The Politics of Revival: Sean Feucht, the NAR, and Christian Extremism - Jed Hartley - Episode 356

7 months ago

John and Jed explore the growing intersection of politics and faith, specifically focusing on the influence of the New Apostolic Reformation and key figures like Sean Feucht. With candid personal commentary and historical insight, they reflect on how revival language, nonprofit tax loopholes, and spiritualized political rhetoric have been strategically used to galvanize religious communities. The discussion includes parallels to William Branham, the role of Christian identity theology, and disturbing trends in public manipulation by modern religious movements.

As the dialogue deepens, Jed shares firsthand experiences from Los Angeles during recent political unrest, emphasizing the human cost of spiritualized nationalism. They examine how faith-based communities have been mobilized around emotionally charged narratives, often without awareness of the historical or ideological roots. Throughout the discussion, both hosts encourage critical thinking, empathy, and the need to disentangle faith from manipulation, offering a thought-provoking and at times unsettling look at the current religious and political landscape.
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Transcript

00:00:30Hello, and welcome to another episode of the William Branham Historical Research Podcast.

00:00:36I'm your host, John Collins, the author and founder of William Branham Historical Research

00:00:41at william-branham.org, and with me I have my co-host and friend, Jed Hartley, son of

00:00:46a prophet and former member of the International House of Prayer.

00:00:51Jed, it's good to be back and to talk about the dumpster fires that are spreading through

00:00:56Christianity and politics and the world we live in today, and we just had this conversation

00:01:03before we started recording, but I'll repeat to the listeners, I have no interest whatsoever

00:01:08in politics, and I kind of avoid it, but for the sake of this episode, it's unavoidable

00:01:14what we're talking about.

00:01:16It is politics, and it's merged with Christianity because of the New Apostolic Reformation.

00:01:21In fact, I would say, based on the current events that I see in the news, I would say

00:01:26that a majority of what we see today is because the New Apostolic Reformation has had its hand

00:01:32in politics for so long.

00:01:34We're starting to just start to see the fruits of this, and Jesus said, if you want to know

00:01:38what the tree is made of, you examine the fruits.

00:01:41That's what we're going to do in this, but I will preface this podcast with this.

00:01:44I'm fully indifferent.

00:01:46I don't like either party.

00:01:48I think both parties.

00:01:49The last four years with the previous president, he was a buffoon, and I liken it very much to

00:01:55the weekend at Bernie's.

00:01:56He was our weekend at Bernie's president.

00:01:59And the new one, I go back and forth as to whether it's worse.

00:02:03It might even be worse, but it's not good.

00:02:07The country is not in a good state.

00:02:08And the funny part is, any time I mention any political event indifferently, if I just

00:02:16mention that the event happened, I'll get both sides blasting me.

00:02:20You're a hardcore Republican.

00:02:21You're a hardcore Democrat.

00:02:22I'm neither.

00:02:23So I'll preface with that.

00:02:24I am neither.

00:02:25I don't like either party, but today we're going to talk politics.

00:02:29So if you're listening and you don't like that sort of thing, now's the time to turn it

00:02:33off.

00:02:34That's a good, and you can tell from my background.

00:02:38I knew that we were going to talk more intense things, so I had to be in a lighter atmosphere.

00:02:47That's not true.

00:02:48I did not choose to be out here because of that, but it's convenient now.

00:02:52I got the birds singing.

00:02:54It's nice, fresh air.

00:02:56So it seems like a good atmosphere for it.

00:03:00Well, I'm in my happy place with all my guitars.

00:03:02Actually, I don't know if you saw it.

00:03:03Somebody commented and said, you must be making a lot of money from these podcasts.

00:03:07Look at all those guitars.

00:03:08I've had these things.

00:03:10I started collecting guitars at, what was it, age 14.

00:03:14So it's not a surprising sudden surge of money, but I will say that it did take some money

00:03:20over the years, but it has nothing to do with that.

00:03:23But this is my happy place.

00:03:25So if we're talking politics, this is where I'm going to be.

00:03:28Perfect.

00:03:29Well, and if we're also talking money, I think I've mentioned this several times before,

00:03:35but I like to always reiterate because this is an accusation I'm sure you get and I get

00:03:41where it's like, oh, you're talking bad about these people and making money online by bringing

00:03:48up all these bad stuff about these different people.

00:03:51I want to clarify.

00:03:53Yes, I am speaking bad about a lot of people and I know I am making zero money from any of it.

00:04:00Like it is not something that you do if you want to gain money.

00:04:05If you want to gain money, we'll talk about this, you could deceive a lot of people and

00:04:11open shell ministries and host events that you get donations for and then push it to yourself.

00:04:20There's other ways to make money and we'll be talking about that today.

00:04:24But having a podcast where you go against the community that you were raised in, not as

00:04:31lucrative as people would think.

00:04:33Yeah.

00:04:33Yeah, I just had that conversation with somebody recently.

00:04:38This is not the way to make money, people.

00:04:40You get pennies, pennies for your time, you know.

00:04:44But I was talking to a friend and he said, well, you're going about it all wrong, John.

00:04:48He said, all you have to do if you want to make real money, you just start a cult.

00:04:52That's how they do it, right?

00:04:54And interestingly, we were talking about cults and my response was, yeah, but if you start

00:04:58a cult, I think you have to have a lot of sex because that's apparently what's happening

00:05:02in these places.

00:05:03And my wife won't let me do it, so I can't go that route.

00:05:08But anyway, so to the topic on hand, we have, like I said, a dumpster fire happening in the

00:05:15United States.

00:05:16And I don't know where to begin, but maybe we'll just start with the Sean Foyt stuff.

00:05:20Yeah, so Sean Foyt, for people who don't know, which we've talked about Sean Foyt on this

00:05:27podcast before, I believe.

00:05:30But Sean Foyt has been, he was involved with, I mean, he's kind of at the epicenter of all

00:05:36of the things that specifically you and I have been talking about, John, because he had,

00:05:43I know that he has some background with the International House of Prayer.

00:05:46I don't know exactly how he was connected with that, but he came from YWAM, he has some

00:05:53ties with Lauren Cunningham, and then he's been in Redding, California with Bethel, and

00:05:59then he's been kind of champion, like he became famous back in during COVID because he was hosting,

00:06:07I can't remember what he called them, but when people were on lockdown and supposed to be

00:06:15isolating and there weren't supposed to be, you know, public events, he was like hosting

00:06:22public events because it was both sort of a religious thing and a very much political

00:06:28thing of like, the government won't quiet us, won't shut us down, won't force us to not

00:06:35get together, which, you know, Trump was in, Trump was the president during that time, which,

00:06:41you know, we forget about that, that like, Trump was the one who was, was president during all of

00:06:47these lockdowns. But anyway, Boyd was, was hosting, I mean, he's, he's not really, he, he's a little

00:06:56bit different than some of the people that we've talked in the past, because he's not really,

00:06:59he, he doesn't position himself as a prophet, or as an apostle, he doesn't have like a

00:07:06church that he leads, he has like a few, he's like an itinerant minister, and he's a worship

00:07:15leader. And he, his whole thing has been about merging sort of Christian dominionism,

00:07:23right wing ideology. He's explicitly posted on his various social medias that if you're not

00:07:30a Republican, you're not going to, or no, no, it's not that you're not a Republican. If you are not,

00:07:38if you are a Democrat, you are not going to have him. He has explicitly said that and is just like,

00:07:45he's a very, very firm in the dominionist camp of like, we need America to be a Christian nation

00:07:55again. Very pro Trump. There's a picture of him, where he met with Trump, and you see him like it

00:08:04was, it was him and about a dozen other or a couple dozen other Christian ministers, and they were all in

00:08:12the same room. And you see Sean Foy is like reaching over and touching the sort of side of

00:08:20Trump, just to like, catch his anointing. It's this sort of like, I touched the hem of his garment

00:08:26mentality. And I mean, it's a very funny picture, because he is clearly trying to like, reach over and,

00:08:37and gain the Trump anointing, because this is a big thing for Foy. He also,

00:08:42is very heavily involved in like, grave soaking is a big thing for Foy, which if you don't know what

00:08:49grave soaking is, it's this idea that you can go to the graves of these former ministers, Smith

00:08:56Wigglesworth, Charles Spurgeon, and you can suck in their anointing by laying on the grave and praying

00:09:06for God to release whatever anointing that, you know, whatever anointing you gave Wigglesworth give

00:09:13to me too, and will literally like lay on the grave. And Sean has taken like his son and done this

00:09:18before. I mean, there's videos of him going to Smith Wigglesworth's grave and trying to like,

00:09:26catch the anointing of Smith Wigglesworth. And, you know, perhaps unsurprising to some people who

00:09:35know Sean, recently, there was just a report that was released that was compiled by a lot of

00:09:42individuals who had formerly worked with him, that basically just raised the alarm, brought a lot of

00:09:50accusations against Foy for various forms of fraud, tax evasion, and just like, being cruel to his

00:10:02staff, and being unkind to his staff. And so, I mean, we should probably talk about that a little

00:10:08bit, because that's, that's just what happened. And I will say, it is very unsurprising reading

00:10:16about it, it is very unsurprising, especially because I've seen the world and seen a lot of

00:10:22other ministers have a lot of these same dispositions. But, but Foy, especially, like he sells jerseys

00:10:30that he has worn. So, he'll wear like sports jerseys to events where he's preaching and doing his

00:10:39ministry, and then he'll sweat in them because, you know, it's up on stage playing worship

00:10:45music is, you know, laborious work. And then he will sell his worn jerseys, like he's some sort

00:10:53of celebrity, like he's, you know, LeBron James or something like that. He will sell his jerseys

00:10:58online to people, and apparently people buy them. I mean, maybe not, maybe he's just putting it on

00:11:06line to see who will see if anybody bites. But yeah, he just quite clearly has been

00:11:14an opportunist since the beginning of his ministry. He has been clearly looking to make a buck, build

00:11:21some wealth. He owns a bunch of different houses. And so, I was very unsurprised when I saw

00:11:29this report come out about him.

00:11:33I would agree with the opportunist theme, and it goes a little bit deeper than that. So, in my latest

00:11:38book about Christian identity to the NAR, I talk about how the fusing of politics and religion

00:11:45came in – it started long before anything we're talking about now, but it really came with the

00:11:52birth of Christian identity and its predecessor, British Israelism. You started to see yourself as

00:11:59this divine – they believe that they were part of the Lost Ten Tribes of Israel. Well, if you follow

00:12:05that path out to its logical conclusion, everything that was promised to Israel and the nation for

00:12:10whom they're with gets applied to your religion. So, as they're merging British Israelism with the

00:12:17American politics of late 1800s, early 1900s, that – by definition, it is a political discussion.

00:12:25I'll just say it like that. But then, it really, really got heated in later years because so many

00:12:34groups were trying to use religious platforms to sway political votes. And this became a huge

00:12:41problem in the United States because large sums of – large multitudes of people can be persuaded,

00:12:49and in some cases, in the cults, you can say even indoctrinated, to vote one way or another. So,

00:12:55if your candidate started to appeal to each religious party, whether there's money exchange or however that

00:13:02happens – well, then they can start to sway political votes. And essentially, what you're

00:13:07doing is you're bypassing the popular vote and you're bypassing the entire strategy that was

00:13:12implemented for America. So, these guys started doing this. This turned into a huge problem.

00:13:17But here's, I think, what a lot of people miss. The leaders in government started to realize that this

00:13:25is a huge problem. You can effectively hijack a country like this through religion. So, they started to

00:13:31implement laws where they were forcing the churches not to support a particular political candidate.

00:13:41In other words, I can tell people the doctrines. I can say whatever I want, but I can't say go vote

00:13:45for this guy or that girl, right? That's breaking the law, essentially. And what happened over time,

00:13:52and especially through – by the time you're into the New Apostolic Reformations being birthed,

00:13:56what they did instead was they found a way to circumvent the laws. What they did was, if you

00:14:03spiritualize it – in other words, if I say that candidate A or B is infested with a demon, and then

00:14:10you start talking about the demon, well, once you have associated that demon with the candidate, you

00:14:16don't even have to talk about the candidate. You talk about the demon. And so, people would get into this

00:14:21spiritual warfare about this demon. Well, using the loaded language of these cults, they're talking

00:14:27about the demon so they know the cult knows they're talking about the candidate. That's a way to bypass

00:14:32the laws. And that's one of many, many manipulating tools that was invented. That's so interesting because

00:14:38I've seen this play out in my life. And I've never really understood what the rules are on religious

00:14:52individuals supporting political figures. Because when I was in the 90s and early aughts,

00:15:03I remember there being some difficulty around – like, I remember my dad talking about how you have to be

00:15:14careful because you can lose your 501c3 status. Like, you can lose your status of tax exemption if you

00:15:23are too explicitly pro a single politician. And I remember back – maybe that my perception is warped.

00:15:33You know, this is, of course, anecdotal. But I was – I was pretty sure back when I was younger,

00:15:43like, there seemed to be this sort of at least attempt to keep the church and state separate,

00:15:50you know, where we would talk – like, I don't remember us talking about explicit politics.

00:15:57Like, I remember people being vaguely pro-George Bush during some of my early years at, like, IHOP.

00:16:09And, you know, loosely antagonistic against the Clintons and everything. But it wasn't until, like, Obama

00:16:19came on the scene that I remember it feeling a little bit more intense and loaded. And then,

00:16:26and then for several decades after that, obviously, it is the NAR and, like, the IHOP and everybody,

00:16:35the sort of church community that I grew up in went from being like, let's, let's be careful not to

00:16:41explicitly condone these particular candidates to – that's not a thing anymore. Like,

00:16:53people are talking as explicitly political as possible. And, yeah, using, I guess that makes

00:17:02sense, the sort of shift of using, like, demonic language to talk about the woke mind virus or whatever

00:17:09they, you know, whatever demonic term they come up to associate with the Democrats. But, like,

00:17:21if you are a part of that community, you do not have agency to vote and support a not-Trump candidate.

00:17:30Like, it's, it's so explicitly pro-Trump. And you see people like Foyt who are, like,

00:17:39really, really – I don't understand how he is able to have a ministry that has 501c3

00:17:46status when he quite clearly is, like, explicitly political.

00:17:52Yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. I'll walk you through this Psalm in the book,

00:17:56but, honestly, you could write an entire book off of just that one subject. It was – I want to say

00:18:02it was 1954, Lyndon B. Johnson passed the Amendment to the United States Tax Code and it prevented all

00:18:10nonprofits from endorsing a candidate. So, up until 1954, you could do it. But they realized that

00:18:17Christian identity was literally controlling American politics. So, 1954, they put a stop to it

00:18:23and said, you can't do this or we'll take away your tax-exempt status for nonprofit. Well,

00:18:29then what happened was people – like I said, people started learning these loopholes. You can

00:18:34go around it in certain ways. And how is the government going to stop it? So, one of the things

00:18:42that somebody did – I can't remember who introduced the law – but because they didn't understand cult

00:18:48indoctrination, they thought that, well, this is going to solve it. So, we already have a law,

00:18:53you can't endorse a candidate. Well, it was – I don't know what time frame you're talking about,

00:18:58but I think it was 1987. Congress amended that original amendment to have language that also added

00:19:07in opposition to. So, you can't endorse a candidate, you also can't have language in opposition to.

00:19:15Interestingly – and this is a fact, people. It's not that I'm endorsing the candidate – the

00:19:22president that I'm about to talk about – but it is noteworthy that whenever – I think it was his

00:19:292016 campaign election – Trump started calling for the repealing of this amendment that prevented

00:19:36the merging of church and state. He realized the power of this, and he realized that this is exactly

00:19:42how I'm going to be elected. This is how I will continue to be reelected. So, let's repeal this

00:19:48thing that has been enabled to protect us, right? And so, this is a huge problem. However, I don't think

00:19:55that there could be an amendment that would protect the country in whole because once you have associated

00:20:03associated in your minds of the people, once you have associated a spiritualized version of that

00:20:09story, you can say anything you want. So, for example, when William Branham started preaching in the

00:20:18divine healing revivals, he started to build the idea in the people's mind that Elijah was coming for the

00:20:26end of days' battle between good and evil, and he kept dropping hints that it was himself. He didn't

00:20:32outright say it, but he kept dropping hints. Well, what do people do when they're indoctrinated? They

00:20:36pick up on the hints. So, they started linking him to his Elijah statements. Later in the years,

00:20:44after people had associated him with the Elijah figure that he's talking about, he never once had to

00:20:50say anything about current politics, he would always say Elijah. So, whenever JFK was elected,

00:20:56he would say, we need another Ahab to go storm – or another Elijah to rise up and go storm the gates

00:21:03against Ahab, right, and Jezebel. So, he's talking a spiritualized language. There isn't a law that can

00:21:09prevent this. And so, the NAR has adopted that policy, right? And they're starting to – that's the

00:21:15reason, I think, why Wagner started introducing the spiritual warfare, because if you say the

00:21:20Queen of Heaven is over this one country, all of the politics that are against that country, you can

00:21:27preach about this Queen of Heaven or any of these spiritual warfares. You can talk about it freely

00:21:33and not violate any tax laws. Well, and now, I feel like because it's been, you know, the

00:21:40the frog in boiling water sort of thing, it's been so explicitly done, where through these

00:21:49talking about the spirit of Jezebel or whatever, using this spiritualized language to sort of talk

00:21:55around it. Now, even if people like Foyt or Lance or these others who are just like, will clearly

00:22:05talk about Trump and say his name and talk about him in this very like, I mean, literally talk about

00:22:13him as Cyrus or God's candidate. I mean, Walnau wrote a book called God's Chaos Candidate talking

00:22:21about Trump. And so, even if they are breaking tax codes, I don't know if anyone's enforcing it.

00:22:30And I think that this is what's going on. Like, this is what's happening with with Foyt. Not just

00:22:36the like, he's obviously very explicitly political and is not doing as much as he

00:22:43pretends to be like a religious figure, like he is 100% a political figure who's holding like

00:22:49political rallies and using sort of spirituality, merging those sort of two things as if they are one

00:22:58and the same. All of these detailed allegations, which I encourage people to look it up and read

00:23:05about this and not just take my word for it. There's a website, truthandfreedomstories.com,

00:23:13I think is what it, let me look. Yeah, truthandfreedomstories.com, where it's his former

00:23:20people who have worked with him and they're using their names. You know, this is not just some like

00:23:25anonymous group have talked about how he was doing a lot of like, credit card fraud where you and I

00:23:35saw this happen all the time with my dad and other ministers, where, you know, you would pay for

00:23:40personal expenses, we would go on trips, we would do, you know, go to dinners and do all of these

00:23:45things. And as long as you, you know, he would just always put it on the ministry card and pay for

00:23:53ministry expenses. And like donations that were being given to the ministry were like used to buy

00:24:00homes. And like my dad did this all the time. He has a group of properties that he bought and he calls

00:24:12them yellow houses. They're just Airbnbs that he uses. And, and, but he like states that it's a part

00:24:20of his mission because he's like prayed over these houses and he's using these houses to bring peace to

00:24:27people. Well, he's still just charging individuals. Like it's just a regular Airbnb and it's not to like

00:24:34religious individuals. He's not, he doesn't like allow religious individuals to come use

00:24:40the house for free or anything like that. It's just like, it's an explicitly, like,

00:24:44this is a business, you own a bunch of properties and then you rent them out or you use them as

00:24:49Airbnbs. Um, but you use spiritual language around it. And so they're all, they all become

00:24:55tax write offs or they're bought by the ministry and not by the, the, um, for-profit organization

00:25:03that he owns. And, um, this is very similar to what, uh, Foyt is being accused of doing. And, um,

00:25:11he has like, he isn't properly putting on his taxes, like the money that he is giving to himself.

00:25:18And, um, I mean, there's a whole detailed list of things that, um, he's accused of, which if you look

00:25:23at them, sometimes it feels, and like when I was growing up, these sort of tax evasion strategies,

00:25:29it felt very pedantic to, um, enforce these. Like it felt very like, oh, ticky tacky. Like who cares

00:25:38if I bought this dinner with this credit card or that, but like in total, if you live your entire

00:25:46life like that, you can accrue a great deal of wealth and avoid taxes, um, by using these different

00:25:53strategies. Like it, it's not a little deal. Like it's a very big deal that you can do. And like

00:26:00people like Foyt have, I mean, he's a multimillionaire now because he, and it came from

00:26:07these different ministry things that he's doing. And I also, so I know someone, I was just talking

00:26:12with someone who used to live, Foyt has like a bunch of properties he owns. His ministry and his like

00:26:20wealth accumulation is like very similar to my dad's where, um, it's like primarily through

00:26:27properties, but using ministry to sort of like gain influence, gain, you know, that sort of seed capital

00:26:35and then, and then use the ministry to avoid taxes. Like that's, it, it's pretty much the same,

00:26:41um, or it appears to be the same sort of, um, process. Um, but I was talking with someone who lived in

00:26:49a, he owns a, a Foyt owns a lot of properties in, um, near Reading and in near Pennsylvania.

00:26:56And I had, um, a friend of mine who, who actually lived in one of his properties and she, um,

00:27:05he was the landlord and he wouldn't fix the heat in, in this Pennsylvania house. And it's like,

00:27:10it's super cold there during the winter. And for like months that he just wouldn't fix the heat.

00:27:17And these are, you know, these are religious Christian people who are a part of like that.

00:27:22They probably got connected with Foyt and his house because they're, you know, it's all in the

00:27:28sort of same circle and everybody helps everyone. And he literally wouldn't, he wouldn't even fix the

00:27:35heating in, in these people's houses and they had to leave. They had to like find new housing.

00:27:40And she, I remember she was talking to, uh, me about this and she was like, I, I had to, um,

00:27:49go live. Like I was going to live in a tent for a while. And in my friend's backyard, because

00:27:55she couldn't, uh, it was just too cold and couldn't live where she was living.

00:28:01Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of

00:28:06modern Pentecostalism transitioned through the latter rain, charismatic and other fringe movements

00:28:13into the new apostolic reformation? You can learn this and more on William Branham Historical Research's

00:28:19website, william-branham.org. On the books page of the website, you can find the compiled research

00:28:26of John Collins, Charles Paisley, Stephen Montgomery, John McKinnon, and others with links to the paper,

00:28:33audio and digital versions of each book. You can also find resources and documentation

00:28:39on various people and topics related to those movements. If you want to contribute to the cause,

00:28:45you can support the podcast by clicking the contribute button at the top. And as always,

00:28:50be sure to like and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or watching.

00:28:56On behalf of William Branham Historical Research, we want to thank you for your support.

00:29:01You know, if people understood the history as it was written, I think they would run screaming

00:29:06from some of these things. When you were talking about your dad and the house, it made me think

00:29:11about the infamous C Street house, which I don't know, our listeners may not be familiar with this

00:29:17name. You may not even be familiar with this name. But if you're unfamiliar, just go type it up into

00:29:22Google, type in the C Street house, and it will blow your mind. When we did our YWAM episode,

00:29:28what was it two episodes ago? Yeah, I got all this feedback. Oh, I was in YWAM. I was in leadership.

00:29:34It was such a wonderful, blessed thing. And one of them, one of them strongly condemned you and I,

00:29:40and I invited him on the podcast. I said, well, voice your voice your opinion on the podcast. I'm not

00:29:46opposed to opposite opinion, which I don't know if he will or not. But see, they're off into a

00:29:52different area. It's not that they have all of the information. So in their area, yeah, maybe it

00:29:58was okay. I can't say whether it was or wasn't. But if they knew things like this, so this C Street

00:30:03house, this was something that one of, I can't remember the path of progression, but I know that

00:30:11Cunningham had deeded it over to the Fellowship Foundation, which is the epicenter for everything

00:30:17that we're talking about. It is the hub, the central core of how all of these religious institutions,

00:30:24from Bethel to IHOP to all of them, they're all integrated into this spiritual hub,

00:30:31and that's how they basically persuade Washington, all the lobbying. Well, in the C Street house,

00:30:38one of the ways that they did the lobbying was, this was like a, you've heard the phrase,

00:30:43when you go to Vegas, what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas.

00:30:45Darrell Bock Stays in Vegas, yeah. Well, this is the religious house

00:30:48for that purpose. Whatever your congressman does, whoever they sleep with in the C Street house,

00:30:52it stays in the C Street house. And they got exposed for this after multiple people. We're talking

00:30:58famous people who are going to this house. The Clintons, Michael Jackson, you can look it up. I'm not

00:31:05making any of this up. But that came from YWAM, that came from Cunningham, and it became this infamous

00:31:11place where all of this merging of political, do what thou wilt, everything else, it's such a mess. But

00:31:23the point that I'm driving at is the fact that these people, Foyt, you know, all of these people

00:31:29were talking about across the podcast, they're using the politics to their advantage by manipulating

00:31:36the Christian crowds. And the rank and file members in these groups have no idea what's going on. They

00:31:42don't know this history. One of the things that they do, for example, so – and I always go back to

00:31:48Branham because he's really the architect for this mess, whether they admit it or not. Branham was mixing

00:31:56Christian identity politics with religion to persuade masses in ways that were very anti-Semitic.

00:32:03And people in the movement did not even know that they were aligning with anti-Semitic views.

00:32:08But that was the core central theme of what he was doing. And the way in which he did it,

00:32:15he started to propose the notion that America has crossed the line and they must either repent or

00:32:23face divine judgment. Whether you believe that's true or not is a different thing altogether than

00:32:29what I'm talking about. He was using it for political advantage but using it in religious terms

00:32:34instead because he would always talk about administration. Like I said, JFK, he's talking

00:32:39about political aspects of his ministry. And it's the politics that is the reason why they crossed the

00:32:46line rather than the religious aspects. Kennedy was a strong supporter of civil rights and that was what had all

00:32:53of these people just enraged, right? Well, if you look at Sean Foyt, and I'm not singling him out. There are

00:33:01others that are doing the same thing. That is the trigger that ignites all the indoctrination.

00:33:08Much like if you are in Islam and you've been programmed by Islam extremism to go blow up

00:33:16a suicide bomb or whatever, that is the language that triggers all of the thoughts that are programmed

00:33:23into their heads. You start talking about they must repent or face divine judgment. The catalyst that

00:33:28starts that explosion, however, believe it or not, is a revival. All you have to do is start talking,

00:33:34this is it. We're in end time revival. Everybody is activated. So what these people are doing,

00:33:40whenever they mention revival, it freaks me out because you don't know what's going to happen. It's like

00:33:45a thousand suicide bombers. And I'm not saying they're going to go blow themselves up, but they're

00:33:50all being activated. And people who are in the movement have no idea that this is their term for

00:33:55activation. Yeah. Well, and people don't, I mean, when you're in that community and you're being

00:34:01radicalized, which like that's explicitly what's happening is the radicalization of people. And when

00:34:09when it's religious radicalization and political radicalization, like that's how you get

00:34:17dangerous really fast.

00:34:20So just, just a week ago or not even a week ago, I mean, by the time this comes out,

00:34:26it'll be a couple of weeks, but I live in Los Angeles and there's obviously a lot of turmoil in

00:34:33Los Angeles right now because ice is being sent in to, um, crack down on, uh, illegal immigration.

00:34:42And there's a lot of people, a lot of undocumented individuals who are being like, um, taken and,

00:34:48and excommunicated. And, um, and there's a lot of like questions about doing it without due process

00:34:54and, um, you know, targeting people who, um, are like trying to still go through the process in, in

00:35:02correct and right means, but not having the opportunity to like defend themselves. And, um,

00:35:08I will say as someone who lives in Los Angeles and who like, so I'm a teacher and I, and I work with

00:35:14students here and I work in different schools and like, um, largely I'd say 60% of the individuals,

00:35:25um, and children that I work with are, are, um, Latino and, um, it's terrifying. Like it legitimately

00:35:33is a very scary time for a lot of people who live in Los Angeles, both citizens and, and undocumented

00:35:41citizens. And, um, you know, this, I know that my politics aren't going to, I, some people are going

00:35:50to have a lot of different perspectives than I do. And like, I, I've always wanted to be careful

00:35:55about like, you know, I'm trying to speak out against, um, the world that I grew up in. And, and,

00:36:01and I, I think that even if you have different political beliefs than me, like, I still want to

00:36:07share what's going on in these worlds. So I don't want to like alienate people with political, um,

00:36:13talk, but, um, you know, just to, just to share kind of explicitly, like, I really think that it's,

00:36:20it's, it's pretty terrifying what is happening and, and pretty heartbreaking what is happening in Los

00:36:25Angeles right now. Um, I, um, do not support, um, a lot of this deport, you know, deport, mass deportation,

00:36:35um, that's done very like, without, um, understanding or compassion for the people

00:36:43who are living here. I don't even if you're undocumented, like that still a person, but anyway,

00:36:49um, so there's a lot of resistance and like largely the citizens of Los Angeles are not in agreement

00:36:58with what is going on. And like, it's so crazy because like, we are the people who are supposed

00:37:05to be being protected right now by this, the whole idea, um, that the idea that Trump is selling and

00:37:12that Foyt is selling is that like these illegal immigrants are coming in there. They're dangerous

00:37:18to the communities and they're stealing, you know, American jobs and who that affects that doesn't

00:37:24affect, you know, if you're living in Missouri, what is going on in Los Angeles, like that is,

00:37:30that is not affecting you. It doesn't matter. You're like, if you're not in here, you may,

00:37:35obviously like there are issues of undocumented, um, immigration all over the United States,

00:37:41but specifically when we're talking about the issues in Los Angeles, like that doesn't affect

00:37:46people who live in Missouri and live in the Midwest. Like it's, it only would be for the people who live

00:37:53here in Los Angeles. And so the question is, is like, who is this for? Who, who wants this? Who

00:37:59is saying let's get all of these undocumented immigrants? It's not the Angelino people. Like

00:38:05it's not the people who live here because like when you live and interact with people who are

00:38:10undocumented on a day-to-day basis, you're like, these are other, they're human beings, you know,

00:38:15that you can't, the demonization of these people is really ineffective when you actually interact with

00:38:22them. And you know, it's, it's this person's, um, grandmother who didn't have the proper ways to

00:38:30like immigrate, but like was worried about, you know, safety in Mexico or wherever and immigrated

00:38:36here. Like there's so many like rational reasons where if I was in, you know, just empathetically,

00:38:41like I would also do the same thing that a lot of these people did. And regardless of, even if you

00:38:47do think that there, there should be a crackdown on illegal immigration, like there's ways to go

00:38:52about it that are more humane and, and just like this fear that people are not going to be able to

00:39:01be, um, able to defend themselves or go through proper due process. And this whole idea that like,

00:39:09oh, if you're not a American citizen, you don't deserve due process is like one of the more inhumane

00:39:15things that I, I think people just say without thinking about, but anyway, I got on a tangent

00:39:22there, but just as someone who cares about my city and who's seen what's going on, Sean Foyt

00:39:29comes a week ago and he is holding these revival meetings in Los Angeles. He's not from Los Angeles,

00:39:36like he comes and holds a revival meeting in Los Angeles on a rooftop in Los Angeles, um, where they

00:39:44do like their worship service. And the next day, Trump sends his, the National Guard in, um, because

00:39:52there's all of these protests in, in Los Angeles. And Foyt starts posting online as if he was what

00:40:01broke the spirit that allowed Trump to send these, the National Guard in. Like, like he somehow is involved

00:40:09in the narrative of what is going on here. And it's, it's so delusional, first of all, like no one,

00:40:17pardon my language, but no one gives a shit what, what, uh, Sean Foyt is doing on, uh, the rooftop of

00:40:25some Angela, you know, Los Angeles worship, you know, his worship service that had like 300 people or

00:40:31whatever is not shifting the politics of what's going on in Los Angeles. Um, but that ego to like,

00:40:39insert yourself into the middle of like the heart of what is going on in the nation. Um,

00:40:46it's yeah, one, just delusional. And two, like, I don't care what your politics are. There's no way

00:40:53to look at the like National Guard coming in and be like, yeah, this is a good Jesus thing. Like,

00:41:00it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's a terrible situation regardless of what your politics are.

00:41:06And it's terrifying for the people who live in Los Angeles. Like, it's just,

00:41:13it's so frustrating because, you know, I grew up and I've, I've said this so many different times,

00:41:19but like, I grew up really believing that I was a part of a group and community that was

00:41:27the salt of the earth, that was the city set apart on a hill that was going to fight for compassion

00:41:32and love and going to be the examples to the rest of the world of how to truly love people well.

00:41:40And to then see that same community that I grew up in, see the nasty underbelly about like, no,

00:41:47it's about profiting on people's misfortune and people like Foy doing this, that you would

00:41:57see this situation that is going on in Los Angeles as like a optic opportunity to like

00:42:04progress your political and religious extremism is just so

00:42:18you know, I want to use the word evil. It's just, I, you know, I want to, I can't think of a better way

00:42:26to describe it because it's just like, it's, it's cruel too. And anybody who doesn't think that

00:42:32there's cruelty going on here in Los Angeles with the way that people are being deported, just like,

00:42:38hasn't seen it, hasn't, hasn't been here, you know? And if you don't live in Los Angeles, like,

00:42:44I don't get, I don't care what you think about this city. And this, so many people just hate Los

00:42:50Angeles because of all of these demonizing language and stuff like that. And want to,

00:42:55want to find just validation for their contempt of these people. And it's like,

00:43:04yeah, if you worked in the schools, like I did, and you worked with these people

00:43:10and you saw the humanity in them. I mean, even if you have different politics, like you cannot

00:43:16dehumanize the people who are suffering here. It's just, you can't do that. And you especially can't do

00:43:22that. If you are wanting to progress a Christian message, like it is such a mess, man. And again,

00:43:29I always go back and trace it to its roots during the latter rain revivals. Branham was saying

00:43:34essentially, and this was Christian identity 101. He was saying that the devil had set up camp in Los

00:43:40Angeles because remember right then they were attacking the movie industry because the movie

00:43:44industry were starting to portray people of different races living together in a home.

00:43:49Right. So they were attacking Los Angeles. They were also attacking Paris, France for other weird

00:43:54reasons. And then said that Satan had set up the headquarters in Rome, which was part of the

00:43:59Christian identity theology. But it's such a weird, weird mess. And so this is, this may be the only

00:44:07time I do this. I rarely voice my political opinions because I'll get hate mail. But in this one case,

00:44:13it has relevance. And so I think I will. And I'll preface it with this. I believe,

00:44:20and it is my opinion, that if you want to enter the country, there's a process to do this.

00:44:26The fact that people are bypassing the process, to me, that's a problem.

00:44:30But I'm also objective about this. Whenever I hear somebody say that this country was founded and

00:44:37they have rules that apply, people haven't really looked at those rules. It's more difficult than

00:44:42you think to go through that process. I know people who have been immigrated legally. I actually

00:44:48know people who are here illegally. And it's, it's a big mess. I'm just going to say it like that.

00:44:55But the point I'm going to be driving at isn't that it's the fact that they have politicized a

00:45:02straw man argument over the whole thing. And then a step beyond that, these Christian nationalist

00:45:08activists are taking that straw man and preaching it. Whenever they say that these immigrants,

00:45:14illegal immigrants are coming and taking jobs, that's a straw man argument. Because number one,

00:45:20the labor intensive jobs they want, Americans do not want. Number two, if they're here illegally,

00:45:26the good jobs they can't even get because they don't have work visas. That's the part that's really

00:45:32eliminated from all the conversations. You can't just go get a white collar job. And in some cases,

00:45:38you have to have a college degree to even do it in the first place. So there's no way they would pass

00:45:42the interview process. But the politics have created a straw man argument. And the way in which you can

00:45:50tell that the Christian identity and Christian nationalist leaders are preaching politics rather

00:45:57than Christianity is look to see, are they preaching the same straw man arguments? If they are, it has its

00:46:04origin in that political nature. It's not a Christian thing. It's not a Bible thing. It's all coming from

00:46:10these political activists. So the fact that they're creating these straw man arguments and then

00:46:15preaching it from behind a pulpit and mixing it with the revival language, they're literally activating

00:46:22all of these people, all the programming in their head, they're activating it for whatever is their

00:46:25political party. This is dangerous. Yeah. And, you know, we like to pretend that we are beyond,

00:46:34you know, just explicit racism and xenophobia of like, you know, I'm sure that Foyt would be

00:46:40like, it's not because they're brown or anything like that. It's because they're illegals. But

00:46:47obviously, the history of the entire movement has been built on xenophobia and just like a fear of

00:46:54people who are non-Aryan. I mean, Branham, I know that I'm literally preaching to the choir right here,

00:47:05because you obviously talk about Branham all the time and this, but like, I remember

00:47:12listening to some of his audio talking about interracial marriage and integration and how he

00:47:22was like, this is, he was using spiritual language to demonize the marrying of different races and was

00:47:32like, oh, leave it alone, you know, just let, have these people, what you're doing is despicable or,

00:47:38you know, this sort of just the idea that someone, a white man would marry a black woman was so disgusting

00:47:47and revolting in his world. And like, that's the history, that's, that was not long ago. Like,

00:47:53that's the world that you grew up in. And by extension, the world that I grew up in. And so like,

00:48:01when Foy and when Trump and various individuals spiritualize the invading force of illegal immigrants

00:48:12and use militaristic language about like invasion and, and occupation, um, and like the, the occupation of, of, uh, um,

00:48:24the United States by these, um, illegal invading force, it's, it's stirring up that innate fear of what is different and of

00:48:36people groups that are different and, um, creating this like, uh, it's so dangerous. I mean, so many people

00:48:46are being persecuted and, um, violence against individuals who are good, innocent, probably Christian

00:48:57individuals, um, violence against them is being condoned. Um, and you know, like I said earlier,

00:49:05like the idea that like, because they're not citizens, they don't get due process.

00:49:09Human beings are human beings. Like every human being, the whole foundation of the United States

00:49:16built on this idea that like every man is created equal and that we have this sort of like

00:49:22born inalienable rights as human beings. And like the right to due process is something that like

00:49:29everyone shouldn't have extended to them. And the fact that that's being curtailed now is terrifying.

00:49:38And it a hundred percent is being condoned and spiritualized by these individuals like Foyt and

00:49:48Wallnau and the, the NAR, you know, dominionist Christians who see this as a way of like gaining total

00:49:57control of, of gaining all the power of, of the Christian or the, sorry, the American government.

00:50:04And it's just all in the hands of people like me and people who agree with me. It's all about accruing

00:50:10power and accruing wealth. And it is so explicitly is that way. Like the fact that all of these individuals

00:50:18who are pioneers in this, this world are like being exposed for frauds and taking advantage of

00:50:27individuals within their own community. I mean, it's so explicitly is for the sake of, of power and

00:50:36money.

00:50:37You know, when you mix power and money with Christianity,

00:50:40you get something that's not Christianity. In fact, when you mix anything else with Christianity,

00:50:45Christianity, you get something that's not. And I think that's what people don't understand.

00:50:50And like I said, if they just knew the history, they would run screaming because what we're seeing

00:50:55today, as soon as I saw the news that the military is being deployed, all of my research back into

00:51:00William Branham and not just Branham, but think of this, Christ for the Nations is emerging at the

00:51:05same time. All of the people who are big into Christ for the Nations, they're right there in Dallas.

00:51:12I think in even in the same neighborhood as Lee Harvey Oswald, there's some weird mess going on

00:51:18there. And it's the same exact scenario. You're starting to see the military deployed for things

00:51:24that aren't really in military space. And you're starting to see Christian leaders aligned together

00:51:31with politics for things that aren't really Christianity. And I think that's really, for me,

00:51:36that's just the scariest part. Because I understand if you have a candidate that has moral values that

00:51:42support your moral themes, you want people to vote for them. Yes, that's what you want.

00:51:48But instead of talking about candidate A or candidate B, you talk about the morals. Instead,

00:51:54you start talking about the things that you want them to better their lives or live more Christian

00:51:58lives. You don't talk about the people or the politics. You don't talk about the policy or the

00:52:03legislation. But what we have is for decades now, they have indoctrinated masses of Christians,

00:52:12not even in cults. Some of this is mainstream. They've indoctrinated massive and massive bodies of

00:52:18people who they can activate with this revival language. As soon as you activate them, they're

00:52:23going to charge forward because this is the end of day's war. This is the Armageddon is coming. Now we

00:52:28have to fight. We have to fight to become Christian. Even that, if you look at the parables of Jesus

00:52:34about how the end time plays out, even that is wrong, man. It's supposed to be this peace. You're

00:52:39Christians. You're supposed to be peaceful. You're supposed to persuade people peacefully,

00:52:44and that's not what they're doing. In the end, for me, it's just like I take a step back from all of

00:52:50this and I look at the whole mess and I realize that the dumpster fire we see today with Christianity

00:52:55isn't because of all of these values entering into Christianity. It's because what we see today as

00:53:02Christianity isn't. Yeah, I think that's such a good point. And when talking with people who have

00:53:10different political beliefs than me, it's something that I've tried to advocate for in the past and I

00:53:16think is, you know, I would stand behind is like, earlier, I was like, who is this for? You know,

00:53:24the removing all of the, or having these like campaigns to remove undocumented workers in

00:53:37specifically like the Los Angeles area. If you frame it instead of like, instead of around the fear,

00:53:45and instead of around the like, um, sort of sensational danger. And instead, if you really

00:53:53think that this is a big issue, think about like, okay, well, like, it is harder for people

00:53:59in Los Angeles to get jobs. And like, over the last two years, I've really struggled getting a good

00:54:05job. I finally got hired coming up this, this year for a full time job. I was working like,

00:54:10um, as a contractor doing tutoring for the last several years. And like, I was spending,

00:54:17you know, 10, 15 hours a week, um, applying to jobs and going to interviews. And it was just the

00:54:25job market is so difficult. It was not undocumented workers who were making that job more difficult for

00:54:34me, like quite obviously. So, because like, it's not a job in which those individuals, you know,

00:54:39like it's teaching, you have to have documentation for teaching and you have to have a college degree

00:54:45for teaching. And, um, you know, it's chat GPT that's, and, and other, you know, ways that they're

00:54:52trying to like cut down labor costs and, and the flooded markets and stuff like that. And there's a lot

00:54:59of things contributing to it. And so if you really are passionate about this subject, there's ways to

00:55:07advocate for, okay, let's like advocate for higher wages, let's advocate for penalties for, for, um,

00:55:16organizations that employ undocumented workers, if you want to do it that way, or trying, there's many

00:55:23ways that you can like work towards the job market in a way that you could like come in agreement with

00:55:30Democrats and Republicans and liberals and leftists and right wing, like everybody could be like, hey,

00:55:35like, let's just work for the workers in Los Angeles. And instead of it being this antagonistic

00:55:42sort of politic, you can be supportive where you can be like, okay, I want to try to fix this job.

00:55:48Because what happens now is that we have these actions that are being done that are under the,

00:55:54the premise of helping people like me get jobs. And it's like, this is not going to help me. None

00:56:01of this is going to help me in my pursuit of getting a job or other Angelenos in their pursuits of getting

00:56:07labor. Like, and so we now have actions that are done that are so disconnected from the actual good.

00:56:13And I think that this is the problem because like, whenever politics and religion and money

00:56:20and power all get wrapped up together, you have things like the Trail of Tears. You have things

00:56:27like, you know, displacement of indigenous people and done through the manifest destiny of God. And like,

00:56:35this is the land that God has given us. And like, a lot of really inhumane things happen under the

00:56:42auspice of Christian dominionism. And like, it's happened in the past. And why isn't it just

00:56:48happening? Like, it's just happening again today and during this time. And so, that's where it's like,

00:56:56you really have to fight to be kind and compassionate. You have to fight to bring about

00:57:01good instead of just bring, you know, wrapping your worldview around fear and anger and contempt. And

00:57:11yeah, so I, if anything, if anything that I say today too, is like, just fight for the goodness of

00:57:18people. Fight for people even that you disagree with. Fight for people who are being disenfranchised,

00:57:24who are being persecuted. And like, it's so heartbreaking to me that like, Christianity

00:57:33has been co-opted to no longer be about that. And to no longer be in support of the widow and the

00:57:40orphan instead is about cleansing the world and taking dominion over the nation. It's just,

00:57:48it clearly is like, a very, very dangerous path that we're treading down.

00:57:54Darrell Bock It is dangerous. And like I said,

00:57:56it scares me. And this is a conversation that is one of Bob's themes. So, I may pass it to Bob and

00:58:02let him follow up. But the fact that, so in your case, you're attempting to get a job. Thankfully,

00:58:09you finally found one. And you're starting to see firsthand. So, you realize that what they're

00:58:14saying is a straw man argument. I'm not of that same mindset as the rest of the people. So, I can

00:58:20look at it and critically think about it and recognize that it's a straw man argument. But

00:58:25think about the masses of people that are indoctrinated with this, that aren't allowed to

00:58:29critically think. And they can't put two and two together to see what everybody who's outside of

00:58:34Christianity, all of them look at this Christian mass and think, what is this? What are these people

00:58:40doing? They're not even thinking straight. Their heads aren't screwed on straight. And it really

00:58:45comes down to they have indoctrinated people with trigger words where they can immediately immobilize

00:58:52their brains in one way or another. And they've also manipulated them such that they can't critically

00:58:57think. And that is the combination for disaster. So, I think, you know, if anything is,

00:59:04anything can be said from this podcast that they can pick up, it's just simply critically think

00:59:10about what's going on and try not to get caught into this trap. But that's about as much political

00:59:17talk as I can do because I hate politics anyway. So, thank you for doing this.

00:59:21Yeah, my pleasure. And to all the people who are going to just be so supportive in the comments, I'm

00:59:28sure. No, I appreciate people listening. And I've so appreciated the people who have been so

00:59:38supportive of everything that we've been saying in the past. And, you know, it's difficult. It's

00:59:42difficult when we deal with topics that have to do with like a range of very like loaded opinions,

00:59:49you know. So, hopefully, I think a little bit of compassion and empathy undoes a lot of sort of

00:59:59political and religious programming. So, I have hope that as much as it is very tumultuous situation,

01:00:09and I've seen a lot of Christianity be used to do some of the more horrific things that are going on

01:00:15right now. I also see a lot of compassion rising up and a lot of people like questioning and beginning

01:00:22to like deprogram and have these instances be like red flags for them to start thinking

01:00:28deeper about what's going on in their lives. So, hopefully, hopefully, we can see some more of that.

01:00:33Hopefully so. And not to worry, I have this special folder in my Outlook account for people who send

01:00:39hate mail. So, we're covered there. It's all good. Yeah. So, if you've enjoyed our show and you want

01:00:46more information, you can check us out on the web. You can find us at william-branham.org.

01:00:51For more about the dark side of the New Apostolic Reformation, you can read Weaponized Religion,

01:00:56From Christian Identity to the NAR, available on Amazon, Kindle, and Audible.

01:01:09Today we're all about Dr. Luke Sh positiv.

01:01:11Thanks for watching, sir.

01:01:16We'll see you next time.

The Politics of Revival: Sean Feucht, the NAR, and Christian Extremism - Jed Hartley - Episode 356

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