B Sudershan Reddy said disruptions in Parliament were essential in a democracy, but cautioned they must not become an integral part of the democratic process.
00:00My journey has begun in 1971 when I was enrolled as a member of the Bar Council.
00:10Ever since, I am associated with the functioning of the Constitution, its values, its conventions.
00:17Right from the day I started the practice and it continues till today.
00:22I consider this journey is the same, ultimately culminating, if given an opportunity, to protect and defend the Constitution.
00:32Hitherto I was upholding the Constitution. That is the oath administered to a judge.
00:37And there are only three offices in this country.
00:41The prescribed oath mandates that they have to protect and defend the Constitution.
00:47That is the highest office of the Republic of India.
00:51President of India, Vice President of India and the Governors at the state level.
00:57So this journey is nothing new to me.
00:59It has been argued that top constitutional posts should be filled by consensus to reflect national unity.
01:06So what are your views on this?
01:07I wish there could have been a consensus.
01:09But you know the quality as it stands is a fractured one.
01:14In the circumstances perhaps it has been inevitable leading to this contest.
01:20So how would you describe the current state of democracy and the government opposition ties?
01:26You know currently we see a lot of strain.
01:28Earlier we used to talk about deficit economy. There is deficit democracy.
01:36I do not say that India is no more a democratic country. I do not subscribe to that view.
01:44We still continue to be a constitutional democracy but under strain.
01:51And about the government opposition ties?
01:54I wish it could have been better instead of reducing the discourse to the level as we see today.
02:02It could have been better. Earlier the opposition parties and the party in power used to coordinate on many national issues.
02:12Unfortunately which we do not find today.
02:16You have said that this election is not about one individual but about the idea of India.
02:22Can you elaborate on that?
02:24Yes. Certainly not about a contest between me and Shri Radhakrishnanji.
02:31It is a contest representing two different ideologies.
02:38One which the other side themselves are propagating that here is a person quintessential RSS man.
02:49Therefore the country should elect him as a vice president.
02:52So far as I am concerned, I do not subscribe to that ideology and I am far, far, far, far away from it.
03:01I am essentially a liberal constitutional democrat.
03:05This is the area or rather the arena for the contest where the fight goes on.
03:13The vice president is also the chairman of the Rajya Sabha and you have talked about your commitment to decorum and dialogue.
03:21What do you have to say on the politics of disruptions that is emerging as a regular feature now in parliament?
03:28You see the difficulty is this Mr Chopra.
03:32Somebody, an eminent journalist like you asked my friend, she arrogantly, when they were frequently disturbing the Rajya Sabha.
03:44The views expressed by that departed soul who is not amongst us today.
03:52Disruption also is a legitimate political activity and a parliamentary practice.
03:59Whether a particular disruption at a particular point of time was correct or not is a different matter.
04:07But disruptions do take place. Disruption is nothing but one form of dissent.
04:13If you are not allowed to speak or express your views, this is one form of speaking.
04:20That is how I look at the disruptions.
04:24Not that I wish that disruption should become an essential and an integral part of democratic process.
04:33Opposition parties have unanimously chosen you as their joint candidate for the second highest constitutional position in the country.
04:40So what factors weighed in your favor that makes you stand out?
04:44I feel greatly honored.
04:49But when I look at the rainbow of the political parties,
04:55unanimously agreeing on my name and sponsoring my candidature.
05:00But there was nothing surprising as such.
05:03All of them knew my work. All of them have watched me quite for some time.
05:08They must have used their discretion and thought it fit that I should be their candidate.
05:15And I feel greatly honored for more than one reason.
05:18First, it represents the diversity.
05:21Secondly, the unanimous choice.
05:23Thirdly, in terms of voting strength, if you make an analysis,
05:28they represent more than 63-64 percent of the population.
05:34What else could be an honor, Mr. Chopra?
05:38So now that you are in the contest, you also come under attack.
05:43Yesterday, Home Minister Amit Shah has accused you of one supporting quote unquote nationalism.
05:51He has also cited your judgment on Salva Judam saying that it has been there.
05:56Had it not been there, left-wing extremism would have ended by 2020.
06:02I do not wish to join an issue directly with the Honorable Home Minister of India,
06:09whose constitutional duty and obligation is to protect the life, liberty and property of every citizen,
06:19irrespective of ideological differences.
06:23Secondly, I have authored the judgment.
06:26Judgment is not mine.
06:28Judgment is of the Supreme Court.
06:31There was another judge sitting with me and repeated attempts were made to get it overruled.
06:39But it didn't happen.
06:41On merits of the judgment, I would not speak because I am trained by my peers
06:47that one should not speak about the greatness of one's own judgment.
06:52It is for the people to judge.
06:54It is not my personal document.
06:56I wish the Honorable Home Minister could have himself read the whole judgment,
07:01instead of getting briefed by, I do not know, hopefully he would not have that much time to read the judgment,
07:09which runs into about 40 pages.
07:12If he would have read the judgment, perhaps he would not have made that comment.
07:16That is all I say and leave it there.
07:18So you don't want to disturb the decorum of the debate?
07:22No.
07:23There must be a decency in the debate.
07:27What do you have to say on your opponent who has been a governor and a politician in the past, unlike you?
07:36Perhaps he was discharging his constitutional duties and obligations to the best of his ever,
07:44about which I have no comment to make.
07:48The Vice President's election you are contesting was necessitated due to sudden resignation of Mr. Jagdeep Thankar.
07:54So what do you feel about the circumstances in which he put in his papers?
07:58Jagdeep Thankar Ji himself is a senior lawyer and a veteran of many battles.
08:05It may be appropriate for him to disclose the reasons why he has to leave the office all of a sudden.
08:15I do not wish to indulge in any guesswork.
08:21You have always held the constitution close to yourself.
08:24What do you feel about the tirade launched by the opposition against the government over protection of the constitution?
08:31Is it under serious threat?
08:33You see, constitution, you cannot just read the articles and say that no article is under threat.
08:39Constitution is an integral one. Constitution means constitutional conventions. Constitution means constitutional morality.
08:49There are various steps taken by the government in power making one feel legitimately that it is coming under challenge.
09:03Therefore the debate that is going on in the country whether the constitution is under attack is a welcome debate where everyone should participate and express their opinion.
09:16Your take on the recent controversy about the words socialist and secular in the preamble.
09:21You know the RSH and some leaders of the BJP have questioned the formulations introduced under late Indira Gandhi.
09:28Those somebody quote unquote, I would not say anything, are not quiet even today, even after the decision by the Supreme Court of India.
09:41According to me, the socialist and secular expressions used in the preamble of the constitution have made things explicit which is otherwise inbuilt in the provisions of the constitution.
09:57You talk about equality.
09:58You talk about equality.
09:59You talk about equality.
10:00Article 14.
10:01If it is not secular then what is the equality?
10:04You talk about fraternity, one of the most important values according to me.
10:09What would be the fraternity without secularism?
10:12And without the expression socialism, what is the equality we are talking about?
10:18Both the words which are made explicit, the idea contained in the constitution are welcome.
10:34It is true that amendment came, that is 42nd amendment when emergency was invoked.
10:40But one must remember, the government next that came into power, that is the Janata government, consisting of various political parties, including the present BJP, which was Jansang at that time, have anonymously approved it.
11:02Therefore, one fails to understand with what intention that debate is being triggered now.
11:11You headed a panel to assess the merits of the caste survey in Telangana.
11:15Why is there a need for a caste survey?
11:18Many also argue that a caste census will further fragment our already fractured society and deepen fault lines.
11:25The people who advance that argument which you are now advancing before me, have fallen in line, realized the importance of caste survey.
11:37Please tell me, Mr. Chopra, how do you identify the backward classes?
11:45Because the constitution doesn't speak about the caste.
11:49If you have to classify your group, together some people as the backward classes, you have to find out their caste, their socio-economic conditions, their way of living, their access to power and the way they are recognized by the society.
12:13Now, the government of India, which intends to conduct the census, have announced, yes, in this survey, census, caste survey also would be there.
12:30We have to find out, isn't it, how many scheduled caste people are there?
12:35How do we fix the reservations?
12:37I won't reveal the data which we have analyzed as an expert group headed by me.
12:44But one thing I can share with you about my own state, Telangana, 84.6 percent of people belong to the weaker sections of the society.
12:55That's quite a number.
12:57So, how do you propose to frame your social and economic policies?
13:04How do you empower them?
13:06How do you make them to feel that they are equal citizens of this country?
13:13Not that by giving some doles or some temporary succor would meet the impending challenge which many people don't realize.
13:32Their empowerment is mandated by the provisions of the constitution.
13:38Therefore, you have to find out their strength and frame your socio-economic policies.
Be the first to comment