- 2 days ago
Late Night with Seth Meyers - Season 2026 Episode 2 -
Karl-Anthony Towns, Shawn Levy, Andrew Ross Sorkin
Karl-Anthony Towns, Shawn Levy, Andrew Ross Sorkin
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00:01From 30 Rock and Thunder Plaza in New York,
00:04it's Late Night with Seth Meyers.
00:07Tonight, Carl Anthony Towns.
00:10From Stranger Things, producer-director Sean Levy.
00:13Author, Andrew Ross Sorkin.
00:20And now, Seth Meyers.
00:23Good evening, everybody. I'm Seth Meyers.
00:25This is Late Night. We hope you're doing well.
00:26And now, if you don't mind, we're going to get to the news
00:29in a post today on Truth Social.
00:31President Trump said, quote,
00:33The USA markets just hit another all-time high, all of them.
00:36Thank you, Mr. Tariff.
00:38Oh, no.
00:39Does he think the tariffs are people?
00:42I just had dinner with Dave and Julie Tariff.
00:45Very nice. They paid. They paid for everything.
00:49In a new interview, President Trump said that Venezuela
00:51will not have new elections in the next 30 days
00:54and added, quote,
00:55We have to fix the country first.
00:57I don't know. I think it's going to take longer than 30 days
01:00to build them a new ballroom.
01:04According to a new poll, 44% of Republicans
01:06would support amending the Constitution
01:08to allow President Trump to seek a third term,
01:11while the other 56% said,
01:13He's only on his second term?
01:17While speaking today to House Republicans,
01:19President Trump said that he wouldn't say
01:21that he wants to cancel the election
01:23because, quote,
01:23the fake news will say he's a dictator.
01:26Well, if you cancel the elections,
01:27it won't be fake news.
01:28At that point, the dictionary will call you a dictator.
01:33President Trump also told House Republicans
01:35they have to win the midterms because, quote,
01:38If we don't win the midterms,
01:39they'll find a reason to impeach me.
01:41Of course, the challenge isn't finding one.
01:43It's picking one.
01:45After Minnesota Governor Tim Walz announced yesterday
01:49that he will not run for re-election,
01:50President Trump accused Walz of stealing taxpayer dollars.
01:54Him?
01:55Yeah.
01:56That must be how he gets all those fancy clothes.
02:00The only thing this man is stealing
02:01is the blue ribbon at the county fair.
02:04Today was the fifth anniversary
02:06of the January 6th Capitol attack.
02:08This news first reported by the cake
02:11in Fox News' break room.
02:12In a post yesterday on Truth Social,
02:18President Trump repeated his recommendation
02:20to pregnant women to avoid taking Tylenol.
02:23All right, well, if you don't want people taking Tylenol,
02:25just stop talking.
02:29The Corporation for Public Broadcasting
02:31voted yesterday to dissolve itself,
02:33which will cut off a major funding source
02:35for NPR, PBS,
02:37and hundreds of local radio and TV stations.
02:39Things are so bad that Oscar
02:41had to get roommates.
02:47I never quite know what we're going to expect
02:49when we make a bad news joke about Sesame Street.
02:53New York's MTA recently reported
02:55that since the start of Manhattan's
02:57congestion pricing program,
02:59air pollution in Midtown has decreased by 22%,
03:01and it's great because now you can really smell the urine.
03:07And finally,
03:08the Wall Street Journal recently published a profile
03:10on the Detroit Ford Motors employee
03:13who came up with the idea
03:14to put an arrow on the dashboard of a car
03:16indicating which side the tank is on.
03:18It must be a nice feeling
03:20to know you've accomplished more
03:21than the President of the United States.
03:23And that was a monologue, everybody.
03:26He's got a great show for you tonight.
03:28He's an NBA All-Star,
03:29the 2016 Rookie of the Year.
03:33He recently helped lead the New York Knicks
03:35to winning their first NBA Cup championship.
03:37Carl Anthony Towns is on the show.
03:40So happy Carl's here.
03:43He's a multi-talented producer,
03:45director, and writer
03:46whose movies include Deadpool and Wolverine,
03:48Free Guy,
03:49as well as The Night at the Museum franchise.
03:52He's an executive producer
03:53and director of the Netflix,
03:55Smash, Stranger Things.
03:56Sean Levy is here.
03:58Everybody gets to talk to him
03:59about his fantastic show.
04:02He's the co-host of CNBC's Squawk Box,
04:06an award-winning journalist whose book,
04:091929 Inside the Greatest Crash in Wall Street History
04:12and How It Shattered a Nation,
04:14is a number one New York Times bestseller.
04:16Andrew Ross Sorkin is also joining us.
04:19Family Chips,
04:22we had a great conversation with Jim James.
04:24Do give that a listen wherever you get your podcasts.
04:27You guys, here at Late Night,
04:29every night, I deliver a monologue.
04:31It is written by a diverse team of writers as a result.
04:35A lot of jokes come across my desk
04:37that due to my being a straight white male
04:39would be difficult for me to deliver.
04:41But we don't think that should stop you from enjoying them,
04:44so we'd like to share them with you now
04:46in a segment called Joke Seth Can't Tell.
04:48Hey, everybody.
04:53These are two of our writers, Amber and Jenny.
04:56I'm black.
04:57And I'm gay.
04:58And we're both women.
04:59And I'm not.
04:59So here's how it works.
05:01I'll read the setups for these jokes,
05:03and Amber and Jenny will read the punchlines.
05:05So here it goes.
05:07A woman recently proposed to her girlfriend
05:09during a professional women's hockey game.
05:12Experts are calling it the gayest sentence ever said.
05:15The Washington Post recently ran an op-ed titled,
05:19There are two black Americas.
05:21Said black people, take me to the other one.
05:25What are they doing in the other black America?
05:28The electric slide.
05:29Oh, all right.
05:30A library recently held a reading
05:33to celebrate Emily Dickinson's birthday.
05:35It included one of her most famous poems.
05:39Hope is the thing with feathers.
05:41Also, I'm gay.
05:44A popular fast food chain
05:46will test a new chicken and waffle sandwich.
05:49That's cultural appropriation,
05:51said black people going through the drive-thru.
05:54Have you tried it yet?
05:56No, but it better be good,
05:57because if not, I will still be eating it.
06:00Author Kristen Arnett recently released
06:04a novel about a lesbian clown.
06:06A lesbian clown is like a regular clown,
06:08but with uglier shoes.
06:11Jenny, what's the hardest part
06:13about being a lesbian clown?
06:15Learning to use makeup.
06:20Today was the 164th anniversary
06:23of Jefferson Davis being elected
06:25the president of the Confederacy.
06:26So if you'd like to learn more
06:28about a racist president,
06:30pick up today's newspaper.
06:33Two lesbian grandmas
06:35recently went viral on TikTok.
06:37TikTok is also what lesbians say
06:39on a first date.
06:40TikTok, we get married or what?
06:44Producers in Hollywood
06:45recently released the annual blacklist.
06:47We also have a blacklist,
06:49said police.
06:54What was that?
06:55True.
06:58Pornhub announced
07:00that there has been
07:00a considerable increase
07:02in searches for the term
07:03lesbian MILF.
07:04A lesbian MILF
07:05is like a straight MILF,
07:07except she doesn't have time
07:07to f*** you
07:08because she's running the PTA.
07:14Scientists have found
07:15a black hole
07:17that has been blasting winds
07:18at 130 miles per hour.
07:21I said,
07:22excuse me!
07:22Mom's going to be so bad!
07:32Hey, Seth,
07:32why don't you...
07:33Oh, no, I could not,
07:34absolutely.
07:35No, I just feel like
07:36if I tell when it will not end well.
07:37Oh, come on, do it.
07:38All right, all right, all right.
07:40Out.com recently published
07:42a queer guide
07:43to starting over abroad.
07:45You had me at abroad.
07:47Seth, no!
07:49Oh, God.
07:50Shame.
07:51Yeah, you know what?
07:52That was really bad.
07:52Yeah.
07:53I think I'm going to win you back.
07:54Can I try one more?
07:55Please, please.
07:55Okay, and you promise it's fine?
07:57Yes.
07:58Carbange to do
07:59whatever I feel is best?
08:00You will win us back,
08:02guaranteed.
08:02All right.
08:03Thank you, Amber.
08:04Mm-hmm.
08:04And thank you, Jenny.
08:05You're welcome.
08:05For your trust.
08:06Uh-huh.
08:08The U.S. Mint
08:09recently ended production
08:10of The Penny,
08:11said black people,
08:12so then how are we
08:13supposed to tip?
08:15Oh, my God!
08:18Hey, how are you?
08:19Seth, how could you do it?
08:20You laughed at it in rehearsal!
08:22Don't act like you
08:23haven't heard it before!
08:24It was your idea
08:25to make me do this.
08:26You guys should be ashamed
08:27of yourself.
08:27You guys,
08:28black women and lesbians
08:29are liars.
08:34We'll be right back
08:34for Carl Anthony Towns.
08:47Our first guest tonight
08:49is a five-time NBA All-Star
08:51and the 2016 Rookie of the Year
08:53he recently helped lead.
08:55The New York Knicks
08:55to winning their first
08:56NBA Cup championship.
08:58Please welcome to the show
08:59Carl Anthony Towns, everybody!
09:01How are you, Kat?
09:17I'm good, man.
09:18I'm good.
09:18I'm thrilled to see you.
09:19Yes, yes.
09:20You came straight from practice.
09:21I did.
09:22I did.
09:22I did.
09:23By the way, this is wonderful.
09:24Marty Supreme, you're shouting out.
09:27Yes, yes.
09:28This is kind of a shout out to Timothee Chalamet.
09:31Who is really one of our foremost Knick fans.
09:33Literally, literally.
09:34Yeah, shout out to my brother, man.
09:36He's doing an amazing job.
09:38And I'm happy to see the critics and everyone really appreciating what he's doing.
09:41When you won the NBA Cup Championship, you actually posted that you actually personally FaceTimed with some of our...
09:47I did.
09:47I did.
09:48Ben Stiller seems very happy here.
09:50Look at that.
09:51And there's Marty Supreme-Massell.
09:54Yes, look at him.
09:56There we go.
09:56How much when you...
09:58You know, again, these are some of the familiar faces.
09:59Tracy Morgan's another one.
10:00Yeah, yeah.
10:01Edie Falco.
10:01Yes, yes.
10:02Do you ever make eye contact during the game?
10:05Give him a little nod?
10:06I think they make it themselves known in the game, you know?
10:10So, but no, we have such great support here.
10:13I mean, the fans are amazing.
10:14And, you know, I think with the NBA Cup happening and us finding a way to win and doing a lot of amazing things right now,
10:21it's a special time to be a Knicks fan.
10:23You started your career, obviously, in Minnesota.
10:25Yeah.
10:25And, you know, it's a huge transition for anybody who lives in Minnesota to come to New York.
10:31I'm been told.
10:32You know, I know you grew up in New Jersey, so you're, you know, from the East Coast.
10:35But how was that transition to when, you know, obviously you played in Madison Square Garden,
10:39but what's it like having home games in that stadium?
10:41Like you said, I mean, it's different when you're a visitor and you're the home guy.
10:44I've been used to coming to MSG and being booed.
10:46So this is the first time that I'm getting cheered for.
10:50And it's been amazing.
10:51Last year was an amazing season for us.
10:53And obviously this year the fans expect even more.
10:55So we're trying to exceed their expectations.
10:58You guys won on Christmas Day.
11:00Yes.
11:00That was not the best thing that happened to you on Christmas Day.
11:02No.
11:03You went straight from the game.
11:04And congratulations, Cat.
11:06I appreciate it.
11:07You got engaged.
11:07Yes.
11:08There you are.
11:08I don't know if they're cheering for me or for her.
11:17I feel like everyone's a bigger fan of her.
11:19Yeah, but it's pretty amazing.
11:20I mean, quite a vantage point.
11:21Did she have any expectation was coming?
11:23How much of a surprise was it?
11:25It was a surprise.
11:25It was a surprise.
11:26Yeah, we've been dating for five and a half years up to that point.
11:30And yeah, I know in Hollywood that doesn't last long.
11:32So we found a way.
11:35We found a way five and a half years, ebbs and flows of a relationship, as anyone would
11:39know.
11:40And I think the most important thing, and we had this conversation the other day, is
11:44that we always chose each other.
11:46Yeah.
11:46You know, through the bad and the good, we always found ourselves choosing each other.
11:50And I think that makes for a strong bond, a strong relationship.
11:53And I wanted her to have a ring that shows that bond and relationship that we've built.
11:58And yeah, I want everyone to know she's mine.
11:59Was she happy with the ring?
12:04Yes.
12:05She was ecstatic.
12:05She was ecstatic.
12:06Okay.
12:06I think I did well.
12:08Okay.
12:08That's really good.
12:09Well done.
12:09Her mom approved.
12:10That's the most important thing.
12:11Yeah.
12:11I didn't even risk it.
12:13I said to my wife, like, hypothetically, what would you want it to look like?
12:17We had a wonderful night together recently with Fanatics.
12:22There was a release of the new Topps basketball cards.
12:25Yes.
12:25Topps got the rights back to basketball.
12:26I brought your kids with some in the back, too.
12:27Oh, did you?
12:28That's fantastic.
12:28Well, you actually, my son, both my sons came to this event.
12:32And here's a photo of you and Axel.
12:33Look at that.
12:34That's my son Axel.
12:35That's you.
12:36You're obviously immediately their favorite player in the NBA for how kind you were.
12:40But it was an interesting night because we went to this event.
12:44There was this little green room.
12:45It was the NBA store.
12:47And the green room was the size of me.
12:49It was very small.
12:50And there was a lot of boxes of cards stacked up.
12:52And you're a big, you love cards.
12:54I love cards.
12:55The good people of Fanatics bought a lot of boxes of cards.
12:58They were giving you cards, me cards.
13:00End of the night, I'm grabbing all the bags.
13:01Yeah.
13:02I see a couple of boxes of soccer cards.
13:04And I'm like, oh, you know, I feel like these are for us.
13:06Yeah.
13:07And I took them home.
13:09And they were not for me.
13:12And we had exchanged numbers.
13:14And even when we exchanged numbers, I was like, I wonder if we're ever going to have a reason to text each other.
13:19And then like an hour after we met, you were like, did you steal my cards?
13:25I didn't say steal.
13:28I thought they were misplaced.
13:30You did say LMAO.
13:33Thank God.
13:33I was more worried someone came in our green room and stole our cards and my hats.
13:38Well, I did use the word steal, though.
13:39Yeah, yeah, yeah.
13:40I take that back.
13:41And then I did say that I've been telling people what's cat like in person he's so easy to steal from.
13:47That's not good in New York.
13:51But you actually worked in a card store when you were a kid in high school.
13:55You have a wonderful Big Bodega Cards, one of my favorite Instagram channels.
13:59I appreciate it.
14:00But anyway, I said, hey, I'll get the cards to you.
14:02It was a Thursday night.
14:03I go, I'll get them to you on Monday.
14:04I remember, yes.
14:05I was like, I can get them to you on Monday.
14:06This is how bad it got.
14:07This is how bad our card collection was.
14:09Yeah, I was like, I'll get them to you on Monday.
14:11You're like, actually, I'm going to send somebody now.
14:14I would never forget it.
14:15And he was like, I got a flight.
14:16I was like, well, don't worry.
14:17He'll be there before the flight.
14:18We'll go get the cards.
14:20You did not.
14:20You were like, you're trustworthy, but I am going to get them now.
14:24But then I just want to speak to the kind of guy you are, because you didn't just send somebody to get the cards.
14:28You're also like, I'm going to bring something for your kids.
14:30What size shoe are you?
14:31Oh, size 20.
14:33Size 20.
14:34Yeah.
14:35If you want to know what it is.
14:37I thought it was reasonable for me, but all right.
14:40If you want to know what a size 20 shoe looks like, this is what it looks like when my children autograph shoes.
14:46And, you know, it's so funny.
14:47They put them on the windowsill.
14:49And it's like, when I put the curtains up in the morning, I'm like, it's still dark in here.
14:53That's how big your shoes are.
14:56I thought it was the hot.
14:58So people don't come in here.
14:59So you grew up in New Jersey.
15:02You were a Philadelphia sports fan.
15:04Is that right?
15:05Yes.
15:05I was an Eagles fan.
15:06Eagles fan.
15:06Eagles fan.
15:07Eagles fan.
15:07And I'm with my Yankees all the time.
15:09Yeah.
15:10Yeah.
15:11Do you get excited about being a sports fan still, even as being a professional athlete?
15:15Yeah.
15:16No, I do.
15:16I do.
15:17I mean, not many times in my life I get to be a fan of something.
15:20I'm usually always the one that's entertaining and doing the basketball part and the sports part.
15:24But, yeah, my Eagles are looking to be back-to-back, hopefully, this year.
15:28Do you watch it like a fan?
15:31Do you get nervous?
15:31Do you get excited?
15:32Or do you have ā
15:33Oh, no.
15:33Yeah.
15:33Yeah.
15:34Me, JV, Deuce McBride are big Eagles fans.
15:37So we get stressed out on those games.
15:40That's really good.
15:40Do you ā how about ā what is your stress level before games when you're playing?
15:44Like, I mean, you've been at this for a while now?
15:47Honestly, I just ā I get excited.
15:48Yeah, that's a better feeling.
15:49I'm a politician.
15:50I love going out there to play basketball.
15:51But it's just really exciting every time I get to put the jersey on.
15:54I think now in my stage in my career, I'm still ā I'm just entering my prime and everything.
15:59And I'm more understanding the importance of every game and the value that comes with it.
16:04Because you never know how much longer you're going to be doing this.
16:06You never know what God has planned.
16:07So I just go out there and enjoy every moment I get.
16:10It's all-star voting right now.
16:11Do you want to make a case for yourself or do you want me to do it?
16:13I'll let the fans pick.
16:14You'll let the fans pick.
16:15I'll let the fans pick.
16:15I'll let the fans pick.
16:16I just ā all I want to keep doing is impact and winning
16:19and finding ways to win here in New York.
16:20You've obviously ā like you said, you've been at this a long time.
16:23You played before the NBA.
16:24Obviously, you were a kid who played basketball.
16:27Is it true that due to your size, parents on the other team thought that you were lying about your age?
16:32Oh, yes.
16:32Yeah.
16:33Absolutely.
16:33I almost felt like it was like when you leave the house, you would be like, all right, make sure you got your shoes.
16:39You know, kids, we're always going to forget the shoes.
16:40Make sure you got your shoes, your jersey for the game, and the birth certificate.
16:45If you got those three things, I'm playing today.
16:48Wow.
16:48And so how often did your coach have to break out the birth certificate?
16:52Really?
16:52A lot.
16:53Yeah.
16:53I mean, it is very funny that if you were so much taller that you tried ā the idea is even funnier that you would try to get away with it.
16:59Yeah, no, right?
17:00Imagine.
17:01Yeah.
17:01Because obviously, this is not your age group.
17:04I was lucky, though.
17:05My dad always told me that, you know, for me to be my best, I had to go against the best.
17:08So I actually ended up playing like three age groups up.
17:11So it was like a lot of times I didn't need it.
17:13Well, he obviously made a good choice there.
17:16Yeah.
17:16Congratulations on everything.
17:17Good luck for the rest of the season.
17:19And thank you so much.
17:20Thank you so much.
17:21Appreciate it.
17:22Most of the time.
17:23All right, Anthony Towns, everybody.
17:24We'll be right back with Sean Levy.
17:29Welcome back, everybody.
17:39Our next guest is an Academy Award and Emmy-nominated producer, director, and writer whose movies include Deadpool and Wolverine, Free Guy, and the Night at the Museum franchise.
17:49He's an executive producer and director of Stranger Things, which just streamed its series finale and is available now in its entirety on Netflix.
17:57Let's take a look.
17:58Stop.
17:59I'm serious.
18:00It's not safe.
18:01You're going to fall.
18:02It's unstable.
18:02I got it already, okay?
18:04No, don't.
18:05Stop.
18:05Being an ass.
18:06I'm not being an ass.
18:07I'm trying to get to them.
18:08You're always trying to get yourself killed, and I can't let it happen again.
18:11Stop being so selfish, please.
18:13If you go on there, you're going to die, and I can't deal with it again.
18:16You can't die because I can't deal with it again.
18:18Don't let it happen again.
18:20Please.
18:21Please don't let it happen again.
18:23Not you.
18:26I'm sorry.
18:26Please welcome to the show my friend Sean Levy, everybody.
18:42Hello, Sean.
18:43What an exciting time to have you.
18:47It was also, I was so fortunate backstage, I met your oldest daughter and your wife, and
18:52it's lovely to see them as well.
18:53It is, but can I just, I have to start by saying that you've, without knowing it, you
18:59become a bit of a marital problem for me.
19:01Okay.
19:01Okay.
19:02Because, so I've been with my wife for 30 years, but she is low-key obsessed with you
19:07and your show.
19:07I'm sure she's not alone.
19:09Right?
19:09Yeah.
19:10And so, like, literally, it's, like, I cannot get Serena to come to bed without her Sethi
19:16first.
19:16Wow.
19:17She's like, no, no, no, I need my Sethi.
19:19Wow.
19:19And so you didn't even know you're, like, the third prong in this throuple.
19:23I mean, so exciting.
19:24I mean, I thought, I would have to do so much work to be in a throuple, and now.
19:29But this is, like, it's low-maintenance, low-impact.
19:33Well, that, I will say, my wife is a huge Stranger Things fan and never watches this
19:39show, so I do feel like it evens out.
19:42It's almost like a platonic couple swap.
19:45That sounds great.
19:46I also, I feel like we do, we have something in common, which is, we both kind of started
19:51thinking maybe we'd be actors in this business, and this is one of your early, is it your first?
19:57That is, that is basically my first real gig.
20:01You were on an episode of 21 Jump Street, which, uh, before the younger viewers, I was
20:06going to say, for the younger viewers, there was this super popular TV show.
20:10Yeah, and that's Johnny Depp right there, just to give you an idea.
20:12But this was actually, this was the craziest, but very memorable welcome to the business
20:18kind of moment, because I was, like, 21, I was fresh out of college, and I got the guest
20:23spot in the spring break episode.
20:25So I go to Miami, and I'm sitting in this car, because it's going to be a drive and talk
20:29scene, and Johnny Depp gets in the car, and I am, like, too eager.
20:35Kind of like I am right now, but younger.
20:38Yeah.
20:38And I was like...
20:39Eager when you're already successful is fine.
20:42Eager before you've done anything.
20:43Yeah, right, but it's not a great look when you've achieved nothing.
20:45Yeah.
20:45Um, and I was like, hello, Mr. Depp, I'm Sean Levy from Montreal, Canada.
20:50Like, I mean, truly...
20:52Oh, do we have some Canadians in the house?
20:54Okay.
20:55Guys, that just made me less nervous.
20:58Um, and I was like, nice to meet you.
21:00I'm thrilled to be where...
21:01And he's like, you like being a puppet?
21:03Because what I didn't know is at this point, all Johnny Depp wanted to do was go start
21:08his huge movie career.
21:10Yes, of course.
21:10And I was like, I'm sorry, Mr. Depp.
21:12He's like, welcome to the puppet show, kid.
21:15Dance, puppet.
21:17Dance.
21:18Like, full on with, like, the marionette hands and everything.
21:21Yeah.
21:21And I've never seen Johnny Depp since.
21:23Yeah.
21:24That was like...
21:25I don't know that that was the reason.
21:27Yeah.
21:27Um, but it definitely was this very, kind of, ominous welcome to the, welcome to the
21:33business.
21:33I mean, I would be so happy if you saw him again after all these years.
21:36And he's like, puppet?
21:38Yeah.
21:39Well, you, I feel like we worked together on a puppet show.
21:41Then I would really feel like I've achieved something.
21:43Uh, you have achieved something.
21:44Congratulations and everything.
21:45But specifically, Stranger Things, um, it just must be so rewarding to have had this
21:50show that started in 2016, first started airing.
21:53Um, and do you feel like, I mean, obviously, I feel like the fans feel as though you
21:57nailed the landing.
21:58Uh, do you feel the same?
21:59I was, I was shooting my latest movie in London when I first watched the first cut of the
22:04finale episode.
22:04And I was a wreck.
22:06Like, sort of like the videos we now see all over the internet of people weeping openly.
22:10That was me.
22:11Yeah.
22:11Even though I was in the initial pitch, I had read every draft.
22:15I had seen the dailies.
22:16But seeing it all come together, I, I, I was going to text the Duffers, who I've been
22:20with for a decade making the show.
22:22But I FaceTimed them.
22:24And they were driving.
22:24And I couldn't even get through a sentence without sobbing.
22:27It was, it was deeply humiliating.
22:29Well, the one thing that is interesting is even though you can, you know, read the scripts
22:33and everything, like, uh, and I think it's the way we all feel is like these, you, these
22:36kids just like grew up while it was happening.
22:38So we also, I feel like it's the passage of time is very unique.
22:43It also like, no matter how old you are, images like this make us all weep at the passage
22:49of time.
22:49Yeah.
22:49Right.
22:50Because it was like that, like you, you're very proud of these kids, but you miss when
22:54they're like younger.
22:55But can I say this?
22:56They, they were sweet, authentic kids when we found them at 12 years old and they're
23:02still sweet, authentic young adults.
23:04Yeah.
23:04It's really, it was a magical thing.
23:06And, and as magic as they were individually, the combination of them, uh, which was really
23:12evident in that very first episode, in the very first season in that basement, that D&D
23:18game in the basement, which is where it started is of course, by the way, have you all seen
23:22it?
23:22Cause I don't want to, like, what if, what if this whole appearance became like a massive
23:30spoiler?
23:30I know, but by the way, I love that you think a spoiler is it starts in a basement.
23:34No, but I was about to allude to the ending.
23:36Ah, I see, I see.
23:37It also ends.
23:38So you've done, uh, you've done Marvel stuff as well.
23:40Um, you must understand the idea of spoilers more than most people.
23:45I do, but I feel like I, I really needed that lesson more than an average human because
23:49I have a, just a big mouth and I love to talk and I love to kind of tell people things.
23:55Um, but between Stranger Things for 10 years and Deadpool and Wolverine and now this Star
24:00Wars movie that I'm making.
24:00Yeah, you're, you just said, that was when you say you were in London shooting a movie,
24:03it was a Star Wars movie.
24:05Oh yes, this, this part, this part was, uh, although I feel like this, this particular
24:11picture that I took was on the Mediterranean off of Sardinia.
24:15Um, and, but that picture is a good reminder of why I just, just virulently avoided pictures
24:22with Ryan Gosling because no matter how good you feel about yourself, like, don't be in
24:28a picture with Ryan Gosling because you will feel worse, right?
24:31Like, like every, like, yeah, there's no weather that his hair doesn't look even better.
24:36Do you know what I'm saying?
24:37It's like, I mean, I think this kid's mad at you.
24:39He's like, why am I in it?
24:40He looks pissed off.
24:41Yeah.
24:42Yeah.
24:43Um, you, uh, we were talking about the show starting in 2016, Stranger Things.
24:46Did you, when did you realize that it had resonated with an audience in a way?
24:51Because again, it's kind of crazy.
24:52You've been in a world with IP as well, right?
24:53Yeah.
24:54Where you're like, this came from nowhere.
24:55This came from the Duffer brothers.
24:56And this was, this was a script that I read in 2014.
25:00Yeah.
25:01And really nobody was interested because the rule back then was you don't make a show
25:05with kids.
25:06It isn't for kids.
25:07Right.
25:08And that opening weekend, I think it was July of 2016.
25:11At that point, Netflix proudly didn't share viewership data.
25:15So I remember that it was literally like online and social media.
25:18And I called up Matt and Ross and I was like, guys, a lot of people seem to be talking about
25:23our show.
25:24And it was like the next day.
25:26And that was my first sense of, oh, this is, this is something unique.
25:31And then it just grew from there over a decade and not just in North America, but kind of
25:36shockingly everywhere.
25:37Did I, I heard that the Duffer brothers nickname for you was the warlock.
25:42This is true.
25:43Which couldn't be negative or positive, but I think they used it in a positive way.
25:47I get that.
25:48No, they did.
25:49And I, I mean, I will confess, I don't know if it's just me, but I think we all really
25:53wish we had a nickname.
25:53Yeah.
25:54Like I remember when I was young, I was like, call me Spike.
25:56Yeah.
25:57And like, but, or like I was a fast runner.
26:00So I was like, they call me flash.
26:02But the truth is like, nobody called me Spike or the flash.
26:06Um, so, but then the most amazing thing happened, like in the middle of my life is I got an organically
26:12earned nickname.
26:13Um, we were making season one of the show and there was a scene where 11 levitates the
26:20Millennium Falcon.
26:21And, you know, you send, you tell Netflix, we need permission.
26:23And they came back and said, no, no permission.
26:26The answer is no, you got to have her levitate something else.
26:28And, uh, and Matt and Ross called me and they're like, do you think there's any way you could
26:33get that answer to change?
26:34And so I, at that point, I did not know Kathleen Kennedy.
26:38I reached out, she was running Lucasfilm and I basically begged and the no became a yes.
26:43And they were like, well, okay.
26:45And then like a few months later, we wanted to use Michael Jackson's thriller in our trailer.
26:50And the answer was a hard pass from Michael Jackson's day and the Duffers called me.
26:55And so I just had this run of weird menial tasks where I turned a no into a yes.
27:02And they started calling me warlock and it's still what they call me.
27:05I mean, it's a really right one to get a late in life nickname and two to get it from
27:09the Duffer brothers who are like great at like building lore.
27:13You know what?
27:13I never thought of it that way.
27:15And, and it's even better than Spike or the flash.
27:18Yeah.
27:18So I feel like I just, I want.
27:20Yes.
27:21Spike and the flash were like famously already taken.
27:23Although if that, if that was a TV show, I would love to watch Spike.
27:27By the way, not all the kids aged.
27:28Well, I can't remember what they looked like in the first season.
27:34This is the photo I wanted to show.
27:35What other gifts do you have to share there?
27:37Just, well, this, I wanted to show a picture of you and your beautiful family.
27:40Uh, so this was, uh, that is my life.
27:42Walk of fame, the Canadian walk of fame.
27:44So this one here, that's the one who loves her, Sethi.
27:46Yep.
27:46Right.
27:47Okay.
27:47Um, and the other four are my four daughters and yeah, there's, um, there is a Canada walk
27:52of fame and they asked if they could honor me with a star on the walk of fame.
27:56Um, but, and it was a fun, a fun night, but the best part is that they had my daughters
28:00present me with the award.
28:02And so, I mean, I think any of us who are parents, like all we want to do is earn a connection
28:09and the respect of our kids.
28:11Yeah.
28:11And I just want to keep earning it for the rest of my life and never bitterly disappointed.
28:17All right.
28:17Well, so I think you're off to a decent start.
28:20So far.
28:20So good.
28:21Thank you so much for being here.
28:22Congrats on the show.
28:23You guys shot me.
28:23These changes things.
28:24We'll be able to stream on Netflix.
28:26We'll be right back with Andrew Ralph Sarko.
28:41Our next guest is an award-winning journalist, author, and co-host of CNBC's Squawk Box.
28:47His book, 1929, Inside the Greatest Crash in Wall Street History and How It Shattered a Nation
28:52is currently a number one New York Times bestseller.
28:55Please welcome to the show my friend, Andrew Ross Sarko, everybody.
29:12Hello.
29:12I'm so happy to see you.
29:14Thank you for having me.
29:14You know, I've been out with you.
29:16I've been lucky enough to be at dinner parties with you.
29:19And as a financial reporter, I've noticed in the time I'm with you that people want to
29:24ask you about financial advice.
29:26Does that happen everywhere you go?
29:28A lot.
29:29Yeah.
29:29Yes.
29:30Are people satisfied with the answers you give them?
29:32Never.
29:33Because you go through an airport and they say NVIDIA or they say Bitcoin or gold or silver.
29:38And I look at them and basically say, I wouldn't be at this airport if I knew the answer.
29:42Right.
29:43Well, that's a good point.
29:44Yeah.
29:45If you're flying domestic or I'm sorry, if you're flying commercial.
29:48Yeah.
29:48They're like, this guy's not as smart as he seems on TV.
29:51Just play one on TV.
29:52But you also are not allowed to, as a financial reporter, you can't actually buy individual
29:58stocks.
29:58True.
29:59So I've never actually bought and sold individual stocks at all.
30:03In fact, as a journalist, the whole point is that I can actually tell you whether such and
30:07such company is good or bad or whatever it is and feel independent.
30:10That's the whole idea.
30:11We have rules, both at CNBC, at The New York Times, about what we can do.
30:16These are rules, by the way, that our government officials, by the way, do not have.
30:21Yes.
30:21At least at this moment.
30:22Well, it's fascinating, too, because, you know, the other difference between you and
30:26the government is they are in meetings where they're actually hearing information earlier
30:30than normal.
30:31Yes.
30:31Than even, yes.
30:32I like to think I'm early.
30:33They're really early.
30:34They're really early.
30:35And not because they have good sources.
30:37They're literally just people are telling them information.
30:39They are the sources.
30:40They're the source.
30:41There's been a bipartisan effort, it should be noted, to try to, you know, put the same
30:45limitations on members of Congress as there are on journalists who cover these fields.
30:51Do you think there's any chance of it passing?
30:53Look, there's been going, people have been talking about trying to do this forever.
30:56And this is something that I think everybody would agree.
30:59Our, you know, our congressmen should not be owning stocks after hearing.
31:03I mean, by the way, there are people, I don't know if you saw this, it's not just the stock
31:08market.
31:09Now there's these prediction markets, Polymarket, Calci.
31:12On Friday of just last week, with this whole situation in Venezuela, somebody made $400,000,
31:18literally betting.
31:19And clearly, I imagine, knew that something was about to happen this weekend.
31:24So, yes, there is a bill on the table right now that would prevent Congress from doing
31:29this.
31:30Basically, everybody's prevented from doing this, except for one person.
31:34Who do you think?
31:35Is this DJT?
31:37Are those the initials?
31:38He lives in 1600 Pennsylvania.
31:40Yeah, yeah, yeah.
31:40So, yeah.
31:41So, he would be effectively off the table.
31:45I mean, he could still trade, do whatever.
31:47Yeah.
31:47Everybody else couldn't.
31:48But for years, people have been talking about trying to do this.
31:51And Congress and the Senate have never wanted to do this to themselves.
31:54I used to actually write columns.
31:56I remember talking to folks at the SEC, which regulates this industry.
32:01By the way, it regulates insider trading.
32:02Yeah.
32:03CEOs, business leaders are not allowed to trade back and forth willy-nilly, especially when
32:08they know information.
32:09That's technically illegal.
32:11And when you go and you talk to the head of the SEC and say, why don't you regulate this?
32:14And why don't you put in some rules and regulations?
32:17They say, guess who funds us?
32:19Yeah, there you go.
32:20Congress.
32:20Yeah.
32:21So, if you follow the money, you can understand everything.
32:24Well, I would like to follow the oil for my next question.
32:27You mentioned Venezuela.
32:28And I think a lot of people have this assumption that maybe what happened this week is based
32:33on the fact that Venezuela is an oil-rich country.
32:38Yet, you know, I think for somebody like a layman like myself, I think that you can just
32:42go in and it's very easy to get the oil.
32:44That is not the case in a country like Venezuela.
32:46Look, I think that whatever we're hearing in terms of headlines out of the White House or
32:51otherwise saying this is going to be some kind of boondoggle for oil companies, they're
32:55all going to go in there, they're going to extract oil, they're going to create cheap
32:57oil for Americans.
32:58This is like a tens of billions of dollar project that would take literally years, potentially
33:06decades, way after President Trump is going to be in office.
33:10Maybe.
33:10And no, but so part of the issue is effectively whoever these oil companies are that may want
33:22to do this, even if they wanted to do this, and it's not even clear they would, because
33:25ultimately, by the way, there's going to be a price tag on all this.
33:29Oil companies actually don't want lower oil prices.
33:32Yeah.
33:32And so increasing the supply of oil, not always helpful.
33:37But I say that because the other piece of this is, if this does take decades, and who
33:42knows what the politics of Venezuela are going to turn out to be, all that uncertainty means
33:48that most oil companies, especially CEOs of publicly traded companies, they don't want
33:52to go in there.
33:53They don't want their employees getting killed.
33:55They don't know what's going to happen.
33:56Yeah.
33:57So this is just, I don't want to say it's a pipe dream, but I think it's a long ways
34:02out until we actually see something like that.
34:04All right.
34:04Well, I take the other side.
34:05I think he has a plan, and we're going to see results fast.
34:11Hey, congratulations.
34:13This book is fantastic.
34:15And it's not the first time that I've read one of your books that is about something
34:18that, you know, I don't feel like I fully understand the economy or anything of that matter.
34:23You write it so that even somebody like me, it's just a thrilling read.
34:29And by the way, it's trying to be like, you're trying to write like a novel.
34:32Yes.
34:32And it reads like a novel because I think sometimes we think these books, you know, we
34:36think about a stock market crash.
34:38We think about, you know, we do think about, you know, the economy.
34:41We think about numbers.
34:42And really, it's about people.
34:43Always.
34:44And it's immediately, you know, introduced us to all these great real life characters.
34:49How soon when you worked on this book did you realize, oh, this, I can write this like
34:53a novel.
34:53I can write this like a page turner because it is a page turner.
34:56So that's what I wanted to do.
34:57And the truth was there have been some amazing books written about this period, but mostly
35:00by economists and people back even in the 50s.
35:02And it wasn't until I actually landed a library and started opening up boxes and seeing transcripts
35:08that the secretary of a leading banker in New York had been keeping during his phone
35:13calls with Roosevelt and Hoover that I thought, okay, you could really do this because
35:18you could put people in the room so they could actually see what was really happening.
35:22I think we all have sort of a perception that something terrible happened in 1929.
35:26There was a stock market crash and then the Great Depression happened.
35:29And that's so not what really happened.
35:31It's such a more intricate, crazy.
35:33It's a drama.
35:34It's a soap opera is what it is.
35:35Yes.
35:35And people are very human in the same way that they're human now.
35:38I think, you know, there's a lot of vanity involved in things like this.
35:43There's a lot of not wanting to admit how bad things are because.
35:46Always.
35:46Yeah.
35:47And so many of the characters are exactly like the people today.
35:50There's a character that's like Jamie Dimon who runs J.P.
35:53Morgan today.
35:54There's a character like Elon Musk.
35:55There's a character that probably you think of as like a Sam Altman kind.
35:59So they're all it's it's it's almost like history does repeat.
36:02And by the way, we had tariffs in 1932.
36:04So.
36:05And how'd they go?
36:07You don't know spoilers.
36:08No spoilers.
36:09No spoilers.
36:10You know, another thing, you know, we talked about trade dropped by 60 percent.
36:14You know, one thing is, I believe Hoover is the one who basically tries to keep telling
36:20the Americans that things are actually better than.
36:22Yes.
36:23They are perceiving it.
36:24This is tested by presidents.
36:26So, you know, and again, like another bipartisan thing is we've, you know, had back to back
36:31presidents, Donald Trump and also, you know, President Biden, who told Americans, you know,
36:35I know you think there's an affordability crisis, but there's actually not.
36:38And ultimately, politicians are in a tough place when they're trying to tell Americans
36:42how much things tell people how they're supposed to feel when they go to the supermarket.
36:47And I think we saw this, by the way, under Biden, as you said, I think we're seeing this
36:51under President Trump.
36:52You know, Hoover was literally trying to put up billboards telling people, literally,
36:56if you just smile and feel good, things will be better.
36:59Now, there wasn't TikTok back then, but, you know, people go to the supermarket today and
37:04you can see them.
37:05They're showing you the price of things and they know how they feel.
37:07And things are, I hate to say, less affordable than we want them to be.
37:12You got into this business as a young man.
37:14How old were you when you first started at The New York Times?
37:17I was 18 years old.
37:18So 18 years old.
37:19And how did you get assigned your first story?
37:21So I was in high school.
37:22I wasn't supposed to be there.
37:24OK.
37:24I had actually talked my way into the building sort of as a pseudo unofficial intern.
37:29But nobody had hired you?
37:31No, no.
37:31I was literally Xeroxing, stapling and getting coffee for a reporter that I was a huge fan
37:36of.
37:36And I was almost just shadowing him.
37:38Got it.
37:39And then there was an editor who overheard me talk about this thing called the Internet.
37:44This is back in 1995.
37:47Yeah.
37:47She thought I was like a real person.
37:49She thought I was like a college grad.
37:51Yeah.
37:51Who was, you know, capable of something.
37:55But she didn't know that I hadn't graduated from high school.
37:58Right.
37:58She assigned me a 500 word story to write.
38:01And is it true that your first story was about the sound modems make?
38:05It was that.
38:06Do people even know what a modem is?
38:09My kids don't know what a modem is.
38:10Do you remember that sort of mating noise?
38:13Yeah, of course.
38:13I mean, that's not how I thought of it, but.
38:17So she had said to me, what is that noise?
38:19Yeah.
38:20And I explained to her, I called it like a mating signal that the two modems.
38:24And she said, oh, that's great.
38:25You should go write that.
38:26Gotcha.
38:26And that's how I started my career.
38:29When did she find out that she'd given the coffee kid an assignment?
38:33Like a week and a half later.
38:35Yeah.
38:35After it was in the paper, happily.
38:37Okay.
38:37Gotcha.
38:38And then your first byline, what was your first story with a byline?
38:42First story with a byline was another esoteric question of the computer age.
38:46Why aren't computers pink?
38:48Okay.
38:49Do you remember how they're always that beigey gray back then?
38:51Yeah.
38:51Yeah.
38:52So that was that article.
38:54And you might appreciate this.
38:57So I go by Andrew Ross Sorkin.
38:59It's a, I don't know if people think it's maybe a little too much, the three name pretentious thing.
39:03But the truth is that came from my, that came from the first byline that I ever had because I, that's my mother's maiden name.
39:12So you can steal my credit card now.
39:14And I had always gone by Andrew Sorkin.
39:16I still do.
39:17I think when I see you, I just say Andrew Sorkin.
39:19But I had had.
39:19And I'm always like, we met.
39:20Stop introducing yourself.
39:24But I had lunch with my grandfather, my mother's father, the day before the article was published.
39:28And he said, Andrew, you got to use your full name in the paper.
39:32This is going to be like our first and last time it'll ever be there.
39:37So.
39:37I mean, I will say Andrew Ross Sorkin is a guy.
39:40I mean, Andrew Sorkin, like, forget about it.
39:41But I'll read a book by Andrew Ross Sorkin.
39:43I mean, this guy, this guy knows what he's doing.
39:45The book's great.
39:46I'm not surprised.
39:47Thanks so much for being here.
39:48Thank you for having me.
39:48It's such a pleasure.
39:49Andrew Ross Sorkin, everybody.
39:511929 is now.
39:53Come join the audience at Late Night live in Studio A.G.
40:08For tickets, head over to LateNightSethTickets.com.
40:11Follow us at Late Night Seth on all social media platforms.
40:15Subscribe to Late Night Seth on YouTube.
40:17Find us online at LateNightSeth.com.
40:19And subscribe to the Late Night Podcast.
40:22Featuring a closer look, guest interviews, and more.
40:25Available wherever you listen to podcasts.
40:35I want to make my guests, Carl Anthony Towns, Sean Levy, Andrew Ross Sorkin, everybody.
40:39Thank you all for watching.
40:40We love you.
40:41I want to make my guests, Carl Anthony Towns, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and I want to make my guests, and
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