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The race for clean tech innovation: who will lead the next wave of green growth?
Keeping the global temperature increase below 1.5 degrees will have its challenges, but it is possible, say a number of experts from China and the EU, who discussed the future of green growth at a special Euronews and CGTN debate.
In partnership with CGTN
READ MORE : http://www.euronews.com/2025/12/02/the-race-for-clean-tech-innovation-who-will-lead-the-next-wave-of-green-growth
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Keeping the global temperature increase below 1.5 degrees will have its challenges, but it is possible, say a number of experts from China and the EU, who discussed the future of green growth at a special Euronews and CGTN debate.
In partnership with CGTN
READ MORE : http://www.euronews.com/2025/12/02/the-race-for-clean-tech-innovation-who-will-lead-the-next-wave-of-green-growth
Subscribe to our channel. Euronews is available on Dailymotion in 12 languages
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00:00Hello and welcome to a special joint production from CGTN and Euronews asking who will lead the
00:14next wave of green growth. I'm Wang Guan in Beijing. And I'm Jeremy Wilkes at Euronews in
00:20Brussels. It's great to be with you. In this program, we're debating how the race to deploy
00:25clean technology will unfold. Both China and Europe agree that we're aiming for a sustainable
00:31future. We need to complete the energy transition and we have to build resilience in the face of
00:37climate change. To meet those goals, we need the right mix of technologies, legislation and
00:42cooperation. And in today's world, we can also expect plenty of competition on the road to a
00:48greener planet too. Now to debate the question of who will lead the next wave of green growth,
00:53I'd like to welcome our four panelists. We have Professor Wu Changhua, President of Global Climate
00:59Academy and Chair of the Governing Council of Asia-Pacific Water Forum. And I'd also like to
01:04welcome Karine Vernier, the CEO of InnoEnergy in France. Hello. And another guest from China,
01:12Dr. Ma Jun is Director of the Institute of Public and Environmental Affairs. And I'd like to welcome
01:19Ben Honan, Investment Lead for the Climate Kick, an EU community working on climate innovation.
01:26I'd like to start with an icebreaker question to you, Ben. Is there one green technology that you're
01:33particularly excited about today? Yeah, thanks, Jeremy. We're quite interested in energy storage
01:38at the moment. I mean, all renewable technologies are interesting and the market's evolving quickly.
01:44So we're quite excited for the next couple of years. Professor Wu, the same question. What green
01:49technology excites you the most? Well, at this very moment, I'm looking into the AI-enabled
01:55industrial decarbonisation, which is a fascinating developing at this moment, particularly for China
02:01context. On one side, we do need to decarbonise the industrial emissions as much as possible. But in the
02:07meantime, now we have really fast growing AI capability. So combining the two together,
02:13it's very exciting to see what's going to be unfolding.
02:17Karine, can I come to you with that question? What are you excited about at the moment?
02:22It's extremely difficult to give you just one technology. I followed my two colleagues.
02:28We are looking a lot on storage. We are looking a lot on hydrogen, artificial intelligence also. So
02:39it's a mix of multiple new technologies that are coming to, I would say, to change the world at the end
02:47of the day. Dr. Maju, in the same question, what green technology do you consider the most important
02:52for the moment? Yeah, we continue to track the amazing progress made on renewables and renewable
02:59technology. And I was invited to visit a solar company that developed the so-called
03:06peravoskite solar panels, which can absorb a large amount of sunlight using an extremely thin layer. It means
03:17that it can be stacked upon top of the silicon cells for much higher efficiency. It also means that it
03:25can be painted on top of cars, surface of buildings, or even on sportswares. So the cost will be a lot more affordable.
03:35Cost is very important. Now, let's move on from ambition to action, which was supposed to be
03:43the goal of the recent climate change summit in Berlin, Brazil. Now Ben, if I can go to you first.
03:49Now, COP30 in Brazil just came to a close. And although the final deal was not seen as a success
03:55by many commentators, we did see a lot of coalitions of nations deciding to work together
04:01on environmental problems and clean technologies. What do you read into that trend?
04:06It's quite interesting, actually. It's quite promising to see a total of 80 countries come
04:11together and form a kind of sub-cop coalition, if you like, to talk about the phase out of fossil
04:18fuels. We think that that's a really interesting development and something that really wasn't
04:23part of the conversation two years ago. And it's now front and center, which is really interesting and
04:29something that we often talk about sometimes the higher level agreements at a national
04:34level or at COP itself aren't clear. But if you look below that to what the cities are doing,
04:40to what the industry is planning, then often you can find really interesting points of progress
04:46and some fascinating markets to step into. So we think it's quite interesting. It would have been
04:53nice if it was in the COP agreement itself. But nonetheless, we think sets up very nicely for
04:59for the conversation next year.
05:00Yeah, Corinne, you know, a lot of people said it was a relatively weak COP in terms of the
05:06agreement. We also have the US recommitting to fossil fuels under Trump. We have Canada also rolling back
05:13on climate commitments to allow more oil and gas production. Who do you think is going to lead the
05:19next wave of green growth?
05:20I confirm that we have some move back to the fossil energies. But I would say that
05:30that's not because we have this move back. That's the end of the story for the new energy and the green
05:37the green energy. For me, it will not be led by a single actor. It's about, I would say, four parameters.
05:50The first one is the innovation hub. This is where, from where we will bring some new solutions
05:57on the market, which will be cheaper, easier to implement using less raw materials, being recyclable.
06:05So this innovation part is super important. The second part is the scale up. The scale up because
06:14this is only with giga scale that we are creating the dynamic and that the market appeal for new
06:22technology because the market does not want to take any risk. So you must be at the scale up size.
06:29Then there is a global pan-national industrial alliances, if I can say that,
06:40that will ensure that the whole value chain related to each sector is under control.
06:45And finally, and perhaps it's the more important, the demand, because if there is no demand, you can
06:55generate or produce what you want. There will be no market and so it will be a dead end.
07:02And if you look at that innovation, giga scale alliances and demand, then at the end of the day,
07:10you cannot see one, only one single geography.
07:13Nobody can manage in total auto car key. And so the world must cooperate. And even if it has been a
07:24weak COP, I would say it has been a COP and this is the place where we have to all cooperate.
07:31Thanks for that, Corinne. Now I'll ask the same question to our guest here in Shanghai, China.
07:37Professor Wu, what do you think? Who do you think will lead the next wave of green growth?
07:42Well, I echo very strongly what Corinne just said. I don't think you can single out any
07:47single country that this country will be tasked to lead the next round of green innovation or green
07:53transformation. But even though the COP30 is generally regarded as weak, but there are a lot of
08:00progress as breakthroughs already. On top of that, I think there is a global recognition
08:07that leadership companies in clean energy or green energy, green transition, somehow happens when they
08:14somehow better align national strategy, policy, innovation, scale, as well as actually system
08:22thinking. I think China definitely has made a very strong and convincing case to the international
08:28community that how it's been leading the global clean energy transition. If you look at the scale,
08:34China is definitely the country at this moment on this planet, leading in installments in industrial
08:40value chain and investment, you name it. In the meantime, if you look at the technology capability,
08:45China has been moving up along the innovation curve as well, rather than just catching up. But in the
08:51meantime, investing heavily in new technologies like better storage capabilities. If you look at
09:02ultra-high voltage grid capabilities there as well. And then if you look at the system thinking,
09:09I think China has made a very, very convincing case how it integrates and connects everything. While Europe and
09:16U.S. definitely all each have their own capability and strengths in terms of innovation. But China somehow
09:22manages in terms of really able to put everything together. So literally, China has been connecting
09:30infrastructure, industrial value chain products, technology financing, you name it actually, into one
09:37big green growth engine. And that's where China succeeded so far at this moment. Looking into the next stage,
09:46I think I wouldn't say China will be the only country to lead next to green transition. Rather,
09:51I do see China, Europe, U.S. as well as many other south, you know, developing countries really coming
09:58together. China has its own strength in terms of scaling, in terms of the pace, in terms of affordability,
10:05driving down the cost, industrial capability there. But in the meantime, EU definitely has very strong
10:11capability in terms of investing, you know, innovation, regulation standards, as well as
10:17actually a market there as well. And together, we'll be able to really put in all the resources,
10:22expertise, capabilities together to lead the next round of green transition.
10:27That's interesting. I want to put a question to Marjun about this. We think it's easy to kind of
10:33forget the big picture. The reason we're doing this is to reduce carbon emissions. China has pledged
10:39to cut carbon emissions by 7 to 10 percent from peak levels by 2035, which is its first absolute
10:45reduction target. Do you think that's enough?
10:48Yeah, thank you. First and foremost, yes, this is not just the first time for China to commit to an
10:55absolute emission reduction, but it is also the first time for it to make it cover the whole economy
11:04and also all different kinds of greenhouse gases. So it was a progress made forward. And
11:11for a country with 1.4 billion people, this is not easy because it's still going through that massive
11:23industrialization and urbanization and this energy and economic transition, social economic transition
11:33is not easy. If this target can be achieved, it will bring the single biggest reduction over the
11:40next 10 years globally. I think this absolutely, you know, is important to the global
11:50climate governance, which is in a big, big trouble, you know, due to all kinds of impact.
11:57Could you explain to me a little bit about how those targets are set? What's the thinking
12:03inside China and about the numbers? How do you arrive at those percentages?
12:07To set this target, Chinese government have assembled a whole group of experts from
12:16all different kind of ministries and industries to try to do their research,
12:24of course, based on all the baseline and accounting and modeling and try to come up with a
12:31with a figure, you know, that with a target that as Chenghua mentioned, which can align the climate action
12:40or with the social economic development target. And partially, you know, this is to meet with China's
12:51global responsibility. But partially, this is also about how to, you know, continue to, through the green
12:59transformation, create benefits to the Chinese people. You know, without that, it can be even more
13:09difficult for the society to accept, you know, this policy, climate policy. And furthermore, we also, of course,
13:20we all need to recognize that the NDCs submitted by all the more than 110 countries put together are not
13:31enough to limit temperature below 1.5 degrees. That means that we all need to do more if we don't want to
13:40fail the Paris agreement target. So China's NDC actually left the space, made space for that.
13:55And because it said 10%, you know, it said that we will try to do better. And so 10% should not be
14:07considered as the sailing for China's emission reduction. And I think partially, it's about culture.
14:14Culturally, China tends to set targets that can be over delivered. While the West, Western countries tend to set
14:23more ambitious targets, so as to stimulate more efforts to achieve as much as possible. So there's some difference
14:33there. But trust me that I think in China, all the stakeholders will make their efforts to try to bend the curve faster.
14:43Guan, let's move over to talking about innovation, cooperation and digitalization.
14:48That is very important. I'm so glad you brought this up. I mean, digitalization is the go-to topic here.
14:55We talk about the green technology here in China and elsewhere. For that matter, let me turn to our guests
15:02in your Korean. If I can ask you about this, the digital economy is a key engine for a sustainable future.
15:09In areas such as artificial intelligence for smart grids, digitalization of industries and green fintech,
15:16will we see more cooperation or more fragmentation between China and Europe? What do you think?
15:23So first, I think that clearly, indeed, the digital economy is a key engine for sustainable future.
15:32is and will be more and more a key engine. I think that it's a factor for more cooperation,
15:42not more fragmentation, more cooperation. Because at the end of the day, everybody is winning with the
15:50digitalization and artificial intelligence because we are able to create, I would say, leaner, more efficient
15:59and lower energy production systems. So at the end, we are all winning with this kind of new tools.
16:10And just give you two examples. If we imagine that we are able to share in between China and Europe, digital
16:20twins, for example, in industry, then it means that we will all be able to partner to co-develop new platforms and factories. And we will accelerate the
16:34the duplication, the launching of new large projects in terms of industry. And then we will decarbonize the industry and the world. So it's one good
16:47topic for cooperation to share digital twins.
16:51But Karine, let me ask you real quick, if I can jump in here, do you see geopolitics, I mean, geopolitical headwinds, as potential
17:04the digital sharing, digital economy from realising its fullest potentials, when it comes to cooperation between China and Europe?
17:12I don't think so, because I think that this is a solution, more than a blocking point. Why? Because if everybody is putting some
17:26border mechanisms to block the import from other countries, we will all lose the time for the
17:37planet and also the capacity to have global market exchange all over the world. And this is from the very first
17:45beginning of the world, the basis of our relationship in between the people and the countries. So sharing digital
17:54twins is not about sharing some extremely strategic in terms of defence topics, it's just about sharing
18:06the know how and being able to build value in the in all the geographies. So for me, it's a factor of
18:15acceleration and cooperation, not a blocking point.
18:19A question for Professor Wu. Following on from what Karine had to say, we know there is a kind of tension in innovation between
18:28developing homegrown intellectual property and then collaborating across borders to grow new technology. What would you say
18:36are the biggest barriers to collaboration between countries on green tech? Is it, as we were just saying, a lot of it kind of to do with
18:45with what's in the minds of people rather than the reality on the ground? What's your take?
18:49That's a very important question at this moment of time. IPR or intellectual property right is not a new
18:58issue. It has always been there, right? Somebody created some kind of technologies, their proprietary rights,
19:05and that needs to be protected. But somehow today we are talking about this issue because we're talking
19:11about, you know, fighting climate change, sustainability. So green technology somehow sits in the intersection
19:18of all the sort of saga landscape, actually, all the complexity, complex issues and dimensions there.
19:24I do like Karine's example. I think the digital change definitely should be one of the examples, actually,
19:32in terms of how countries cross border collaboration, because there are technology capabilities in terms of
19:39to somehow de-risk, you know, the specific data, protect the privacy, and protect, you know,
19:47whatever the rights that needs to be protected. But in the meantime, the digital trends, the tools,
19:52instruments definitely can be shared that could be used, actually, to play a much bigger role,
19:59you know, for better benefits there. Now, back to your question. Unfortunately, we do face a lot of
20:05barriers when green technologies actually are concerned today. One is a trust issue. We do not trust each
20:14other that much these days. That has become a major barrier because, unfortunately, you know,
20:20the industrial policies and national security somehow they've been combined together. You know,
20:26we literally, we do not trust each other. We cannot really share that much, actually,
20:31from technology perspective. If you look at timing, different countries geographies actually have
20:37different ways of handling intellectual property. China definitely has been sort of demonstrating
20:44its capability in terms of really industrializing technologies as quickly as possible to achieve
20:50scale to reduce the cost. But then if you look at the EU and the US, the US is pretty much venture
20:56capital, sort of the driven innovation, you know, cutting edge technologies there. The EU has very
21:03strong regulatory context there, right? And so the pace is pretty much different. Now, in order to
21:10cooperate, actually, so we're, in many cases, we're not really in a sync or in the same step,
21:16actually, with each other. That's challenging. Now, in terms of standards, I think that there's this
21:22sort of fragmentation, actually, we face all over the place these days. And even on the carbon
21:28counting standards there, yes, we have started to have international standards like the ISSB.
21:34EU has its own disclosure, carbon disclosure standard. China is moving up there as well.
21:39But somehow today, we are still facing challenges in terms of how do we account, actually, carbon
21:45emissions, carbon footprints there. That needs to be addressed. And very lastly, I do think,
21:52actually, the geopolitical factor is a big one. And somehow, if we do not address the trust issue,
22:00and if we continue to let the geopolitical saga, interrupting everything, actually, today,
22:06we know for sure, even though we have technologies these days, to address climate change, to advance
22:12or accelerate the green transition or clean energy transition, somehow, we wouldn't be able to achieve
22:17that because we wouldn't be able to get to the scale, get to the pace that's needed to do so.
22:24So that's pretty much the harsh reality we're living in.
22:27Yeah, we do need to harmonize standards and protocols and coordinate policies in order to lower those
22:34barriers of cooperation between China and Europe. Now, Mr. Majun, let me ask you, can you give us some
22:40examples of digitalization actually making a difference for the better, of course, and to helping
22:48to drive down emissions or at least to stabilize emissions?
22:52Absolutely. Yeah. Over the past 12 years, we have witnessed how digitalization helped to
23:01cut China's air and water emission and enhance the quality of the environment.
23:06And, you know, China initiated the Clean Air Action Plan and then Clean Water Action Plan. It's all
23:12started from massive monitoring and disclosure. So with all this monitoring, tens of thousands of
23:21monitoring stations which reported sulfur and PM2.5 and ozone every hour, and then with all these tens of
23:35thousands of automatic monitoring installed on the smokestacks of the factories, which have them to
23:45report it to the public about their air emission every hour as well. This allows a digital solution to be
23:55developed to track the performance of regions and industries and factories and also create a real
24:03accountability based on the multi-stakeholder governance, you know, through public oversight and government
24:13enforcement and also market-based solutions like green supply chain and green finance. The efficiency is
24:20much, much higher. And through this process, the China's carbon emission, we're talking, you know,
24:27you asked about the example of emission reduction. China's sulfur dioxide emission
24:36at the beginning was, you know, 12 years ago, that was 20 million tons. And in just 10 years of time,
24:45it came down to 2.4 million. And nitrogen also cut by half and PM as well. So as a result,
24:54the Beijing, which used to be dubbed as the capital of smog, you know, CSPM 2.5 drop, you know,
25:03level dropped from 89.5 micrograms in 2013 to 30.5 last year. And so on the stoffer side, you know, on the air
25:16emission side, we have seen a massive reduction already enabled by the, through the digitalization.
25:23And now, you know, in China, the carbon accounting, as Chang Huang mentioned, you know, carbon accounting,
25:30you know, on scope one, two, three are being developed and, and required. And, and also, you know,
25:36we have also rolled out our own digital solutions, which can help even small and medium sized companies
25:44to do their carbon accounting in a more cost effective way. So those who use the digital
25:50solutions to measure and set targets have already saved, achieved reduction of millions of tons of,
25:59of carbon emission. That's very interesting. Let me come to Ben, because climate scientists tell us
26:05we need to have a 5% drop in emissions every year, if we want to stabilize global warming. China is still
26:12a huge emitter, but its emissions seem to be flat or they're falling now. What's behind that? What do you
26:17read into that? From your point of view, Ben? Yeah, I think, first of all, a massive congratulations to
26:24China. That's been a heavy lift. And the first step is always the hardest. I read a quite promising
26:31signal into that. And I think it's a very interesting market signal towards Europe that China is well
26:39planned and well committed to its decarbonization journey. And in there is a lot of market opportunity.
26:45There's what we always say where there's emissions, there's opportunities. And I think that that's a big
26:51signal for big business in Europe and for European politicians that the game is afoot. Decarbonization
26:59is the future and it's time to get moving faster. And in some ways it's a race, but it's a positive
27:06race because it's one where everybody wins. We get clean air, cheap electricity, better quality food.
27:12You know, it sounds like quite a nice kind of future scenario to me. So I'm quite pleased with
27:19that achievement. I think it's excellent and really looking forward to how that can increase and ratchet
27:25over time so that we can blow past the 5% reduction and start to talk about, you know, 15, 20% year
27:32over year reductions. That's when things get really interesting. Ben, for people in other parts of the
27:38world, outside Europe or China, what do you think are the lessons and the kind of models perhaps they
27:43should be following then? Yeah, I think, Professor, we mentioned before systems thinking is really
27:48important. So this idea that you can't just have one particular silver bullet option or one particular
27:55technology is not going to win the day. What you really need is a whole market development engine
28:01that quite deliberately looks at the regulation that's in place, that influences consumer demand,
28:07that works with the big industrial incumbents on decarbonisation and really build an ecosystem
28:12of players. So the message to the world, I think, would be like maybe let's let up on this unicorn
28:19narrative a little bit and instead focus on the market development side of things. How can we change
28:25the way that the market operates? How do we focus on these reporting standards? These kind of mundane
28:30things sort of sit below most people's headline attention, but they're really important to
28:36building a strong and innovative ecosystem. So that's the message if you want to follow in the
28:42footsteps of Europe and in China, then start to think about how you can change your system.
28:48Thanks so much for sharing, Ben. I'm sure China has a lot to learn from our European partners and
28:53friends as well. Now, Jeremy, let's move on now to discuss the most promising technologies. Perhaps
28:59they're already here with us like solar or perhaps they're just around the corner or just coming
29:04on stream like hydrogen, nuclear or large scale renewable energy storage. Yeah, absolutely. Ben,
29:12we come back to you about what you're talking about, unicorns, the fact that we have this kind of
29:16tendency to focus on one particular technology. But we've already kind of at the beginning highlighted
29:23a few. Are there some that you really think have a great deal of potential right now that we
29:28should spend a lot of time concentrating on and investing in now because they are ready to go
29:36and will really make a difference? I think there are quite a number of things that are
29:41well discussed around the value of renewable energy and the rollout and scaling challenge. I would
29:48kind of more interestingly these days talk about the role of artificial intelligence in
29:53decarbonizing some really tricky industrial processes. I think that that's where we can
29:58potentially find some really interesting breakthrough options in the next year or two.
30:03We have a really interesting change in the way that we can solve problems and the way that we can
30:10set about experimenting as well in digital twin models. So I'm quite interested and would like more
30:16people to be looking at AI not so much in the chatbot sense but very much in the sense of how can we use
30:21AI for experimentation in industrial processes like nitrogen fixing or energy production? How do we use it for
30:28biomedical processes and how can we use it to optimize our food and fiber systems? There's a lot of really
30:36complicated real world challenges that are wrapped up in decarbonization. I think we tend to think about
30:42electricity production but we also have to tackle transportation, we have to tackle food production,
30:48there are a lot of different very technical processes that I think applied AI is really very
30:55interesting for finding some breakthrough solutions. So that's what I would like the conversation to shift
31:00towards a little bit less about solar panels and unicorns and a little bit more how do we get into
31:04these deep tech industrial processes. Now Professor Wu, I'm curious to know if you think
31:10there are emerging European technologies that you believe China should embrace and adopt more often
31:17and more widely. Definitely there are plenty. I think even though China has been demonstrating its
31:23leadership in terms of you know accelerating the clean energy transition particular from this you know
31:29manufacturing capability, industrial value chain and you know installation stuff like that but from really
31:36technology perspective we still have a lot to learn from Europe. I've been looking into some key areas,
31:43dimensions there. The firstly actually it's really about the industrial efficiency, deeper
31:48industrial efficiency. Of course now we have the AI, AI definitely is adding to that picture as well but if you look at the
31:55for instance the high pressure, high temperature, you know heat pump for steel, chemical processes, you know Europe
32:04definitely has been leading that. If you look at the energy perspective, integrated you know grid,
32:10integrate smart grid integration and the flexibility systems and because China in many many ways is still
32:17strong in terms of a large scale you know centralized sort of energy system but in Europe actually they are
32:25very good at a distributed model in order to do so actually. So this integrations flexible system is very,
32:32very key so there's a lot China should learn. The third dimension is really about the circularity
32:38and the material science there. Yes even though China has been really moving ahead with you know factory
32:44recycling everything like that but if you look at the technologies you know how to recycle technologies
32:50for higher value I think Europe definitely is much much stronger actually than China in many many ways
32:56and then if you look at hydrogen you know Europe definitely has been leading breakthroughs in terms
33:02of green hydrogen. I think China of course is trying to catch up in that area as well but definitely
33:07Europe has been leading. So those are probably around the climate mitigation energy transition perspective.
33:14Now coming on board actually is also the other side about adaptation resilience there. So then for
33:20this nature-based solutions or nature positive solutions if you look at the peatland you know
33:26restorations there, urban resilience, so China definitely needs to learn a lot from Europe. Now particularly
33:34China has submitted its first adaptation action plan to its NDCs to COP30 and so now we have a plan we need to
33:43deploy to make sure we have technology solutions there. In that area I do think China EU share a lot. So China
33:50can learn more from Europe from that perspective. Thank you for that, that's very interesting. I mean
33:55what's going through my mind though as I listen to you is that we're going to need a lot of power,
34:00we're going to need a lot of energy. Karine can I come to you, where's the energy going to come from?
34:05I would say let's do the link with the geopolitical topics. If you look at the geopolitical topics at the
34:14end of the end of the day, it's about raw materials. And so my view is that we have to create some new way of
34:22producing energy and that not consume too much raw materials. So recycling, for example, or that consume raw materials that
34:34are well spread all over the world. And that will avoid a lot of problems. So there is no one magic solution for everybody everywhere.
34:44Once again, I think that it's about a mix with a strong focus on the end of the chain, which is to how we recycle the products.
34:56But today, my view is that if we bet on a way of producing that are not using to concentrate raw materials, we will have the key for the future.
35:11Thanks so much for sharing, Karine. Now, Mr. Ma, let me ask you about fossil fuels, because it has been around with us and they
35:20probably will be in the foreseeable future. We just saw with COP30 in Brazil how difficult it is just to reach consensus on
35:28moving away from fossil fuels entirely. So how would you characterize China's path, which is unique to decarbonization today?
35:38Thank you. Yeah. At COP30, you know, in Berlin, I also, you know, personally witnessed how difficult it is to reach, you know, to even
35:49reiterate the Dubai consensus, you know, the Dubai agreement on transitioning away from fossil fuel.
36:01I mean, even that could not be put into the final document for COP30, because this issue now, it's so challenging.
36:15And to me, you know, I think, you know, the failure, partially at least, can be anticipated, can be expected, because from COP29 to COP30, there's not enough discussion about the commitment made in Dubai in COP28.
36:44on the, on tripling the renewable capacity. You know, the world come together to agree with that. But unfortunately, there was not, there was no, not enough discussion about how to actually implement that, you know.
37:03But among all the countries, China stood out, you know, with this massive investment and deployment on the renewable energy. I mean, that is absolutely mind boggling. You know, China achieved the 2030 target on renewables last year, six years earlier. And on the solar power alone, you know, we just rolled out and launched our new report.
37:32In the, which titled 1000 gigawatts of solar power. But even before we can publish our report, the capacity already reached 1100 giga. And, and the installation capacity,
37:50the power generation capacity, the power generation capacity, the power generation capacity, 100 times. And China's capacity equals the, the rest of the top nine countries put together. And along with this renewable energy transition, it's, you know, China's also make,
38:12spare no efforts to, on electrification. China's electrifying its economy nine times faster than the rest of the world. So this combination of energy transition plus electrifying, electrification, you know, set a clear path, not just toward carbon picking,
38:40carbon picking, but carbon neutrality. So, so I think,
38:45Can I ask you about, I mean, we've talked a lot about how China's achieved things, but how do we kind of, how do you see the way that we're governing shared challenges, the way that we're managing things here in Europe? What's the kind of perspective from China on the European governance of how we're trying to roll out these green technologies?
39:06technologies? And in the way that you're talking about? What's, what's the view from, from Beijing?
39:11Yeah, you know, I absolutely agree with all the rest of the distinguished guests, you know, which, which could, you know, repeatedly, repeated this word, this term of collaboration, and working together. So I think, you know, both EU and China, are they clear, you know, global, you know, they have the ambition to be global leaders.
39:40leaders to, to deal with climate change, and both have the capacity, and resources and innovative power, to try to be the leader, be leaders. And if the two, but, and, and as, as the guest all mentioned, you know, each have its own advantage, EU also have a lot of advantages.
40:05And as, as, as, as Changhua mentioned, you know, on the circular economy side, on the, you know, recycling side, you know, we have so much to learn from EU. But on the renewable side, now, you know, over the past 10 years, China gradually, you know, develop some, some more innovative solutions.
40:23innovative solutions. So if the two can really come to work together, I think that will be a blessing, not just to our two regions, countries, our two sides, but also, it will be a blessing to the, to the entire world, particularly to those least developed countries.
40:43that, which we all need to think about, even, you know, in, in Africa, we have hundreds of millions, still denied for the basic access to power electricity.
40:55Ben, we see the EU winding back green deal commitments with its simplification packages, and we have the carbon border adjustment mechanism on the horizon in the year 2026.
41:07Do you think the EU's path towards the green tag, its path forward is fully understood, is actually clear to those outside Brussels?
41:17Yeah, I think it speaks to just how complex the challenge of taking climate action seriously really is, right?
41:24And I think the bigger picture in Europe is that consumers are very forward on climate action, that politicians, by and large, are very forward on climate action.
41:33SMEs and industrial players are as well.
41:36But when you really face the facts of what it means to transition at the speed that we're talking about,
41:42you end up in some really uncomfortable situations that are very costly and honestly quite painful.
41:48So I think what's happening in Europe is a bit of a course correction, a bit of a bump in the road.
41:54I think the bigger transition is still very much underway.
41:57I've not heard anybody backing off from the message in Brussels around sustainability and competitiveness being the future for Europe.
42:05I think there's some discussion around how we do that well and how we do that efficiently and how we do that in good partnership with industry in particular.
42:14So I think it's definitely a setback.
42:17The omnibus vote was a real disappointment.
42:20But I think if you take a step back from the cut and thrust day to day actions in Brussels and look at the bigger trends,
42:27then for sure there's not that much shifting in Europe that we're still very much interested in a future economy that's sustainable,
42:35that's just and has a nice place to live for all of the citizens of Europe and indeed around the world.
42:42Yeah, thanks, Ben. I mean, here in Euronews, of course, we're monitoring what we hear from the European Commission all the time.
42:49A question for Karine. The European Commission wants to boost production and recycling of rare earths in Europe to reduce the dependency on China.
42:58Do you think that's a wise move?
43:01I don't like the end of the question, in fact, because it's not to reduce dependency on China.
43:07It's to be able to produce in our own geography. And that's the point.
43:14The partnership with China is clearly on the table.
43:18And we like, we love working with Chinese when it's question to implement production units in Europe.
43:26So there is no way from European people to, no will from European people to stop the cooperation with the Chinese.
43:37And as it has been said just previously, China has a lot of things to create value in Europe.
43:47And on the contrary, we have a lot to bring to bring as Europeans to China.
43:53So it's all about a partnership. And the question is around the balance.
43:59And my view is that once again, the cooperation will be key.
44:04For example, if you look at PV, today, China has the know-how in how to produce cells and modules.
44:12But we cannot, as Europeans, consider that we can only buy all the products to China.
44:19So we have to produce in our territory, not meaning that we want to produce without Chinese.
44:25So that's the key point. So let's not misunderstand or create some fight where it's not a question to have some.
44:35Thanks for these clarifications, Corinne.
44:38Now, Professor Wu, do you think China and Europe can find immediate common ground on things like rare earth and critical raw materials
44:46and show that effective global governance is actually possible?
44:50The short answer is absolutely yes.
44:53Yes. I think partly, as Corinne mentioned, you know, this is one of the areas EU-China already been working together.
45:00But somehow we do have some hurdles, challenges that we need to figure out how to remove or lower the hurdles in order to achieve the scaling or accelerate it to actually transition there.
45:11Now, back to the bilateral on the rare earth issues.
45:15I think there are a few ways of looking at this particular issue.
45:18The first point, actually, I want to emphasize, actually, both sides share the vulnerability.
45:25So, you know, if you like the narrative, actually, China is using this sort of a secured supply chain sort of narrative.
45:35EU side actually is using the phrase like, you know, strategic autonomy.
45:41If you look at the underlying narrative there, it's pretty much the same thing.
45:45We all expect to have, you know, the predictability and we do need to have, you know, the security.
45:55We have to make sure they are produced responsibly there as well.
45:59So from that perspective, actually, I think we do need to understand, you know, we share the vulnerability.
46:05The second point I want to emphasize is that I think it's all understood really, really well.
46:12Cooperation is much cheaper, actually, than the confrontation, particularly from the rare earth perspective.
46:20And if we work together, you know, if we actually go alone, let me put that way.
46:26If we go alone, actually, we all know the cost to rise.
46:29The barriers started to rise and basically the transition will be slow, much, much slower.
46:37And also geopolitical part actually will be much deeper.
46:40And that's not the scenario we want to, you know, all get into.
46:45Rather, if we really work together, we'll be able to really invest in each other,
46:50investing in responsible, green, sustainable mining, refinery, as well as manufacturing there as well.
46:57The third point I do want to emphasize, I think a rare earth probably offers one of the best opportunity
47:03or test a bet to see how the two largest economies in the world can really work together,
47:09joining our forces to continue to lead a global clean energy transition to fight climate change.
47:16And on the positive side, I think we started to see, you know,
47:20for instance, we're all addressing, you know, investing heavily in transparency, disclosure,
47:25and invest, for instance, by diversity in nature, and also actually a drastic transition there as well.
47:33So there are positive signals already or focuses already, the two parts already, you know,
47:40the two sides already taking steps.
47:42And that's where I think this global governance comes in.
47:46And so we already have the foundation.
47:48Somehow we need to further opening up to each other and trying to figure out actually
47:53how to invest in global governance to make sure, you know, we work, we work together, go together,
48:00benefit from, you know, in that process, respectively.
48:04But in the meantime, really accelerating global clean energy transition.
48:08Thanks very much for that.
48:10And we're going to wrap things up soon.
48:12But I just wanted to come with a final question to everybody.
48:15Maybe I can come to Corinne first.
48:17We talked a lot about who will lead and where.
48:20What's one change that you'd make now to accelerate the deployment of green technologies?
48:27To accelerate the deployment.
48:30It's to create the fair conditions of market, of competition in each territory.
48:38Meaning that if we want to go, if we consider Europe, for sure, there is place for Chinese products in Europe.
48:49That's not a question.
48:51For sure, there is place for Europe, European products or energy made in Europe.
48:59And if we cooperate, there is room for everybody.
49:02And that's the point in all the discussion we had on the artificial intelligence, raw materials, recycling.
49:12And everything is linked or climate adaptation.
49:18Everything is linked to a proper cooperation and a well-balanced cooperation.
49:24So my point is, let's not focus on what is not going well.
49:28Let's focus on what is going well.
49:30We are totally able to cooperate.
49:33We are industrial.
49:35We are not doing politics.
49:37And so that's probably the key to succeed on the ground.
49:42Let's work all together and we will change the world.
49:46Together we will change the world.
49:48On that note, let me ask you, Majun, what is one change you would like to see happening to accelerate the green transition?
49:55I think, you know, very much agree with the Korean and we need collaboration and we need to have a healthy competition.
50:06You know, competition is not a problem.
50:08You know, market competition actually motivate change and enhance the whole efficiency and create values.
50:15And I think we need to focus on those solutions that give values, not, you know, that's the other side of the coin.
50:25We should not just try to, you know, only set all this target with all this, you know, troubling global climate governance.
50:35Only setting those ambitious targets is not enough.
50:38We need to tap into the technologies, the AI and renewable and all this and try to create real good solutions.
50:48Professor Wu, can we come to you with the same question about a change you'd make now to accelerate the deployment of green technologies?
50:56I like, you know, both Korean and Majun's point, but in the meantime, I would like to go further to the root cause.
51:03The one thing I would like to see change is literally to fix the trust infrastructure.
51:11Fundamentally, if we do not manage to address that, all the aspirations we now we have on the table or the targets, the commitments wouldn't be able to be delivered very successfully.
51:22So I will go for fix the trust infrastructure.
51:26Now, Ben, you have the final words.
51:28Yeah, I agree. It's very important that we work on the governance and trust relationship all around the world.
51:36And I think that's very interesting change that's possible in the very near future as data infrastructure comes online and the advent of artificial intelligence makes collaboration easier.
51:47So I would certainly echo that if I could change one thing, it would be the way that we choose to trust one another and the way that we choose to collaborate with each other.
51:57I think that could be a really significant shift in accelerating the clean transition, but more importantly, creating a nice future for us all to live in and enjoy.
52:07Now, on that note, I want to thank everyone for an insightful discussion on the practical pathways for China EU cooperation on green growth.
52:15There's clearly a lot of potential ahead to create a more sustainable future for our planet, a more synergy between China and Europe.
52:23My thanks to our media partner, Euronews, to Jeremy and to our guests.
52:28Thank you, Guan. I think we've highlighted many shared interests.
52:32You're totally right and shared challenges ahead.
52:34Thanks also to CGTN and to our guests.
52:37We'll see you soon.
52:38Thank you and see you soon.
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