- 5 months ago
Anna Wintour’s Interview About Appointing a New Editor of American Vogue
The Condé Nast veteran on choosing Chloe Malle as her successor, changing fashion, “The Devil Wears Prada,” her signature sunglasses and hair style, and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s Met Gala look.
The Condé Nast veteran on choosing Chloe Malle as her successor, changing fashion, “The Devil Wears Prada,” her signature sunglasses and hair style, and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s Met Gala look.
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00:00So Anna, we are talking on the day that Connie Nass announced that Chloe Mao
00:04is going to succeed you as editor of American Vogue. How do you feel?
00:11I feel great. I love Chloe. I'm very happy for her. She's going to do a brilliant job.
00:16We've worked together for well over a decade. But at the same time, she really had to prove
00:21herself during the interview process. We saw a lot of amazing, amazing candidates. And
00:27Chloe consistently came back with the clearest vision and the most original ideas and understanding
00:34of what a Vogue in, well, I don't think we can talk in five, ten years anymore. In two
00:40years, it's going to look like.
00:42What are the specifics?
00:46She understands a newsroom. She understands immediacy. She understands culture. She understands
00:52completely that fashion doesn't exist in a vacuum, that it's a result of many different
00:58forces, whether it's something that might be happening in music or film or politically and
01:04wants to put it into that kind of a context. Plus, she has a great sense of humor. I mean,
01:10her story that she thought of this summer called Doge, I mean, it went through the roof with our
01:17numbers. And it was so much fun just to look at all those crazy dogs dressed up with earrings and
01:22beautiful collars. And celebrities from all over the world were sending their dogs.
01:29So she has a really good balance about what works.
01:33Now, why step aside from American Vogue now? Have you been thinking about this for a long time?
01:39I have been thinking about it for some time. And it felt like this was the right time because
01:46we're seeing so much change in fashion when we go off to the shows. Well, actually, I think they
01:51start next week. I believe there's well over 14 new creative directors in very high level positions
01:59all over Europe and some here. So it seemed like a good moment to bring in someone with a different
02:08perspective and a different generation who could look at things in a new way.
02:12Now, at first in 1988, you burst on the scene as the new Vogue editor by putting somebody on the
02:20cover with a pair of jeans on. In fact, I noticed that Chloe was wearing jeans in her photograph on
02:26the Vogue website. Was she maybe signaling something?
02:31I think that picture was taken a while ago, but she looked great. And similarly to Chloe,
02:37I had been working at Vogue as creative director before I took the position at American Vogue
02:44and also British Vogue. So I also had some history. And I think that's a very helpful way to start a
02:55new job to understand how things work, who the people are, how decisions are made, and maybe you
03:00want to do things in a different way. But just having that is a huge advantage.
03:05So you have this odd situation now. You are not leaving your office, your physical office. You've
03:11got two huge jobs at Condé Nast where you're the editorial director of, well, of everything. And
03:18you've got a lot going on, whether it's the Met Gala or your other interests and family and all this,
03:25but you're still, you're right there. And your successor is down the hall. And Chloe said this to the
03:31Times today, the truth is that no one's going to replace Anna. And so you're going to be right
03:37down the hall. And the Times wrote that both women have acknowledged the strangeness of this
03:42arrangement. How will this work?
03:44Well, I think I implicitly trust Chloe. And I want her to succeed to the best possible degree. I think
03:54that she is beloved by her team. I think that she will require from all of us, not just me, from
04:03everybody and from our editors group, from everybody here at Condé Nast. I think she'll, and she's the kind
04:09of editor that welcomes that. She doesn't work in any way in isolation. She's very open. She's very
04:15communicative. Her office is always full of people. She's very outgoing.
04:22But will you be in her head is what I mean. In other words, will she be trying to edit
04:26to please you?
04:28I don't think so. I absolutely don't think so. I think she's very much her own person. She has her
04:31own point of view. I mean...
04:33How does it differ?
04:33She looks at things with a more... What's the right word? Not eccentric, quirky, unusual
04:41point of view. She comes at things from different angles. She's interested in fashion, but not
04:49obsessed with it. So that there are many levels that will weigh into her decisions. I think that
04:56she will not be drawn into, I don't like this word, but a fashionista conversation. I think
05:03that she will be able to step back and look at things in a very healthy context.
05:08Has the fashionista conversation dissipated and disappeared in the contemporary world?
05:13I think it exists very much in certain circles. And I think that what I love about Chloe is
05:20that she's an insider, but she's also an outsider.
05:24What you're saying is she doesn't want to be an Anna Mini-Me.
05:27No, not at all. And that was very clear during the interview process and all the conversations
05:32that we've had. She wants to be her own person. I think she's not interested in those kinds of
05:39comparisons. She just wants to be herself and show herself and prove herself and make news,
05:45as I'm sure she will.
05:46So when you took over Vogue, Vogue had this immensely central place in this very big business and in the
05:53fashion discussion. And now we live in an age of Instagram, TikTok, the technological democratization
06:01of fashion itself. And God knows what role AI is going to play. So how is her job different from
06:08yours?
06:09Well, I look on Vogue as being the world's biggest fashion influencer. If you look at our reach from
06:15a social perspective, American Vogue alone has well over 50 million followers. If you look at the numbers
06:22that we receive on our site or on our app or the way whatever we may be putting across any of our
06:34platforms are received or seen or heard, the influence is immeasurable. So I think, in a way,
06:41Chloe has a much bigger platform than I had. When I came in, I always remember Alex Lieberman
06:46telling me...
06:47Editorial director in those days.
06:49Yes. Editorial director, wonderful figure, my mentor and my boss for many years. He used to tell
06:56me that they would go to Jones Beach in the afternoons because there wasn't that much to do. Can you
07:02imagine that, David?
07:03I really cannot.
07:04So I don't think that Chloe will be spending any of her time at Jones Beach in the afternoon. But I
07:09actually think if I remember when I started at American Vogue and it was solely a print publication
07:16with a few events and genteel sort of parties that we had to go to. Now she has all these
07:23different ways of talking to our audiences, whether it's through social or TikTok or print or events,
07:31which are a huge part of what we think about today or any of the many, many ways that we reach our
07:38audiences. How amazing, how exciting, how interesting, how culturally relevant is it? And
07:46it's so fascinating to see how much Vogue means to our world. I mean, I was flooded with emails this
07:54morning. It does mean a lot to people within the fashion world and without. And it's a great
08:02honor and it's a great responsibility.
08:05You mentioned print. When I started in 1998 at The New Yorker, I thought I was about to lose my job
08:11within a month. Cy Newhouse, of course, owns the joint and ran Conde Nast completely and thoroughly
08:20in those days, asked to have lunch with me at his apartment. Usually we went to some restaurant.
08:25I thought, well, this is a world record. You've really done it. And he took out...
08:31Was it a yellow pad?
08:32He took out a yellow pad and we were losing money at that point. I won't say how much,
08:37but it was not insubstantial. And he said, you know, if we went from weekly to bi-weekly,
08:44we would save millions and millions of dollars and we would suddenly become profitable. And then he said
08:49something that I'll never forget. He said, but it's your decision. It was the editor's decision
08:55to make this very consequential. And I decided pretty quickly that that would signal, in fact,
09:01something terrible. Not only it would be terrible for The New Yorker, it would be terrible for
09:06businesses that it would signal the life magazinization of The New Yorker. We live in a
09:12very different time now. The internet was not in play then. What does print mean going forward for
09:19Vogue? Chloe, in fact, mentioned that she wants to have fewer print editions. Why?
09:25Well, I think we all look at print as something that is collectible and something you might want
09:33to archive and hold on to. And I think it also has to represent a news-breaking moment. Like,
09:40you need a reason to put somebody on the cover for any of the stories that you might be running
09:46inside. And I think that's what Chloe was talking about, that it has to feel in a way more important,
09:53more substantial, and separate from the day-to-day news-breaking stories that we put up on
10:01your site or our site.
10:03But it's not purely a decision about decline of print advertising or it's not a purely business decision.
10:09I think it's the right decision. And I think there's a lot of different factors that play
10:15into it. And obviously, it's something that we all need to sit down and talk about and figure out
10:20what the right path is going forward. But I think it comes from the idea that print has to feel
10:27more substantial and more important. I mean, it's our runway show. If you think about
10:33how many people actually go to a Vuitton fashion show, it's between 400 and 800 people.
10:42But then it goes out to millions and millions. And I think instantly by Instagram or live stream,
10:47whatever it may be. And I think print has that same responsibility. You're giving a message. You're
10:53making news. You're giving your vision. But it doesn't necessarily have to be over and over
10:59again, many, many times a year. I mean, I think most of the big designers probably
11:03have six or seven shows a year.
11:05You're a very politically engaged person and a very politically aware person. And it's no news to you
11:10that the world right now is in so many ways in really bad condition. How do you make a case that
11:18fashion is important in the midst of all that?
11:22Well, I think fashion is always important. It's a question of self-expression and
11:26a statement about yourself and, you know, whether it's a loud logo you might choose to put on
11:32yourself. Fashion can say so many different things. And forgive me, David, but how boring
11:39would it be if everybody was just wearing a dark suit and a white shirt all the time? I think people
11:43are individuals and they ought to be able to express themselves. And it's a form of creativity.
11:49For decades, you've been known as the editor with exacting control over every spread, every...
11:56Well, that's very much exaggerated.
11:58Is it?
11:59Yes.
12:00I don't buy that. You don't say yes or no on everything that's in vogue?
12:05Up to a point. I mean, you know, I oversee so many different vogues now that it's impossible to
12:11have that kind of detail. I think it's really important to surround yourself with people whom
12:17you admire and that you respect. I really rely on the editors that we have there to... I can say,
12:23I don't think this looks so great, but they can come right back and say, this is what will work in
12:28this culture.
12:29What I mean is, how deeply do you get into other vogues, other magazines, either here in the United
12:36States or around the world?
12:37Yeah. I mean, I...
12:38How granular.
12:39In terms of vogue, I look at every print issue before it goes to what's hypothetically called
12:46the press now. I don't know exactly where it goes in different territories.
12:52Goes to the press.
12:52Goes to the press.
12:53And, you know, I will look at their sites. I can't understand all the languages. I look
12:57at all their social media, but it's... And I will make suggestions and call and say,
13:02are we sure about this or why aren't we doing that? But, you know, there's no way that you
13:07can keep up with every single platform across all the territories, but I certainly keep my
13:14eyes out.
13:15Did you ever feel like along the way, did you have a time or a year or a moment you think,
13:20enough with this. I can do a lot of things. I just... Enough.
13:25I actually know, David, because I love what I do. And I grew up, as you know, in a family of
13:31journalists where we were always being dragged home from vacation holidays, as we would say
13:37in the UK, because some news was happening. And in those days, you couldn't do email or
13:42Zooms. You had to be there. And my dad was someone who always had to be there. He had to
13:46be in the newsroom. And that was actually exciting in a way. And our house was full of journalists
13:51and politicians and interesting people. And I find that today just as exciting and just
14:00as interesting. And I'm always more interested in looking forward than looking back. I think,
14:06I do think sometimes we spend too much time on nostalgia.
14:10How do you mean?
14:10I think people always ask, what was that based on? Or what was your inspiration? And sure,
14:21people have inspirations and they have unconscious thoughts in their heads. But true creative design,
14:26I'm talking about the fashion world, true creative designers, and I'm sure it's the same with your
14:32world. It's original. It comes from their mind, not from somebody else's mind. Maybe they had some
14:37influences, but the idea is theirs. And when I work with Andrew Bolton, who's the chief curator at
14:44the Metropolitan Museum, we work very closely together every year on the exhibitions. And it's so
14:51fascinating and exciting and interesting to see how his mind works and how the ideas form. And yes,
15:00he reads a lot. He looks at a lot. But in the end, the original thinking is entirely Andrew's.
15:07So to me, that's a great artist.
15:09I wonder how you felt when Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez arrived at the Met Ball in a white dress slathered
15:19with the slogan, tax the rich.
15:22Yes. Well, I'll tell you a story about that, David. She was actually sitting at my table and I stand in
15:28the receiving line and I don't see the people arriving on the carpet. I don't have a secret
15:33live stream coming, being zoomed into my earphone. I'm just standing there shaking everybody's hands
15:39saying, thank you for coming, blah, blah, blah. So I said, you know, thank you for coming. And she
15:43went by and then I went up to her when, before we all sat down at the table. I said, I just love
15:49your dress because I'd only seen her from the front. And it wasn't until the next day that I
15:55understood what had happened. So fortunately, I had a wonderful evening.
16:02And when you saw it later, how'd you feel?
16:05Well, you know, it's something going back to what we were talking about before. I think everybody
16:10uses fashion in different ways. And obviously that was something that was important to her.
16:15Your father was at the London Evening Standard. Your brother, is he back from Iran?
16:21He just came back. Yes, safely. Thank you.
16:24Is that the Guardian?
16:25Yeah.
16:25Journalism is in your blood and you found your place in it, God knows. The most interesting
16:32part of any biography for me is not the later big triumphs, as interesting as they can be,
16:37but how somebody becomes themselves, in a sense how they invent themselves. When you think about that,
16:44how you became the Anna Wintour that at least the public knows and understands, where do you think
16:51that all came from?
16:51I think I was so lucky, as we were discussing before in my upbringing and meeting all these
16:57people and knowing that I wanted to work in journalism, in media, but being very aware of
17:04my father's success in Fleet Street, as it was then called in Fleet Street, and not wanting to
17:10be part of his world and trying to make my own mark and filling out all those stupid school
17:18forms that you have to do and asking my dad, well, what shall I fill in when you write what
17:23you want to be? This is a true story. He said, well, you just write. You want to be editor of Vogue.
17:27And so, yes.
17:28No. Age what?
17:29I don't know, 13. So, I wrote that in, and then I felt confident. And yes, this was something
17:35that I could work towards. And the other thing, my first job was working in London. Like,
17:41there's no money. There's no staff. There's no teams. You have to learn how to do everything.
17:47What was the job?
17:47I worked. My first job, I worked at Hopper's Queen. And I was in the fashion department. And you had
17:55to cover the market, go on shoots, write the captions, lay it out, go to events, go to the
18:01shows. It was just, you know, the original sort of multitasker. And I think that...
18:06Do you have to know how to operate a needle and thread in the show?
18:09Yeah, I was never any good at that.
18:11No hemming for you.
18:12Yes. Awful. But so, when I came to the States and it, you know, there was a shoe editor
18:16and a underwear editor and a fabric editor. It was also siloed. I felt very confident
18:24because I sort of knew how to do everything. And that, that was the best training.
18:29But you, you determined your final, not final destination, as it turns out.
18:33It was helpful.
18:34At that early age, I'm going to be the editor of Vogue, which is a little bit like saying
18:38I'm, I'm going to be, play shortstop for the Yankees. And that was Derek Jeter.
18:41Well, it was a goal. It wasn't, you know, it was a goal to work towards. And obviously
18:47there were many ups and downs along the way, including getting fired from Harper's Bazaar
18:53because I was told I would never understand the American market. So...
18:58Tell me about the firing.
19:00It was very brief. It was very brief. Very brief.
19:04The conversation?
19:05But everyone should get...
19:06The conversation was...
19:06Everyone... Very, very brief.
19:07What was the start? We've all done it. How do you do it?
19:10How do I... I try and be kind and thoughtful and, you know, listen to what people have to
19:18say. But I was not given that. I was basically told to leave. So, but I think everyone should
19:26be fired once. You've probably never been fired, David.
19:28I've only had two jobs so far, so far.
19:30But it helps you get everything into proportion and pick myself up and eventually landed at
19:39New York Magazine where my multitasking really came into full use because there wasn't anyone
19:47there that understood anything that I was doing. And I was very lucky to work for Ed Kozner
19:53who was a wonderful editor and gave me free reign. And that's where I caught Alexander Lieberman,
19:59the editorial director of Condé Nast, I, and then I moved over to American Vogue.
20:04I hope this is not a sexist question. Maybe we could ask it of men, too. I hope we do.
20:08How did you develop your look and why?
20:10Well, for my hair, it was always pretty much this way.
20:14And then some British hairdresser decided they were going to experiment on me and they
20:21cut it into three layers. And it was honestly the worst haircut you've ever seen in your
20:27entire life. So I think I wore a hat for a year. And then after that, I resolved not to
20:32cut my hair except this way ever again. And I mean, the glasses just because I'm very
20:37short-sighted, but they also helped me get through situations.
20:43Were you bored to death?
20:45You said that on me.
20:46I did. I think I'm going to take it up. Another thing that you're known for is your ability
20:55to do about 3,000 things in a given day. Give me how your days typically go. When do
21:00you get up? What do you do? And how is it carried out?
21:02Well, I get up really early, 4.35 o'clock, and I read online the papers, all the English
21:12papers and the Times. And then I have a lovely walk through Washington Square Park where you
21:19see a very interesting slice of life and go to the gym. And then I run back and then...
21:25You were a runner when you were a kid, right?
21:27Yeah, I was.
21:28A good one.
21:28Yeah. My grandfather was a very, very fast runner. He ran for Harvard. And I was always
21:36being encouraged to run, to go into serious training. But I just, I didn't take that path.
21:42It was the 60s in London. So I took another path.
21:46I took another path, many other paths. And then, you know, I go to the office and then
21:50the day starts.
21:51And then the day starts. And you've said you'd never write a book about your life.
21:58Never. Why is that?
21:59Never. I don't think I'm that interesting. And...
22:03Okay. That's where you're wrong.
22:04Thank you, David. But I really, I don't, I just, it's not a story I want to tell.
22:10Because it's too personal? It digs too deep? Or is it, you're bored with it? You're bored
22:15with the past?
22:15The past is done. And I can't rewrite it. And of course, there's lots of wonderful things
22:23about it too. But it's just not something that has of any remote interest to me. Are
22:28you ever going to write the story of your life, David?
22:30I don't think so.
22:31There you go.
22:32I'd like to learn something new.
22:34Yeah.
22:34Like Chinese or something.
22:35So there was a time that even unschooled people like me knew about, or a little bit
22:40about, designers of huge influence, at least knew their names or a kind of sketch of what
22:46they did, Lagerfeld, Mutia Prada, who's still very much around, Galeano, Marc Jacobs, still
22:51much around. Suddenly, nearly all the fashion houses are led by young or younger designers whose
22:59names are not particularly well.
23:00But they will be. And many of them are.
23:03And not many are women, either.
23:06No, that's...
23:06So how do you assess this new scene that...
23:09Well, it's...
23:10One moves, and then it's like a pack of cards.
23:17Why?
23:17Well, because one designer goes from A to B, and then that leaves an opening, and then
23:22somebody else is slotted in, and then there's another opening. But it is totally true that
23:27this is the first time that I can ever remember where we had so many openings in so many high
23:34profile houses. But it's also incredibly... And I think it will be a very creative moment,
23:42because if you talk to these designers, of course, they're very aware that they're all
23:46making their debuts in the next few weeks. So all eyes, not just on them, but on all of
23:52them. And I think they will all make each other better.
23:55Who are you most keenly watching?
23:57All of them. I mean, I think they all bring different points of views, some degrees of
24:03experience, some brand new, some less known, some known. But what I think is great about
24:12all of them is that they are very original thinkers. And I think that they will not be
24:16defined. They will respect, but they will not be... Like Chloe, they will respect, but not
24:21be defined by their past. I think Jonathan Anderson at Dior is going to be... Have an incredible
24:29show, an incredible run at Dior. I'm very, very excited to see Mathieu Blasie at Chanel.
24:36He was at Bottega before. And Jack and Lazaro, who are Americans, going to Les Hervées. So,
24:43I mean, those are just three. I mean, Sarah Burton, a woman at Givenchy. She worked for McQueen
24:48for so many years. Louise Trotter at Bottega. I mean, it's just a long, long list. And then
24:54there's the designers like Demna, that was at Balenciaga, has now gone to Gucci. And
24:59Pierpaolo, who was at Valentino, has now gone to Balenciaga. So, it's, you know, it's...
25:06The carts have been shuffled.
25:07Snakes and ladders everywhere.
25:09But my colleague Rebecca Mead recently profiled Jonathan Anderson. He's now, as you say, at Dior.
25:14And he told Rebecca that he prefers to think of fashion houses, not as luxury bastions, but
25:23as cultural brands. That there's a... He says luxury is elitist. And he wants to keep luxury
25:31at arm's length, he told her. How do you view luxury at this point? Is it something that you
25:39embrace? Is it something that...
25:41Well, I hate that word, don't you?
25:43Well, it rarely enters my thinking, but go ahead.
25:46No, but it doesn't mean anything. It seems like a sort of dated...
25:50It sounds to me you're like expensive.
25:51Yeah, and it feels dated to me. And something that... I think I like the idea of creativity.
25:59And what does that mean? And how you bring in a community in all kinds of different levels,
26:04whether it's couture or runway or a pair of sneakers, you're investing in somebody's creativity
26:12and vision. And to me, that's much more interesting than the idea of luxury. I mean, I don't really
26:18even know what that word means. It's so overused. I think it's lost its heart.
26:25In some ways, it might be an illusion, but the economy is riding pretty high. And yet,
26:32a lot of fashion houses are very anxious about the economy.
26:37Well, there's many reasons for that. I mean, I think, first of all, there's been so much
26:41change that I think a lot of the normal customers are waiting because they want to wait and see
26:49what the new designers are going to bring. They don't want to seem like they're behind or they're
26:54not in step with whatever direction a designer might be going, or they were someone who liked
26:59what the old designer did, and they're not sure yet about the new one. So there are lots of
27:03different reasons. But I also think that the industry has been very hard hit by the tariffs.
27:09So Trump's tariffs are going to affect things?
27:11They already have, because people would move their businesses out of China and into India. And then
27:19you saw what happened in India. So it's hard to be able to plan long term. And also,
27:25the fashion industry already has 12.5% tariffs on a lot of what they produce. So to stack it again
27:33is going to make it even more difficult, particularly for the smaller businesses.
27:37You have made Vogue a political magazine in many ways over the years. And you yourself are a
27:43political person. You've been involved in fundraising and more for Hillary Clinton and for the Democratic
27:49Party in general. Tell me about that decision.
27:52I think my personal values are very important to me. And I also try to be balanced in our coverage.
28:03And I also believe that what I believe many of our audiences do as well. So it's a it's a tough time
28:13for Democrats. There's no question. And hopefully, somebody will emerge in the not too distant future that
28:19will challenge our current administration.
28:22Do you see anything of that?
28:23Well, I've been impressed by Governor Newsom. I think he's he's certainly making a stand. And obviously,
28:30I'm sure there'll be many other candidates that will emerge, hopefully soon.
28:36Hopefully soon. It seems pretty grim at the moment, though.
28:40Well, we we have time.
28:42There's a movie that you may have heard of called The Devil Wears Prada. And at first,
28:48and we didn't know each other very well when that came out. Condé Ness had a kind of different
28:51alignment than it does now. And I should say it's changed largely because of you and having
28:56editors meetings. And the editors got to know each other a lot better than they used to, which is a
29:01gift. When that first came out, were you hurt by it? And then you seem to embrace it in a certain
29:08way?
29:09Well, I went to the premiere wearing Prada, completely having no idea what the film was going to be
29:18about. And I think that the fashion industry were very, very sweetly concerned for me about the film,
29:28that it was going to paint me in some kind of difficult light.
29:34Cartoonish.
29:35Yes. Caricature. But first of all, it was Meryl Streep, which is fantastic. And then I went to see
29:43the film and I found it highly enjoyable and very funny. So Meech and I talk about it a lot.
29:51And I say to her, well, it was really good for you. And you can imagine what she says back. But
29:57you know, in the end...
29:58No, I can't. What did she say back?
30:00But no, I think, listen, it had a lot of humor to it. It had a lot of wit. It had
30:07Meryl Streep. I mean, it was Emily Blunt. I mean, they were all amazing. And in the end,
30:14I thought it was a fair shot.
30:16At a certain point, celebrities came to the cover of Vogue. Was that something you did
30:23with hesitation? You did it pretty early on. I think Madonna might have been one of the first.
30:27I felt that times were changing, that time was different, and that our audiences, our
30:35readers were looking at fashion not just through the lens of a model, as was primarily on the
30:46cover before that. Although, of course, if you think back to the days of Mrs. Freeland and
30:53others, they did, you know, they had people like Candice Bergen, Chloe's mother, or...
31:00Who played the editor of Vogue on Sex and the City.
31:03Or Mia Farrow. I mean, it wasn't unheard of, but I think that we recognized a change. We saw a
31:10change. And Madonna, of all the many celebrities that we've had on the cover of Vogue, she certainly
31:17loved an epitomized fashion and was fearless with it and had fun with it. And it just felt like the
31:23right, the right time. And I remember being on this plane and, and sitting next to a straight
31:30laced, straight, straight wearing a suit gentleman. And he asked me what I did. And I was telling him
31:36and he said, well, Vogue means to me, Audrey Hepburn, Catherine Hepburn, never Madonna. And that
31:43made me think time to change.
31:45What are you most proud of having published at Vogue?
31:49I couldn't possibly choose one, one piece or one story or one, one cover. David, I, I think
31:56it was, it was very, it was quite moving being in the meeting this morning, talking to all my
32:06colleagues about how I felt about Chloe and what a great job that she was doing. And, and I think the
32:13thing I'm the most proud of is bringing in over, over so many years, different talent, writers,
32:20photographers, videographers, editors to Vogue. I mean, that I, to me, I'm sure you feel to some
32:28degree the same way. It's, it's about who you surround yourself with.
32:31Entirely.
32:32And in the end, that's by far the most important accomplishment to me.
32:37Were you emotional at this meeting?
32:38Well, I've been thinking about it for such a long time, but no, I was actually thrilled
32:47and excited and happy for, for, for Chloe and excited for myself to, to look at things
32:54in a different way.
32:55Does it mean that you'll have more free time? I can't imagine Anna Wintour with free time.
32:59Oh, well, I think I'll have, um,
33:02Only two jobs.
33:03Yes, two jobs, two jobs. But I, I am remaining full, fully committed as theater and tennis
33:11advisor to Vogue. That's my, going to be my next big chapter.
33:14Okay. I'm holding you to that. Now, I think we're now ready for what we call the lightning
33:20round. Are you ready?
33:20Yes, of course.
33:21Okay. Who was the greatest fashion designer of your era as editor?
33:25David, I only look towards the future.
33:29What was the most triumphant or influential fashion show of that era?
33:33Ditto.
33:34Most lamentable fashion trend of your era?
33:38Dayglo.
33:40Okay. True or false, Jeff Bezos was interested in buying Condé Nast.
33:44Well, actually, I heard that he called you about that.
33:47False. Good turn. You are actually, just as true or false, you are actually thrilled when
33:54assistants move at a glacial pace.
33:57Nobody at Vogue moves at a glacial pace, least of all my assistants.
34:01This is the most important question of all, Anna. Finally, I wore a decent shirt and an
34:07actual jacket today in deference to you and the occasion. But still, I think it's fair
34:11to say that I'm not known for my impeccable sense of style. Anna, is it hopeless? Where
34:17can I possibly begin?
34:18David, I'm very touched that you wore a jacket, but I really like you in those New Yorker sweatshirts.
34:22There, I was living up to the sartorial standards of the late Cy Newhouse.
34:29Thank you for having me.
34:30Anna, thank you.
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