- 5 months ago
Alex Lieblong is the owner of Reef Runner, the winner of the G2 1351 Turf Sprint in Saudi Arabia last month. Despite the current conflict in neighboring countries, Reef Runner has been training in Dubai to make his next start on Dubai World Cup day. Alex Lieblong joined this week’s TDN Writers’ Room to talk about his decision to soon be joining his stable star in Dubai.
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SportsTranscript
00:00:18Welcome to another edition of the TDN Writer's Room brought to you by Keeneland.
00:00:22I'm Zoe Caban, filling in for Bill Finley, who I'm going to give you a direct quote, guys.
00:00:27Bill said he's going to be in Florida drinking beer and watching the Red Sox in the sunshine.
00:00:34So go, Bill. I'll be filling in for him today. I'm Zoe Caban with First Racing and First TV.
00:00:41Let's see. Bill could be sitting here or he could be drinking beer and watching the Red Sox in Florida
00:00:47sunshine.
00:00:48He probably made the right call. I'm Randy Moss with NBC Sports and the Buyer Speed Figure team.
00:00:53TD Thornton checking in from a little north of Boston today. I'm a correspondent with Thoroughbred Daily News.
00:01:00How's the weather, guys? Is it warm and sunny in your climbs yet? Either one of you?
00:01:06I'm in Minnesota. It was 62 degrees here yesterday.
00:01:10Wow.
00:01:11Pushing past 60 degrees here today as we tape this on Monday in Boston.
00:01:15Okay. All right. Well, let's get to the first order of the day.
00:01:19It's going to be the San Felipe. 50 points to the winner. That went to Petente.
00:01:23I'm a little bit biased, so I'm going to let Randy start first.
00:01:28I thought it was an okay prep. Disappointed in Brandt, who set a reasonably robust pace.
00:01:38But if Brandt was going to be, I think, what Brandt was touted to be because of his lofty purchase
00:01:45price,
00:01:46I think he probably wins that race, which wasn't an especially strong derby prep.
00:01:51Instead, it looks to me like Brandt may wind up being more effective around one turn.
00:01:58Potente winds up beating Robusta, the big Calumet Farm long shot, like 70-1 or something like that.
00:02:06Robusta looked like he was home free and then sort of staggered home with the final quarter
00:02:11and a little bit over 26 seconds. Didn't change running leads.
00:02:15He was on his left lead to the wire.
00:02:17And the Baffert train, Potente, ran him down late.
00:02:20I don't think Potente is going to be the favorite, though, for the Santa Anita Derby.
00:02:27Potente, Robusta, a couple of other horses in there are going to wind up going back again in the Santa
00:02:34Anita Derby.
00:02:35But Baffert has another three-year-old out there that we talked about last week that just broke his maiden
00:02:41named Cherokee Nation with a 100-buyer speed figure.
00:02:45And right now, it looks to me like Cherokee Nation is going to be the favorite in the Santa Anita
00:02:51Derby
00:02:51if they all get back together and reconvene as expected.
00:02:56Yeah, we had two prep races over the weekend, the Tampa Bay Derby and the San Felipe out at Santa
00:03:02Anita.
00:03:03Similar in that they both came back numbers-wise right on the level.
00:03:06They both earned 89 buyers, and they were both won by fairly lightly raced horses.
00:03:11Potente is now two for two.
00:03:13And the Puma, who we'll talk about in a bit, broke his maiden in the Tampa Derby.
00:03:20A little bit unusual to see a horse breaking its maiden in a stakes race.
00:03:24But I agree with Randy there.
00:03:26The $3 million Brandt, off at four to five odds.
00:03:30He was cooked by the three-eighths pole.
00:03:32So happy got first run on him.
00:03:34Robusta got second run on him.
00:03:36And Potente came along, had to shift off heels of Robusta in deep stretch.
00:03:41It was a well-timed ride by Juan Hernandez.
00:03:45However, it's a little deep into the season to be getting on board horses who are two for two,
00:03:52and he'll be making only his third start coming up in the Santa Anita Derby.
00:03:56All right, well, let's talk Potente really quick.
00:03:58He's going to be better around two turns.
00:04:00We said that going in.
00:04:01He's actually galloped out five in front of the rest of the field.
00:04:05I like him moving forward from here.
00:04:07We'll see where Bob sends him.
00:04:09He did kind of fiddle with him, thinking he might have taken him to the Rebel earlier,
00:04:14but he said he can be kind of a little bit funny sometimes, so he wanted to keep him at
00:04:19home.
00:04:20I have a feeling he might want to ship him before Derby time just to see how he handles everything.
00:04:25The number's a little bit low, but visually the gallop out was very good indeed for Potente.
00:04:32As far as Robusta is concerned,
00:04:35and the horse he beat when he broke his maiden was none other than Cherokee Nation,
00:04:41who, like you said, Randy, will be one of the favorites for the Santa Anita Derby.
00:04:45So he's run against a pretty good horse.
00:04:47That may have been Cherokee Nation's worst race, but Robusta beat him.
00:04:51He never should have been 60 to 1.
00:04:54Absolutely no way he should have been 60 to 1 in there.
00:04:56And as far as Brandt's concerned, he just needs to go one turn.
00:04:59He was never an overly big horse.
00:05:02He's grown, but he's not your atypical two-turn horse.
00:05:06He's going to be a good horse.
00:05:08He's going to be a good horse, and I believe he's going to be a good horse around one turn.
00:05:12So that wraps up the San Felipe.
00:05:14Let's talk about the Tampa Bay Derby.
00:05:16The Puma, breaking his maiden.
00:05:19I refuse to say Puma.
00:05:21I'm sorry.
00:05:21It's not in my English nature.
00:05:24There is no poo in Puma, as far as I'm concerned, at least by the spelling.
00:05:29It's Puma.
00:05:31He is named for Gustavo Delgado Sr., because that's apparently what they call him, the Puma.
00:05:37I can kind of see why.
00:05:39Breaking his maiden.
00:05:40It was good.
00:05:41Congrats to Romero Restrepo, the team that bought Mage, for purchasing him off a hidden roof for just $150,000.
00:05:47So thumbs up for the Puma.
00:05:50What did you think of the race?
00:05:52What did you think of the race?
00:06:22And the other horse he was rallying with, Cantaletto, came flying by on the outside and just blew by power
00:06:30shift around the turn.
00:06:31Now, it's easy to look at the Tampa Bay Derby and say, okay, it had an 89 buyer speed figure,
00:06:37which is not good.
00:06:38The same as the San Felipe.
00:06:39But I think, in this case, you've got to look a little bit deeper, because both the Puma and Cantaletto
00:06:47ran anywhere from four to five wide around the first turn, and from five to six wide around the second
00:06:55turn.
00:06:55So you can't just take the buyer speed figure at face value and say, oh, 89, that's a slow race,
00:07:02because they covered a lot more ground than even further ado.
00:07:07I mean, it was a great ride by Irad Ortiz on further ado to sort of stay in the four
00:07:14path around the turn and keep those other two way outside of him stacked up and turning for home.
00:07:20He fanned out a little bit, and he does what Irad does, good race riding.
00:07:25He just wasn't quite good enough to get the job done.
00:07:27But if you factor in the ground loss, the race wasn't as bad as it looks on paper, right?
00:07:33Now, buyer speed figures don't factor in ground loss.
00:07:36But what I did, and I'm not going to get into the mathematics, because it'll make your eyes glaze over.
00:07:41But, you know, I went in, Equibase distance traveled actually is pretty accurate on their Equibase e-charts.
00:07:50I know I've been a critic of Equibase data in the past, but they're kind of getting this right.
00:07:55They put a lot of effort into it.
00:07:57So you can look at the distance traveled, and you can compute a feet per second, and you can do
00:08:02all those calculations.
00:08:03And I did them for all of the prep races, the last prep races we've seen so far.
00:08:08The Fountain of Youth, San Felipe, the Rebel, the Tampa Bay Derby, and the Risen Star.
00:08:13All right?
00:08:13And I factored in the ground loss and got a true number for every horse.
00:08:17And what it shows is that the Fountain of Youth horses are by far and away the best that we've
00:08:23seen so far.
00:08:24Chief Wallaby rated about three points higher than Commandment because he covered more ground in the Fountain of Youth.
00:08:31Then you've got a gap of about five points after that to Paladin, the winner of the Risen Star, and
00:08:39the Puma just because of his ground loss.
00:08:42So his speed figure was 12 points lower than Commandment just on face value.
00:08:48But he makes up seven points of that 12 due to the extreme ground loss that he had in the
00:08:55Tampa Bay Derby.
00:08:56So I'm not quite as critical of the Tampa Bay Derby as some people might be just looking at the
00:09:02speed figure at face value.
00:09:05And I think the Puma was not your ordinary maiden winning the Tampa Bay Derby.
00:09:10He had some street credibility, so to speak, because of his company lines in his two races.
00:09:14He lost a maiden race to Chief Wallaby at Gulfstream Park.
00:09:18And then he ran in the Sam Davis at Tampa.
00:09:21So a maiden in against stakes company for his second career start going around two turns.
00:09:26And he lost a renegade in that race.
00:09:30So he was, in effect, facing a little bit of an easier grouping.
00:09:35Both of those two horses, Chief Wallaby and Renegade, are ranked in the TDN top 12 for this month's Kentucky
00:09:43Derby rankings.
00:09:44But another thing that happened prior to the Tampa Bay Derby on Saturday afternoon was that the skies opened up
00:09:51and it began to rain right before the race.
00:09:53Now, before they ran the Tampa Derby, there were seven previous dirt races on the card.
00:09:59Three of them were won in wire-to-wire fashion.
00:10:01The other four were won by horses just sitting right off of the pace.
00:10:06And I don't know if the reins really totally changed the complexion of the racetrack.
00:10:11Equibase called it fast.
00:10:13I would have called it a wet fast type of designation.
00:10:16But you wonder if it did make the outside a little bit better place to be.
00:10:21The Puma was four wide on the clubhouse turn, shifted out to the eight path on the backstretch, was five
00:10:26wide for his big run around the far turn.
00:10:29Canaletto also gave up some ground, but he was traveling okay as well.
00:10:33He was six wide into the clubhouse turn, seven wide just down to the Pumas inside in the backstretch.
00:10:38And he was in the four path on the far turn.
00:10:41And even post-race, I was surprised because Canaletto made that big move.
00:10:46And Flavian Pratt, in his comments after the Tampa Derby, said he was surprised that the horse produced that much
00:10:52run because he didn't feel he was traveling that well underneath him.
00:10:54So you wonder if the reins messed up the footing a little bit or changed it subtly.
00:10:59But that race was won by a horse stalking coming from off the pace.
00:11:04And the final race on the day, which they took off the turf, was also one coming from farther off
00:11:08the pace.
00:11:09So the track seemed to have shifted.
00:11:11And I will give some subtle, maybe better than it looks type of points to further ado, because under those
00:11:17circumstances, he pressed the early pace and then stuck around to be involved in the photo finish at the end.
00:11:23So I think the Tampa Derby, just lining up those two races on Saturday, comes, in my mind, a little
00:11:29bit stronger than San Felipe.
00:11:30Yeah, one more quick point I want to make.
00:11:33I know we're running out of time here.
00:11:35The Puma, in his last race at Tampa, and also this one, shifted in down the lane and sort of
00:11:42lugged in.
00:11:42And he did that again in the Tampa Bay Derby and actually probably cost Canaletto second place.
00:11:49He came over just enough at about the 16th pole to interfere with Canaletto.
00:11:54If I was a steward, I would not have done anything to the order of finish because I thought the
00:11:58Puma was the best horse.
00:12:00I thought, you know, he went on and won by, you know, enough.
00:12:04But I was very surprised that there wasn't at least an inquiry sign put up by the stewards because there
00:12:09should have been.
00:12:11All right.
00:12:11Well, we know the Puma will be headed to the Bluegrass for his next start.
00:12:15Let's talk about the ladies.
00:12:16We'll head to Oak Lawn Park and discuss the Azeri stakes.
00:12:19Take nothing away from the winner, Dan Ward, winning a graded stakes there, former assistant to Jerry Hollandoff, a majestic
00:12:26oops, getting the win.
00:12:28She's by the big cap winner, Majestic Harbour.
00:12:30She's a cow bread.
00:12:32So congratulations to the connections of her.
00:12:34But Randy, what happened to nitrogen?
00:12:38You would think the off track would have been just fine because she's handled it very well in the past.
00:12:43Every off track is different.
00:12:46As we've, you know, often said jokingly, horses are not machines.
00:12:49It's not a joke.
00:12:50It's true.
00:12:50They don't always run their A-level race.
00:12:53And nitrogen clearly didn't run as well as she is capable of running based on her past performances.
00:12:58Now, what does that mean going forward?
00:13:00I don't know.
00:13:01I don't think Mark Cassie knows.
00:13:03I don't think John Green knows.
00:13:04The apple blossom will be next for her, which was the race they were pointing for the first part of
00:13:10the year anyway.
00:13:11It's not like she ran poorly.
00:13:13I mean, she was third and she was mixing it up with a couple of decent horses in front of
00:13:16her.
00:13:17Credit to Dan Ward.
00:13:18He's done such a good job.
00:13:21Such a good job with his mare.
00:13:23When he first got her, the breeders owned her and gave her to Dan at the beginning of the 2025
00:13:32Oakland meeting.
00:13:34And within three or four races, he had really engineered some dramatic improvement.
00:13:39And she went on a three-race stakes win streak, and she was purchased after her Monmouth stakes win by
00:13:46her current owners.
00:13:47And Dan has just kept her going at a pretty high level.
00:13:50I mean, she doesn't always run that well.
00:13:52She didn't run that well in the Breeders' Cup, but she sure bounced back at Oakland.
00:13:55And she's a small, skinny filly.
00:13:57I mean, she really seems to outrun and go over the top on occasion.
00:14:02She broke on top.
00:14:04She broke running, conceded the lead, stalked down on the inside on a sloppy track, and then swooped four-wide
00:14:11into the lane and was really responding to the rousing ride that she was given.
00:14:15But it's her 35th lifetime start.
00:14:18Earlier in her career, she was running for as low as a $12,500 claiming tag in Northern California.
00:14:24She also competed up in Alberta in Western Canada.
00:14:27So it's nice when you see those dark horses, so to speak, come up and spring the upset.
00:14:32And it was the first ever graded win for Dan Ward as a trainer record.
00:14:37How about that?
00:14:37He was an assistant, obviously, for a long time, for Bobby Frankel, and also for Jerry Hollendorfer.
00:14:43You know, it was really cool to see that.
00:14:45Good guy.
00:14:46Good guy, Dan Ward.
00:14:47Wishing him all the best.
00:14:49Okay, for someone who wasn't a surprise winner on the day, let's talk about the grade one behold the mile.
00:14:54Slendora TD, five-weight race win streak for this grade one Breeders' Cup winner.
00:15:00What did you think of her performance?
00:15:02Walk in the park.
00:15:03She just keeps rolling along.
00:15:05She is the defending champion in the Breeders' Cup Philly and Mare Sprint, and I think they're going to be
00:15:10pointing her for that as the year-end goal this year in 2026.
00:15:14Last spring, about this time, Bob Baffert tried her going nine furlongs, tried a mile and a 16th, figured out
00:15:22that's not her ballgame.
00:15:24Seven-eighths going one turn, a two-turn mile on this weekend in Santa India.
00:15:30That seems to be her sweet spot.
00:15:32She was in just complete control and cracked the race wide open under light urging.
00:15:38It's going to be interesting to see what they do with her next.
00:15:40Michael Talla, the co-owner, said after the race that they're going back east.
00:15:45He said, we're going to go where the money is.
00:15:48So what does that mean exactly?
00:15:49You look at the stakes schedule coming up nationwide, and in four weeks' time, there's the Apple Blossom handicap at
00:15:56Oakland, which is $1.25 million.
00:15:59That's where the money is, but it's at a mile and a 16th.
00:16:03She's done okay around two turns, as long as it's not a mile and an 8th, in the right spot
00:16:09with the right trip.
00:16:10She would face nitrogen if she goes in that spot.
00:16:14Are they going to do that?
00:16:15If they don't, what do they do?
00:16:17Look for maybe what used to be the Humana Distaff at Churchill Downs, seven-eighths of a mile.
00:16:24I think that's where they're going.
00:16:25I think that's the spot.
00:16:26I mean, that's a long time to wait, but that's probably, that's seven-eighths of a mile is probably a
00:16:33little bit more in her wheelhouse, like TD pointed out, than a mile and a 16th.
00:16:37So we'll see.
00:16:39Let's talk about a little bit of the other owners.
00:16:42Randy Boyd, who is the president of the University of Tennessee system, brought in with his wife, Jenny.
00:16:47They were on hand to watch her run.
00:16:50They bought, who did they buy?
00:16:52Seismic Beauty.
00:16:53They purchased Vava for $3.1 million.
00:16:56So they got the one-two in the Breeders' Cup Philly and Mare Sprint already.
00:16:59It looks like they're going to be a big force in the game, do you think?
00:17:02Yeah.
00:17:03They were looking for another broodmare to add to their broodmare band.
00:17:06And they said, okay, you know, they love Splendora.
00:17:09Why not?
00:17:10Who wouldn't love Splendora?
00:17:11And the fringe benefit of buying in now, and it was a reported 50% interest, is that they get
00:17:18to watch her run for a year.
00:17:19And then worry about the breeding shed so they can have some fun along with it.
00:17:25Santa Isabel was run on Sunday yesterday at Santa Anita.
00:17:29Once more, Randy, we got to see Super Corridora just stand in the gate and just lost the race at
00:17:36the beginning and could never regain traction.
00:17:39Bob Baffert running.
00:17:40Who won that race?
00:17:42I have it written down here somewhere.
00:17:44Forced Entry.
00:17:44Who won?
00:17:45Forced Entry.
00:17:45Forced Entry won the race for Hall of Famer Bob Baffert.
00:17:49What do you make of the Santa Isabel?
00:17:53Well, I think you've led off with the proper point there.
00:17:57I mean, the race was decided, so to speak, taking nothing away from forced entry.
00:18:01But the two-year-old Philly champ and the Breeders' Cup winner, Super Corridora, tossed her head a little bit,
00:18:08dwelt in the gate, had some awkward action, and was really not persevered with late.
00:18:13And we saw in one weekend two champion distaffers, the two-year-old Philly champ, Super Corridora, and Nitrogen at
00:18:21Oaklawn, both going down in defeat.
00:18:22But forced entry.
00:18:23It was a stalk-and-pounce type of trip.
00:18:26And it's just her third lifetime start.
00:18:28They had tried her sprinting on the grass in start, number one, transitioned her over to the dirt, and stretching
00:18:33out on Sunday afternoon proved to be the right mix.
00:18:38But Super Corridora helped her out a little bit by getting left behind.
00:18:42Yeah, hopefully Super Corridora came back okay.
00:18:44You know, I would presume they would go on to the Santa Anita Oaks, given the fact that, you know,
00:18:49it wasn't really her fault, necessarily.
00:18:52I mean, she did it to herself, but you can't expect that to happen next time.
00:18:55And she was the favorite in there, I think, primarily because it looked like she would be able to set
00:19:02the pace.
00:19:02And that's her game.
00:19:04That she's really, at this point, she looks like pretty much a one-dimensional frontrunner.
00:19:08But that dimension's pretty strong if she can get to the lead.
00:19:12But after the start, I mean, a horse like Super Corridora, if you're one-dimensional, you've got zero chance in
00:19:17that situation.
00:19:17So I always hate when people say this, but this is truly a draw a line through it type of
00:19:23race.
00:19:24And going forward, just completely ignore it.
00:19:26And we'll see if Super Corridora can make the lead if she runs into Santa Anita Oaks.
00:19:31So forced entry took down the Santa Isabel.
00:19:33It's time to pay some bills.
00:19:35We'll hear from Keeneland.
00:19:36And when we come back, we'll have the Gainsway Guest of the Week.
00:19:40I do want to remind you that the TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:19:43It was a big day of graded stakes action on Saturday and a big day for Keeneland grads.
00:19:49Final Boss won the Grade 2 Frank E. Kilrow Mile at Santa Anita.
00:19:54Two-time Keeneland graduate Destino de Oro took the Grade 2 Hillsborough.
00:19:59Disruptor, there you go, Mike Propoli, won the Grade 3 Challenger stakes at Tampa Bay.
00:20:04And the Puma, named for Gustavo Delgado, won the Tampa Bay Derby.
00:20:09We'll be right back after this message from Keeneland.
00:20:13We do this so your granddaughter can work on a farm someday.
00:20:18So the stands will still be packed in 50 years.
00:20:23That's why we come to work every day.
00:20:25Obsessed over every single detail.
00:20:30Because the story of racing is written one moment at a time.
00:20:35And the future of our industry deserves nothing less.
00:20:40Keeneland.
00:20:40Every moment matters.
00:20:43The Fastest Horse of the Week is brought to you by the Fast Sires at Windstar Farm.
00:20:48This week, let's talk about Timberlake.
00:20:51Their Grade 1 winning juvenile buy-in to mischief.
00:20:54If you recall, Timberlake won the Champagne Stakes as a 2-year-old.
00:20:58And finishing behind him in that race was fierceness.
00:21:01And now, Timberlake's foals are stepping out into their first stage.
00:21:06Here's a couple for your admiration.
00:21:08Here's a colt out of Liffey, photographed at just 28 days old, bred by Judy Hicks, who's also the breeder
00:21:16of Torpedo Anna.
00:21:17And this is a 38-day-old foal out of Cora Pearl, bred by Mara Blue Farm and Pegasus Stud.
00:21:27No telling what the others are going to look like.
00:21:29Timberlake stands at Windstar Farm for a fee of $15,000.
00:21:34Fastest Horse of the Week.
00:21:35Ran in that race I know you guys are all familiar with.
00:21:37The Big Daddy Stakes.
00:21:39At Turfoy Park on Saturday.
00:21:41His name was Joe Shiesty.
00:21:44Joe Shiesty has been a sprinter of some success in Kentucky.
00:21:48He loves Turfoy Park.
00:21:494 for 7 lifetime.
00:21:50And all he did in his first start of 2026 in The Big Daddy was to draw off and win
00:21:56by 6 1⁄4 lengths.
00:21:58With a career-high buyer's speed figure of 1.04.
00:22:02Co-owned by the Foster Family Racing and Lonnie Reynolds.
00:22:04Trained by Eric Foster.
00:22:06You might remember Eric as the trainer of Everland, who won the Bourbonette Oaks and went on to finish 5th
00:22:12in Torpedo Anna's Kentucky Oaks.
00:22:14And Ketadan, who took down the $750,000 Dueling Grounds Derby back in the day.
00:22:22So congratulations to the Fosters.
00:22:24Joe Shiesty, your Fastest Horse of the Week.
00:22:31It is now time for our Gainsway Guest of the Week.
00:22:34And I'm very pleased to say it is the one and only Mr. Alex Lieblong.
00:22:38Alex, thanks for joining us today.
00:22:39How are you doing today?
00:22:41Fine.
00:22:42It's been a good weekend.
00:22:44It's been a good weekend indeed.
00:22:45It's been a good year for you.
00:22:47And that's where we're going to kick off with Reef Runner.
00:22:49Congratulations, by the way, on winning over there and Saudi.
00:22:53I've never been to Saudi.
00:22:54Can you just give me an overview on how your trip was and culminating with the win?
00:23:01It had to be just absolutely brilliant.
00:23:04It was.
00:23:06I wanted to, one of the reasons I wanted to go, I really wanted to see Saudi.
00:23:09I understand what the rest of the, you know, Dubai and everybody, but I still wanted to see Saudi for
00:23:13it.
00:23:14It changed too much, but they're changing very, very fast.
00:23:17And everybody was very nice.
00:23:19And my wife had a problem going over there.
00:23:21She chipped a tooth on the plane.
00:23:23So we had to get a dental deal.
00:23:26She wasn't real nuts about that.
00:23:28But, you know, they would have men's waiting room and ladies waiting room.
00:23:33And I asked, where should I sit?
00:23:35And they said, anywhere you want.
00:23:36And so I did.
00:23:37I sat with her.
00:23:39But some Saudi people came in, and they were traditional.
00:23:43You know, and he went to the men's side, and she went to the men's side, and I thought, well,
00:23:46out of respect, I'm going to go sit in the men's side.
00:23:48And I said, but everybody was very, very nice.
00:23:51And it helped win him, though.
00:23:55Made it even nicer.
00:23:57Big expectations going in there?
00:24:00I thought he'd run well.
00:24:01He usually shows up.
00:24:03He doesn't throw too many bad ones.
00:24:04And so it's usually just how the rest of the race is going is how he's going to do.
00:24:09But I had him.
00:24:10My thought was in the top three.
00:24:13And next on his dance card, obviously, Alex, since he's over there already, will be Dubai.
00:24:17As we speak, the drones are flying.
00:24:21The explosions all over the place, although Dubai seems to have calmed down just a little bit.
00:24:27What are you going to do, first of all?
00:24:30Are you anticipating that they'll go ahead and run as scheduled?
00:24:34And if so, do you and your wife hazard the trip over to Dubai like you did Saudi Arabia?
00:24:42I think, one, they'll have it because I think there's politics at play, egos at play.
00:24:48And he's done such a fabulous job over there with that.
00:24:51I mean, who would have ever thought Dubai could have done it?
00:24:54I mean, it's just amazing.
00:24:55And it's probably not written about enough.
00:24:57But, you know, the horse is training well.
00:25:01And somebody says, you know, he can hear the missiles going over and this and that, but it hasn't bothered
00:25:06him.
00:25:07And they say he's actually trained a tick better than he was in Saudi Arabia.
00:25:13And, yes, the answer is we're planning on going if they open up the airspace.
00:25:19But I did say something to Joanne last night.
00:25:22I said, look, I could just go.
00:25:25I said, I can run fast pretty good, but I don't know.
00:25:28And she said, I don't know, buddy.
00:25:29If you're going, I'm going.
00:25:31So that was it.
00:25:32You know, Alex, as you know, you've been around.
00:25:34There's an old saying, if a horse is so totally calm and nothing bothers him, you could set off a
00:25:38bomb next to him and it wouldn't bother him.
00:25:39But let's hope we don't test it out to that to that extreme.
00:25:44But, yeah.
00:25:46Alex, my understanding was that after Reef Runner had won in Saudi Arabia, it was your intention and your wife's
00:25:55intention to keep him over in that part of the world and then aim for the big sprint race on
00:26:01the turf in Dubai.
00:26:02But you wanted to bring your entire family over there.
00:26:04And I guess that's called into question.
00:26:08That's called into question.
00:26:09He's got a couple of granddaughters, one granddaughters, Rick, and I'm nuts at this point for even considering it.
00:26:15But I thought I said, look, you know, 75 is the time to take chances, not 25.
00:26:22And so, you know, at 75 years old, you don't want to leave two things on the table.
00:26:29Well, let's talk about your homebred Reef Runner, who's by your stallion, the big beast, who stands for just $4
00:26:37,000.
00:26:37And some people are like, oh, buy a $4,000 stallion.
00:26:41But I think a lot of people have forgotten that he's actually out of a half sister to Paradise Woods,
00:26:46a grade one winner.
00:26:47Tell us how proud you are of having a homebred that's accomplished so much already.
00:26:55Oh, it's fantastic.
00:26:56And there's a story.
00:26:57What's so great about it, I've got so many of my trainers have all got something to do with this.
00:27:03Hobby was the first trainer of the big beast.
00:27:05But I remember Hobby coming to me as a two-year-old and said, hey, he's too fast.
00:27:09If we go in now, you're not going to have a horse.
00:27:11Now, not a lot of trainers will tell you that anymore.
00:27:14But Hobby did back then, and we ran him, I think, March.
00:27:17He was a three-year-old.
00:27:18And then as Oakline wound down, we thought, okay, he'd fit better up at New York.
00:27:23And so Tony took him up there and did a great job up there with the king's bishop.
00:27:28And then Mandela is actually the one that picked out the mayor.
00:27:31We were going through, of course, you know, he was close to the family.
00:27:37And so, like I say, and then Asmussen ended up training the mayor.
00:27:41So, like I say, they all pretty well got in there except Jinx.
00:27:45For my old trainers.
00:27:51From Steve Hobby to Dutch Road to Asmussen, yeah.
00:27:54So, you're 75 years old, you just told us, but you haven't slowed down too much.
00:27:59You're still a businessman of note in Arkansas.
00:28:03You're the chairman of the Arkansas Racing Commission, the longtime chairman.
00:28:08How did you get involved in horse racing to begin with?
00:28:13What's your background in the sport?
00:28:16Well, we always were around horses.
00:28:19My wife and I, we got together probably in the eighth grade.
00:28:22And around here, it was rodeo.
00:28:24Everybody around here, it was a rural state, obviously.
00:28:27It had livestock and horses and things like that.
00:28:30So, we rodeoed from that time on.
00:28:32But as we got older, that part kind of slowed down.
00:28:35And some good friends of ours, Gus and Pat Blass, he said, hey, why don't you get a horse?
00:28:40I said, well, I'm not sure I know anything about that.
00:28:43He said, so I joined.
00:28:44We joined.
00:28:45They were nice enough to let us join them for a couple of years.
00:28:48And then, finally, Buddy called me one day.
00:28:50He said, well, I've taught you all I can teach you.
00:28:53You're on your own now.
00:28:54So, at that point, I split off and got into deep waters.
00:29:02And tell us a little bit about the depth of those waters.
00:29:05You've been very active at the sales, but you've also picked up some brood mares.
00:29:10And you're involved in producing horses that you race yourself.
00:29:13What is the split right now of your stable between homebreds and horses that you buy at auction?
00:29:19I've been guilty of that a time or two.
00:29:23But now we're getting more and more homebreds coming on.
00:29:26And, you know, I can buy what I think is a 10 at the sale, and it turns out to
00:29:32be a 3.
00:29:32You can do the same thing breeding one.
00:29:34So, we'll probably keep a little bit of both going.
00:29:37But at 75, too, it's time to start pulling in the horns just a little bit.
00:29:43I don't see you slowing down anytime soon, Alex.
00:29:46Not anytime soon.
00:29:47Hey, give me the update on Big Paradise.
00:29:51Big Paradise.
00:29:53That is – that's one.
00:29:55He's still down in Florida, right?
00:29:57That's the – oh.
00:29:59Yeah.
00:29:59You're talking – oh, I'm getting –
00:30:01The half-brother.
00:30:02Paradise Bay's other one.
00:30:04Yeah.
00:30:05Yeah, we don't have that one.
00:30:07That one's got a claim from – right.
00:30:10Oh, okay.
00:30:11Okay, so what she's got on the ground right now is the Omaha Beach.
00:30:15And I think she just had a – now, this is – life is good.
00:30:19Tell you a funny story about Omaha Beach.
00:30:22Of course, Mandela called the other day.
00:30:23He said, hey, I got a new plant.
00:30:25He said, you need to stay here and let Fox go on over there with the horse.
00:30:30And if anything happens with Fox, send the horse to me.
00:30:33And I said, okay, so Dick was out there working.
00:30:40So, Alex, you've not only been a longtime chairman of the Arkansas Racing Commission,
00:30:46you were on the commission for quite a while before that, before you were made chairman.
00:30:50And you've seen Oaklawn Park go through quite a comeback thanks to the gaming and the casinos
00:30:59that are fueling such a huge burst increase at Oaklawn.
00:31:03You've seen both sides.
00:31:04You've seen Oaklawn when it wasn't doing quite as well, when it was struggling a little bit.
00:31:08What's your opinion of the overall landscape of horse racing right now around the country?
00:31:16Do you think gaming is going to be absolutely essential for a racetrack to be successful?
00:31:22I mean, what are your thoughts on that?
00:31:24Yeah, and I don't like that in a way because I kind of think, you know,
00:31:30there was an old guy who used to tell me when I was a kid, I heard him say this.
00:31:33He said, you know, I believe every tub ought to sit on its own bottom.
00:31:37And in a way, racing is not sitting on its own bottom.
00:31:40It's taking, you know, contributions from other areas.
00:31:44There was a big lightning.
00:31:45Sorry about that.
00:31:46So I would, you know, I'd like to be able to see it stand up on its own,
00:31:50but I think it's still, at this stage, it's got to have some help.
00:31:54And where we're lucky at Oaklawn, we have been very fortunate at the Purses,
00:31:58and we're very fortunate because the ownership of Oaklawn, they truly like racing.
00:32:04And that's hard to find at this stage of the game.
00:32:08And there's not a whole lot of new tracks being built.
00:32:12Alex, did you ever, in your wildest dreams, thinking back 20 years ago or even 10 years ago,
00:32:18think that Oaklawn would be where it is today?
00:32:23Oh, no, I was laughing the other day because I always remember thinking about,
00:32:27man, if we can ever just make it to Keeneland, you know, when the Purses jump.
00:32:31And when we were, I think we were running for 25 or 28, whatever it was out here,
00:32:35and then the Purses up there were 50.
00:32:37And so everybody's game plan.
00:32:39And that's when we ended in time to go to Keeneland.
00:32:42And to now look at the Purses, I mean, it's astounding.
00:32:47And looking at the horses, I mean, it's coming through there.
00:32:50Going down to the paddock and looking at the horses,
00:32:53the big change over the last five years and the quality of the horses here is amazing.
00:32:59And my performance has gone straight down because of it.
00:33:06Hey, you don't expect us to believe that, Alex.
00:33:08You're winning races all over the place.
00:33:12Well, I had to go 8,000 miles to win one race.
00:33:17But it was a good one.
00:33:19Yes, it was.
00:33:20That was the right one to win.
00:33:22Put it that way.
00:33:23I have done it reverse before, win the $10,000 claimer and lose the stake.
00:33:28So we did it right this day.
00:33:31Well, Alex, we're wishing you the best of luck in your endeavors and good luck in Dubai.
00:33:37We're really rooting for you.
00:33:38If anyone is rooting for you, it's myself and fellow Archibred here, Randy Moss.
00:33:44And, of course, TD.
00:33:46We miss Randy.
00:33:48And I grew up with, didn't grow up watching him.
00:33:54I grew up with when he was the man.
00:33:57Randy was.
00:33:59This week's guest of the week, Alex LeBlanc, brought to you courtesy of Gainesway.
00:34:04And we're now watching the Gainesway stallion drain the clock put on quite a show at the OBS breeze show
00:34:10this week.
00:34:11They're tearing up the track all over the place.
00:34:14We taped the show on Mondays this week, one day before the OBS sale begins.
00:34:19But the offspring of drain the clock have absolutely dominated the five days of breezes.
00:34:25Two drain the clocks equaled the OBS track record, breezing a quarter mile and 20.1 seconds.
00:34:31They were hip number 284 of Philly and hip 748, a cold.
00:34:37Meanwhile, hip 508 registered the fastest time on Friday with an eighth of a mile and 9.3 seconds.
00:34:44And hips 132 and 595, all they did was cover the eighth of a mile and 9.4 seconds.
00:34:53In all, 25 sons or daughters of drain the clock are entered in the sale, which again begins Tuesday and
00:34:59runs through Thursday.
00:35:00And for all that speed, drain the clock stands at Gainesway for a fee of just $10,000.
00:35:14Drain the clock will win and win by as much as he wants.
00:35:17Drain the clock will bound home the winner.
00:35:25Drain the clock, Jackie's warrior, drain the clock by a head.
00:35:31$270,000.
00:35:32In the back, $250,000.
00:35:38It's now time for First Things First, a fantastic weekend of racing at Santa Anita.
00:35:43This past weekend, I caught up with the connections of the San Felipe, the Grade 1 Big Cap, and of
00:35:50course, the Grade 1 Behold a Mile.
00:36:00And they're off in the B-Wing Hughes.
00:36:03Celebrate Splendora taking down the Grade 1 Behold a Mile.
00:36:06Here with the jock, JJ Hernandez, and of course, owner Michael Tala.
00:36:10JJ, that was a pretty nice birthday present.
00:36:12Happy birthday.
00:36:13Did you ever think you would get an opening quarter in 23-2 for your birthday today?
00:36:18Well, you know what?
00:36:19She's really fast out of the gate.
00:36:22And she was doing that really easy.
00:36:24And, you know, it's always just big.
00:36:26Like, probably go a little faster, a little slower.
00:36:28But today, the first fraction was just perfect for her.
00:36:32Michael, this filly has answered every single question.
00:36:35You know Bob joked when he walked down here.
00:36:37He should have run her in the Big Cap.
00:36:38What do you think about that?
00:36:39Well, Bob was thinking about it, but a mile and a quarter, that's a tough ask for her.
00:36:45I'm not sure she could go that far.
00:36:47But we're going to head back east, and we're going to take on the big girls back there and see
00:36:52what happens.
00:36:53But the end goal is to go back to Breeders' Cup and try and repeat,
00:36:57and maybe we can win an Eclipse Award this year, we hope.
00:37:02And they're off in the San Felipe.
00:37:04Joined by Peter Fleur of Speedway Stables, we get to talk Petente, the winner of the San Felipe here, Pete.
00:37:11Let's talk about the race.
00:37:12Any anxious moments for you watching that?
00:37:15Because it looked like he needed every piece of ground today.
00:37:19Well, I thought there would be a lot of pace, and there was.
00:37:23And so Juan laid just off that pace, and he's bred for this distance, Zoe.
00:37:29But, you know, he's only had been in a sprint race, so you kind of cross your fingers and give
00:37:34it a little of this
00:37:35and hope something positive happens.
00:37:38But I thought Juan did a great job laying behind him, going around the far turn.
00:37:42He gave him a kick, and then we all started getting excited.
00:37:48And they're off in the Santa Anita Handicap.
00:37:52Grade 1 big cap goes to this guy, Richie Baltus, alongside his jockey, Diego Herrera.
00:37:58British Isles, Richie, it's your second big cap.
00:38:01How are you feeling?
00:38:02I feel great.
00:38:03Yeah, I was a little worried around the turn, but you know what?
00:38:06Hey, I don't know.
00:38:08I mean, Diego did a great job with this horse.
00:38:10I thought around the turn he was asking him, and I didn't know if he had anything left.
00:38:14And then all of a sudden he bursted away, and I was just, I was ecstatic.
00:38:17You know, it meant a lot to the owners, and it meant a lot to Diego, his first grade 1
00:38:22win.
00:38:23And it's, you know, keeping it in the, keeping it close.
00:38:26Thank you, buddy.
00:38:32Just a reminder that we do continue racing Friday, Saturday, and Sunday.
00:38:35Do join us on Saturday for a George Mott burger.
00:38:41He is the burger king.
00:38:43If you like fried onion smash burgers, just show up at Santa Anita.
00:38:47We'll give you a cold brew to go with it.
00:38:49The place to be.
00:38:50I know, Randy, you could really use a George Mott burger, couldn't you?
00:38:55Never, never had one.
00:38:57It sounds good, though.
00:38:59Well, one of my favorite horses took down the grade 1 Santa Anita handicap on Saturday.
00:39:05That was British Isles giving young jockey, 21 years old he is, his very first grade 1 win.
00:39:11That's Diego Herrera.
00:39:13He started off galloping quarter horses as a young kid.
00:39:17He actually won a grade 1 quarter horse race a couple of years ago,
00:39:20so it's nice to see him pick up his first grade 1.
00:39:23Perhaps not the strongest rendition of the grade 1 big cap that we've seen in times past
00:39:28with the scratch of Skippy Longstocking, just one of the main scratches there.
00:39:33But, Randy, what did you make of the big cap?
00:39:36And apart from making it a $20 million race, what can we do?
00:39:40Bill wants to move it to Memorial Day.
00:39:43We saw that in his column today, a very good column, by the way.
00:39:47You should read it, Bill Finley's column.
00:39:48But what would you do?
00:39:50Well, hang on.
00:39:51First of all, other than the obvious, which is the name, British Isles,
00:39:55why is he one of your favorite horses?
00:39:58Just a cool dude.
00:40:00You know, Baffert had him originally.
00:40:03I'm not quite sure how he wound up going to Baltus.
00:40:06I think they might have bought him in like a horses of racing age sale.
00:40:09He's just, you can spot him out on the track.
00:40:12He's a big chestnut horse with a white face.
00:40:14It just seems like he's been around forever.
00:40:16He's just a cool dude.
00:40:17And it was nice to see Diego, who, by the way, is going to move his tack down to Gulfstream
00:40:21Park starting next week, I believe.
00:40:24Nice to see him get a grade one race.
00:40:26He's a really good kid.
00:40:27So the name British Isles doesn't have even just a little bit to do with it?
00:40:31Not a tiny bit.
00:40:32Not a tiny bit, Randy.
00:40:33Not a tiny bit.
00:40:36The puma.
00:40:39I don't know what you mean.
00:40:41Okay.
00:40:44You know, I don't want to, I don't want to dump on the Santa Anita handicap.
00:40:48It's clearly, in my opinion, at least, Skippy Longstocking would have just aired if he had run in that race.
00:40:58And for those that don't know, I think most people watching this would know, he was going to go.
00:41:02They loaded him into an airplane.
00:41:04Before they even took off, he started throwing a fit uncharacteristically on the flight.
00:41:09And, you know, for those that think that people always put money over the well-being of horses, they voluntarily
00:41:18gave up what would have been a pretty solid, you know, $230,000 payday or whatever, and pulled him off
00:41:26the plane because they didn't want to risk him completely having a meltdown on the flight and hurting himself in
00:41:31route from Florida to California.
00:41:32So, without Skippy Longstocking, it turned out to be a, what I thought was a pretty weak field.
00:41:39And I'll tell you how weak it was.
00:41:41British Isles went his final quarter of a mile in 28, a little over 28 seconds and drew away.
00:41:51And I actually, I was in such disbelief of the final quarter mile and the final time of 205 and
00:41:58change that I downloaded the race and I put it on the video timer.
00:42:02And damned if it's not accurate.
00:42:06If you had gone with a buyer speed figure looking at the other races on the card, and this was
00:42:12the last dirt race on the card, and there would have been plenty of other races worth of evidence, then
00:42:17the Santa Anita Handicap would have come up with something like a 70.
00:42:21That's how bad it was.
00:42:22That's how bad the race was.
00:42:23And we boosted it up, assuming that maybe the track got slower.
00:42:29I don't know.
00:42:30But he had run a 90 in his most recent race.
00:42:33And so, we went ahead and what we call projected, we projected a 90 for the big cab.
00:42:37How can you give the big cab a 70 when a horse draws away to win by open lengths?
00:42:43But clearly, the race is struggling for whatever reason.
00:42:48It used to be a million dollars.
00:42:492016 was the last time that Santa Anita gave away a purse of a million dollars.
00:42:54Now, it's $300,000.
00:42:56And I know this is a little bit of a one-off because of Skippy Longstocking and all that.
00:43:01It's not usually this week, but it's in grave danger right now of losing its grade one status after a
00:43:10field like this.
00:43:11I know that's been a topic of conversation.
00:43:13Is it fair?
00:43:15Do you give California, because of the struggles of Southern California and the importance of the circuit,
00:43:20do you give them the benefit of the doubt and don't downgrade some of these races?
00:43:26But then on the flip side, this was not a good race.
00:43:30It's not a grade one caliber race for sure.
00:43:33So do you stick with the data?
00:43:35Do you give California credit?
00:43:38I don't know, TD.
00:43:39That's a tough call.
00:43:40You know, there are other, there are swirling explanations as far as what has led to the demise of the
00:43:49big cab.
00:43:50And it's kind of coming to vogue right now to pile on the Stronach group for whatever reason,
00:43:56some of them legitimate and some of them are circumstantial.
00:43:59But you tie in that, you go back a decade, and the last time the Santa Anita handicap was a
00:44:05million dollars,
00:44:06I believe that coincides with its purse knockdown the next year,
00:44:11was right around the same time the Pegasus World Cup was introduced by the Stronach group at Gulfstream Park.
00:44:16So that siphons some horses.
00:44:19There's also the big cluster of international races in the early quarter of the year, every year.
00:44:25The Saudi Cup now has come into vogue.
00:44:28The Dubai World Cup, that's been around for 30 years.
00:44:32So there are lots of options around.
00:44:36I know our colleague, Bill Finley, in his Week in Review column that came out in Monday's TDN,
00:44:42said, why don't we move it off the calendar from early March?
00:44:46And we put it into a spot where there aren't a lot of races for older dirt root horses at
00:44:51the grade one level.
00:44:52He was thinking sometime around Memorial Day,
00:44:55which is a spot that the Hollywood Gold Cup used to occupy when Hollywood Park was running.
00:45:01But there are no easy answers.
00:45:03And I think it's, you know, you can zero in and try and drill down on what to do to
00:45:09complain about
00:45:10or hopefully to fix the big cap.
00:45:12But it's endemic for other grade one races.
00:45:15And it's accentuated in Southern California because the circuit essentially functions like an island right now.
00:45:22But, you know, same day in another grade one race, the Beholder Mile,
00:45:26we had a Breeders' Cup winner against four other horses.
00:45:29And only two of them, the best they could manage, were grade three stakes winners.
00:45:33So it's not just the big cap and it's not just Santa Anita either.
00:45:37Yeah, I think the primary issue for the big cap is the fact that it's got to go up against
00:45:41the Saudi Cup
00:45:42and the Dubai World Cup.
00:45:43You know, I mean, especially now you throw the Saudi Cup into the mix.
00:45:48I mean, there were enough horses that didn't want to make the trip to Dubai.
00:45:52That it would still be an okay race, you know, in the early days of the Dubai World Cup,
00:45:56although not as good as it used to be.
00:45:58But now you put the Saudi Cup in there at $20 million as well.
00:46:03And horses are not going to run in the Saudi Cup and then come back and run in the big
00:46:06cap.
00:46:07That's not going to happen.
00:46:08And there's nothing they can do about that.
00:46:10So maybe moving it, if they want to preserve it, might be the only option.
00:46:14Maybe tie a big bonus for the Pegasus World Cup to the Santa Anita Handicap, you know,
00:46:21try to keep some of those horses in this country.
00:46:23I don't know what the answer is.
00:46:25And at the end of the day, guys, money talks.
00:46:28If you think about the Dubai World Cup, what's that worth now?
00:46:31Six?
00:46:32Is it six?
00:46:33It was 10 or 11 at one point.
00:46:34I think it's like 12.
00:46:3612.
00:46:37Sorry.
00:46:37It's 12.
00:46:38All right.
00:46:38So that's still a lot of money, right?
00:46:40But they're having the same dilemma every year because Saudi is $20 million.
00:46:46So people are like, well, yeah, I think I'd rather go to Saudi than go to Dubai.
00:46:50And if they win Saudi, they're already there.
00:46:52So it'll be an added bonus.
00:46:54But people are more pointing to Saudi than they are, you know, 20 versus 10.
00:47:01It's money.
00:47:02And it's always going to be that way, unfortunately.
00:47:05All right.
00:47:05Enough of that.
00:47:06Let's switch gears and stay with Dubai.
00:47:09We'll talk about the Dubai World Cup.
00:47:1020 Japanese runners confirmed.
00:47:13Six already there.
00:47:14Some are dropping by the wayside due to what's going on over in Dubai.
00:47:18We do know that Forever Young is already there.
00:47:21That, for me, will be the main one that I'm concerned with.
00:47:24Randy, do we know who's going, who's not going?
00:47:26The plane's supposed to leave America on Saturday.
00:47:30Yeah.
00:47:30I think people are still, you know, watching CNN, watching Fox News, trying to see.
00:47:35Well, yeah, we talked about it last week.
00:47:37You know, are they really going to run the Dubai World Cup?
00:47:40It was no sense in talking about it last week.
00:47:44You can make the case that even talking about it right now is premature because things change in 24 hours.
00:47:51You know?
00:47:51I mean, if suddenly bombs start falling close to Maidan, you know, the drones and whatever, then it changes the
00:48:01entire complexion.
00:48:02What do you do then?
00:48:04So, as of right now, I think it seems to have stabilized enough that people are willing to take a
00:48:12shot, as Alex LeBlanc pointed out.
00:48:13I mean, his granddaughter's going with him.
00:48:15He is 25 years old.
00:48:19And he confirmed after we got off the air.
00:48:22You know, he confirmed that he's trying to talk his granddaughter out of it.
00:48:24But, you know, he said, you can't tell a 25-year-old anything nowadays.
00:48:27So, she's going.
00:48:30So, as of right now, it looks like it may be more business as usual than, you know, really adversely
00:48:38affected.
00:48:38But that could seriously change, given what goes on.
00:48:45Yeah, I have enough trouble trying to handicap horse races without trying to handicap geopolitics.
00:48:50But it does seem to be in flux.
00:48:53And I think we're going to see some changes right up until the time that plane takes off on Saturday
00:48:56from the United States.
00:48:59If you're familiar with the TD and Riders Room, and of course you are because you're watching this, you're familiar
00:49:03with this acronym, PHBA.
00:49:05Today, one of our sponsors, Pennsylvania Horse Breeders Association, the $1.7 million Pennsylvania bred stakes schedule kicks off on
00:49:13April the 22nd with a pair of $100,000 stakes for older horses, one for fillies and mares, open to
00:49:19all PA breads,
00:49:20and a $75,000 three-year-old stakes for Pennsylvania sired PA breads.
00:49:27It's all three of those stakes races, and they're called the Paige McKinney, the Unique Bella, and the Wait For
00:49:32It will be run at six furlongs at Parks.
00:49:36Nominations for these stakes will close on Wednesday, April the 8th, so don't miss out.
00:49:40Contact the Parks Racing Office to get those noms in.
00:49:43Meanwhile, if you'd like more information about the Pennsylvania Breeding Program, you can go to pabred.com or you can
00:49:49call Brian Sanfratello, 610-444-1050.
00:49:52The Pennsylvania Breeding Program is the best program in the country.
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00:50:24With some of the fullest fields in the country and quality racing year-round,
00:50:29there's never been a better time to reap the rewards of breeding and racing in Kentucky.
00:50:35Purse money in Kentucky is at an all-time high, as is average purse per race, outpacing California, Florida, and
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00:50:48Race them.
00:50:50We all win.
00:50:54The TD and Riders Room is also brought to you by the KTA and the KTOB.
00:50:59And Kentucky Breads took home the weekend derby preps.
00:51:03The Puma, Kentucky Bread.
00:51:05Obviously, we've talked about him, the Tampa Bay Derby.
00:51:07And Potente and the San Felipe Stakes.
00:51:10In fact, the entire derby leaderboard is topped by Kentucky Breads.
00:51:15No surprise there.
00:51:16Paladin, the Puma, Solid Tactic, Class President, Commandment, Iron Honor, Potente, Chip Poncho, Golden Tempo, Litmus Test.
00:51:22They're all bred in the Commonwealth of Kentucky.
00:51:25And for the second year in a row, $20 million is being paid to breeders participating in the KTBIF program
00:51:33for racing in 2025.
00:51:36Kentucky Breads, breed them, raise them, race them.
00:51:40We all win.
00:51:42Well, earlier this week or even last week, it was announced that John Kimmel was set to saddle his very
00:51:48final winner.
00:51:49After decades in the training ranks, I can name a gazillion good horses he's trained.
00:51:55He's a good horseman.
00:51:56He's a licensed veterinarian.
00:51:58And he's also was a part-time bloodstock agent.
00:52:01Looks like he'll be going full-time now.
00:52:03I've run into John numerous times already at the OBS sales, and, you know, Bill was kind of penning this
00:52:09as a sob story.
00:52:11Another trainer bows out of the game, and I know it's expensive in New York, but John's 71 years old.
00:52:18He's got a very good eye for a horse.
00:52:20He buys good horses.
00:52:21Trust me, I'm not feeling sorry for John.
00:52:24He is smiling, driving around in his golf cart, and he is a very, very happy man right now.
00:52:30And honestly, he described it a little bit as maybe a conflict of interest, being a trainer and also a
00:52:36bloodstock agent.
00:52:37So he's probably going to get more clients than he can swing a stick at.
00:52:41So rather than feel sorry for John Kimmel, I'm going to embrace him and say, good for you, John.
00:52:47Enjoy some time off, not having to work 24-7 and answer the phone all day long.
00:52:54It's a big thumbs up for John Kimmel.
00:52:56What do you think, Randy?
00:52:57Well, he no longer has to explain to owners why horses don't win, right?
00:53:03You know, what Bill was going for.
00:53:07I know.
00:53:08Yeah, yeah.
00:53:09Yeah, I get it.
00:53:10You know, is the challenge facing all trainers nowadays, especially trainers in New York.
00:53:15You've got the cost of doing business in New York with workers' comp and everything else involved.
00:53:21You've got the difficulty in finding help, which has been exacerbated now by the immigration situation, okay?
00:53:27You've got the shrinking fold crop, which means there are fewer horses to train the same number of trainers.
00:53:33And then you've got the rise of the super trainer, where guys like Baffert and Pletcher and Cox, I'm not
00:53:41faulting them, but they can train 200-plus horses, which kind of squeezes out some of the other trainers with
00:53:49fewer horses to go around.
00:53:51So all those challenges are why a lot of trainers are either getting out of the business or contemplating it,
00:53:59but I think you're probably right about Kimmel at 71.
00:54:01He can go out with his head high and smiling.
00:54:05And he'll be active at the OBS sales starting this week.
00:54:08And, you know, I think it's also Chris McGrath of Thoroughbred Daily News wrote a great long-form profile of
00:54:18John, I believe, about 18 months ago.
00:54:20If you look at Bill Finley's news story from last week about John stepping away from training, there's a link
00:54:28in there at the bottom to that story.
00:54:30And if you go through that, you know, even as far back as late 2024, John Kimmel was signaling that
00:54:38it might be time for him to step away.
00:54:41He had had his success when he could still feel he could manage a stable hands-on when it was
00:54:47in the 40 to 50-horse range.
00:54:49But at one point, he made a decision.
00:54:52He didn't want to be one of those guys who manages 200 horses because it's a different ballgame.
00:54:58He's just trying to take care of that many head and spreading them out and not conflicting.
00:55:03And you're on the phone all the time dealing with owners and dealing with logistics.
00:55:08But you talk about, you know, a trainer steps away and you don't see his name in the standings or
00:55:13you don't see his name in the entries anymore.
00:55:15There are other human costs that cascade down from that.
00:55:18I mean, you talked about the help a little bit, but John has had some of the guys working under
00:55:23his shed row for 30 years.
00:55:25And that's a big change in life for those guys to all of a sudden have to go and try
00:55:29and reconnect and hook on with another outfit after being with somebody who's been so steady and strong.
00:55:34But John was down to just a handful of horses, I believe, just five when he opted out over the
00:55:39weekend.
00:55:40And we do wish him luck in his new endeavor.
00:55:42And we think he'll do well.
00:55:43One thing that I had totally forgotten this.
00:55:45He was the original trainer through the first four starts of the 1995 Derby winner Thunder Gulch before the horse
00:55:52got privately transferred over to Dwayne Lucas' boy.
00:55:55I didn't know that either.
00:55:57Wow.
00:55:58Oh, rabbit hole TD Thornton.
00:56:01Look at this.
00:56:02Yes.
00:56:02Yes.
00:56:05Okay, let's switch gears and talk about some upcoming races this weekend.
00:56:08I can think of 500,000 reasons to go to Colonial this coming weekend.
00:56:14It is the Virginia Derby with a $500,000 pot.
00:56:18It looks like it's going to be a field of one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
00:56:25About a field of 10.
00:56:26A full field.
00:56:28Who's a led by, Randy?
00:56:30Who needs a field?
00:56:32Well, Baffert's got butane in there.
00:56:34You know, so Bob's always, you know, got to be, obviously, strongly considered in any of these races.
00:56:40Although butane is not one of his A-listers, I don't think, at this point.
00:56:45But, yeah, I was talking to a trainer the other day, and it was Brad Cox, actually.
00:56:49I was texting with him about one of his horses.
00:56:53Confessional, I think, is running in there, right?
00:56:55Yes.
00:56:56And so I was like, you know, so where are you going to send confessional?
00:56:59I guess your choices are kind of, you know, limited.
00:57:01You can go here.
00:57:03You can go there.
00:57:04And he said, oh, we're going to a Virginia Derby.
00:57:06I was like, oh, my gosh.
00:57:07I don't even think about Virginia.
00:57:09I know.
00:57:10It's a newcomer, right?
00:57:13And I said, you know, Wayne certainly thought about it, you know.
00:57:18Wayne Lucas won it last year with a horse that just ran off, ran off the TV screen.
00:57:23A fantastic effort.
00:57:25Yeah, yeah.
00:57:25So, yeah, it's now become a points race on the road to the Kentucky Derby, and it's something
00:57:31that a lot of people, like me, have to get accustomed to.
00:57:35Yeah, well, think about this as you try to put the Virginia Derby on your radar screen.
00:57:39It did start last year.
00:57:41Colonial's race meet has traditionally been through the summer months with a focus on their great
00:57:46turf course there.
00:57:46But they wanted to do something a little bit different, and they ran a – it's a spring
00:57:53festival-style meet just over this weekend in March.
00:57:56Last year's Virginia Derby was the first time that the race, which had previously existed
00:58:01on the turf, it got switched because they're not going to be making extensive use of that
00:58:05turf course in March.
00:58:06So, it's a one-turn, mile-in-eighth race, which kind of stuck out as an anomaly last
00:58:13year, and it is for this year as far as a points race on the Derby qualifying trail.
00:58:18But turn your clocks ahead till next year and think about this.
00:58:23Once the new Belmont Park opens and the Remsen Stakes in December is run there and the Wood
00:58:29Memorial in April is run there, those mile-in-eighth races at Belmont Park are also going to be
00:58:33one-turn.
00:58:34So, now next year, we're going to have three races at a unique configuration, a one-turn,
00:58:40nine-furlong race, and the Virginia Derby won't stick out.
00:58:44It will be a bit of a bridge between those two races.
00:58:46So, we are starting to see the scene shift a little bit.
00:58:50I don't know what that portends for this year.
00:58:52I think Butane is the horse to beat.
00:58:53He kind of – he seems very logical as far as a Baffert horse who shows tactical speed
00:59:00going a one-turn, nine-furlong race.
00:59:03He was third in the Southwest Stakes.
00:59:05He was second in the San Vicente.
00:59:07And don't forget, even as far back as six months ago, he was the beaten favorite in the
00:59:12hopeful stakes at Saratoga over Ted Noffey.
00:59:15But I think Confessional might be kind of the wise guy.
00:59:19Second choice play here for Brad Cox.
00:59:21Blinkers on.
00:59:22And he's got some decent horses in his company lines from Florida, having run second behind
00:59:27nearly, and he was seventh behind Renegade last time out in the Sam F. Davis.
00:59:33So, he's going to be stretching out in distance but shortening up, in a way, to a one-turn race.
00:59:39Zoe, this is what –
00:59:40He's got a high camp in there as well, just broke his maiden.
00:59:43He looks like a sprinter.
00:59:44He's by Instagram, but he's out of an Uncle Mo Mare.
00:59:46Got a pretty decent figure going, seven panels, winning by five for Will Walden.
00:59:51This is what makes TD TD, Zoe.
00:59:54I mean, everybody knows Belmont Park is being rebuilt and aquatics are going to close down
00:59:59and everybody's focused on what the grandstand at Belmont is going to look like and when
01:00:03they're going to reopen.
01:00:04I haven't heard anybody talk about the Wood Memorial at a mile and an eighth around one
01:00:08turn.
01:00:08That's a great point, but true.
01:00:11Yeah.
01:00:12Well done, TD, because I hadn't even thought about the Wood Memorial there.
01:00:17Like, yeah, wow.
01:00:18Okay, let's talk about the Virginia Oaks.
01:00:20Who can give me the winner of that?
01:00:22Where are we going?
01:00:23It's kind of a small field.
01:00:24Is it Baffert again with Baudelaire Rouge and Pratt?
01:00:27The numbers say Dazzling Dame.
01:00:30She is four for five lifetime.
01:00:34She lost in the Pocahontas, another one-turn race at Churchill Downs to the Terry Bradshaw
01:00:39Philly, taken by the win without too much of an excuse there.
01:00:42But in her other four races at Laurel and Delaware and Aqueduct and Monmouth, so she's
01:00:47been a traveler.
01:00:48She's looked pretty good.
01:00:49I don't know what she beat necessarily in her last start.
01:00:53But she won the Busanda by 11 and a half lengths with the buyer's speed figure of 90.
01:00:59And for three-year-old fillies in January, that's a pretty gaudy number.
01:01:05She hasn't run since then.
01:01:06She's been training well.
01:01:07And I'm guessing that she'll be a relatively solid.
01:01:12Well, I think she'll be the favorite.
01:01:16Not a solid favorite because you've got Baudelaire Rouge in there, TD.
01:01:20Yeah, I think Baudelaire Rouge, I think the Baffert syndrome will eventually sway the betters
01:01:25over to favoritism there.
01:01:28I think they'll pile on Bob's horses shipping in.
01:01:31I was also on Dazzling Dame and the filly that she beat in the Busanda when she aired
01:01:38by the length of the stretch.
01:01:39She came back and won the Ruthless Stakes in her next start in early February at Aqueduct.
01:01:45And I guess I do have a little bit of a negative handicapping opinion on Baudelaire Rouge coming
01:01:49out of her race at Sunland Park.
01:01:51She was 2 to 5, figured to be much the best on paper there.
01:01:55But she was swerving in and out in the stretch, all out to hold off a 21 to 1 maiden
01:02:02in that
01:02:03race.
01:02:04And, you know, the race was the focus of a steward's inquiry.
01:02:07Her number did not come down in that race.
01:02:09But it wasn't as visually impressive, I thought.
01:02:12And I'm going to maybe try to take a stand against her in Virginia.
01:02:16And she probably should have come down, Baudelaire Rouge.
01:02:19They did give J.J. Hernandez days.
01:02:22So he served days at Santa Anita, I think about 10 days ago.
01:02:26And it's interesting to see that Flavian Pratt, who's obviously going to be there anyway,
01:02:30picked up the mount on Baudelaire Rouge.
01:02:33It is now time for the work of the week, brought to you by First TV.
01:02:37And it was really nice this week to see our old buddy, Carson's Run, back on the work tab.
01:02:42Here he is, finishing up nicely in a five furlong breeze in 103 and four.
01:02:47Tepid, but he looks really, really good here.
01:02:50This is at Payson Park for trainer Miguel Clement last Saturday.
01:02:54Carson's Run is a two-time grade one winner whose 2025 was limited to just two starts,
01:03:00but he's been working very steadily since February for his 2026 debut.
01:03:05That's him on the outside.
01:03:06You can see, I think he looks really good there.
01:03:09It'll be nice to see our old buddy, Carson's Run, back at the races.
01:03:17Be a smarter bettor with First TV, the best horses.
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01:03:30All at your fingertips and delivered right into your inbox.
01:03:35Everything you need to be informed.
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01:04:00Change your life, make new friends, and compete at the highest level of thoroughbred racing.
01:04:08West Point Thoroughbreds, the gold standard in racing partnerships.
01:04:12Visit westpointtv.com.
01:04:15Another of our sponsors at the TD and Riders Room, West Point Thoroughbreds,
01:04:19has arrived in Ocala for the OBS March sale of two-year-olds in training,
01:04:23and they've gotten there on a high note because their horse, Final Boss,
01:04:27upset the grade two Frank Kilrow Miles stakes on Saturday at Santa Anita.
01:04:33Final Boss is a five-year-old son of American Pharaoh.
01:04:35It was his first start of the year for trainer John Sadler.
01:04:38Bloodstock agent David N'Gordo selected Final Boss as a yearling for West Point and co-owner Michael Talla.
01:04:48Well, that's a wrap on this week's edition of the TD and Riders Room.
01:04:51Bill will be back next week.
01:04:53Hopefully, he's hung over or something, or at least got a suntan.
01:04:56I mean that.
01:04:57And maybe the Red Sox won as well.
01:04:59So thanks, everyone, for joining us.
01:05:01Thanks to our Gainsaway Guests of the Week, Alex Lieblong, Randy, TD, Sue, Katie, Bill, and Ali.
01:05:09We'll all see you next week.
01:05:11Bye.
01:05:12Bye.
01:05:12Bye.
01:05:13Bye.
01:05:16Bye.
01:05:16You
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