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Murder Point of Contact Season 1 Episode 4
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FunTranscript
00:00This was a cold and calculated murder.
00:16There's always a breaking point in an investigation.
00:24The timeline of events didn't add up.
00:30It was crucial we supported our family contact.
00:48This case is really all about an innocent woman asking for her freedom, asking to move on
00:58with her life and being killed off for making that choice.
01:04A female that had obviously been tricked to go to India, five and a half thousand miles
01:10away.
01:11At the heart of this was a young woman whose life had been cruelly taken by people who felt
01:16they had the right to do that.
01:17Well, there's a phrase which I find chilling to this day, which was every day I felt terror
01:27and fear for my life.
01:29I was asked by my SIO, Clive Driscoll, to accompany him to meet a family.
01:39I would eventually become the family liaison officer working with their daughter, Subjit
01:46Athwal.
01:48My name is Angie Barton.
01:50In 2005, I was a police family liaison officer, often referred to as a flow, deployed on the
01:57case of Subjit Athwal.
01:59It's so important to have that connection with the family, to work with them, because
02:07a lot of families, that is the very first time they're having any contact with police.
02:11They don't understand the court system or, you know, post-mortems or forensics or anything
02:16like that.
02:17It really is a minefield.
02:19Our role is to help them understand what's been done, why it's been done, to understand
02:25how an investigation unfolds, and for me, it's about if I was in the position of the
02:30family, what do I want the police to do?
02:34Surjit's sister-in-law, Subjit, was absolutely petrified that she had been got rid of, murdered.
02:41From that moment, I became her point of contact in the murder investigation.
02:46Hello, dear Sandy Barton.
02:56Oh, hi Clive, how are you doing?
02:59Yep, yep.
03:00Yeah, I know about that case.
03:02Shall I pop up and see you?
03:04Yep, I'll be there in a minute.
03:08My name is Clive Driscoll.
03:10I was appointed the Senior Investigating Officer attached to the Racial and Violent Crime
03:15Task Force within the Metropolitan Police Service.
03:19The task force was really set up around crimes of a racial nature that maybe we hadn't investigated
03:27to the standards that were required.
03:32Originally, the briefing was that Serjeet Athwell said at the time that she was going to go out
03:38to India to three weddings, five and a half thousand miles away.
03:43After leaving on the 4th of December 1998 and due to come home on the 18th, she never actually
03:49came home.
03:54There'd been absolutely nothing heard about her for over seven years.
04:00When somebody's reported missing, if there's no movement for them, after seven years they
04:05can be officially declared dead.
04:07It was a case well worthy of an investigation.
04:11Clive's an amazing SIO.
04:12He pointed to the picture of Serjeet and he said, Angie, that's what I'm after, that's
04:17what I'm looking for.
04:19I'm making sure that we're doing the right thing for Serjeet.
04:22Clive said, could you come with me to meet this family?
04:25It's a missing persons, it might be a murder, but we're going to go and speak to father of
04:30a potential witness.
04:32This meeting sub's parents for the first time, you know, you're being respectful, you're going
04:36into somebody's home.
04:38They invited us to come and sit down and they provided us with drinks.
04:42It became pretty obvious to me that the father was really, really worried about his daughter.
04:46She wanted to talk about what she knew about what had happened to her sister-in-law, Serjeet.
04:53I just remember thinking, he looks really worried, looks really, really worried, scared.
05:02I do remember him saying, please, Mr. Clive, protect my daughter, please protect her.
05:07To the best of my ability, I said, yes, we will guarantee her.
05:11Looking at Saabj's mum in her English isn't very good and I'm not very conversant in her
05:16language, but there are some things that transcend language.
05:20Maya held her hand and said, we're going to do everything we can to protect your daughter.
05:24We talked about how we were going to make contact with their daughter to have the conversation
05:30about what she needed to tell us, about what she knew.
05:33So I was married into the Atrol family.
05:43My name is Saabj Atrol.
05:45I was the key witness in the investigation of the disappearance of my sister-in-law, Serjeet
05:50Atrol.
05:52So it's quite a big family.
05:54We're all living in the same house.
05:56It's a three-bedroom house.
05:57And my father-in-law is really nice, really sweet, caring and supporting.
06:01When he was alive, everybody just got in with each other.
06:06And there's no frictions, no arguments.
06:10It was my father-in-law, my mother-in-law, Bachchan.
06:14They had all daughters.
06:16And the man I married, his name was Hardave.
06:20Sookdave was his brother.
06:23Serjeet was married to Sookdave.
06:25When I moved into that house, Serjeet was already there.
06:28She got married a year and a half before I did.
06:30She was a young woman when she met and married Sookdave.
06:34She was about 16, I think.
06:35It was an arranged marriage.
06:38My father-in-law became quite seriously ill.
06:40He passed away.
06:41My mother-in-law announced that she was going to be the head of the family.
06:44And everything had to be her way.
06:47She had certain rules put in place.
06:49And she did rule the family.
06:51Everybody had to look up to her.
06:52My name is Rajabir Dhillon, and I am the niece of Serjeet Atwell.
07:02And my father, Jagdish Singh, was Serjeet's oldest brother.
07:06When it comes to marriage, having children, it's not acceptable for somebody to marry out of culture.
07:16I accept some of those traditional values, but not all of them, because I feel like it does restrict a human being from totally being free.
07:26And my father and Serjeet had a very close relationship right from a young age.
07:34They would have a lot of banter together.
07:37And at the same time, there was a lot of pure love.
07:40They were just there for each other.
07:43He was just so concerned and so distraught when he knew she hadn't returned from India.
07:49When Serjeet didn't come back, her brother, Jazz Singh, he was instrumental in keeping the pressure for an inquiry to be commenced.
08:06He was desperate to explain to the police that this is unusual.
08:12My father wanted to get to the bottom of, where is she? We need to find my sister.
08:17He had a gut feeling that something wasn't right.
08:20He actually did go over to the household of Serjeet.
08:24But him would just brush off and just not take the responsibility of her whereabouts and say, oh, I think she just ran off.
08:33He went into sort of a panic mode.
08:36Okay, we need to do something right now.
08:37So we need to contact the police right now.
08:40When Jagdish Singh and Mr. Dillon, Serjeet's father, went into the police station,
08:45the case started as a missing persons inquiry.
08:49The police went to do door-to-door inquiries.
08:52They spoke to local neighbours to find out where Serjeet was.
08:55Serjeet's brother put out posters and all sorts of different things.
08:59I started sort of being proactive with my father,
09:02going with him to go and speak to the local community of West London
09:08and actually ask them if anybody has heard or seen anything.
09:12His own personal drive is unmatched to anybody that I know.
09:19He just chose never to give up.
09:22So when we did put missing photos up, they would just get ripped off.
09:26The local community were not helpful.
09:28The committees of the Gudra would actually say to my father
09:33to not put any of those missing photos up
09:35and not to speak about the issue.
09:38It just felt like we were being rejected
09:40and nobody wanted to come forward and help.
09:43It was fairly obvious he hadn't come home in the new year.
09:57That's when he went over to the murder teams.
10:00And then, obviously, they conducted a murder inquiry.
10:04When the police came to our house,
10:06they would speak to Sukhdeva and Bachchan at the door.
10:11I could sense it, the atmosphere in the house was like,
10:14they were quite concerned when the police came,
10:17what the questions were going to be asked
10:19and making sure they all stuck together.
10:23Sukhdeva was more like playing a game with them.
10:27He would say that, you know, she's left on her own accord.
10:30She's left two kids behind.
10:31I'm too busy looking after the kids.
10:34I don't, you know, I can't really do much.
10:36They didn't come into the house at all.
10:37And I think that's one of the mistakes they made.
10:45There was an investigation going on in India as well
10:49for the disappearance of murder of Sir Jean Athwell.
10:53My father, at that time,
10:55he sent emails to the Indian embassy and to parliament
10:59and to the prime minister.
11:01We started to receive anonymous calls,
11:04which were coming from back home in Punjab.
11:07They would say, well, we can't, we can't tell you who we are.
11:11But what we can tell you is that she's been murdered.
11:19The Indian police certainly did inquiries as a murder.
11:22There was two suspects in India.
11:25One was the brother of Bacancore Athwell.
11:27So after some time, me and Sergei fell pregnant.
11:41Kind of the same time.
11:42She was three weeks ahead of me.
11:45And then we supported each other on that.
11:48Sook Dave and Sergei gave birth to their first daughter.
11:52And they were happy.
11:54Between Sergei and Sook Dave, things seemed okay.
11:58Mother-in-law was over the moon that my sons had a daughter.
12:02She was just fine.
12:03After some time, Sergei and Sook Dave moved into the house
12:06on the right-hand side.
12:08They were living next door to each other.
12:09So it was Sergei and Sook Dave in one house.
12:13Me and Harday in the other house.
12:14But the mother-in-law, Bachan,
12:16she had the option to be in whichever house she wanted to be in.
12:21Sergei got a job back here through the airport
12:22as a customs officer.
12:24She loved that job.
12:26It made her gain a bit of freedom.
12:29She was able to go out and be herself.
12:32She was learning more skills.
12:33She was becoming more experienced in the outer world.
12:36She was still being that loving person at home.
12:39She was still doing the cooking, the caring for her kids,
12:43the housework, all of that she still carried on doing.
12:47The only difference was that she was going to work,
12:50making new friends and socialising
12:52and becoming her own person.
12:55And Sook Dave wasn't happy about that.
12:57He would just say, when you finish your work,
12:58can you make sure you come straight home?
13:00And it was that freedom that they didn't like.
13:02There was obviously a lot of pressure on Sergei.
13:04She would dress in the way she wanted to dress.
13:07It was nothing outrageous at all.
13:09She would dress in modern clothing,
13:11wear make-up.
13:13But she would have said to Sergei,
13:15we want you to leave work.
13:18We want you to stay at home and look after the kids.
13:20And Sergei disagreed.
13:24As time went by,
13:26Sook Dave became more and more angry towards her
13:30because he said that she wasn't listening.
13:33Sergei was a very sort of free thinker,
13:36very liberated herself
13:37and very confident in sort of speaking about her values
13:41and her opinions.
13:42And she wouldn't shy away from sort of explaining how she felt.
13:48That was part of Sergei's personality
13:50and you can't fit her into a box.
13:55And Bachchan said,
13:56I can't let her carry on like this,
13:58become my honours at stake.
14:00It's bringing a lot of shame to the family household.
14:02And Bachchan was very cold,
14:07very controlling.
14:10Bachchan would sometimes actually say to my auntie Sergei,
14:14oh, do this in the kitchen
14:15or you haven't cooked this right
14:17or you need to redo this.
14:19It was very transactional,
14:21very, very much one-sided.
14:24You can only be a good wife
14:26if you abide by these rules.
14:28Whatever she said that had to be done,
14:31we couldn't question it.
14:33If I wanted to go and see my parents,
14:34if I wanted to see my siblings,
14:36I had to get permission from her.
14:37If she said I was allowed to go, I could.
14:39But otherwise, I wasn't allowed to go.
14:42I had to pick up the phone and call my parents,
14:44make some excuse up
14:45so they wouldn't feel let down.
14:48The treatment between her daughters and us,
14:51myself and Sergei,
14:52was completely different.
14:53They didn't have any rights in that household at all
14:56because they were daughters-in-law.
14:58We had to maintain a certain image within that family.
15:02They could do whatever they wanted to do.
15:04They could go out, meet people.
15:06But with us, it was completely different.
15:09It's more control, more pressure,
15:11that you can't do this, you can't go there,
15:14you can't wear this.
15:15Not to do anything that was shameful or dishonorable.
15:18I think in our culture, shame is such a huge thing
15:21that whatever you're reading in our life,
15:24whether we're communicating with people,
15:25dressing in a certain way
15:26and living in a certain way,
15:29the standards are really, really high.
15:31I think Butchina wanted to make sure
15:33those standards were maintained
15:35at the highest at all levels.
15:37But by doing that,
15:39she didn't really care of what happened to anybody.
15:43They lived within a Sikh household,
15:46but I think that the Athwolds
15:48took that to a new level.
15:50They took it to a level
15:51which I'm not so sure
15:52even Sikh families would agree with.
15:55It was a real rod of iron.
16:00So it was struggling with her marriage with Sukhdev.
16:03Her marriage started to destroy
16:06her personality over time.
16:08She was no longer able to express herself anymore.
16:13She was no longer that bubbly person anymore.
16:15She was no longer the person
16:17that would reach out to you.
16:19Sukhdev Athwell was 10 years senior to Sergei,
16:24but he was also someone
16:26who somehow felt he owned Sergei
16:28other than a partnership in a marriage.
16:31There were domestic abuse situations between them.
16:35Sergei was really unhappy in her marriage
16:37and she did try applying for divorce.
16:39I think she had started the application.
16:41But as far as she was concerned,
16:43and nobody knew about this,
16:45but somehow Sukhdev found out
16:47and that information was passed on to Bachchan.
16:50Within our culture,
16:52having a divorce is such a big, big issue.
16:54Even talking about disagreements within the family
16:57is a complete taboo.
17:00She wanted a divorce.
17:02And at that moment there,
17:04I think that that was unacceptable,
17:06certainly at the Bacchancourt Athwell,
17:07but it was unacceptable
17:09with Bacchancourt Athwell's vision
17:11of what the family should be.
17:14This family felt that her leaving,
17:16it would have offended their honor.
17:19That was the straw that broke the camel's back.
17:23So I felt, well, there is a motive for murder.
17:27I was at where I lived
17:40and mother-in-law came over
17:42and she said to me,
17:43can you put some tea on?
17:44So I started putting the tea on
17:45and Hardeva came downstairs.
17:50Then soon after, Sukhdev came
17:51and one of their daughters came over as well.
17:54I was quite surprised thinking,
17:55what's happening,
17:56why are these people coming over?
17:58And they're all sitting at the table
17:59and Bacchan said,
18:00can you just turn the tea off and come inside?
18:03So I came inside
18:05and joined them at the table.
18:07Bacchan had said that
18:08Serge's behavior is getting out of control.
18:10We can't allow her to carry on like this.
18:13She made a plan to take her to India
18:14and said that she was going to get rid of her.
18:16In our culture, in our language,
18:20that means that you literally
18:21are going to get rid of that person.
18:23She had spoken to her brother in India
18:25who said that he can take care of everything.
18:29When I heard those words
18:30that they were going to get rid of Serge,
18:32I felt so anxious.
18:33I felt sick.
18:34I felt numb at the same time.
18:36She's the daughter-in-law of this family.
18:38She's your son's wife.
18:40She's got two kids, your grandkids.
18:43There's no way you can do this.
18:44Her son's appeared not to have,
18:48dare I say, a bit of a backbone.
18:50You know, why are you allowing your mother
18:52to tell you what you're going to do
18:53with your lives and your wife?
18:57I couldn't understand how a family could be so cold.
19:02I knew I had to do something.
19:04I couldn't just sit back
19:05and just ignore the whole situation.
19:09I wrote a letter to my local police station.
19:11Any moment I got on my own at home
19:15and everybody was at work,
19:18I put pen to paper
19:19and I started writing a letter
19:21outlining everything I needed to know.
19:24I didn't put my name on it at all.
19:26I put the house address on it.
19:29I put everything about the meeting.
19:31Every single little detail
19:33the police would have wanted to know.
19:34When I was writing that letter,
19:35I was really, really scared.
19:38Writing for my own life,
19:39thinking if anybody found out,
19:40God knows what will happen.
19:43For me, that letter was a massive thing.
19:47Now it was down to the police
19:48to act on that letter.
19:50To act on it in the right times,
19:52I said you could have still been alive.
19:54I heard Bachchan speaking to Sukhdev and Hadev
20:01about Serge's behaviour
20:03and she seemed really upset and angry.
20:07At the same time,
20:08she started talking to Serge
20:10and she said,
20:10let's go to India.
20:12We'll see two weddings out there.
20:14Show yourself out there.
20:16They haven't seen you.
20:17Be the dutiful daughter-in-law you can be
20:19when you come back.
20:20We won't stand in your way.
20:21You can have your own life.
20:22In other words,
20:24if you come to India with us,
20:27if you attend the family weddings,
20:28looking like you're part of the family,
20:31that protects our honour
20:32and then we will give you your divorce.
20:35And that made her really excited and happy.
20:38She kind of went along with the plans,
20:40booking the tickets,
20:40speaking to Bachchan about the dates
20:44and getting holidays off work.
20:46On the 4th of December, 1998,
20:50her brother-in-law, Hadev,
20:51drove her to Heathrow Airport
20:53and she took that,
20:55I think it was about 30-hour flight
20:56with view to go to these weddings.
20:59The footage of Sajid going to the wedding,
21:03in that moment she may look happy,
21:06but more than likely she's been told
21:08to pull that face or look happy
21:12because it's now going to be evidence
21:14for Bachchan to show,
21:16yes, we took her to the wedding
21:18and she's had a great time.
21:25She's actually come back.
21:28She never knew
21:29what was going on behind the scenes.
21:35As a result of that investigation
21:36going on in India,
21:38as well,
21:39British police officers
21:40arrested Back and Call Athwell,
21:42Sukhdeva Athwell,
21:44Hadeva Athwell,
21:45who was Sajidh Aswell's husband,
21:46and Sajidh.
21:48And I told the police
21:49everything in that interview,
21:51what her intentions were,
21:52what she said,
21:53that they were going to get rid of her
21:55and take her to India.
21:56And I felt like the police
21:57didn't believe me at the time.
21:58I remember them sitting in front of me
22:00and said that,
22:01we haven't received any letter
22:02that you're talking about.
22:03They puzzled me again and again
22:05and again about the letter.
22:06Then one of the officers,
22:07he said to me,
22:08I think you've got mental health issues
22:10and you should go and see your doctor
22:12and get some help.
22:13I was really shocked,
22:15really shocked thinking that,
22:16here's me,
22:17putting myself at risk.
22:19And you're literally,
22:20you're just dismissing
22:22the whole situation.
22:23The case didn't really go anywhere
22:25because there was lack of evidence.
22:26The police believed Back and Call Athwell
22:28and Sukhdeva had not solved you.
22:30And after that,
22:31I realised actually,
22:32I had lost complete trust in the police.
22:34I had no hope they were going to help me
22:36or support me
22:37or guide me
22:38or listen to me
22:38or even believe me.
22:39But I had no choice
22:41and I had to go back home
22:42to the family.
22:44I had to live with them
22:45for a further seven years.
22:46Before I'd met with Savjit
22:55to have her interview,
22:56we had already started looking at
22:58the information around the family,
23:01what they'd said previously,
23:03gathering together
23:04to have the evidence
23:06to arrest again
23:07Bachan and Sukhdeva and Hardev.
23:11One of the blood daughters
23:12of Back and Call
23:13had kept a diary
23:14where she put it,
23:16Mum's a murderer.
23:17And that's when we gained
23:18other information.
23:20Sukhdeva said
23:21that his wife had left him,
23:22had abandoned him
23:23and his children
23:23and was living in India.
23:25But he'd made an application
23:27to a Department of Work and Pensions
23:29to help him pay the mortgage
23:30now that he was a single parent
23:32and his wife had died.
23:33So the question is,
23:34how did he know his wife had died?
23:37Sukhdeva said
23:38that he'd been into Terminal 1
23:41and Terminal 3
23:42at Heathrow Airport.
23:45He said he was approached
23:46by this woman
23:46he'd never met before,
23:47whose name was Kate,
23:49who said,
23:50are you Surjit's husband?
23:52And she got her mobile phone out,
23:54apparently,
23:55rang Surjit
23:56and gave the phone
23:57to Sukhdeva,
23:58who apparently heard
23:59from Surjit
24:01that she was never coming back,
24:03that she's happy
24:05and so on.
24:06Is that true?
24:07Or can we show
24:08that it isn't true?
24:10We found this Kate
24:11through inquiries
24:12who said,
24:14I've never met Sukhdeva.
24:16Don't know what he looks like.
24:18But I was really worried
24:19that he might come back
24:20to say,
24:21we got the wrong Kate.
24:22So I spent a few weeks
24:23at Heathrow
24:24going through their systems
24:26looking for any other Kate,
24:27Katerina, Catherine,
24:29spelt different ways,
24:30who could be
24:31the other Kate
24:33and couldn't find anybody
24:34that matched the description
24:36that he was saying.
24:37We could show
24:38that it wasn't true.
24:41We started to look at
24:43what did we need to do
24:44to try and prove
24:45that this missing person,
24:47Surjit,
24:47was potentially
24:49a victim of murder.
24:51The fact that
24:51Subjit was sister-in-law,
24:53was willing
24:53to speak to police,
24:55I was worried for her.
24:57How was this going to work out,
24:58especially since
24:59she's living
25:00with the family
25:01who are suspected
25:02of being part
25:04of Surjit's murder
25:05or disappearance?
25:07Clive asked me
25:08if I could do
25:08the interview with her.
25:11We knew from
25:13Subjit's father
25:14that if
25:15Subjit was known
25:17to be speaking
25:17to the police,
25:18that would put her
25:19in grave danger.
25:21So we couldn't just go in
25:22and normally ask
25:24if you'd come
25:25and do an interview.
25:26We were thinking
25:26about the safest way
25:28for her to get
25:30to a venue
25:31so that we could
25:32interview her
25:33and we worked
25:34with the family
25:34to arrange for
25:36Subjit to be brought
25:37to a police station
25:38in West London,
25:39made the arrangements
25:40about that interview
25:41through her father.
25:42We had to really
25:43prepare it,
25:44get the video suite
25:45ready at a particular time.
25:47We managed to arrange
25:48a date on the 27th
25:49of October 2005
25:51for her to meet me.
25:54You are relying
25:55on a little bit
25:56of other people's actions
25:58because, you know,
26:00we realised
26:01that her husband
26:02was still at home
26:03and she was making
26:04his dinner
26:04and so we didn't know
26:05is he going to go to work,
26:06is he not going to go to work?
26:07He did go to work,
26:08thank the Lord
26:09and literally then
26:11we managed to get her out.
26:12We did it between
26:13two o'clock
26:13and four o'clock
26:14in the afternoon.
26:15When I entered
26:16the police station,
26:17I was barely able
26:18to walk and shaking
26:19and my legs were trembling
26:21because I was thinking
26:21that if anybody saw me
26:22walking to the police station,
26:24I would have been
26:25in really, really big trouble.
26:26I was experiencing
26:28video interviewing
26:29of vulnerable victims.
26:30I was just struck
26:31by how frightened she was
26:34and I felt at the time
26:35incredibly brave
26:36because she'd only recently
26:38had a small child
26:39and there she was
26:40about to talk to us
26:41and tell us about
26:42what she knew
26:43had happened to Sergei.
26:45Angie was really lovely,
26:46she was really caring
26:47and approachable.
26:51I've always felt
26:52that the family liaison officer
26:53was extremely crucial.
26:55It's a bridge between
26:56the senior investigating officer
26:57that's in charge
26:58of their investigation
27:00and the family.
27:02In this case,
27:03the family,
27:03we've lost a bit
27:04of confidence in the police
27:05and so building up
27:07that confidence,
27:08building up that trust,
27:10that is a crucial role.
27:13The FLO played a major part.
27:14The family need to know
27:16that they can trust you,
27:18that you're going to do
27:19what you say you're going to do.
27:22We didn't have much time,
27:24but I just kept reassuring her,
27:26explaining the process
27:27about how we were going
27:28to do the video interview
27:29and for her just to,
27:31don't make anything up,
27:33don't leave anything out,
27:34just tell us what you remember.
27:38I knew that we needed
27:39to get the most important parts
27:41of what she had to say
27:42captured in that interview.
27:44They went to pick the mum up
27:49from the airport
27:49and she came on her own.
27:52I still couldn't believe
27:53that she actually went ahead
27:55and did it.
27:56So I just wanted to find out.
27:57Everybody was at work one day.
27:59Butcham came over
27:59from the house next door
28:01into the house
28:02and she sat down
28:03and she said that
28:05everything's been taken care of now.
28:09And I just wanted to be clear
28:10that I was understanding it correctly.
28:13So I said to her
28:14and I said,
28:14where's Sergit?
28:15She goes,
28:16Sergit's been taken care of.
28:19And she just said that
28:20she's not going to come back.
28:22Butcham's brother
28:23and another friend
28:24drove Sergit
28:25far away somewhere
28:27in her jeep.
28:29On the way,
28:30they drugged her,
28:31they strangled her
28:32and they threw her body
28:34in the river.
28:37I was really, really shocked.
28:46I couldn't understand
28:47how Butcham confessed
28:48to this openly.
28:50She said,
28:51you're not going to speak
28:51to anybody about this.
28:53We're going to close
28:54the conversations
28:56around this now.
28:57Nobody's going to mention
28:57anything to anybody.
28:59Nobody's going to talk
29:00about any kind
29:02of dishonor
29:03towards our family.
29:04No more shame.
29:05And from that moment onwards,
29:07I just looked at Butcham
29:08in a completely different way.
29:11She wasn't a mother-in-law.
29:14I just,
29:16I just didn't think
29:17she was a really evil person.
29:21I felt
29:22I wasn't safe in that house.
29:26She was a murderer
29:26and I was living with her
29:28every single day.
29:30Back in 2000,
29:31Subject would have been
29:33treated as a suspect.
29:34I took a different view.
29:35I thought, well,
29:36actually, your truth
29:37is the only truth
29:38that makes any sense.
29:41One of the decisions
29:42I made
29:43was to go and
29:43obtain all of the papers
29:45which were being kept
29:46at Barnes Police Station.
29:49There were 13 boxes
29:50and I can remember
29:51taking them home
29:52for the weekend
29:52and reading them.
29:54So a considerable amount
29:55of paperwork.
29:57And lo and behold,
29:57what I found
29:58was the letter.
30:00So it was there.
30:02So what we had
30:03was that person's evidence now.
30:05What you always do
30:06is almost
30:07give continuity
30:08to evidence.
30:11He goes,
30:12can you recognise
30:13this piece of paper?
30:15I said,
30:16this is the letter
30:16I wrote to that
30:17where the officers
30:17accused me
30:18of having mental health issues
30:19and said that
30:21I'd just made it all up.
30:22When she wrote that,
30:23she tried her hardest.
30:24She did everything
30:25in her power
30:25to make us,
30:28the Metropolitan Police Service,
30:29sit up and understand
30:30what was happening.
30:32For Clive
30:32to go back
30:33and find that letter,
30:35it just really meant
30:36a lot to me
30:37for him to come in
30:38and acknowledge
30:38that he had it.
30:40After Sarge
30:41had given the video interview,
30:43she felt
30:43that the family
30:45were thinking.
30:46She was their weak link.
30:49There was a feeling
30:50that they might have known
30:52she was talking
30:53to the police
30:53and that they were
30:54plotting and planning
30:55something
30:56which would have ended
30:58badly for Mrs. Sarge
30:59Atthwell.
31:01Butchen came over
31:02to our house.
31:03She wanted to stay
31:04the night.
31:05She actually said
31:06that she would stay
31:07that night
31:09and sleep in the same bed
31:11as Sarge.
31:12She said to me,
31:13you're going to sleep
31:13with me in the same bed
31:15and something
31:15didn't seem right at all.
31:17I felt trapped.
31:18I couldn't find a way out.
31:19I was scared
31:20if I fell asleep.
31:21God knows what would happen.
31:22Sarge Atthwell said
31:23she never had a wink sleep
31:24because she thought
31:25she was going to be
31:26murdered in her bed.
31:28After that morning
31:29when we came downstairs
31:30and Butchen said that
31:32since you've been married
31:33in this family,
31:34she goes,
31:34we've never had a trip
31:35together, have we?
31:36And instantly,
31:38I knew straight away
31:38what she meant.
31:39She said,
31:39I think now's the time
31:40for you to go to India.
31:42No, enough's enough.
31:44I had a meeting
31:53with the Crown Prosecution Service.
31:55I went through the evidence
31:56we now had
31:57in our possession.
31:59The letters,
32:00the video interview,
32:02the information
32:03that she was murdered
32:05by being taken
32:07to the River Davie,
32:09strangled,
32:09and then thrown in
32:10the River.
32:11Their indication was
32:13that we were
32:14certainly going
32:15in the right way.
32:17As a result,
32:18we arrested everybody
32:19connected with this case.
32:21Back and Crawl Atthwell,
32:22Sookdev Atthwell,
32:23Hardave Atthwell,
32:24and we also arrested
32:25Mrs. Sarge Atthwell,
32:26who will remain to this day
32:28the only person
32:29I've ever met
32:29who was happy
32:30to be arrested.
32:31That was to make it
32:32look like she was part
32:34of our operation
32:35and a suspect.
32:36Sookdev and Bachan
32:38were charged
32:38with murder
32:40and they were kept
32:41in custody.
32:43Hardave and
32:45Sarbjit were released.
32:48After we'd arrested
32:49and charged
32:49Back and Crawl Atthwell
32:51and Sookdev Atthwell,
32:52that's when the pressure
32:53really went on.
32:55So Sarbjit was
32:56back at home
32:57with her husband,
32:58Hardave,
32:58and their children.
33:00I think she still
33:01in her mind
33:01felt she could save
33:03her marriage.
33:04Maybe
33:05her husband
33:06would do
33:07the honourable thing.
33:09That's what she hoped.
33:12The Sarbjit
33:12always wanted
33:13to give evidence
33:13but she said
33:14she was being threatened
33:15which extended
33:16to threats
33:17towards her children.
33:18The messages
33:18that were being
33:19flying left,
33:20right and centre
33:20from her husband
33:21was just dreadful.
33:22Truly dreadful.
33:24She said
33:24she was assaulted,
33:26pushed down the stairs
33:27and then
33:27I think she felt
33:29am I ever
33:29going to be safe?
33:31Bear in mind
33:32that then
33:32Hardave Atthwell
33:33hadn't been charged.
33:35We could not
33:36prevent him
33:36from seeing
33:37Mrs. Atthwell.
33:38We didn't have
33:39the power
33:39to prevent it.
33:40We'd rather he didn't
33:42but we couldn't
33:42prevent it,
33:43that's for sure.
33:44Between Christmas
33:45and New Year
33:45Sarbjit contacted me
33:47to say,
33:47Angie,
33:48what I said
33:48in that interview
33:49was all made up.
33:50I was struggling
33:50with my mental health
33:52having just had a baby
33:53and I want to
33:54withdraw it.
33:55You know,
33:55we had no body,
33:57we had no CCTV,
33:58we had no forensic.
34:00If Sarbjit's voice
34:01is removed
34:02or her account
34:03is removed
34:04it makes it
34:05more difficult
34:05to prove
34:06beyond reasonable doubt
34:07that Sarbjit did leave
34:08under the pretext
34:10of getting a divorce
34:11when she came back
34:12to be murdered
34:13in India.
34:14I remember
34:15having a conversation
34:16with Clive
34:17and we immediately
34:18arranged to meet her
34:19and we took her
34:20to a police place
34:22that we've got
34:22in West London
34:23and we had a conversation,
34:24just the three of us
34:25and she was adamant
34:26that no,
34:26I needed to know
34:27that what I said
34:27was all made up
34:28along those lines
34:29I want to withdraw
34:30my statement
34:31what I told you
34:32wasn't true
34:33and Clive was asking her
34:35you know
34:35have you been put
34:36under pressure
34:36and she was saying
34:37no, no
34:38I'm fine
34:39I just don't want
34:40my statement
34:40to be used
34:41and we realised
34:42she couldn't stay
34:43in the family.
34:44She knew that
34:44she wanted to be away
34:45in case she was going
34:46to get the same treatment
34:47because that's what
34:48Batchan had effectively
34:48told her
34:49so she was under
34:50a lot of pressure.
34:51We arranged with her
34:52and her parents
34:54for her to leave
34:55the family
34:55with her children
34:56and come to
34:57temporary accommodation
34:58and be together.
34:59What she wanted
35:00was protection
35:01quite rightly
35:02and so Kingston Council
35:04gave us a property
35:05and we moved her in
35:07for which
35:08I'll remain
35:09forever grateful.
35:10There was never
35:11a formal withdrawing
35:12of a statement
35:13ever
35:13because we acted
35:15reasonably quickly.
35:16We'd put Mrs. Athwell
35:17somewhere safe.
35:18My name is Alan Goodley.
35:21I'm a retired
35:22detective sergeant
35:23from the Metropolitan Police.
35:25In April 2007
35:27I was deployed
35:29as a family liaison officer
35:32to Sarbjit Athwell.
35:35My SIO, Clive Driscoll
35:37asked me to establish
35:38a relationship with her
35:40whereby we could
35:42contact each other freely.
35:45Well Alan was like
35:45our first reserve.
35:47He's worked on murder squads
35:48flying squad.
35:49The most unlikely bloke
35:51you'd ever think
35:51in a million years
35:52to be an FLO
35:53but he was blinded.
35:55When you're moving someone
35:56you don't want that address
35:57known to anybody
35:58other than maybe
36:00close family members
36:01trying to make sure
36:02that the bad guys
36:04and girls
36:04don't find out
36:05where they are.
36:07Having had previous experience
36:09within the witness
36:09protection program
36:11then you will take
36:12anti-surveillance
36:13methods and techniques.
36:17Passing the address
36:18not looking about yourself
36:20not doing U-turns
36:21at the top of the road
36:23and coming back
36:23and parking.
36:24I know Angela and Alan
36:25did all sorts of things
36:27to make her feel safe
36:28because that's what
36:30you're trying to do
36:31is protect your witness.
36:33It's very difficult
36:33to understand
36:34when somebody
36:35has had to ask permission
36:37to do everything
36:39that you suddenly
36:40take them out
36:41of an environment
36:42where they do have
36:43to make
36:44all of their decisions
36:45themselves.
36:47There was an occasion
36:48where she
36:50she was in
36:51Kingston Town Centre
36:53and she rang me
36:54and she said
36:56she didn't know
36:57what to do
36:57all these thoughts
36:59were flashing
36:59through her mind
37:00and would I come
37:02and see her
37:03we had a drive round
37:04and then
37:05took her home.
37:06To suddenly be
37:07independent
37:07and having to
37:08make decisions
37:08for herself
37:09I think she found
37:10that really overwhelming.
37:11I remember walking
37:12into this warehouse
37:13and looking at
37:14all these beds
37:15and I remember
37:16turning to her
37:17and saying along
37:17the lines of
37:18if I'm not going
37:20to sleep on a mattress
37:21you're not sleeping
37:22on a mattress.
37:23It's not so much
37:24being a flow
37:25it's just one human
37:27helping another human
37:28at that moment
37:29when they need it.
37:31It's not written
37:32in a book
37:32you know
37:33go and help
37:34a victim find
37:35a mattress
37:35but if they need
37:37help
37:37you do the right
37:39thing by them.
37:45I don't think
37:46she believed
37:47the day would ever
37:47come that Bachan
37:48and Sukhdev
37:49would be charged
37:51with the murder
37:52of Sergit.
37:53It had been
37:53so many years
37:54her trying
37:57to tell the police
37:57living with the family
37:59and then finally
38:00telling us
38:01her account
38:02that had led
38:02to them being charged.
38:04She was in shock.
38:05the role
38:07of a flow
38:08at the trial
38:09is crucial
38:09to make that
38:10as stressless
38:11as possible.
38:13Sabja was really
38:13really scared
38:14but I did
38:16everything I could
38:16to explain it
38:17to her
38:17to deal with
38:18any concerns
38:19that she had.
38:20Angie literally
38:20just talked me
38:21through the whole
38:22process.
38:24She supported me.
38:25when the trial
38:27date was coming
38:28up I took her
38:29to the Old Bailey
38:30to show her
38:31the building
38:31so that on the
38:33day that she
38:33would turn up
38:34it wouldn't be
38:34a complete
38:35and utter shock
38:36because there's
38:36so much to take
38:37in.
38:38That gave me
38:38some reassurance
38:39that when I come
38:40into the day
38:41when I come in
38:42to give them
38:42my evidence
38:43of the day
38:43this is what
38:44I'm going
38:44to expect.
38:49The trial
38:50eventually started
38:51on the 25th
38:51of April
38:522007.
38:54The most unique
38:55thing about
38:55this case
38:57is that
38:58nobody
38:58was ever
39:00recovered.
39:01Normally
39:01in a case
39:02like this
39:03we'd have to
39:05be in a position
39:05to prove death.
39:07The evidence
39:08was
39:10circumstantial.
39:12There is always
39:13that element
39:13of doubt
39:14in the back
39:14of your mind
39:15that that wouldn't
39:16have been
39:17sufficient enough
39:18for a conviction
39:20of murder
39:21what Sarjit
39:23had to say
39:24in her statement
39:26and the evidence
39:27that she was
39:29going to give
39:30was crucial.
39:31My role
39:32was to pick
39:33her up
39:34bring her
39:34to the court
39:35be with her
39:37during the day
39:38look after her
39:39and then
39:39take her
39:41home.
39:42When it came
39:42to going
39:43into the
39:43courtroom
39:44I just remember
39:45saying
39:45your most
39:46important role
39:47is just to
39:48explain to the
39:49jury
39:49and the judge
39:51what happened.
39:52Direct your
39:53answers and
39:54responses
39:54to the jury
39:56because they're
39:57the ones that
39:57need to hear
39:58your account.
40:03We arranged
40:04that I would
40:04go in with her
40:06and sit to one
40:07side so that
40:07if she was
40:08feeling a bit
40:08anxious or nervous
40:09she could look
40:11at me
40:11just to let her
40:13know
40:13I'm really nervous
40:14could you help
40:14me please.
40:15And I remember
40:16she was absolutely
40:17petrified
40:17and it was
40:18my job
40:19to reassure
40:20her
40:20that actually
40:21the worst
40:22of it
40:22has already
40:22happened.
40:24I think it
40:24must have
40:25been my
40:25faith in
40:26God that
40:27helped me
40:28through going
40:28into the
40:28box and
40:29giving evidence.
40:30She spent
40:31three and a
40:31half days
40:32in the
40:33witness box
40:33giving her
40:34evidence
40:34and being
40:35cross-examined
40:35and that
40:36was tough
40:36that was
40:37really
40:37tough.
40:38I was able
40:39to give
40:39my evidence
40:40tell the jury
40:41exactly what
40:42happened
40:42everything
40:43they did
40:43how they
40:44did it
40:44all the
40:45threats
40:46that was
40:46put towards
40:47me and
40:48my children.
40:49She stuck
40:49to what
40:50she knew
40:50and although
40:51it was
40:51stressful
40:52for her
40:53she did
40:53a fantastic
40:54job
40:55explaining
40:55what had
40:56happened.
40:56In court
40:57she was
40:58very truthful
40:59she didn't
41:00hide from
41:01it
41:01she was
41:02petrified
41:03no very
41:04brave
41:05incredibly
41:06brave.
41:07At the
41:08heart of
41:08this was
41:08a young
41:09woman
41:09whose life
41:10had been
41:10cruelly
41:10taken
41:11by people
41:12who felt
41:12they had
41:12the right
41:13to do
41:13that.
41:14and
41:14Sarjit
41:15was
41:15putting
41:15that
41:16wrong
41:16right
41:17by making
41:18sure
41:18people
41:19understood
41:19what
41:19had
41:20happened.
41:21She was
41:21the voice
41:22for
41:23Serjit.
41:24Seeing
41:25Bachchan and
41:26Sukhdev in
41:26that courtroom
41:27was really
41:27really hard
41:28for me.
41:29At times
41:30I tried
41:30avoiding it
41:31and angling
41:32myself
41:32towards the
41:32judge.
41:33Neither
41:34Bakhan
41:35Kool or
41:36Sukhdev
41:37Athwal
41:37appeared to
41:39show
41:39any emotion
41:40whilst they
41:41were in
41:42the dark
41:43at the
41:43Old Bailey.
41:44It was
41:44very unnerving.
41:46Bachchan Kool
41:47and his
41:48Sukhdev
41:48did suggest
41:49that she
41:50run off
41:50with another
41:52man to
41:52Mumbai
41:53in India
41:54and there
41:54was certainly
41:55no evidence
41:56to suggest
41:57that.
41:57Sukhdev
41:58gave evidence.
41:59He just
42:00came across
42:01sort of
42:01like he was
42:02lying.
42:02at the
42:10conclusion of
42:10the trial
42:11Bachchan Kool
42:12was found
42:12guilty of
42:13murder
42:13of
42:14Sergit
42:14Athwal
42:14and she
42:15was sentenced
42:16to 20
42:16years
42:17imprisonment.
42:18Sukhdev
42:19Athwal
42:19was sentenced
42:20to 27
42:22years imprisonment
42:23for the
42:24murder of
42:24his wife
42:25Sergit.
42:26Bachchan Kool
42:27has never
42:27shown any
42:28remorse for
42:29her part
42:29in the murder
42:30of her
42:30daughter-in-law.
42:31Sukhdev has
42:32not made
42:33any comment,
42:35apology,
42:36acknowledgement
42:36that he
42:37played a
42:38major part
42:39in the murder
42:39of his wife.
42:40I phoned
42:43Mrs Athwal
42:44to tell her
42:46what had
42:46happened.
42:47They'd been
42:48found guilty
42:49and then the
42:49phone went
42:50dead.
42:51And I
42:51said,
42:52are you alright?
42:52And then the
42:53phone was her
42:54sister.
42:55Said,
42:55she's fainted.
42:57She'd fainted,
42:58I told her,
42:58and she'd
42:59crashed down.
42:59I just
43:00felt a
43:01dizzy spell
43:01and I sat
43:02on the
43:02floor.
43:03I think
43:03she was
43:03in shock
43:04that actually
43:05the jury
43:06and everyone
43:06had heard
43:07her story
43:07and believed
43:08what she'd
43:09explained,
43:09what had
43:10happened.
43:11It was
43:11almost as
43:11if it
43:12was confirming
43:12that what
43:13she'd
43:13done,
43:13it was
43:13the right
43:14thing to
43:14do.
43:15I was
43:15relieved
43:15that they
43:16were found
43:16guilty and
43:18finally we
43:19were able
43:19to get
43:19justice for
43:20surgery.
43:20That was
43:20the biggest
43:21thing that
43:21made me
43:22really,
43:23really happy.
43:23I kept
43:24in contact
43:24with Saab
43:25after the
43:26trial just
43:27to make
43:28sure that
43:28she was
43:28still okay.
43:29She was
43:30moved from
43:31another property
43:31to a new
43:32home.
43:33By then
43:33she was
43:34more confident.
43:36She had
43:36the courage
43:37to stand
43:39up for
43:39what was
43:40right and
43:41to live
43:42her life.
43:46Angie's
43:46coming over
43:47today.
43:47I'm really
43:48excited to
43:48see her.
43:49It's been
43:49quite a while
43:50actually when I
43:51saw her last.
43:52Just looking
43:53forward to seeing
43:53her, yeah.
43:54I know the case
43:55has ended
43:55now, but the
43:57friendship we
43:57made throughout
43:58the court
43:59case, that
44:00still remains.
44:01has been
44:02seen.
44:03I like
44:06a lot of
44:06coffee.
44:07How are you?
44:08How are you?
44:08How are you?
44:09You look amazing.
44:11How are you feeling?
44:11I'm all right.
44:14I love you. I'm good, I'm good.
44:16It's so lovely to see you, so lovely to see you.
44:19Yeah, I like you. Good, good.
44:23Well, love must be treating you well at the minute,
44:25because you look amazing. It is, thank you so much.
44:27The woman that I first met at that interview in October 2005
44:33is a completely different person to who I see today.
44:38She's blossomed, she's free,
44:40and she has such a lovely, warm, loving family
44:44who are all so proud of her for doing the right thing.
44:48And she's gone on to do incredible things,
44:50supporting others who are in a similar situation.
44:53After the trial, I joined the police
44:55because I wanted to give something back.
44:58Officers came up to me and said that
45:00we could deal with people like you in the police force.
45:03I think Clive encouraged me again and again,
45:05and he goes, just apply for it.
45:07I think he saw the potential that I had.
45:09I applied for it, did all my training, did all my tests,
45:14and that was one of the proudest moments of my life.
45:18I'm going to hear about the charity as well.
45:22It's going well. That's incredible.
45:24Yeah, yeah.
45:25We've formed a charity called True Honour in her memory,
45:29and we support victims who go through similar situations,
45:34and we support survivors.
45:37I think she's just an incredible person.
45:39I can't thank Angie and Helen for all the support they gave me.
45:43They were absolutely amazing.
45:45That was the biggest thing that made me really, really happy.
45:48We finally got justice for surgery.
45:51You've got each other for us,
45:54and this is one of the things we've done in our community.
45:56It's been amazing.
45:57It's incredible.
45:58Its way of achieving this,
46:00and it's been amazing.
46:01The heart of a lion's mother and a woman could die a bit and the dumbass.
46:03It was a young man whose vision was something that had been taken.
46:04It was amazing.
46:05It was just an incredible person.
46:06It was just a big man.
46:07I'm really sad to see.
46:08It's been a while in the past.
46:09The original dream is a small man.
46:11Our vision is a beautiful woman's love.
46:12It's been a beautiful.
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