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Short filmTranscript
00:00:00Is my video on? Oh, no, wait, I have to do videos.
00:00:05There you go.
00:00:08No, you are so nice.
00:00:10Once for years.
00:00:18I got to interview the man who started my career 20 years later.
00:00:24I got one of, I think, the last and longest interviews with him.
00:00:28My biggest question, to be honest, was like, did you know what it took to get that show on the
00:00:35air?
00:00:38Because I kind of knew some of what I was doing was wrong.
00:00:47The way we did it was dirty and manipulative and destroying people's lives.
00:00:57There's a lot of made-up stuff.
00:00:59This is all fake.
00:01:00We're doing it for attention.
00:01:02No one's going to get hurt.
00:01:04Welcome to the show.
00:01:05I was 17.
00:01:06I was pregnant.
00:01:07I felt like he'd exploited us.
00:01:09I feel like the Jerry Springer show is known for portraying the most you can possibly get away with.
00:01:15Whether that's nudity and vulgarity and chaos from people's messiest lives.
00:01:21We don't watch Jerry Springer on TV!
00:01:26A lot of people don't realize the effect this show had.
00:01:30If there's ever an entity that you could say was really trying to cause harm, it's the kind of thing
00:01:37those producers do on the Jerry Springer show.
00:01:40I'm asking you whether or not you're exploiting people that are troubled for money.
00:01:459-1-1, location, emergency.
00:01:47Two teenagers charged with a horrible crime are blaming a TV show for the idea.
00:01:51Somebody might be harmed or killed in here.
00:01:55What do you want your legacy to be?
00:01:59Uh, the, uh, I don't want one.
00:02:10I don't know what's going on inside the house.
00:02:15This is just a silly show.
00:02:17It's just entertainment.
00:02:26I've been involved with television throughout most of my career.
00:02:29I've had several talk shows myself.
00:02:32I know Jerry Springer from multiple projects.
00:02:37He's a hard guy not to love.
00:02:41It's just so uncomfortable.
00:02:43But when I used to watch the Jerry Springer show, I enjoyed Jerry trying to make Devonshire cream out of
00:02:50dog excrement.
00:02:52I appreciated him trying to do that, but it also made me feel bad.
00:02:58On the show, you're seeing a very narrow slice of time for these guests.
00:03:02Most of the audience doesn't realize that there's trauma behind the scenes from the people who come out on that
00:03:08set, but also the producers themselves are being traumatized.
00:03:11Whew.
00:03:12The Jerry Springer Show.
00:03:14I'm a journalist who's been covering news and Hollywood for the last 15 years.
00:03:18Today on Springer.
00:03:20But I was a kid when I first came across the Jerry Springer Show.
00:03:24When I was flipping through channels with my remote, and I'm sure my parents quickly shut it down.
00:03:30It was an unavoidable aspect of life in the 90s.
00:03:35The Jerry, Jerry, Jerry, Jerry, Jerry, Jerry.
00:03:38That chant, everyone knows it.
00:03:41It ran for 27 seasons, and it aired over 4,000 episodes.
00:03:47Physical fights were encouraged.
00:03:49Secrets were exposed.
00:03:52Entire families were destroyed in real time on TV.
00:03:56This week's TV Guide lists the 50 worst TV shows of all time.
00:03:59Congratulations to number one, Jerry Springer.
00:04:02And it all really started with one person.
00:04:06An executive producer named Bert Dubrow.
00:04:11Why did you want to talk about Jerry Springer Show today?
00:04:15It's time.
00:04:15Listen, if this achieves anything, what you're doing, it'll set the friggin' record straight.
00:04:21Finally.
00:04:22Because it needs to be set straight.
00:04:24And his bodyguards, Al and Joseph.
00:04:29Richard didn't want...
00:04:31Everybody wants to take credit and say, I came up with this.
00:04:36I'm saying there was a plan for the Jerry Springer Show
00:04:39to become a crazy, aggressive show saying things that might not entirely be true.
00:04:50I was working at a place called Multimedia.
00:04:54They're known for producing big talk shows like Phil Donoghue and Sally Jesse Raphael.
00:05:00I was mainly doing Sally Jesse Raphael and this show called The Bob Braun Show.
00:05:04We were 90 minutes live.
00:05:06The last half hour was local news.
00:05:09And they hired a guy named Jerry Springer to come in and do commentaries on the news.
00:05:15I never even thought I'd be in show business.
00:05:18You know, I was doing politics.
00:05:20Jerry Springer worked on Robert F. Kennedy's campaign just before his assassination.
00:05:25He became mayor of a large city, Cincinnati.
00:05:27He became a city councilman.
00:05:30Someone came, hey, come to me and said, how about anchoring our news?
00:05:33This was the NBC affiliate.
00:05:35And that's how I got to be the news anchor for 10 years.
00:05:37Good evening, America.
00:05:38Spirit is soaring tonight right along...
00:05:40And he was a natural for television.
00:05:42And it started ticking then in my head that Jerry Springer should have his own show.
00:05:50And so I went to the CEO of the company.
00:05:53So the CEO takes me to lunch one day and says,
00:05:55we're going to do another talk show.
00:05:57You're hosting it.
00:05:57So I was assigned to it.
00:06:00Thank you, sir.
00:06:00Okay.
00:06:02I floor directed him on the news.
00:06:05So when I heard Jerry Springer is starting his own talk show,
00:06:09of course, in my mind, I'm thinking I'm going to worm my way onto that show.
00:06:13And it took me a month.
00:06:15And then I was on the show.
00:06:20Television talk shows have a host.
00:06:22And the host is responsible to make something happen in front of the camera.
00:06:25But the reality is there's a giant machine behind that host.
00:06:29At the top of any kind of TV show is the executive producer.
00:06:33And the buck stops with them.
00:06:35That executive producer does everything.
00:06:37From the moment that show comes on to it goes off, you're responsible.
00:06:41Something goes wrong, it's your buck.
00:06:43And they're going to be the ones who approve every single guest,
00:06:46every single segment that appears on an episode of the show.
00:06:50Under the executive producer, you have the producer.
00:06:52So that producer decides kind of what the show is going to be about, what type of guests they want.
00:06:57And then below the producers, you have the associate producers.
00:07:00And the associate producer is working the phones to try and find those guests.
00:07:04Underneath an associate producer is a production assistant.
00:07:08The production assistants pretty much entertained the guests.
00:07:12Keep them company while they're in town.
00:07:14Befriend them.
00:07:15Make sure they're having a good time.
00:07:16And then at the bottom of the totem pole is the interns.
00:07:20The interns were the bitches of the production.
00:07:25You know, I would stock the coolers because they were always complaining about warm water.
00:07:29Why is my Fiji water warm?
00:07:30Why is my Fiji water warm?
00:07:32How come it wasn't in the fridge?
00:07:37The Jerry Springer show that we know today, the extreme chaotic version, is not how the show started.
00:07:45The show had pretty tame origins.
00:07:48Jerry Springer, weekdays at 11.
00:07:50In the beginning, we did show five days a week.
00:07:53It was really fashioned after the Phil Donahue show.
00:07:57More traditional format, topic driven, interesting expert guest.
00:08:02In the very beginning, we did some heartfelt shows with kids with certain diseases and stuff like that.
00:08:09One day, you're doing a show on homelessness.
00:08:12The next day, we had Jesse Jackson on for an hour.
00:08:16I do believe to this day it was the lowest rated show that we had done.
00:08:20It just didn't work.
00:08:21People weren't exactly setting their VCRs to record the Jerry Springer show.
00:08:28And it certainly wasn't breaking any records in the ratings, you know?
00:08:32Well, look, nobody wants a low rating, of course.
00:08:35But for the record, let me state it now.
00:08:39We never said, gee, we're failing.
00:08:43The best way to do this is to have fights every day.
00:08:47Never happened.
00:08:49Most good ideas come to us by accident.
00:08:54In 1993, Jerry Springer brought in a group of white supremacists, outspoken, and some black activists.
00:09:02What could go wrong?
00:09:03They went at each other and all hell broke loose.
00:09:08Holy crap.
00:09:10This was one of the first fights.
00:09:16We stopped the tape.
00:09:17We were scared to death.
00:09:19We didn't know what happened.
00:09:21We didn't know what hit us.
00:09:22We didn't know if anybody was going to get hurt.
00:09:24Jerry's just trying to get through it.
00:09:27I don't think he really knew what to do.
00:09:29I spoke to the audience.
00:09:31Everybody sit down.
00:09:32Jerry spoke to the audience.
00:09:33The test is going to be whether we can continue for an hour to talk about this.
00:09:41You can see from listening to Jerry and watching Jerry how new this was.
00:09:47I bet you if I interviewed Jerry at that moment, he would go, no, no, no.
00:09:50This, we've gone too far.
00:09:51We don't want to go this way.
00:09:53And yet, it kept going.
00:09:56As a producer of the show, you're thinking, this is good.
00:10:01You know, this is good.
00:10:02This is now going to be on the news.
00:10:04After a white racist made a nasty comment, things got physical.
00:10:08We promoted the hell out of it.
00:10:09This is going to rate.
00:10:11And I remember going, whoa.
00:10:13Let's go with this.
00:10:15I'd bring everybody over to bring staff meeting with everyone.
00:10:19Jerry, too.
00:10:20I said, look, we're wiping the slate clean.
00:10:22You guys tell me what you want to do.
00:10:24Come to me with ideas.
00:10:26People came with crazy stuff.
00:10:29Good stuff.
00:10:30Now the Jerry Springer show is evolving, here are some of the segment titles.
00:10:36Stripper Sex Turn Me Straight.
00:10:39Stop Pimping My Twin Sister.
00:10:41Surprise, I'm in love with your mother.
00:10:45Conjoined twins, going on a date.
00:10:47Christmas with the Klan.
00:10:49Surprise, I'm screwing your cousin.
00:10:52What's sexier, big breasts or little breasts?
00:10:56You slept with my stripper sister.
00:10:58My wife wants to be a call girl.
00:11:00My grandma stole my man.
00:11:01I want to confront my pimp.
00:11:03I slept with 251 men in 10 hours.
00:11:06I got a 79-year-old woman naked running through the crowd.
00:11:10It's one of my biggest accomplishments.
00:11:12Jerry loved that episode.
00:11:13I married a horse.
00:11:14Have you ever been with a woman?
00:11:15Yes.
00:11:16I mean a human.
00:11:18Yeah.
00:11:18The guy who married his horse.
00:11:20That was a classic.
00:11:23It was a bit of a tug of war with the company that owned the show because they didn't really
00:11:28want it to be that.
00:11:29But we would dabble in those areas of strippers and racists and chairs flying to get ratings
00:11:37and it worked.
00:11:38So it was really about trying to harness those types of shows and do them every day.
00:11:44And the show became massive.
00:11:47Jerry.
00:11:49Cool.
00:11:50Thanks.
00:11:50The lower the bar, the higher the ratings.
00:11:53That is the paradox of The Jerry Springer Show.
00:11:56Show business used to be a couple of executives sitting either in Hollywood or in New York.
00:12:03And they would decide who the big acts will be, who the stars are going to be.
00:12:08And that was the first time we have regular people being who you watch on television.
00:12:16It's the people have become their own entertainment.
00:12:20Then we decide who the stars are, not some executives.
00:12:24And it makes you wonder, why would anybody subject themselves to this level of humiliation?
00:12:31Do you, what do you think of this?
00:12:33Should we have her sit there or do you want to pull up a chair?
00:12:36I got introduced to The Jerry Springer Show back in 2002.
00:12:40I was in a bad relationship.
00:12:43So I knew if I confronted him on national television that there's nothing he could do about it.
00:12:49That the world would find out how big of a monster he truly is.
00:12:54So when I talked to the producer, he said that he wants us on TV.
00:12:58He was like, I'm going to fly you out.
00:13:00I was like, fly?
00:13:01Plane?
00:13:01Many of these people were never on an airplane, never in a hotel, never on television, certainly.
00:13:07That was a big deal for them.
00:13:09He had a limousine waiting for me.
00:13:11I felt like royalty.
00:13:13I thought I was dreaming for the longest time.
00:13:15It was felt so privileged to be able to be on that stage and to touch the Jerry Springer sign.
00:13:21It makes a guest feel like they are a celebrity when you're whining and dining them and picking them up
00:13:27in a limo.
00:13:28Especially for someone who comes from a small rural town in America.
00:13:34This is thrilling.
00:13:35And these producers are rolling out the red carpet for you.
00:13:39It makes you want to give them exactly what they want.
00:13:43After the show, I felt my empowerment back.
00:13:46I've never seen my boyfriend ever since then.
00:13:50Not long after the air and after I came back home, they reached out to me and said, you were
00:13:58a big hit on the show.
00:13:59People loved you.
00:14:01We want you to come to Jamaica with us.
00:14:04It was for spring break.
00:14:06This resort was a very adult resort.
00:14:09We had breakfast, lunch, and dinner.
00:14:11All paid for.
00:14:13And you had all the drinks you wanted.
00:14:14It's a reciprocity.
00:14:15People feel obliged to reciprocate in some way.
00:14:18Meaning, deliver when you're on the show.
00:14:21My episode that I aired in Jamaica was I was dating this skinny, scrawny man and having an affair with
00:14:28him with this 600-pound man.
00:14:30Which was all fake.
00:14:31It was all made up.
00:14:33And that was pretty wild.
00:14:35What did you think when they gave you this storyline and you're like, you're like, wait, but my story, my
00:14:40last story was real.
00:14:41This is, this is completely fake.
00:14:43What were you thinking?
00:14:44That no one's going to get hurt.
00:14:46We're doing it for fun.
00:14:47We're doing it for attention.
00:14:5090% of the guests, thank you.
00:14:54They enjoyed it.
00:14:55It was a treat for them.
00:14:57And that nobody was really getting hurt.
00:14:59Go ahead, Edmund.
00:15:02I think that was important.
00:15:05When I was 14, I was a guest on The Jerry Springer Show.
00:15:09I am proud of my heritage.
00:15:11I believe in racial separation and I don't think there's a thing wrong with believing how I believe.
00:15:18Do you believe we can stop this?
00:15:20No, it's okay.
00:15:21Just give me a second.
00:15:22No, it's okay.
00:15:24No.
00:15:28As far as what I want people to know about The Jerry Springer Show was they destroyed my life and
00:15:34I'm sure many other people's as well.
00:15:44once upon a time i was an associate producer on the jerry springer show
00:15:51i was a guy in my early 20s and i quickly went from pa to audience warm-up guy to
00:16:00associate
00:16:00producer so the role of the ap uh on the jerry springer show was for booking the amazing wonderful
00:16:08people that you you saw on that show the time that i came into the show i missed the the
00:16:15growing pains
00:16:15of getting the show to a format it was starting to become a hit but i noticed everyone was very
00:16:25young
00:16:28so all the producers on the show were all in our 20s they could have hired the top-notch producers
00:16:34from the entire talk show industry but why didn't they if you're an executive at the jerry springer
00:16:43show you want to find young impressionable producers who are willing to do whatever it takes
00:16:49to climb the ranks there you can convince them to do things that a more mature producer would be
00:16:57unwilling to do i wasn't prepared for the amount of responsibility that came with it
00:17:05richard dominick he was a producer richard used to work as a tabloid reporter everybody had
00:17:12one show a week and he wanted it to be insane we had different buckets for shows one of the
00:17:22categories
00:17:23came from these racist shows but this was kind of his twist on that what about kids
00:17:38my father was august christ the third say something for the camera and was in the kkk
00:17:51he was known in the movement christian identity
00:17:56which is a form of christianity but their version of it is that white you know caucasians
00:18:06are god's chosen people and not the jewish people
00:18:13as soon as my parents divorced when i was 12 he started bringing us to everything that he went to
00:18:20rallies every sunday violent marches kkk cross lightings so it kind of just became a normal part of life
00:18:37it was horrible i hated it
00:18:40what's wrong you mad at me
00:18:43it was not me at all
00:18:47no child is born racist i don't believe that she was born racist she grew up under the tutelage
00:18:53of a kkk leader under a white supremacist so what do we think is going to happen here
00:19:02when i was 14 my father one day just said that he had talked to a friend of his who
00:19:09was also in the
00:19:09the quote white power movement and he said that they were looking to have us as guests
00:19:18on the show and we were going to go on the jerry springer show in chicago
00:19:25and we didn't have a choice at all
00:19:30when the jerry springer show started it actually started in cincinnati and then subsequently moved
00:19:36to downtown chicago the nbc tower watching people talk on the phone a lot of times
00:19:43people are like well how much are you gonna pay me i'll come on there but you're gonna give me
00:19:47money
00:19:47it's like we can give you an experience i can pay for your hotel we can wine and dine you
00:19:51through
00:19:52chicago we can't pay you you can't buy anything for tv they flew us in they paid for everything round
00:20:01trip airfare hotel accommodations unlimited room service and also paid him from another producer
00:20:08that we interviewed made it very clear you don't pay people
00:20:14absolutely pay people they gave him a thousand dollars cash every time we were on that show
00:20:23and then the next day when we got there the producers told us exactly what words to use
00:20:29exactly what to say they wanted me to say it with as much hate and anger as i possibly could
00:20:35and they weren't happy until i did that when all the producers are super young there was definitely
00:20:42kind of this underlying thought there that like hey if you can't pull it off there's a line of people
00:20:50ready to take your spot
00:20:55the first time we were there we were in the green room my father was in the green room
00:21:01producers came in said something to him heard them talking about signing the waivers for us to be on tv
00:21:11because legality because my parents had joint legal and joint physical custody but they were divorced
00:21:19if your parents have joint custody over you you do need consent from both of your parents in order to
00:21:26appear on a tv show like jerry springer and i remember thinking please god please god
00:21:34hopefully this means we don't have to do it
00:21:38they stepped out and uh after a couple minutes he came back in and i guess it was brushed under
00:21:46the
00:21:46rug because we still went on so it makes you wonder why did her mom consent to her going on
00:21:54this show
00:21:55or did the mom have zero awareness of her children going on this show and did the producers neglect their
00:22:03responsibility in receiving that consent from her mother meet 14 year old jennifer christ and her
00:22:11sister 11 year old amy first of all how cute was she i mean let's start with that in the
00:22:19bible it tells
00:22:19us that when yahweh returns that's what i call my god uh he's going to mark every jew and they
00:22:27shall be
00:22:27killed i am jewish my daughter is jewish are you saying to me that if given the chance you would
00:22:35kill
00:22:35my daughter in a second are you okay right now
00:22:56you don't have to go through these if you don't want to it's okay it's okay
00:23:06i am proud of my heritage i believe in racial separation and i don't think there's a
00:23:13thing wrong with believing how i believe what are you feeling embarrassment anger sadness
00:23:29that i was ever put in that position by all the adults
00:23:36how am i going to like somebody that crucified my god i just felt like i was a circus animal
00:23:41or
00:23:41something under attack but no one knew the truth
00:23:47joining us now is jennifer and amy's father august christ a lot of people say well why didn't you just
00:23:53refuse to go on the show and they don't understand that i was being abused at home already
00:24:02i was being sexually abused from as early as my memories go back
00:24:09i was a kid
00:24:11what choice did i have
00:24:24if you're living with a father who is sexually abusing you there is a
00:24:30power dynamic there that you are going to feel pressured to uphold and acting like a little racist
00:24:36was what was going to keep her safe and keep her in her father's good graces
00:24:42the producers knew how i was being raised was abusive in and of itself
00:24:49so why would they want to add to that by exploiting me for that same reason
00:24:55how are they any better when the show was over everyone was trained to get these people out
00:25:09we had a thing we would say you pick them up in a limo and send them home in a
00:25:13cab
00:25:13and that's kind of how it worked and then we would literally read off of a script i could be
00:25:20wrong on
00:25:21the exact number but this episode cost 92 000 to make and everything that you said on this episode we
00:25:27are accepting as the truth if you go to the press or to the media and state that anything you
00:25:32said on
00:25:33the show was not true we will sue you for the entire cost of the show and let's be honest
00:25:37these
00:25:38weren't super educated people most of them right
00:25:43and it was very cruel and it made me feel like crap
00:25:52after we left jerry springer we ended up moving about five hours north of where we were
00:25:58i started making friends and it wasn't long maybe a month or so after we had gotten there that it
00:26:04aired
00:26:04we believe that blacks are not equal to whites and when the time comes god will demand us to kill
00:26:09all jews
00:26:11people immediately saw it and started spreading it around i was 14 years old just trying to come into
00:26:17my own as a teenager and i was already dealing with the backlash of his beliefs in school
00:26:28i was threatened on a daily basis i had to start carrying mace to school they tried jumping me
00:26:34a handful of times i just had to deal with it
00:26:43ultimately television doesn't ruin society because we watch showing the underbelly is not necessarily a
00:26:49bad thing exposing it to the world to the light is fine the problem is they drag their kids in
00:26:56with
00:26:56them and that's a bridge too far the producers knew what was happening where's the line here
00:27:04the first executive producer of the show was me the two shows that i came up with sally and jerry
00:27:11were both doing pretty well so the company had moved me up so i went from executive producer
00:27:18to senior vice president programming or something like that my role was to oversee all these shows
00:27:24and i was still very involved i made a girl by the name of terry murphy the executive producer of
00:27:31the show when terry left we needed a replacement i had richard dominic with me from the beginning
00:27:39i felt he was there long enough he put his time in and that he could do it so a
00:27:44new executive producer
00:27:45comes in richard dominic this is a guy who walked around the office with like a louisville slugger
00:27:59he has that chicago gangster vibe going on and this is richard with his beer and cigar and jerry
00:28:08very intimidating very scary people moved out of his way when he walked down the hall and on top of
00:28:15that then if he's yelling at you with a bat in his hand which i saw him do that to
00:28:20a lot of the other
00:28:21aps and people around me one time he said if you don't get this right i will throw you out
00:28:28that window
00:28:29now of course you know he didn't quote unquote mean it but it's definitely a different time
00:28:36there were people that used to contact me that didn't like the way they were treated
00:28:39i wasn't there um so i i can't confirm any of it i can't deny it i came in everybody
00:28:47was on their best
00:28:47behavior and to my knowledge everything was okay during my time there i felt really bad for
00:28:56the women in the office and there were a lot of them and seeing these poor girls crying running out
00:29:05of the office being humiliated that was bad uh there was harassment in the office
00:29:11i mean i saw an ap get duct taped to her chair that's not normal behavior
00:29:21i feel a little uncomfortable talking about it
00:29:26i mean the reason you probably had a very hard time getting any women to talk about
00:29:32their time there is out of here
00:29:37talk show industry is very small and understandably many people can be afraid to
00:29:41come forward about specifics because they're very worried about going against their superiors
00:29:46and ruining their reputation everybody that worked there that lasted that climbed the ladder they were
00:29:54all willing to do it so one time a guest in the green room was irritated
00:30:02gonna walk the show i'm gonna leave gonna do this gonna do that and um
00:30:07i tell my production assistant i said when you go in the screen room shake your ass for this guy
00:30:12because i don't need him leaving she's like of course we'd say that to every staff member every day
00:30:18sexual harassment was a daily thing for everyone
00:30:24i know that um a producer she had to expose herself for a show segment
00:30:31she did what she had to do to save the show i've always thought that if you were a producer
00:30:39on our
00:30:40show you could one day be a producer on any other show because it would be a cake war compared
00:30:46to it
00:30:46so
00:30:53bert dubrow loved ratings as much as anybody else and he knew how to get them
00:30:58and he brought in the guy that he thought would take springer to the next level richard dominick
00:31:07and i remember hearing him on phone calls you know saying yeah do it turn up the heat richard
00:31:14and he let him loose
00:31:17i remember a day when we were told do whatever you want to make it work there are no more
00:31:26rules
00:31:27for the previous couple years once in a while we'd have a fight and you'd see the ratings pop on
00:31:34those
00:31:34shows and all the producers kind of went all right let's do it
00:31:42it was like the wwf out there and people were throwing chairs and people were hitting each other
00:31:50it got crazy it became a cliche and a very very very successful cliche
00:31:59the producers are not psychologists they're not mental health professionals but they knew exactly how
00:32:06to manipulate it to get the kind of ratings that they wanted i noticed pretty quick what the secret
00:32:14was and let me give you a secret here's how we got him to fight in the beginning on springer
00:32:19post clan
00:32:20fight let's say that i have two brothers in a conflict when you're prepping the guests
00:32:29you tell one of them now look if your brother says something you don't like you can yell at him
00:32:38you can get up in his face you can even spit on him but whatever you do don't hit him
00:32:44then you
00:32:44don't tell the other person any of that once you produce one person to get up and spit in someone's
00:32:51face and then you don't give any instruction to the other one the other one is going to haul off
00:32:55and
00:32:55knock the hell out of the one who did it and boom you got a fight
00:33:02was there ever any anything you put together that you were like i feel responsible for how that turned
00:33:07out yes there was a um love triangle with three people out of new york
00:33:17one guy was a big guy the other one was a smaller kid
00:33:22who had the girl and um the big guy's like jimmy i gotta talk to you i gotta talk to
00:33:26you
00:33:27so he throws everybody out of the green room and i'm like what's up he goes i'm gonna kill this
00:33:34kid
00:33:34and i'm like calm down i go what well i'm gonna hit him but they're gonna stop me they're gonna
00:33:42stop me
00:33:42and i'm like thinking to myself all right i can get this guy to hit him all right i go
00:33:48hit him and i'm
00:33:51gonna tell you how to do it i said pretend you're gonna walk up to him and put your hand
00:33:58out to shake
00:33:59his hand close your fist and crack him with the other hand i go by the time you hit this
00:34:07kid he'll be laid
00:34:09out no one's gonna see it coming nobody security's not gonna move that because you're attempting to
00:34:16reconcile he did it cracked him
00:34:25he busted his lip open and there was blood and i got in big trouble security had to stop it
00:34:32at the
00:34:32right time to still give the show you know what the show was looking for but to make sure no
00:34:38one got
00:34:38seriously injured or you could be sued it's not easy to do it was short and quick so i was
00:34:45screamed
00:34:46at yelled at but um it's probably the only time i admitted that to anyone and uh i do feel
00:34:55responsible
00:35:04my name is cheryl racinos i was 13 when i first ran away from home during those years i was
00:35:13homeless
00:35:14being 17 and homeless is a risk not just because of predators but being 17 meant that i was an
00:35:22unaccompanied minor and i could at any point be arrested for being homeless so one day when i was
00:35:2917 i was in squats which were abandoned buildings or different places there were some older looking
00:35:35guys that were recruiters for the jerry sprinter show and offering like if you go on this show we'll
00:35:40listen to your story and we'll fly you to chicago you can stay in a nice hotel we'll feed you
00:35:45and we'll
00:35:45give you 200 bucks that's a pretty appealing offer the problem is the producers were mining for guests
00:35:53who are at the lowest point in their lives so there's a desperation behind their decision to
00:35:59actually appear on the show even if they have no idea what they're getting themselves into at that time
00:36:06i had just found out that i was pregnant and i didn't really know what i was going to do
00:36:13next
00:36:14and so this 200 would go towards probably like baby clothes or diapers or something those are an easy
00:36:21sell for somebody who's hungry they picked us up the next morning again with another limo fully stocked
00:36:29and they brought us to the studio we weren't prepared for what was about to happen please
00:36:37welcome tanim and cheryl to the show there were a few questions from the audience why are you on the
00:36:43streets but then quickly interrupted with you go out and get you a job get a job go home you
00:36:48need to cut
00:36:49your hair and go home you need to stop having i'm actually very troubled by this phenomenon called
00:36:59stochastic terrorism where people act out violently on people because they've just they dehumanized them
00:37:05so much and this is where that began this is where that started where television started to dehumanize
00:37:15like the same thing over and over again but none of those solved our housing issue look we like to
00:37:20be
00:37:20in a football game with audience we like to be part of the fans and we like to clap and
00:37:24react together
00:37:25but that can have a more sinister turn where people adopt the attitudes of the crowd which is often
00:37:32aggressive it could even be bloodthirsty i felt angry and powerless and jerry you know fed into it but i'm
00:37:41gonna be the mean guy right now let's say you're asking for change on the street gotta be some guy
00:37:46that looks at you say hey you know what go and get yourself a job work for something and then
00:37:50you'll
00:37:50have money what would have been nice and what would have happened on a sally jesse raphael or an oprah
00:37:58or
00:37:58whatever is there would have been a segment where we put this poor soul into some type of shelter and
00:38:06help her that wasn't what that would have like killed the vibe and that's a big difference
00:38:14i was kind of shell-shocked and at the end of the episode the security guy handed us each a
00:38:19very thick
00:38:20envelope of one dollar bills and stood in front of the door while jerry exited and all of us kind
00:38:26of
00:38:26had a bad feeling when that envelope was handed to us and we rapidly counted the money
00:38:33and he had given us each 100 it definitely wasn't the 200 he'd promised that was when
00:38:44i knew we'd been exploited i don't understand how you do that how you connect with the person
00:38:50and then cast them out i can't even i can't imagine that in most cases you never saw him again
00:39:00there was no margin for error you had to have your show ready each and every week
00:39:08we got to book those guests we gotta get the show in here
00:39:12if a guest cancels it's because you haven't done your job right and it's like you don't want to get
00:39:17fired if i couldn't book people we had binders and binders of people that called the show
00:39:26and we would never stop calling you and then i got a call they called back said let's try again
00:39:35let's bring you back
00:39:45after the first episode eric the show would just call when they maybe needed a bump in their ratings
00:39:51i don't i don't know
00:39:56my father didn't really tell me every single little detail it would just be like oh jerry springer called
00:40:02we're going again and he did not have a job so he wanted the money
00:40:10the second time we were on there i was about 15. it might have been called a racist family
00:40:18only a week ago we had a program where we brought back some of our most memorable guests in celebration
00:40:23we used to have him on a lot so whenever we did race shows you know we likely had him
00:40:28on
00:40:29this particular guest would often provoke jerry are you threatening me on television are you
00:40:35threatening how am i threatening you i'm asking you no i would never threaten you you're not
00:40:39threatening me i'm making your promise jerry springer was a minority himself jerry springer was jewish he
00:40:45was the descendant of holocaust survivors so he knows the cost of that kind of rhetoric
00:40:52three weeks before hitler goes into poland mom and dad they were let out of germany but grandparents
00:40:59uncles and cousins they all were exterminated it became visceral for him in that moment
00:41:05okay you're off the show
00:41:13oh my gosh and to be fair think think about jennifer's nazi salute there right that's what
00:41:20jennifer did she was being abused she was a mess she was under the influence of this horrible parent
00:41:25i mean that's where that comes from right
00:41:31i was happy we were being thrown off that we were getting through i wanted to go home
00:41:37ended up bringing us back a third time jennifer why didn't you come on out now when you see me
00:41:43on
00:41:43the jerry springer show when i was 17 that was not me i think by that point i was just
00:41:49starting to get
00:41:50really mad because i did not want to be there i didn't want to be saying these things i didn't
00:41:55want
00:41:55anything to do with it why do you want to hate why not live this one chance you have on
00:42:00earth
00:42:00just trying to be as kind to this nice god tells it in the bible this is my interpretation of
00:42:06how
00:42:06god tells them in the bible that has to be manufactured from home right and by the way it's
00:42:11softening it's not as harsh as it was when she was 14. i'm sitting here listening i mean you're sick
00:42:18me sitting here i'm gonna expect you to say that i'm gonna expect any one of you to say that
00:42:22i don't care so you can really see the anger in me as well let's bring out now her dad
00:42:31august
00:42:36it's like he's impersonating a priest and you teach and god is hate that's what you're saying
00:42:43i hate the evil i hate you yeah okay these people went out of their way like he said to
00:42:51get their
00:42:52goat and he was angry why don't you shut up why can't we ever bring our point across
00:43:00okay okay we know that the six million people died trust me no we don't know they're not they're not
00:43:04i
00:43:05know you shut your face right now i honestly thought that the audience was gonna rush the
00:43:16stage and trample and hurt us jerry really was upset and you could see that was completely out of
00:43:24character for him completely we went out afterwards and we talked about it the show was about dysfunction
00:43:34so these neo-nazis certainly fit into that category and so i lost my temper on on one show
00:43:42but this is america and if you want to get on television and spout the world it's free society
00:43:49you know i'm not allowed to censor you i'm not allowed to say because i disagree you can't be on
00:43:54jerry was such a huge believer in freedom of speech freedom of expression i'm sorry about that
00:44:00but now let's but jerry was not happy that it got him to that point jerry thought he was better
00:44:04than
00:44:05that and uh you know we just sat and talked about it uh hugged each other it was you know
00:44:11it was a
00:44:11moment for us listen when we look back through history there are plenty examples of what happens
00:44:19when you platform violent racist rhetoric jerry chose to give people a platform no matter what
00:44:29their views were but jerry always had the last word because at the end of the show jerry would give
00:44:35his
00:44:35unfiltered final thought see the final thought was what brought it all together it really was nothing
00:44:43more than jerry's commentary at the end of the news and a lot of people don't know jerry wrote him
00:44:50jerry wrote him on the fly in the moment my hope is that sometime in these kids lives somebody breaks
00:44:57through and saves them in the meantime and until that happens if ever we all can only hope that they
00:45:04don't have children when i'm listening to it again i thought it kind of feels like victim shaming
00:45:18how dare you you're abusing me as well you and your entire staff for money how is that any better
00:45:32when i turned 18 and i married and got the hell out of there my dad i reported him in
00:45:3996 after i left
00:45:43myself and one of my other siblings and um they refused to even investigate
00:45:51i believe it wasn't investigated because of who i was but then he was arrested in 2014 for sexually abusing
00:46:02kids
00:46:16the only good thing that came out of that was my mother was able to get custody
00:46:23of my siblings full custody she should feel proud of herself ultimately as a survivor
00:46:31he passed away the end of may 2025 no no i'm not letting you off the hook people are torturing
00:46:38themselves people that are in these terrible positions they go on these shows and they get
00:46:43mocked and they get ridiculed and you use them to make money the people come on the show because they
00:46:49want to come on the show and talk about things that are going on in their life 99 of the
00:46:54time it's
00:46:54not a very serious issue but it's not life-changing and then they get taunted by an audience that's
00:46:59making fun of them and laughing at them if they don't want to be on the show they don't have
00:47:04to
00:47:04they do not get paid they do not get it right though when i've interviewed jerry he will usually
00:47:09describe his show as this stupid show i do my show is a circus i mean that's all it is
00:47:15it's stupid
00:47:16i brought down western civilization no it's a stupid show i apologize i'm sorry this is just
00:47:22television this is just a silly show it's just entertainment well if you continuously minimize
00:47:29the impact of the show then you don't have to be held accountable for some of the negative consequences
00:47:35that have taken place there's always been something that emerges on the cultural landscape
00:47:43that previous generations worry in particular that they're going to destroy the youth
00:47:48i mean listen there were talks of canceling the show i mean that happened stations were angry
00:47:56by that point the show had been on television for seven years
00:48:00we don't want jerry springer on tv you better feel responsible because you've encouraged it
00:48:07you've glorified it and you've legitimized it it's a television show and get real give the public a
00:48:15little more credit than that it's a television show and that's the end of that i don't think
00:48:20it had the capability of destroying america
00:48:31i worked for the hollywood police department and i handled all cases involving child abuse
00:48:36physical sexual emotional abuse on children i think it was 1998 a teacher called me up at the hollywood
00:48:44pd and i got information that this young girl eight years old had been sexually molested by her
00:48:50brothers and had told her teacher at school the first thing i'd done was talk to the child
00:48:57she had told me that her mom would leave at 6 30 in the morning and these boys at that
00:49:03time
00:49:04her older brother 15 and 13 would engage in sexual activity with her
00:49:10so i ended up picking up these two boys 15 and 13 at the time during the course of their
00:49:16statements
00:49:17i talked to this 15-year-old like nothing it just struck me as very cold-hearted
00:49:23he told me incidences where he would give her candy and have her perform other type of sexual acts on
00:49:29him
00:49:30and his brother was involved so i let him what do you call this and his remark was incest i
00:49:39says okay
00:49:39and where did you learn about this he said jerry springer show
00:49:53i don't watch jerry springer i don't know if he ever did a show on incest eight months before the
00:50:01investigation jerry airs an episode entitled i am pregnant by my brother in this episode a 17-year-old
00:50:11girl named heather has been impregnated by her 16-year-old half-brother so you grew up separately
00:50:18but knowing that he's your blood brother wouldn't that say to you you know what this is not a guy
00:50:23i sleep with
00:50:26i love these shows there's a sister sleeping with her brother what
00:50:33and i'm not saying isn't that a great topic and everybody in the world should do it
00:50:38that's not what i'm saying i'm saying for that time then when we were doing these kinds of shows
00:50:44this was the kind of stuff i'm not saying that this particular episode is what the two teenage
00:50:49boys were referring to but it did just air a few months earlier and now when things like this start
00:50:55happening it is getting a lot of heat in the press two teenagers charged with a horrible crime or
00:51:00blaming a tv show for the idea the suspects say an episode of the jerry springer show which dealt with
00:51:06incest was the motivation for the attack using us as an excuse for bad behavior or to do something
00:51:13to your sister is absolutely ludicrous you know they'll say it at the end of the show this is not
00:51:18something we promote this is something that was put out there you know as a shock value more shock value
00:51:26if you read stories about this case there's a lot of obfuscation there's not a lot of detail because
00:51:31these are minors and they don't want to expose them to every detail but the reality is study shows
00:51:37that television doesn't cause this type of behavior however television radio images jerry springer show
00:51:46did have a tendency to normalize these things it's not causation but desensitization and it shows here
00:51:55because the older brother acted as if this crime was just inconsequential when i took the statement from
00:52:00the 15 year old i got it i gotta say it really shocked me his demeanor which was very nonchalant
00:52:11as a
00:52:11matter of fact when he had made mention of the jerry springer show uh it kind of like that it
00:52:20was okay i
00:52:21mean i've seen it on tv so what's the big deal wow he's cold-hearted and that's why i said
00:52:27you know this
00:52:28thing's got to be done
00:52:40after about five years of doing the show it started to change into something that i didn't really want
00:52:46to be a part of it there are some things that were never meant to be aired out on television
00:52:54it wasn't the
00:52:58forum and i pack up my little box and walk out of it never went back
00:53:07there are a number of different categories that you would see on the jerry springer show
00:53:10you would see cheating stories love gone wrong racism was a big one and now show time
00:53:21we would do things above and beyond what the normal production crews would do i've always thought that
00:53:29that if you were a producer on our show you could one day be a producer on any other show
00:53:39because it would be a cake war compared to it we reached manson in prison
00:53:46we wanted to do a satellite shoot with him
00:53:49we were going to do a cannibal true to life cannibal i seen a guy who's murdered somebody
00:53:58in cold blood chopped them up and ate them then there was another category called secrets revealed
00:54:07inherently the producers are withholding information and one person doesn't know that
00:54:13that's coming the result is completely unpredictable every time a talk show runs like jerry if you
00:54:22remember uh doing a toss out to break you'll see do you have a secret that you're keeping from someone
00:54:33if so we want to know call jerry the majority of the guests came from those leads and they want
00:54:41to tell
00:54:42you their whole messy life and out of that you figure out an angle for the episode
00:54:53we did the surprise i'm a drag queen show and in this show i booked the sweetest little old lady
00:55:01from alabama her son was probably in his late 30s early 40s and he had a surprise for her and
00:55:11at this
00:55:12point i was polished i could get anybody on that shelf i wanted you i got you right and i
00:55:18told her
00:55:19you know your son has a surprise for you he does and he wants to share it with you on
00:55:25the jerry springer
00:55:26show jerry and i said and i'm gonna fly you out to chicago we're gonna put you up in a
00:55:33swanky hotel
00:55:35i'm gonna pick you up in a limo and you're gonna get to meet jerry
00:55:39and your son's got a surprise for you what's his surprise well that's the surprise you may like
00:55:45the surprise you may not but hey you're gonna get to come to chicago and meet jerry
00:55:51so it's time for the surprise and she's sitting on the stage and her son comes out and he's dressed
00:55:59in full drag and he had written a song all the lyrics written bashing his mother who to my knowledge
00:56:12at that point was probably the sweetest person i had ever booked on the show and she sat there with
00:56:19so
00:56:19much class and integrity and just took it segment ends and i go backstage to check on her and she
00:56:31had just burst into tears in my arms and how could you do this to me
00:56:40and i was just you know i was i was only a kid in my 20s but i just knew
00:56:48it was wrong you know it was
00:56:50very wrong and it just felt horrible and that night i called bert dubrow and i said bert
00:57:00i quit
00:57:05in 1997 multimedia entertainment was bought by universal richard he had an edge
00:57:13that worked for the show at the time and it exploded it did wonders for jerry and it did wonders
00:57:21for the universal richard dominic created a show that you literally couldn't look away from
00:57:28there was so much drama going on people don't look away from those things we were a bunch of young
00:57:35competitive producers who all wanted to make the best shows and ratings were kind of the benchmark
00:57:42of your success and so you wanted your shows to rate you wanted them to rate better than everybody
00:57:49else like there was a lot of internal competition people are putting money into that station
00:57:57and if they're putting their money into it they want to make sure it's successful ratings ratings
00:58:03right our job was to get ratings and we did in 1998 the jerry springer show beat oprah in the
00:58:11ratings
00:58:12bringing in 8 million viewers oprah winfrey show was not just the gold standard in talk it was the
00:58:21ultimate success ratings in television today are nothing like during our heyday
00:58:29probably a year or two after universal took over my contract was up universal took over
00:58:36and i went on the show kept going under richard dominic now the jerry springer show is evolving but
00:58:43how far do you let that go the most volatile ones are those secret shows there are a lot of
00:58:50young
00:58:50people though that they they don't admit it but they really want to be famous they want to be a
00:58:55star
00:58:55and it's understandable because it looks so attractive but it isn't all wonderful all the
00:59:03i have a secret i'm gonna expose something i'm gonna say they're very dangerous please meet eleanor
00:59:09so on may 7 2000 a show was taped entitled secret mistresses confronted she says her husband's
00:59:18ex-wife needs to know what's really going on
00:59:21hello what's going on well jerry i'm here to tell you i mean i really hate my husband's ex-wife
00:59:30sounds like classic jerry the episode is all about two women who are involved with the same man
00:59:37eleanor and nancy eleanor claims that nancy her husband ralph's ex-wife has been stalking them
00:59:46she has stalked us she has driven by our home peeks in our window trying to get in touch with
00:59:54ralph and
00:59:54trying to reconnect with him romantically that's richard dominic there at the podium watching okay here
01:00:02she is nan nancy comes on the show and she looks like a total fish out of water and like
01:00:12she doesn't
01:00:13want to be there ralph and i are trying to restore our marriage and this uh
01:00:20and this trailer trash won't leave us alone nancy looks visibly uncomfortable while eleanor is reared
01:00:28up she's ready for this fight with nancy nancy she's not willing to engage in this confrontation
01:00:35in the same way that eleanor is so you can tell immediately something is off no see there's no room
01:00:42in our bedroom for another fat lady like you stand up stand up i'm remembering why i never watched
01:00:53jerry springer it's just so uncomfortable and then ralph comes out here he is ralph
01:01:08he's odd he just seems odd and detached and something's very very wrong with ralph
01:01:13the matter of the fact a month ago i married ellie and i do love eleanor ralph wants to stay
01:01:20with eleanor
01:01:21what in fact happens during the show is ralph and his new wife eleanor ridicule and demean nancy
01:01:28he loves the excitement he doesn't want you nancy he loves you're old you're fat
01:01:33the producers knew that if they told one person to antagonize one person to the point of torture that
01:01:40human nature says this other party is going to respond with force nancy does the exact opposite of
01:01:47what you think would happen she doesn't engage she didn't talk she couldn't speak in fact she walks
01:01:53off the stage he's telling you he doesn't want to be with you that's fine bye i thought that nancy
01:02:00had
01:02:01a lot of class and dignity and it was truly a departure from the way that we have seen most
01:02:07guests
01:02:08on jerry springer behave at the same time ralph is celebrating with eleanor and so mean to the ex-wife
01:02:17this was the man that she thought loved her completely humiliating her in front of this
01:02:24audience i mean it was brutal the show taped on may 7th but it didn't air until july 24 2000.
01:02:3893911 location the emergency hello hi i'm not really sure if there is one
01:02:45problem here earlier today at this house across the street from me okay what's the emergency right
01:02:51now sir well he's afraid that somebody might be harmed or killed in here we don't i don't know
01:03:05in july of 2000 we're sent to a welfare check so we just went to the house
01:03:12checked the front door no answer and then started walking around the house
01:03:20there was a side window that you could see and we could see someone laying on the kitchen floor
01:03:35i got a call from communications telling me that they wanted me to respond to a possible homicide
01:03:43the victim was nancy campbell panitz
01:03:48and she was brutally beaten in her own home
01:03:56she wasn't just killed she was there was a lot of rage there there was at least two areas where
01:04:04she had put up a struggle
01:04:08it appeared that she barricaded the front door
01:04:13she also disabled the exterior garage door
01:04:17so that kind of told me that she was scared of something
01:04:24this case there wasn't a ton of evidence physical evidence other than the victim
01:04:31there were several partial bloody shoe prints
01:04:35that were off to the right of where the victim was underneath her arms
01:04:42she couldn't have left those shoe prints she was barefoot
01:04:47i was able to notice that there was some lines on her face
01:04:52so i did something that i never did before and never had to do again i got clear plastic and
01:05:00i put it
01:05:00up on the side of her face where i saw the lines and i used sharpie marker to mark the
01:05:06lines and it was
01:05:07consistent with the shoe pattern that had been on the floor
01:05:12which to me represents somebody was stomping on her face her face is completely distorted by
01:05:20trauma she was stomped to death it's profoundly violent this was cold-blooded stuff
01:05:34ralph was captured and the shoes he was wearing when he was arrested they were able to match them to
01:05:39the crime scene at some point i learned that they had been on the jerry springer show
01:05:46and that it had aired that day of the homicide
01:05:51it just sort of became the jerry springer homicide and not the nancy pan that's campbell homicide
01:06:03because nancy's no longer with us and i can be a voice for nancy
01:06:10before nancy was killed nancy made an appointment to see me about ralph nancy met ralph online
01:06:20they dated for a while and they got married and then things kind of took a turn for the worse
01:06:28there had been acts of domestic violence in the past
01:06:34he had threatened to kill her that he had threatened to hurt her
01:06:38that he had actually batted her and hit her and shoved her in the past there had been a petition
01:06:45for
01:06:46restraining order for restraining order filed in 1998 there had been another petition for
01:06:53restraining order filed from nancy against ralph again in 1999 which is when they had gotten divorced
01:07:03there had been a interloper in their marriage
01:07:09a woman by the name of eleanor who is also part of the reason of the demise of the marriage
01:07:17with domestic violence there is this vicious cycle that unfolds where someone who knows that their
01:07:24partner is abusive continue to return to them but what the victim doesn't realize is that they are
01:07:30actually putting themselves in danger in this particular case it was either ralph or eleanor
01:07:36who would have called in to be on the show to confront nancy on national television
01:07:41but then it would be up to them to convince nancy
01:07:46she said she got a call and i think ralph had said to her you know i'm in germany
01:07:50and i don't have the money to get home and if you go on the jerry springer show with me
01:07:55they'll pay for me to fly over and then we can live happily ever after again what nancy had told
01:08:01me
01:08:01was she was going to be told that eleanor was out of the picture and that her and ralph
01:08:06were going to reconcile which is not what happened
01:08:12the producers had an opportunity to look into ralph's background to conduct a simple background check
01:08:20we didn't do formal background checks on people we brought people that had restraining orders
01:08:26we brought people that were not supposed to leave their state
01:08:32there had been public records which ralph had been arrested for felony battery that got reduced to a
01:08:38misdemeanor and ralph had been on probation for battery at the time that they were on jerry springer
01:08:46and i don't understand why the producers couldn't just vet these people
01:08:52it is so easy to check the public records in the counties where they live in
01:08:58this isn't like rocket science this isn't brain surgery this is just like doing a little quick
01:09:04computer search we were more concerned had they been on another show because we didn't want to bring
01:09:08people that had been on other shows and they were just like bouncing from show to show like telling their
01:09:12story we were more worried about that than if they were actually criminals that's a big mistake
01:09:22they should check the court records on people take that long and another death
01:09:32acts as the series finale
01:09:42after nancy left the jerry springer show refusing to continue to participate and when she got back to
01:09:50sarasota at some point after that ralph tried to make amends with her she had alleged that he was
01:09:56physically violent to her again and ralph then decided he was going to reconcile again with eleanor
01:10:04and he moved eleanor into nancy's house
01:10:12nancy was kicked out of her house and she was living on the street in her car
01:10:18so i ended up working to get ralph out of the house and that was my main focus
01:10:27the morning of july 24th of 2000 on the day nancy was killed we went to court for a hearing
01:10:34on
01:10:36the petition for protection against domestic violence which was pretty much synonymous with
01:10:41what we would call a restraining order the judge granted nancy's petition and gave nancy possession of the
01:10:48house and i remember i gave her a big hug and that she should go home and that was the
01:10:57last time i saw her
01:11:01ralph was removed from the house and ralph had gone to the bar
01:11:10and when he was at the bar the jerry springer show aired
01:11:16and there's nancy like just right there
01:11:21you know just the coincidence of that was just kind of amazing
01:11:31this is the police interview with the bartender who saw ralph and eleanor
01:11:34ralph got here about 12 12 15. did they make any comments or were they happy the show upset with
01:11:43the
01:11:43show he said how she stopped and she looked in windows and the bartender says he seemed kind
01:11:49agitated a little bit in and out of the seat i firmly believe that the guy as he's drinking that
01:11:58he
01:11:58looked like the villain
01:12:03so now you're humiliated in front of whoever's in this bar people are telling him how bad he looks
01:12:12the guy snaps and does it commits murder
01:12:20you make me cry
01:12:30nancy will stay with me i cared about nancy i feel like for me you know i tried to help
01:12:37her
01:12:39and even though i won on paper i lost
01:12:54after the murder with springer happened it's a big shock did they slow down no
01:13:05the show was going to go to jamaica and do a spring break thing see how wild they could get
01:13:11people to this day think they left so no media could talk with the staff about the murder that took
01:13:21place whether that's true or not i have no idea is the timing convenient maybe
01:13:32maybe maybe not
01:13:36i feel like after the murder they got a lot stricter on secret releasing guests secret
01:13:43releasing was the producer's workaround to keep the guests in the dark about the secret
01:13:47by giving options on what the surprise could be
01:13:50it could be that you're going to find out that you're being cheated on it could be that you're going
01:13:56to find out that your partner is cheating on you with someone of the same sex it could be that
01:14:02who you're with is a prostitute but one of them was really it just we didn't fully give them all
01:14:07of the details of that we would give them those options of what they might hear before they went on
01:14:12to stage so that the show would not be liable but i still kind of knew some of what i
01:14:18was doing was wrong
01:14:21and that's why i quit actually i was asked by a guest
01:14:29he felt like he had trusted me and then i misled him in his story he was like how can
01:14:36you live with
01:14:36yourself like i trusted you you're like damn maybe i don't want to do this anymore i was like you
01:14:43know
01:14:43maybe i am wrecking people's lives
01:14:48just before nbc universal moved production to stanford connecticut in 2008 richard dominic resigned at
01:14:55the end of the 18th season another producer rachel wilkos and wife to the security director steve wilkos
01:15:01took over as vp and then another producer picked up the helm in 2015 by the time i left all
01:15:09the
01:15:10shows sort of looked the same it's crazy it sounds there was no shock value anymore
01:15:15i think the show was starting to become a one-trick pony and most of the time it was just
01:15:21kind of
01:15:23tongue-in-cheek fun but you know when you do something dirty and underhanded like that and
01:15:29manipulative yeah it may seem tongue-in-cheek fun for a while but something's bad's bound to happen
01:15:37in this episode blake galvey's a guy from louisville kentucky who was confronted by his
01:15:42fiancee who told him that she was having an affair with his friend i don't want to marry you
01:15:48his friend also joins him on this episode the two get into a scuffle
01:15:55before they are separated and blake had no idea this was going to happen
01:16:00about 10 days after it aired blake died by suicide
01:16:19we've handled a variety of wrongful death cases over the past several decades in kentucky and ohio
01:16:25primarily if you are killed and no fault of your own one of your family members has the ability
01:16:31to bring a lawsuit on your behalf and your state's behalf and a lawsuit was filed by blake's family
01:16:40against the jerry springer show and other defendants alvey versus gerald springer
01:16:47nbc universal they alleged that blake's death was a result of extreme emotional distress
01:16:54that was caused by this show and the airing of it boy if there's ever an entity that you could
01:16:59say
01:17:00was really trying to cause alarm harm embarrassment it's the kind of thing those producers do on the jerry
01:17:07springer show our firm and i were not involved in any way in this case but i looked at the
01:17:14pleadings
01:17:15the case docket this is a document that the production team has given on the springer show
01:17:22and it's an outline and advice uh rules guidelines that they're supposed to follow when they have
01:17:28guests and participants on the show and the first number one out of
01:17:3730 lines or so the number one rule is to always play dumb
01:17:45most important rule to follow on show day is always play dumb all bold
01:17:52many guests will ask you all kinds of questions regarding why they're here
01:17:56the other guests on their show and various other details of their story you must not mention anything
01:18:01regarding their story if you ever have any doubts about what you can or cannot say to a guest then
01:18:07do not say anything at all as far as they know you just started this is a four page document
01:18:17with
01:18:17multiple bullet points and guidelines on every page and not one speaks to the well-being of the
01:18:24participants listen when you are interviewing guests and you're talking about revealing secrets and
01:18:32cheating scandals there is a measure of responsibility that has to be in place in order to protect
01:18:40the guests of the show so it's naive to assume that someone is not going to die as a result
01:18:48of this
01:18:49extreme conflict on the show and so in this case the judge agreed and ordered that the parties go to
01:18:59arbitration and then several months later the case was dismissed we do not know how much the plaintiff
01:19:06was suing for a lot of times that negotiation is confidential but the hope is always that by
01:19:12bringing a lawsuit that you will change the behavior of the jerry springer show
01:19:25jerry always said that the show doesn't create society it reflects it and he is absolutely correct
01:19:31that is 100 correct but think about all the chanting and stuff they're human beings and we dehumanize
01:19:37them that is on us we should look at ourselves very carefully it seems like a certain percentage of
01:19:47both the people that worked on the show and people who appeared on it were spiritually depleted in the
01:19:56experience i don't want to say that people became spiritually bankrupt because of it but they certainly
01:20:01were at risk of being so these days i am a ceo of my own company i'm a showrunner exec
01:20:09producer i've done
01:20:10several network cable tv shows and have i made money off of trainwreck tv yes i have but i will
01:20:24tell you
01:20:25the only time that i did it and wasn't proud of it and couldn't sleep at night over it was
01:20:32when i was
01:20:32producing the jerry springer show i'm not super proud of all the shows that i made the springer show changed
01:20:43our culture in a lot of ways
01:20:48i think it belonged in the past and that's where it should stay
01:20:55after i was on the show i became a physician an author and i am an advocate for young people
01:21:03experiencing homelessness it's an ego thing when we today talk about our legacy holy kidding after
01:21:11interviewing jerry 20 years later my biggest question was like did you know what it took to
01:21:17get that show on the air yes i knew what you guys did but i i was so separated from
01:21:27what actually
01:21:28happened including not knowing ahead of time they never told me who the guests were going to be jerry
01:21:35springer never knew about the stories before we came to tape and it may have actually helped
01:21:41just due to the fact maybe he wouldn't want to see some of the stuff we put together you know
01:21:49if you can cover your ears close your eyes and walk away you can fake ignorance that's plausible
01:21:55deniability but i think this is the question and this is a question that still endures today
01:22:01if it's your show your face your name but you choose to turn a blind eye to morally bad behavior
01:22:09from your
01:22:09team aren't you complicit is it been good for society in that show it's been horrible but look
01:22:14at all the money you made well yeah whenever i watch any of this all i think about is i
01:22:20wish he was
01:22:21still here okay thank you i don't think of the show think of him
01:22:35what's the final thought for today
01:22:40you should be saying may you never be on my show
01:22:53rachel from boy me's world is a porn star people who go from being child stars you were america's
01:23:00sweetheart to being an adult family dan is now in adult entertainment don't you feel bad about these
01:23:07you've got to look in the mirror and be happy with who you are
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