Minneapolis and St. Paul, are suing the Department
12:31of Homeland Security to stop what Attorney General Ellison calls the Trump invasion of Minnesota.
12:38The deployment of thousands of armed mass DHS agents to Minnesota has done our state serious
12:45harm. This is, in essence, a federal invasion of the Twin Cities and Minnesota, and it must stop.
12:54Leading off our discussion tonight is Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison. I want to begin,
12:59General Ellison, with your reaction to what you saw in the U.S. Attorney's Office today in Minnesota
13:06and the Civil Rights Division in Washington.
13:09Well, the first thing is that we still have the precious life of Renee Nicole Good that needs to
13:18be investigated. And if the most experienced federal lawyers are not going to be involved because
13:27Harmeet Dillon and Todd Blanche and Pam Bondi have said they wouldn't be, and if they're still denying
13:35state investigators access to the file, then how is Ms. Good's case ever going to be investigated?
13:44The feds won't do it, and they're denying the state access to the file. So that is deeply concerning.
13:50Now, look, it turns out that prosecutors have ethics, principles, morals, and the Trump administration
14:02has crossed the line with them, so they had to walk. This is what any principled person would do
14:08when they were confronted with a moral quandary that they simply could not engage in.
14:13They had to walk, and I commend them for it. I can tell you that for the difficulties that
14:20we're having with the federal government in Washington, we work quite cooperatively with
14:26federal officials in Minnesota, whether they're at the U.S. Attorney's Office or whether they're
14:32at ATF or even the FBI. The calls to basically shut down this investigation are coming from Washington,
14:41not Minnesota. And it sounds like even people in Washington are saying, we are here to investigate
14:48cases exactly like this one. If you will not allow us to be involved in this case, we cannot remain
14:53here. And I am saddened by it, but it really speaks to the fact that the federal government is covering
15:00up
15:00a death investigation. And that's pretty sad.
15:06So in a shooting like this, the three most important evidence sources are, of course,
15:13the body and the autopsy report that is produced from that. Secondly, the gun. And thirdly, the car.
15:20The FBI has the gun. The FBI has the car, as I understand it. But the county, state of Minnesota,
15:27the county, has the body and is in charge of the autopsy report. Will we see the autopsy report?
15:35You know, let me tell you, all bets are off nowadays, Lawrence, but I think the answer is yes.
15:42But that's what I'm pushing for. That's what I believe should happen and will happen.
15:47I hope not to come to your show and say, I thought so in good faith, but the federal government
15:53did something to prevent it. But my understanding is, yes, we will, that information will be
15:59forthcoming. But the shell casings, the gun, the car, whether or not there's been a toxicology
16:10test for Jonathan Ross, which is standard, those kind of things are in the possession
16:20of the federal government. And quite honestly, if we're doing things anywhere close to the right
16:25way, they have essentially declined prosecution at this point. So open up the file and hand it and
16:35let the state get access to it so that we can do our investigation. The state has a right to
16:39investigate this homicide. And now the federal government has decided that they're not going
16:46to pursue it. So they should open up the, hand the file over. And I think that's just logical.
16:51And I would wonder why they wouldn't do that since they've been crying.
16:55If there's a Minnesota grand jury investigation, would that create the, would that have the power
17:03to subpoena the gun from the federal government or subpoena the car and subpoena whatever is in
17:12possession? Would any, any evidence that's actually in, physical evidence in possession
17:16of the FBI?
17:18I say yes. But understand this, Lawrence, that's probably going to be a thorny legal issue to sort
17:27through. Because logically, the federal government has declined the case at this point. They should
17:33hand over the file. But what if they don't? And there have been a lot of unorthodox, unprecedented
17:38things that have happened. If they don't, then we're going to have to get a judge to make them
17:43release it. And will the, does, does a court have the authority under separation of powers to tell
17:49the executive branch to release information? I mean, it would be, I suspect we'd have a court
17:55battle over it, but my position would be that the state would be entitled to it.
18:00Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison, thank you very much for starting off our coverage tonight.
18:04Thank you, sir.
18:06Thank you. Coming up, Donald Trump's so-called border czar, Tom Homan, finally faced the question,
18:11what happened to the $50,000 in cash FBI undercover agents gave him during the last
18:16Trump presidential campaign. That's next with Senator Sheldon Whitehouse.
18:25Investigative reporting by MS Dow's Karolinig and Ken Delaneyan broke the news in September of last
18:32year that Donald Trump's so-called border czar, Tom Homan, who serves in a position invented by
18:37Donald Trump that does not require Senate confirmation, was recorded on an FBI undercover
18:43video accepting $50,000 in cash from undercover FBI agents in the last year, the year before Donald
18:53Trump became president. When that news broke, Tom Homan disappeared from Sunday morning TV,
18:59where he might be asked a difficult question about the $50,000 in cash. But this Sunday,
19:04on Meet the Press, at the end of an interview about other issues, Kristen Welker followed the money.
19:15As you know, in an undercover operation in 2024, the FBI recorded you accepting a bag which was
19:22determined to contain $50,000 from agents posing as business executives who said you indicated you
19:29could help win government contracts in the second Trump administration. I want to stress,
19:32there was an investigation. It was closed last year. The Justice Department said it found,
19:37quote, no credible evidence of any criminal wrongdoing. I do want to give you an opportunity
19:42to respond, though, Mr. Homan. Where is that $50,000? Did you keep it or did you return it?
19:48I didn't take $50,000 from anybody, and that's the question for the FBI. I'm not going to give
19:52this story anymore, Eric. Bottom line, I did nothing illegal. I did nothing, and the FBI and DOJ reviewed
19:59this. No credible evidence that did anything, because I didn't do anything illegal. But was
20:02there $50,000 in the bag, and did you return it? I'm not giving this story any more, Eric. This
20:07is
20:08an attack on my integrity and my professionalism. I'm not addressing it. That's a question of the FBI.
20:13Can you address, given that it's been recorded, did you keep the money? Did you return the money?
20:20$50,000 is ridiculous. The FBI has been clearing this. You know, and it irritates me. This story
20:25keeps going on and on and on, even though I've been found that there's nothing inappropriate. So
20:29I'm not going to ask any more of these questions. But just a minute, did you return the money?
20:33I didn't have any money to return. Okay. I didn't take the $50,000, bottom line.
20:37Let me ask you, you're saying you did nothing unlawful. Would you be comfortable
20:41with the FBI releasing the recordings? That's a decision of the FBI. But it might be a decision
20:48for the FBI. But would you be comfortable if they released those recordings? Again, I'm not getting
20:52ahead of the FBI in this investigation. But can you just say, on a personal level,
20:56would you be comfortable releasing the recordings? I am not going to get ahead of the FBI. That's
21:00their decision. Okay. All right. Mr. Holman, thank you very much for being here. Thank you.
21:08Joining us now is Democratic Senator Sheldon Whitehouse over at Allogies,
21:11a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, and he has been waiting to hear those questions asked
21:15for several months now. Senator, let me begin with the question that Mr. Holman refused to answer.
21:23Would you be comfortable if the FBI releases those recordings?
21:29No. I mean, if he says he's done nothing wrong, and it's totally, everything he did was totally
21:37appropriate. Why would you not allow those recordings to be released? Why would that be
21:45inappropriate? And by the way, when the FBI delivers $50,000 in an operation like this,
21:52there's a whole procedure of paperwork and reports that they have to go through to get access to that
21:59cash. And they have to then report what became of it. Did they get it back?
22:05And so there's an actual federal record through the FBI about this $50,000. And we can't get answers
22:15to those questions. We asked Attorney General Bondi about it. We've got a FOIA out about it.
22:22These are fairly standard records. And so, you know, when Holman said, you know, these questions,
22:30they just go on and on and on and on and on. Well, duh, the reason they keep going on
22:35and on and on is
22:36because you won't answer where's the $50,000. And between him and the FBI, they know where the $50,000
22:45is. And yet here we are months later, and they still won't answer.
22:50So the great thing about Kristen Welker staying specifically on the $50,000 is this gets the—this—
22:59she just established the best record yet of what Mr. Holman has to say about the $50,000. And he
23:07says,
23:07I didn't take $50,000 from anyone. He also says, I didn't return $50,000. Well, one of those things
23:15is—one of
23:17those answers is provable on video. There is reportedly a video of that guy sitting in a room
23:24with undercover FBI agents who are doing an undercover video. And on that video, we will
23:30see him take the $50,000 or not take the $50,000. And if he can show a video of
23:37him not taking the
23:39$50,000, wouldn't they rush to get that video out there?
23:43Yeah. And there's highly likely to be an FBI 302 also, the investigative form that they fill out
23:51after an interview or an episode like this, where they come back to the office and they write down
23:57what took place. So they've got a contemporaneous record that the tape would then support. So there's
24:05a ton of evidence about what actually happened. And the MAGA DOJ just won't let it out because they
24:11don't want their guy to be embarrassed.
24:14And we—this is—it's very clear. This is one of the things—one of the reasons why Donald Trump had to invent
24:19a job that does not require Senate confirmation in order for him to be working in the federal government now.
24:27Yeah. And, you know, the thing that's kind of a riot, if you think about today's recent news and
24:36the subpoena to Jay Powell, Jeanine Pirro's explanation for that is because that they weren't
24:43getting answers. They weren't getting complete answers. They weren't getting timely answers.
24:48And so they had to resort to a subpoena. Well, false, incomplete and untimely answers is sort of the
24:56hallmark of this administration. So the idea that they're aggravated by false, incomplete or
25:02untimely answers, I mean, the irony is rich. And this guy is the perfect example of false, incomplete
25:09or untimely answers.
25:11And he—clearly his—his game was he was going to stay off TV long enough for this to cool down.
25:17Uh, but, uh, Kristen Welker didn't see it that way. And—and the record is now lucky, uh, because of her
25:23persistence on that. Uh, and—and it—it comes down to a very simple, provable thing with the video. There's a video
25:31that
25:31will show him taking the money or not taking the money. And it seems to me if the Democrats win
25:36the
25:36Senate, uh, next year and you have more control over this Justice Department, you should—would you
25:43at that point have more power to get this video? Yes. And even more would come through the House
25:50Judiciary Committee because a House Judiciary subpoena doesn't need to go through a filibustable
25:58Senate for enforcement. Whereas, as we saw with our subpoenas to try to get to the bottom of
26:05Clarence Thomas' many scandals to Leonard Leo and other people, the Senate Republicans refused
26:13to allow the enforcement of the subpoena to proceed through the Senate floor. So we have an additional
26:21hurdle in the Senate at getting subpoenas enforced. The House can go right at it.
26:27And so one way or the other, whether it's a Chairman Raskin or potentially a Chairman White House
26:34in the Senate Judiciary Committee, um, this is going to come out sooner or later. But, you know,
26:40I think their hope is by then they're gone and, you know, getting paid by somebody else,
26:45and that's the end of it. All they need to do is get through this moment. But I think it's
26:50going to
26:50come out and, um, it just has to. Chairman to be Sheldon White House, thank you very much for
26:59joining us tonight. Thank you. And coming up, the Democrats now have a strong chance to win control
27:06of the United States Senate in this year's election and make Sheldon White House the chairman of the
27:11Senate Judiciary Committee. And Donald Trump is now doing everything he can to help the Democrats.
27:18That's next with Georgia Senator John Ossoff, who is running for reelection this year.
27:26With the announcement yesterday of a strong Democratic candidate running for Senate in
27:30Alaska, the Democrats now have a much stronger chance of winning control of the United States
27:35Senate in November's election. And Donald Trump is doing everything he can to help the Democrats,
27:41as he did today in his speech to rich people at the Detroit Economic Club, mocking affordability.
27:52In the coming weeks, I will be laying out even more plans to help bring back affordability. And
27:57again, remember, that's a fake word by Democrats. Prices were too high. They caused the high price.
28:04They never want to talk about affordability. They always go,
28:07this is an election about affordability. They say they caused it. But they're good at that stuff.
28:16Donald Trump speech writers write the mandatory line about affordability. They put it in the
28:22teleprompter. And when he sees the word, he has to stop reading the teleprompter to tell his audience
28:29that it's a fake word invented by Democrats. And then he says they're good at that. Democrats are
28:37now good at talking about the affordability issue throughout the country. And here is what the new
28:42Democratic candidate for Senate in Alaska, former Congresswoman Mary Peltola, said about it in her
28:48announcement video.
28:51It's not just that politicians in D.C. don't care that we're paying $17 a gallon for milk in rural
28:58Alaska.
28:59They don't even believe us.
29:01The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports, quote,
29:05This time last year, U.S. Senator John Ossoff was considered to be the Democratic Party's
29:09likeliest casualty on the 2026 Senate map. Now, Georgia Democrats increasingly
29:14are confident of the first-term lawmakers' midterm chances. And Republicans are the ones
29:21sounding pessimistic. A growing chorus of prominent Republicans is warning that without a course
29:26correction, the party risks disastrous midterm losses and another six years for Ossoff.
29:35Joining us now is Democratic Senator John Ossoff from Georgia. He's a member of the Senate
29:39Appropriations Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, the Senate Rules Committee. He's running
29:43for re-election this year. Senator Ossoff, your candidacy now is suffering from what I know,
29:51candidates like you worry about. And that is other people's confidence that you are going to
29:57win. But I think you have to recognize what we are seeing nationwide here on the issues, what we've
30:06seen in the elections this year. And now when we see a strong Democratic candidate emerging in Alaska,
30:13not only is there some confidence that you're going to win, but there is a building possibility
30:20toward confidence that the Democrats could win back the Senate.
30:25Lawrence, thank you for having me. And here's how to look at it. We have huge momentum
30:32because this president and his agenda and his enablers in Congress are massively unpopular.
30:41They have been stripping the country bare and selling the spare parts to enrich themselves
30:48and their wealthy donors. People are hurting. People are hurting because their health insurance
30:54premiums are skyrocketing. People are hurting because wage growth has stalled. People are hurting
30:59because the tariffs are a disaster. People are hurting because prices keep getting higher and higher.
31:05But complacency and overconfidence are our enemies. We cannot, just because we had some good results
31:15in Virginia and New Jersey, take anything for granted. Remember, I'm the only Democratic senator
31:22defending a seat in a state that the president won. They will spend hundreds of millions of dollars.
31:28They will use every dirty trick in the book. And so if you are furious at the weekly Watergate and
31:35the
31:35daily desecration of our nation's highest ideals, I need your help. Here's something you can do right
31:42now that makes a difference. Go to electjohn.com and help me win this Senate race in Georgia.
31:50The Atlanta Journal-Constitution is reporting 190,000 enrollees on the Affordable Care Act in Georgia alone
32:02apparently have lost their health insurance at this point in the year
32:09because of the Republican refusal to extend the subsidies that those people were enjoying
32:15that enabled them to even afford health insurance.
32:20And this is exactly what was predicted and just the beginning. You know, this is
32:29folks in Georgia and across the country who don't have health insurance anymore. Some of them
32:35in the middle of a cancer fight, some of them fighting diabetes, some of them already with
32:41surgery scheduled. I'm hearing from my constituents who are in this position every single day. Their
32:47premiums have gone up 100%, 200%, and folks just can't afford it. It is avoidable human suffering and
32:57illness and even death that's being imposed upon the country by Republican politicians and the White
33:06House here in Washington. And by the way, all three of my opponents oppose extending these ACA tax credits.
33:16Now, my prediction, as the pain grows, as the suffering becomes clearer and clearer, all three of my
33:23opponents will reverse their opposition to extending these tax credits. And a lot of Republicans in
33:30Congress will change their tune too, but too late to prevent so much of the harm that's already been done.
33:37We've seen that in the House of Representatives, where Republicans who voted to inflict this harm
33:41are now trying, some of them now trying to vote their way out of that problem. What is your reaction
33:48when you see Donald Trump stumble over the word affordability every single time the speechwriters
33:54put it in the teleprompter for him, every single time? He has to say it's a fake word that you
33:59Democrats got together and invented some fake word to describe what Americans are facing now.
34:06He doesn't care what working class and middle class Americans are going through and he doesn't know.
34:13There are some folks in the White House who recognize this as the political liability form
34:17and are trying to get him to at least pay lip service to it. But what does Donald Trump care
34:21about
34:21above all? Donald Trump cares about retribution. Donald Trump cares about harassing and persecuting
34:29and punishing the people he believes to be his enemies and using the powers of state
34:35in order to manipulate people, whether it's Jay Powell or members of the Senate he doesn't like
34:40or others who he views as his adversaries. Senator John Ossoff, thank you very much for
34:46joining us tonight. Thank you. Coming up, the pressure Congressman O'Connor is putting on the
34:52Trump Justice Department about the Epstein files is working. Today, a federal judge is demanding answers
34:59from the Trump Justice Department. Congressman O'Connor joins us next.
35:06As of tonight, the Donald Trump control Justice Department has released less than one percent of
35:11the Epstein files. The department was required to release by law 25 days ago. Today, U.S. District
35:20Judge Paul Engelmeyer, who presided over the criminal cases against Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell,
35:27ordered the Trump Justice Department to explain by Friday why they have released so little of the
35:33Epstein material. The order also directs the Trump Justice Department to respond to Congressman
35:37Ro'Connor and Congressman Thomas Massey, who are asking the judge to appoint a special master or an
35:43independent monitor to oversee the release of the entire Epstein files. Former President Bill Clinton
35:49and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton have refused to comply with subpoenas to testify
35:54to the House Oversight Committee. The New York Times is reporting that committee chairman,
35:58Republican James Comer, quote, said he would take steps to hold them in contempt of Congress.
36:04Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Ro'Connor, California. He's a member of the House Oversight
36:09Committee. Congressman Conor, thank you very much for joining us tonight. You have gotten the judge's
36:14attention and he wants answers by Friday. What are you expecting to hear from the Trump Justice Department?
36:21Well, we were very pleased that Judge Engelmeyer issued the order today, just two days after we sent the
36:29letter. He was very clear. He expects the Department of Justice to explain why they are hiding the
36:37documents they are and what their plan is to be in compliance with the Epstein Transparency Act. He's
36:42also seriously considering appointing a special master who would review all the documents. And he's asked
36:48the Department of Justice to brief that issue. He's asked Thomas Massey and I to brief that issue,
36:53which we will be doing and our brief will be due in the next couple weeks. And the speed of
36:59a judge's
37:00response in a situation like this indicates that this judge thinks this is a very valid point,
37:07at least. It doesn't tell us which way he's going to go, but it certainly tells us that
37:10he thinks this is valid and important. Absolutely, Lawrence. Look, he could have just ignored
37:15this. He's under no obligation to respond. He could have sat on it. He, within 24 hours,
37:23says, I'm going to seriously consider this. I want to hear the arguments. I want to make sure
37:28that the Epstein Transparency Act is being complied with. Department of Justice, tell me what your plan
37:33is. Tell me whether this is a good idea or not. And he's even graciously given Representative Massey
37:39and I the opportunity to make our case. So, so far, he's conducted himself with great integrity
37:44and fairness. And I do believe that he can really help solve this issue. He can appoint someone who
37:53finally gets the files out and he can also direct the type of files we need out, like the Section
37:59302
37:59statements where the survivors have named other rich and powerful men who abused them.
38:06Should Bill and Hillary Clinton comply with the subpoenas to your committee?
38:12Well, they should come before the committee, but their point was, in my view, a fair one. And what
38:17they're saying is, one, they want to testify publicly, not behind closed doors. And two,
38:23there are all these other people that we should be calling, people who are directly implicated with
38:28Epstein, that we should be calling Pam Bondi before the committee who hasn't complied with the
38:33laws. I mean, Bill Clinton was president in 1992. And there are other relevant people. So my
38:39understanding is that they're open to coming. They should come. But this cannot become a witch hunt
38:45for the Clintons. It needs to be about the survivors and justice.
38:49What are these next steps for you in the committee in terms of the investigation the committee's
38:56conducting? Well, we just got the state accountant and lawyers subpoenaed. That was a big deal. I
39:05want to credit the ranking member Garcia and the entire committee for doing that.
39:09And so they will be coming before the committee. We're still getting documents from the Epstein
39:15estate. And the committee is going to continue to put pressure on the Justice Department. I
39:19heard the earlier segment about Chair White House when we take back the Senate. Well,
39:24we're going to have Chair Garcia when we take back the House. And those people in the Justice
39:28Department who are not complying are going to face a new oversight committee. And so it is very,
39:36very important for people at the Justice Department to understand they have a legal obligation to comply.
39:42And this is going to be a huge priority for the oversight committee when we're in the majority.
39:46Congressman Ro Khanna, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Thank you. We'll be right back.
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