- 6 weeks ago
- #thefutureisfemale
On this episode of #TheFutureIsFemale Melisa Idris speaks with Dr Alaa Murabit, Managing Partner for Sustainable Growth at 500 Global. She was appointed by the UN Secretary-General to be a Sustainable Development Goals Advocate.
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00:00Hello and good evening. I'm Melissa Idris. Welcome to The Future is Female. This is the show where we find the extraordinary in every woman.
00:18I'm here at Kazanah Megatrends Forum 2025 with one of the speakers at the event today, Dr. Ala Murabit, who is a medical doctor and a movement builder.
00:28And because of this, she was appointed by the UN Secretary General to be a Sustainable Development Goals Advocate.
00:35She also currently serves as Managing Partner for Sustainable Growth at 500 Global. I wanted to welcome you on the show.
00:42Hello, Dr. Ala. Welcome to the show.
00:44How are you? Thanks for having me.
00:46Well, thank you. So I think many of our viewers today will be meeting you for the first time.
00:52And I, you know, want to say that you have worked in war zones. You've spoken to, you know, global leaders. You've sat at negotiating tables in the UN.
01:03If you were to introduce yourself to the audience today through a single story, one that represents the work that you do, why you do the work that you do, what would it be?
01:13Oh, that's an excellent question. I think I would actually start with, I am the middle child of 11 brothers and sisters. Perfect middle. Five older, five younger.
01:23Wow.
01:24And for me, actually, I would probably take them back to arguably our dining table when we were growing up. My parents had immigrated to Canada. They're originally from Libya, North Africa.
01:35And I spent the first 14 years of my life being raised in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, and then moved when I was 15 back to Libya when I had finished high school.
01:44So I would probably take them actually to our dining room table because I think there's so much that you learn about a person, about the way, about the world.
01:52And I think for me, everything I've learned about diplomacy and politics and rights and humanity has been a consequence of being one of 11 children in an immigrant family and has been a consequence of the way my parents taught us to negotiate and debate about everything from faith to, you know, politics to social norms.
02:15And I took so much of that with me into medical school. It was what really convinced me that my calling was to be a physician.
02:22And then in my final year of medical school, so much of that really, you know, kind of encouraged me, convinced me to create a women's rights organization in the middle of a war.
02:33And so I think I would I would really take them back to the foundation. So often we go to the moment when you put all of those lessons and learnings into action when it clicks when it clicks.
02:43And I think there's so much more to be said about when you're building so much of that identity and so much of that value system that drives you into these spaces because everything I've done since has been a consequence.
02:54Yeah, talk to me about that. So you mentioned building, creating a women's rights group in the middle of the war. You were so young when you started it, you were 21.
03:04I think about all the things that I didn't do in my 20s. And I'm in awe of that such a remarkable thing. Did you know when you were creating it, what it would eventually become?
03:15Talk to me about the idea of creating it, what you wanted to do. And now in hindsight, when you think about what it has become, what are the lessons that you've learned?
03:25Well, I think age is such an interesting thing because I think I had the benefit of what I now call the arrogance of youth.
03:32There's a level of like, you know what I mean? You're naive, but in like such a...
03:37You're so confident.
03:38You're so confident. You're like, you know what, these people, they just don't have the information. If I just give them the information, if just I show up, there's definitely an element of like, well, they just don't have the data.
03:50So if we show them the data, things will change. And so when I started the organization, the focus really was on how do we present these solutions in a compelling way to political leaders and to an emerging political class?
04:03You know, emerging political movements that we had not yet had. And in the beginning, the organization was fundamentally focused on women, peace and security, on really engaging given the context of conflict.
04:15And then over time expanded to really be looking at, okay, what are economic labor policies that could support women? What would a women's, you know, a women's charter look like in a constitution?
04:25And really took that role on. But I will say, you know, it was really born out of a belief that every single person has the capacity and the capability to change outcomes if they engage.
04:36And I think I felt that so, so strongly at 21. And I hadn't found the vehicle in front of me. So it was, you know, I needed to create the vehicle.
04:46So you created it because it was a gap that you saw.
04:49It's a gap that I saw. And it's the same thing can be said for everything from the Sustainable Development Goals to the work I do today at 500 Global.
04:55In almost every space that I've worked, it's been what is the reality we're looking at?
05:01What are the, who's missing from this room? And how do we bring them in?
05:04What are the gaps we're seeing? And then how do we build to be able to actually create tools and systems that are more fit for purpose in the moment of time we're in?
05:12Could I get you to unpack that? Because I think there are a lot of people today who feel very strongly about justice, about equality, but they struggled to turn that into that conviction, into meaningful change, into real concrete action.
05:29So when you did it, especially in one of the most difficult contexts in the, in the middle of the war, a war, a civil war, how did you do that?
05:39Talk to me a little bit about moving from an idea to building a movement that people can get behind, can take seriously and can effect change eventually.
05:49I have a couple of answers to that. One, I'll start with first answering the question directly, but then I really want to talk about how we define leadership,
05:56because I think it's also very important. In my instance in particular, and I think in most successful movement builders,
06:03I think recognizing that people are also experiencing what you're talking about is critically important.
06:08You're not just solving a challenge for yourself. There is a collective behind it. That's the point of a movement. It's never one singular person.
06:15There were so many incredible organizations that were working in this space, and the reason we actually did something called the One Voice Conference
06:22was to be able to bring them together to say, okay, can we coalesce around a movement, right?
06:27And it's recognizing that so many people need to see themselves in what you're trying to build and need to see the challenges
06:34and need to feel like they are architects in the solutions. And so that was very important to me very early on.
06:40I think the second thing is conviction is a very powerful thing. And when you see someone who is fully convinced that they can make change,
06:47you believe in your own agency a bit more. And so I do think that kind of arrogance of youth was really compelling.
06:52People are like, wait, if she thinks this is doable, then it probably is? Maybe? She, you know, she seems intelligent enough.
06:58And so you're able to bring in people from a vision, an idea, you know, something that feels compelling, feels actionable.
07:05It feels, you know, like they can see the light at the end of the tunnel. So that was critically important.
07:11And the third thing connects me to kind of how we define leadership, which is, I think there are so many people around the world who are so justice oriented.
07:20It is one of the most exciting things to see at a time when a lot of our politics can be really disappointing globally.
07:26It's exciting to see people out in the millions, marching, demanding justice, demanding equity, demanding rights.
07:33And I think we underestimate the power of doing that in your local community.
07:37So VLW really started in my local city. It wasn't the capital. It was my community. It was people I knew. It was my university.
07:45And it expanded from there. And I think we need to give more credit and respect and space to people who in their own workplace,
07:53in their own family, in their own religious community, in their own sphere of power are saying, you know what, I don't feel comfortable with something.
08:00I'm going to demand change because that's how it starts. Not everybody is going to go from day one to a global movement.
08:07I didn't. Right. I think when we see something in our own lives and we say, you know, I'm going to demand better and I'm going to influence my sphere of power.
08:17I'm going to put my reputation, my networks, my credibility on the line for this to be able to drive change in my community where my voice can hold the most power.
08:28I think from that, the most change happens around the world.
08:31That's so inspiring. But I think for many people today, and especially today, I want to note that Gaza is top of mind.
08:41So with your work, you know, having worked in conflict, so in trying to protect people from the impact and repercussions of conflict,
08:50when you look at what's happening in Gaza today, the suffering of women, children, entire families, what strikes you the most about the way the world is responding?
09:00Oh, the absolute failure of leadership. I think for a very long time, and I have been part of the belief that we have a core understanding of human value.
09:14And my mission in life, regardless of whichever platform I am working through, is that every person has the right to a dignified life,
09:22and no child should die of preventable causes. And I understood that to be the hallmark of human rights values.
09:29Many of us who come from countries in what is called the global south are often told that, you know, these are human rights values.
09:36These are important international values. And I think it has been a glaring education for so many people about the lack of moral consistency,
09:45and the lack of moral leadership, and the illusion of values that drive so many of our international platforms.
09:52For me, it's been an incredibly interesting education, not one that has been surprising, but has been shocking, if that makes sense.
09:59And one that feels like it has shifted a lot of our, rightly shifted a lot of the global conversations around everything from human rights,
10:11to sustainable growth, to development, to equity and opportunity. And I think it should.
10:16And I will say one of the things that is, I hope, a silver lining, and that sounds awful to say, but is that many countries like Libya,
10:26like Malaysia, are starting to look at their role in the world and say, actually, we are going to define this differently.
10:33And we are going to be assertive in our belief that human rights matters. I mean, seeing South Africa stand up and the ICJ is an excellent example of that,
10:43to say, we're going to lever some of these international forums to actually demand the equity, the human rights that they are supposedly built on.
10:52And I think that's been exciting to see.
10:54It has been an almost pivotal point in the way the world has seen the rules of the world.
11:02Hugely.
11:03The rules-based order. Can I ask you in terms of…
11:06Whose rules?
11:07Whose rules and who's playing by those rules? And whose rules apply to whom?
11:12Exactly.
11:24Can I ask you, Dr. Allah, when you think about the role of women in peace and security, in the current setting of the global power dynamics, women are often left out from those decisions.
11:46You've made it your life mission to make sure that women are at the table. When we think about what that looks like, could you paint a picture for us?
11:56For those of us who are not in the room when those decisions are being made, what does real inclusion look like, taking into account the role of women in peace building?
12:06So back in the year 2000, there was a resolution called Women, Peace and Security. And it was really born out of the recognition, resolution 1325.
12:14It was born out of the recognition that 90% of our peace processes fail within five years. And if you imagine the implications that has, that means that you are likely to go back into conflict, you are not building up infrastructure, education stalls again, healthcare stalls again.
12:30And what we found was with the inclusion of women at the agenda setting phase to really talk about, okay, what are the things that need to be demanded of most?
12:37It's not simply, you know, reparations, it's also education, it's not just having an inclusive security process, meant that we were 35 times more likely to have those same processes last 15 years, which is huge impact, 35 times, a huge impact on education, on healthcare, on economic development and opportunity.
13:00And I think that that's very telling. And it's not, you know, some people sometimes tell me like, okay, well, if we just had women everywhere, then there would be peace.
13:07And I'm like, that's not the argument, actually. The argument is for inclusion. What you want is a representative body.
13:13And because conflict isn't just born out of those with guns, right? Conflict is born out of a collective.
13:19And if you only have a certain group sitting at the table, once their needs are met, they leave the table.
13:24But once they realize that actually they're not getting the same benefit that they once got in conflict, they want to go back, right?
13:31And so you find that the people who have the most to lose are the ones who are most necessary at the table.
13:36And to your point, that's most often women and children.
13:39And so really having civil society having women ultimately changes the trajectory of peace processes.
13:45It means that more people are staying in school, more people are gaining employment, more people are seeing the potential for a conflict-free society
13:54and able to build the resilience that they need over time.
13:57The evidence is remarkable to think that.
14:00You can see why at 21, I was like, we just need to tell people the evidence.
14:05Anecdotally, you think it's true, but clearly the evidence has confirmed to this.
14:09Yeah, the evidence is really compelling.
14:12So I have to say that I watched your TED Talk in 2015, years ago, and it really moved me and changed me personally as a journalist.
14:24And I was so excited to hear that you would be in town today and I wanted to jump on the opportunity to speak to you here at the forum.
14:31Looking back at your TED Talk now, I'm just wondering if you could assess in the decade since where I would encourage everyone to go and watch Dr. Ella's TED Talk.
14:43I think the title is, if I'm getting it correctly, What My Religion Says About Women.
14:50And it was profoundly moving for me.
14:53In the 10 years that it's been out there, being viral, what has been the impact to you?
14:59Have people come up to you and talk to you about it?
15:02Have you seen change and progress because of the words you put out there?
15:06People do come up and talk to me about it. It's actually one of the most kind of sustained discussions I have.
15:13I think some come up and want to challenge the notion that religion can be leveraged for good.
15:19I often dispute that by saying anything that can be leveraged for negative can usually also be leveraged for good.
15:25We just need to be able to engage with it in the most accurate way or in the most effective way.
15:29Some often tell me, you know, hey, it's giving greater power to religious leadership.
15:34And I say, in many contexts, religious leadership doesn't need to be given greater power.
15:39It's actually rights movements that do.
15:42Some come up and tell me it's profoundly changed their understanding of how they engage with their own faith community.
15:48And that's across faiths.
15:50And how they could engage with it differently to advance some of their rights missions.
15:56And so I think in the 10 years since I only feel more strongly that religion is really one of the most effective social organizing and kind of communities that people congregate around,
16:08identify with, define their life values and their life mission from.
16:13And I think that that's critically important for us to not only be able to recognize but then to say how do we ensure that religion,
16:19this incredibly powerful force is one that uplifts and motivates and demands the equity that I think so many of us believe our faiths demand.
16:29It really spoke to me, sorry to interrupt, it really spoke to me about reclaiming women's leadership from within my faith.
16:38I'm Muslim as well.
16:40When you look at the world now, do you think that reclamation is happening bit by bit?
16:44Are we progressing towards that?
16:45It's so interesting you ask that.
16:47So I have actually a, I have an op-ed coming up in the New York Times in December.
16:51It's part of their turning point series and it really focuses on kind of what you think is happening in the world.
16:57And I point to what is resurgence of faith.
17:00In a time of AI and automation and more people are reclaiming for the first time in decades,
17:06a decrease in faith has stagnated and the younger population is actually increasing what they're calling in their spirituality or religious identity.
17:13And I think that's so interesting because I think people are seeking and looking for community.
17:18I agree.
17:19I think people are seeking and looking for purpose and for agency.
17:22And, and it is one of the historically most effective ways in which people seek that out.
17:28So this reconnection to some, some form of divine.
17:31And I think it's particularly interesting when you think about global norm setting and policy.
17:38A lot of our countries say that they are secular states and yet most of their laws are still anchored in some faith.
17:46And, and so faith continues to be a defining function of our norms, of our institutions.
17:52And I think reentering the conversation to say, okay, has that influence, how effective has it been?
17:58Which, you know, has it, has it really been a representative interpretation?
18:03All of those are very fair things.
18:05And, and I'm excited to see more young people, more women come into the conversation and say, actually, wait, I don't understand.
18:12Where is that interpretation?
18:14Um, this interpretation has been solely defined by those who, who identify in likeness.
18:19And so I'd like to, um, understand that.
18:22I'd like to get a little bit more framing on that.
18:24Seeing more women enter official, um, religious education and, and, um, really kind of increase their influence and voice there has been really exciting.
18:32I can't wait for your op-ed to come out then for me to read it.
18:36Um, in, in summary, I, I want to ask you maybe a message of hope or what keeps you going, especially in times where, in times like these where, you know, as Kazana Megatrends, um, the theme is the uncertainty, the age of uncertainty.
18:53When you think about how you have seen maybe the worst of humanity, even, what keeps you going?
19:01What keeps you hopeful?
19:02Um, you've seen the worst, but I'm sure you've also seen it at its best.
19:06Yeah.
19:07So, yeah.
19:08When I was younger, my dad's a physician.
19:11And when I was younger, as I mentioned, I had a lot of siblings.
19:14So I would often go, um, after school to the hospital.
19:17And I knew I wanted to be a doctor from, I would say, when I was five years old, um, cause I would go to the hospital and, and I would argue that a hospital has seen more prayers than any mosque, church, or synagogue.
19:30Um, people are their absolute, at their absolute most human, um, in a hospital.
19:37And I, I felt so strongly that that was a calling, um, to be part of, to be part of a community that's sole mission is to save lives, is to prevent, um, pain and suffering.
19:52I felt really aligned mainly with my, my faith beliefs actually, um, that this was a calling.
19:58And so, I think that gives me hope.
20:00Um, this idea that we are all put, we're all put on this earth, I think, for a finite period of time.
20:07And nothing is going to get solved, um, in our time.
20:10I mean, it's also something I learned from my faith.
20:13You know, the Prophet, you know, in his time, there were these challenges.
20:18Um, and if the Prophets and the Sahaba were not able to individually solve them, I think we should enter spaces with humility and say,
20:26I might not individually be able to solve this.
20:29A lot of these challenges will still exist when I'm gone.
20:32But inshallah, I move the needle.
20:34Hopefully I do my part.
20:35And I leave the world a little bit better than I found it.
20:38Um, and so for me, that keeps me going.
20:40That my, that there is a level of humility.
20:43Um, so much of this is not in my hands.
20:45Um, but what is, is how I show up in the world.
20:49And what I leave behind.
20:50And what I leave for others.
20:51Um, and hopefully I have done my part.
20:53And others do theirs.
20:54And I think ultimately that will lead us into a much more, um, equitable, much more fair,
20:59much more respectful, um, place for all.
21:02You've given me hope.
21:03It's been such a joy talking to you.
21:05Thank you so much.
21:06Likewise.
21:07Thank you so much for having me.
21:08Thank you so much for having me.
21:09That's all the time we have for you on this episode of the Futures Female.
21:12I'm Melissa Idris signing off for the evening.
21:14Thank you so much for watching.
21:15And good night.
21:16Good night.
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