- 7 months ago
Amidst widespread misinformation and confusion about Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI), this panel seeks to clarify and educate. What is DEI? Is it still being implemented, and if so, how? How does it impact you? Join us as experts debunk common myths and provide a clear, accurate understanding of DEI—what it truly is and is not. Gain insights into the current state of DEI initiatives and their real implications for individuals and organizations.
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00:00Office of Gibson, Dunn, and Crutcher, Mylon Denistein.
00:07Chief Diversity Officer for U.S. House of Representatives 117th and 118th Congresses
00:14and Chief Strategist for Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett, Dr. Seisha Joy Moon.
00:20And Global Business Executive and CEO of COCL, a global think tank that researches workplace
00:31diversity, equity, and inclusion, Linnea Irvin.
00:38Thank you so much for coming out on this morning.
00:41This is a very important topic, but let me just start by saying this.
00:47The reason why I'm glad we're having this conversation today on a Sunday is because
00:51today is the day many of us would be worshiping or going Bedside Baptist or catching the High
00:56Light of the Church on Instagram.
00:58But what dropped into my spirit as we were doing this is that many have been worshiping
01:03at the altar of white supremacy, the altar of injustice, the altar of racism.
01:09And I'm so glad that I had this amazing lit panel of women on this morning that is going
01:15to shed some light in dark places because I believe that there is something that happens
01:21when a woman walks through the door.
01:23And baby, when it's a black woman, right?
01:27So let's get into this conversation.
01:31Just off the bat, I want you all to define diversity, equity, and inclusion.
01:38What it is, what it is not.
01:40And I want to just quote the Heritage Foundation that says that it does not promote racial harmony.
01:46Instead, may in fact be manipulative, unlicensed attempts at psychology.
01:53I'm just going to go down the line and answer that.
01:58Would you, Mylon, start for me on that one?
02:02Sure.
02:02Well, good morning.
02:03It's great to be here with such a distinguished group.
02:08And I just want to say that hearing that quote, it makes me so sad because it's so misguided.
02:18Diversity, equity, and inclusion is really a very basic principle about fairness and equity
02:26for all of us.
02:28And not just black people, all people.
02:31And really, it's a choice organizations make to invest in equity
02:38and the promotion and inclusion of diverse people, and especially black people.
02:43I think what those types of organizations have done
02:47is try to use affirmative action
02:51where there's actually a racial preference for a particular group
02:55and try to turn that into that's the same thing as diversity, equity, inclusion.
02:59And it just isn't.
03:02You know, affirmative action is to remedy past discrimination.
03:06It's embedded in our laws.
03:08It's embedded in our court cases.
03:09It's embedded in executive orders and in regulations.
03:12And we'll talk a lot about that later.
03:14But the point is, diversity, equity, and inclusion,
03:17inclusion, it's about us being able to have the same opportunities as other people.
03:25Cisha.
03:25So, in the essence of creating acceptable and accessible spaces,
03:31I want to share that my pronouns are she, her, hers.
03:32If anybody is joining us live or streaming,
03:35I want to describe myself in case anybody identifies with visual difficulties.
03:38I'm a black woman wearing a tan fedora, orange glasses, bamboo earrings,
03:44a red lip, and a floral sundress.
03:47A couple of things.
03:49I want to start off with where the definition came from.
03:53And I might challenge to say it's not misguided.
03:55It's quite guided.
03:57It's quite intentional.
03:58The definition that the current anti-DEI movement has advanced is diversity
04:04is putting identity above merit by rewarding and punishing individuals
04:08based on a hierarchy of oppressor versus oppressed.
04:11Equity is treating all inequality as illegitimate
04:14and forcing group equalization through inequality of outcomes.
04:18And inclusion is restricting the range of oppressing discourse
04:22and excluding white Christian conservative men.
04:25Direct quote.
04:27Those who do this work know that that's not the definition of DEI.
04:30In Congress, how we defined it was that diversity was the practice
04:34of ensuring that the congressional workforce represented all segments of society
04:38in which we were elected to serve.
04:40That equity is making sure that the processes were fair, just,
04:43and impartial for those communities.
04:46And then also ensuring that inclusion was acknowledging,
04:49appreciating, and applying their contributions.
04:52We also were very important about putting a real,
04:54we were very intentional about putting a focus on accessibility,
04:58ensuring that the infrastructure allowed the fair
05:00and free usage of those systems also.
05:02I think that's important because when you think about diversity
05:05and we're focusing on a lot of race talk,
05:08our dimensions of representation really expanded from everything from age
05:11all the way down to accessibility within rural communities
05:14and limited broadband access.
05:15Any part of your life where you are underserved or underseen
05:18as it related to legislating your life.
05:21So we just set that record straight.
05:24Linnea, would you want to comment on how you see what it is and what it ain't?
05:31I mean, it's interesting because it's a shame that people are being compelled to believe
05:40that this work is in any way about exclusion because it's the exact opposite.
05:45To Milan's point, it is very much about ensuring folks have fair access to opportunity.
05:53This is about fairness and promotion processes in pay
05:57and opportunity to develop in one's work environment.
06:04We've seen a politicization of things that are very much just about ensuring people are treated more equitably, right?
06:14In our health care systems, in our schools, in our workplaces.
06:17And, you know, I'll be honest, the three letters DEI have become a proxy for race work.
06:31Come on.
06:32And I do think, you know, this anti-DEI, anti-woke, anti-opportunity rhetoric
06:39is really just anti-blackness veiled in a very, very strategic and thoughtful movement against our progress.
06:49And effective.
06:50There was an article, I just looked at the title, and it said,
06:55Here's why some white people love the myth of mediocrity,
06:59because it is easier to believe that the world is fair than to make it so.
07:05DEI has been blamed on everything.
07:08When Silicon Valley collapsed, they blamed it on DEI.
07:11When the daggone cargo ship hit the bridge in Baltimore, they blamed it on DEI.
07:18DEI is being wrapped up in Ukraine.
07:21DEI is being wrapped up everywhere.
07:23Somehow, and now they are even referencing that when it comes to Vice President Kamala Harris.
07:29But before we do this, I want to just go down very quickly.
07:31I want to ground this small time that we have left in a little bit of history.
07:37And so talk about why we are even at the spot of DEI.
07:40And I'll open that up to our panel.
07:44Go ahead.
07:45Okay.
07:46So I think our panelists have actually said this.
07:50I mean, there is a well-organized, well-funded movement.
07:54There are 16 organizations currently whose goal is basically to take away our freedom and the freedoms of other people, period.
08:04They want to roll back everything and advance themselves, plain and simple.
08:10It is exactly what you say.
08:12It's about I feel entitled to X and I deserve it.
08:17And somehow that means it's meritorious, which is just not true.
08:22That is a myth.
08:24Everybody knows we're all human.
08:26We are all capable.
08:29We just need the opportunities and a fair chance, and we will succeed.
08:34So I think the history is there are at least 16 groups since the Supreme Court's decision eliminating affirmative action, which happened a year ago almost to today, in higher education.
08:49And think about that.
08:51For years, as black people, first of all, we worked for free because we were enslaved.
08:56And now to say that all that is done and everything is fine is just simply not reality.
09:05And eliminating the ability for schools to make up in the smallest of ways for what's been done is disgraceful.
09:16Candidly, it's disgraceful.
09:18And that erosion by our courts, our Supreme Court, has been going on for a long time, much longer than the Supreme Court decision in the Harvard case and the North Carolina case last year.
09:33I mean, if you look 10 years ago in Gratz v. Bollinger, the Supreme Court said you can't use racial preference in points with the University of Michigan.
09:42So it's been coming because they are organized, because they are committed to their mission.
09:48And because they don't care.
09:49It is not a secret.
09:50You can all go online and read all about all of this.
09:54It is very transparent.
09:57And it is very, very deliberate.
10:03I do agree with you.
10:04It's targeted and intentional.
10:05And we've got to be targeted and intentional in the work that we do here.
10:11Cisha, I want you to put some numbers to this.
10:15When we talk about the truth of DEI, what it does and what it creates from the boardroom on down, because the numbers go against the conversation that is being put out by people like Project 2025, which we will get into.
10:31Okay.
10:32Can I get into that first before I talk about that?
10:33Get into it.
10:34Get into it.
10:35I woke up to, we were joking in the back about black jobs.
10:39So waking up to the headline that America may soon be subjected, that word was very powerful in this headline, to the country's first DEI president, Kamala Harris.
10:50There's a black woman who went to Howard.
10:51There's a woman with a JD.
10:53Come on.
10:53This is a woman who became the attorney general, the first black vice president, but her blackness is her ultimate disqualifier.
11:00And so when you talk about the proxy, I think that is very powerful.
11:04I know that we're talking a lot about Project 2025, but I really need for people to go all the way back and research Project 1980.
11:11This work was started before the presidency of Ronald Reagan.
11:14You had 360 scholarly organizations come together to create a nearly 2,000 page volume of documents for a conservative agenda in this country.
11:25Right now, what you are seeing is it comes to full fruition.
11:29This is an exercise that happens in four year intervals based on the presidency, whether regardless of the outcomes in November, then that project will just get stronger because then they'll have another four years to continue to plan.
11:41Why I need for people to understand the narrative work is because it's very important.
11:46I really try to just say their words so that we know exactly because they're not forcing us any longer to read between the lines.
11:54So Project 2025 is also supported by a three-line, three-pronged strategy.
12:00Narrative line.
12:00First, utilize both social and mass media to share stories to inspire an emotional response through public discourse and debate about the elimination of DEI-related initiatives.
12:10Second line, policy.
12:12Leverage the manipulated narrative from the first line as a source of permission and persuasion to advance popular policy reforms that are legally defensible, transitioning from anti-DEI strategy from a slogan to a solution with a 70-30 split in public support to eliminate the profession.
12:30And right now what we are up against, just to be quite honest, is the third one, which is action line.
12:36Combine the first and second line in order to change the rules of the game to advance the elimination of DEI.
12:41Now, I'm going to let other people chime in on some of the statistical numbers, but I'm just going to talk about Congress really quick.
12:46That was the best job of my life, but it was also the hardest.
12:50I was appointed by Nancy Pelosi, I was retained by Kevin McCarthy, and I was asked to stay until they eliminated my office by Mike Johnson.
12:57To survive three speakers in the 117th and 118th Congress is no small feat.
13:01But why I want to mention that is because a Republican and a Dem, two white men from Gettysburg, helped to protect me and my team for nearly two years when our office was supposed to be eliminated in six months.
13:13225 conservative offices used our services and 197 Democratic offices used our services.
13:20So to say they saw the value in DEI, they used it every day.
13:25We have more Republican offices use ODI than Dems.
13:28And so right now, I think what we're seeing, though, is where you are positioned with the seat at the table.
13:36And so I'll let other people chime in on some statistics so I can share the stage.
13:39But I got my numbers, too, if you want them, sis.
13:41No, I think it's important to bring out some numbers.
13:43Anaya, go ahead.
13:47No, I think it's interesting because you've outlined something that has been so thoughtfully put forth.
13:55Not six months ago, not 12 months ago.
13:57We're talking multiple election cycles, you know, multiple stakeholder groups, right, within politics, within business, within, you know, every fabric of society more broadly.
14:13But, you know, it's interesting because I think that this appointed attack is actually the only way to pursue this because there actually is sufficient research to point to the fact that diversity, equity, inclusion actually is great for business.
14:33It's great for economies, right?
14:36You know, it makes it so that the drugs that are developed have greater health outcomes, right?
14:42It's one of those things where we know that diverse boards make better decisions.
14:48Diverse teams drive better outcomes and innovation.
14:52There's endless.
14:53You know, COPOL, our organization, we conduct research.
14:56And we have plenty of research to show that, you know, teams with the greatest diversity pick up market share, right?
15:03It's, it's, it is not something that is a myth.
15:07It's actually been proven.
15:09There's data to demonstrate that it matters.
15:11And I do think that more of this has to do with power and who owns it.
15:17And I, I, I, I fundamentally believe that what we're seeing in way of backlash is last stand for those who've been power holders for generations.
15:30Demographically, right?
15:3618 year olds in this country, majority of them are people of color.
15:3953% the last time I checked.
15:43Those are, that's our emerging workforce.
15:45Those are our future executives.
15:46Those are our future board directors, creators, designers, engineers.
15:52So a lot of this, um, this, uh, backlash is just fear of inevitable change.
15:58There's been an abrowning of America.
16:00It's not happening.
16:01It's already happened.
16:02Absolutely.
16:03And I'm glad you said that because when we were going over this, the stats were talking, saying that I was looking at was saying by 2043, this nation will be predominantly a nation of color.
16:13And that, that browning of America, we're even seeing a redefining of browning.
16:18Can, can I just say one thing, ma'am, while we're talking about these numbers, I do want to, because it is browning.
16:23And it's important to know that the disparities still exist.
16:26According to Anita B., out of $450 billion in donations to nonprofit organizations in 2019, less than 4% were awarded to those led by people of color.
16:36Let's go to black women being the highest group of entrepreneurs, uh, entrepreneurs in this country, college educated, but yet less than 1% of venture capital firms with investments to black women.
16:491.6 trillion million dollars, 1.6 trillion dollars in student debt, 43% more than our counterparts in the world, 6% of the national workforce, yet right now only one black woman in a CEO position at an S&P Fortune 500 company.
17:05Or even when we look at labor force, 64% black women, but yet we still make 67% on the dime.
17:11And when we think about the fact that we are currently at the largest convening in black women in this country, right now we're having a conversation about the intersection of government and entertainment and technology and music and sports.
17:21UCLA does an annual report on the Hollywood, pretty much on Hollywood diversity.
17:25They found that with the browning of the country, despite it, in Hollywood, less than 2 to 1 composed among theatrical film leads, less than 2 to 1 theatrical film directors, and approximately 2 to 1 for theatrical writers.
17:42But this is my favorite statistic.
17:43The films that cast at that 31 to 40% BIPOC for our national parody levels, then were the highest median global black box office receipts.
17:54And so DEI is a competitive advantage globally, and not just for companies, but for our country.
18:00And not just for your success, but also for your soul.
18:03Absolutely.
18:03Go ahead.
18:03I just want to piggyback on what my esteemed panelists have said, and I think it's really important.
18:10I want to just give you two concrete examples recently.
18:13Tractor Supply, a big company.
18:15Yes.
18:16And in a matter of three weeks, through a social media campaign, they reversed course and changed their whole DEI program and eliminated offices.
18:29Similarly, and this is a different perspective, the Fearless Fund, which is a black venture capital fund and foundation founded by black women that funds women of color businesses.
18:44And you heard the statistic about how less than 1% of a trillion dollars goes to black women business owners were sued by one of the leaders of this movement, Edward Blum, who brought the Harvard case for a $20,000 grant program for black women.
19:02And I think that gets to your point about eliminating browning.
19:08And let's just go one step further.
19:11Who else are they fighting about what kind of AP class and what kind of history can be taught about black people?
19:20I mean, that is, it's hard for me to talk about and not get emotional and passionate,
19:26because it is my history being defined by people who don't want to accept the reality of what's happened in this particular country.
19:38But do want to put up the Ten Commandments.
19:40And when I saw that, I said, is Jesus going to be black?
19:43I'm just wondering, what, what, what's, how are we about to talk, talk about the word?
19:47Well, I just, I just wanted to know what the reputation was going to look like.
19:50But what gets me, ladies, as we, and I want to get to some Q&A, is that as we talk about these conversations for those who may be watching online or those who are watching in person, we know this, right?
20:01We, we, we know this.
20:03We hear this.
20:03We know this.
20:05So it's not that we, that the other side doesn't know either.
20:09It is that it does not matter.
20:11That is when we get into these alternate truths.
20:14And that's why I opened up by saying they are worshiping at an altar of injustice and white supremacy.
20:20And so the only thing that can tear down that God that they have erected is bringing forth truth, which is why we need people.
20:27Even your silence can be complicit, which is what Dr. King told us, which is why we have to leave this place and talk about what you are hearing today and then figure out what the solutions are.
20:37The solutions first start with yourself, then in your own home, out to your community.
20:42I want to switch for a second before we open up and just say, I want to hit some concrete solutions.
20:48What is it that we need to be doing?
20:50I'm going to start with mine.
20:51I need y'all to support black media, especially black owned and operated media.
20:55Because when I hear people say, what is Vice President Gumbel Harris doing?
20:59I want to know, are you actually looking at, at, at American urban radio networks?
21:05Number one, because she travels with a pool, just like the president.
21:09All of the networks are there when she does something.
21:12They have the option at the end of the day to broadcast what, what she does and what she does not do.
21:18And I don't see them talking about this economic opportunity tour that she has been doing.
21:23I don't see them talking about how, how she has been, uh, helping to create some of the, this bipartisan legislature that has been going forward.
21:31That's my piece.
21:33I'm going to, I'm going to leave it on to you.
21:34So I'm, I'm an optimist and so I'm going to, something I learned at Essence this week, somebody else used this quote.
21:43So I'm going to use it.
21:44When people build fences, we build tunnels.
21:48And, and now I'm going to add to it.
21:50We can fly over.
21:51Um, we build planes too.
21:53So I think we just have to dig deep, not be complacent, not be accepting and be relentless in the pursuit for justice.
22:05Because too many people have sacrificed too much for me.
22:08And I know my panelists feel the same way to be sitting on this stage.
22:12And I am not about to let that change.
22:15Listen, our ancestors have been here before in multiple iterations.
22:20Stacey Abrams, very much so like you says, you know, uh, uh, said earlier on the panel is that indeed I was not created in like this lab in 2020.
22:28It has been associated with every social movement in this country.
22:31I think right now.
22:32Since 1619.
22:33Can we go, can we take it back there?
22:34Okay.
22:35I believe this is the time to lean in.
22:37I believe that this, that this, um, relentless last ditch effort means because we've actually made some forward movement.
22:47And so for DEI professionals, I hope that we just take advantage of this opportunity.
22:51Uh, cause I see opportunity right now.
22:54Um, take care of ourselves in this time cause it is a hard time.
22:58Can you double back on the opportunity part?
23:00What is the opportunity that you see at this time?
23:03I believe right now we have a real opportunity to really formalize our profession.
23:09I believe like sometimes the skepticism makes me excited cause it's like, oh, that's the gap that you see.
23:15All right.
23:17Right now I'm seeing time where we can build competency models where I'm seeing that we can develop position descriptions on what truly is a chief diversity officer.
23:24That we can expand the scope of DEI from just personnel to public policy and bleed throughout the entire tentacles of your organization.
23:32I see so much opportunity right now, which is why shout out to Alfonso and the global black economic forum for giving us an additional 10 minutes to talk about this conversation because it is important.
23:44But the biggest thing I'm nonpartisan.
23:45I truly am guys.
23:46I really am.
23:48But I need for people to vote and I need you to vote in your best interest and the best interest of your community.
23:54I'm going to give y'all two quick things just to remember.
23:57And again, I'm nonpartisan, but I'm just going to state some facts.
24:00The vice president was here yesterday.
24:02It's not just the principal and the politician.
24:05It's who's behind them.
24:06The vice president has one of the most diverse offices in the history of the vice presidency.
24:11She has crafted a team that looks like America.
24:13Leader Jeffries was here on Friday.
24:15Who?
24:16Just saying, putting it out there, he will be the first black speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives.
24:20Okay?
24:21And I need for people to understand, he made sure to also appoint a young lady named Tasia Jackson, who is the first black woman to ever hold that position.
24:29She is the highest-ranking Democratic staffer on that hill.
24:32And so what I need for you to vote is because you're not just voting for the politician, you're also voting for the person behind them who is going to legislate our lives.
24:39I love that.
24:40I love that.
24:42Give us something, a takeaway for people before we get to the questions as far as the action going after this.
24:50Yeah.
24:50You know, I think just to complement what's been shared, I think there's plenty of work to do when we talk about the profession, when those of us who are in diversity, equity, inclusion work.
25:02But I think collectively as a community, there's a tremendous opportunity for us as well.
25:07I do believe we spend a lot of time with large companies, some who are still very much committed to this.
25:14And internally, they're spending time with their legal counsels and others to say, hey, how do we weatherproof this work, right, against this shifting social, political, legal landscape?
25:27And they're leaned in to things such as equity and debiasing efforts, you know, things that are universally beneficial to talent, right?
25:38Whether it's sponsorship or psychological safety, these are things that they realize that culturally it matters for everyone to have.
25:45So it's great.
25:46We do believe that there are opportunities for institutions to continue to lean in here.
25:51But I think there's an opportunity for us as a community as well.
25:57In our data, you know, we see that, you know, black women are still four times as likely to be passed over for promotion by equally or less qualified peers.
26:09Black men are twice as likely to feel they're just being evaluated by completely different criteria altogether in the work environment.
26:17The likelihood that a black woman will be looking for a new role in some of these large companies in the next six months is multiples higher than peers.
26:30So we can wait around for them to see us.
26:33Or collectively, we could create opportunity for one another.
26:37Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
26:41I have two questions that I want to get to very quickly, and I'll open this up to the panelists.
26:44I'll just have one person answer one and another, the other question.
26:48The first question is, do you see a possibility for DEI initiatives to become federally and locally enforced?
27:00Well, I mean, yes, absolutely.
27:04You know, one of the top things that if Leader Jeffries is then coordinated as a speaker in January
27:11is that he will reestablish the Office of Diversity and Inclusion and he will insulate it as a part of public policy.
27:17And I think that's just going to be a major step in the right direction.
27:20When we talk about opportunity, I think what we have seen is how easily they could be dismantled.
27:25And so we're learning a lot of lessons right now on how to reestablish some of these capabilities.
27:29I do want to remind people that may not know that when President Biden got in office,
27:34he instructed all 95 agencies to first look at how they can go after equity within each of their departments.
27:42And they all have a plan that's on the website.
27:45Executive Orders 13985 is for external.
27:48Executive Order 14035 is for internal, which was supplemented by over 15 additional DEI-related executive orders.
27:55Didn't I tell you they were going to light this room up?
27:57All right, second question.
27:59Do you see a possibility, wait a minute, hold on.
28:02What does an ideal DEI workforce environment look like?
28:06And how can we, companies, accomplish that ideal environment for everyone?
28:17Well, the ideal environment is one in which everyone's fully activated, right?
28:23They're able to bring their most unique contributions into the work environment and be celebrated for those unique contributions.
28:32I think there's, there's, I think an opportunity for organizations to understand that a lot of the barriers are systemic.
28:42So, you know, I think those of you in corporate spaces, I think the opportunity is to really just begin to look at your talent systems end to end.
28:51Because I think you debias those, it benefits everyone.
28:55Where is bias creeping into recruiting and talent acquisition, how folks are being developed, promoted throughout an organization?
29:02If you really get at the system, then you don't require a figurehead, you know?
29:07You know, only the chief diversity officer to be championing, you know, more fair and equitable access.
29:14You don't have to have the, the one CEO who gets it, right?
29:19Because oftentimes we have organizations who are like, oh, we lost leadership.
29:24We don't have the same air cover.
29:25We don't have the same buy-in.
29:27If you really, really focus on the actual process, the systems around which your people and culture are framed,
29:36then you don't have to, you don't have to rely on any one man to validate our existence.
29:42I love it.
29:42Let's give our panelists a round of applause.
29:47Thank you so much.
29:48Before we came on this stage, someone said, is your necklace looks a little heavy, is it?
29:52I said, it is not as heavy as what's going to happen, the yoke that they're trying to put around your neck.
29:58All right.
29:58Thank you, everyone, for coming out for our panel discussion on DEI.
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