- 6 days ago
Jason Segel, Brett Goldstein and Bill Lawrence talk about finding comedy in grief and how their own therapists feel about the new show.
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00:00Get out of here.
00:02This is my office.
00:04It took you longer than it should have.
00:14Okay, well, thank you guys both for doing this.
00:17I think, like most good ideas, this one started at a pub. Is that right?
00:22So take me back. It was you and Bill initially.
00:26Yeah, and we were working on sort of separate ideas that were about grief,
00:33sort of a comedy about grief and about therapy.
00:38I think my version was much darker and his version was possibly lighter.
00:42And we were talking about it and we were like, actually, you put these together,
00:45this is the right tone for this show.
00:47What's the darker version?
00:49A lot more murder.
00:51And then we, I mean, the thing with it, we had dream people and he was the dream.
00:59And I don't know if you know Jason Segel, but he's fantastic.
01:04But he also has like a quite special quality that, I mean, he's here.
01:09It's a couple of years.
01:11But he's so sort of, he's fucking funny and he's a very good dramatic actor,
01:16but he also has like an inherent empathetic, sympathetic, vulnerability, emotion.
01:21Like, you just love him. I just love him.
01:25That's so sweet.
01:26And it meant that with this character, it's like, you can take him quite far
01:30into making the wrong, doing the wrong thing or making bad decisions.
01:34And as an audience, I think you just love him and you, and it means you can push it quite far.
01:39And he has all that inherent vulnerability.
01:42And so we, we FaceTimed with him thinking no chance.
01:46And then, and I remember being like, I wasn't sure how it had gone.
01:49After, after, after we sort of pitched him, would you like to be involved?
01:53And then the day later he said, yeah.
01:55And we were like, fuck yes.
01:57What do you mean, how often, what are the incoming calls look like now?
02:00I mean, you, you write so much of your, your own stuff.
02:03So what do the incoming calls look like?
02:05And how did this sort of compare to the ones that have come in recent years?
02:10Yeah, this was a really interesting situation.
02:12Cause I do write a lot of what I do, but maybe a year and a half ago, two years ago,
02:17I got a cold call from Bill Lawrence, who said that he wanted to try to make a show together.
02:21And we had met really briefly like 10 years ago.
02:24Okay.
02:25So that's a really dreamy call to get.
02:26And also I feel like, uh, Bill is really amazing at what he does.
02:30And there's a Venn diagram overlap of our two styles that I thought would work really well together.
02:36Uh, and so then, you know, you never know if anything's going to come of it.
02:40And we pitched back and forth a couple ideas.
02:44And then he came to me with Brett.
02:46And I was really excited, uh, because I think Brett is the best at what he does as well.
02:51And, uh, that's true.
02:53And, um, and then they pitched me this idea and it felt like,
02:58it felt like the real wheelhouse of what I wanted to do if I was going to make another TV comedy.
03:04Cause I, I did one for like nine years, a really, really long time.
03:08And I thought, okay, I've kind of had that experience, but this was, um,
03:12um, this beautiful mix of drama and comedy.
03:16And I think that making people laugh through tragedy is like, uh, it's my favorite form of comedy.
03:22Even for getting Sarah Marshall, when I was like 25 years old,
03:26that was like as dramatic a thing as you might go through at that age, losing your girlfriend,
03:30like your heart's broken and all that stuff.
03:32And, um, I think like the full frontal nudity and for getting Sarah Marshall is the best I could do it.
03:38Like raw vulnerability.
03:40Yup.
03:41And then this was, uh, what if we do the grownup version of that?
03:44What if you, what if someone is mourning the loss of something that they will never get back?
03:49Uh, but it's, it's real stakes and it's, it's grownup feelings.
03:52And, uh, combine that with like Pratt Falls and an amazing comedy cast, it just felt like perfect.
03:59Do you have, I mean, as you just noted, you were on a sitcom for, for nine years.
04:04Do you have, what are the sort of questions that you have, perhaps concerns, hesitations that you have going into something again?
04:13How do you make that decision?
04:14Yeah.
04:15The concerns I have, but television has changed are about repetition.
04:19Yup.
04:20The nature of a sitcom from the era we did that is that you're supposed to be able to,
04:23you're supposed to make syndication, uh, so that you can then check in to any episode.
04:28Yup.
04:29It's like comfort food.
04:31Yup.
04:32It makes sense, you know, no matter when you turn, tune in.
04:35And, uh, I had the same concern about movies.
04:38It became repetition, like something does well.
04:40And then you do like decreasing versions of that.
04:43Uh huh.
04:44Uh, this was really different.
04:46It is a five hour story with a beginning, a middle and end.
04:49And you watch these people have really fully realized arcs and not just my character,
04:54which has a beautiful arc, but like everyone, they did an amazing job of like every character
04:59has a fully realized journey.
05:01And so it felt like, uh, I felt lucky.
05:04Uh huh.
05:05Uh huh.
05:06So this FaceTime that you weren't so sure was, uh, went so well.
05:09What, uh, what do you remember from it?
05:11Did you walk away feeling like it went well?
05:13Well, I don't like lie, you know what I mean?
05:17And so I don't sit there the whole time like, oh, I'm, I love it.
05:21I love it.
05:22I want, I was really listening.
05:24Uh huh.
05:25And then I do this thing that maybe is, uh, not the smartest thing career wise.
05:30Uh huh.
05:31But I then like take some time to think if I'm actually the best person to play the part.
05:35Uh huh.
05:36And sometimes I have been offered things that I like would have loved to do, but I tell
05:41them like, I don't think I'm the best guy for it.
05:43Interesting.
05:44I think somebody else might be able to do it.
05:45With people around you saying like you're, you're being an idiot.
05:47You're just, you're just taken.
05:48Yeah.
05:49Because I try to imagine playing it and if I got the, if it is, if it will make what
05:53they're trying to do the best version of it.
05:55Uh huh.
05:56Because I make stuff too.
05:57Uh huh.
05:58And so I know that you, like whoever's pitching you the thing wants their thing to be great.
06:02Yep.
06:03Uh, but this one I felt like, um, like kind of like Liam Neeson in Taken when he says
06:08I have a unique skill set.
06:10I felt like this used a lot of what I can do.
06:14Uh huh.
06:15And the world of therapy.
06:16Yeah.
06:17You all sort of came to this idea of like this is a world that is going to be sort of
06:20right for, for stories.
06:22Um, I think Bill has said you guys are all shrinked up.
06:25Yeah.
06:26I think it's his terminology, uh, if I have that correct.
06:29What is it that you wanted to explore there?
06:33Where did you think that you could take this?
06:34Where did you think you couldn't take it?
06:36I think therapy, listen, we're all fans of therapy.
06:39I would recommend anyone who has access to it does it.
06:44Uh, I mean, we're all crazy and we would have been much more crazy without it.
06:49And, uh, but I also think it's such an interesting relationship, such a unique relationship between
06:55a therapist and their patient.
06:57It's like so intimate and they know everything and it can go on for years and years and years
07:02of your life.
07:03And yet, and yet, and yet there's these boundaries.
07:06You don't really know about them and you know, you paying them.
07:10It's such a unique and strange relationship.
07:12And also they're of course people and they have their own problems in their own life.
07:16So that I think there's drama and comedy inherent in that relationship.
07:21And I think there's a slight element of like wish fulfillment in this show in terms of,
07:26I think some people would love their therapist to shake it and say, here's what you need to do.
07:31Yeah.
07:32Uh, but I also think as much as we play around with the edges of it, we'll just take it very seriously.
07:38We didn't want to ever disrespect therapy.
07:41We had so many consultants and therapists checking everything.
07:44We didn't, and we didn't want it to be a joke about therapy.
07:48It's, it's within the bounds of exploring it without being stupid.
07:54Do you prepare your own therapists for, uh, for a project like this?
07:58I told my own therapist, uh, when we were starting to write and prep, like, I just want you to know some of these sessions,
08:05I'm going to be just looking at you and you're going to feel a very different energy.
08:10Uh, and how did your therapist take this and did your sessions then change as a result?
08:15Exactly.
08:16Yeah.
08:17Uh, I think he loved it.
08:18I think the funny thing, like unintentional segue, I think like one of the things that the, uh, show kind of reminds you of,
08:27it's easy to view your therapist as just an authority figure, but they're just like a flawed human being.
08:33Yep.
08:34So I imagine my therapist felt a flush of pride.
08:37Uh huh.
08:38Yeah.
08:39Oh, I'm going to watch it.
08:40I wonder if I'll see little bits of myself, you know?
08:42Right.
08:43No, I think that that is, that is totally right.
08:45So your character in this also, you know, goes, I mean, when, when the show opens,
08:50it is obviously sort of very broken.
08:53Um, I think it's fair to call him sort of a mess.
08:56Sure.
08:57Um, and, and you see this, this amazing sort of evolution.
09:01I guess I'm curious as an actor, sort of the, the playing that initial broken guy,
09:08sitting outside, you know, with all sorts of drugs and women and what, is that, is that easier or harder to play?
09:16I guess the question is really sort of where are you most comfortable?
09:20What is the, what are the hardest parts?
09:22What are the, uh, most comfortable parts for you to explore?
09:27Those parts are actually very comfortable to explore because I think that we all have our versions of rock bottom.
09:33Yep.
09:34And we may have experienced the loss of somebody.
09:37We may have just felt really bad.
09:39You know what I mean?
09:40Like everyone knows this feeling of rock bottom of, I don't know if I can take this much more and it can't get any worse.
09:46That part I actually find really fun to explore because, uh, you're not falling down in your, the only way to go is up.
09:56So rock bottom is this exercise in watching someone crawl their way up, which is inherently funny.
10:01They have no roadmap.
10:02It's dark.
10:03You know, how the hell do I get out of here?
10:05I think the biggest challenge I've always felt for acting is trying not to show off.
10:11It's like as that camera is inching closer and closer to you, your instinct is like, oh, now's my moment.
10:17Like now I, now I really show them.
10:19Yep.
10:20Go big as possible.
10:21Yeah.
10:22And it's like really the exact opposite.
10:24Um, to try to just stay honest when that camera's getting closer and closer, I think is the really fun challenge.
10:31You talked at the beginning about this idea of sort of emotional vulnerability.
10:34And I'm curious sort of as you are writing this show and presumably you, you know, you, you are sort of asking each other, we've got to keep pushing.
10:43We've got to keep pushing.
10:44We've got to keep pushing.
10:45Where is that line?
10:46And, and what are those conversations like?
10:48What felt like perhaps it could be too far and, and sort of veers outside of being funny anymore?
10:55It's such a process that is every stage of it in the scripts, in the shooting, in the edit, that you're, and I guess it's instinctual, but you're moving the knob.
11:06So sometimes you're like, this is too funny. It's now too silly that we won't take it seriously.
11:11Or this is so depressing. We're never going to laugh again.
11:14And, and it changes, you know, you think you've nailed it a script, but then when you're on set, I think sometimes you're like, I think this is too heavy or could we be lighter or could you be heavier with it?
11:23And same again in the edit, but it's, it's very marginal sometimes.
11:28And I also think the writers room, my experience with all the writers room I've been in, which is Ted Lassar and this one is it's like group therapy.
11:36You've got a lot of people sharing their trauma and you go, and, and all of it is the emotion of it.
11:43You take from, from everyone's vulnerability, everything is added into it.
11:46So I don't know if you can calculate if it just comes, but you know it as well.
11:52Like you, you, you get it.
11:55Are there times, what were the moments where you either dialed back or pushed harder?
12:00Well, what's neat about film acting as opposed to theater is that you get to decide after the fact.
12:07And so my kind of strategy going in is always to try to provide a range when you're doing the scene.
12:14Like you don't really know what the scene is until you get there and you don't know what your co-star is going to do.
12:20And, uh, the dialogue is great and you have a, maybe a plan, but then you realize, Oh, it doesn't know this plan means nothing.
12:27You know what I mean?
12:28And so I just think it's a really neat place where you're exploring, like what happens over here, what happens over here, what happens over here.
12:35And hopefully by the time you then get into edit, you get to kind of pick and choose based on doing the same thing with all the scenes around it.
12:43It's like the last stage of writing. You get to write again, you know, in the edit.
12:47Yeah, yeah, yeah. And casting the show. So, so you, so you get Jason and then you have this idea of, Oh, I'm going to try Harrison Ford.
12:55Um, which feels like the biggest pipe dream in the entire world. So I, yeah, take me back to even the conversations around that.
13:02And what gave you guys, I think it was like a joke.
13:06Yeah. Like it was like, obviously not Harrison Ford, but someone like Harrison Ford.
13:11Yes. You offer it to someone like Harrison Ford. This is my experience.
13:15So that like for a week you can say out loud, Oh, we're out to Harrison Ford.
13:19Yeah. And then you will go to the real person.
13:21You go to the person you can actually get. Yeah.
13:23And then Brett heroically like.
13:25Well, I was in London and he was filming Indiana Jones and, uh, and he, it was just the maddest day where I just suddenly get a missed call.
13:35And it's, Hey, it's Harrison Ford. And I was like, what the fuck is happening?
13:38And so, okay. So, so actually, so you, so you, you meet him, you FaceTime him.
13:42I met him. He, he, it's a long story, but the short version is I went to his apartment, uh, to discuss it.
13:51And the discussion was very, very quick because he immediately, he was just so fucking great. He wanted to do it.
13:58I thought there'd be like, I'd have to convince him.
14:01Yup. You're pitching. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
14:02There was no pitching. He was like, I love it.
14:04Do you go like, are you sweating and just, Oh yeah.
14:07Oh yeah. Okay.
14:08I'm like, I'm going to meet Indiana fucking giants. This is nuts.
14:10And, uh, he was so lovely and he, and what I found really fascinating about him, but of course, cause he's just a very good actor.
14:18There's a, uh, quote in the Mike Nichols biography where he talks about him in working girl.
14:23And he says that Harrison Ford was amazing because he's like, tell me how to serve the story.
14:28He wasn't a diva. He's not a, and when I met him, he wanted to talk about how the cat, he had thoughts about how the character dressed.
14:36He wanted to talk about all the things that related to his life. Like he was an actor, you know, he was like a working actor.
14:41He was like, I see this and this is what, what I would like to bring to it and tell me about the rest of it.
14:46It wasn't all just, how do I shine? It was like, what's the thing? And you see him in it.
14:51Like it's an, it's Jason Segel and an ensemble and, and he is fucking brilliant, but he's in the ensemble.
14:58It's not, he's not stealing. He's not, it's fantastic.
15:01He said this thing to me when we were shooting where he does something really amazing.
15:05From the moment he arrives, it's very generous. He makes you feel like a peer.
15:10He like breaks down that you're supposed to be in awe of me thing real fast.
15:14How does he do it?
15:16Uh, with this sense of, uh, like they're, he's a craftsman. It's, you know, he used to be a carpenter.
15:22He said this thing to me, um, I've been hired to build a house and all I want is that when we're finished,
15:30the people who hired me are happy with the house. And, uh, that's pretty cool.
15:36Yeah. You know?
15:38Yeah. Uh huh.
15:39Yeah. He's just there to, he's, he's been hired to help like build someone's dream home. Metaphorically.
15:45Yeah. You know?
15:46Oh, I love that. And then once you actually, so at that point, how much of the show do you have when you're, when you're pitching him?
15:51He read two scripts.
15:52He read two.
15:53And he is not yet a huge piece of it, certainly not in the pilot.
15:57He becomes obviously.
15:58No, no. Yeah.
15:59And how much of that is because you got him and how much are you sort of writing to the folks that you've cast?
16:05You end up writing always. It's the thing that Bill Lawrence said early on when I worked for him and he's completely right,
16:12is usually by the latest episode five, the actors have become their characters and they sort of take ownership of them.
16:20And it becomes easier to write because you now know their voices and you're excited to write for Harrison Ford, for Jason,
16:27you know what they sound like, you know how they're doing this.
16:29And so yeah, I mean, we had a plan, we knew what the season was, but yeah, everything evolves and changes once you're working with these fucking amazing actors.
16:39I mean, the whole cast is insane.
16:41It's an incredible ensemble.
16:42Yeah.
16:43My last Harrison question is, as you're writing, I think it is episode six, which is, which is an amazing episode.
16:52But like, I'm curious sort of what handing over a script to Harrison where you're like, you're going to be, you know, eating your tie, among other things.
17:00Uh, well, I'm not going to spoil it any, any more, but I'm curious sort of what, what that process is, where you sort of think you can take him?
17:10Are there places that, that you're not sure you can take him? How do you?
17:13I have a reflection on that.
17:14Yeah.
17:15I just remember, so you're doing your best with what you think someone might be good at or how they would want it to go.
17:24Right.
17:25And so initially your kind of thought is, okay, you're going to write Harrison Ford gruff and everyone will do comedy around him and he will kind of respond grufffully to people being funny.
17:40And around a couple episodes before, and then that episode, you're like, oh, he's doing moves.
17:46Like Harrison Ford's here to make comedy, not to react to comedy.
17:51And I think that for me then, like, I just started to realize like, oh, this is, this guy's a powerhouse.
17:58Mm-hmm.
17:59Uh-huh, I know.
18:00My, my experience when I would, cause I just couldn't believe we got him the whole time.
18:05Yeah.
18:06And no one ever, I don't think anybody, I don't think even on episode 10, I still think there was crew and everyone just going, how the fuck is Harrison Ford?
18:12I know.
18:13I kept thinking that when the announcement came, it would say like, in a strange mood, Harrison Ford.
18:19Yeah.
18:20But I felt when I watched the read through of the pilot, which was amazing, I could see in his eyes, like, glee.
18:27Like I was like, oh, he hasn't done a big comedy.
18:29No.
18:30Like, he's fucking excited to be, being funny.
18:33And when he was getting big laughs in the room, it was like, I was like, oh, this is new for him.
18:37This is fucking, and he's so funny.
18:39Right.
18:40And to have something that does feel new at sort of that stage of your career must be actually quite thrilling.
18:45I think all of us have parts of ourselves that we think are unseen.
18:50Uh-huh.
18:51You know, and we would like to have known.
18:53All right.
18:54What, what is that part of yourself, Jason?
18:56Let's turn this into.
18:57I actually try to tackle that.
18:58Uh-huh.
18:59How I Met Your Mother ended.
19:00Um, I, for the first time since like, I mean, Freaks and Geeks started when I was like 19 years old.
19:06Yep.
19:07And I kind of went straight through and I made a bunch of romantic comedies.
19:10At the end of that run, I was like, oh, this is the first time I get to choose something.
19:15I get to like figure it out.
19:17And do I keep doing what I've been doing until like that train eventually hits a wall?
19:21Though it would have been, I assume, quite lucrative.
19:23Yeah.
19:24Yup.
19:25Who knows?
19:26But I just thought to myself, like, you have the experience of people sitting around at
19:30dinner parties being like, well, if I had directed The Revenant, I would.
19:34Right.
19:35Yup.
19:36Yup.
19:37And I just like, I never want to be that guy about any of the things.
19:38Uh-huh.
19:39I wanted to find out if I could do dramas.
19:40I wanted to figure out if I could write.
19:42I wanted to figure out if I could show run, all of these like different things.
19:45And you try them to various degrees of success and failure.
19:48But I think it like exercises some of the things that like keep you up at night.
19:52Yeah.
19:53Sure.
19:54Do you have a version of that too?
19:56Of things, things?
19:58Yeah.
19:59This idea of sort of the pieces of you that have not yet been seen, but you'd love to
20:03sort of be able to explore through work and out of that.
20:06I always wanted to be a stuntman.
20:07So I guess I would.
20:08Is that true?
20:09Yeah, it's true.
20:10Yeah.
20:11You'd be great at it.
20:12Thanks, man.
20:13Yeah.
20:14He's really strong.
20:15I'm a big strong boy.
20:16Yeah.
20:17No, I mean really strong.
20:19I love it.
20:21I'd like to do jumping out of things.
20:26Yeah.
20:27Just jumping out of things.
20:28He jumps so high.
20:30This is great.
20:31No, I mean really high.
20:32Really high.
20:33Yeah.
20:34You also, I mean, I think you talked at the beginning of this.
20:41I'm just imagining it.
20:43You can't.
20:44I can't actually imagine.
20:45You think you're imagining it?
20:47You're not imagining it.
20:48It's so high.
20:49And he went for winning time.
20:50Yeah, that's right.
20:51It's so high jumping.
20:52So in this, in the room you're also exploring, you're taking stories from, versions of stories
21:00from your own life.
21:01You sort of talked about it being a version of group therapy.
21:04I think you've said your dad is a version of the Harrison character.
21:09But I imagine all of you are taking versions of yourself.
21:12What have you sort of borrowed from your own worlds?
21:15Is that then, what does it actually feel like to then see it come back to you on screen?
21:21Yeah.
21:22The acting that I've always responded to most is like the, this is gonna sound like a joke,
21:27but it's really not sadly, is like the Kermit the Frog school.
21:30Like Kermit the Frog, Tom Hanks, Jimmy Stewart, these guys who are like, I am you for this story.
21:37Imagine, I'll do the work for us, you know?
21:40And so I guess it's all, for me, it all feels sort of like me.
21:45It's the, how do I relate to what's happening in these scripts?
21:49And that's the part I need to put out, you know?
21:52Yeah.
21:53It's all of it.
21:54Yeah.
21:55This is why I love him.
21:56Yeah.
21:57He wants to be Kermit the Frog.
21:58So badly.
21:59Don't we all?
22:00Yeah.
22:01What are the pieces of you that, that found its way into the show?
22:04Oh, I mean, it's interesting when you, when you, we're talking about this show
22:10and we've been often asked this thing of like tone and like, how hard is it to make a funny show
22:17about grief and stuff like that.
22:18And I, I always think like, that's how I feel every day.
22:21Like that is life.
22:22Yeah.
22:23Like, my experience of, I sort of have this, I hate, I don't like to be negative,
22:32but the one thing I hate in film and TV is when you watch something that is just grim, grim, grim, depressing,
22:37and has no light, no light in it, no humor.
22:40I always think that's badly made art.
22:43I'm like, you didn't watch life.
22:44Like, that isn't how it is.
22:46Like, you read people who survived the Holocaust, they talk about laughing.
22:49Yeah.
22:50It happens.
22:51Do you know what I mean?
22:52Like, people in war zones, they make jokes.
22:54It isn't real to not have that in it.
22:56So, I don't know.
22:58That's just, all of that goes into it.
23:00Sure.
23:01It's just instinctual life experience.
23:04Yeah.
23:05So, when you were making Ted Lasso, I think, if I have this right, you were like five episodes
23:08in, and that's when you really felt like, oh, I am Roy Kent.
23:12Yeah.
23:13And I think.
23:14That's right.
23:15Sort of pitched yourself for it.
23:17Yeah.
23:18I'm curious, as you were writing this one, did you ever have, I know schedules didn't allow
23:22you to be in this one, but did you have any, any of that with any of these characters
23:28Oh, these characters.
23:29Or another.
23:30I thought, I did think.
23:31A way into this world.
23:32I did think I could have been Harrison Ford, but I was like, no.
23:35No.
23:36I think it's pretty good.
23:37No, I never, I, I, I never went into this project sort of thinking that.
23:42I, I think, I don't know.
23:44Some, some projects you've, everything feels different.
23:47This just felt like I was writing for these guys and I was very happy with that.
23:51It didn't, it didn't occur to me on this one to put myself away.
23:54Is it a different exercise to then write in where you don't have to be in it?
23:57You don't have to then say the lines.
23:59Is there a freedom in that?
24:00I don't, I don't know if you feel this way.
24:03I don't really think there's much difference between writing and acting.
24:06It's just that one happens behind closed doors and one happens on camera.
24:09Because in both, they're both the same brain.
24:12They're both like, how do I feel?
24:15What, what, what am I trying to do?
24:17Where am I?
24:18How am I relating to the people in this room?
24:20Like, it's this, you're just imagining it when you're writing, but it's still the same.
24:24I agree.
24:25You do.
24:26You do.
24:27I do.
24:28It was, well, when Judd Apatow kind of mentored me, us, one of the things he said was if you
24:36can improv like this, you can write.
24:38There's just a skill set you have to learn.
24:40You have to learn structure, which is a real thing, you know, but beyond that, you're just
24:44improv-ing all these characters.
24:45Yeah.
24:46Interesting.
24:47And you have-
24:48You kind of act it, when you're writing it, you find, you know, you're, you can make,
24:53it's an awful thing to say, but it, I can't say.
24:56You can make yourself cry writing a scene because you're kind of acting the crying,
25:01you know what I mean?
25:02Uh-huh.
25:03Yeah.
25:04And also we have other stuff going on.
25:05Yeah.
25:06Emotionally.
25:07I was really-
25:08It's the scenes.
25:09But it's writing.
25:10At the time we were writing, I wasn't able to jump as high as I saw, and that made me sad,
25:14so-
25:15So the tears are just streaming down, got it.
25:17There's nothing to do in the scene.
25:18Nothing.
25:19Writing also makes me so hungry.
25:21And so you were, this was a, became sort of a night gig, and by day you were-
25:28Yes, I was, because of the way the timings lined up, I was in London doing Ted Lasso,
25:35and this, so this was happening night time, my time.
25:39He is a crazy workaholic.
25:41Like, I've said, uh, hey, I just finished writing something, I would love for you to
25:45read it sometime.
25:46And he's like, sure, send it to me.
25:47And you send it thinking like, in a few weeks he'll get back to me, and then like an hour
25:51later it's like, I think it's great.
25:53It's, it's really intense and amazing.
25:55I love it.
25:56Yeah.
25:57Even the idea of writing not for yourself.
25:59I, I write also, but I find it so hard.
26:03Like just, it's so much work.
26:05Yeah.
26:06I can't imagine like putting out the effort not to be in it.
26:10Hmm.
26:11Oh, it's interesting.
26:12Well, I'm a fad night.
26:13Yeah, well.
26:14The idea of then not actually acting, that-
26:17It's like two or three years of your life.
26:18Sure, sure.
26:19You know what I mean?
26:20You think of this idea, I don't know when you, you and Bill thought of it, but-
26:23Long time back.
26:24Yeah.
26:25Long time back.
26:26You put a lot into it.
26:27It's like pushing this boulder up a hill.
26:28So you might as well also acting.
26:29Yeah.
26:30Yeah.
26:31I mean, don't get me wrong.
26:33I fucking love it when I do it.
26:34I really want them to be in it.
26:36Yeah?
26:37Yeah.
26:38If we get future seasons, I really want them to be in it.
26:39Are you, are you willing to commit to that?
26:41On camera?
26:42Right here, right now?
26:43Yeah.
26:44Yes.
26:45I would like, of course I'd love to play with these people.
26:47Um, I love it.
26:48Have you started to think about what, what the future of this looks like?
26:51Is that something you have all mapped out?
26:54Can't say.
26:55In a dream world, yes, we have.
26:57You've already done all of it.
26:58It's all been written and it's ready to go?
27:00Yeah.
27:01Got it.
27:02We did it last night.
27:03It's all ready.
27:04Yeah.
27:05He said, can you read the script?
27:06I said, just let me finish the fucking season.
27:09Um, what were the, I mean, as you sort of look back on the filming of this, what were
27:14the sort of the, the, the high points for, for you all?
27:18What, uh, what are the, what were the moments that, that you sort of remember whether they
27:22made it on camera or, or they didn't.
27:25So you change into your wardrobe very quickly when you arrive.
27:30Uh huh.
27:31Uh, and so I started like thinking, it's makes no sense for me to waste energy picking
27:36out an outfit for the beginning of the day.
27:38Uh huh.
27:39I started wearing just like a jumpsuit, you know?
27:41Uh huh.
27:42But I didn't have the guts to show up when someone else might see me.
27:45So I would intentionally show up like 30 minutes before my call time.
27:48Uh huh.
27:49Just sneak into my trailer and put on my wardrobe.
27:50Uh, and the first day I like worked up my courage and then I got there early and Harrison
27:55Ford was waiting outside my trailer to run lines.
27:57Oh my God.
27:58I didn't see that coming.
27:59So we started talking and he kept like eyeballing my jumpsuit.
28:03Uh huh.
28:04Uh huh.
28:05He would like talk to me but he kept looking down at it.
28:07And I said, uh, you checking out my flight suit, Harrison?
28:10And he said, I sure am, kid.
28:12And I felt really embarrassed.
28:13Uh huh.
28:14Like, I don't know why.
28:15But the next day I showed up and Harrison Ford was wearing a matching jumpsuit.
28:20Oh.
28:21And now we're best friends.
28:22And now you're best friends.
28:24Yeah, how about that?
28:25I love that.
28:26Oh, I absolutely love that.
28:29Um, and you weren't on set so you probably-
28:31I'll tell you what was the treat for me is, uh, because I wasn't there so I would watch
28:35rushes at night and there would be like Easter egg like treats because they did a lot of improv
28:41and they're very funny people so there'd be stuff.
28:43I wasn't there when it was generated and like just fucking extra bits that would make me laugh
28:49out loud because I didn't know they were coming, you know.
28:51Uh huh.
28:52And every night it would be like Christmas like, oh, what extras am I going to today?
28:56It's fucking great.
28:57How much- I mean, how much improvising was actually done on set?
29:00I mean, you have Jessica who's obviously-
29:02Well, the writing was impeccable.
29:03Yep.
29:04So, like, you had the writing to rely on and you always make sure that you get it.
29:09And then also though, this damn stuff is happening.
29:13Yeah.
29:14You know, and I am like a big proponent of paying attention to that stuff.
29:19I'm like, oh, she said that word weird.
29:22Uh huh.
29:23I'm not going to like pretend that didn't happen.
29:24Uh huh.
29:25I'm going to say something about it and like all of a sudden you have this little aside.
29:28But I have this like really special magical feeling about acting on film is that you're trying to catch something.
29:34Uh huh.
29:35I really appreciate the repetition of it and it's important.
29:38But I think the moments I generally respond to are when you feel like the camera caught something electric, you know?
29:44Yeah.
29:45What's on the cutting room floor that you wish people could see?
29:50Hmm.
29:51Or an ideal.
29:52And it may not have been filmed.
29:53It could have also been an idea.
29:54You know what's mostly on the cutting room floor, truthfully, is sort of bits of exposition that you're like,
29:59we didn't need this.
30:00Yes.
30:01We didn't need to spell this out.
30:02It's clear.
30:03I think the stuff I love is, is in it.
30:06I think it's the stuff we're missing.
30:07I gotta give credit to Bill Lawrence.
30:09He is an incredible editor because some, this thing will happen where, uh, the cut will come in and it's like 52 minutes.
30:17Uh huh.
30:18And you're like, oh no.
30:19Oh no.
30:20Uh huh.
30:21And then like a week later, he'll say, here's one that's 32 minutes.
30:25I promise you, you won't know what I cut.
30:27Hmm.
30:28And then you watch it and it's true.
30:29I truly don't know what he cut.
30:30It really is.
30:31He's fucking very good.
30:33Yeah.
30:34Uh, that is an incredibly impressive skill.
30:36It is.
30:37And you always think, uh, and then you watch like, I can't remember what he's cut.
30:42It's really, really good.
30:43Yeah.
30:44What about the debates in, in the room about where these characters could go or, or what did
30:48you find tended to be the things that you really sort of, whether it was actually debated,
30:53fought, just, just went back and forth on.
30:56Um, my big thing, which, which Brad has already touched on was I said to them at the beginning
31:00and like a stroke of uncomfortable self-awareness cause I have to write for myself sometimes.
31:04Like people will feel like he's a good guy.
31:07Uh huh.
31:08Uh huh.
31:09You can push him as far to that line.
31:11If you cross the line, I'll tell you, but otherwise I'm pretty sure I can land him back into likability.
31:17It'll be more fun if we make him unlikable.
31:20Um, and that, we just kept trying to keep our eye on that cause otherwise it can become too
31:26sad or awkward dad.
31:28Mm hmm.
31:29And I was like, no, make him like, uh oh, I hope, make him uh oh dad.
31:33You know what I mean?
31:34The number of times you actually call out this, this idea that it is awkward dad.
31:38I mean, it just, it's, it's, it's fascinating.
31:40And also you watch it and then you're rooting for him.
31:43Yeah.
31:44In a, in a different, in a way that you perhaps wouldn't if you didn't actually call it out.
31:48Yeah.
31:49I mean, you think of the very first scene, like it's such a proof of him as a performer and a person
31:55that that opening scene with a different actor, you've got a man doing drugs by the pool where
32:00he's hired a load of sex workers and he's keeping up his neighbors.
32:03Uh huh.
32:04That's your intro to this character.
32:05Uh huh.
32:06And I don't think there's a second where the audience doesn't go, I like this guy.
32:09I know.
32:10Oh, he's going through a tough time.
32:12Yeah, yeah.
32:13Were you always comfortable with this idea that you could sort of bring him back and that
32:17people would still like him or is that something that you evolved that, that sort of came as
32:21you've done more of this and.
32:23Uh, oh, you mean since I'm young?
32:25Uh.
32:26Or on this show?
32:27No, I, over the course of your career.
32:28Yeah.
32:29Is it something that you always sort of felt comfortable doing?
32:31Because I would sort of describe so many of your roles that way.
32:34Yeah, yeah.
32:35Uh, I'm really interested, like the comedy I think is the funniest, is the really honest
32:41stuff where you like get to the dirty underneath.
32:44Uh huh.
32:45Uh huh.
32:46That to me is what's interesting.
32:47Uh, if I've gotten bored in my career, it's when I, uh, was no longer doing that.
32:52Uh huh.
32:53When stuff became kind of surface or repetitive.
32:55Yep.
32:56Like, oh, what's under there?
32:57Uh huh.
32:58That's what we all are interested in, you know?
33:00So when.
33:01People are all the same.
33:02Uh huh.
33:03I, I really do believe that.
33:05Uh huh.
33:06Like, everyone's got their stuff and I think like getting to the stuff is interesting.
33:10Uh huh.
33:11So was there any moment at which you said, ooh, I think we've, we have pushed him too
33:16far?
33:17I don't think so.
33:18Okay.
33:19I don't think so, right?
33:20No.
33:21I don't think so.
33:22I don't, I don't think so.
33:23And I do think that's like a collective, you, me, Bill, Neil Goldman, the show, and like,
33:27I think it's, and the writers, and the, it's just collectively I think our instincts
33:31were aligned.
33:32Yeah.
33:33It, it, we never had a discussion where I was like, what are you saying?
33:36Uh huh.
33:37Yeah.
33:38It's a lot of, I gotta say, really, really nice people like in that writers room and
33:42everything.
33:43Like, there wasn't, we weren't pulling back like some real like, real bad ideas.
33:48Right.
33:49You know?
33:50Right.
33:51Not that you would necessarily tell me if you were.
33:52Yeah.
33:53Um, nor does anyone ever sit in front of an interviewer and say, there's such an assholes
33:57in the room.
33:58But I genuinely believe that based on what we see.
34:00I don't take it for granted.
34:01Like, it's, it's such an incredible writing, writers room.
34:04Yeah.
34:05That is, uh, really, really nice.
34:07And, and also one of them, uh, Rachna said the other day, she was like, she was talking
34:11about a friend of hers in a different writers room that's apparently a nightmare.
34:14And she was like, yeah, this writers room's great because everyone's done therapy.
34:17Like that was part of the, like, hiring.
34:19Yeah.
34:20Yeah.
34:21You, you obviously came from being in the Ted Lasso room.
34:24And I'm curious sort of how, A, how it, how it differs, but also what you've learned
34:28there that you are bringing here.
34:30Well, I don't think it's that, it's that different at all.
34:35Like, uh.
34:36That's a therapized room as well.
34:37Yeah.
34:38I mean, it is.
34:39And you've got, and, and, and it's the same thing of being, being in a space that has to
34:44feel safe enough and comfortable enough that people can share and can be funny and can
34:49be honest and tell their things.
34:51And then in, in terms of structure and character, it's all the things that, that we've learned
34:58over time of, like you said, make sure every character has an arc.
35:01Every character is three dimensional.
35:02Every character matters.
35:03You don't just have someone there as a comedy side game who has no personality.
35:08You know, you make sure they all interweave.
35:10And the main thing that I learned from Jason Sudeikis is about intentionality.
35:18And I think it's something you sort of know instinctively, but when you really apply it,
35:22which is that the funny stuff's easy.
35:25You've got funny people.
35:26It's really easy.
35:27I don't mean that flippantly as in, when funny people are funny, it's quite easy to make the
35:32show as funny or as unfunny as you like.
35:36The decision is, why are you doing this?
35:39Why are you putting this scene in?
35:41Why are you, why is this character doing this?
35:43Everything should matter.
35:44Yes.
35:45That's, that's what I learned from Jason and certainly hope that we brought to this is,
35:50it should all matter.
35:51It should be, because, because you can do, it's easy to do bits that are just a string
35:56of funny bits.
35:57Like, why are we doing this?
35:59That's progressive.
36:00I mean, I think comedy has also evolved so much, but I think when you were starting
36:04out, comedy was just stringing together bits and then it got darker and I feel like we're
36:09now coming back to somewhere in the middle where you can play with, with both.
36:13Yeah.
36:14It's one of the things very similarly that Judd said to me when we were writing these movies,
36:19he said, forgetting Sarah Marshall in particular, he said, write a drama.
36:24This is going to be funny because of the way you see the world.
36:27I guarantee it.
36:28And if it's not, we can add jokes on this all day long.
36:31Hold on.
36:32But the only thing people are going to care about is the drama.
36:34Thank you both for doing this.
36:35Thank you very much for having us.
36:36And happy birthday again.
36:37Thanks a lot.
36:38Happy birthday.
36:39Happy birthday to you.
36:40And to you.
36:41And to you.
36:42And to you.
36:43And to you.
36:44Bye.
36:45And to you.
36:47Can we take part of the video intentionally?
36:48Have a great day.
36:49Bye.
36:50Bye.
36:51Hi.
36:52Hi.
36:53Hi.
36:54Hi.
36:55Hi.
36:56Hi.
36:57Hi.
36:58Okay.
36:59Hi.
37:00Hi.
37:01Hi.
37:02Yep.
37:03Hi.
37:04I'm really excited.
37:05Hi.
37:06Hi.
37:07Hi.
37:08Bye.
37:09Hi.
37:10Hi.
37:11Hi.
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