- 2 days ago
The Yorkshire Post's rugby league writer, James O'Brien, assesses the news that Super League will increase from 12 to 14 teams for the 2026 season - and the criteria by which they will arrive at that change.
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00:00Hello and welcome to the latest edition of Rugby League Talk from the Yorkshire Post.
00:12We're going to be joined by James O'Brien in just a few seconds.
00:16I'm going to take a slight break.
00:18It's not a slight break from Super League.
00:19It's a slight break from talking about Super League games that have been and are coming up.
00:24We're just going to focus on something which kind of caught a few people maybe by surprise on Tuesday night when the Super League came out and said it was unveiling plans to expand from a 12-team format to a 14-team format.
00:39I think it's the first time since 2014.
00:41James will clear that up for us when we bring him in.
00:45It's not quite clear yet how the other two teams, I think as I understand it, 12 teams will be picked by the IMG grading system, which was only introduced last year.
00:54With the other two being hand-picked, essentially, with the criteria for how those two teams are hand-picked, they've yet to be finalised, which begs the question, why didn't they wait until they've got the criteria finalised before they announced it?
01:09But there you go.
01:10This is Super League, as James will explain, as he joins us now.
01:14Hello, James.
01:15Were you expecting this?
01:17Have there been rumblings of this in recent weeks and months?
01:22Just explaining your words, because you're the expert and I'm not.
01:24What is it that they're proposing?
01:26If you can, sort of you can.
01:29Experts are a very loose term there, I'm not sure about that.
01:31But, yeah, it's been rumbling for a while.
01:34There was talk about it going to 14 teams next year and then the word was they're going to wait until the following year when the broadcast deal is up for renewal.
01:44But they've decided to go with next year.
01:46That's not really a surprise.
01:48The surprise is the way that they're doing it, which is a very rugby league way of doing it.
01:52The opposite of what anyone else would do.
01:56So, they brought in this grading system only last year.
02:00It's not even a year old in terms of being live.
02:04It was last October at the end of the season.
02:07And now we're moving away from that slightly.
02:11Well, we're using part of that and then we're using another method altogether to select the final two teams, which just seems crazy.
02:20If you've got a system that you trust in and you just use it, don't you?
02:27You tip the top 14 teams and go with that.
02:32I mean, yeah.
02:35There's talk that they don't want French teams in, so they don't want Toulouse in as well as Catalan.
02:41And that's why they're going to 14 teams as well, just so they can cover the backs there in terms of the TV deal.
02:48If you have two out of 12 Super League clubs from France, it does limit what you can get in terms of exposure and stuff like that.
02:57And they don't bring much in that respect.
02:59But yeah, and I guess there is a scenario as well.
03:05If Salford are one of those top, somehow sneak into the top 14, how would they explain that after the season they've had?
03:13So maybe they're covering the backs in that respect as well, because it's hard to see Salford surviving and being in Super League again next season from the IMG perspective.
03:25And obviously they're not going to get handpicked to stay in other.
03:29I remember talking to you about Salford very early on in the season when the problems first started to emerge.
03:35I think everyone back then seemed fairly confident that it would be resolved within a matter of weeks and that Salford would be back to normal.
03:42Yes, they'd lost a few players as a result of not being able to pay them or whatever it was.
03:46And players could obviously see what was coming and left to go to pastures new.
03:51But here we are, what are we now, around 20, 21 coming up or something.
03:55And they're no better off than they were at the start of the season.
03:58I mean, they're quite clearly at the moment, unless something magical happens between now and, say, I don't know, end of November or whatever.
04:05Whenever Super League or Rugby League determines they're going to choose these extra two teams or the 14 teams and bar whatever measure.
04:13Unless something magical happens to Salford, then they surely can't be considered ready or fit for Super League.
04:20Or maybe even, I don't know.
04:23I know Rugby League don't care much for optics, clearly.
04:28But if you let a team like Salford go through a season like this, just limping from one week to the next in terms of team selection as well and the financial side's a mess.
04:39Talk of them relying on a payday loan company coming through and giving them all this money to pay the wages to get through to the end of the season.
04:45You can't then allow them back in.
04:49So, there's got to be repercussions and they've got to lose the Super League players, whether it's through the grading system or just getting a big old boot up the backside.
04:58Because no club can go through a season they have and survive.
05:01I'm not talking financially, I'm just talking about the competition itself.
05:07So, yeah, I'd expect them to go.
05:09So, then you're looking at three new, fresh clubs from the Championship or are you?
05:15Well, I was going to bring this up.
05:16I mean, the one name or the one club that seems to have been mentioned a lot since this story came out last night as one of the more likely candidates to sort of, you know, mark a Super League return is that of Bradford Bulls.
05:35I think there are some people who maybe think that this is a way of getting Bradford Bulls back in Super League, which for them could only be a good thing, given they've not been there now for about 11 years or so.
05:46Yeah, it's been a long exile, hasn't it?
05:49And it's probably as long as people expected because when they left Super League, they were in a right old mess.
05:55But they're back on their feet now.
05:59You just worry about Oddsall.
06:01It's a stadium stuck in time and they've got Speedway there now, so the pitch is shorter and stuff.
06:07It's not a great place to watch Rugby League, it has to be said.
06:11For those of us old enough, it was a great place to watch Rugby League back in the day.
06:15In the start of Super League, it was probably one of the best places to go and watch Super League.
06:21But that's a very, very long time ago and the spot doesn't wait for anyone, does it?
06:25But to be fair, without the Nigel Wood stuff, they were pretty close anyway at the end of last year.
06:32I think they were 14th.
06:34That sounds about right.
06:36Or, no, 16th.
06:37They were quite a way back.
06:40I mean, they were behind Toulouse, London and York.
06:44But they were knocking on the door anyway, but they might get that extra push now from a man who knows them inside out.
06:51And it's just not a great look for Rugby League, is it?
06:54Having Nigel Wood, who stood down as chairman, but according to Companies House anyway,
06:59he's still got between a 25% and 50% stake in the club.
07:03So, he's effectively in charge of this whole decision-making process.
07:08Have they given themselves a time frame to get this resolved?
07:12Again, I mean, why not talk about this in maybe, OK, this is what we're going to do in two years' time.
07:17But no, here we are, coming up to the start of August, and they're talking about it being next season, aren't they?
07:25They are, yeah.
07:25Yeah, so it doesn't leave a lot of time.
07:28Three clubs are going to be way behind in terms of getting a squad of Super League competitive.
07:37Because they'll have been building a squad for the Championship next year.
07:40They'll have been buying players in for the Championship next year, presumably, already.
07:44Well, York have already started planning for Super League two months ago,
07:49which Clint Goodchild had told me that.
07:53He said they've been planning for this to go full-time next year for a couple of months now.
07:57Right.
07:57Which makes you think, have they been given the nod?
08:00Otherwise, it's a bit of a gamble, isn't it?
08:04Yeah.
08:05But yeah, I'd love to see York in there.
08:08I think they've got a very strong case going into a new area.
08:13Such a good place to watch Rugby League these days as well.
08:15A fancy new stadium.
08:17It puts a few Super League stadiums to shame.
08:19It's a lovely city.
08:21You can get a park and ride from the centre out to the ground.
08:25What's not to love?
08:26I think they sell the away end out every weekend or every other weekend whenever they're playing there.
08:32Certainly in the first season, it'll be a novelty for the visiting fans.
08:37It's somewhere exciting to go.
08:39Although it's still on the doorstep of the M62 corridor.
08:42Yeah.
08:43But it's a new market for suit.
08:45It's not a new market for Rugby League.
08:46It's a new market for Super League then.
08:48Yeah.
08:48Yeah, exactly.
08:50And I was speaking to Matt Ellis earlier, the Wakefield owner as well, and he explained
08:54why they're going to 14 teams next season instead of the year after the broadcast deal
09:00ends at the end of 2026.
09:02So they're basically wanting to showcase what the future of Super League will look like
09:06next year in the hope of then getting a better deal for the following year and beyond.
09:12Yeah.
09:12But then the danger there is you're inviting three teams in who aren't Super League ready.
09:17Could you have a scenario where you've got those three sides, Huddersfield, Cass, still
09:22off the pace?
09:23That's five teams who aren't really competing in a 14-team competition.
09:27And then you've got eight playoff places.
09:30So that's over half the competition that's going to be in the playoffs.
09:34And if there aren't eight strong sides, it's not going to look great, is it?
09:40No, no, it's not.
09:41It's going to look how it did at one point a few years ago.
09:43Yeah.
09:44In terms of, well, how they're going to go about it, I mean, like I say, in terms of
09:52time frame, do we know when they would expect to announce these extra teams?
09:56Well, if the IMG grading releases anything to go by, that was after the championship grand
10:04final, which was the middle to the end of August, from memory.
10:07I think it was the end of, sorry, not August, October.
10:10So we might be looking as late as that.
10:12That's when the gradings are released after the championship grand final.
10:18And they can't release the extra ones, extra teams, until they know who's in the 12.
10:24So it could be November, in which case it's just beyond farcical.
10:30That's probably the time frame you're looking at.
10:32It's like I say, you can't pick the additional teams if you don't know the first 12 teams.
10:37Regardless of the crazy way, well, yeah, it's been said many times.
10:42Regardless of the crazy way they're going about it and the ridiculously short time frame
10:46they're giving themselves to do it, as a concept, as a format, does 14 teams work
10:54I know you've expressed the reservations there about how strong some of these teams coming up
10:58will be, particularly next year.
11:01But as a format, do you think 14 is better than 12?
11:06And it's just a case of getting to that point at some point in the near future as a league.
11:13I personally do.
11:14But I think it's when you've had years of the loop fixtures, which are just mental,
11:19it's not even as if they spread them out over the season.
11:22You can play all three games against an opposition in the first half of the season
11:28or the second half of the season.
11:29We had Salford v Centrelands twice in three rounds recently.
11:33And stuff like that.
11:34It's just, if they were spread out more, they probably wouldn't be noticed as much.
11:37But the fact that they're all clumped together, well, some of them are clumped together,
11:41then it just gets very, I think the schedule is very, it's tired at the moment.
11:47You're seeing the same fixtures over and over again.
11:49So I do understand why they're going to 14 teams, but the way they're going about it
11:55and how they're going to select those 14 teams, just, or two of them,
11:59it just doesn't make much sense.
12:01But yeah, I do understand that side of it.
12:05The player pool, there's an argument that we don't have the players to sustain a 14-team competition
12:09or the quality of players.
12:10You've got a lot, I think I mentioned a while ago,
12:13that you do have players in the Championship who are probably good enough to play Super League,
12:16but they want to stay in the Championship because they can get paid more in their day job.
12:21It's the same in a number of sports.
12:23It's the same, I mean, I'm not going to bang on about Arsenal,
12:25but Arsenal will be what I cover, obviously, as you know.
12:28It's the same argument.
12:30People are saying we need to get the imports down, we need to get the imports down.
12:33But the argument against that is that the quality isn't there to keep the quality of hockey
12:38at the standard it currently is at the moment.
12:40It has to be a gradual sort of process, maybe do something that's done over five,
12:44ten years, reducing the imports in ice hockey, for example.
12:47But you're talking about the same there.
12:49You're talking about strength in depth that doesn't necessarily spread across 14 teams.
12:54Well, they've pre-empted this, or it seems like they've been joining the dots for a while,
12:59but clubs are permitted up to ten overseas players from next year, from seven.
13:06Right.
13:06That helps you get an extra three overseas players through the door.
13:09I mean, they're not going to be top-level quality NRL players,
13:12but they'll come from the reserve-grade competitions in Australia,
13:16which some people say is about the same standard as Super League or just below.
13:19So they're decent enough players, but then there's the argument that you're blocking
13:23the pathway of junior players.
13:25But if there's 14 teams, those need to be spread around anyway.
13:29And like I say, if there are players in the top end of the championship,
13:33take a Paul McShane or someone who's got a decent – I know he's coaching,
13:38so he's a terrible example.
13:39Ignore that.
13:40But you've got someone, a top-end championship player who's got a good day job
13:44that pays over 100 grand, for instance.
13:46Is he going to want to jeopardise that if he's towards the tail end of his career
13:50just for a year or two in Super League?
13:53Probably not.
13:55So, yeah, it's very – there's no easy solution in Super League as we're seeing
14:00or as we've seen all the way through.
14:03And what has the reaction been like generally from fans?
14:07Have you managed to sort of cast an eye over how the reaction has been?
14:10I mean, I imagine it's been quite huge on social media.
14:13You know, this is the day – you know, this is the age of social media.
14:17It doesn't take long for people to get their opinion out there, does it?
14:20No, it doesn't.
14:21And Nigel Wood's a divisive figure anyway, if that's the right word.
14:27Yeah.
14:27So, people were on to him from the start and the way it's developed is exactly as they feared.
14:32So, obviously, they're fuming.
14:34And then you've got news of Ralph Rimmer coming back to Tordesfield.
14:37It's just like going back in time.
14:39And to the bad old days of sports rugby league administration.
14:45So, yes, the reaction hasn't been great.
14:51They didn't trust him from the start.
14:52Basically, as I say, it's unfolding as they feared.
14:55And I think most people can predict where it's going to go next.
14:59Bradford, one of the three teams, one of the three clubs to get admitted to Super League,
15:04which I'm not wholly against.
15:05But the way they're going about it, it's not great.
15:08If they're one of the top 12 clubs at the end of the year, you can't really argue.
15:13But if they've been hand-picked, it's going to be a terrible look for the sport, isn't it?
15:18It has to be squeaky clean throughout this whole process, doesn't it?
15:21Well, you'd think so.
15:23But I don't know.
15:25I just spot England after I was saying this.
15:28I'm not sure he's breaking any rules by being in the position he's been in
15:34and having a stake in Bradford.
15:37But the optics are just horrendous, aren't they?
15:40Yeah.
15:40If they get in through the back door with someone familiar opening that door for them,
15:47it doesn't look great.
15:48No.
15:49So how – okay, we'll just sort of, you know, regardless of when these teams are finalised.
15:56Well, I think most people could – if you're a betting man,
15:59you'd probably say at this point it'll be York, Bradford, London.
16:03Because you've got Gary Hetherington, who's gone to London.
16:06Right.
16:07And would he go in there if he didn't – if he won't tiptoe that?
16:10Yeah.
16:11It will be a Super League club.
16:12And they're getting backing from Australia and stuff like that.
16:16Okay.
16:17So, yeah.
16:17And Toulouse aren't – like, as I mentioned, they're not too popular in Super League circles.
16:23Just in terms of what they bring, I mean, they're a great club.
16:27They're doing good things, but what do they bring to the table?
16:30That's what Super League clubs – that's the mindset of those Super League clubs.
16:35So, yeah, I would not be surprised if it's those three clubs.
16:38Those three and Salford Drop.
16:40And Salford Drop, yeah.
16:41So, I mean, in theory, you should have – it's two additional clubs from the Championship.
16:46But presuming Salford Dropout, then you've got three spots.
16:49And I'd expect those three to fill them.
16:51Although you've got clubs like Oldham, who are knocking on the door.
16:54A witness who would love to come back to Super League and Toulouse, I've mentioned.
16:58But if I had to pick three frontrunners at the moment, it'd be Bradford, York, London.
17:03And just quickly on the London thing, because it is an interesting point, you're right,
17:06because now it's beginning to make sense, I gather.
17:10Potentially, obviously, this is – nothing is finalised.
17:13But, I mean, I guess – I mean, we probably spoke about it at the time, I'm not sure.
17:17But there is no one better, in a way, than Gary Hetherington to go down to London
17:24and help that club sort of – not realise its potential, because, you know,
17:28whether – was the potential there in the first place, but to actually make a success of it.
17:32Because, obviously, London Broncos were a dead man walking for the entire 2024 Super League season,
17:38given what the iron degrading was.
17:39And it was like, well, there's no point in us trying to be competitive,
17:44because we're not going to be in this thing next year anyway.
17:46But – so he got a big kick in the teeth there.
17:49But by having Gary Hetherington on board, a man who was made massive successor at Leeds Rhinos,
17:54obviously, and everything he seems to touch, you know, seems to work and work properly,
18:00there's probably nobody better than him, perhaps, to make the Broncos an actual success
18:07and build it into something that everyone perhaps hoped it would be in the very, very start.
18:11But, yeah, I mean, it's probably his biggest job.
18:15I know Leeds were in a bit of a state when he took over there, to put it mildly.
18:19But growing the game in London, just how do you go about that?
18:22Because they had Richard Branson at one point, and he got them to –
18:26they went to Wembley under his stewardship,
18:29and they were threatening towards the top of Super League at various points.
18:34But he's just never got off the ground there.
18:35And if he didn't get off the ground in the late 90s when they were at Wembley and stuff like that,
18:42they had Martin O'Feyer at the time and Sean Edwards, two Wigan legends.
18:47I'm just not sure if they're ever going to crack it.
18:50I just – I don't know what's going to change.
18:51I know we've got different ways of marketing clubs and stuff these days with social media and everything else.
18:58But it's a hell of a task.
18:59I just can't see it catching on.
19:03There's just so much going on in London, I'm not sure rugby league's on anyone's or many people's radars.
19:08I just – I don't know if it's just me.
19:12Obviously, it isn't because it's not growing down there.
19:15But it needs to be a miracle work, to put it that way.
19:19If London is going to take off and they're going to get five-figure crowds and stuff like that,
19:24I just can't see it happening.
19:33I just can't see it doing it.
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