- 7 months ago
An India Today special investigation, 'Operation Ayushman,' exposed how numerous empanelled private hospitals deny cashless treatment to eligible patients and demanding cash payments across Delhi NCR, Punjab, and Himachal Pradesh.
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00:00a game-changing scheme a life-changer for millions
00:20on paper health care is promised to all but at the hospital gate that promise
00:29quietly disappears India today exposes the reality of the health care for all
00:37promise from hospitals claiming no funds to ensure free treatment to even
01:06doctors discouraging treatment under the scheme
01:24we expose some of the biggest hospitals of the country in this multi-state
01:30reality check Aishman Bharat claims to open doors to treatment but in reality
01:38for the poor health care remains a luxury and inaccessible
01:46the Aishman villains India today investigation
01:51hello and welcome I'm Sonal Manotra Kapoor this is five live you've already got a
02:02glimpse of it and that will be the focus on the program today on paper the
02:08government has promised Ayushman Bharat is one of its big big promises that comes
02:13in but in reality it falls flat people after people state after state hospital
02:22after hospital is denied of that treatment which is said to be cash free by the
02:27government the full one hour today will be dedicated to bringing you that ground
02:32reality first up the headlines at this hour
02:35India today's operation Ayushman impact the governments of Delhi Punjab Himachal and Uttar
02:43Pradesh now promise action after our cameras caught hospitals and doctors denying treatment to
02:49Ayushman Bharat scheme beneficiaries big setback for Tamil Nadu government Madras High Court allows
02:57lighting of the lamp on top of the pillar at the Madurai hill near the Darga now blasts the state for
03:03causing disturbance for political agenda DMK government now has moved to Supreme Court
03:09the Karur stampede continues to haunt TVK chief Vijay the Thakpati summoned by the CBI on January 12th for
03:19questioning over a tragic incident that claimed 41 lives and it is double trouble for Vijay indeed as the
03:27Madras High Court has refused the immediate release of his final film Jana Nayagam yet to receive the
03:35censor board nod ahead of Friday release
03:37Supreme Court comes down hard on CAQM over air pollution for failing in their duties as they seem to be no hurry to
03:47identify even the causes of pollution or finding solutions to tackle it directs the CAQM to bring
03:53in experts and hold meetings within two weeks
03:57JNU administration now initiates action seeks FIR after alleged provocation provocative chants were made
04:07against Prime Minister Modi and Home Minister Amit Shah during a campus event
04:15the draft voter rollout for Uttar Pradesh is out nearly 2.9 crore names removed from the list
04:23meanwhile TMC moves Supreme Court over the SIR exercise
04:27there is no end to the Hindu hate in Bangladesh
04:3140 year old Sarat Chakrabarti dies after being attacked with sharp weapons
04:35hours after a journalist was killed
04:38six Hindus have been killed in the past one month
04:41Bangladeshi PACE
04:44Mustafa Izzur Rahman is unlikely to be compensated by KKR for
04:49or BCCI after he was released from the IPL 2026
04:55and the latest entrant in the weight loss drug category
05:01it's the first of its kind daily oral pill for weight loss
05:06manufactured by Novo Nordisk
05:08now launched in the US market
05:11Vigovi will cost $149 a month
05:15but Indians will have to wait for it
05:25K.I. Gushman Bharat Yojana is India's largest publicly funded health insurance scheme
05:41it was launched in 2018 to provide cashless healthcare to the country's most vulnerable citizens
05:47under the scheme families are entitled to treatment worth up to 5 lakh rupees every year
05:53in impaneled public and private hospitals
05:57on paper this effectively doubles the health cover for eligible families
06:03but in reality does this translate into treatment at hospital counters
06:09India today conducted a reality check across these impaneled private hospitals in Delhi and the National Capital Region
06:16what we found was repeated instances of patients being discouraged
06:21asked to pay out of their pocket
06:24or even in certain cases deny treatment
06:27despite having a valid Ayushman card
06:30From Outer Delhi to South Delhi
06:34and even across the National Capital Region
06:37the promise of cashless healthcare
06:40ceases to exist
06:42Here's the investigative report
06:50The Ayushman Bharat scheme launched by the Narendra Modi government in 2018
06:54has been one of the most transformative healthcare schemes of the government
06:59The scheme provides secondary and tertiary hospitalisation for up to 5 lakh rupees per family per year
07:07and covers roughly 55 crore beneficiaries
07:11Over 33,000 public and private hospitals have been empaneled as Ayushman providers
07:19The Ayushman Bharat Yojana was implemented in Delhi only in April this year
07:26And in Delhi, the new government has given an additional cover of 5 lakh rupees to its residents
07:34But how does Ayushman Yojana work in reality?
07:37To find out, we started from Sushila Hospital in Outer Delhi
07:43Located in Outer Delhi's Narela area, the privately run Sushila Hospital is empaneled under the Ayushman Bharat Yojana
07:52We approached their reception to inquire about a hip replacement surgery under Ayushman
08:00We were told to speak with orthopedic doctor Rakesh Singh
08:05More of the
08:10The
08:30Once the doctor realized that we were seeking treatment under Dayishman Yojna, he started
08:58listing the shortcomings of the scheme.
09:28We then inquired about hospitalization charges.
09:56In case the patient needed to stay for a week or so to recover.
10:03This is what the doctor had to say.
10:26This is what the doctor had to say.
10:31This is what the doctor had to say.
10:33Clearly, the subtle message from Sushila Hospital is that you will need to shell out almost
10:4780,000 to 90,000 rupees over and above the Ayushman Yojna package for a decent hip implant and a
10:56week's stay in a private AC ward.
10:59Our next destination was the Universal Center of Health Sciences in South Delhi, a hospital
11:09empaneled under the Ayushman Yojna since 2021.
11:13Here, we came across an Ayushman Mitra, a point person meant to help Ayushman patients.
11:20And this is how he helped us.
11:49As instructed, we met the hospital director, Dr. Shailesh Jain.
11:54He assured us that he would check the feasibility under Ayushman and let us know.
12:00But despite several reminders, we never got a reply from him.
12:06From South Delhi, we drove to Jeevan Jyoti Hospital in Ghaziabad's Pratap Vihar.
12:12We asked about the orthopedic doctor, but the receptionist sent us directly to the TPA department
12:19that deals with the third-party assurance.
12:22First, we have to look at the TPA department.
12:29When he was placed in a TV, he went to the left.
12:30The camera said, ''In the TPA department, you can't stop leaving.
12:33I am going to take off the toilet.
12:35I am going to take off the toilet."
12:37And when you sit on the toilet, it isactive.
12:40And there is a vĂȘle of the toilet.
12:42And then you need to take off the toilet.
12:45And then I am going to go to the toilet.
12:47The government website clearly shows this hospital is empaneled for all kinds of surgical
13:12procedures.
13:14After probing further, we bumped into the TPA manager, Ramveer, outside the hospital.
13:21He explained the economics of treatment under Aishman.
13:24The hospital is a hospital.
13:32The hospital is a hospital.
13:34As per the Ayesh
14:04As per the Ayeshman empanelment list, Surphi Hospital in Noida is supposed to provide all kinds of treatment.
14:11But in reality, this hospital provides only selected treatments.
14:34So this is the reality of hospitals in Delhi NCR.
14:56Their Ayeshman Bharat scheme is mostly on paper.
15:00At the ground level, poor patients are either turned away or the scheme is flouted in the name of cash and extra expenses.
15:10From Delhi, we drove to the Union Territory of Chandigarh and went straight to Mukat Hospital and Heart Institute.
15:18This hospital has been empaneled with the Ayeshman Yojana since 2021.
15:26We told them we needed a surgery under the Ayeshman scheme.
15:31We were introduced to the surgeon's assistant, Sachin, who got our Ayeshman card verified in the TPA department.
15:39And then the excuses started.
15:41The hospital is called the Ayeshman.
16:12To verify Sachin's claim, we went to the TPA department, where the Ayushman coordinator, Abhay, gave us another spin.
16:22He claimed that even though the Ayushman card is valid across India, outstation patients need approval from the Ayushman central office.
16:31We were hearing this one for the first time.
16:41If the card is valid, then the assignment will be passed, but the approval of the Ayushman is not valid.
16:48The Ayushman is valid.
16:49Sir, the card is valid.
16:51Sir, we don't see it, our patients don't get delivered.
16:55The assignment is valid.
16:57This is the same.
16:59This is the union directory?
17:03Yes, when the hospital comes, it will be the same.
17:07It was clear that the hospital itself was discouraging patients.
17:32But then Sachin came up with a simple solution.
17:36Get it done in cash.
18:06Clearly, outstation Ayushman cards had no value in Mukad Hospital.
18:14The message to the poor patients was simple.
18:18If you want to get treatment of your choice, be ready to shell out from your pocket.
18:24But it isn't just limited to few hospitals or a few locations, as part 2 of our expose will show.
18:41That's the reality of Ayushman Bharat.
18:45If you thought that this was a story of Delhi NCR alone, well, we've got news for you.
18:49The Ayushman Bharat Yojana was designed to ensure that no Indian is denied hospital treatment for lack of money.
18:57Remember, we still have a country where one hospitalization or one serious ailment can erode the entire wealth of the family.
19:10That's why this scheme was put into place.
19:12Imparalleled hospitals were meant to provide cashless care to eligible patients, including emergency situations under a fixed package system.
19:21But how does the scheme work when patients walk into a hospital emergency ward late at night, seeking urgent care?
19:28India Today extended the investigation beyond Delhi to the urine territory of Chandigarh, even neighboring states of Punjab and Himachal Pradesh.
19:37From hospitals located on national highways to well-known multi-speciality centers in district headquarters and hill towns, we put the Ayushman system to the test.
19:49And what we found was the same pattern of denial.
19:54Emergency cases being asked to pay cash, illnesses being declared not covered, and impaneled hospitals quietly refusing to treat Ayushman patients all together.
20:06Across multiple hospitals, patients were told the scheme was financially unviable.
20:13Approvals were pending, or that only selective treatments were allowed.
20:19As private hospitals turn away those who were mandated to treat, serious questions come about enforcement, accountability and who is actually benefiting from India's flagship health insurance scheme.
20:33This is part two of our investigation.
20:37Take a look.
20:37This is the Indus International Hospital on the Chandigarh-Ambala National Highway in Mohali District.
20:54It is empaneled with the Ayushman Bharat Yojana.
20:58We reached here at around 9pm on the pretext of admitting a dengue patient whose condition was serious.
21:05We met Anil in the billing section outside the emergency unit.
21:12This is what he said.
21:14Clearly, even in emergency situations, it is a very difficult situation.
21:44The hospital was insisting on the cash payment and ignoring the Ayushman scheme.
21:51We decided to speak directly to the emergency ward doctor.
21:56The doctor clearly said a serious infection like dengue is not covered under the Ayushman scheme.
22:22Despite all our efforts, we could not get our dengue patient admitted in the emergency ward.
22:28Patiala's famous Bhatia hospital, neuro and multi-speciality is empaneled with the Ayushman scheme since 2021.
22:53And it claims to treat all kinds of diseases.
22:59At the hospital reception, we met Kuljeet, who said the hospital had stopped treating Ayushman patients due to pending payments.
23:09Even the TPA manager admitted that no patient was being treated here under the Ayushman scheme.
23:17Not willing to give up, we escalated the matter with the hospital owner, Dr. Kavar Singh.
23:35He heard our case and said the ortho specialist will examine and recommend treatment.
23:40As directed, we met orthopedic doctor Pawan Kumar Kamal.
24:00After looking at the x-ray, he agreed that hip replacement was necessary.
24:05He charged ÂŁ1,70,000 for imported aid, ÂŁ1.5,000 for email.
24:18So Ayushman is...
24:19With four days of stay, including every...
24:22Ayushman, ÂŁ83,000, ÂŁ84,000 to use the package.
24:29That's why the government.
24:30That's...
24:31Dr. Kamal clarified that Ayushman package is fixed.
24:40No additional amount can be charged.
24:42But the reality is that the hospital provides treatment on its own terms.
24:50Actually, hospital court permit has packaged it.
24:55The one which is the cheapest quality, but...
25:25So we can find it.
25:26The investigation, we can take the medical process.
25:27The hospital is also like an emergency building.
25:28The hospital is in an emergency room.
25:29For the hospital we have to put it in an emergency room.
25:29And the hospital is actually going to be diagnosed.
25:30You know, you are going to haveueprint treatment.
25:31You know, so you can don't do it there.
25:34So how about that, this COVID-19 has been tested, right?
25:36The hospital is very big.
25:37I just have to advise it.
25:38And...
25:40we have to advise it.
25:41We have to stay up here.
25:42We have to keep using a life and abuse.
25:43Usually, if you are not to have a disability.
25:45The doctor will have to be mounted in an emergency room.
25:46The doctor will have to ride the hospital.
25:48But the doctor will have to charge the person in emergency room.
25:49do you have time to see that?
25:55Yes, sir.
25:58He's taking about 50,000.
26:00He's only about 20,000 people,
26:05but he's not so much at the time.
26:10If you guys are working with a number of people,
26:12then you'll have a mobile device.
26:15This is the case over 4 days.
26:18It's a very difficult problem.
26:20It's a very difficult problem.
26:22Actually, the packages are government-related.
26:24If I have to pay for money,
26:26I have to pay for the hospital,
26:28I have to pay for it.
26:30It's a private job.
26:32When I have 8-8-Krona,
26:34I have to pay for it.
26:38Actually, in the hospital,
26:40we have to pay for it.
26:42We have to pay for it.
26:44We have to pay for it.
26:46Our next stop was JP Hospital
26:58on the Ambala Chandigarh Road
27:00in Ziragpur.
27:02Here, we talked to Radha
27:04at the reception.
27:06She flatly rejected the Aishman card.
27:08Listen to her explanation.
27:10As per official records,
27:12JP Hospital is empaneled with the Aishman scheme
27:14for all kinds of treatment.
27:16But the receptionist bluntly said,
27:30they only entertain dialysis cases under Aishman.
27:32From Punjab, we drove up to Solan in Himachal Pradesh.
27:36Here at the Navjeevan nursing home,
27:38a board of Aishman Bharat Yojana is clearly visible.
27:42But what is the reality?
27:58We began our probe with the receptionist.
28:02Aishman Bharat Yojana
28:03Aishman Bharat Yojana
28:04Aishman Bharat Yojana is clearly visible.
28:05But what is the reality?
28:06Aishman Bharat Yojana is clearly visible.
28:07But what is the reality?
28:15We began our probe with the receptionist.
28:21Aishman Bharat Yojana's interview with the Aishman Bharat
28:22Aishman Bharat Yojana leads to Aishman Kumar Yohana.
28:23Why is a treatment?
28:24Whether it's a treatment or a treatment or a treatment or something?
28:27Aishman goes away now.
28:29What's the treatment?
28:30Yes.
28:31Didn't you expect the treatment in Aishman to make the treatment?
28:33The treatment for a treatment?
28:36Yeah.
28:37What's it?
28:38In any case.
28:39Aishman is also not in the car.
28:42No.
28:43There is no, no.
28:44No.
28:45Do you have a patient of an emergency?
28:47I would have to pay for an emergency?
28:48No.
28:50We did not believe it, so we met the hospital owner and surgeon, Dr. Aysar Sharma.
29:10As soon as we mentioned the Aishman scheme, he flatly refused.
29:15They are not accepting it, but they are not saying the dues, why the dues are pending, they are stopping it.
29:30A crore?
29:32We are going to go to the hospital, so go to the hospital, go to the hospital.
29:40No, no, no, we are not accepting the card of any kind.
30:08Our next destination was El Cura Healthcare on Solon's famous Mall Road.
30:23This hospital got empanelled under Aishman Bharat just last year.
30:27We spoke to Mehak at the reception and told her that we had to admit a dengue patient urgently.
30:40The hospital was a very good person.
30:42I was told that Aishman was not covering for any kind of hospital.
30:47I was told that I was not covering for any kind of hospital.
30:48What, what?
30:49I was told that I had to ask questions.
30:50I was told that I was not covering for Aishman.
30:51What is that?
30:53I have to cover for Aishman.
30:55So it boils down to the money, and not the patient.
31:15While the government claims that Aishman Bharat gives the poor the right to free treatment,
31:19several enlisted private hospitals are openly rejecting patients.
31:29Some say it is a loss-making deal, while others directly ask for cash.
31:37The question is, when such hospitals turn away poor patients, then who is availing the
31:44real benefits of this scheme?
31:49Odd reality there, being brought to light by my colleague Nitin Jain, who did that
31:54entire investigation in Punjab and Himachal Pradesh.
31:58But let's take that reality to the authorities.
32:01Joining me next is Dr. Balbir Singh.
32:04He is the Health Minister of Punjab, thank you so much for your time.
32:07Dr. Singh, you are a doctor yourself, you understand the plight of patients, you also understand
32:13the realities of the hospitals.
32:15So my first question to you is this, when the investigation shows very clearly that hospitals
32:22in broad daylight are saying we will simply not give treatment, impaneled with the government
32:28on Aishman are denying flat out that forget emergency, forget, you know, any kind of no
32:35Aishman card will be accepted.
32:38How is this happening in your state, sir?
32:40Well, I have seen your report and there are some, I would say, bad sheeps.
32:46And we have already suspended three hospitals before your report as well.
32:53And we have fined many hospitals to the tune of 1 lakh and 25 lakh rupees, 1 crore and 25 lakh
33:00rupees.
33:01So there are some bad people, but I would say 80-85% people are doing a good job as well.
33:07There is no problem with the big hospitals like PGIE, Sector 32, our own medical colleges,
33:14and most of the private hospitals as well.
33:15But there are certain bad hospitals, yes.
33:18We do take action and we have de-impaneled some hospitals and there are bad efforts.
33:23So we will take very strict action.
33:25I have seen your report and it's very commendable report and it's a wonderful work.
33:30I appreciate India today's opportunities.
33:33Sir, if I can name those hospitals for you.
33:35There is the Indus International Hospital in Mohali.
33:38There is Bhatia Hospital, neuro and multi-speciality in Patiala.
33:42There is JP Hospital in Ziragpur.
33:44And these are just, you know, random picks made by our reporters.
33:48I have noted them.
33:49I want to know what is the specific action that will be taken against them apart from just
33:53de-paneling them.
33:54You see, there is some issue also with your report.
34:00Neither the doctors nor your correspondent is aware.
34:03Like hip replacement is a reserve, it's in the reserve package.
34:07What it means is when it's in the reserve package, that means these are some of the procedures
34:13like total knee replacement, hip replacements.
34:16So any procedure which is likely to be misused, so we remove it from the private sector and
34:22it's only available in the, they can go to PGI, they can go to our own medical colleges.
34:26So general packages.
34:28But there were dengue emergency patients as well.
34:31We went to emergency centers.
34:33No, no.
34:34All emergencies are covered.
34:36All emergencies are covered.
34:37Even road accidents.
34:38We have a fresh day scheme for that.
34:40And we are giving them special rates for that.
34:43So that's very bad.
34:44It's, I mean, unbecoming of any doctor to say that.
34:47I have observed them, yes.
34:48We will take very strict action against them.
34:50So the last report that you saw there, a doctor who owns one of those hospitals says very
34:55clearly that they already have a lot of pending payment coming in from the government and which
35:00is why he simply cannot afford to run the hospital this way.
35:04If you look at the numbers as well, a total allocation of 9,406 crore was made in the union
35:11budget last year.
35:12It has already been increased by 29%.
35:14You know, budget is around the corner.
35:16We are expecting another increase to happen over there.
35:19A lot of this allocation goes directly to the states.
35:22I'm trying to understand where is this money going?
35:24I will tell you, even the very scheme of the central government is faulty.
35:31You see, central government owes Punjab 300 crore rupees.
35:34When we, you see, raise the will, they are supposed to give, it's a 60-40 scheme.
35:40Central government 60%, state government 40%.
35:43But they give us only, they say that we have a budget of 105 crores for Punjab.
35:49They have a limit.
35:50So they say it's a central government scheme.
35:53So they limit the budget, but they only actually pay us 20%.
35:57So all the states are suffering because of that.
36:00This scheme is like any other scheme, you see, smart city.
36:02You see the condition of smart city Guru Gram, Delhi, or any other smart city.
36:07So they announced the scheme with big fanfare, but they don't give the matching grant, which
36:12should be there.
36:13How can they fix the budget?
36:15It has to be 60%.
36:17Because so many people are covered with that 16 lakh families in Punjab.
36:22Now we are going to give it to the entire population of Punjab and we have already kept 1200 crores
36:29for that.
36:30So the money does not come.
36:32Their portal was not coming or working.
36:34So most of the problems are with the central and that change.
36:37So states suffer because state has to, we have to face the, you see, people when they
36:43come for treatment, but the money does not come from the center.
36:46So the problem is...
36:47Have you raised this issue with the center, sir?
36:49We are again going into Amati Party versus BJP over here.
36:53Would you say this is the issue only with Punjab or would you say this exists across states
36:58as well?
36:59I am not saying that.
37:00I am saying that there are often delays.
37:03There are often delays and the money allocated is much less than what is the share of the center.
37:09These are facts.
37:10I can give you the facts.
37:11I have met the Honourable Union Health Minister twice for this.
37:14I have written DO letters for this.
37:16I can share with you.
37:18You see, they told us to get the, you see, audit done for the previous year for the Congress's
37:22name.
37:23We did that also.
37:24We submitted the reports.
37:25So there is a problem.
37:26I am sharing with you.
37:27So there was a problem that even in Punjab, the money had to come from Monday board.
37:32It has to come from exercise department.
37:34Now what we have done is we have made it budgetary scheme.
37:37So the new scheme is a much better scheme.
37:40The money is there in the budget.
37:42It's a universal scheme.
37:44There will be no delays.
37:46So we are going to start it on 15th of January.
37:49And this is the first of its kind scheme in the whole of the country.
37:53And we already have a primary care.
37:54This is a separate scheme from what Ayushman is?
37:57This is a separate scheme.
37:59This is Mukha Matri Seth Yojna scheme, which covers the entire population.
38:04It covers the 3 crore people of Punjab.
38:06You have money for that, but you don't have money for a national scheme.
38:09No, we have blended it with that because they cover only 16 lakh families.
38:15We have 64 lakh families, 65 lakh families.
38:18They cover only 25% of the families and for those families also they pay only 20-25%.
38:24They are supposed to pay for 60%.
38:26That is the issue.
38:27Dr. Singh, this sounds really dodgy to me.
38:30You are saying you have money, you will start the scheme.
38:33You will start the scheme only under your state government and not take a national scheme.
38:37No, we are taking the national scheme.
38:40Those beneficiaries who are eligible, the only SCCC families are eligible for national scheme.
38:46There are exclusion criteria.
38:48They take only very few socio-economic and caste census families.
38:53Only a fraction of the families they take.
38:55But we are extending it to all the families of Punjab.
38:59It's a universal.
39:00This is the first of its kind.
39:01I tell you, all the states will follow suit.
39:05And we have doubled the coverage.
39:08We need, we don't want people and their hardships are not divided by state borders, no?
39:14People in hardships, I am sure people of Punjab who come under your state, who vote under you,
39:19they travel to other states as well, right?
39:22They travel and they would require the same scheme.
39:24Why would you not follow the one, you know, one nation, one car sort of philosophy here?
39:29One nation, one health sort of a philosophy here?
39:31I will tell you, we are using the NHA portal only.
39:37We are using the same portal.
39:38We are using the NHA portal.
39:40And you see, for those 16.5 lakh families, there will be all India portability.
39:49But for rest of the, for the state scheme, only the state hospitals and the Chandigarh hospitals are,
39:55and only the people are eligible in these hospitals.
39:57Dr. Singh, before speaking to you, I thought the hospitals were not really doing their bit.
40:00But after speaking to you, I feel like there's a bit of politics involved here as well.
40:03No, no, there is no politics.
40:04There is no politics.
40:05That's what it's come down to.
40:06That's what it's come down to.
40:07This is a universal scheme.
40:08We are upgrading it.
40:09We are doubling the amount coverage from 5 lakh to 10 lakh, making it universal.
40:14So, we are, we are only making it better.
40:17If you get the money, if you're saying you don't have the money under the state,
40:20you know, the central scheme, and the government is not giving it to you,
40:22what you have, you're going to, you're going to give it out, but under a different name.
40:26No, no, I'm giving you the facts.
40:28We are paying, we are, we are paying even the central share.
40:32We have only pendency for one month, so that the hospitals, they also don't suffer.
40:37Because the principal reason for hospital to refuse treatment is when their payments are pending.
40:43So, we are taking care of that, but there are fraudsters and we will deal them with very stick players.
40:48We hope to see that action come through, Dr. Singh for now.
40:51Yeah, definitely.
40:52Thank you so much.
40:53Thank you so much for joining us.
40:54Definitely.
40:55Thank you very much.
40:56Thank you very much.
40:57Alright, so that was the Health Minister of Punjab over there.
41:01You heard his views.
41:02I'll leave it for you to decide what you made up with it.
41:04But let's go across to our reporters now, people who have actually done this expose on the ground
41:09and they give us a glimpse of what exactly is happening and what the ground reality is.
41:14Joining me now is Shivani Sharma here from Delhi.
41:17Samart Rivasava joins me from Lucknow in UP.
41:20And Kamaljeet Sandhu joins us from Punjab.
41:24Samart, let me come to you first.
41:26We explored hospitals in Noida.
41:29We explored hospitals across the Delhi NCR region as well.
41:32On the face of it, every time you put out an expose like this, the ordinary, you know,
41:36the initial reaction from the government is we'll take action.
41:39But are they taking this seriously?
41:41Or is it the same issue what I heard from the Punjab Health Minister who's saying,
41:46listen, we've not been, the money hasn't come from the centre.
41:48How do we pass it on?
41:53Well, exactly.
41:54See, we have done that investigation.
41:56But if the health minister was himself very worried about this particular situation,
42:02the ministry themselves had done some review or some drive regarding that,
42:07at least you put a check on the private hospitals,
42:09whether they are accepting the Ayushman card or not.
42:11When we spoke to Burjesh Pathak, the deputy CM of Uttar Pradesh
42:15and the health minister as well,
42:16he clearly said that those who are registered,
42:19they only are pressed to do this particular thing of giving the free treatment
42:24under the Ayushman card.
42:25But those who are not registered,
42:26then we asked that wherever the investigation happened,
42:29wherever that particular thing happened,
42:30all private hospitals were registered.
42:32And they were clearly saying that they have some issues
42:34regarding the reimbursement from the government.
42:37Either they did not get it on time or they did not get it.
42:40So when we asked these questions, he clearly said,
42:42if some hospital is not giving free treatment under the Ayushman scheme,
42:46then the action will be taken against them
42:48and even will be suspended the medical thing
42:51of these particular hospitals, the practical practice, etc.
42:54But the question is,
42:56why we have to do this particular investigation?
42:59That's the bigger part.
43:00Because see, the poor has no one to hear.
43:03We are the media, we are the fourth pillar.
43:05We'll be there for the investigation and everything.
43:07But what actually that particular health ministry was doing in the state of Uttar Pradesh
43:11and other places where this particular investigation happened by India 2 Day TV,
43:16that's the bigger concern.
43:17Because yes, we showed those reports of two to three hospitals
43:20either in Noida and Ghaziabad.
43:22And action might be taken, they might take action in this particular regard.
43:26But what about others?
43:28Because it's also not possible for us even to go into every private hospital
43:32and do this random check.
43:34What's the responsibility?
43:35Why the CMOs have been stationed in the districts?
43:37They have been given.
43:38They should be held responsible for this particular thing.
43:40At least ensure that whatever...
43:42And just de-panelling them is not the solution, right?
43:44You have to put some penalties in place.
43:46You have to create some fear of the law and you have to create, fix some,
43:49you know, responsibility there and accountability there.
43:52That's what's really required.
43:53Let me take that question to Shivani as well.
43:55Kabbal Ji, just stay, you know, back with me.
43:57Because Shivani, while the Punjab minister can say,
44:00oh, the centre is not giving us...
44:03You know, there are a handful of states which are led by the opposition, frankly, right?
44:06But in Delhi, in UP, they can't make that claim, right?
44:10We're expecting better coordination between centre and state
44:12since both BJP governments are in power over there.
44:15What's the excuse here in Delhi?
44:17See, Sonal, it's all the more unfortunate when it comes to this gap
44:21that has been pointed out by the Sting Operation of India today
44:25where national capital Delhi had announced an additional 5 lakh
44:28of reimbursement benefit to the people under this scheme.
44:32So now, 5 lakh plus 5 lakh.
44:35That was the amount for which people can get free benefits
44:39and around 1900 processes are covered under this.
44:43Sonal, can you imagine?
44:44And all over the country, there are more than 31,000 hospitals
44:48that are entitled to give benefits
44:51under Ayushman card health benefits scheme.
44:53But what's happening on ground?
44:55Just a check of 7 to 8 hospitals has given us this picture,
44:59the bitter truth on ground,
45:01that there is a serious requirement to implement this scheme.
45:06It should just not be the announcements at the time of the election.
45:10It should just not be that card to show the people.
45:12But yes, there must be implementation on ground.
45:15We need to find that where is this gap?
45:18Is there a corruption fabric that's working against the poor people
45:22who are in need of hospitals, in need of treatment?
45:24Where is the gap?
45:26Where is the gap?
45:27We need to find that out.
45:28And in Delhi, around 6.7 lakh families
45:31are entitled to get this scheme benefit.
45:35But is it already happening on ground?
45:37And we saw that it's just not there.
45:39The people who have been made to sit in the hospitals
45:42as the helpers or the counsellors under this scheme,
45:45they just outrightly reject these cardholders.
45:48They say, no, this kind of surgery cannot be taken
45:52under this Ayushman benefit card.
45:55So we have to see that where this gap is,
45:58is it about corruption?
45:59Is it only about the blame game or the politics
46:01that the Punjab government or the other opposition government
46:03has been playing?
46:04Or is it about the actual interest
46:08that the government is taking to benefit the user
46:10or just a political card?
46:12Right.
46:13Kamal ji, that's a good point that Shivani raises, right?
46:15Let's try and identify and, you know,
46:17I want to pick your brains a little bit on this.
46:18Where is the gap?
46:19Is the gap between how that one of the owners
46:22of the hospital, who's a doctor,
46:23who said that, listen,
46:24we are not getting any refunds from the government.
46:26How long can we carry out like this?
46:28That's why now we outrightly reject all Ayushman cards.
46:31Is there the gap between what the health minister is saying
46:33in saying that, listen,
46:34we've not been reimbursed by the central government.
46:36How long do we start paying out of our pocket?
46:38Where is the gap, really?
46:43Well, there are multiple issues.
46:45For instance, there are several doctors who pointed out
46:48that Ayushman card is being carried by several people,
46:52including the VVIPs,
46:54some people who are not even entitled.
46:56This is mostly meant for those people
46:58who cannot afford insurance as such.
47:00So this is a card which works well for all those people
47:03who are required to really benefit from Ayushman card.
47:06Now, there are several others who are actual benefiters
47:09when they go to these particular hospitals.
47:12Now, they actually do find a lot of loopholes there.
47:15And that's where the doctors say either pay by cash,
47:18come through the other way.
47:20So this is where there is some sort of pressure tactics
47:23which are built on patients,
47:25especially those who come through emergency.
47:27Some people will say,
47:28OK, we only have dialysis.
47:30We do not admit other patients.
47:31The others say,
47:33OK, we need to really verify the documents.
47:35We need another 24 to 48 hours.
47:38Now, not everybody has that sort of a time span
47:41to really look into this
47:42because some people really required urgent intention.
47:45The other is what the state governs,
47:47especially the non-BJP governments are saying,
47:49for instance, Punjab and for instance, Himachal Pradesh.
47:52Himachal is a much smaller state,
47:54but they're saying they get 50 crore rupees
47:56from central government.
47:585 crores is only paid by Himachal government,
48:01but that is way too small for the population
48:03because remember,
48:04they have already created a pendency of 180 crore rupees.
48:08So they say the government is still paying for it,
48:10but they want center to pinch in as much as 90%,
48:14not 50 or 60%.
48:16So this is where they say a lot of times the hospitals
48:19and we saw even in the state of Haryana
48:21where several of the hospitals
48:23and the doctors went on strike saying
48:25they're not going to admit patients of Ayushman scheme
48:28simply because they're not getting the money
48:30in from the state government itself.
48:33Now that is one of the reasons
48:35where hospitals feel that they really need to survive
48:38and they survive on money.
48:39So if that's being late or that's not being given to them,
48:42that creates a whole lot of issues.
48:45So what we've seen is,
48:46be it the BJP or the non-BJP states,
48:48there seems to be some core problems,
48:50including the pendency issue,
48:52including doctors and hospitals finding loopholes,
48:55trying to convince patients to come in
48:57either through cash or other mechanisms
49:00simply because they feel they're not making enough profit
49:02from this particular scheme itself.
49:04And this, mind you,
49:05is the flagship scheme of Prime Minister Narendra Modi,
49:08something which is to benefit all the poor.
49:10But definitely a whole lot of people
49:12are actually facing a uphill task
49:14when it comes to medical treatment
49:16in these impaneled hospitals.
49:18Yeah.
49:19Shivani, you know, let me come to you.
49:21You know, Kamal Chief made an excellent point over there
49:24about how there are multiple reasons why this fails.
49:27And one can't say there are niggles anymore, right?
49:29Because this scheme has been in place from 2018 onward.
49:31It's been a while.
49:33Those initial hiccups should have been sorted out by now.
49:36Year on year,
49:37we are seeing more and more budgetary allocation being done.
49:39Your and my taxpayers' money
49:41is going into schemes like these.
49:43But none of it is actually getting translated on ground.
49:46In the biting cold of Delhi,
49:48where you and I are at the moment,
49:50year after year,
49:51we have seen outside Ames, outside Safdarjang,
49:54you have people who just line up,
49:55who perhaps sometimes say that they will die out of the cold
49:57before they die out of the illness.
49:59That's the reality.
50:00On ground,
50:01we are not seeing the healthcare system move at all.
50:05You are absolutely right, Sonal.
50:08See, it's not only about the Ayushman card
50:10or the benefits of 5 lakh or 10 lakh rupees.
50:13It's about the complete healthcare system.
50:15We have seen the hospitals even before the Ayushman scheme
50:18and even after the Ayushman scheme,
50:20especially the government hospitals.
50:21What's the state of affairs out there?
50:23And we really need to investigate
50:25what's the reason of this kind of rejection
50:28by the hospitals to the Ayushman card holders.
50:30Is it the corruption?
50:31Or is it the loophole?
50:32Or is it the delay of payments
50:35by the government to the hospitals?
50:37So we really need to know about this.
50:39But certainly this is an enforcement requirement
50:42that needs to be done from the government also.
50:45That when you have entitled and enrolled
50:4831,000 hospitals across India,
50:50what are you doing to ensure that these
50:52Ayushman card holders get benefits of the scheme?
50:55So this is certainly a flaw that needs to be corrected
50:58and investigations further
50:59that why these people are not being given the benefits
51:02in spite of holding the cards.
51:04So, Shivani, Samarth, Kavaljeet, all our other colleagues
51:07from the SI team who actually have done this investigation,
51:10kudos to all of you.
51:11Thank you so much for your time and bringing us perspective.
51:14Remember, your and my hard-earned money,
51:17our taxpayer money is what goes into schemes like these.
51:20And when it's not even seen translating on ground,
51:22that really pinches.
51:23We are days away from the budget
51:25and we would love and really urge the government
51:28to look into it and understand
51:30where are those 9,000 crores really going?
51:33We'll leave you with that thought.
51:34We'll see you again tomorrow.
51:35Bye-bye for now.
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