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Black Slave Owners



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Learning
Transcript
00:00Welcome to TTIOT, the show that proves anyone can have opinions.
00:05Today, we're stepping into a part of history that rarely gets mentioned.
00:08A chapter that challenges assumptions, complicates the narrative, and forces us to look a lot deeper.
00:14We're talking about slavery, but not the simplified version most of us were taught.
00:19Because the truth is this.
00:20Throughout history, there were black individuals who were also slave owners.
00:25It may sound shocking, maybe even offensive,
00:27but today we're unpacking the uncomfortable truth, the messy context,
00:32and the human motivations that textbooks like to leave out.
00:35Let's get the circus started.
00:46You know, history is rarely as simple as it seems on the surface.
00:51That's definitely true.
00:52Sometimes the most, well, the deepest insights come from looking at these overlooked corners, right?
00:57Exactly.
00:58Those areas that don't quite fit the main narrative we usually hear.
01:01And that's really where we're headed today.
01:02It's a challenging topic, I think.
01:05It really is.
01:05Right.
01:05Because these stories, they often push back against what many of us learned or maybe didn't learn in school.
01:12Absolutely.
01:13So today, this deep dive is exploring something complex, often surprising,
01:19and frankly, frequently misunderstood about American history.
01:23We're talking about free black individuals who owned enslaved people.
01:26Yeah.
01:27And we've pulled together a stack of fascinating sources for this one,
01:32including some excerpts from a book titled Black Slave Owners in American History.
01:36And our goal here, really, is to unpack these historical realities to try and understand the
01:41different contexts, the motivations, maybe.
01:43Without judgment, though.
01:44Without judgment.
01:45Just presenting the facts as the sources lay them out.
01:48We're going to meet several notable people and look at their unique stories.
01:52And for you listening in, think of this as a chance to get a more nuanced view,
01:57a fuller understanding of slavery itself and just how complex the social dynamics were in pre-Civil War America.
02:04Yeah. Offering insights, they definitely go beyond the sort of standard textbook narrative.
02:08Okay. So let's get into it.
02:09Right. So first, just to set the context, it's crucial, absolutely crucial to remember,
02:15the vast majority of enslaved people were held by white individuals.
02:19That's the overwhelming reality.
02:20Of course.
02:21But that being said, some free black individuals did also own slaves,
02:26mostly in the southern states before the Civil War.
02:28And knowing that fact, even if it feels jarring, it adds layers, doesn't it, to our understanding?
02:34It does. It's part of the historical record we need to grapple with.
02:37So our first case study takes us way back, early colonial America, Anthony Johnson.
02:43Yes. Anthony Johnson, an African man who turns up in Virginia, early 17th century.
02:49And his story is incredible because he becomes one of the first recorded black landowners in the colonies.
02:55Yeah. His journey is pretty extraordinary. He likely came from Angola, arrived around 1621,
03:01probably initially as an indentured servant.
03:05Meaning he had to work off a debt or his passage.
03:08Exactly. Worked for a set time.
03:09But somehow he gains his freedom. And by 1651, which is pretty remarkable, he owns 250 acres of land.
03:17And the records show he had several indentured servants and also enslaved people working for him.
03:23Wow. Okay. And what really stands out about him, according to the sources anyway, is his success in court.
03:30Yes. His legal maneuvering. He actually successfully fought for his rights in court, which, I mean, for a black man at that time.
03:36Almost unheard of, right.
03:37Incredibly rare. There's our famous case where he sued for the return of a runaway servant.
03:41And he won.
03:41He won the case, yeah.
03:42So what does his story tell us then, this early on?
03:45Well, it really illuminates how complex things were even then.
03:49Race wasn't the only factor determining status. Not yet. Not entirely.
03:52His story shows this brief, maybe contradictory moment where wealth and knowing how to work the legal system could,
04:02for some black individuals, kind of cut across the emerging racial lines.
04:06Hmm. A sort of window before things solidified, maybe?
04:10Perhaps. It's definitely complex.
04:11Okay. Let's jump forward quite a bit now. Leaving the 1600s for the 19th century, William Ellison in South Carolina. A very different story.
04:20Very different, yes. Ellison was a free black man who became, well, one of the wealthiest African-American slave owners.
04:26Yeah.
04:26He was a successful cotton gin maker, had a plantation.
04:29And his background, he wasn't born free, was he?
04:31No. He was born into slavery, gained his freedom in 1816, started out as a skilled tradesman, a gin maker.
04:37And built up considerable wealth?
04:38Well, considerable is putting it mildly. By the time he died, the sources say he owned over 60 enslaved people.
04:44Sixty.
04:44Sixty. And his estate was worth maybe $100,000. That made him one of the wealthiest men in the whole state, white or black.
04:50That's staggering. But, okay, the sources also highlight something uncomfortable here.
04:56His status as a slave owner, but within the free black community.
05:00Right. And he was influential, too, involved in local politics, civic groups.
05:04So how do we make sense of that? A wealthy, influential, free black man owning dozens of other black people?
05:10That's exactly the controversy the sources point to. Ellison's life really forces you to confront these uncomfortable realities.
05:18For some free black individuals, it seems economic survival, upward mobility, even building immense wealth.
05:25Was tied into the system itself.
05:27Paradoxically, yes. It was tied into participating in the very institution that oppressed black people generally.
05:32Yeah.
05:32It just shows the kind of brutal compromises the system forced on people.
05:37The available choices were shaped by the system itself, no matter how, well, unpalatable they seem to us now.
05:43It's hard to wrap your head around. Okay, let's shift geography again. New England now. Paul Cuff.
05:47Ah, Paul Cuff. Prominent black businessman. Philanthropist, too. Known mostly for shipping business, but also for advocating African colonization.
05:56So tell us about him. He was born free.
05:58Yes, born in Massachusetts. His father was a free black man. His mother was Native American from the Wampanoag tribe.
06:05And he became a very successful shipbuilder, merchant.
06:09And this idea of resettling free black Americans in Africa, he was a major proponent.
06:14He was. He strongly believed it was a path to greater freedom and autonomy, and he actually financed voyages himself to Sierra Leone.
06:23Okay, but here's the nuance with Cuff, according to the sources. His relationship with slavery wasn't always opposed to it.
06:29That's right. The sources indicate that early in his life, he did own slaves.
06:33Ah.
06:33But, and this is the crucial part, he later freed them. And then he really focused his energy on supporting free black communities and the colonization effort.
06:42So an evolution in his thinking, maybe.
06:44Exactly. His life really shows the tensions within the black community itself about slavery and freedom.
06:51You see individuals like Cuff, whose views and actions changed over time, perhaps reflecting a deepening moral conviction or changing circumstances.
06:58It shows that kind of internal debate and development.
07:01Okay, another really compelling and maybe complex figure is Madison Washington.
07:05Yes, Madison Washington. His story is, well, it's dramatic. He started out enslaved.
07:12Became known for trying to escape.
07:14Yes, multiple attempts. He escaped in the early 1800s, was recaptured, but eventually managed to buy his own freedom.
07:21Okay, so he achieved freedom, but then comes the twist the sources talk about.
07:26The twist is that after gaining his freedom, he actually purchased enslaved individuals himself.
07:31Yeah.
07:32And ran a successful business using their labor.
07:34Right. That's unexpected, given his own background. But that's not even the most famous part of his story, is it?
07:39No. His most famous act, the thing that really cemented his legacy, was leading the revolt on the slave ship, the Creole.
07:47Tell us about that.
07:47It was a ship transporting enslaved people. Washington, who was being transported after another attempt to free his wife, organized a rebellion on board.
07:56They took control of the ship and sailed it to the British Bahamas, where slavery was illegal.
08:00And how many people were freed?
08:02128 enslaved individuals gained their freedom because of that revolt. It was a huge incident. It caused a major diplomatic row between the U.S. and Britain.
08:11Incredible bravery. Incredible defiance. So his story, purchasing slaves, then leading this massive liberation effort.
08:19It just embodies the complexity, doesn't it? It reflects that broader struggle for freedom and rights in the antebellum period. You see this extraordinary agency where someone could navigate the system, even participate in aspects of it, like slave ownership, perhaps, for business or family reasons.
08:34We don't always know the full motivation.
08:36Like it.
08:36And then also strikes such a powerful blow against it. It defies easy labels.
08:40Definitely.
08:40Okay, one more case study. Francis J. LeMoyne.
08:43Francis LeMoyne, yes. A free black man from Pennsylvania. Another businessman, another slave owner. And his life adds yet another layer of complexity to this picture in the 19th century.
08:55So he was born free in Pennsylvania.
08:57Yes, born free. Worked as a businessman in Pittsburgh. And the sources confirm he owned several enslaved people. They worked in his home and also in his businesses.
09:05Okay, so similar in some ways to Ellison, perhaps, in terms of being a free black man owning slaves for economic reasons. But what's the striking contradiction with LeMoyne?
09:16The really striking thing, which the sources emphasize, is that despite being a slave owner, LeMoyne was also involved in abolitionist movements.
09:24Wait, involved in movements to end slavery while owning slaves himself?
09:28Exactly. That's the profound contradiction. It creates this incredibly complex legacy. How do you square those two things?
09:34I mean, how do we make sense of that?
09:36It's difficult. LeMoyne's life just vividly illustrates the kind of tightrope some free blacks might have walked. Operating within a system that defined wealth and status, partly through slave ownership, while perhaps simultaneously holding genuine beliefs about the injustice of slavery itself.
09:53Maybe seeing it as a necessary evil for stability, or trying to influence things from within, it's hard to say.
09:58It forces us to think about the immense pressures, the limited choices, the ways people might have rationalized their actions or navigated these conflicting ideals.
10:08Did they compartmentalize? Did they see their own slave ownership differently?
10:12We often don't have the answers, but the contradiction itself is historically significant.
10:17So we've looked at Johnson, Ellison, Cuff, Washington, LeMoyne, quite a range of experiences. What's the connecting thread here? What does bringing these stories together tell us?
10:30Well, first, it clearly challenges any simplistic, monolithic view of American slavery. It shows this spectrum of roles, motivations, and experiences among black individuals, both enslaved and free.
10:42It wasn't just one single experience. Not at all. And if you ask, what does this all mean? I think it shows people navigating just immense social pressures, harsh economic realities, and wrestling with the meaning of freedom itself within a society built on enslavement.
10:55Their choices, whether buying family members to protect them, which sometimes happen.
10:59Right. That's another motivation we sometimes see, buying family out of slavery, though legally they were still property.
11:04Or accumulating wealth like Ellison, or evolving views like Cuff, or fighting back like Washington, or living with contradictions like LeMoyne. It's all part of a much more intricate picture.
11:16Exactly. It paints a picture that's far more complex than we often allow for.
11:19And I guess this raises a really important question for you listening. How did people actually cope? What kinds of strategies, what compromises did they make to survive, maybe even thrive, or find ways to seek liberation within such a deeply, profoundly unjust system?
11:35Yeah. It reminds us that history, especially when you're talking about something as morally fraught as slavery, it's rarely just black and white, if you'll pardon the expression.
11:44No, it forces you to look at the gray areas, the difficult choices.
11:48It pushes us beyond easy categories, beyond simple heroes and villains, and encourages us to understand the full, messy, human experience, even within a system we rightly condemn.
11:59Okay. That feels like a good place to pause and reflect as we wrap up this deep dive.
12:03The core insight, really, is that this history, looking at black slave owners, it just reveals these layers of complexity, deep contradictions, and also human agency that often get overlooked.
12:15It's definitely a challenging part of American history, but a necessary one, if we want to understand the full scope of it.
12:21So we want to leave you with a thought to mull over something provocative, maybe.
12:26Go for it.
12:26How do the choices and the legacies of these people we've talked about operating within this system of profound injustice, how do they challenge our understanding of what it even meant to be free in pre-Civil War America?
12:40Hmm. That's a deep question. Because free clearly didn't mean equal or unconstrained.
12:46Not at all. And how do we reconcile their multiple roles, sometimes conflicting roles within that system?
12:51Owning people, fighting for freedom, advocating abolition, building wealth?
12:55It's a powerful reminder, isn't it? That individual lives and actions can simultaneously reinforce broader societal structures, even unjust ones, while also, sometimes in the very same life, resisting them.
13:07You're welcome.
13:14And that's it for today's episode. History is rarely simple. People are complicated, and the truth doesn't care who it offends.
13:21Thanks for listening, and until next time, stay curious.
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