On this Special Report, the focus is on the controversial decision to lower the NEET PG percentile to zero. Dr. Rajiv Jayadevan, a senior medical professional, defends the move, stating, 'First step, for our viewers, I'll say that zero does not mean zero marks, all right?' He argues that MBBS graduates have already proven their competence by passing 19 subjects and that filling vacant postgraduate seats is essential for the healthcare system. Conversely, Dr. Ivanshi Kaul, Senior Resident at Safdarjung Hospital, strongly opposes the dilution of standards. She contends that if a student cannot manage basic cut-off marks after five years of rigorous training, the 'whole education of MBBS is failed.' The discussion also explores why 18,000 seats remain vacant, with Dr. Kaul pointing toward poor infrastructure, lack of faculty, and low stipends in non-clinical branches at private colleges. The programme highlights the tension between ensuring social justice and maintaining merit-based excellence in India's medical specialist training.
00:00But let me bring that open to our panelists now, our doctors who are joining us.
00:04Dr. Ivanchi Kohl is from Safdarjung Hospital, Senior Resident, Department of Anesthesia, is joining us.
00:11Also with us is Dr. Rajeev Jayadevan.
00:15Dr. Rajeev, to you first, you just heard that young guy over there.
00:19So happy to hear students like that.
00:21But, you know, saying that make it tougher, but get the right kind of doctors into the system.
00:25What are your thoughts about the lowering of the percentile?
00:32First up, for our viewers, I'll say that zero does not mean zero marks.
00:39All right.
00:40I'll just explain how the marks are handled first in about 10 seconds.
00:46Let's say you're selecting for a sports team and you're selecting based on height.
00:51You've got people from height of 5 foot to 6 foot 3.
00:54So these are the candidates lined up and the average height is 5 foot 6.
00:59So as of now, people 5 foot 6 and higher are higher.
01:04But when the seats are vacant, they are saying that one way to do it is to bring it down a little bit.
01:10So 5 foot 4 also gets in, but they go through the same train.
01:13So that does not mean that people at the lowest level or let's say somebody who scores what's called zero marks are getting in.
01:21I know there are some nuanced exceptions here, but I'm talking about a general category here.
01:25So people should not be under the impression that doctors with zero scores are getting in.
01:29It is just that instead of those scoring...
01:31But the SCST, OBC reserved category, their minus 40 is a qualifier, right?
01:36I know.
01:37I'm aware of that.
01:37That's a different category.
01:38That topic is social justice, and we are not going to get into that right now.
01:43Let's just stick with the standard need guidelines now.
01:46So we can always argue two ways.
01:48One is, should we allow all these positions, seats to remain vacant in all these postgraduate training centers?
01:57Or should we have people sit on the seats and complete the education?
02:02We can have arguments back and forth for both sides.
02:06But I will tell you my view.
02:08I'll take you to my MBBS class.
02:10So in my MBBS class, if you look at all the marks that were given out, there were people who had all ranges of marks.
02:20But when I look at our class 35 years since our graduation, or 40 years since our graduation, I don't see a difference in the quality of doctors at all.
02:29They've all gone on to become excellent doctors in various forms.
02:33Some are doing medicine.
02:35I'm doing medicine.
02:36Others are surgeons.
02:37Others are teaching.
02:39Some are in general practice.
02:40Some are in pharmacology.
02:41Others are in community health, and so on.
02:44So when I look back, in fact, we joke about this, saying that marks really didn't matter.
02:48So I'm not saying marks don't matter.
02:50But here's an important distinction.
02:52Remember, MBBS requires passing 19 subjects.
02:56Thirdly knowledge of 19 subjects are tested, and then only you get the MBBS degree.
03:01And then you go through another exam, which is neat, the postgraduate entrance, and that is the person who walks into the postgraduate seat.
03:09Now, the postgraduate seat, for our viewers, I'll say, is there are some postgraduate seats that are very focused.
03:14Say, for example, if I want to teach anatomy, I would only look at anatomy, and it's very easy for me to focus on just one topic.
03:22Or if I wish to study ophthalmology, I can only look at ophthalmology.
03:26I get your point, Dr. Rajiv.
03:28I get where you're going with this.
03:30But the larger question is still, and we'll perhaps have the answer very soon, right?
03:35Today is when the phase three of counselling actually opens.
03:40That means by 26, 27 Jan, we should know how it's actually turned out.
03:44But Dr. Kahl is also with us.
03:45She doesn't exactly agree with you.
03:47Dr. Kahl, Avi, is this the right way to fill up those 18,000 vacancies, according to you?
03:53So, I'll count us, sir, on this fact that, as he said, that we study 19 subjects to pass MBBS.
04:01And of any person, any student, be it a general category or any result category, we study 19 subjects.
04:07And after five and a half years of rigorous training, he's not managing to score even the basic cut-off marks in a NEET-PG exam.
04:15It's not a basic entrance-level exam.
04:17You're training to become a specialist in a country, in a medical healthcare system.
04:22If after so much years or so many studies, so many subjects, if you cannot even manage to get that cut-off,
04:29and the cut-off has to be reduced to a mere minus 40 marks, then the whole point of reservation or even the whole education of MBBS is called killed.
04:39It's killed.
04:41You want to respond to that, Dr. Rajiv?
04:43I know, I get what the doctor is saying.
04:47But the point here is, when you are doing a postgraduate, you become very good at the subject you are focusing on.
04:55So, that does not necessarily require a very certain knowledge.
04:57But it's not just about becoming good at the subject, no, Dr. Rajiv?
05:00It's about sincerity as a student that you have.
05:03If you've not been sincere for your five years of MBBS, not to score a basic mark and a cut-off in your PG NEET,
05:10then what is the guarantee that the next two years that you're going to be sincere?
05:14I mean, that's the question that's before us.
05:17Yeah, I need to correct you there.
05:18This is not about sincerity.
05:20We are looking at people who have honorably passed the MBBS course through the rigorous curriculum
05:25and have gone through an exam, and we are debating the exact marks that should be the cut-off year.
05:32These are not failures.
05:33Then what is the point of the NEET exam then?
05:36Yeah, the NEET exam is a…
05:37Then tell me the point of the NEET PG exam.
05:39NEET PG exam is a gateway of entry into the postgraduate seat.
05:44See, if the candidate is not good, the candidate will not pass.
05:47All right?
05:48So, there is…
05:49But the gate is always open.
05:51If you're for a particular category and you are scoring even zero, the gate is constantly open.
05:56It's hardly a gateway anymore.
05:58That is not true.
05:59As well, it's not really…
06:00The score is not zero there.
06:01No, the score is not zero.
06:03There is a screening tool.
06:04And if your score is zero, you will not walk into that gate.
06:07You will not.
06:08What does that mean?
06:09Just explain that to me.
06:11And I know Dr. Kohl wants to come in.
06:12I'll let her explain that.
06:13Yeah.
06:14No, I mean, I agree with you, Sonal, because it's as good as not sitting in the exam.
06:20Okay.
06:21Dr. Raji, very quickly, I have last 30 seconds.
06:23What do you mean that zero is not enough?
06:24Yeah.
06:25Zero, as I mentioned at the beginning, if you arrange people according to their marks, zero means average mark.
06:32All right?
06:32So, we are saying, the new guidelines are saying you could score below average mark.
06:38It doesn't say zero mark there.
06:40And for the general category…
06:42Zero percentile minus 40, from what I know.
06:45Yeah.
06:45Percentile does not mean…
06:46Out of 800, correct?
06:47Yeah.
06:47Percentile does not mean zero.
06:48Can you tell me SCST or any reserve category over there?
06:52And this is not against reservation at all.
06:54It should not be perceived as that.
06:55I'm just saying, for a reservation student, what is the lowest benchmark required for PG, according to you?
07:02I am not aware of the…
07:04I am not updated with the SCST category.
07:07As I said, it is social justice.
07:08And I'm not going to comment on that.
07:09It requires a long discussion on SCST alone and not in 10 seconds.
07:14All right.
07:15Dr. Kohl, I'll give you the last word over there.
07:18I want to understand from you, since you are the younger of the lot, please, apologies for sort of mentioning that.
07:24But just because you're the younger of the lot and we've seen consistent dropouts in the NEAT-PG examination,
07:30I'm constantly going back to the same question.
07:32Why are there vacancies?
07:34A lot of people are saying that let's fill it through lower percentile, etc.
07:38I'm just asking, why are there no takers for NEAT-PG?
07:43See, the title of seats that are going vacant are mainly of the non-clinical branches
07:47and mainly of private colleges.
07:50Why this is happening?
07:51Because just increasing the number of seats is not enough.
07:54Most of the places, there is lack of infrastructure, lack of faculty.
07:58Maybe there is a bond.
07:59Maybe there is less stipend.
08:01So people, they are not keen to join on those places.
08:03Maybe they are located in peripheries.
08:06So students don't pick up those seats.
08:07And as the kid first from the quota said, that people want to go and for more clinical branches.
08:13So non-clinical branches.
08:15So perhaps some redundant branches that people don't want.
08:18And that's where all the vacancy is coming from.
08:20I have very little time, so I have to leave it there for the moment.
08:23Thank you both for joining us and for the moment.
08:25Good luck to all the kids who are appearing for the PG NEAT as well.
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