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The Traitors Uncloaked Season 4 Episode 03 br EnglishMovie cdrama drama engsub chinesedramaengsub movieshortfull
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00:00Banished and murdered players first, so spoiler alert.
00:03Please make sure you've watched episode three of the traitors before you watch this.
00:07You have been warned.
00:08Coming up on Uncloaked.
00:12Yep, they've got one already.
00:14Banished traitor Hugo is here to talk about being caught out by his fellow players.
00:19Murdered faithful Ben joins us to share his experience of the game.
00:23We have the exclusive moment when Ben came face to face with Hugo and found out who the traitors are.
00:28Plus, the secret traitor is about to be revealed.
00:31We'll be dissecting the mother of all cliffhangers with celebrity traitor Kat Burns and series three faithful turn traitor Charlotte.
00:43Welcome, Kat and Charlotte.
00:45Now, before we get into this, because we've got a lot to talk about, Charlotte, can I ask you about your socks?
00:50Yes.
00:51Look, they say faithful and traitor.
00:54Amazing.
00:55How good.
00:55I love it.
00:56I love them.
00:56Well, I just think it's nice to have one foot representing each of my roles in the cast.
01:02And Kat, I like your traitors.
01:06Now, as traitors, you are used to being in control in the turret.
01:10That's obviously where you do all of your scheming.
01:12But how are Rachel and Stephen feeling in this moment as the secret traitor is about to walk through the door?
01:17No, I'm really jealous because I basically want to go back and be a secret traitor.
01:21I'm really jealous.
01:22That red cloak.
01:24Unbelievable.
01:25Yeah, it looks, it's pretty, it's pretty swish.
01:28Yeah.
01:28As, as my dad would say.
01:31I don't know.
01:32I don't know.
01:33If that was me, I would have just surrendered to the fact that I don't know who it is.
01:36Yeah.
01:36And then each day we get a shortlist, I would just write down or mentally note down who the
01:41shortlist people are.
01:42Exactly.
01:42And then if I live to see the day that I'd get really, really far in, I'd go, right, well,
01:47I could just whittle it down.
01:49It's probably one of these people.
01:51Yeah.
01:51Yeah.
01:51That could be it.
01:52Like, I wouldn't be stressed going, I need to find out, like, who the, who the secret
01:56traitor is.
01:56Because I just, I think that's what Rachel's doing too much.
01:58She's not playing.
01:59Agree.
02:00Remembering that people might be thinking who, like, who's a traitor.
02:03Because no one else is thinking there's a secret traitor.
02:06Because no one else knows there's a secret traitor.
02:07She's, like, watching everybody and I'm like, no, just wait, just chill out.
02:10Yeah.
02:10There's no point.
02:11She's got enough going on.
02:12Yeah, exactly.
02:13She doesn't need to worry about who the secret traitor is as well.
02:15Yeah.
02:16We're going to go on a deep dive with all the theories.
02:17Okay.
02:19I do want to know, though, how did we rate Rachel's attempt to get Stephen to the family
02:24tree to do the shortlist selection?
02:26What, like needing to learn some Latin or something?
02:28Yeah, you speak Latin, don't you?
02:29Yeah, I mean.
02:30And Rhys was like, I'll come.
02:31And she was like, oh, man, get away.
02:34No.
02:34In fact, Rhys left straight away, just left them in the kitchen.
02:37And then Rhys was like, oh, I don't want to go alone.
02:38I don't want to go by myself, come on, guys.
02:40And she was like, oh.
02:40See, I thought that was quite good, that it was a good excuse to get him to the family
02:45tree.
02:45But the bit that really set my teeth on edge a little bit is when she sort of got rid
02:50of Rhys to keep her and Stephen alone now.
02:52Yeah, I don't think she should have done that.
02:54And then I didn't Stephen clock it.
02:55He was like, well, now Rhys will literally know if it comes down, if it's revealed that
03:01the death was done by the family tree.
03:02Let's remind ourselves of that moment when Rachel tries to shake off Rhys.
03:07Such a connection here.
03:10There's a big connection here.
03:12Like, that's very, very dangerous.
03:14Yeah.
03:15Speaking of dangerous.
03:17I've honestly.
03:18I need to give you a heads up on something.
03:21I can go if you want me to go.
03:22I don't mind going.
03:23Will you give me, I want to just.
03:25Of course, of course.
03:26Sorry.
03:26No, don't be daft, don't be daft.
03:28Oh, my God.
03:28See, what's interesting about that is she doesn't say, can you go to Rhys?
03:32He does offer that.
03:34But I still think he'll remember that they were by the family tree together.
03:37If indeed someone spots on the family tree that there's those marks on there.
03:42I think it was bad wording.
03:44Either she should have just waited it out until Rhys left and got bored of looking at
03:48the family tree.
03:50We should say as well, we know Rhys is a faithful at this point because he's been on a murder
03:53shortlist previously.
03:55So how do we think they did, Kat, in terms of selecting the people on the portrait?
04:00Do you think they took too long or?
04:01I don't think she really thought about it because I guess statistically the secret traitor
04:06would have picked one of those nine anyway.
04:08So I would have just put my finger on the painting and just done a line.
04:11Yeah, just smeared it across and just tried to cover the bases.
04:15And then signed Ross.
04:16Yeah.
04:18I think Rachel is very, yeah, very thoughtful and she is thinking.
04:21She does seem quite a good traitor.
04:22I'm thinking if I put my finger in the red paint pot, I'm holding a red glass.
04:27Yeah.
04:27So no one will be able to see that.
04:28And then she goes and washes the glass and washes her finger at the same time.
04:31It is like watching a sort of murder plot happen.
04:33Everything's just down the drain.
04:34Yeah.
04:35Yeah, it's very Agatha Christie, the whole thing.
04:37It is.
04:38What do we make of this pact that Rachel and Stephen made?
04:41The extended hug.
04:42Like, I'm never going to vote for you.
04:44I'm never going to vote for you.
04:45Yeah, too much.
04:46Like, I mean, I can't wait for that to be shown in a flashback moment in like two episodes
04:52I mean, it's really early on in the game.
04:55I think I don't think you should be doing that.
04:57I think Stephen especially has shown that if enough heaters on someone, he will dash them.
05:02So I, if I was Stephen, I would have been like, of course, I'm not voting your name.
05:07Yeah.
05:08And just cross my fingers behind my back.
05:10Yeah.
05:11Because I would have to vote for her if like...
05:14Yeah.
05:14To protect yourself.
05:15Exactly.
05:15You have to.
05:16So I think that was, you know, that was sweet that they did that.
05:19But I don't think that...
05:20I don't think either of them believed it.
05:22No, I agree.
05:22I don't think there was any sincerity from either side.
05:25I think it is so early on and now we're going to meet another secret traitor.
05:29I mean, I honestly, I feel like this with the way Hugo's gone so soon and then the secret traitor,
05:36I could see the traitors at the end being brand new traitors.
05:39Let's talk more about the secret traitor.
05:41I want secret traitor guesses from both of you.
05:44So we know who it isn't because of the murder shortlists.
05:48Yeah.
05:48Rhys, Maz and James are the ones who are left in the game who we know are faithful.
05:53And obviously Nettie, Judy, Ben and Hugo are all gone.
05:56Kat, who do you think it is and why?
05:58At first, I thought it was Jade.
06:02Maybe because I just think she's a queen and that she's really fab and that she'd be great at it.
06:06I also did think it was Ellie because she's a psychologist.
06:14Yeah.
06:14And I just thought that would be amazing for a psychologist.
06:16You should be puppeteering everyone and like using her degree.
06:20Fiona as well, because she keeps saying things that might allude to the fact that she could be one.
06:26Can it be Ross?
06:27It could be Ross.
06:28Oh, it could be Ross.
06:29Should I go really left?
06:30No, Ross is in an absolute sickness.
06:31He's a sweet.
06:32He can't get his words out.
06:33He's just panicked all the time.
06:34Can we briefly understand this Ross Nettie situation of like...
06:39He didn't articulate himself in the best way when probed about it and I think because everyone's just looking at people with a suspicious lens and because he didn't word things the way they wanted him to word things, which is I think just what the game is.
06:54You act differently to me and I think that way is weird and therefore I'm voting for you.
06:58Yeah, so I think for him, he just was like, oh, you know, my plan was just to act like I didn't know her.
07:02And then people are like, your plan?
07:04What do you mean your plan?
07:05What if he is the secret traitor?
07:06I think that would be great if he was.
07:08Kat, obviously, this is a great opportunity to play the game at home.
07:11And this would be your first time playing as a faithful.
07:14How does that feel?
07:16I don't like it.
07:19You want control.
07:20It's not fun.
07:21I don't enjoy it.
07:22No, it's fun.
07:23I think it's actually, it's fun to not know and it's fun to be with the rest of the world and be confused as well.
07:29It's fun to not know who a traitor is without the worry of being murdered.
07:33Exactly.
07:35Okay, now, traitor Hugo and faithful Ben are about to join the conversation.
07:39But first, it's time to find out what happened when they came face to face immediately after leaving the game.
07:49Ben!
07:51How are you?
07:52Yeah, good, mate.
07:53Oh, good to see you, mate.
07:54I'm here.
07:58What I want to know is what happened at breakfast?
08:01Well, we twigged it was you.
08:03And obviously, we did take a moment to say what an excellent, you know, competitor and player you've been.
08:08Right, okay.
08:09How sorely you'd be missed.
08:10So that was definitely the feeling in breakfast.
08:12They were very sad that you weren't there.
08:13Right.
08:14I actually think there's five traitors.
08:17That's what I've written down.
08:18Right.
08:18I've got three little other suspects, but they're my five traitors.
08:22My five traitors are...
08:24Maz.
08:24Yeah.
08:26Amanda.
08:26Yeah.
08:27Ross.
08:28Yeah.
08:29Sam.
08:30Got it.
08:30And you.
08:31Why me?
08:32So you're a barrister.
08:33True.
08:34Right?
08:35We're sitting at the round table, and I'm looking at you.
08:38Now, you're perfect today.
08:40This was you at the round table.
08:44Ah.
08:45As if you couldn't care about anything that was going on.
08:48I was waiting for people to ask questions.
08:51Not once did you cross-examine anybody at the round table.
08:56Right?
08:57And I thought, what is going on here?
09:00Right?
09:00So now I want to know, what were you, a traitor or a faithful?
09:07You are a very canny man.
09:11What are you telling me?
09:12You're a traitor.
09:14A devil.
09:15You're a traitor.
09:17Yes!
09:18Get in there!
09:19Congrats.
09:20Get in there!
09:20And it's because you were on to me, we thought you would never be banished, because you were
09:25never a traitor.
09:27Everyone could see you were faithful, Ben, and that's just a massive compliment to you.
09:31You wore your heart on your sleeve.
09:32You were walking around, trying to find the traitors every day.
09:36Yeah.
09:36So I hope you take it as a compliment.
09:38No, I do.
09:39That you had to be murdered, because you would never be banished.
09:41Yeah.
09:42So, Ben, I bet you want to know who the others were.
09:44Yes, I do.
09:44So, if you reach to your left, sir.
09:49Have a look.
09:49It's in there, the secrets of who the other traitors were.
09:53Oh, this is exciting.
09:55What's it say?
09:56Read it.
09:58Hugo.
09:59Oh, you knew that.
10:05Rachel!
10:08Bloody hell!
10:09Now, why are you so surprised?
10:10Oh, she never changed her demeanour at all.
10:13That has really surprised me.
10:14Now, she is canny and under the radar.
10:16When I saw her in the turret, I had the same reaction as you just did, Ben.
10:21I thought, no way!
10:22Jesus!
10:23You're so under the radar.
10:25Okay, go on.
10:26And?
10:32Stephen!
10:33Stephen!
10:33Only three.
10:34Well, Ross.
10:36What the hell was Ross doing?
10:38Ross is digging himself a hole so deep he could play in Traitors Australia.
10:44I mean, that man is entirely innocent and yet has covered himself in guilt, suspicion.
10:51That's why I thought he was a traitor.
10:55And Traitor Hugo and Faithful Ben are with us now!
10:58Hey!
10:59Thanks for having us.
11:00Welcome.
11:01I have to mention the outfits to start with, guys.
11:03You both look fantastic.
11:05Hugo with the crimson velvet tuxedo.
11:09The lining as well.
11:10Oh, a space-based lining.
11:13And Ben, of course, with the blue.
11:15Midnight blue.
11:16Midnight blue, thank you.
11:17Midnight blue velvet tuxedo.
11:19You look fantastic.
11:20And sometimes it's awkward when you turn up and you're wearing the same thing,
11:22but I think it's really worked for you guys.
11:24Oh, thank you.
11:25Thanks.
11:26Hugo, you're a real Welshman, of course.
11:28Yes.
11:29How does it feel to come face-to-face with Charlotte, the fake Welsh person?
11:33Wow.
11:33Lost me far.
11:35Shumay!
11:36Shumay, Charlotte.
11:38When they started saying that you were Welsh towards the end of your departure,
11:42I was like, what?
11:43You didn't sound Welsh at all.
11:45I don't know.
11:45Maybe it's just, it comes and goes.
11:47What did you make of Charlotte's accent on the show?
11:50It was good.
11:50Yeah, it was good.
11:51Because it was low-key.
11:52It wasn't, you know, sing-songy, beautiful Queen Fiona.
11:55You know what?
11:55It had to be, because although Fiona was everything I ever wanted to channel,
11:59which is like, absolutely amazing, mother of dragons, that kind of thing.
12:04Yeah.
12:04It takes so much energy.
12:06Yeah.
12:06Oh, Charlotte.
12:07Church was in the room with you.
12:09Massively pared back.
12:11Um, Kat, what did you make of Hugo as a traitor?
12:14How do you rate his efforts?
12:16Do you know what?
12:16I think you did a really good job.
12:21Now, can you say that once more without laughing?
12:23No, no, no.
12:25I think the speech was, was, I think, I think it was when you were like, whoever did this
12:33should not be happy with themselves.
12:36Can we just have a moment?
12:37Because Ben, I was next to him yesterday and I was sweating a bit, but that senior gentleman
12:42was giving absolutely everything.
12:44Yeah, yeah.
12:44For the mission he was.
12:45That was a tough mission.
12:46That hill two thirds of the way through.
12:48Whoever has done that is beyond me.
12:50I think everyone went, ooh.
12:56Oh, yeah.
12:57I think it's you, sweetie.
12:59To be fair, though, if you'd done that and been a faithful, it still would have been suspicious.
13:03Like Kaz, I did a Kaz.
13:04That is literally what I said.
13:06I think it's just drawing too much attention to yourself.
13:08You cannot draw attention to yourself.
13:09And because you are a traitor, it was like, nah.
13:12Definitely.
13:12You shot yourself in the foot.
13:13Big stale.
13:14Yeah.
13:14But I was giving you a send-off.
13:17Yeah, mate, you don't need to be so...
13:18It's a funny way to show it, isn't it?
13:19Well, I think it would have been better if you had done it in a smaller group.
13:23When you were just eating or whatever, you could have just been like, oh, do you know what?
13:27Yeah.
13:27Instead of being like, ah!
13:30But you commanded the attention of the room, which I think is always a mistake.
13:34Always.
13:34Yeah.
13:34But halfway through, I thought you've got away with this because you said, didn't Ben do well in the mission and all of that sort of thing?
13:40And people agreed with you.
13:41They went, yeah, he did really well.
13:43And then when you slipped into the second half and went, it's beyond mean.
13:47And you just see, you see a shot of Rachel just going, oh, my God.
13:51I know.
13:52I mean, it's tearing.
13:53Yeah.
13:53Ben, we saw that incredible moment in that clip there where you accuse Hugo of being a traitor before he's revealed it.
14:00Yes.
14:00Literally pointing the finger at him.
14:01Yes.
14:02You're a traitor.
14:03Yes.
14:03How did that make you feel when you found out you were right?
14:05Yes.
14:05Brilliant.
14:06I got him in a winner.
14:07And I knew it was him.
14:09He was sitting at their own table.
14:10And every time I looked at him, he was like this.
14:13I was off duty.
14:14And I thought, what is he playing at?
14:15I was off the clock.
14:16I'm a lawyer, right?
14:17The clock wasn't ready.
14:18And then he was gobbing off left, right and centre to everybody.
14:20And I thought, what are you doing, mate?
14:22I know.
14:23You're definitely a traitor.
14:25Now, obviously, Ben, that was a great accusation of Hugo that we've just seen.
14:28But Hugo, how did that compare to being absolutely railroaded and intensely questioned by Harriet at the round table?
14:36I was chopped off at the ankles.
14:38I was defeated.
14:38I mean, you know, yeah, it was like a machine gun opening up.
14:42And there was just no way back to it.
14:44And fair play to her.
14:46I don't know if she's fallen out with another barrister in the past, perhaps.
14:49May have been the motivation, but the delivery of it, it was like a missile.
14:53But she's hiding that.
14:54So hats off to her or wigs off to her, as we'd say.
14:56Well, let's remind ourselves of that.
14:57Oh, please, let's.
14:58Oh, yes.
15:00It has occurred to me from the moment that I found out that you were a barrister,
15:05that you would be a prime target for the traitors to take out.
15:10You have experience at cross-examination.
15:13You're good at presenting your case.
15:15And you're highly articulate.
15:16So I had in my mind, as I came into breakfast this morning, if you had survived, that really
15:24raised big questions in my mind.
15:28A number of people also said that they were intimidated by your professional position to
15:35take you on.
15:36They are hard backs, as far as I'm concerned.
15:41That was intense pressure.
15:43That must have felt really intense in there.
15:44Yeah, at that point, really.
15:46Yeah, there's not really much you could do about thinking about the exit and how you're
15:49going to get out of there.
15:51I mean, look, that logic, you cannot deny.
15:54As she said, you're either a traitor or the traitors are going to think, well, this guy
15:58eventually is going to do something useful.
16:00So why didn't they get rid of me?
16:02So I had a strategy, which obviously didn't work.
16:05Well, first of all, enjoy the short time you've got there.
16:08Try and do a couple of, you know, mess around a bit.
16:10And second, be chaotic, not slick, because people think a lawyer is going to be really
16:15professional and down the line.
16:16That didn't buy me much time.
16:18And then, and this was just such a moonshot, if I could find a traitor.
16:23I may be one of the only traitors ever on this fantastic show, a traitor genuinely
16:28looking for a traitor, the secret traitor.
16:29Because as you guys know, when you are a traitor, you have to act like a faithful.
16:34So that was a really good headspace to be in, was like looking for one.
16:39Did you have an inkling in that moment with Harriet that you were going toe to toe with
16:43a fellow barrister or ex-barrister as Harriet?
16:46100%.
16:46I thought that she was, yeah, a very senior respected lawyer who we just hadn't crossed
16:52paths.
16:53Or even worse, perhaps she'd sent me a brief and I'd, you know, been against her.
16:57But there was something there that was not on display.
17:00Just in that moment when she said that.
17:01That was motivating her.
17:02Yeah.
17:02But then, as I say, the execution of it was just...
17:05Outstanding.
17:05Yeah.
17:06And she was telling the truth.
17:08But she's kept it a secret, her profession.
17:10Yeah.
17:10Did you consider Heidi yours?
17:12I did.
17:12I did.
17:13But I thought, again, go in there and don't treat it like a court, treat it like a stage.
17:18Yeah.
17:18And I was kind of trying to channel, like, Phantom of the Opera meets, you know, some sort of
17:22slapstick.
17:23Sorry, mate.
17:24Is that right?
17:25There was a wonderful moment in that exchange as well, where you are trying to dig your
17:30way out of this hole as Harriet's speaking.
17:32And you say, well, yeah, a lot of people have mentioned that I've not been cross-examining
17:35anyone at the round table.
17:36And Harriet goes, yeah, I hadn't even considered that.
17:38But yeah, that's also part of my argument against you.
17:41Yeah, well, I'll have that.
17:42Yeah.
17:42Thanks, mate.
17:45Taxi!
17:45Now, obviously, Stephen voted for you at this round table, turned on you very early.
17:50Did you expect that to happen so early in the game?
17:52Look, trade is going to trade, trade, trade, trade, trade.
17:55You've got to just shake it off, shake it off.
17:58The names for traitors, we're all traitors.
18:00Yeah.
18:01Of course.
18:02But he didn't have to.
18:03You know, it's so early on, he could have voted for someone else and it wouldn't be,
18:06I don't think, suspicious to have voted for anyone else.
18:09Yeah.
18:09I think he saw the way it was going.
18:10Yeah, but I think he was panicking.
18:11I think Stephen was actually panicking and he thought to himself, I'm going to join the
18:15Klan and I'm going to vote.
18:16Oh, yeah.
18:16That's a good point.
18:17Because he was under pressure because of the room.
18:18Because he was under pressure.
18:19Because he was in the room.
18:19Right.
18:20So he thought to himself, right, I'm going to vote for you.
18:22Yeah.
18:22Then it takes a bit of pressure off me.
18:24Yeah.
18:24And that's what I think he did.
18:26Yeah.
18:26I got no problem with it.
18:27I mean, the best dressed traitor.
18:29I mean, he was...
18:29Oh, yeah.
18:30And his lovely sort of soft voice.
18:32And then he's the brutal killer.
18:34It's just great.
18:35So, obviously, there was a lot of chat about keeping your behaviour consistent
18:39after the trade selection.
18:41I think we are sat with the absolute queen of staying consistent after the trade selection.
18:46Kat, what do you think Hugo could have done to maybe stay under the radar as you did?
18:51I think jobs play a really big part in the game.
18:55Because I'm a singer and I make vulnerable songs, it's easier for me to...
18:59My disposition to just be naturally calm and quiet.
19:03Because it's hard when you're a traitor, when you know someone is a faithful,
19:06to go for them and say, I think you're a faithful because Vex Mind Zed,
19:09and know that they're going to come back and go, well, I'm not because of X, Y, and Zed.
19:12And you know that they're not.
19:14So, it's easier.
19:15That's why most traitors will sit back because they're like,
19:17I know none of these people are, so I'm just going to...
19:19So, because your job, people would expect you to speak up and say something
19:24because you didn't, that backfired.
19:25So, I think if I was you, I probably would have tried my hardest
19:28to go for people a bit more or say theories a bit more
19:33so that people think that you're actively trying to be in the game and find a traitor.
19:38Ben, I do want to ask you this.
19:39You mentioned that Hugo was one of your five names, as we know.
19:44Well, he was number one.
19:45Is he who you would have gone for at the next round table?
19:48Yes.
19:48Would you have voted for...
19:49Yes, 100%.
19:50Yeah.
19:50Really?
19:50I did, yeah, 100%.
19:52Judy, I changed my mind with Judy, right?
19:56I was actually going to go for Ross, right?
19:59Surprisingly.
20:00But the consensus, the opinion round the table,
20:03I just followed everybody else because everything that was coming out,
20:06I thought, maybe I'm wrong here and it is Judy.
20:08But then it was him.
20:09He was next.
20:10In fact, if I had two votes, I'd have voted him twice.
20:13Well, it's nothing personal, mate.
20:15I would have killed you twice.
20:22Hugo, after you left, after you were banished,
20:25we saw Rachel being quite delighted that you'd been banished.
20:29She maybe said it on two or three occasions, going,
20:31I'm absolutely...
20:31Using the word delighted, I'm absolutely delighted that Hugo's gone.
20:34How does that feel?
20:35Well, I took the opposite meaning.
20:38Okay.
20:38No, and those two, because of the way they're playing it under the radar,
20:44I think they're a very, very well-matched, very good team.
20:47Actually, the three of us, we got on in the turret.
20:50We never really disagreed.
20:52Well, we didn't have much choice.
20:53You thought you got on.
20:54Yeah, yeah, fair enough.
20:56Behind closed doors.
20:57Well, it's the traitors, right?
20:58It is the traitors.
20:59Because I think quite quickly, Rachel was saying,
21:02Hugo will throw me under the bus at the first given opportunity.
21:05Rachel didn't trust you straight away.
21:07I messed that up, because I said I'd throw the secret traitor under the bus
21:11when they came into the thing, and Rachel picked me up and said,
21:13well, you're going to do the same to us.
21:14So, you know, day one, lesson one of diplomacy school.
21:17Yeah.
21:17Don't, you know...
21:19Because you can't trust anyone.
21:21Like, even if you're team traitor or team faithful,
21:23you are really just team you.
21:24Yeah.
21:25You can only really look out for yourself.
21:27I think so.
21:28Ben, I want to talk about your murder a little bit now.
21:30Oh, dear.
21:31What was it like to walk in and see the dreaded envelope on the chair?
21:35Oh, what a nightmare that was, wasn't it?
21:37But there again, I've got to say, I've won by being on that show, right?
21:43Whether I was murdered or not, to be on the show, I've won already.
21:46Yeah.
21:47So, to see the envelope, I knew it was part of the game,
21:50but I was absolutely gutted.
21:52And I knew it was him.
21:53I knew, hands down, it was him.
21:56I don't even know why I'm sitting here.
21:57Oh, mate, come on.
21:59It's because I know your point.
22:00And I was absolutely gutted, but I was thrilled to do the game.
22:04And I think I said that on my exit.
22:06Yeah.
22:07Yeah.
22:07But to be fair, we wouldn't have chosen that shortlist.
22:10And we did have a choice of three.
22:14So, and there were four of us, we know now, that put you in the frame.
22:17So, there was two others you could have picked rather than me.
22:19Yeah.
22:20Or I'm a quarter guilty.
22:23But you were an amazing detective, and that's why I was happy to vote for you.
22:27Because when you asked me sort of four or five questions on the bounce,
22:30I thought, I cannot get anything past this one.
22:32Yeah.
22:33Seriously.
22:33So, you were an amazing sort of detective, investigator character, I think,
22:37picking up on every little thing that was said and done.
22:40And you were so nice, you know, we had to get rid of you,
22:42because you never would have been banished, mate.
22:43Yeah, I know you said that.
22:44That was really kind of you.
22:45That's true.
22:46Do you think this is truthful, or do you think he's dressing it all up as a compliment?
22:48No, I think that bit's truthful, because he actually said that to me.
22:52He says, I don't think you were ever going to get banished.
22:54And I think that came across when they were all speaking at breakfast anyway.
22:58Yeah, I think so.
22:58I really appreciated that.
23:00Yeah.
23:00That's the only thing I'll take is pause it.
23:03Oh, well.
23:05Charlotte, would you have chosen to murder Ben on that shortlist?
23:09Because the rest of the shortlist was Rhys and Maz.
23:11It was Maz's second time, wasn't it?
23:12It was.
23:13On the list of three.
23:13So, to be honest, I'd probably just be like, yeah, okay, two strikes.
23:17Yeah.
23:17But we didn't know in the turret what was the secret traitor thinking to put Maz on twice.
23:23In a way, it protects the secret traitor, because if you keep repetition on the list,
23:28you're not, every time they put a new name on the list, you know they're not the secret
23:33traitor.
23:33Yeah.
23:33So, by repeating it.
23:34Yeah.
23:35It's like three dimensions.
23:36No, I know.
23:37I mean, frankly, we were saying they should have repeated both two.
23:40Yeah.
23:40And then, you know, just changed one.
23:42So, I think that's sensible from them.
23:45I would have got rid of Rhys.
23:46Yeah?
23:47I would have kept you in, Ben.
23:48Yeah.
23:49Oh, you're so lovely.
23:51There we are.
23:51But it was the choice to murder...
23:55I love you, Kat.
23:56Yeah, I love you, too.
23:58I think they went for you, and I may be wrong, Hugo, as well, because you were the most liked
24:03or the one that everyone thought, why would you ever kill Ben?
24:06And it causes the most chaos.
24:08Right, yeah.
24:08Yeah, that's right, an earthquake under the castle, all that kind of thing, and it did,
24:12it did, because it has people looking in every direction, and then they're all snapping
24:15at each other.
24:15Yeah, I totally agree with that, because if I'd have been a traitor, I'd have done the
24:19same.
24:20Yeah.
24:20Absolutely.
24:21I'd have looked at, well, the person that was, I'm not saying I was popular, but the
24:26person that was kind of under the radar that was quite nice, I'd have been dame.
24:30Yeah.
24:30Without a doubt.
24:32Okay, Ben and Hugo, I have to get both of your thoughts on the twist of the century, which
24:36is, of course, the secret traitor, which you were party to at the moment we find out about
24:41the secret traitor, Hugo, but Ben, I mean, you're obviously just finding out about it
24:44as you watch the show go out.
24:46Watch the show, yeah.
24:47Yeah.
24:48We know that Maz is a faithful, but can I get your reasons as to why you suspect the other
24:53players that you put on your list, please, because obviously one of them could be the
24:57secret traitor.
24:58You've got Amanda, who you suspected.
25:00Yeah.
25:01Why do you think she might be a traitor?
25:02Amanda, Amanda, to me, was very, she was very inquisitive.
25:06She was like, eh, like a lawyer, I suppose, or a barrister or detective or something like
25:12that.
25:13She was questioning everything that was going on, and I thought, right, okay, why is
25:17she doing that?
25:17And she was having a go at you quite a lot, wasn't she?
25:20Right?
25:21She's not all about it.
25:22And I thought, right, okay, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here, but
25:25I've still got this 10% about you that I'm not fully covered with.
25:29Yeah.
25:30So that was kind of her.
25:31Such an amazing moment at breakfast as well, when they all start talking about how funny
25:35it would be if there was a secret detective in there.
25:37Yeah.
25:38And she just has to sit there like...
25:40Yeah.
25:42You also suspected Ross.
25:43We know that there was a lot of suspicions around Ross.
25:45Oh, Ross was really...
25:47Is that mainly because of the Nettie situation and how he reacted to it?
25:50Yeah, it was a Nettie situation.
25:52And then if you watch it back when Judy goes, right, now everybody goes, oh, like that.
25:58Ross is, whoa, right?
26:00If you watch his reaction, and I thought, that's a bit over the top.
26:03So that's why I was heading down his route.
26:06Well, I think we can agree that the secret traitor twist is gigantic.
26:10It's one of the biggest twists that's ever been on the show.
26:12Yeah.
26:12Hugo, you referred to it as feeling like middle management.
26:15Yes.
26:16When Claudia told you what was happening.
26:18How did you feel that moment when Claudia let you know that someone else would be feeding
26:23you the shortlist every night?
26:24I wanted a direct report to my queen of darkness.
26:28It was really annoying because I wanted to kill Fiona, for example, because I couldn't
26:33lie to her because she was just like lying to my mum or my bigger sister and I just couldn't
26:37lie to her.
26:38So I wanted her gone.
26:38And just not to have the freedom at all to be dictated to by someone else.
26:43And we couldn't even figure out if the secret traitor was trying to help us or just look
26:48after themselves.
26:48We really were all at sea.
26:50I think they're probably just trying to look after themselves.
26:51I think that makes sense.
26:52I mean, as a lover of the game, it's genius.
26:54It is now three-dimensional traitors, isn't it?
26:57But yeah, in the moment, it was annoying.
26:59And the red cloak.
27:00Like, I'm sorry, but I never thought the green cloak would look inferior.
27:04Yeah.
27:04Oh, thanks.
27:05I want to wear that red cloak.
27:07Yeah.
27:07We now know that the secret traitor is going to rejoin the traitors in the turret.
27:11Yeah.
27:11But you had no idea what was going to happen in the future, whether you would ever know
27:15who the secret traitor is.
27:16Right.
27:16You don't know how it's going to play out.
27:18You don't know whether that hierarchy that you talk about is going to be there sort of
27:20constantly.
27:21Yeah.
27:21Yeah.
27:22So it was completely baffling.
27:24Hugo, what's it like watching Rachel and Stephen navigate the game now you're gone?
27:28Are you going to be rooting for them or will you be delighted if there's a downfall?
27:32No, I wish them all the best.
27:33I think they were playing it absolutely properly and they're both very canny, smart people
27:38and they're both lovely people.
27:40And yeah, we were all traitors together and I would have taken the first opportunity to
27:44knife them in the front with alacrity.
27:47Yeah.
27:47Now we're out of time for part one, but we'll keep chatting over on BBC Sounds.
27:52I'm going to ask Hugo who he would have murdered next and we'll find out if Ben told Claudia
27:57he wanted to be a traitor or a faithful.
27:59Plus there'll be more from Charlotte and Kat.
28:01It's all in your bonus episode of Uncloaked, which you can hear right now.
28:05Just scan the QR code on the screen and listen as you get ready for bed.
28:08I'm back on Wednesday night straight after episode four with all the reactions to that
28:13secret traitor reveal.
28:14It's a huge moment.
28:15Who's it going to be?
28:17Big thanks to Kat, Charlotte, Hugo and Ben and to you at home for watching.
28:21I'm Ed Gamble.
28:22Stay faithful.
28:22Find out who the secret traitor is Wednesday night at 8 on BBC One.
28:30Press red now for match of the day highlights of today's four Premier League games on iPlayer
28:35ahead of the main show at 10.30.
28:37And even in the darkest places, there's still room for hope, understanding and change.
28:41Brand new drama waiting for the out here next.
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