Amy Klobuchar Asks Expert About User-Data Standards That 'Reign In Abuses' From Big Tech Platforms

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During a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing prior to the congressional recess, Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-MN) questioned Digital Progress Institute President, Joel Thayer, about user-data privacy standards.

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00:00all right do you have any other I'll just I think Center Schiff is kind of

00:05thought maybe you know since we have a glass ceiling for only women asking

00:08questions here we can I mean Holly came by Blumenthal they've all had other

00:13hearings they're great and been really helpful to us maybe we'll just ask two

00:17more and see if he can make it so mr. Thayer in your written testimony you

00:27referenced a European study that found that after the passage of JDP are the

00:31general data protection regulation I'm going to have to jump in here because

00:38they need me to go to VA to vote that's where he is oh yeah that's where yes

00:43that's where Senator Blumenthal is so I will say my thank yous to you all in

00:49case I don't get back before this closes and remind you all that we're going to

00:56have questions for the record as you can see we have lots of questions and we

01:00are ever so grateful that you all have come before us I'll go vote okay thank

01:06you very much and thank you for again for putting together this hearing so I was

01:11talking about the JDPR we know we don't like everything that Europeans are doing

01:15on tech but there are some good examples of some good things they've done what

01:20about JDPR were big tech platforms able to take advantage of to entrench our

01:27position how can we avoid doing the same in the US and how can we design data

01:33privacy standards that rein in abuses you know what's the good things we can get

01:37out of that I know there's things we could simply do here that they are agreed

01:41to in Europe that we're still fighting out over here so it's a fantastic question

01:47and it's and I think it really comes down to defining your goals that was like

01:52the first big issue but in terms of what happened with the GDPR and to be

01:56clear there are elements of the GDPR that I think a lot of states have latched on to

02:02is particularly Texas where they pull pull this an article analytical framework

02:06between data controllers and data processors being able to articulate exactly

02:10who has the responsibility is a big part of it we're I just want to have the

02:13record reflect that Texas use the European model but keep going I fell right into it

02:20yeah but I I think where things went a little bit awry where there was this

02:27weird responsibility that the controllers basically had with respect to

02:31contractual regulation I think it's article 24 of the GDPR where the

02:36controller basically has to dictate specifically well first whether or not

02:41they have to make the assessment of whether or not the processor is even GDPR

02:44compliant and that gives the controller a lot of authority over what that what

02:50that smaller company most likely is can do and can't do I think that's one area we

02:55may want to stay away from but my overall point was that you need privacy and

02:59strong antitrust enforcement and competition enforcement I think the both two

03:04things go hand in hand and so I think what Congress is currently looking at and I

03:09think is very important is that you guys are it seems like you guys want to walk

03:12and chew gum in which I very much appreciate where you have these

03:15competition reform bills that are on that are currently being discussed you are a

03:21sponsor of that senator which is the open app markets act I think that goes a long

03:24way in quelling some of those concerns but one of the ways I would one of the

03:29things I would caution against is creating an overly generalized authority and

03:34allowing the controller to have the pure mandate or at least the pure control to

03:39control what the lower the smaller companies are doing I think that's one

03:43way you can avoid some of the pitfalls okay last two questions up Mr. Martino and

03:50they're they're related and then I'll turn to center chef we're very excited you're

03:53here yes thank you mr. Martino you can follow up on that but could you talk about

04:00the challenges small businesses have operating across state lines quickly

04:04because I want to give center chef a chance here yeah I'm certainly senator

04:09first let me just follow up real quickly I wanted to add a point to what Mr.

04:14Thayer was saying it's just that there are some things that aren't that are

04:19problematic in the GDPR and some of the expectations put on controllers envision a

04:25construct where the controller is the big company and they're they're getting these

04:29smaller processors to do what they want and that's not what's developed here in

04:34the US where you have very few almost monopolistic big tech companies who are

04:40doing the vast majority of the processing consumers need including transmission

04:45including broadband and cable and you know think about how a Main Street

04:49business might only have a choice of one broadband provider and and imagine

04:54trying to negotiate that contract I mean they don't do as they do the same as we do when

04:59we try to you know argue about a cable bill or a broadband bill so we've all had

05:04that experience in terms of the multi-state operations yeah it's it's sort of a

05:09sense that I know I put in my original testimony you know many of us live in in

05:14areas that are tri-state or multiple states are close by there is you know

05:20travel across state lines there's shopping and then certainly online you know if

05:25there's a boutique you know store in Minnesota that while you're here in

05:30Washington you know doing your job here you want to make a purchase from there

05:34you are engaging in interstate commerce and so it's really important that and and

05:40these privacy laws tend to be set up to apply to the location where the the the

05:46consumer is so if you're in DC and you don't have a privacy law they comply with

05:51privacy law there so what these small businesses need to do is they have to I

05:56mean there's a de facto national standard because they have to comply with all

05:59these different states but they're constantly changing new laws are coming

06:02online so Congress can do a really helpful job by passing a uniform national

06:08standard yes and last question here mr. Butler you've advocated for a federal

06:13privacy law as well but you want one that sets a floor obviously it's all gonna be

06:16political negotiations but could you talk about why you would take that

06:21approach sure thank you for the question senator Klobuchar you know as mr.

06:26Martino alluded I think from the vast majority of businesses in this country they

06:29just want to know what the rules are and Congress's traditional role in privacy

06:33laws has been to set the baseline standard but allow states to address new

06:39challenges and threats as they emerge and that's been true and I could you know I

06:43have the list here I could rattle off the list of acronyms but if you look at

06:46federal privacy statutes by and large they don't set a ceiling on the level of

06:50protection that states can provide but what's really essential here is for the

06:54federal Congress to step in and say here's what the consistent standard is and

06:58I think if they do that then we'll have a consistent standard companies will know

07:02what to comply with and states still have the flexibility in the future to

07:05address new issues thank you senator Schiff thank you

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