During a House Judiciary Committee hearing on Wednesday, Rep. Darrell Issa (R-CA) confronted Julie Margetta Morgan, President of The Century Foundation, about her claims about collusion among Ivy League schools.
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00:00is recognized, Mr. Eisen. Thank you. Dr. Morgan, you went to Boston College, also known as one of
00:07the New Ivies, right? I did go to Boston College for law school. I have no idea whether it's called
00:13a New Ivy. Google says it is, and who else can we ask? The bottom line is undergraduate is now
00:23over $67,000, over $88,000 all-inclusive. Is that one of the elite schools that you would be
00:30referring to beyond the original eight Ivy Leagues? Absolutely. I do think that colleges...
00:37Good. And let me ask you a question. Since you made such a point that Boston College, or that
00:42other colleges, the basic eight, and we'll just add the New Ivies that charge similar amounts,
00:47they should be exempt from antitrust because they have a small market share and catered to the
00:53ultra-rich? My testimony offers no opinion... No, no, no. You made a point as an antitrust point
01:01that because they had such a small market share, they had little or no effect. I'm sorry. Can I
01:08answer the question? No, I want you to answer that question. Okay, so the point I'm making about the...
01:13I don't want to know the point you're making. You can say yes or no. Did you say that? Can you
01:18restate the question, please? What did I say? You said, and I'll paraphrase, thank you very much.
01:26You said that, you know, that we shouldn't be concentrating on them because they had such a
01:30small market share. Is market share a factor in antitrust activity of multiple companies working
01:39together in collusion? I believe we should be focusing on... Now, thank you for not answering
01:43that. You make it easy on me, doctor. Mr. Martin, is collusion, even without large market share,
01:52if it makes prices unreasonably high, if it has an effect, is that antitrust behavior?
01:58It's per se unlawful. Okay, so you have per se unlawful behavior alleged, and yet the Democrats'
02:05witness, for some strange reason, wants to say, oh, don't look at that shiny object. Instead,
02:10what we heard today was, give us more funding for the bloated state universities that also are raising
02:18their prices. Mr. Shea, you described yourself as sort of part of the wealthy and entitled,
02:28which is unusual in this body for anyone. Everyone else seems to want to be Horatio Albert.
02:34But your family was able to pay what needed to be paid at an Ivy League school, correct?
02:43Right. And most Americans can't afford this, though. $93,000 a year, that's like 150% of the
02:49median American income. Okay. And the evidence that's being presented today is that the effect
02:55is not just Ivy League schools, but if you take away the subsidies being paid by other taxpayers,
03:01all universities are rising at very high rates because of these practices, including what you
03:07talked about, this massive amount of overhead, if you will, inefficient overhead by administrators.
03:16Absolutely. Administrative overhead is growing not just at the Ivy League, but at state universities
03:20all across the country. It's risen dramatically in recent years.
03:23And Dr. Cooper, is it fair to say that one of the things you see among cartels, antitrust
03:30activity, and so on, is you see higher prices and less efficient higher overhead? Isn't that
03:37kind of a hallmark when you give antitrust exemption?
03:41That's correct. We often see higher prices and higher profits.
03:44So for our witnesses, is it fair to say that if, in fact, we bring back real competition at all
03:52levels, at all universities, and as a result, we then would be able to drive down prices, drive up
04:00the efficiency, we could, in fact, allow more people to be able to leave college without burdensome
04:06debt?
04:06I think that's correct. We need more competition in higher education.
04:13Okay. So today's hearing is really about antitrust behavior by the most esteemed university. And
04:20Mr. Che, I'm going to ask you a question. Is it your understanding as a rising junior, if I'm correct,
04:28that if you go to one of these great universities, the rest of your life, your career income is, on
04:35average, greater, isn't it?
04:37This is empirically true, is that if going to an Ivy League school can definitely raise your potential
04:43earnings, especially if you're from a low-income family.
04:47So, Mr. Martin, the tendency by the universities that will deliver the highest lifetime earning to
04:54restrict, to reduce, and as a result, to deny to the people who otherwise would have that opportunity,
05:01isn't that one of the real detriments of this antitrust behavior?
05:05It should trouble us as antitrust lawyers.
05:08Thank you. I yield back.
05:09Gentleman yields back. Now recognize the ranking member for-