00:00Ulrich Bruckner is a professor for European Studies at Stanford University and joins us now from Berlin.
00:07Ulrich, thank you so much.
00:08What is the EU position on Donald Trump suggesting that the US will take over Greenland?
00:16Well, as difficult as it often is to speak with one voice.
00:20In this case, it's very simple.
00:22Everyone is furious about such a claim of a NATO partner.
00:29We have been within a security alliance and believed in collective security is real.
00:36But having an enemy within the system, someone who could come out with an imperialist idea to steal a junk of a kingdom of Denmark,
00:47is so outrageous that there was nothing like a strategy in the drawers that could just be used for a case like this.
00:54Is it at all being seen as political theater?
00:58We know Donald Trump says a lot or is it pointing to a deeper problem in how the US views its allies?
01:05Well, of course, it also shows that there is a great disrespect for the allies and that making America great again implies that everyone else has no interest or is treated as a condition taker.
01:21This doesn't distinguish between potential enemies and close partners.
01:28And it has no idea since February last year.
01:29And this is something that is a given in an otherwise very uncertain situation.
01:35But generally speaking, it's hard to predict because if a few weeks ago someone would have said that Trump would be willing and able to kidnap a president or to act as a pirate in the Atlantic to conquer a ship that is under Russian flag.
01:58We would also would have said this is just rhetoric and it wouldn't happen until it did.
02:03How much leverage does the EU and NATO actually have to stop Donald Trump from taking Greenland by force if necessary?
02:12Understanding, of course, that that would be a last resort for the United States, as he says.
02:16Well, first of all, taking Greenland by force is not even necessary because there is an agreement between Denmark, a very loyal and pro-Atlantic and America ally within NATO.
02:32They have been fighting side by side with the United States in Afghanistan and in Iraq when everyone else was kind of skeptical about whether they are weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
02:44Denmark followed and Denmark expected to be respected as a consequence of this.
02:50This is no longer real.
02:52So it's very difficult to think about a scenario in which NATO would be involved because NATO is a collective security organization to defend the NATO members.
03:04And to think about something that happens within the alliance that is meant to send a signal of deterrence to potential enemies is so outrageous that I don't think that it will ever be something like a NATO problem.
03:20But with this agreement from 51, Denmark gives the United States the opportunity to protect NATO territory with air bases and military operations on the island because they see that strategically Greenland plays an important role.
03:40And it's growing of importance with the melted ice and its importance as a route both for trade and for military vessels.
03:50So this is important and it is of rising relevance.
03:53But to just take it is beyond imagination in the NATO countries.
03:59Thank you so much for chatting to us.
04:01That's Ulrich Bruckner, Professor for European Studies at Stanford University in Berlin.
04:06Thank you, John.
04:07Thank you, John.
04:08Thank you, Lord.
04:21Thank you, of course.
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