Europe's asylum system is 'broken': Danish immigration minister

DW (English)

Danish Minister for Immigration and Integration Rasmus Stoklund told DW he envisions a new system that helps people in the Third World, close to the conflicts and hardships that prompt people to seek asylum in Europe.

Transcript

00:00Denmark is a small country north of Germany and west of Sweden.

00:04With me is the Danish Minister for Immigration and Integration, Erasmus Stockland.

00:11He visited his German counterpart Alexander Dobrindt.

00:15Minister Stockland Germany's approach now is a turnaround in migration policy.

00:22To be stricter on migration policy, something that has Denmark already done years ago.

00:28What is the main recipe you told your counterpart today?

00:32Well, I haven't told my counterpart any recipes because Germany is doing a good work itself.

00:38And I think it's really important that Germany, as one of the biggest countries of Europe,

00:44is now sending a signal to both the rest of Europe but also to human smugglers and to migrants

00:53considering whether to try to get into Europe, that it's not that easy anymore

00:59and that we have strict rules and regulations and that it will have consequences not to follow them.

01:04So I think it's an important partnership.

01:06And I'm very happy that a big country like Germany now shows some kind of inspiration for the rest of us.

01:15But the image of Denmark is to be strict on migration policy for almost 10 years or over 10 years now.

01:22So what are you actually doing differently?

01:25Your numbers are much lower compared to Germany and also to Sweden.

01:29So what's the difference?

01:31We have done a number of different things.

01:34First of all, we quite a long time ago realized that we wouldn't be able to maintain a high degree of social cohesion

01:44and trust in our society if we accepted a migration from countries where there was too many people

01:50who ended up being unemployed and being criminal.

01:54And that was why we restricted our regulation in a broad number of ways.

02:00Which means that today it's relatively difficult to get access to live in Denmark.

02:07And for that reason we are able to hold the numbers down.

02:12Family reunification is more difficult.

02:14You need to provide for yourself welfare benefits alone and so on.

02:18So your aim is to deter migrants to come to Denmark at all?

02:22So they remain either in Germany or go on to Sweden? Is that also the deal?

02:28No. Our aim is to say that we need a new asylum system in Europe in general.

02:34That is something we've worked a lot with during our presidency in the European Union

02:38because we think that the European asylum system in general is broken.

02:43Today it is human smugglers who are paid a lot of money by migrants with resources that control who get access to Europe.

02:52We don't think that is acceptable and that is why we want to establish a new system

02:57where we can help a lot more people but help them in the third world and help them close to the conflicts around the world

03:05instead of helping a few number of relatively privileged people here in the western part of the world or here in Europe.

03:14You took over your post in September and you are demanding or proposing more repatriation and more returns,

03:21even more re-migration of asylum seekers and migrants from Denmark to their original countries.

03:27You are a social democrat. This sounds for German ears a little bit like far-right policies like the alternative for Germany here,

03:35the opposition party is proposing. So are you actually have the same demands like the far-right here in Germany?

03:44I don't consider it a far-right position. I consider it a very social democratic position because we have built a welfare state

03:53that only exists because people are able to go to work and pay a lot of money in taxes.

04:01And when they pay almost half their income in taxes, they expect something from the society on the other hand.

04:10They expect a welfare system that works. They expect hospitals that work and a good school system and so on.

04:16And they also expect a society that is not dominated by criminality or instability or by people who try to take advantage of it.

04:25And that is why we try to say that, well, we have this welfare model that we appreciate.

04:31We have a high degree of social cohesion and trust. And we want to maintain that.

04:37We won't accept parts of our cities where it's difficult or dangerous even to come.

04:44And we won't accept that people who arrive from the outside, they don't contribute by going to work

04:51or try to push different norms or religious behaviors that we won't accept.

04:57So we try to be relatively strict on these matters.

05:00So remigration is one point. Another point is what is also included now in the European asylum system

05:06is to have asylum procedures directly at the borders of countries of first origin and then to return migrants immediately.

05:15Denmark tried to establish a system to have asylum procedures outside Denmark actually that failed.

05:23Are you still pursuing this path?

05:25We have actually had a lot of focus on that during our presidency,

05:30because if we're able to conclude together with the other member states that we can make lists of safe third countries

05:38and we can make lists with safe countries of origin and so on and also the ability to make return hubs.

05:48That would all in all mean that we would be able to, for instance, make a reception center,

05:52maybe with a couple of other member states of the European Union, where asylum seekers that arrived in Copenhagen,

06:00they then would be sent to and then they would have their case handled there.

06:04And if they were actually were allowed to have asylum, then they would be granted access to live there.

06:14But on the other hand, if they weren't, they would be sent back home.

06:18And that is what we aim to be able to establish because right now we have a system where way too many people come to Europe.

06:27And then even though they are rejected because they don't have any ground for receiving asylum,

06:33they stay anyway. And that is just unacceptable in our view.

06:39Tough migration measures in Denmark were also meant to keep down the race or the rise of far-right or populist right-wing parties.

06:50You are social democrats. The People's Party is still rising.

06:54And in the recent elections, you didn't do well actually in the communal and the local elections.

06:59So is this working? Can you keep right-wing parties low by tough migration policy?

07:07That's a good question, but I'm not a political spectator, a commentator myself.

07:14I'm a politician and I think I should present the policies that I think are the right policies,

07:20the solutions that I think would be the right ones to implement.

07:26And that is our focus. That is to implement policies that we think are right for Denmark.

07:31And we think it is both right and fair to say that people who arrive in Denmark,

07:36they should be able to take care of themselves and they should be able to contribute positively.

07:41And they should also accept that we are a small democracy where men and women are equal

07:47and where religious norms don't play a role in our society in general.

07:50That's something you have in your private life.

07:53And that is our position and that is not altered because of opinion polls that are low or something like that.

08:06Did the German minister somehow indicate that he wants to copy your approach?

08:11Because also in Germany the far right is rising. It's neck to neck in polls with actually the conservatives.

08:17So is he eager to get something from you? How to do it?

08:22I won't refer from my conversations with Alexander. We've had a lot of good conversations

08:27and we look eye to eye on a lot of matters when it comes to this issue of how to control migration

08:36and how to secure that we maintain social cohesion in our societies.

08:43And I think we agree on a lot of things and that is also why Germany and Alexander is a very important partner for us

08:54in the work we are trying to do also during our presidency in the European Union.

08:59Mr. Stocklund, thank you very much for your time.

09:01You're welcome.

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