During a House Armed Services Committee hearing in July, Rep. Don Bacon (R-NE) condemned Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth's conduct during the Signalgate scandal.
00:00Log number 5659 by Mr. Moulton. For what purpose does the gentleman from Massachusetts seek recognition?
00:05Mr. Chairman, I have an amendment at the desk.
00:07Will the clerk please distribute the amendment without objection to reading an amendment dispensed with?
00:11The chair recognizes the gentleman for the purpose of explaining his amendment.
00:15Mr. Chairman, this bipartisan amendment is simply a sense of Congress that says what we all know is true if you take the politics out of it.
00:23And I'm grateful to Representative Bacon for working with me to ensure that we have taken the politics out of it.
00:29First, details of an active military operation shouldn't be sent to anyone on signal, much less your wife, your brother, or a personal lawyer.
00:38And two, leaders worth following take accountability for their actions.
00:43So here are the facts, just the facts.
00:45We know the Secretary of Defense shared information that he should not have, in a manner in which he should not have, with people he should not have.
00:55We all know this information was classified, and in our hearing with us, the Secretary made clear by confirming that it came from CENTCOM.
01:05Now, that would make Secretary Hague's actions likely a crime, but even if in some fantasy world it was unclassified information, it was still wrong, dangerous, and in fact, still illegal.
01:16Sharing the time on target and the weapons platforms associated with an airstrike over an unsecured platform put the success of the mission and the pilots of those aircraft at additional risk.
01:28And pretty much any junior service member, the most junior private in the National Guard where Secretary Hague has served, knows that.
01:35The Houthis, in fact, have extensive anti-aircraft capabilities and have shot down seven U.S. aircraft.
01:43Think about that.
01:45Seven U.S. aircraft shot down over Yemen to date.
01:49Thankfully, no piloted ones yet.
01:52And that leads me to point two.
01:54Secretary Hague leads the largest organization in this country, with close to three million people,
02:00an organization in which the single most important skill is leadership.
02:04It's the first lesson we learned at OCS.
02:07You can fail a test.
02:08You can drop out of a run.
02:09You'll probably get a chance to retake that test or do the run another day.
02:14But you lie about anything, you're gone.
02:17You go home.
02:19You learn it again when you get your job.
02:22My job description as a platoon commander was very simple.
02:25You're responsible for everything your platoon does or fails to do.
02:29Leadership alone is 40% of your grade in Marine officer training.
02:32The leadership skills of our NCO Corps is what makes our military second to none.
02:39Well, there's no quicker way to lose the respect of your team than holding yourself to a lower standard than you expect of them.
02:46Passing the buck.
02:47Refusing to admit your mistakes.
02:49Dodging accountability.
02:50Secretary Hegseth, of course, promised that, quote, accountability is back at the Pentagon.
02:58But I struggle to understand whether he believes that accountability applies to him.
03:04In fact, I asked him that simple question myself a little over a month ago when he was sitting in this room,
03:10and he refused to answer eight times.
03:15Our troops deserve good leadership.
03:17Leadership that respects them enough not to needlessly increase the risks that they face
03:22in doing their jobs keeping us all safe.
03:27In doing their jobs serving our country.
03:29Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
03:32Gentleman yields back.
03:33Chair recognizes himself.
03:35This amendment, like the other two before it, is simply political posturing.
03:39There are policies and procedures already in place that govern this.
03:42Everyone with a clearance is briefed on proper handling of classified information.
03:46Therefore, I oppose the amendment.
03:47And with that, I now recognize the gentleman from Nebraska, Mr. Bacon.
03:52Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
03:52And I respect your opinion here.
03:55I do support this amendment, though.
03:57I've worked with my friend from Massachusetts on this.
04:01It strips out what I think is consequences that would hobble the OSD.
04:06But yet it lets us state the truth that what was done by the secretary was not right.
04:12And by the way, I was a five-time commander.
04:14None of us are perfect.
04:16We're flawed individuals.
04:17We make mistakes.
04:19But when you're in responsibility, you take responsibility when you make a mistake.
04:24And you own up to it.
04:25And I think that's the real issue here with this incident.
04:28I think the secretary knows he did wrong.
04:31But he doesn't acknowledge it.
04:32And therefore, it doesn't go away.
04:34If you would have just apologized up front, taken responsibility, we would not be having this discussion today.
04:39And I think this has hurt his credibility.
04:41And I share the sentiments.
04:43If I would have done this as a junior officer or as a brigadier general, I would have been disciplined for doing what was done by the secretary.
04:51So I think this gives us an opportunity in this committee to put something on record that's saying this is wrong.
04:57But yet we're doing it in a way that's responsible and it doesn't hobble operations out of the secretary of defense or the Pentagon.
05:04And I think acknowledging the truth is very important.
05:06With that, I yield.
05:09Gentleman yields back.
05:10Any additional member seek recognition?
05:12Mr. Vindman of Virginia.
05:14Thank you, Mr. Chair.
05:15So I rise in support of Mr. Moulton's amendment that affirms the basic truth, the unauthorized sharing of national defense information,
05:23especially over unsecured, non-governmental platforms, endangers missions and puts American lives at risk.
05:30This is not a hypothetical.
05:32One of my constituents came up to me at a district event furious because her son was one of the fighter pilots in the air over Yemen
05:38during the breach known now as Signal Gate.
05:41Secretary Hague says careless use of unsecured apps may have compromised their entire operation.
05:49When I asked the secretary if he'd like to apologize to this mother, whose son's life he put in danger,
05:55he looked me in the eye and said, I do not apologize.
05:58I think we all remember that moment.
06:01This amendment rightly reminds us that distributing classified information to unauthorized individuals is a crime under the Espionage Act.
06:08It also reminds us that core principles of military leadership, including setting the example and taking responsibility,
06:16must be uniform from private to general to secretary of defense.
06:23That standard must apply at every level, especially at the top.
06:27I urge my colleagues to stand up with our troops and national security community by adopting Mr. Moulton's common sense amendment.
06:34I do want to acknowledge and thank my colleague from Nebraska for speaking the truth today.
06:41With that, I yield back.
06:43Gentleman yields back.
06:44Does any additional member seek recognition to speak on Mr. Moulton's amendment?
06:48Seeing none.
06:50Oh, there is.
06:52Dr. McCormick of Georgia is recognized.
06:54I just want to address the fact that they say they want to take the politics out of this.
07:01We have three amendments on the same issue, knowing it will not pass.
07:04That's politicization.
07:06It will politicize and delay this process of the people's business.
07:11No lives were lost.
07:12The mission was accomplished.
07:13Follow-on missions have not had the same problems.
07:17Military recruiting is surging.
07:19The contracting process is being reformed, and we are back in the business of winning battles and wars.
07:26Unlike the previous administration where lives were lost, and we had an abysmal withdrawal, we are doing things right again.
07:35This is a self-directed review of what went wrong and how to address this.
07:39I urge my colleagues to vote no on this amendment.
07:43Gentleman yields back.
07:44Gentleman from New York.
07:45Mr. Ryan is recognized.
07:46Thank you, Mr. Chair.
07:49I yield the balance of my time to Mr. Moulton.
07:52You know, the definition of political courage is standing up to your own party.
07:58Politicizing things is not a bipartisan amendment.
08:02It's doing what's right by the troops.
08:06And I would challenge my colleague from Georgia to just go give that explanation to the Marines who served on your helicopters.
08:13To say, yeah, it's okay.
08:17Go ahead and do this.
08:18There's no consequences.
08:25I don't think that would happen.
08:26And I do want to just, once again, praise the political courage and the leadership of my colleague from Nebraska.
08:37Because I know he gets a lot of grief for doing things that go against this administration or are perceived to go against this administration.
08:44But that's what we've got to do.
08:48And when Secretary Austin made his mistakes, we did demand accountability.
08:55And you didn't see me trying to defend it just in the name of a mission accomplishment or not hobbling the Secretary of Defense or making things political.
09:03As a Marine officer, I was a Marine officer not afraid to criticize the Secretary.
09:12And I think that's exactly the kind of leadership that we need from this committee.
09:16So thank you again, Congressman and General Bacon, for your leadership, your political courage.
09:23And I hope that we can get more bipartisan support for this common sense amendment.
09:29Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:30I yield back.
09:31Gentleman yields back.
09:32Does any other members seek recognition on Mr. Moulton's amendment?
09:35Seeing none, there's no further debate.
09:38The question occurs on the amendment offered by Mr. Moulton.
09:41So many as are in favor will say aye.
09:43Aye.
09:44Those opposed, no.
09:45No.
09:46No's have it.
09:48The amendment is not agreed to.
09:49Recorded vote is requested.
09:51The recorded vote is postponed until a later time.
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