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00:00You shot a dog that wasn't doing anything.
00:08What's your problem?
00:09I don't know.
00:09That's not an answer.
00:10Well, I did shoot the dog.
00:12You have no right to shoot any dog.
00:14This is Judy Justice.
00:33Michael and Perry Butler are suing their neighbors, Michael Welch Jr. and Lisa Welch, for vet bills.
00:41Court come to order.
00:42All rise.
00:44Have a seat, please.
00:47Judge, case 4024, Butler v. Welch.
00:50You're welcome.
00:51Mr. Butler Sr.
00:53Yes.
00:54This is your grandson.
00:55Yes.
00:55You live on a piece of property, a rural piece of property, and that property is owned by whom?
01:01By me.
01:02And you've owned that property for how long?
01:05About 20 years.
01:06And the defendants, are they tenants of yours?
01:09No.
01:10They live close by?
01:12They have an RV parked on part of my property.
01:16With your permission?
01:17With my son's permission.
01:19So your son lives on the property with the defendants?
01:22Well, he lives on the property.
01:24Well, who's going to explain this to me?
01:25You're going to explain it to me?
01:26Come on, stand up.
01:28Your last name is Butler.
01:29Yes.
01:30Your father owns property.
01:32Yes.
01:32And you live on your father's property.
01:35Yes.
01:35In a house or an RV?
01:37House.
01:37How do you know the defendants?
01:39Just old friends.
01:40Did you allow them to move their RV onto the property?
01:43Yes, I did.
01:44Michael, I did.
01:45Michael.
01:46The father, yes.
01:47That's you.
01:48The one sitting down.
01:49Okay, so you're friends.
01:50Yeah.
01:51And your father allows you to do that.
01:53Yes.
01:53Just my own information.
01:55Do you pay Mr. Butler any rent?
01:57Give it to Scott.
01:58How much?
01:59$400 a month.
02:00And your dad knows about that?
02:02Yes.
02:02Okay, very good.
02:03And this beautiful dog belongs to you?
02:05Yes, that's correct.
02:06Have a seat.
02:09Now, Mr. Butler Jr., you don't live with your dad or your granddad?
02:15No, I do not.
02:16According to what I read, and I believe this is right,
02:18there came a time when you were going away to celebrate a wedding of a friend.
02:22We were going to my niece's graduation.
02:25And what date was the graduation?
02:27June 1st.
02:28And so you couldn't take the dog with you, so you asked your grandfather and or your dad
02:34if you could leave the dog.
02:36And the dog's name is?
02:37Ruka.
02:38If you could leave Ruka with them for a couple of days.
02:41Correct.
02:41Many times when we travel.
02:42How many days?
02:43I believe it was about a week.
02:44Okay, on what date, do you remember, did you leave Ruka with your dad?
02:49I believe it would have been the 29th, and the incident was the morning of the 30th,
02:54if I remember correctly.
02:55Because we were leaving the day the incident happened.
02:57We were flying out, so we got a call that morning before we took off.
03:00Okay.
03:01So this is what I think happened.
03:03Your last name is?
03:04Welch.
03:05Mr. Welch, you lived with?
03:06Um, my mom and my father, yeah.
03:08Great.
03:08And you have chickens and some ducks.
03:12Actually, Scott's the one with the chickens and the ducks, and while he went to jail,
03:16I told him I would take care of the animals and not let any harm come to them.
03:21So...
03:21So they belong to Scott?
03:23Yes.
03:24Okay.
03:24You live with your parents?
03:27Yes, in a camper outside of the property, yes.
03:31In a camper?
03:32Yes, I live in a camper outside of the property.
03:34Do you pay any rent?
03:35No.
03:35Nice people.
03:36You want them off your property or you want them on your property?
03:38We've asked them to leave.
03:40Really?
03:41The owner of the property wants you off the property.
03:43What's your problem?
03:44My husband just went through hip replacement a couple weeks ago, so he's been down for six weeks.
03:51How did he get here?
03:52No, he just got his hip replaced.
03:54He just walked into court.
03:55Yeah, he did that two or three weeks ago, so he's...
03:58What difference does it make?
03:59They asked you to leave the property.
04:00How long have they been asking you to leave the property?
04:03Scott told us that we didn't have to leave.
04:05Perry's the one that said...
04:08Scott doesn't own the property.
04:10His father owns the property.
04:12Am I hearing that right?
04:14That's right.
04:14The owner of the property wants your camper off their property.
04:19What's your problem?
04:20Nothing.
04:21When are you going to leave?
04:23As soon as we can.
04:24What does that mean?
04:25You start your motor home and you go.
04:27And you go to a motor home camp and you plug in someplace else.
04:32Our motor home is not starting.
04:34That is the problem.
04:35No, that's your problem.
04:36Yes, that is my problem.
04:38That's your problem.
04:39You can't squat on somebody else's property because you've got a problem.
04:44They want you to leave and they want you to leave for a reason.
04:46And this is part of the reason.
04:47Because he dropped off his dog a week before in mid-May, according to you, a dog came on
04:55the property that doesn't belong to you and took away chickens or ducks that also don't
05:01belong to you.
05:02So far, I have that right?
05:04Yes, you do.
05:04And they came back and forth and back and forth, these dogs, for a while.
05:09How long?
05:10A week, two?
05:11Just two days.
05:12Two days?
05:13Yeah.
05:13What two days?
05:15Pretty sure it was May 27th and May 26th.
05:2026th and 27th.
05:22Yes, the first day he took a duck.
05:25I don't care what he took.
05:26Okay.
05:27That's not relevant.
05:28They weren't your ducks.
05:29They belong to them.
05:30They weren't your chickens.
05:32And it's not your house.
05:34It's not your property.
05:35So what you did on the 30th is, according to you, dogs came back on your property, a dog
05:43came back on your property on the 30th that you had seen taken to ducks and the chickens
05:49before.
05:50That's what you say.
05:51It was actually a misunderstanding because the neighbor had a dog exactly like his, and
05:57that was the dog that was doing it.
05:58And I made a terrible mistake, and it really went further than it should have.
06:03I shouted for the dog to stop, and it did not.
06:06Bottom line is, you shot a dog.
06:12You shot the dog multiple times.
06:15With a BB gun.
06:16The BB gun.
06:17Would you like me to do that to you multiple times and then try to say to you, you know,
06:20it's just a BB gun.
06:21Just stand there.
06:22Don't be a sissy.
06:23It's just a BB gun.
06:25It can only sting you.
06:26And later today.
06:28Your lawyer said, well, let's rattle the cage a little bit.
06:31Tell her she can't take the boy to Japan.
06:35That's what you say happened.
06:45Michael and Perry Butler claim their neighbors, Michael Welch Jr. and Lisa Welch, owe for
06:52vet bills.
06:52Michael Jr. says he shot their dog while protecting the other animals on the property.
06:58You shot a dog.
07:00With a BB gun.
07:01His dog injured the dog.
07:04This dog that wasn't doing anything, and there were over $4,000 in surgical bills.
07:11Because he made a mistake.
07:13Yes.
07:13So what are we doing here?
07:14Why didn't you take care of the medical bills?
07:16So we don't feel like we should have...
07:18I gotcha a second.
07:19I don't care about you.
07:21Yeah.
07:21I didn't take care of the medical bills because I didn't feel like I should have to be put
07:26the whole bill on me.
07:27Let me ask you this question.
07:29I wasn't holding the gun with you, right?
07:31No.
07:31Sarah Rose.
07:32She said you never saw her before.
07:34No, no.
07:34She wasn't holding the gun with you.
07:36No.
07:36Now, your mom didn't say to you, shoot the dog.
07:39Did your father tell you to shoot the dog?
07:41No.
07:42So you did that all by yourself?
07:44Just answer my question.
07:45That requires a yes or no.
07:47You shot the dog all by yourself.
07:48Well, yes, I shot the dog myself.
07:52Right.
07:52Yes.
07:53So now that you say you shot the dog yourself, you shot the wrong dog, right?
07:59Yes.
07:59You had no right to shoot any dog, but this dog certainly hadn't been on your property before
08:03because it had only been dropped off the night before.
08:06This was a visiting dog.
08:07Let's say instead of a visiting dog, he dropped off his twin boys and they would come on the
08:14property and chase the ducks and chase the ducks and chase the ducks and then they would
08:17go home.
08:17And then another kid that was pretty much the same size as those kids came on your property
08:23and you thought that that kid was the one that was torturing your ducks, stealing your
08:28chickens.
08:28So you shot the wrong kid.
08:30No, I wouldn't do that.
08:30Why not?
08:31Because that's a child.
08:33Really?
08:34Yeah.
08:34So you think that shooting somebody else's property, attacking somebody else's property,
08:40and you shot the dog multiple times.
08:43With the BB gun.
08:45And the BB gun.
08:46Would you like me to do that to you multiple times and then try to say to you, you know,
08:49it's just a BB gun.
08:50Just stand there.
08:51Don't be a sissy.
08:53It's just a BB gun.
08:54It can only sting you unless you get it in the eye or unless you get it in a vital
08:58organ.
08:58I wasn't shooting at vital stuff.
09:01I was shooting at the body of the animal.
09:03I wasn't trying to shoot at its head or its eyeballs or anything like that.
09:06Then you say, I'm sorry, I made a terrible mistake.
09:09I will take care of the vet bills because I made a mistake.
09:13It's my mistake.
09:15Why are we here?
09:16I understand.
09:16You're right.
09:17Perfect.
09:18When are you moving off the property?
09:19As soon as I get back there.
09:21As soon as you get back there.
09:22How far away is it?
09:24I'd say about three hours away.
09:25It's in North Palm Springs.
09:26Fine.
09:27You have a car?
09:28My car is broken.
09:29That's why I'm still there.
09:31It's because my car is broken.
09:33How long has your car been broken?
09:35Probably about a little bit over nine months.
09:38Mm-hmm.
09:38Other than camping out on the property, what else do you do?
09:41Also, I'm not on the property, actually.
09:44I'm off of their property in BLM land.
09:47In where?
09:47I'm on Bureau of Land Management land.
09:50I'm not on Scott's property.
09:52So you're on my land?
09:54Probably.
09:54I didn't give permission to be on my land.
09:56What are you doing on my land?
09:58I don't know.
09:58I guess I was just hanging out there.
10:03Can I see the vet bills, please?
10:05Yes.
10:06Scott.
10:07Yes.
10:11What were you doing in prison?
10:13I was in jail.
10:14For what?
10:16Receiving stolen property.
10:17What kind of property?
10:18I was buying and selling cars, and I had some I shouldn't have had.
10:22Okay.
10:22And how long did you spend incarcerated?
10:25Three months.
10:26Okay.
10:27Do you work?
10:28Yes.
10:29What kind of work do you do?
10:30I do boilers now.
10:31When did you first tell them that you would like them to leave the property?
10:34It was about six months ago.
10:36Michael Jr. is one I told to leave.
10:38Just him?
10:39Michael Sr. has been there for a while, and I've always got along with him.
10:42And then Lisa sort of came back onto the property, and so did Michael Jr., which I never wanted him
10:48there.
10:48But you just wouldn't leave.
10:51You know what you did to the animal that you thought was on your property that wasn't your own?
10:57Did you ever think that you're on property that's not your own?
11:00Oh, I knew I was.
11:01You know you are.
11:01I'm trying to draw an analogy there for you, sir.
11:04You're missing it.
11:05No, no, I didn't miss it.
11:06I understood what you're saying, but I totally understand now what is going on.
11:11Well, get off his property.
11:12No problem.
11:13What are these three $50 receipts for?
11:16Lisa agreed right after the shooting to pay the bill, and then she paid me two $50 amounts, which I
11:26gave her receipts for.
11:27Okay, judging for the plaintiff in the amount of $4,156.48.
11:32Thank you very much.
11:33This court is adjourned.
11:37Well, I appreciate the fact that she ruled in the way that she did.
11:40I feel like we've gotten justice for Ruka.
11:42When I called and told him that I'd shot the dog, he mentioned a few hours later that it was
11:49his son's dog.
11:50And also the fact that my grandpa can be reimbursed for, you know, the hardship of having to take care
11:55of this.
11:56Time to find another place.
11:59I was under the impression, maybe you were too from the papers, that the ducks and the chickens and the
12:03other animals that the defendant was claiming to be protecting belong to him.
12:08Only right now in court did we find out that they actually belong to the plaintiff.
12:12And so there is no defensive property claim that he could claim for his actions.
12:17But I think at the end of the day, he accepted responsibility.
12:19He knows he did the wrong thing.
12:21Why it had to come in front of us to get solved.
12:24Because he didn't pay the bill.
12:25All right.
12:25On to the next.
12:26On to the next.
12:27Case number 4007.
12:30Rodriguez versus Vidari.
12:31All parties, please come forward.
12:33Selma Rodriguez is suing her former daughter-in-law, Natalie Vidari, for the cost of canceling a trip to Japan.
12:41Ms. Vidari, this is your former mother-in-law.
12:44Correct.
12:44Your former mother-in-law is suing you for the cost of a trip that she paid for, for your
12:5014-year-old son, a trip to Japan that was canceled by you in a time frame when she could
12:58not get any refunds on the trip for your son.
13:02That's what your case is about, correct?
13:04Yes, correct.
13:04So I'm going to recite what seems to me to be sort of an agreed set of facts based upon
13:12your complaint and your answer.
13:14But I have to start with you.
13:16How long had you been married to her son?
13:20We were married for 13 years.
13:21And you have two children together.
13:23One is 14.
13:25What's his name?
13:26Vittorio.
13:26Who is this?
13:27My son, Vittorio.
13:29Step outside.
13:34I don't think he has to be here.
13:38Okay.
13:39Vittorio and?
13:40Mila.
13:41How old is she?
13:42She's eight.
13:43And those are your only two children?
13:45Yes.
13:45Do you work?
13:46Yes, I do.
13:46What kind of work do you do?
13:48I'm in customer service for the automotive industry.
13:50When were you divorced?
13:5117, 18, it was finally official.
13:53In what year were you divorced, sir?
13:552019.
13:56And during the period of time of your divorce, after it was finalized, your mother-in-law has maintained a
14:03relationship with both of your children.
14:05Yes.
14:05And she's even traveled with one or more of your children.
14:09Yes.
14:09Independently of you and her son.
14:15It's outrageous behavior, in my judgment, for you to think that you are a sole parent, that you can take
14:21these two children on a whim to another state when they have an ongoing relationship with a custodial parent.
14:39Selma Rodriguez claims her former daughter-in-law, Natalie Vadari, canceled a trip with her grandson to Japan, costing her
14:48thousands in non-refundable fees.
14:50So she's taken the 14-year-old away on vacation.
14:54Yeah.
14:55Tell me where she's taken him.
14:56Um, she's taken him to Alaska.
14:59She's taken him to Tennessee.
15:02And I assume that the two children, since one of the children was here, that they live with you full
15:07-time.
15:07We split custody.
15:08So they're back and forth at my house and their father's house.
15:11Now, when was it for the first time that your mother-in-law expressed an interest in taking your son
15:17on a trip to Japan?
15:20Oh, I want to say...
15:22You don't remember, I'll ask her.
15:24January.
15:25Of what year?
15:262024.
15:27And there were several things that had to be done.
15:29Yes.
15:30One of the things that had to be done is that your son's passport had expired.
15:33Yes.
15:33And what did you have to do to update his passport?
15:37We had to go to the post office and renew his photo and his information.
15:40And you did that with him?
15:42Yes.
15:42And do you remember what month you did that?
15:44I believe in January.
15:45And that was all for the purpose of getting ready for this trip to Japan, which was supposed to take
15:50place when?
15:50The departure date was May 28th.
15:53Now, on what date did your lawyer tell you you shouldn't let your 14-year-old go to Tokyo?
15:59That was back in April.
16:01You have a boyfriend?
16:02Yes.
16:03How long have you had your boyfriend?
16:05We've been together for three years now.
16:06What does he do?
16:07He's a veteran.
16:08He's retired.
16:09He lives off a pension.
16:10Yes.
16:11So let me understand this.
16:13Your children have a close relationship with their paternal grandmother.
16:17They split custody with their father and you.
16:19And according to your answer, what you wanted to do was take your children and move with your boyfriend, who
16:26is unemployed, to Montana.
16:28That's what you said.
16:29We're relocating.
16:30You wanted to move with your boyfriend to Montana.
16:34Yes.
16:35Not because he had a job there that he had to have or because he had to have long-term
16:41surgery and recuperation, but because you liked it better.
16:45Because of the cost of living.
16:46We can't afford to live here in California.
16:47So we're looking to relocate.
16:49You want us to get a job.
16:50You have a job.
16:51You've been divorced for a while.
16:53You've been able to sustain yourselves here.
16:56And if he's retired, let him get a job.
16:59So what happened is your former husband said to you, I'm not giving you permission to take my children, who
17:06I share custody with, from California to Montana.
17:10Does that sound crazy to anyone?
17:12And after it became contentious and you're currently in court, is that right?
17:17It's in the works.
17:18It's in court.
17:19Your lawyer said, well, let's rattle the cage a little bit.
17:23Tell her she can't take the boy to Japan.
17:26That's in your answer, right?
17:28Okay.
17:28Well, you're going to pay for the trip that he didn't go on, that she paid and couldn't get a
17:33refund on.
17:34That's outrageous behavior.
17:35First of all, madam, it's outrageous behavior, in my judgment, for you to think that you are a sole parent,
17:42that you can take these two children on a whim, nothing but a whim, to another state, when they have
17:49an ongoing relationship with a custodial parent.
17:52And think that that's okay.
17:54Where do you come off thinking that's okay?
17:56To be honest, your honor, like, it's not off a whim.
17:58We have pre-approval, you know, to...
18:00You have what?
18:01Pre-approval of a home loan to move to my town.
18:04We have everything set, so it's not just on a whim.
18:06Just a second!
18:08Who told you to get everything set?
18:10That's absolutely ridiculous.
18:12So you made these plans, knowing that you have two children, 14 and 8, who have serious ties in California.
18:23Sometimes people, when they have visitation every other Tuesday, if the moon is full with a child, and parties remarry,
18:31and somebody is being sent by the army to Montana.
18:35Well, a judge may say, listen, if we make arrangements for them to visit that one day every Thursday when
18:42there's a full moon, okay.
18:43But your children have a parent here, the same kind of parent as you are.
18:47How would you feel if he said, you know what, I'm going to take the kids?
18:50I think that I have better opportunities for the children in Tennessee.
18:54Before all this, we did have an agreement already on the schedule and everything with the kids.
18:58We just had to make it, you know, go to court and get it approved and everything.
19:01It's not just off of a whim.
19:03It is a whim, and it's not in the best interest of children.
19:06Your 14-year-old has grown up knowing both of his parents.
19:09And because you've got an unemployed boyfriend and want to make a change of life for yourself, you think that
19:15you can disrupt these children.
19:17Leave them with their father.
19:18I'm sure his mother will be more than happy to help take care of them if he's working.
19:22You working?
19:23I am.
19:23In any event, how much was the cost of the trip?
19:25$38.65.
19:27May I see, please?
19:35What's your last name?
19:37Vidari.
19:37Could you stand up next to your mother, please?
19:40Were you consenting to her moving your two children to Montana?
19:44No.
19:45When was the first time she told you she wanted to move the children to Montana?
19:49December of 2023.
19:51And what happened?
19:52We just never really talked about it until about April of this year.
19:56And I told her, like, what I would feel comfortable with was if she already had a home, already had
20:04a job there, because I wasn't comfortable with the situation she was putting herself in.
20:09That didn't happen.
20:10She was angry.
20:11Okay.
20:12Is it currently before the court, this application to relocate?
20:15I have no idea.
20:16You have it before court?
20:18We haven't gone there yet, Your Honor.
20:20You have a lawyer?
20:20Yes.
20:21Did your lawyer serve papers on him?
20:23Not yet.
20:24Okay.
20:24I'm going to suggest it's a monumental waste of time.
20:27Any judge worth this or would deny your application to relocate?
20:30I would deny it.
20:31As a family court person for 25 years, I would deny it in a heartbeat.
20:35Judgment for the plaintiff in the amount of $38.65.
20:38You're responsible for the cost of the trip.
20:40You had no reason to cancel it.
20:42We're done here.
20:42Thank you very much.
20:43Thank you very much, Your Honor.
20:44This court is adjourned.
20:48Two days before the departure date, she sent me a text telling me, I hope you realize that
20:55he won't be able to go with you because I'm not authorizing him to go.
20:59Well, this was regarding the trip and they made it into the Montana thing, which has nothing
21:03to do with the case.
21:04She has really worked on severing the relationship with the children and me.
21:08Well, we can just work this out and move forward.
21:11Your passion for the best interest of the child definitely got to shine through a little
21:16bit in there.
21:17But really, it's true.
21:18Once you have a child, your own personal whims, desires don't come first anymore.
21:24Since 50% of marriages end in divorce, and most marriages have at least one child, then
21:30you have to figure, you're going to be tied to this person for at least 21 years.
21:37Because you may get tired of the mate, but you can't get tired of your kids.
21:41No.
21:43Are you having a family dispute?
21:45Go to JudyJustice.tv.
22:08Have you ever had a family?
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