00:06Muzyka
00:07Joining me on 12 Minutes With
00:10is Finland's Interior Minister
00:12Mari Rantanen. She's a former
00:14police officer and nurse and
00:16in her current role as minister
00:17she's in charge of internal
00:19security, immigration and border
00:21control, including managing
00:24the eastern frontier with Russia
00:26a major border for the EU
00:28and NATO.
00:30Welcome minister, pleasure to have you here with us.
00:32Thank you very much. So let me start
00:34with the escalating conflict
00:36that's gripping the Middle East.
00:37The UN is warning that if this continues
00:40to escalate we could see more
00:41displacement. Should
00:43EU ministers like yourself start
00:45preparing? Well
00:47obviously the situation is
00:49serious at the moment
00:51and we really don't
00:54know how
00:56far this is escalating.
00:58it's quite early to estimate
01:00what kind of
01:03effects this can have
01:05to Europe in short
01:08and also the long term
01:09but of course
01:12I think that Europe
01:13needs to look this situation
01:16very carefully and
01:17also prepare for
01:19different kind of skin areas.
01:21Is Europe
01:23today equipped
01:25or prepared to deal
01:26with more
01:27migration pressures?
01:29Well at the moment
01:31we don't see
01:32you know
01:34large movements
01:35and basically
01:36usually
01:36when these kind of
01:38things happen
01:38it's the nearest
01:40nearest border
01:42that people are
01:43crossing.
01:45if we
01:46in Europe
01:48are able
01:50to manage
01:51our asylum
01:52system
01:52for those
01:54who need
01:54protection
01:57instead
01:58of those
01:59who are seeking
01:59better life
02:00it's
02:01of course
02:03more sustainable.
02:04And in terms of
02:05Finland
02:05and its
02:06internal
02:07security
02:08do you detect
02:09any imminent threats
02:11the threat of
02:12Iranian sleeper
02:13cells and so on?
02:14Well I think
02:15this is
02:16the question
02:18that is
02:19on the whole
02:21Europe
02:21because
02:22of course
02:23these kind
02:23of conflicts
02:24can
02:28have
02:29result
02:30that
02:30the other
02:32people
02:32in Europe
02:33are trying
02:34to make
02:35violent
02:36movements
02:37as well.
02:38So this
02:39is something
02:39that our
02:40security
02:42and intelligence
02:43are looking
02:45very carefully
02:46at the
02:47moment.
02:47Okay I
02:48want to
02:48move on
02:48and look
02:49at the
02:50EU's
02:50migration
02:51policy.
02:51Now there's
02:52a big
02:52emphasis
02:52on
02:53facilitating
02:54the return
02:55of migrants
02:56who do not
02:57have the
02:57right to
02:58stay in
02:58Europe.
02:59Yet on
03:00Tuesday
03:01after a
03:02meeting
03:02about the
03:03situation
03:03in the
03:04Middle East
03:04a European
03:05commissioner
03:06for the
03:06Mediterranean
03:07Dubravka
03:07Schweitzer
03:08she says
03:08said
03:09that the
03:09EU
03:10is now
03:10developing
03:11partnerships
03:11with
03:12Syria
03:12Lebanon
03:13and Jordan
03:14to ensure
03:15conditions
03:16for voluntary
03:17and safe
03:17returns
03:18to those
03:19countries.
03:20Was this
03:20bad timing
03:21from the
03:22commissioner
03:22saying this
03:23about Lebanon
03:24for example
03:24while there's
03:25an active war
03:26affecting the
03:27country?
03:27We have
03:28failed
03:28with returns
03:30as a
03:30Europe.
03:32If we look
03:33those who have
03:34return order
03:36only 20-25%
03:38is leaving
03:39from Europe
03:40so it means
03:41that every
03:41every year
03:42we are having
03:43more and more
03:44people who are
03:45staying illegally
03:46so we need
03:47to do
03:47something
03:48and I'm
03:49very glad
03:50that
03:50the commission
03:51have made
03:53very
03:54I would say
03:55quick
03:55movements
03:56on this
03:57for example
03:57this return
03:59regulation
03:59is now
04:00on EP
04:01and we
04:03also hope
04:03that this
04:04will come
04:04out
04:05very
04:05fast
04:06so we
04:07can
04:07have
04:07new
04:07tools
04:08for example
04:08this
04:09return
04:09hubs
04:10outside
04:11the EU
04:11Of course
04:12because this
04:13is one
04:13of the
04:13things
04:13that the
04:14commission
04:14has
04:14approved
04:15now
04:15is
04:15that
04:16something
04:16Finland
04:16is
04:17looking
04:17into
04:17setting
04:18up
04:18return
04:18hubs
04:19in
04:19other
04:19third
04:20countries
04:20Well
04:21actually
04:22Finland
04:22is
04:24doing
04:24strict
04:25policies
04:26and
04:26we
04:27have
04:27made
04:27a
04:27change
04:28of
04:28paradigm
04:28of
04:29the
04:30migration
04:30policies
04:31and
04:32we are
04:33looking
04:33for very
04:34much
04:34new
04:35tools
04:35for
04:36the
04:37returns
04:37as well
04:38so
04:38I think
04:39that
04:39all
04:40of
04:40these
04:41regulations
04:42safe
04:43countries
04:43of
04:44origin
04:45and
04:45this
04:45return
04:46regulation
04:47will be
04:48very good
04:49you said
04:49you're
04:50looking
04:50into
04:50new
04:50tools
04:51does
04:51that
04:51mean
04:51you're
04:52in
04:52discussions
04:52with
04:53other
04:53countries
04:54outside
04:54Europe
04:55for
04:55return
04:55hubs
04:56we
04:57need
04:57to
04:57have
04:58this
04:58regulation
04:59of course
05:00first
05:00but
05:01yes
05:01we are
05:02very much
05:02interested
05:03that
05:04option
05:05too
05:05and
05:05what
05:06do
05:06you
05:06make
05:06of
05:07the
05:07criticism
05:08of
05:08this
05:08plan
05:09some
05:09people
05:09would
05:09say
05:10well
05:10people
05:11who
05:11come
05:11to
05:12Finland
05:12and
05:12other
05:12European
05:13countries
05:13in
05:14search
05:14of a
05:15better
05:15life
05:15are
05:15then
05:16sent
05:16to
05:16a
05:16country
05:17they
05:17might
05:17have
05:17no
05:18link
05:19to
05:19no
05:19family
05:20connections
05:20to
05:20to
05:21a
05:22camp
05:22essentially
05:23isn't
05:24that
05:24inhumane
05:25I don't
05:26think
05:26it's
05:27inhumane
05:28because
05:30there
05:31is
05:31an
05:31option
05:32there
05:32is
05:32always
05:33option
05:33to
05:33go
05:34back
05:34to
05:34your
05:34country
05:35of
05:36origin
05:36where
05:36did
05:36you
05:37came
05:37from
05:37and
05:38the
05:38other
05:38thing
05:38is
05:39that
05:39asylum
05:40system
05:41wasn't
05:41created
05:42for
05:43seeking
05:44better
05:45life
05:45it
05:46was
05:46for
05:47the
05:47protection
05:47and
05:48if
05:48we
05:49are
05:49filling
05:49this
05:50basket
05:51with
05:53other
05:54reasons
05:55then
05:55we
05:56are
05:56in
05:56trouble
05:57it's
05:58not
05:58sustainable
05:59but
05:59in
05:59Finland
05:59at
05:59the
05:59moment
06:00that
06:00right
06:00to
06:01seek
06:01asylum
06:01is
06:02suspended
06:03has
06:03been
06:03I
06:03believe
06:04since
06:042023
06:05if
06:06I'm
06:06not
06:06mistaken
06:06please
06:06do
06:07correct
06:07me
06:07is
06:08that
06:08the
06:08new
06:08normal
06:09for
06:09Finland
06:09now
06:09that
06:10people
06:10cannot
06:11come
06:11to
06:11your
06:11country
06:12and
06:12seek
06:12asylum
06:12that
06:13is
06:13not
06:13true
06:14people
06:15can
06:15come
06:15to
06:15our
06:16country
06:16and
06:16seek
06:17asylum
06:17but
06:18the
06:18suspension
06:19of
06:19the
06:19right
06:19asylum
06:20in
06:20relation
06:21to
06:21what
06:21is
06:21happening
06:21on
06:22the
06:22border
06:22with
06:23Russia
06:23that
06:24is
06:24as
06:25you
06:25mentioned
06:25changing
06:26the
06:26paradigm
06:26what
06:27is
06:27happening
06:27now
06:28in
06:28our
06:28eastern
06:29border
06:29is
06:30that
06:30we
06:31have
06:32closed
06:32all
06:33the
06:34border
06:34crossing
06:34points
06:36and
06:37we
06:37have
06:38made
06:38this
06:39border
06:39security
06:40law
06:40under
06:41certain
06:41circumstances
06:43which
06:45if
06:45we
06:45activate
06:46it
06:46then
06:47the
06:47border
06:49guards
06:49have
06:50a right
06:50to
06:51prevent
06:51people
06:52to
06:52enter
06:52to
06:53Finnish
06:54territory
06:54or
06:55if
06:55they
06:56enter
06:56we
06:56will
06:57check
06:57if
06:58they
06:58are
06:58vulnerable
06:59or
07:00in
07:00immediate
07:01life
07:02danger
07:03in
07:03that
07:03country
07:04where
07:04they
07:04enter
07:05to
07:05Finland
07:05if
07:06not
07:07then
07:07we
07:07will
07:09return
07:09them
07:10back
07:10and
07:10in
07:10terms
07:11of
07:11the
07:11other
07:12threats
07:12coming
07:12from
07:13that
07:13border
07:13reports
07:14of
07:14military
07:15buildup
07:16on
07:17the
07:17other
07:17side
07:18of
07:18the
07:18Finnish
07:18Russian
07:19border
07:19how
07:19concerned
07:20are
07:20you
07:20about
07:20that
07:21today
07:21and
07:22the
07:22threats
07:22to
07:22Finnish
07:22security
07:23and
07:23stability
07:24well
07:25I
07:25think
07:25that
07:29it
07:31seems
07:31like
07:32Russian
07:33side
07:33is
07:34building
07:35on
07:36their
07:36side
07:36as
07:37long
07:37as
07:37they
07:37stay
07:38on
07:38their
07:39side
07:39we
07:39are
07:39happy
07:40I
07:40want
07:40to
07:40come
07:41back
07:41to
07:41the
07:41EU
07:41migration
07:41policy
07:42there
07:43seems
07:43to
07:43be
07:43a
07:43certain
07:44political
07:44current
07:45which
07:45Finland
07:46probably
07:46would
07:46count
07:47itself
07:47part
07:47of
07:47this
07:48group
07:48of
07:48governments
07:49who
07:49really
07:49want
07:50to
07:50tighten
07:50the
07:51rules
07:51but
07:51there's
07:52a
07:52smaller
07:52group
07:53of
07:53countries
07:53maybe
07:53taking
07:54a
07:54drastically
07:54different
07:55position
07:55such
07:55as
07:55the
07:56Spanish
07:56government
07:56recently
07:58regularising
07:58half a
07:59million
08:00migrants
08:01in
08:02Spain
08:02who
08:02are
08:02there
08:03irregularly
08:04what
08:05do
08:05you
08:05as
08:05the
08:06migration
08:06minister
08:07for
08:07Finland
08:07make
08:08of
08:08those
08:08policies
08:09well
08:10I
08:11wouldn't
08:12ever
08:13success
08:14the
08:15acts
08:16like
08:16that
08:16and
08:17the
08:17other
08:18thing
08:18is
08:18that
08:18when
08:19we
08:19are
08:19having
08:21the
08:22same
08:22area
08:23the
08:23Schengen
08:24area
08:24the
08:25team
08:26Europe
08:26as
08:28people
08:29is
08:30talking
08:30about
08:31then
08:31I
08:32think
08:32there
08:32is
08:33high
08:33risk
08:33if
08:34some
08:35countries
08:35is
08:36doing
08:36basically
08:37really
08:38opposite
08:39than
08:39the
08:40other
08:40countries
08:41because
08:43now
08:44for
08:45example
08:45those
08:46people
08:47are
08:47very
08:49easily
08:49to
08:50go
08:50to
08:50other
08:51countries
08:51so
08:52I
08:53think
08:53that
08:57we
08:58need
08:58to
08:59all
09:00feel
09:00the
09:00responsibility
09:01of
09:02our
09:02common
09:04area
09:04and
09:05it
09:05comes
09:06to
09:06migration
09:07as
09:07well
09:07the
09:08pact
09:09on
09:09migration
09:09which
09:10should
09:11be
09:11implemented
09:12from
09:12June
09:12this
09:12year
09:13this
09:14was
09:14part
09:14of
09:14this
09:14team
09:15Europe
09:15as
09:15part
09:15of
09:16this
09:16solidarity
09:16mechanism
09:17that
09:17they
09:17call
09:17it
09:17where
09:18there's
09:18an
09:18option
09:18for
09:18other
09:19member
09:19states
09:20to
09:20take
09:20in
09:20migrants
09:21that
09:21reach
09:21some
09:22of
09:22the
09:22member
09:23states
09:23under
09:23most
09:23pressure
09:24and
09:25not
09:26many
09:26countries
09:26have
09:26picked
09:27up
09:27on
09:27this
09:27opportunity
09:28including
09:28Finland
09:29and
09:30there
09:30are
09:30estimates
09:30that
09:31there
09:31might
09:31be
09:32as
09:32little
09:32as
09:3210,000
09:33relocations
09:34in
09:35Europe
09:35so
09:36my
09:36question
09:36is
09:37is
09:37this
09:38pact
09:38really
09:39working
09:39is
09:39there
09:39solidarity
09:41well
09:42there
09:43is
09:43options
09:43how
09:44to
09:44show
09:45your
09:45solidarity
09:46and
09:47Finland
09:47have
09:48choose
09:48by
09:49helping
09:50with
09:51money
09:51but
09:52I
09:52don't
09:52think
09:52that
09:53European
09:53migration
09:54policies
09:55are
09:55resolved
09:56by
09:57solidarity
09:58I
09:58think
09:59we need
09:59to
09:59work
10:00on that
10:00way
10:01that
10:01we
10:02really
10:03decrease
10:04the numbers
10:05who is
10:06coming to
10:07Europe
10:07and how
10:09we do
10:09this
10:09we do
10:10this
10:10in
10:10third
10:11countries
10:11and we
10:12need
10:12to
10:12make
10:14more
10:14innovative
10:15solutions
10:16not
10:16to
10:17bring
10:17people
10:18in
10:18and
10:19then
10:19you
10:20know
10:20we
10:20are
10:20basically
10:21in
10:21the
10:21situation
10:22where
10:22nobody
10:22wants
10:23to
10:24relocate
10:24so
10:25this
10:26is
10:26not
10:27working
10:27in
10:28that
10:28way
10:28you
10:28talk
10:29about
10:29innovative
10:29solutions
10:30what are
10:31those in
10:31your view
10:32what is
10:32the EU
10:33not doing
10:33that it
10:34could be
10:34doing
10:34well I
10:35think
10:36that
10:36the
10:36most
10:37important
10:37thing
10:38is
10:38cut
10:38the
10:39smugglers
10:40money
10:41making
10:41machine
10:42but there's been talk about this for years
10:44but it's still a problem
10:45I know
10:45what needs to be done
10:46but I think that
10:47most important thing is
10:49think how we
10:50prevent people
10:52to
10:52enter
10:53the
10:56Europe
10:56by
10:57smugglers
10:58boat
10:59you do this by
11:00having presence
11:02on the other side
11:03of the sea
11:04and you
11:05you do this
11:06for example
11:06looking for the
11:07possibilities
11:09of
11:09safe
11:12ports
11:14that
11:14if somebody
11:16is rescued
11:16they are
11:17bringing back
11:18to
11:18third country
11:19not to
11:20Europe
11:20so I think
11:21that we need
11:22to decrease
11:23the numbers
11:24finally just to
11:25close off
11:25just for a
11:26clarification
11:26you mentioned
11:27the presence
11:28on the other
11:28side of the sea
11:29you said
11:29does that mean
11:31more presence
11:31for Frontex
11:32more of a mandate
11:33for Frontex
11:34what would that
11:35exactly look like
11:35well actually
11:36at this moment
11:37Frontex mandate
11:38is
11:43rewrites
11:44so
11:45there could be
11:46I think
11:47possibilities
11:48for that
11:48for example
11:49okay
11:50and Minister
11:51thank you so much
11:52for joining us
11:52on 12 Minutes With
11:53thank you
11:55so
11:56thank you
11:56thank you
11:56thank you
11:59for being
12:00for opening up
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